A BluTV & Breaking Waves Exclusive interview w/ Marie Laufiso, Alofa Aiono, and Vasemaca Tavola

[Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] today we have a special episode with three former members of the green party who recently wrote an open letter about their mistreatment by Co leers Mama Davidson Chloe swre and other party members they describe how their cultural and personal well-being was hurt and ignored by the green party leaders especially during the passing of fana eeso Collins alofa aono a co-convenor of the basica greens lived experience Network had just lost a close friend and cooworker but this was not acknowledged by its co-leaders the issues with the BASF green started with the poor treatment of Professor Elizabeth K who had provided important support to the bus speaker greens but was unfairly attacked by some senior staff and imp including its co-leaders the recent mistreatment of MP darling Tana who also faced bullying reopened Old Wounds from their experiences with fat and Elizabeth k m m Davidson and chlo Rick's action were seen as exploiting racial stereotypes in the media before we start I warmly welcome Mar and vas mother who wrote the open letter on behalf of the BSA greens thank you for coming on to Breaking wave to share your experiences we appreciate that you've trusted to speak with us despite other media requests how are you all this afternoon and please introduce yourselves forgive me ad Hana I'm old so I've got a a wee bit of not a brief introduction uh V thanks heaps breaking waves for this opportunity Carano I'm the first born of eight salons with a Tong and great grandmother born here in oty during the 1960s and 7s uh Brock for is our no that's where our family home is and where I still live uh I'm very privileged to be the Green's first Pacific elected member and a third term counselor with the denan city council uh in late 2015 the denan green party Branch asked a number of us Brockville peeps to consider running for the 200 and 16 uh local body elections uh the greens felt that having a voice to represent the lived experiences of Brockville farno and other like suburbs at the council table was important uh in the end I was the only one available and interested so although I was a Manor supporter I joined the green party uh because of our value Polynesian practice of reciprocity once I was a green elected member I gave back to the branch for their Toto call and and for supporting my election um and the Deep South Province as well by assuming responsibility for such roles as Branch Secretary Branch co-convenor Province co-convenor and at a national level I was an exact member as well as local government caucus co-convenor and Secretary of course of the pafic experience uh so thank you again for the opportunity and um I'm feeling good I'm tired but we keep on soldiering on because our people deserve that thank you no worries thank you so much and uh can we go to alofa please yeah yeah yeah thanks for that sister I I I too am old um and yeah so tala my name is ala a uh born in read in Canon Creek P um but have been living now here in Tang new yaka gbin with my wife Elizabeth Kitty Kitty uh and I worked it out this is my 15th year um here in gizy and um I'm the youngest of uh seven children um to my late parents um and my late mother Lena La for a honor from the beautiful Southside Island uh Village of Lano and um yeah Mom and Dad met in in Wellington and basically we're Foundation uh basika family of p and proud to say that the homestead is still ours it's the one house that I was born and raised in in Canon Creek um and so yeah rooted in community down there in poor but now doing Mahi here in in gizy um my time with the the green party um my family were staunch labor supporters um probably uh very similar to mini basano and um I blindly just gave my vote to labor because that's what Mom and Dad did and it wasn't until I met my wife uh we celebrated 32 years this year that she actually got me thinking about why I give my vote to a particular party and so yeah I I had a look and similar to Marie the values that the green party um professed um aligned with mine and because that's where my wife was going I wanted to support her as well I thought yep throw my weight behind uh the green party and because we come from a culture of service it's not just join and sit there and uh do nothing my my service to um the green party probably is not as in depth as um but since joining I became the co-convenor of the Pacifica greens Network um we were small um but we were uh we were determined to actually grow our membership um and to make the green party look a lot more visible in terms of when you see the green party membership that we could see ourselves um so I joined in 2016 and basically um have held that role of um co-convener um since because big sister over there Marie said yep we need to keep going and and you're it so um also was involved in some other stuff um with uh policy sort of like on a side hustle and um recently an international um committee within the greens but due to my resignation I was pretty fastly chopped from that so yeah um that's me a thank you so much ala for sharing that with us now we'll move to vas bua my name is vas formerly known as emmaa um I have paternal connections to jauni in Kavu in Fiji and maternally my mother is a fourth generation pakia in New Zealand um and I've been here in South Oakland since I was 19 years old I came here to study um now uh 23 years deep in this work and in this space uh something there's something about water keeps me um keeps me centered to the space so um a mom um professionally I have worked as an Arts manager and curator for my entire career um but I'm shifting into um centering my art practice um so I started I joined the greens 2017 um Materia to U Materia felt like a leader that um resonated with me so um I left the labor party and I joined the greens and I didn't get very involved other than um you know