Civic Authority Apathy - How Long Will Citizens SUFFER?: The Newshour Debate - (29th July 2016)

[Music] representing the citizen on the news Are Tonight Ashwini kaker CEO Mercury travels from Mumbai bitu seel well-known environmentalist also a concerned citizen a claimed environmentalist and director of the Center for Science and environment Sunita Naran Kiran majumdar Shaw CMD of biocon worried and concerned and angry citizen RK Mishra joins Kiran majumdar Shaw from bangaluru tonight and aay prash is joining us from Mumbai he's past president of the travel agents Federation of India so I have a lot of Citizen voices tonight it's a it's a it's going to be a important debate feel free to come in at any point of time I'm not particularly telling viewers to take turns uh panelists to take turns so feel free to come in uh samit Patra of the BJP Danish Ali of the JDS BJP in power in harana and in New Delhi Danish Ali JDS part of the Coalition in Karnataka uh makran narveer is an independent corporator leans towards the shivaa Shiva in power in the municipality in Mumbai Gaba will be joining us in sometime and that's Raman Malik spokesperson of the harana BJP so okay can I can I can I start the debate here right I just want to ask you today uh will saying sorry work after what has happened the whole country saw what the collapse of the Civic infrastructure across major Urban centers across India we'll saying sorry work for we'll saying sorry work B it won't right and why won't it because they'll do the same thing again and we'll say sorry again yeah see you know if you just take the top three cities Mumbai Bangalore and Delhi Mumbai has a budget of 20,000 crores a year Delhi has a budget of 7,000 plus NOA plus this about 13,000 cres a year gurug now if you take B it's 7,000 CR a year between these three cities there's a budget of 40,000 cror a year does it look like these governments are spending 110 crores a day for our benefit where is that money going what is happening and why is this happening again and again and again yeah because as long as politicians continue to make money Raman Malik right as long as the politician bureaucrats establishment is making enough money whether it's bangaluru or it's Mumbai or it's gurugram big Urban centers are meant to make money Raman Malik so as long as the political establishment right the bureaucratic establishment whatever God forsaken establishment is making money why would you care whe people go through a 16 hour Jam would you care Raman Malik you wouldn't you're fine you're in power life goes on one party convention to another right one party convention to another so we began by saying Raman Malik we're not going to let them get away by saying sorry today yes Raman Malik sure AR let me tell you on the onset that this is uh not just a cliche I am really sorry on behalf of the government we said no no we said saying sorry is not going to work today no ran Malik Raman Malik saying sorry saying sorry is not going to work today because you've broken the world record in the world's biggest Jam let me say something no no no no no no no no one sec I began by saying this I began by saying this that saying sorry is not going to work fine that is your thing but at it's not my thing it's everyone's thing you want me to open up the phone lines what do you mean it's your thing at least let me complete what I'm saying no how how expensive was the car which the chief minister of harana bought for himself how much did it cost listen how much did it cost whatever it cost or whatever that is a different issue let me please finish what issue it tells you the story of absolute apathy of the state government did he forget to buy himself the car on time did he no no one second one second sir finish sir listen to me listen to me there are days when you must sir if you want me to listen to you at Le you listen you listen you listen people of India want you to listen your chief minister of the btia Jan party which promised an auster government minimum government maximum governance your chief minister did he forget to buy himself a 1.5 CR rupee expensive SUV he did not but did he forget to stop the water logging in gurug grah he did Chief Minister he did answer me he did did did he that is what I'm answering please let me answer yeah let me please answer on the onet the way I was saying we are sorry for all of this thing but regardless regardless of what are the reasons behind it we should be sorry because we are in power come on don't give me don't give me a rubbish argument please no no don't give me a rubbish argument feel free to com please mind your language please mind your language no I'm not what's wrong about it's a rubbish argument it's a rubbish argument there's nothing there's nothing bad in terms of the language it's Rish I would say I'm using very elegant language the sitation which is transcribed out here I'm asking you I'm asking you please understand why have you done nothing for the people of gurug grah we have 4,128 grievances with the M with the with the mnc's of gurugram 400 are in relation to repairs to Municipal property Road and traffic and storm water drains which on an average would take 98 days to sort there is no action which has been taken you want to come here and tell me to mind my language one month ago the MCG had sought 7 days to repair portoles in gurugram this after an authority had a year after the last Monsoon to better the services of the city one year you want you did in for one year listen to me for for one year you did nothing you do why did you do nothing why did you do nothing listen to me now what has happened you listen to me Mr Malik and stop waving your finger at the viewers listen you listen to me Mr Raman Malik no why did you Mr R Malik Mr R Malik I want to ask you whether you're whether you think you're going to get away by saying sorry do you know what how this affects the image of this country in this country we have a 20 traffic J I I want to know from Arab goswami does he want to know the fact I want to know from you why why what you will do because you've just had a 20-hour traffic jam for God's sake you don't understand the seriousness of the situation and I'm asking you Rik Rik raik I don't care I'm going to H you over the Cs if required on this subject I'm not going to let you get ready for it Arab I'm ready to give the answers provided you are interested to take it you have no answers clearly let's open the debate by the way anyone is free to come into the debate the debate is open the debate is open so the the debate the debate