hi everybody it's Rebecca Caro here on faster Masters rowing radio today I'm continuing our theme about what is masters rowing like in different parts of the world and I'm delighted to welcome to the show for the first time Digger Barnes from British rowing welcome good morning thank you so much for agreeing to be the be the person who gets to talk Digger tell the listeners a little bit about you and your involvement with Masters rowing in Great Britain um yeah re uh rarely enough um I only started rowing a eight nine years ago um I'm now captain of penguin boat club in shury I also sit on the Masters um committee uh that represented by the clubs uh for the UK um all in eight nine years so yeah come from nowhere really well isn't that wonderful and and aren't you a great symbol of the changes that are happening in Master's rowing in the UK which brings me to my first question can you tell us a little bit about the clubs in the UK and where people can do rowing when they're of a master's age there are lots and lots and lots I don't know the exact number but there are clubs pretty much anywhere around the UK and you tend to find that um there's obviously School clubs but most of the um non-school clubs are nearly always run by Masters rowers um so and I'm sure that's the same across the world but there's the opportunity for anybody you know I didn't start row until I was 45 46 um you can literally uh if you can find a club that that that can take you in um then you can start rowing at any age um and that's a really good thing about Rowan um yeah it's just nobody explains to you how technical it is but you think oh yeah how can that be um but yeah I you know my daughter rode as a junior um and I spent so much time at the club that I thought well I might as well do it myself and then um and we agreed that I wouldn't start R until she left she left I did a beginner of course eight nine years later I'm here talking to you and she isn't growing so she uh she off went off to UNI rode for the first 12 months um and then unfortunately realized that she couldn't do uni work and socialize and row to the level she wanted to all at the same time so uh yeah she rode for a bit um and then when she finished uni and went back to um she actually ended up in London in the end um she rote for 12 months there and yeah it it's all or nothing with her so and he can't do everything she's 20 she was 21 22 and yeah there's other things more important than Rowan now going back to Masters rowing what are the big competition ratas and the events that are in the annual calendar in Great Britain uh yeah there's there's there's two really there's um the British Masters championships um where you can either enter as uh at the championship event um or you can then event or you can enter the uh like an intermediate event um if you win an intermediate event you can only ever enter the Championships going forward um it's held in Nottingham normally but not every year um I think it's stth Cloud next year or a year after um they try and hold it around the UK um again all run by volunteers Masters volunteers um that's probably the one of the biggest events where most people go to and then there's Henley Masters which is a few weeks later um which is just two lane on the heny course um shortened heny course um and that's a Friday and Saturday um again another big event um probably I would have said a little bit more competive than than the British championships and what about winter events do you do head racing yeah we do head racing um I had thought about head racing really uh yeah there's um Vesta they call it uh yeah head of the river um it's the it's the Oxford Cambridge boat race course um we do it the week before um and yeah I mean yeah that that week the whole week is Juniors on the Thursday seniors on the Saturday uh and us old people on the Sunday um 20 something boats um yeah big big big competitive competitive head race and yeah those are probably the biggest ones um you know when we've we've tried to uh we've tried to row winter and you know with the weather it's just been a nightmare but yeah good so yeah but we managed to do um we managed to do the head of the river so yeah that was good now across the Masters you've already mentioned there have been changes happening what sort of Innovations have come in in recent years to Masters rowing in the UK um not lot really um you know because I've only been I've only been rowing myself for sort of eight nine years um not a lot has changed for me um the connectivity between between Masters groups uh themselves um changed a lot in covid you know as an example we used to we used to all gather at UPA 7 on a Saturday morning and go right okay Euro with you and Euro with you um but then um over covid and everything everybody got into WhatsApp and now it's all planned before people go out um but other than that you know personally not a lot changed really for me you know um boats are getting better blades are getting better you know all that sort of stuff but but certainly for Masters yeah I don't see a lot really I really don't do you still have a masters novice category for racing so all of the racing is done on points um it used to be that you you when you were a master or or any or a senior or anybody you had uh beginners and then intermediate Etc um and now they replace that with points um so that the more points you get uh in theory they BN the races so you get um comparative competition um rather than rather than a beginner coming up against um you know somebody that's a lot better than I am um and yeah if there's enough people enter it works really well um if there's if you go to rata and there's only and there's only two of you and one's got 800 points and one's got three yeah yeah but but that's just it's that's a numbers game and certain certain ratas and certain head races are busier and the busier they are then the better it works um it's it's it's a the point system is