'Shivambu's departure a sign of things to come'

in party I am not going to speak here house as to what is the basis of that because that will be ton to campaigning already for a party so I'm going to be actively involved in is a party and shape ER its direction and the politics that are obtaining to in South Africa so that is to end the uncertainty or speculations that have been obtaining in terms of what is going to happen well EF leader Julius malma has described shambo's exit as unexpected he's also assured his longtime friend and comrade of no animosity between them following his decision malma and chambu registered the eff 11 years ago after they were both expelled from thec I stand before you to to accept the decision of the Deputy president of the efff who has voluntarily resigned his positions and did not renew his membership when he sent me a letter yesterday I felt the same pain when I received the news of the passing away of my mother because Floyd to me is not just a comrade it's a brother and he will remain a brother even when he pursues his political career differently but I've made this offer to Floyd that the day you decide to come back you are more than welcome because you are not a member you are a founder of this political party there will not be any replacement of the DP because we're going to the conference in December so there's no need um but also if you appoint anyone to be Deputy president now you are creating expectations and when we arrive there that person is not elected as president you cause more problems now so um we are very fortunate though unfortunate that it happens on the eve of the conference and um the conference will be able to re to resolve that um I can't give a list of who's going to join MK after Floyd I didn't know Floyd was going to join MK so if I didn't know about Floyd can you imagine about others because I'm more close to Floyd all right let's stay with the story bring in our senior politics reporter zanda noo who joins us in studio and in fact zanda you were at that briefing I want to just say that the analysts we had on shortly after the announcement by Floyd shibambu um gave us a sense that just given previous reports um Julius mma's comments last year at the eff's 10th birthday Gara dinner where he effectively warned shibambu against conspiring against him uh there have been several moments where it seemed like there was animosity and our analysts telling us that there was no way Julius malma was surprised by this announcement you were in the room what do you think no that's not true I disagree uh great greatly with those analysts to the extent that Julius malma was expecting an internal battle I mean I remember those comments from the 10th anniversary Gad dinner where he was saying that those who are plotting against him and I'm paraphrasing here but those who plot against him will be dealt with harshly politically in the same way he's done throughout his political career so it seemed like it was only going to be something that is internal looking at Julius mma's face alone today barring whatever our sources of also told us he did not see this coming and he even said in the briefing cuz I asked that question did you see it coming he says look uh you know if I was unaware of uh Floyd shambo's exit uh I cannot even tell you who else might go but yes I am anticipating that others will follow because of their loyalties to the deputy president um and this was of course in line with the question I was asking regarding names such ASI um that have been touted as possibly also going to jump ship as well as Veronica M so of course he couldn't confirm that and Floyd shivambu not wanting to talk about the MK party but certainly um you know Julius was quite clear Mr malma was clear about how they started this together and that this felt as painful as it was when he heard the news of losing his mother yeah I I had goosebumps at that moment um and you know it's either that or he's a very good actor but he certainly seem and I'm not a body language expert but he seemed devastated I was go I would go as far as to say heartbroken and yeah he says the only other time he was this shocked and this devastated was when he received the news of his mother's passing especially seeing that you know the irony here is that Julius malma and Floyd chambu left the ANC during presid when Zuma was the president of thec siril rapos was the deputy president and they were expelled and they went on to form this in 201 13 11 years later the same Floyd shivambu is now uh leaving the movement that he started on the 26th of July 2013 to go work for the party an organization founded by the very same Jacob Zuma I mean I I've been calling around some of the leaders and I've been asking what what does former president Jacob zum tell you guys on the phone or when you go have tea in that is so convincing um that you would want to jump ship and you know there's now this uh phrase after the the exclusive interview that we did with him at new Africa where he said there's a political something something maybe there's something we are not understanding about the shift in politics look there's already talk about this being a much larger plan ahead of 2029 um with not even 2026 even possibly 2026 but the bigger goal of 2020 2029 where the progressive uh forces which flow shambu was quoting that Progressive forces Charter on the The Stance of land expropriation without compensation nationalizing the minds Etc it seems that those parties are really putting their shoulders to the wheel and actually man who I don't think that would have been much of a surprise given the fact that he was still the Jacob Zuma Foundation spokesperson he too has now jumped ship and really this is about just distribution of resources as it were that one thinks that if one goes to an organization like the MK there's a lot more one can do there to complement the the bigger picture so I'm not lost to the progressive left I'm not lost to the ideology that all of us share I just it's just that where I will be in the MK party uh there's going to be much more that one can do so he says he is not lost to the progressive caucus and I I wonder zanda you know there are so many questions that that we should be discussing about let's start here I suppose one of the key questions now becomes how far back do these discussions between Floyd shibambu and the MK party go and I'm referring here to the fact that he was deployed in the runup to the May elections to kiden to try and drum up support for the eff and of course he was relieved of that position taking to the Eastern Cape absolutely um and it's because you know there were s there were always signs in the sense that Michelle at that Manifesto launch you know there were many who said that Manifesto launch at Moses m stadium in February this year was a flop it wasn't the to the standard of