is open the the commissioner police with 800 people and his three DCPS is on the on the road oh my God the the DC G is on the road that is one secondly secondly the problem has happened on the nh8 and the new guro not the old guro please also understand that okay is on theate is on the Maj the major question in the No No are there floods in the yamuna you should tell he doesn't understand what he's talking about okay he doesn't understand what he's talking about does not understand he doesn't understand what he's talking about having a police commissioner is not solving the Civic problems do you understand this is the you do not understand anything what Police Commissioner is going with 800 people to solve the water locking problem pleas you know how the governor why do you have no responsibility you talk about why you have no responsib you understand I also said I also said the DC all his AB there breaking the road Center barriers everything was done listen listen Raman keep quiet you understand ARA please tell him to understand let I'm helping you please watch watch AR Mish one minute AR Mish wait a minute 1 minute one minute Mishra AR Mishra one minute hold on hold on hold on hold on AR Mishra Raman Malik you know what do not look so offended if a citizen is asking you a question REM you you first listen to me have I completed my statement did I give you the permission to interrupt me listen one second just a minute one minute let me set the ground rules here this is the news are we don't take we don't take rubbish from anyone including politicians especially not politicians so you listen even I don't take rubbish from anybody yeah good good I'm not giving you rubbish I'm going to throw some facts at you and if you if you call my facts rubbish let me warn you the viewers are going to get very I'm ready to respond so so so first of all so first of all two two rules here stop waving your finger at the viewers stop disrespecting the citizen voices on the program and kindly behave yourself and now let me ask you the question my question to is this 1,000 crores are collected in the name of toll from the Common Man for using the highways and expressways in harana 1,000 [Applause] crores where does the money go okay the money goes in completing the what do you mean I'm answering you your question is over now can I answer or you set new parameters I am not being upset I upset yes a bit because you don't want a debate you want to rule the debate that is not the way debate happens don't teach me debating sir you do your politics let do my journalism debate I don't care if you've been to wishiwashi channels and not wishiwashi CHS before this I'm asking you 1,000 CR is collected from the Common Man for using highways in harana where does all the money go if there is of if people have to spend 20 hours in a traffic jam please listen I don't come on what are you talking about 4,000 no I'm giving you an answer at least listen to it you you're just not being able to say anything yeah I'm going to open up the phone lines now Sun Naran is he giving a reply I don't see an effective reply Sun Naran is an effective reply the incomplete project the incomplete projects in harana are being completed part of the 10 years stalled KMP is finished the dwara express way is whatever had to be acquired and is not that is not the issue the issue vested interest corruption and theame game between all of you this one is pointing a finger at that one that one is pointing a finger at this one what is going on why this misadministration why this corruption where is that 40,000 CR going where is the 1,000 crores going are you I'll tell you I'll tell you the I'll tell you the problem with this with this BJP government in urban planning one minute one minute just a minute Raman Malik Raman Malik I suggest one thing to you I'm going to now give you a 5 minute break before I go to samit Patra in these 5 minutes either you go on the internet find out some information or call up your political Masters and say I'm being grilled on the news are I need to give some facts you cannot get away with rhetoric not today I will I will move on I will move on to the other panelist now there Sunami cannot gr me listen I will Grill you I will you over the required I will make you answer my question scared it's okay Malik don't I will I'm here to answer sirita Nar Sunita Naran just just a minute Sunita Naran and samit Patra are waiting for their turn on the debate samit Patra is being unusually polite tonight Sunita he's just Gravely listening thinking when his turn will come and how he's going to obfuscate it you know the problem with the BJP is that they've got their priorities wrong for them it is more important to change the name of gura to gurugram in return the people of India's richest uh suburb get a new name and a even more gigantic mess it cost close to a billion dollars to do that by the way all stationary all visiting cards everything has to be changed all websites have to be changed and and you know Raman Malik was just jabbering I hope samit speaks some sense on this they spent 6 CR rupees you know on what samit private gaalas 6 CR rupees will be spent for the maintenance of private gaalas right and people as far as so you'll take care of the cows but what about the human beings they'll spend 20 hours on the road Sunita is there an unfair comparison to make given what has happened today well I ad you know the fact is what what what frustrates me is that every year we talk about the same thing every city is going down underwater because even if you spend money on making a road we just don't understand that it's going to rain one day we have no drainage that we plan for we have no place where we think of water we are a land obsessed country and at the end of the day you look at every road every fly over we make and we continue to make today we never plan for drainage AR enough so it is more than corruption it is corruption of the mind we have no idea how to plan today or to execute anything on the ground you see sambit three things won't work today one is appearing to be grave B saying sorry and three certainly not humor okay the situation is so bad that you said that you would give great governance to this country what you have given in turn is the world record for the world's longest traffic jam how does it feel samit to have brought things down to this is this what you promised the people of this country when you were elected is this genuinely what you were what what what you promised the people of India right that 2 years after being elected