765 | Drew Lock & Dane Belton | Giants Player, Profile & Projections

Drew Lock welcome to talking Giants presented by woo I'm Rusty welcome to talking Giants player profiles and projections I'm your host Bobby Skinner here with my co-host Justin penck we're brought to you by see uh brought to you by Captain Morgan today and today we're looking at Drew lock and Dane belon usually we go straight into it for player profile projections Justin but this is my first episode in Florida and I you know what I'm I might have to be a little more sympathetic sympathetic for DJ I'm I'm Rusty I'm not used to being behind this desk even though we' been doing it you know getting reps in all month it's it's been a nice long month together Bobby Skinner and now you're back in the great state of Florida and I mean even even Drew lock looked a little rusty against the Detroit Lions too and we're going to talk all about him and then we have danne bton on the the back end of the episode two uh did you did you design this with the two players with the first name that starts with a D did you design that one no I I I think I designed it as this is the last week before cutdown days and um you know next week I think is like the Daniel Jones Week the Dexter Lawrence week and I was like you know what people might be a little PPP peed out this is going to be uh un exciting week um but we're going to we're we're going to start get ready for exciting week yeah we're going to start with Drew Lock 27 years old 6'4 228 lbs 2019 second round pick out of missou and it's year six for Drew lock and he uh joins his third team uh after being traded from the Denver Broncos to the Seattle Seahawks where he competed for Goin Smith to be the starter ended up being the backup Giants signed him to a one-year $5 million uh which was essentially all uh fully guaranteed uh to be the Giants backup you know when you watch Lo there's some fun in there Justin and we'll get into it and I you know I watched the film of his two games uh where he's played for the Seahawks over the last two years and you do see improvements from Denver but at the end of the day it's a lot of like fun it's it's a little bit of St fun stuff and like mixed with a mostly not very good if that makes any sense no it it it does make sense Bobby this was the PPP that I've tried the longest and the hardest to be more positive on when it comes to Stats and it's very hard with Drew lock and and we're kind of back in the we're back in the phase and we're back in the The Stance of backup quarterback of you know it's not one of the best it's also not one of the worst I'm not going to sit here and say drew lock is one of the worst backup quarterbacks in the NFL but at the same time Drew lock is a backup quarterback he is a backup quarterback for a reason and usually when these guys are backups they don't have good numbers and they don't have good things supporting them coming coming behind them and that's kind of the case with Dre luck yeah it's my my argument has always been is like there's really no such thing as a good backup QB in the NFL there's he's good he's good in the backup uh definition but just quarterback you know versus the NFL well you're you're the 33rd guy at best obviously there's exceptions to the rules um but that's like mostly what you get but let's let's talk about Drew lock and who he is right he is someone who likes to push the ball down the field he does have a pretty uh decent arm to you know to push it and he started two games last year and went in one in one versus the 49ers in the Eagles and you know he had that you know that throw to uh jsn versus the Eagles and on Monday night football fourth quarter like you that's the fun stuff of Drew lock and in those two games he completed 63% of his passes had a little less than 500 yards three touchdowns and three interceptions so like I said he's gotten better um since Denver and still still wanting to push the ball down the field uh but there's still you know the quick game is still a bit of an issue right he's kind of late reading the conflict player a lot of times and it leads to miss throws or Yak taken away um but you see the aggression right when there's a hole shot or a throw to be made down the field he's going to pull the trigger on it right if he's got a one-on-one with his alert route on on one side of the field he has no fear of saying you know what that's that's the throw I'm going to get to forget the progression I'm throwing to the alert so you see like some big boy stuff but just the down in down out stuff is is not great for Lo right I think that's his best quality is that he wants to and he will throw the damn Ball Deep that 100% And in in an offense a good fit for dble which is a good fit for Brian dble and it's you know and it's an interesting dichotomy to the to the starter in Daniel Jones right but one thing that I do find that Drew lock does do and you saw it a little bit in the Detroit Lions preseason game I think he puts the ball In Harm's Way way way too much and it's with him throwing the ball where I think he actually does a really good job of limiting sacks and limiting negative plays in that regard he's never been a guy that's taken way too many sacks despite I don't think he's a great mover like I don't consider I I I think he probably can move and he can run a little bit but I don't consider him to be a great mover or a great like