wearing the t-shirt and voting um until we started activating the Pacifica greens and in what is termed the lived experience Network so um I also stepped up into a service role in Oakland we have a South Oakland Branch um and I have at two times um been nominated to be a CO convenor of the South Oakland branch and um resigned um from that role the week um that AA died so um I have now resigned from the party as well um and and that is where we have arrived at ah thank you so much V mother for sharing that with us thank you all for being here we appreciate this so much so the first question I wanted to ask was that this letter points out the mistreatment of Professor Elizabeth k um Marie from your perspective what poor treatment did Elizabeth receive from the green party leadership and how did it affect you personally uh to contextualize my answer I need to say that uh Elizabeth vano and and mine have known each other for decades uh we grew up together um in you know we've known each other since the late 70s really in here in ay denan and although um and before Elizabeth left uhti we collaborated on a number of uh projects we were members of the uh one of the few young Pacifica branches of denen um and we worked heaps on uh aoty youth trying to get a voice for youth across all sectors including boot boys and boot girls Etc and uh so when uh although Elizabeth and her siblings have left uh ay and live elsewhere in the Motu uh we're still in touch with uh uh their mother Aon who still lives here so uh and then looking at the green party stuff I I I think the having been at two agms now since Elizabeth resigned it's so weird to me that um they do this amazing damage and destruction of people's reputation and they just move on and there's absolutely no mention of uh politicians uh such as Elizabeth even though despite the huge contribution she's made to the party in all sorts of different ways so that personally affect me just blows my mind that you can do this damage to someone and then you don't even mention them at your um at your Gathering so I think that people in the party tend to forget uh for me there's a distinction uh between our letter because we're not attacking the Grassroots and flax Roots the membership we're actually challenging the co-leaders and the caucus but um people seem to forget I we never forget of course but Elizabeth was fourth ranked in the the um in this in the candidate selection list and then the powers at B immediately saw this mistake sending it to the sending that message to the wrong chat immediately took advantage of it to get rid of her so yeah hence our open letter and I think I I'm not sure about the other two but we I would have resigned if if V had was not um in the running I would have resigned then that's that's my answer I don't yeah I don't know the other two want to add anything yeah Al and V you're open to add to that as well we we all wanted to resign um but we stayed because of a fessel and we stayed because of that work and and we're encouraged to stay um by Elizabeth you know the green party copaa is bigger than the Party politics we all join the party for much bigger reasons than individuals but um it was hard to stay after seeing how Elizabeth was treated yeah yeah and um yeah definitely hard I wanted to resign ASAP um because of what would happen you know uh very personal because it's it's what was happening to my wife um and you know still stayed for the for the great good and I'm glad FY mother said that you know we stayed because Elizabeth told us to you know cuz we needed um to support epel um and some other ones on that list who we thought were were worthy of of our support but the main reason was the brother you know he was a connector for BF people that you know and it was Elizabeth that approached um fatana and basically said hey you know how about the greens being a vehicle because it was it was it was bigger than political alignment it's you know so um yeah it was it was hard I'm glad Murray said about the agms I attended AGM along with fana and Marie um the previous AGM um when that stuff happened to my wife it was freaking hard um but we we went there and I actually remember asking the question to the leaders which they pretty much fobbed off I said how do we um encourage our voter our voters who voted for the first time green I.E my family um when after the treatment that was demonstrated you know to Elizabeth and I can't even remember the their stin caner but yeah so um so yeah very very hard but as F mother Mar said it was a bigger co-a um Elizabeth saw the bigger picture that we needed to get good people into that place yes absolutely and you know I read the article myself and uh Elizabeth k sents a wrong message to the wrong group chat right and the way the leaders you know these are leaders of a party who have the support of hundreds and thousands of people responded to that and actually had the confidence to address it public publicly with these journalists it's very intentional and as a viewer I'm seeing this as there must have been things happening before because you don't just say Oh wrong message I'm going to go tell the whole world about it what is there any more context to this that you guys would like to share if not I'm totally fine with that but I'm leaving the question to you guys yes there's heaps of background you are exactly right leave it at bed okay we'll leave it at that okay I'm I'm super fine with that but I know that no one would just wake up and you know there there's a lot of context with this and I think Marie um hit it on the head too Elizabeth was ranked number four on the initial list ranking which was indicative of the work that she did within the party membership so the so rank number four that's one behind um that other person so um yeah we'll leave it at that hey let's leave it at that okay awesome and um you know we've brought up our our dear friend fana Collins you know a leader in our communities and during