uh in Delhi and about 1 and 1/2 years after being elected in harana we will give the people of India the world's longest traffic jam Mr goswami you are right and uh as a spokesperson of the party which is both in part in harana as well as in the center I believe every panelist has a right to question me today don't paraphrase no no no no don't paraphrase don't give this long introduction please do not give a long introduction come to the point I come to Point sir I am I am I I am not even asking you why in the state of harana ruled by your party today a 20-year-old girl has been almost put in jail-like circumstances in a hospital after being gang raped by five people for the second time and the state is doing everything possible to protect the perpetrators of the crime I'm not asking you because if there is a collapse there's an Institutional collapse that's happening and it's happening under your watch but that I saving for debate number two right now I'm asking you you have given the people of this country the world's longest traffic jam and you are answerable you need to tell us why it happened and by the way sorry you've also given you've also given this country right the most expensive car ever used by a sitting chief minister goes into some millions of dollars the new SUV that the the harana chief minister bought himself explain this hypocrisy no no you're right you have every right to question us and that's why I was answering as to what went wrong I before the debate started in fact the district collector was himself apologizing he was saying that well I promise that this will not happen the next time things may have gone wrong and I'll tell you this is what Sunita Naran was speaking was absolutely right bankruptcy of Mind bankruptcy of planning and I have the report of the CAG 2013 of the planning of guram but then I would not like to politicize this issue it does not deserve to be politicized then you would say I'm playing football between the governments but the way it should have been planned the way the drainage of water should have been planned has not been planned well yes if there was any wrong by the present dispensation also which must have been there must have been wrongs there must have been misses people should be accountable for that and they should be punished but citizen ordinary citizen of this country should not be pushed to an extent where they spend 18 long hours in a jam unimaginable see you're offering you're here to offer sympathy say to you that in in Gujarat in 15 100 people died in Mumbai in 200 five, 1493 people died during the floods in Chennai in 2016 500 people died and you are saying it will not happen again what kind of platitudes are you giving the people sir I cannot answer for what happened in Mumbai you are right you're absolutely right in uh projecting the statistics that you have done but as far as uh guro is concerned I was just quoting what the District administration said in front of the channel I was just borrowing his words that this is the situation you promised I age you're not getting the point suffering did you or did you not promise to make gurgo a super spart city right is it you you said it would be a super smart city I want to know whether this is your vision of a super super smart City then say we have failed or that we everyone is waiting for the turn so I'll be very quick with you never waited for your turn in the way you're waiting today no 30 seconds just two quick points one to say that the Modi government is not working for the infrastructure no sir because if we are discussing the NH the national highway today and this is the government which has given maximum amount of national highways please don't reel the statistics tonight don't reel the statistics tonight I would not we are back the apologist a prash the debate is open let's talk about bangaluru let's talk about bangaluru Kiran majar show is on apologist arguments that we have heard innumerable times absolutely absolutely and uh so you know we are not responsible and I want to get on the debate I mean blah blah blah the fact the fact is that there is CWS and CWS of rupees which are allocated towards these Works none of which seem to find their own way into into the work that it should be done I mean this is an annual ritual the scam that we see in Mumbai the desilting of the miti river the repair of the potholes the relaying of the roads and come next Monsoon we are back to square one so either there is a Clear Vision because we were promised you know uh that things would change two years down the line there is very very little that has changed and all you hear is Mr samit Patra being an apologist or passing the buck now this will not do because there is finally a time when the citizen says I have had enough it's time for the citizen to get intolerant to hold these people whether it is the political people or it is is the bureaucracy responsible and until that happens until each one of us wakes up and says enough is enough this will continue all they want is their L batis and you know the supreme court order be damned and the citizens be damned yeah and there will this this will continue yeah uh in bangaluru I just want to run the pictures before I go to Kiran Maj show um M sure and and danish Ali if you're on the debate please explain to me you see what's happening there there is a lake called the belandur lake the pictures of frightened people when it's being broadcast nationally some people believe that it's a you know this is not real footage people who are outside of bangaluru say it's made up there's some you know special effect somebody is used this is out of a horror film it cannot happen uh you know maybe this is magnified visuals but this is what is happening in Bangalore and viewers this is not foam this is toxic foam this is foam that has incredibly high amounts of ammonia and phosphate and very low dissolved oxygen this is sewage viewers this is not foam this is sewage that has turned into foam and piled up on a lake it is poison and poison has been put and that poisonous lake is now overflowing viewers this used to be Garden City at one point of time it's not a mess it is a nightmare the stench I am told Kiran majumdar Shaw is so unbearable that people who live near this Lake cannot open their windows but as long as things are going fine for HD deaga whose representative is on the program for the congress party who cares right Rahul Gandhi will keep talking about what's happening in gurug grah because it suits him he won't talk about what's happening in in bangaluru