manipulator of the pocket but he does reduce sack and he gets rid of the ball but the only thing is is that I do think he is very willing to put the ball In Harm's Way so you have an aggressive quarterback that wants to stretch the ball down the field he'll even want to throw between the 10 10 to 19 yard range too you know during his time with Denver he had a Almost Pretty even split between thoring towards the intermediate part of the field and the Deep part of the field uh but I do think that comes at a cost sometimes with putting the ball in harms white and having some bad decisions of throw to the opposite Jersey color yeah I mean his one year of starting was you know his second year in Denver and it was pretty reckless with our good old friend Pat shurmer and he just one he just had a bad concept of the offense you know he didn't have a great grasp of what they were trying to do and he said win and doubt I'm throwing I'm throwing it deep you know and he led the NFL an average depth of Target uh that year led the NFL in interceptions that year um now he also dealt with that was like the Jerry Judy drop R he like the only two guys who had a higher drop rate than him that year was Carson Wentz and Daniel Jones um and it's crazy when I like okay well some of this stuff will be better when you look at 2023 right even in a limit of stle size than it wasn't right so like his one year starting in 2020 he was second in deep throw rate and but also 36 of 39 in deep uh throw completion rate so like hey he's thrown it down the field a lot not successfully last year I went and looked at it he was fifth in rate for 20 plus yard throws obviously a smaller sample size so I had to two games right yeah uh but he was three for 11 so he was 42 in completion percentage for it and it wasn't just completion I mean threw three interceptions right like he had the second least dropbacks out of the 49 QBs that like filled in on there and he had the 12th most interceptions on those plays and but he also had two touchdowns right so in two games he had three completions two touchdowns so it's just it's so much give and take and too Drew loock experience and it's too much take and here's my biggest worry this year for the New York JS because he's only on a one-year deal is that he did have a better grasp of the quick game and stuff in Seattle like much better grasp of that than he did in Denver still wasn't really that good at it but had a there's just two two different players I worri that with one year being with the Giants like is he gonna have that same grasp of that kind of stuff where in Seattle he got a full year of just sitting behind Gino Smith re reward that worry for me like he's learning the offense and Drew lock has not picked up offenses very quickly okay so you're worried about like in in Seattle he had like a a better grass with the quick game but he didn't play a game for them until his you know over halfway through his second year there where now if he if say say Daniel Jones gets injured he's in week three he just doesn't have the same amount of time in that offense that he had in Seattle he only had one year in Seattle was last year Bobby no he had two years he just didn't play the year before oh he didn't play oh yeah du see that's the point I'm making a whole missing Gap in his pro football reference page in 2022 because he didn't play didn't register a snap okay yeah okay sure that makes S I mean even again from the preseason game Drew lock did not look comfortable and not not very good reads and and things like that when there should have been better reads so yeah that's it's a legit point it's a legit Point 100% And there's just too much boneheaded this right like even we don't try to talk about preseason too much or training camp in this but in training camp it's just like oh my gosh there's just no grass of getting the ball out on time and the interception in the preseason game was really bad yeah like that that was a that was an awful read where you just like it was it was a dagger concept which we talk about a lot on here where you have like the slot receiver is just running a vertical clearing out space the outside receivers is running like a 15 yard dig or in and then you have something in the flats and he just stares down Isaiah hodin on it the safety's just sitting there waiting for it um because it was a pre- snap safety rotation and he just throws it in there cuz he never he never even checks to see what the safety is doing like that's the type of War you have with Drew lock where I hate to be so negative on this because it's a backup QB and my whole phrase is backup Q there's no such thing as a backup QB but it is a pretty big deficit or or downgrade from tyroc Taylor oh it is I mean I even think like the only thing he has on tyod Taylor's health and right now he's actually injured you know and I actually think that Tyrod Taylor throws a better deep ball like we we had the critiques of Tyrod Taylor you know when he came into the Giants that oh he he didn't he doesn't do do it he doesn't want to do it and of checks it down a little bit too much but then you finally saw it and I think Tyra Taylor had one of the best big throw rates in the you know Big Time throw rates in the National Football League last year on on that limited sample size and like I think Drew Drew locks has a willingness to do it but I I think I think tyod Taylor is