his tongy it's noted that M Davidson and Chloe swri did not acknowledge the BS greens um which fatana had worked hard to build with you Ala why do you think they didn't reach out at that time and how did that make you feel yeah well um at that time um James um who was still co-leader um it was James that was still co-leader with M A and um for reasons laid out in the letter you know the the MPS and party leadership basically just seemed to be ignoring us um you know for lack of a better term um you know and they had been ignoring us for a long time um so and I can only think and if you say about me personally I can only think that it was connected um to the crap treatment of my wife um Elizabeth and um and yeah how they treated Elizabeth and it manifesting into um guilt you know so that's that's my observation of it all um because as it was pointed out in the letter if it was a a tongoa member of parliament of um of the greens there's no way that tonu wouldn't be the first point and call this is what the Liv experience Network you know we have lived experience Network um lived experience within being B so yeah it's I was yeah I was upset I'm still getting upset about it now um but it wasn't just about me it was about our ouru our paf Network who were mad excited that if you know said yeah let's do this you know we can still hear him saying let's do this you know and um so we were yeah it was and it wasn't about oh he didn't contact me it was about him you know having the right send off and the right and the appropriate input from a suitable Community person that could advise the green party you know the green party that he was a member of for five minutes in terms of but yeah so um and we still to this day we all often get together and we still heave and and we're sad about what could have been absolutely um I'd like to open this up to V Mother Maria if you had anything else to add go Southside yeah the I mean you know um I was not part of the exact off cific AG greens but um our exact was 100% Salon you know with a wealth and capacity to inform culturally um to a caucus who didn't uh you know F funeral was but are more to the days you know there would have been a lot of cultural guidance that was um able to be tapped in that in that time frame um but the neglect and the lack of communication felt um intentional and hurtful and um also you know the context for people outside of the party is that you know we all turn up for meetings outside of our Lives you know we we all turned up for flowing up to Oakland I this is my studio here this is where we hosted green party meetings I mean we invested Our Life Energy our time our family sacrific so we could do this work so the insult that that was felt was the insult to all of the labor investment that we'd made into this party to grow the Pacifica presence and um visibility so the hurt is not oh they didn't email us it was like what an insult to all the people we represent to the labor and investment from our communities and to us having a seat at this table but actually from this action it felt like the seat of the table was non-existent MH that actually all of our work and all of our investment felt um like nothing and that's that's the insults you know absolutely and very important for a party that promotes inclusion and diversity uh so you can see these themes um coming through so um just another question to vas mother darling Tanner who was another one who was targeted by media narratives that damaged her reputation in Mana what did you observe about M man Chloe's Behavior towards Darlene and how did this impact you as a green party member um I'll offer as well some some context for that is that um I met darene through um her campaign and so she was standing for Tamaki Makoto when um stand supporting um n's campaign we turn up to things in South Oakland and darene was already there she was already doing the work she had the rosette she was talking to people she was doing the work to make the green party look like us in Southside you know in the mang markets at mang Arts walking around the markets just um when fana and Dalene got together I would stand back and just say look at what the green party looks like and so my relationship and understanding and respect for darene was seeing that and that's how I met her and to learn um about her background as an environmental scientist as an indigenous knowledge eological knowledge plus environmental scientist I was like how amazing to have that capacity within the party that she's turning up to things in Southside it just felt really exciting to me so what I observed in the Fallout um with darene is I mean like I'm a mom I you know bullying you know we see bullying we if we saw any of our kids any of our family any kid being bullied you you see it straight away that's what it felt like we were watching darene being singled out being isolated that um she had no one she was silenced and the language that they were using around her felt so violent it was such a form of um just slashing her Mana slashing her her Integrity when in fact what we have known about the you know alleged behaviors that have happened I mean none of us have seen evidence we're just taking what um was coming from leadership as as fact and when you knew Darlene and you saw her work on the ground and you saw her work and her advocacy which is like from a depth of her career right something just didn't feel right and I just I just um I personally felt really um disgusted in that language being used around an indigenous woman around a woman who's like us had given time and energy and investment to this party it felt so deeply disrespectful to me and in and as if they just wanted to smear her Integrity entirely um to build a narrative that we all sort of saw some gaps in you know and I can't help but notice that every time something goes down there's a an act of running to Media to quickly defame you know the S person that they are attacking and uh