you feel embarassed today Danish Ali at what you've done to bangaluru this is what you brought it down to you feel answerable you feel answerable Danish Al before I go to Kiran majumdar I just wonder why all the politicians are so unusually silent today Kiran majumdar on my program tonight miss Shaw would you like to say something so I think this is a colossal this is a colossal governance failure where we have not held anybody accountable you know where whether it's the citizens holding the Civic agencies accountable whether it's the politicians holding the uh Civic agencies accountable nobody is accountable and this is accumulated failure over a decade or so and it is shameful because even citizens many citizens have flouted bylaws building bylaws encroached on lakes polluted Lakes and this is what we are now facing this is the huge challenge the huge Mayhem that has happened today in Bangalore and as someone said this is going to happen every year and you know politicians have a political agenda that doesn't even feature the average citizen they don't care about people this is not a people's agenda that they are on we all know that there is a lot of corruption there are plenty of nexuses there are plenty of Mafia who are basically you know just absolutely destroying anything and everything about this country and we are all helpless citizens shouting in vain on De ears and I just feel that you know there is there any hope at all I mean really I'm I'm come to that point saying there isn't politi just don't seem to get it no no no K Karan shaww can I can I be brutally Frank with with you on this program with all the viewers if HD deaa would have been living in a house next to that Lake and if a small particle of foam would have entered his house and rested on his garden and if HD deaga or for that Minister case the incompetent chief minister of Karnataka if they had to open their windows and smell the stench then this problem would have been solved a long time back right but it doesn't happen that way Danish Ali you were very busy one month back the big fight over who's going to become rajas saaba Member of Parliament oh my God so much excitement who's going to be Raja MP but what about this yes Miss Shaw go ahead complete your point yeah yeah I just wanted to say that look this is in the heart of a very very upmarket suburb called Whitefield I mean you've got plenty of you know uh teis living there and you have politicians living there so it's not like you know it's it's out in the boonies no no but it's not next to the chief Minister's house it's only it's only a child who has to use inhalers so no no no yes Danish Ali yes Danish Al finally you are opening your mouth what happened today you were so excited one month back when you were on the program your chances of becoming a Raj MP were high every day you would come and passionately debate you would never wait for your turn like this at that time you and samit Patra would constantly at goes at each other making accusations today you silenced I'm happy you're silenced yes Danish Al I I I am not silent at all let it me be very plain see in bangaluru from 1999 onwards till today I have no hesitation to say that there was a big Nexus between the politicians the bureaucrats and the land Mafia which has turned this Garden City of bangaluru into the garbage City I have no hesitation to say and let me remind the viewers in 2006 during Mr Kumar Swami's government there was a legislature commit appointed by under the leadership of Mr it ramaswami which has given the report that how many politician across the political I don't like this political debate at all tonight land I don't like this political I don't I don't like theame game going on what is the point of you know as far as they are concerned there is a government of the state there is a government of the country these are governments which are supposed to represent including some politicians I I have no hesitation to know your problem pointing the finger all the same all the you are all you are all the same you are all the same you are all the same you are you are all the same and when it comes at each other I have heard the jeli in gorakpur for God s please stop the speech Al stop the speech you want you want to ask question then I'm going to ask you why should a 46y old vegetable seller be filling Pooles in Mumbai in memory of his son who was killed by a pothole despite the BMC being the richest Civic body in the country with a budget of 37,000 crores why should a 16-year-old girl called Savita be crushed under a bus in bangaluru in a pole related incident when the C City Civic body pledges to make bangaluru pole free answer that question tonight answer Sunita Nar answer Kiran majar why should an office go be made to wait for hours in a Mumbai traffic jam due to water logging when The BMC spends 400 CR rupees on pumping stations the only question is where does the money go the money is going into the pockets of these politicians the money Danish Ali is is lining the pockets of the bureaucrats and the politicians and you together have come together to cheat the citizen the C however has been patient with you for a very long time but I see pictures today I see pictures today on those pictures which are on the screen are of a father in Mumbai who's covering up portol who's covering up portol with his bare hands because he lost his son in a pole related incident the pro the fact is the politicians don't realize that the patience of the people of this country is really SN wants to say something here is coming in here was no no no no no no no no Sunita I want to raise I I just I just want to raise this debate to you know the question really is what kind of smart cities do we want now one of the things that has bothered me tremendously is that when government has selected the cities that it wants to which it says that it will invest in to make a smart City one of them is New Delhi now my bigger problem is that unless New Delhi drowns unless New Delhi finds out that it is part of India that India it cannot be the Gated colony where everything is green politicians bureaucrats have no idea of the mess that surrounds the rest of us and it is in that part that they want to invest even more to make more green I mean what kind of a message is government giving out will clean our own house we will make it really smart SM City which sense is garbage to uh South Delhi uh New Delhi does not even treat its own garbage believe I know what I'm about to say yet it has 30% underland yeah we we getting no answers from