a better thrower of the deep ball than Drew lockz yeah yeah it's honestly it's it's the quick it's the short accuracy where tayl lock might have an advantage where Tyrod right for all the good you remember like how many just misses he would have in the quick game yeah I will say like Drew lock does have a very quick release like he you know he gets that ball back there he doesn't he doesn't necessarily need to have his feet fully planted he can kind of release the ball from different sort of pseudo arm slots so you know in the quick game if that's really where they want to lean into um you know he can get rid of that ball quick and that that could be an area that they can stay alive just make good choices with the football what do you think we'll finish with this Daniel say Daniel Jones gets injured what do we what are we getting out of Drew lock on a four game stretch I depends what four game stretch we're talking about with this schedule Bobby Skinner uh because the giant schedule does Go In Waves I think we're GNA get a lot of deep throws and a and a hand and a good amount of interceptions and some Brian dable cussing them out yeah you know what's crazy I I think it will look similar to what we saw with Tom and Deo last year I do think it will we except there won't be as many sacks there won't be as many sacks that would that that'll be like the major difference right there yeah there there will be like Dita was willing to to take those deep shots I think there will be deeper shots because I think lock just has a better arm than than Tommy DeVito yeah Deo couldn't throw that deep post but I think where lock loves throwing that DST I think it'll feel similarish to that and when I'm now that I'm starting to say that it will be much better than what we saw with dito because like I said I do not think Drew lock will take as many sacks as Tommy DeVito yeah Ian that was like basically DeVito's biggest issue was the amount of sacks that he would take all right uh Justin won't you talk to us about something I'll talk to you about something and I'll talk to you about Captain Morgan imagine me throwing a battle of Captain Morgan in the background oh I don't need to imagine it I'm glad you're not throwing glass around my head um but this PPP is brought to you by Captain Morgan the official Spiced Rum sponsor of the NFL I'm also going to plug this uh we have a fantasy football draft uh in a couple weeks at the johnboy media office and Captain Morgan is sponsoring it I would like all the people in the world to be in that live stream watching it happen it's the day before the NFL season kicks off that Wednesday um because the more people that are in it the more Captain Morgan will like us and when life gets blind try Captain Morgan original spice rum it's delicious and crisp and perfect for game day with friends spice it up that'll be on the J football channel visit Captain morgan.com to find Captain near you please drink responsibly Captain Morgan original spice rum 35% alcohol by volume Captain Morgan run company in New York New York you'll be glad you did thank you to Captain Morgan for sponsoring our entire summer it made it great it made it Crisp And it spiced it up a little bit spicy you'll be glad you did all Dane Belton right just let's talk about Dane belon 6'1 205 lb safety was a fourth round pick in 2022 out of Iowa at 25 years old last year only started two games had 33 tackles two interceptions one sack three tackles for a loss uh you know started five games as a rookie where he led them in interceptions with two uh and fumble recoveries with two he's gotten his hands on the football as a pro in the NFL he right now is in a battle with Tyler Newman to be the starting safety but I ultimately hope and think he belongs as the third safety which is probably his NFL role anyways yeah danne Belton last year played in 39% of the or excuse me in 2022 he played in 39% of the snaps he was eligible for and then it reduced down to 26% in 2023 I mean he's a Bobby he's a turnover Merchant and I know that's the fun line that people like to go to about Dane Belton and it kind of is true whether it's a fumble recovery Force fumble interception and he dudes out there and he kind of just forces these turnovers I do think he finished finished the year much better than he started he got a little bit more consistent playing time and he got some like full starts to end the year like against the Eagles against the ramsbury had the two interception game but ultimately Bobby we're in year three of danne Belton and I'm still saying the same thing that I said on our 2022 draft recap video I'm still having a hard time figuring out what danne Belton does well or like what his role is fully going to be inter as an NFL player besides okay just just interceptions but he's you know he's on the field 26% of the time last year how do how do we increase that a little bit how do we find more of a full-time role like I I I think you know even on that draft recap Bobby you know one of the things that we expected is hey let's let's have danne Belton turn into this Julian love player and I still think he's even far away from from that Jack of all trades master or none type of guy yeah even you know pre Julian love over the last two years like we would take that from Bel and I don't think he is that yeah he's he's an example of why you don't just look at interceptions when judging DBS