that's a very um how would I say it it's not good and especially when they're in a position you know where having access to Media is quite easy for them you know they could just ring up a journalist and say I have a story and and they could really so it's really an an abuse of power in that sense so um I'd go to uh you Marie what other kind of hypocrisies did you identify with the co-leaders of the green party well I can't really say hypocrisies but as as you would have read in our open letter um clearly Elizabeth and darene have been treated in a different way to to to Julian jenta or Chloe who for that matter yell and hickle all the time in the house and um you know it we're supposed to adhere uh to nonviolence as one of the four pillars uh and also in terms of the decision of the co-leaders and the caucus meekly following along you're supposed to make uh also adhere to the principle of appropriate decision making like how did the how did they make the decisions to to Target these to uh Tong ofo women it's just it's clearly obvious to us uh that it is very hypocritical in terms of the way that Julian gender has been treated so gently uh compared to to the other two and what were your thoughts on that ala I suppose you you touched on it before H you know it's um there's you know the greens profess to do politics differently you know um and yet they actually don't um that's probably a reflection that I have um have witnessed or that's my reflection and probably the other sisters as well um the commitment to Titi is spouted out in the Green Charter but the attacks on three Mighty MPS going back to Mia um um Elizabeth and now darling and it is the the power that the leadership have um the co-leaders have is that they choose to um spin this narrative um and they chw so that it's sort of like a grooming of the membership and the public that what they say then Grooms the public to either idly just go along with what these people are saying because you know um they they're good people aren't they they're good people I've chosen to put my support behind this party they can't but until you actually there and you see it roll out you know you see it roll out and I use the example of my wife is because she was committed to this party and and the amount of work if anyone just did a sort of a a crass sort of work in motion of Elizabeth prior to her um a saying yes I'd like to run because she joined in 2015 you will see the amount of work that this woman has done so so just that alone and then what she achieved in her one term because she was always said I'm only in here for three years guaranteed so I've got work to do so she didn't take it for granted she didn't think I'm going to be here next election um there's there's those the commitment to nonviolence you know Marie and V mother said that you know how can you say that some MP's Behavior we use Darlene saying that it falls below the bar of what an MP should hold M themselves meanwhile the current leadership I.E M you know the leaders can go out and verbally attack that level of violence but no one seems to to to um investigate that or hold that and the example that Marie used with um Julian jenta slap on the wrist as no standown of portfolios no invest you know but yeah so um as you are all sharing these experiences I'm also picking up on a few other things so the attitudes that we receive bullying you know gatekeeping there's favoritism as the treatment of Julian and compared to the um Elizabeth and also um other members so how did that affect the spirit of the party because I'm sure it would have you know these things are happening and party members and supporters and volunteers are this you can't hide this this kind of feeling within a party how was it for for you all um I'll start with you v um well for a lot of people your experience of the party if it's if you're a member is that you might go to a branch meeting um and generally a branch meet so these are you know geographically different parts of Al have got different branches and so you Ro up to a meeting and you meet the other people who were like I'm into the greens too um my experience is that in Branch meetings and the reason we have lived experience networks is because the branch meetings are are pretty heavily dominated by an older generation of paria largely you know kind of home owning a little bit more privileged class um than you know me um and so I didn't expect that when I turned up to a South Oakland Branch meeting but that's exactly what it was um I I'm tell I'm giving you this context because when I think about the culture of the party those branch meetings is the party you know the culture of the green party is exactly what I have encountered in those branch meetings which is I mean I said to our team you know in Southside I've been working here for 20 plus years whereby you go to meetings in South Oakland where Mar and Pacific people in charge we uh we have agency we we um my daughter goes to a school which has Mar and Pacific women at governance management you know uh teaching all the way through so it's normal for me to have M Pacific people at the table at the top of the table um what what unusual for me is to go to a meeting where there's still uh where we feel like a minority and that there's a very eurocentric um dominant kind of energy in that room so um I mean it's you know we we we talk about it amongst ourselves as brown people but like we know what that feels like to be in those rooms where there's a lot being said and unsa or not said and we we sort of have to code switch and people feel comfortable and and not feel too intimidating and you know to I ain't here for that we're not you know the reason we have the lived experience networks which is architecture within the party that was we can thank people like Elizabeth k for actually implementing is to create safe spaces where minority groups like Pacifica Mai rainbow can come together in environments where we can actually have um