the politicians tonight no answers whatever I'm about to say I believe Sunita Nan would uh kind of support and second me uh see what I'm talking specifically of guran the new gur that has faced where did the money go and what is where did the money go no where did the money go let me please Raman Malik Rik listen Rik listen you think this is spea that you're going to come here and make a speech I'm going to let you get away with it no this you answer my question you answer my question you know what Raman Malik you think looking great and giving a speech question I have ANS are required by the telling you India is today colonized by a bunch of corrupt politicians where did the money go in gurug answer you where did the money go so I am telling you would would you be to listen to what where did the money go don't waste my time where did the money go so listen where did the money go what happens is what happens is what happens is what there are 58 sectors in guro which is raised to 120 sectors of of which EDC is collected IDC is collected and there is no infrastru you got your facts wrong you got your facts wrong you don't even know what's happening in your own State you should be embarrassed of yourself you should be embarrassed you don't even know your facts you know I'll tell you what what the real facts are the facts is my facts are right your if my facts are wrong I I'll tell you first of all lower your voice where am I wrong tell me I'll tell you where you're wrong okay I'll tell you why you're not aware the fact is that it was in March this year that the harana Urban Development Authority identified 21 Focus areas to finish pending projects on a priority basis for your kind information and I'm shocked both with your ignorance and your arrogance and after I finish telling you this you're going to stop waving your finger for the rest of the program one of them was the construction of the bridge on nh8 and yet today nothing has been done about it Mr politician for your kind information so stop passing the buck a month ago one second one second I'm not finished I'm not finished finished not finished now tell me answer the question today 1,000 CR were collected from the Cien 1,000 collected from the A C brid that you are referring to on hero Hond for your information it is already under construction oh you want to talk about Hero Honda chalk you got your facts wrong you want to embarrass yourself here on the program so much you think you'll get away with lies now let me now let me contradict you on that fact One Second One Second One Second One Second you the problem is politicians like him must be completely Exposed on shows like this in areas like the Hero Honda chalk right which gets severely waterlock during the monsoon season considering the same problem had hit the citizens last year too for your kind information and you should be ashamed of it nothing has been done to overcome it substantially this year as well the gurugram police and call them right after the program and say I was embarrassed on this program because I got my facts wrong the gurug police has informed that areas except near Hiro Honda chalk are normal point is despite holding several meetings and promising to end the water logging this season there has been no change yet you come on the program and pass the buck now I can get involved in even more detail but the fact is that you have to explain to me and people want to know is that not the is Mishra where does the money go does the money go I don't understand I mean it's as simple that ble is coming into the debate ble a question answer for listen what we are undergoing in this country is environmental Anarchy the politicians seem to feel that they can dominate the environment they can't it bites back at this point Builders rule our voices are stilled because we don't have a voice with politicians the way Builders have now as far as I'm concerned Wetlands were filled in all these cities including Mumbai including Bangalore including Delhi land has been cemented the point listen to me there is no way that a politician can stop a flood from happening if you don't allow water to seep down into the ground you look around your cities today you're building you're just building money is being made Builders are coming out over there and and distributing their wealth and the people of this country are and sir in Singapore every single day every day the city is fantastic everything works normally there's never a flood the the rain comes every single day in our country there's one rain and the whole bloody City drowns yeah how is this situation possible and year after year after year what is going on and one government blames the other government and finger notame anybody I'm telling you the what is this nonsense you know the average going rate I'm told as far as Mumbai is concerned Advocate makran Nader is a cooperator of The BMC leans towards the Shiva you know makrand I am told that 50% of the money goes as bribes or commissions 50% is the margin for Road making in Mumbai and it's deliberately done in such away with fixed people fixed matches between politicians bureaucrats BMC and contractors that 50% of the money is cast aside as money which goes into the bank the rest of the 50% in there is then distributed for the work out of that also another 30% goes in margins to subcontractors so the if 100 rupees is released anecdotally it is told that 25 to 30 rupees go into construction 75 rupees goes into the banks of people who become very rich which explains the number of expensive cars on p hold roads of Mumbai Makar how long will the Sham carry on my my my my my very Elementary question to you is this you're a politician you represent the ruling establishment in The BMC in Mumbai richest corporation of India and one of the richest municipalities in the world I want to know from you that when you see the pictures of a 46y old man taking a scalpel and concrete in his hand taking bricks right and laying them on on the roads I'll run those pictures uh right now and the father is covering up the roads himself he's and cars are stopping out there people are asking you what are you doing he said the government will not do it I lost my son and in order to make sure that others don't lose their children or die I will go from Poole to Poole and I will cover up every single pothole with my own hands I want to know from you makran politicians like you what do you feel when you see like see this going on and when when you are aware that 70% of the money meant for civic amenities goes into bribes do you