because I mean his two interceptions last year were just bad over like you're right place right time but if you're not in like good position in those when Matthew Stafford just tries to no look and and overthrows it right that's just m like that you don't get credit for that um the interception he had his rookie over versus the Texans was good but that was right before a play where he got beat for a touchdown um and then you know the other one was against the Eagles his rookie year where Jaylen Herz just inexplicably just throws the ball up in the Red Zone like I was like what the hell are you doing um but I think what he is Justin is versatile right uh you know he's you know lines up deep nickel and in the Box you know uh his box uh percentage you know last year 45% rookie year 44% deep percentage last year 40% uh rookie year 35% and then at nickel or wide uh 15% last year 21% his his rookie year I mean he's he's a decent athlete for the safety spot not great and I think he is someone who you can even though I I don't know if that's GNA have a huge role on this team like kind of your your big big nickel type safety the only reason why I don't love him in that role though is I don't think he's great against the run right like our talking point for danne belon like you said to like get to what we want out of him which is not like we don't have this oh he's got to be a starting safety but to be like a third safety we're proud of is getting better against the run and that just hasn't happened you know like he's not aggressive in the Box really or from Deep um and he's a takes bad angle sometimes and he's I mean and he's he was a really bad tackler last year right tackle rate yeah six highest Miss tackle rate out of 101 safeties in 2023 um so that's where you get frustrated but he is someone like you can you could put on on a tight end in man coverage and feel okay against it you can ask him to do his Zone coverage duties and feel okay but he's just like you said he doesn't give you a this Advantage anywhere and but if he if he took a step forward as a run Defender which is something that like I feel like is a is a reasonable ass out of him then he's a then he's a third safety you can feel proud of where right now he's just a third safety right you know we we see flashes Bobby I mean you know there were there was even three tackles for loss last year um you know he his pressure rate as a as a Blitzer you know while extremely limited was really good too I don't think Shane Bowen is going to ask him to do the same things that asked his safties asked his safeties to do uh but you know the times that we saw him kind of in the box and involved in stuff especially in the backfield it was on those blitzes now I I I do want to give Belton credit here where it's tough to evaluate you know deep safeties like I'm not hey I I'll put my hand up I'm not I'm not watching to see what a deep safety is doing and their responsibility and how they cover you know a quarter of the field half the field or the entire field I'm not especially the the NFL broadcast on Sundays doesn't even give you an opportunity to watch that because they're not even on the freaking screen but we've seen numerous times whereas Belton has has been in the Box or closer to the line of scrimmage this is a guy that I I think he's a relatively smart player I I I don't think he's fooled much by misdirection he sniffed out screens uh pretty well we saw his rookie year almost get an interception on Gino Smith what would have been his the most impressive interception of his career almost get an interception on Gino Smith on a third down baiting Gino Smith into thinking that you had a receiver that's open so the times that we kind of do see him and everything is limited the times that we do see him kind of in the Box in coverage it's fun it's good you mentioned that you know he could cover you know he could cover a man coverage there was this one play where I forget who was against but again like a misdirection play where you have all these linemen going left but then you have a receiver that's coming across on the right and he's not falling for it he's following his guy across the formation so Belton as a number three safety on this team and maybe even as a spot starter um I'm taking that but I still feel like we could see some opportunities for for growth from him absolutely all right that's a player you you don't have do you I have a stat stat hit us with the stat new stat I don't know what it means I just found it I just accessed the oh God no no no I just accessed the the NFL pro the NFL pro stuff um from NFL premium minus 2.1% catch rate overe expected allowed I can't do catch rate over expectation and minus 10.2 coverage EPA when targeted according to NFL next gen do I fully know what it means yet do I fully know how that Stacks up against everybody in the NFL no it's because I just discovered that this stat in this database yesterday be wanted of what negative is better then positive and Dane Belton negative minus minus 2.1% catch rate overex expected allow boom we're going to have to do like a like a a zoom call with somebody and it's like all right explain this stat and now it's built and then we get a list of like can can use can't use uh cuz I have no idea what any of that means all right let's uh appreciate you guys for listening we'll see you on the next one until then let's go big blue