the eff um and then soon after that Marshall jamini was then deployed to guul Nal and remember that they dropped significantly from around 9% to 2% now there are many theories as to what happened there you know they shouldn't have let VY KOA leave the party he helped them gain um that electoral outcome and even Julius malim himself saying at the national results operations center that the MK party did do damage now what I find Curious is how malma today was talking about how they are aware or they have suspicions of many people who are double parking in both the eff and MK party but I what I don't think he was anticipating that it would be the man who's right next to him that's also possibly double parking so that's why he was saying we're anticipating many others to leave H to to to go back to your question so I mean we did pose those questions I mean I'm very curious to know what was said to Floyd shivambu in terms of his personal political career um and and what he is going to be mandated to do in the MK party that he couldn't do in the eff and the same question was asked about whether these um ractions between Julius malma and Floyd chambo were a large part of him actually leaving the organization given the fact that just now in December the efff is going to its people's assembly which is its elective conference um does it mean that there's not enough space to grow within the organization there are just so many questions that um at this stage can only be answered by n or Floyd Shivam yeah I mean if you talk about the performance of the eff in in Kad and it's massive drop from 99 something per to 2% hin Is 2020 Vision right everything that we're seeing unfolding from 12:00 today makes us look back and and think certain thoughts it also brings up the question zanda when the eff was coing up to the MK party in the buildup two elections was it perhaps overplaying and overestimating its own position in in what may have been those talks and the reason why I'm asking you that is is the FF now unhappy with its decision not to join the government of national Unity sure that's a very interesting question I mean it depends on how you look at it because for the longest time there's been this view that's held that julus malma makes decisions unilaterally and everyone then has to follow suit around that and there's also been a lot of sense that in the way in which the eff conducted itself after the May 29th elections that they actually played themselves and did not negotiate themselves into a good position um when you look at what's happened in and and and the and the talks and how Julius malma was um you know posturing after that almost to say well we don't really need thec and then uh our mmc's will resign in all councils if thec does not you know return back as Finance MMC for an example and the thing is the numbers after the 2024 general elections required all political parties to review their stance and what may have been hardlines such as actiona for an example in Johannesburg and so it goes um I mean who would have thought that in guazu Nal you'd have thec ifpda and NFP working together but such was the outcome and what the voters are actually required um you know of the political parties and so there is a large sense that this is also the discontent with how Julius malma has conducted himself in that aspect so we will have have to see whether or not there is another big grand plan but what I've been told so far is that this is just the start and that there may be others and other political parties who also might be jumping ship to join fascinating 24 hours in politics is a Lifetime right a week what is that um I want to just reiterate some of the comments Julius malma made and was obviously um I think the young people say Throwing Shade uh it was a commentary on Floyd shambu right he says my coffin will be draped with the flag of the eff to resign from the eff would be a betrayal of so many people who risked it all for the party I assure the ground forces that I will never turn my back on you and you know it's interesting if you just toose that with what Floyd shivambu says in his resignation letter clearly knowing um his longtime colleague brother and friend to say that and I'm trying to quickly find it firmly believe that political decisions should never be personalized and treated as a betrayal of the cause and of individuals you are my brother and comrade and will always and will and I will always choose the contributions we made in our lives during the struggle for economic emancipation so I think they were playing a gentleman's dance here um and we're likely to see some of these comments but I mean it's not the first time Julius malma has made um like you said thr shade or um made veiled threats and and this now like I was saying is we just never expected that it would reach this extent perhaps the tectonic shift would have happened internally within the eff but if Julius malma is saying that the top some leaders in the top six structure uh were crying this morning they didn't see it coming yeah um is this the end or the beginning of the end of the eff and and was part of his decision zanda Floyd chambu I mean um the fact that he's been in the wings he's been Deputy president not president for 11 years you know this is an interesting question because it speaks to succession planning in political parties not just in the efff but in political parties whether you're talking about the ifp where Mesi was there for about what 44 years or or decades whether you're talking about cope and how that small party we saw fists fists flying literally in the and chairs flying in the air whether we talk about the a andc now we're in a government of national unity and there are questions about what's going to happen in 2027 when s rapos had to go the issue of succession planning in political parties is something that's beveled a lot of our political parties on the South African landscape and I'm mentioning that because there you you know we're speaking off air was there never a plan when they started in 2013 that okay I'll be president for two terms and then you know you will take over because you can't be Deputy president forever and that's why um you know the emphasis I think from Julius malma he said it so many times a personal political decision almost wanting to isolate this from the organization and the inner workings of the organization that look Floyd is making this decision and you know let him do what he needs to do but also you can still come back if you would like to so um you know we we don't know what the discussion was when they started uh this movement but certainly there will be people who follow him what a fascinating year 2024 is turning out to be politically thanks for coming into studio uh great to get your perspective as someone who was in the room when Floyd shibambu announced his resignation