feel anything for people like it you may want to answer where this part of the money goes because honestly this has been happening for way too long for citizens to take it anymore and during when come elections it is this very own media which helps these political parties to to power so I think part of this money I'm sure the media should answer I think that's that's the most Shameless reply heard very long time the establishment you the politi answer the question you see one second where do media come into it we are at least embarrassing we are embarrassing you we are at least we are at least embarrassing you and hoping that you'll get a little embarrass I think it is very important yeah where did the money go for activist where did the money go not at all in fact I I would say activism is the way forward today because otherwise where does a common man go don't give there is no way that a common to problems and these problems have been there for years and end I asking you a question you did not answer my question and my question is simple that when you see a 46y old father fing p in memory of his at least in the forthcoming elections or whenever there are the when the next elections are there let Media represent the Common Man let Media give out the true pictures during the election do you think do of time highlight ma is sming rightly Kiran majara I don't know what kind of a faral reply is this what kind of a fical reply is this you know you need to understand you the one you the ones with the money we pay our taxes no we pay our taxes Mr Mr M first of all first of all Mr M this insens it is High Time citizens take things in their own hand the most I think I think that was take things in our hand what do you want us to do to throw stones at you what do you want us to take things in our hands we are civilized citizens we are debating with you people come into the you know you know something M you know one second Mand you know something you corrupt politicians you corrupt politicians bureaucrats system Nexus you have the tarity to ask the media questions what will you tell the family of Akil is shik from mulund and 70-year-old Vasan balero bandup who fell into drains and died that the drains were to be covered up by the media the drains did not belong to any particular agency or party but somebody else the absolutely stellar and corrupt Civic management of Mumbai and by that way that's not your personal property that money paid for by the taxpayers of this country you answer the question today have some shame a 46-year-old man goes around the streets of Mumbai filling up Boles that have been created by you and you take that money away and in addition Cooperators like you demand Android phones laptops increase in honorariums AC cars and free medical treatment have you no shame you dare to ask the media the questions Cooperators of the shivaa which you are attached to including the mayor went to the pristine anderman and nicobar Islands in January this year to study roads drains and Water Management you went there for a paid holiday have some shame a a father is cleaning up Pooles in the streets of Mumbai you are having you are having holidays on taxpayer expense and I'm sorry at that point of time the shivaa said this is not a junk KET it's a goddamn study tour we want to go to anderan and nicobar Islands to under drain waterer management you have 37,5 to CR rupees 10% more more than last year and this is what you've reduced the citizens of this country to and you have the tarity to ask the media the questions were it not for the media politicians like you would have got away completely it's not the British Raj so wake up don't be sarcastic be serious for God's sake insulting the viewers on the program like this what right do you have to carry on on this sarcastic tiate feel some shame I asked you that question so you would feel in your heart what a father goes through when he Lo loes his son because of your corruption that boy died because of your corruption it should give you sleepless nights being naive but you learn nothing you learn absolutely nothing you think you can get away with anything you're going to be cornered sir politicians like you and Raman Malik will be cornered and ask questions and embarrassed on National Television so you learn your and you kill your smugness I am telling you for the last time do not call me a corrupt politician I said politician I have never assumed any office of profit I am asking you where did the money go where the people of India are asking you where does the money go don't say R Malik a corrupt Poli you don't try and be hyperbolic I didn't call you a corrupt politician I'm asking where does the money go I not taken a sing where does the money go you first take your words back Mr Mr where does the money go where does the money go not a corrup where does the Mone goes go where does the money go and and let me tell you what I said what I said what I said I stand by I'm saying repeatedly were it not for a corrupt politician bureaucrat Nexus I said there is a corrupt politician bureaucrat Nexus in this country I said R Malik I said there is a corrupt politician bureaucrat Nexus if you feel your part of it it's not my problem took my name and there corrup politician bureaucrat you took my name and said corrup Poli said that till politicians like you don't understand the of the person suffering from this Raman Malik kill your arrogance and tell me PES I am this is selfesteem this is selfesteem how can you I am one person who's given my life to the party Tak you see this is a standard tactic viewers Raman Malik is doing I I said no this is not a what I was about to say before you said this there are there are honest media channels like times now and then there are Radia tapes so there is a difference go to the Radia tapes Channel and ask them the questions Radia tapes is is associated with another Mr listen to me I said corrupt politician and Mr Malik I still maintain I still maintain that unless there is a corrupt politi bureaucrat Nexus unless there's a corrupt politician who said There are not corrupt politici it has been proven people have taken bail on corruption come out come on Kiran majumdar sha we not coming to the point somebody infu is totally committed whatever the problems are identifying and rectifying on a 2 2 kilm stretch Sunita n would appreciate this fact on a 2 km stretch which is only 100 ft wide the earlier government had approved around 27 lakh Square ft of area and can you imagine the pressure on the system and on toping that where it collides