something that gets debated on a regular basis and does it work does it not work you know but then back in the day when it was you had beginners and novices and and such that that only changed if you were in a in a rata didn't change in a head race so you could do a head race as a novice year after year after year and win so yeah didn't work does that does that mean you do not do age group Racing for master yeah so we yeah so we still you know I I'm just turned into a master Z so 55 to 60 and if you get so so if you go to the British championships you know we we and you and you enter um Championship level you'll always and there's say 12 of you they'll always try and Bandit so the people with the highest points are in the in the One race and people with the lowest points are in the in the other race um and again for a rata um head RAC is a little bit different because it's it's a time trial and um they'll put the head race PE the sorry the higher Point people at the front of the um group of suchar all mass disease but the highest point people will be at the front and the lowest point will be at the back so that that there's not so much overtaking when personally I think it should probably be the other way around so you the faster people get to overtake the slower people and maybe drag them along a bit and you know but hey there's millions of ARG arguments there now tell us a little bit about future plans that British rowing has for developing Masters rowing um again it it's not something I get too involved in you know the the British Masters championships um is evolving every year um and there's a um quite an active organizing committee there that uh I'm talking to to our group of Masters Representatives um there's also you know where you have it and what you do um there's talk changing dates and all that sort of stuff but um other than that you know the the there's there's talk of so if we go to um if we go to say R A Riata um and there's a master's e against a master's D um there's always a Time handicap they're they're looking to try and is that the same for men as in women uh or sorry is it the same for women as in men because we've only got one thing so there are all just constant um tugging up the little bits to try and make it more even more fair um more fun um yeah but you know yeah we just um I won say we drift along but um training racing doing a bit of committee stuff and yeah just yeah um hopefully it'll continue as it is and just improve very slightly and there will be no dramatic changes to be honest how many newcomers are you seeing coming in as adult novices to the sport across the country um so adult novices so at penguin boat club where I'm from um we're obviously like I would have said probably 80% of the clubs in the UK we all volunteer run and we have a waiting list to become um a member of penguin boat club and that's great if you can row you can come straight in no problem that's great but we have a list of a 100 plus people waiting to learn to row and I would have said 80% of those are are Masters more probably um and until you find the people that can help them you can't you know you if you did a four five 68 10 week beginners course that's great um and you think okay yeah now they can R but actually they can't really um you need to look after them for 12 months so the there are as many as we can get novices coming in um but it's just dealing with them and looking after them and not disappointing them because you know if you if you if you say right okay come on me be a member of the club we teach you to row you need to look after them for at least 12 months and I'm sure most clubs in the UK are in the same position of we don't have enough coaches and we don't have you know and and the list goes on and help us and everything and it's just a matter of we could take a lot more novices on if we had the man power to do it does British rowing have a a strategy for Masters or a master's pathway for exactly the situation that you just described not that I know of no no um it's it's it's something that's just done on a local level um and um I'm sure those clubs out there go go we haven't got a wait in list but but I certainly know over here that that we have we're one of the only the West Midlands where I'm from is is one of the only only places in the UK that doesn't have a start Center you know for the elite roow was um which hopefully British r or sort soon but um it's not something they they you know they can get involved in how would they help really you know other than supplying us people to help which isn't going to happen is it um you know we just we have to do what we can you know and encourage as many in as we can but but don't encourage them in and then disappoint them it's encourage them in and keep them rather than rather than do a learn to ro course and maybe one or two out of say 15 um stay because that's not not good use of time is it and I'm sure it's probably the same across the world you clearly have a very good insight to the longevity of the sport did uh so I know what it was like when I learned to row um and I you know I did a 10we beginners course and um then got R okay there you go you can row now when I clearly couldn't um and I don't want I don't want people to have the experience that I have going forward so it's it's it's about trying to do the right thing for people people aren't disappointed if they're on a waiting list but they're disappointed if you go right okay this is what it's like and you give them that real Buzz of getting in a boat and that's great and that's hard um and then go right okay you need to go back on the waitting to we can look after you properly and that's just not fair is it absolutely right Digger thank you so much for giving us your time for sharing some little insights into what rowing is like in Great Britain and to the rest of our listeners I will be back with interviews from other federations around the world shortly till next