open and Frank dalor because the branch environments which is really the party environment doesn't really enable that um I've sort of talked around the issue a bit but does anyone anyone else want to comment you had it on the head yeah I forgotten the question too Hana sorry no no that you you answered it perfectly you know just highlighting the culture of what it was like when these things were happening because um you know like I had mentioned before you can't hide that that Spirit kind of carries through the party so you you've you've definitely shared um how you felt and and thank you for sharing that experience with us um um there's also if I can chip in here there's also part of the culture of the greens is because again we're supposed to be committed to the honoring of Titi or whitei however and there is I think there is an acknowledgement sort of from the branches from the Grassroots that they do need training but time and time again um they don't listen like up well probably up in have advised and advised again the branch uh as to the unfitness of the candidates that Tang candidates that they want to run and they just didn't listen to the advice and now and now the green backed uh moldy local uh elected members are playing up and it's like why didn't you listen to the T fer advisers and just the way I think some Branch branches vary throughout the m to as to how they look after people but um our our young Pacifica volunteers who come they're just treated like crap they're not looked after they're not thanked they're not you know accommodation isn't it's all up to them to arrange all that stuff and so the party has got a lot of work to do in terms of actually really walking its talk about you know caring for caring for your people and it's you kind of assume that there's an assumption I think that um basika and tangin don't have ecological wisdom at the Forefront and as you know EPO EPO was talking about what with vzy mother and them talking about yes we have our own ecological wisdom that has been for centuries so yeah got a lot of work to do good luck to them and yourself ala yeah no I think the sisters have hit it on on the head um really yeah lots of work to do when we can only hope that the work can be done um you know the last AGM um the AGM before that didn't give me um much hope in regards to the actual party leadership actually living the values um you know and I really hope that the spotlight is is turned on them in terms of their own behavior it's like how are you actually living the values of the party so yeah exactly and I applaud you all so much for standing strong on your BASF you know values that's very admirable but which brings me to a question because you know if um they're not taking the advice of Mali and buser people uh to help uh grow the party um you know cultural Integrity is highly valued in amongst pacif culture so did you guys ever feel uh pressured you know to uh compromise your culture cultural values to elevate or advance in the party was that kind of like something that you felt with your experience with the green party I'll start with uh you ala um yeah I don't know about about pressure I think the only pressure I I had and pressure with love was from um Marie and Elizabeth um um You Know spoken like a true you youngest of the family um but you know as you heard from our intros Hunter we all held leadership positions within um the party and I I think that it didn't take people long to know that you you know who they were dealing with and you actually couldn't put um pressure on on any of us um to do things that went against our own cultural values you know look where we ended up it's like we' basically said um yeah not we've given you opportunity time and time and time again to do better and you still haven't done better so um yeah I I I think the it was it was more like say for the likes of Elizabeth andan I have that person experience because I see how my wife was treated when she became an elected member um and I remember what she said was that she knew going into that place you know there was a level of toxicity and or that word you know she didn't go in blindly but one of her Reflections was she didn't realize that the biggest challenge that she would have had to face was within her own caucus and that really became even more apparent come and list ranking you know me being so naive when she got number four we were so excited we didn't think that was going to be the case and I said oh wow when she came back I was going with people in you know were your mates in the party you know other MPS and on that floor were they happy and she said it was like tumble we it no one spoke of it it was like and I and there you go you know it's like you should be celebrating the it's like wow from number nine to number four but yeah so that's that's me uh what about yourself as a mother um I think we're always compromising our cultural Integrity when we have to make um pakia feel comfortable and we we had to do that so much in this party and you know I lent so hard on because he was such an amazing um buffer um that he you know to be you know Crest like white women loved him because um he made he he turned into um someone who was unthreatening I mean I watched him physically drop his shoulders and his height you know so that people so you could code switch so that Pia would feel comfortable and he talked about this in his mayoral election um campaign is that you know he a tall brown man in a hoodie was the most feared thing that people thought about in Oakland and and so I think we're always having to compromise when we can't bring our full selves to the table because what what we're accommodating for is prejudicial views of the way that we look and what we represent I mean one thing we brought up in the letter is the Trope of the angry Brown woman you know it's I mean throughout my Korea this has been used against me weaponized against me I'm a 511 big Fijian woman if I make one