with the national highway they have given two petrol pumps and a and now you tell me have to make good of whatever it gets samit If Today somebody gives 30,000 they will not be able to make the city com the is saying something g go on g what are you saying G baa welcome to the debate yeah yeah yeah yeah thank you Arab I just wanted to say the pictures show the Dismal state in especially the city of uh Gula and I think the BJP government whether it is the state or the central government I know that I'm coming to it please be patient the B JP government is busy changing names of the city they are not at all bothered whether they should change the conditions that Prevail in the city and Gula even though it could have been the jewel of harana let me tell you the plight of the residence is such that there is no planning there a builder buys a piece of land he uh then Brides the officials and then he's given a license the infrastructure be it the sage be Road connectivity is completely missing I would contrast it with a city like Noida Noida has been thoroughly planned stop you know this is you think a up election advertisement show going on are you going to give me it is not advertisement program hello listen you mistaken this channel for someone else should answer don't this I'm not interested in your political Tic Tac going on here I don't even find it fun I don't even find it funny I don't even find it funny listen to me I know your important to improve the amenities in the existing C getting counter is coming in I want I want K Ma you find this convincing K Maj K majara you find this convincing every day every day no no one second one second listen God of for God's sake at least today let citizens am I wrong when I say you you check the infrastructure whatever is available in NOA and you see the connectivity I am tell you be it the that is coming from km of Express is coming listen so am I not supposed to highlight something that g every day every day what happens is structured points are given to you by our political parties which you repeat on the program you all make speeches you don't answer I think that what I'm saying today is what I'm saying today g g today listen to some other panelist so please yeah listen listen to some others listen why not I I'm here to listen to them and and they can probably speak enen Mr bwami please ask Mr baa who y Singh there they start there they start between both of them now you will start a standard political debate can you repeat no you don't repeat the point the point is I don't want a standard political debate today my point is simple St new the infrastructure in the ex I won't plead to you again pleas please one second one second I'm going to Kiran majara K majar Shaw is anyone interested in the standard political diet tribe between politicians who fail in their respective States and use each other's failures as ammunition for debates like this stop can I have on the other side please G quiet for a while please I think the first thing that all politicians must remember is that they Citizens First okay I think what we all suffers they also suffer and I think they should put politics above all this and you know basically focus on how do we really crack these problems I can tell you that RK Mishra and myself have given up a lot of our time to work with the government work with the Civic a agencies and one thing that is very apparent to us is that we have very very poor expertise in planning in implementing in designing I think that's where the government has to focus yeah yeah R RK Mishra R Mishra RK Mishra please RK Mishra my point is you've been part of many debates including political debates constantly politician put one other failure can I present a possible solution I don't know one solution which comes to mind is don't let politicians run municipalities and corporations in this country we don't trust them they only use it for bribery corruption and lining their own Pockets do you agree with me on that please listen listen yeah Arab so the problem is running a city government is not about politics City governments are not about making laws the legislator and the politicians are elected to make the law city government is a very specialized technical work look at any municipality in the world is run by a mayor and mayor takes the experts on subject matter and they do the job in India it is made by the politicians run by the politicians for the politicians of the politicians that is why I said look Bangalore mayor do you know the name of the Bangalore mayor shangai mayor is as powerful as CH in bang for you have absolutely no CL how you know in again I would say what you are doing here is politicizing the whole thing I think it is and do not take this line down think people should get activism [Applause] I think I think Mak you're repeating yourself let AR complete his point Mak one second the problem with problem with politicians like you is Sol the city problem understand who talking I don't understand who talking no no no one sec M will you for God sake keep quiet when when I tell you to be quiet will you be quiet or will you go nonstop like a broken record please wait for your helping for yeah second makarand be quiet running the cityis running the city is about expertise no no one second the point is running the city is about running the city is about activism is not about activism it is about expertise exactly here we have a politician running the city is not about jenda running not politics it is about about the expertise don't know how to fix the dra you don't know how to make the road you don't know how to manage the traffic it is scientific up the political I told you to be quiet don't you understand it when I tell you once you're talking about no you don't understand are going to their jobs people are going to their jobs they earning money they don't have they don't have time to come on the street what nonsense you're talking about R you people have people have jobs to do they earn the money only cities create jobs only cities create modi's government has been accused of not creating jobs only three cities in the country create jobs why the hell Modi is not focusing on the cities cities need one lakh 2 lakh crores he's giving 5,000 500 crores for a smart city it's a gimmick it's a joke Bangalore Mumbai Ahmedabad Delhi they need 2 lakh three lakh crores why the hell he not talking about that they the only city who create jobs they absolutely have no clue how to run the city look at Shanghai look at Tokyo look at Bangkok what the hell we are doing talking about here he's absolutely no clue he's running around the world our chief minister absolutely no clue they have only 10 % representation of the city in the par Karnataka is 70% tax of Karnataka 60% of GDP of Karnataka but has only 10% of MLS that's why Saraya doesn't care about Bangalore he doesn't worry about Bangalore Rahul Gandhi is giving all this Gan in loka why the hell the only state they have in India is Karnataka why the hell he doesn't come and come and fix Bangalore why doesn't he fix Karnataka giving them funny speeches and parament is not going to make congress come back make Karnataka better make Bangalore better you might even come back the politicians have absolutely no clue what they are doing this is a problem and they're so scared about what you just suggested no no one second before you just respond there because you think some somebody said something about the BJP suit one minute you see viewers viewers one second a very serious suggestion made here politicians we don't need you just get out of municipalities it's not your business you don't know how to run cities get out and M to m m trying to hustle his way into the program saying no no no no Mak is trying to say people are very angry understand people should rise up M people have risen up people have risen up and they are politely I think I think I think people are politely telling you to get out told politely people are telling you to get out of municipalities you don't know how to run cities you only want to use it as a parking lot for your for your corruption that's all that there is to it that's what they're saying I mean understand how no no do you understand you understand how seriously you are being told by a citizen on the program R Mishra is saying what are you saying RK RK says two words today he's saying two words to a politician tonight what are you saying same politicians get we do not need you in the cities you go make the rules in parament legis we don't don't know how to we don't need you to run our CI the cities one second one second has to come the debate in the middle place is on the de come on you're being told us clear mess come hold your horses you might run municipalities you might run countries you don't run the damn weather absolutely and you don't understand you can do what you like you're going to be punished and with you so will I so will my children so will my people why don't you wake up for God's sake and stop quibbling we are in trouble we are in serious trouble right now we're in advanced stages of climate change do you understand you fill your Wetland you can't decide sitting in theud no but it's not a question the public Representatives been thrown out from the municipalities from the local B what nonsense you are talking about we are not in the cities we are on the road what non talking about we are not expertise on the road you must take a break and come back second please calm down is on the debate and look at the levels of insecurity that have spilled on the program today the moment the moment R Mishra says to the politicians that please please we don't need you to manage our cities look at the insecurity that has broken out you are simply sending a message let experts run cities Poli are not don't need laws Al don't show me your aggression on the program tonight don't you understand a clear message of the people of this country I'm asking you Danish Ali you lost your right you lost your right you lost your right to govern the cities when a 16-year-old girl of the government that they don't they don't nominate the expertise they nominate their in no no no no no no God's sake one sh and what the hell they do you know something what the hell the politicians do a minute a minute a minute what do politicians do D what has he done for Bangalore a minute a minute a minute you lost your right to run run cities when a 16-year-old girl and and and you'll remember this Kiran majumdar show called Savita she was crushed under a bus in Bangalore you made a pledge in it was a Poole related incident you lost today you are saying you don't need politicians don't need we don't need you for cities yes we don't politians saying that we're telling you we don't need you to run cities you find other way find other ways to get rich yes you find other ways to get rich stop running our cities you made a godamn mess of it you made a frightful mess of it is responding n is on the debate you want to [Applause] Dem country know about running the cow [Applause] this I have accepted that there is a between corrup politician building MAF I am honest to that n adab I'll just like to say I do not agree with this I think think we do need politicians to run our cities but we need to make them accountable the day I'm sorry that's they don't know what you trying to be politically correct what do politicians know about running the city city is not politicians it is not about making the laws okay it is not about making the laws no no one second I is respond to the CI voice can be good politicians there can be bad politicians we going to take a break at that point break time I want to I want to ask I I'll close here I'll close here I'll close here there is there is something called there is something called just make one point before you close no I I want to go to k ma before that K Maj why is there so much shock and nervous make one last statement yes k k you have destroyed the cities of this country want to City you invest nothing in the city I just want to say that we have to hold our elected representatives accountable yeah yeah I agree we have to now can I respond one point I I'm closing the you make money out of cities you invest nothing on another one I want to say I want just in any system there are people as well as bad people not all politicians are bad are all bureaucrats back give you the money youest okay viewers I put this question to you I put this question to you as I go to debate number two viewers I put this question to you do you trust politicians to run our cities I believe politicians should not run hospitals politicians should not run hotels politicians should not run Airlines and politicians certainly should not be running our cities I think our cities are better off without politicians politicians can find another way of trying to make money cities are the cash politicians can find another way to make money why spoil our cities I'm going to debate number two which is also on the issue also on the issue when I come back I thank you all for joining me on debate number one on the news tonight thank you