Pia feel unsafe it's like she's so big and scary it's like too easy you know so we cultivate environments where we can bring our whole selves to the table and I think that becomes a threat sometimes and what about yourself Marie uh I think the sisters have done a good job of answering yeah awesome uh thank you so much for that so I understand you know from your answers and from this uh talo that you guys strongly stand on your values and even while strongly standing on your values you have accommodated to the needs of bangy people you know to make them feel comfortable um so this brings me to uh a question that you know if you don't believe that uh Pacific people should have to compromise you know their values and their cultural Integrity the re the harsh reality is most of the parties that are leading are bani parties so I my question to you is what would your Solutions be what how could we move forward together as basica people and making a staple and you know achieving the outcomes of representation I'll start off with um well unfortunately with the exception of the of tiati Mii uh the political parties are as racist AF so if you really want to be in a create a space or be in a space um you have to create your own party I that's ultimately um my response and I know it's a lot of work and take amazing commitment but um yeah yeah and and again as uh as ala said earlier these political parties are only a vehicle they're only a vehicle for um achieving the vision of what we want to see for for uh for honoring to because if that happens that means automatically that the there will be vast Improvement in the lives in in and um Faro in communities of Pacifica throughout the M thank you for sharing that Marie um it does that sounds like a huge goal but I know um you know with you know woman as yourself I know it's not impossible um it's definitely possible it's just going to take a lot of hard work and gr and I'm sure it'll be more re rewarding I also support you know things that are led by basik and M people as as well um it's a lot um easier to attain the outcomes that we're wanting to achieve um what about yourself as a mother um yeah I think that's um really good points and I think what our experience illustrates is that it's very hard to retrofit a decolonial agenda inside a paria system um without um a real commitment to transformation or change and I think about the leaders in who been in the green party who've really um made me feel like that was possible was Materia it was Elizabeth um and it was a fle and it and so when I think about actually that kind of leadership um the natural alignment is with Tanga um and so I look at at things like the growing um I mean the growing energy in this country of unity unification of um Mari G and commitment dedication and it's it's in the language it's in the everything the the strength of what we're witnessing right now is is phenomenal and that gives me that gives me excitement things like um the invitation from the King for T Moana to turn up on the 20th of August to talk about allyship our natural allyship is with theena and so I don't know what that looks like I mean my experience have been with the labor party which you know had a lot of brand representation then with the green party um so I'm I'm like Maria is just like actually the power of being politically engaged doesn't happen inside those Vehicles it happens outside them and so it's definitely about just finding like-minded people standing up showing up turning up um pool to well from my point of view it's like anything that Mar need we put our weight behind um and that's yeah that's sort of where my energy is now and I think that's a very important point that you bring vasim ma because for people like myself you know when I was at a younger age and entered politics I was is often told you can never make it unless you join one of the major parties and that's the only way you can you know progress or bring your what you want to achieve so it's very encouraging to find women who believe in US believe in our own people to create their own Solutions um alofa what were your thoughts on that I look I I'll leave it with um with Marie and vas mother like I said earlier you know my political sort of life was um was pretty non-existent in you know and it's it's only because I've been around my wife and like-minded people with um with Maria and vasim mother so what they said I just want to Echo that and not lose their message thank you so much ala and you know um there will always be basa people going into National Labor you know these major parties uh what would your you know uh what do you think these major parties can do to so that Busa people can participate fairly besides not be racist well personally personally I I think they're just ticking boxes yes they don't really care about the lived experience and the suffering of over Decades of our people so they're just ticking their boxes and um personally I you know my parents um here in ay used to support the labor party and get out on scrutineer I used to go with Dad um in particular and go and Mom and go scrutineering on Election Day on polling day and and over the years well Dad I don't know about YY but um dad switched to New Zealand First Once he'd retired because of the gold card so um I don't you know they didn't really care about our people as volunteers that they didn't do enough to encourage them to stay and I haven't frankly been interested in labor since romics you know I think they're dogs that treat treat treason us and traitor us to the people sold us out and we're still suffering 40 years later that's political [Laughter] parties H what about your um s what was the question again I was just what do political parties need to do to make sure Pacific Pacifica people can participate fairly um I think you know the onus really is on paria in this country to do a lot of work around um cultural competencies um we know as uh non-white people what it takes to code switch and move into different Environ environments even change the tone of our voices drop our shoulders you know we are skilled in Intercultural communication um we are not on the same level as Paka and and this is why where the um the rub comes in is that we feel like we're doing a lot of work to um accommodate for Paka norms and Pia sense of security I mean this is just we are a young country but and and my mother is p a pakia woman and uh I just know how much you know as culture shifts a lot of the owners that she has to come on to um in terms of Al's maturity um as a nation culturally is the ownes on paria to do a lot of the hard work of um understanding that transformational change is going to be uncomfortable there is discomfort in US recognizing the inequalities of the past us that um created the environment of why we are where we are um but yeah that radical shift in thinking which a lot of us have had the privilege you know us three sitting here we've been around radical thinkers and like people who actually say actually things don't need to be like this like I know a lot of people who are just you know the media is truth they watch the news TV and Z is culture know like there's um a lot of people education the media landscape everything has cultivated a sense of comfort for pan new zealanders so um I think the onus is actually not only on the individual but on the whole system I mean we're seeing it in education like the way my daughters grown up singing wa and doing kak at the beginning of the day like this is transformation what's happening in our children it's the olders it's the elders that need to also do work and this that's the work that we witnessed like I witnessed in the branch meetings of the green party I witnessed in the policy conference that I went to earlier this year that um the onus really is on uh certain generations of par here who um need to do a lot of work to sort of understand how to live and move with the the rate of evolution that's happening in this country you know there's a real push back we had after just and we now get this Coalition so there's always swings you know um but in this swing and then within this tension I think there there is an onus actually on paria New Zealand people and culture um to have good hard looks at um how they um what's their role in in cultivating safe spaces for other people to engage effectively yeah and yourself ala yeah um all all of that all of that and I suppose it's at its most simple level is is like um just hand the mic over we have paf leadership uh we have wisdom like we said you know we get we get stuff done and it's um more than just a tick box if you truly you know want this transformational change is actually lean in to the experience and the skills and expertise that is out there you know it's um and and what does what is your party doing to truly get that engagement and to Value it see the green party say you know and they have the lived experience networks awesome but then it's like that's the tick box that's it we've given you a little space for you to hang out and be with your your sisters and that but when it comes to AGM you know it's it's it's that thing it's like what does it truly look like do you really want want a membership that does have a voice or are you and I'm saying this to the leadership or are you just really ticking boxes which then makes you a little you know even worse than our right our other political parties because you say you do better but you do not and it's the whole thing you know when you know when you know more do better as opposed to you know just trying to hide things and B things um and lies I'll say it I'll call it out and just manufacturing lies for people to basically I'm not going to dig too hard to see whether that's truth I'm just going to believe it and that's what they rely on yeah I I just quickly add to that that you know we know our worth we know that we bring cultural capital um and we what feels the most rotten is when our cultural capital is used without us and that's what I guess you know for me when we when we mention B's name in our letter is that what we witnessed after the funeral and um uring yeah but the way this party used his Mana to elevate a political IC cause it felt so violent and so Shameless and that's when I talk about cultural capital and the misuse of our cultural capital that was evidenced in that week and the thing is is like we saw it from the inside but our people saw it from the outside we saw it we saw it in the formativeness of how the green party maneuvered around his death and from the last week of conversations I've had with my community we all could see it you know the the our letter became just evidence for what a lot of people could already see and so we just yeah it's not okay it's not okay in 2024 and we didn't lose for this out yeah thank you so much for for sharing that with us and um I can tell just by um your sharing your lived experiences how how much this has impacted you all and how important this is but um i' just like to applaud you all that your work will not go unnoticed and um there will be blessings um that will come from it and um hopefully that will manifest within our youth so uh my last question I'd like to ask you all is you know what is your words of encouragement your word of advice to BASF and M youth who are wanting to enter politics and may face these kinds of challenges um I'll start off with you Marie uh the path to leadership is service so if you if you want to be in those positions of leadership once you get to those positions never forget your never stop doing your service um and by your work you shall be known um and find a great group of colleagues and mentors and hold yourself accountable to them because when you go in there wherever you go to ockland council or the community boards or Parliament uh you are not an individual you are the voice piece uh for your people so be really clear about your motivations um you're not going in there for to advance yourself or personal Prestige you're going there to serve so as as said I'm I haven't come here to to learn I've done that I've come here to help and big strength to anyone who wants to put them El up for that it's hard and it's sometimes thankless thank you for that Marie and yourself ala um you all that I think you know these challenges that young people um are challenges that young people might face in in school job or any nonpf environment or non- Maran space that they're in and pretty much what Marie said is figure out the things that you care about find some mates start the work and you know we we mentioned it you know the political machine party or whatever it's a vehicle if that's where you'll end up but you have to you know do the work you know it's not going oh I want to go into Parliament you know it's like um your work will speak for itself and um I just look at the work that these ladies um do and continue to do um and and many many other people in BF peeps you know I yeah I take my hat off this podcast um amazing amazing this is the telenor that is important for not just young people to here but my generation um as well because there's still people of my generation that vote blindly if they are voters at all that vote blindly just because it's habit you know it's habit and one of the things that I got excited about and so did Elizabeth was that we wanted to tap in about the values around the green party is to actually give our people an alternative you know an alternative because we all have different political views and stuff and you mentioned about we're going to have BASF and Mary people that join you know right-wing parties for whatever it is but the thing that Elizabeth and F were really good at was building those relationships and finding common ground yeah and then working for the greater good and that's the stuff that you don't see on TV and Parliament TV is the stuff that goes behind the scenes in terms of building those relationships cross party you know and so that's the stuff and I think that's where real leadership um you know is in terms of yeah how can I work with this party that I may not agree with but we've got to find some common ground he so yeah that's it's like let's get the work done and I know we've got some exciting powerful fantastic young people you know that want to do this m absolutely thank you for sharing that ala and vasata um I think it's really the emphasis on service is so important that um it's showing up turning up you know we all know we all talk about we're busy busy busy being busy is just like you're it's not a priority you know make showing up priority um turning up for Cooper bodies on the ground you know yes it's cool to like turn up to zooms and stuff but when you turn up physically it means so much um and so I would say that I would say um definitely understand what your values are and don't compromise them align with people who share your values um who understand the principles that um drive us as Pacific people and where they are aligned with um other people I mean it's the reason that I gave so much of my energy to's campaign and Mya you know me and my daughter did a pilgrimage down to Wellington to watch his Maiden speech you know um because I was saying to the ladies we were so broke that week but it was like you just turn up show up because watching that speech now I know that it was totally I'm I'll never regret standing up for that day you know but um I also want to really emphasize um that it's about learning from our elders because there are people who you know all time and circular you know and things repeat themselves we've seen what we've experienced in the green party we've seen things happened before this is why we've arrived at this conclusion it's like alen Elizabeth Materia um so you only learn about those lived experiences of the past by talking to people who were there so absolutely listening to Elders in this space um and read books it's sort of like it's one thing to get you know your news from like Instagram and stuff but um there's so much to be said for um reading widely you know um and I I tell that to myself as well because um you know sometimes I won't finish books and read the first chapter but um always say um read widely befriend Elders show up and know that um yeah absolutely the message is that political parties are only a vehicle showed us that you know that um he did his work at in labor party he did his work on the local board he did the work in the Council of Oakland Council as a councelor and then he stepped into and put his neck out there to be the mayor you know that's leadership that I have put my whole way behind you know so find those people and and people who recognize people like that because that's the network you want to be part of for sure 100 yeah a thank you so much for sharing that V mother oh that was such a lovely um round of advice you know join politics because you want to serve not because you want a fancy seat in Parliament uh know how to connect with everyone find a common interest and make sure that you're working together for common goal and um you know it's it's so important for our youth to take this on but thank you all so much for coming on to breaking waves and sharing your wealth of knowledge thank you for sharing your experiences and most of all for trusting um myself and my team to deliver this taleno because you know I do understand you have received other media requests which you have all respectfully declined and thank you so so much um this was such a a lovely episode for me to facilitate and I just want want to thank you all for that and I wish you all well on your journey moving forward I know you have big things coming your way um you know with the spirits that I'm able to um connect with just through the zoom it's been lovely thank you so much so love thank you [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music]