Leafs Re-Sign Nick Robertson & Eye Max Pacioretty | Prospect Showcase in Montreal! 🔥

[Music] it's going back the other way put on a suit drink water don't drink and drive game over take [Music] light now you're more fluent he got so this is really good right here absolutely let's do it good evening Toronto Maple Lea fans and hockey fans how we doing tonight happy to be back here with another episode of leaes unfiltered here as always with my co-host Caroline how we doing tonight good thanks excited action-packed episode tonight huge huge yeah usually we have to kind of have like our like pregame discussion on okay what type of uh topic can we bring into the live tonight that we can maybe talk through and maybe extend it and actually make it feel like we've got real content to discuss but we don't need to do that tonight no we got it yeah yeah the news is creating itself it's creating our show here lot going on and fortunately for us for our show Leafs unfiltered it's Leaf related we're not talking about a leon dry CLE signing we're not talking about what other teams are doing we might do a little bit of that but most of the focus as it usually will be here will be on Le news and what the team is doing and they were doing some things today you beta all week they've been brewing yeah Brad tree living cooking cooking going through his phone he's just making the calls making the round oh yeah yeah and you know what if the leaves can play 15 forwards on opening night we're going to look really good we will look so good we'll be a bit a little bottom heavy on that 15 but to be expected when you have 15 players yeah but all those details that feels like semantics they figure that out in the next two weeks is at least what we're uh going to be talking through today and how are they actually gonna figure that out so just to ke up uh some of the conversations that you guys will be hearing and even before we do that as I usually always kind of forget initially if you are tuning in definitely drop us a comment if there's anything you want to ask a question on or you've got a thought on anything uh leave hockey related please don't be shy drop us a comment and we also encourage any of our viewers if they want to come on the live here on the hot seat you can ask us a question uh criticize any of our takes we'd love to have you on and that's kind of what the show is all about so we want to make sure uh we engage your audience and if you want to come on don't don't hesitate drop us a comment and we can bring you in yeah so as I was saying earlier teeing up the topics for today so the news kind of uh hit early and often um today we had the um I guess first up was the announcement of a resigning of Nick Robertson and shortly after that we have the confirmation of not one but two more um additions Max Patcher ready on a PTO which had been kind of talked about and rumored for a couple days but was made official today yeah and then our buddy Yanni hawen paaw Yanni Hapa yeah he is gonna be a leaf Caroline he will be a leaf amazing amazing just as they reported on July 1 and now even the Toronto Maple Leaf say it's happening so that's a good sign yeah unreal only one year though this time he got two years initially two years for 1.5 million I think and it's been downgraded to a one-year contract so something's gone on there's been some some meddling in that contract but yeah perhaps the two years was based on the presumption he had two healthy knees maybe now they know it's only one so you only get the onee deal I don't know I don't know yeah that's good you should tweet that I should yeah um so where would you like to begin I think that's probably our main to ICS we're also talk a little bit about this weekend's Prospect showcase coming up in Montreal where all the top prospects for both the Canadians and the maple e will do battle at the Bell Center in Montreal for game Saturday and Sunday so I can show you kind of the uh lineup for that and we can talk through who we're most excited to watch but I think we should start with obviously the uh big clubs moves today so where would you like to uh Kick It Off well I think we should sort of run down like you introduced the big moves that have happened today um I guess it all happened today um yeah and then also getting into like if we can pull a narrative out of what's happened in Leaf's nation in the last two weeks sort of who is vying for the leftwing spots that we have because there is a lot of one of these for left Wingers I think like it's just kind of up in the air uh nothing's locked in there's a lot of different ways that the team could go with these guys they brought in on PTO and the guys that they have coming up sure so I'd love to look at or hear what your takes are on who's going to get those those bottom two Winger spots for sure and like on on that note I have kind of like a sort of pecking order depth chart based on the uh signings today that we can kind of look through and we can see how kind of uh full it is looking right now for lack of a more appropriate term it just there's obviously a lot of NHL caliber players signed to NHL contracts and that doesn't even include obviously the upand cominging prospects that we see this weekend who may have a chance to crack the lineup so there's yeah there's uh as we uh joked about earlier there's only going to be 12 forwards playing opening night but right now you could probably make a case for at least 15 yeah I wonder if any these guys any of the four that were out can play D yeah yeah yeah I that's at least in the past been something we need but now do we have H Hawkin paaw that's not a worry that's true actually right yeah we think we do we think we do we'll find out soon we will we're we're coming into some exciting times so we'll hear more uh 10 sleeps Josh until preseason 10 sleeps is that all wow I'm not sure if the Leafs play on opening night of the preseason but the opening night of the preseason is September 21st and we're leaste game is the 22nd so yeah we have 11 got sleeps okay we were trying to Short Change us here it sounded like it was too hard to believe I know I'm like only 10 to get there for sure so I think maybe start with um Nick Robertson because I think that comes with you know a little bit it's not to me a very straight forward transaction I don't know what your thoughts are I'll let you kind of go first in terms of your initial impression of the move but I think there might be something else going on here other than oh yeah I just uh I decided I wanted to resign today but where are you at from I don't know a first kind of impression when you heard that he was resigning shocked was my first impression second impression is I kind of feel feel like he's going to be coming back coming into Camp dealing with Leaf's media dealing with the fans with sort of a tail between the leg situation he this summer had asked for a trade that was blasted across Toronto media it's pretty much the only thing we had to talk about for the first half of the summer so everybody heard that that he wanted out and I I'm curious to see what the reception will be for Nick when he arrives at training camp when he's playing in preseason if it's you know um um but also I like obviously he' made those statements he wanted out he didn't get any offers any bites from another team so I tip what's that it it would seem like he didn't get much at least the uh Maple didn't receive much interest or at least it wasn't good enough for what they needed back to move him yeah or you know Brad had a higher value on what he wanted in return um but I think it's really you know it adds an extra layer of excitement to the to the preseason and you know into training camp and I wonder what your take is on this is that maybe the Leafs have had some extra looks at Cowan who's also a left Winger in the last couple weeks and they've thought not quite there yet and that's why they've got Nick Robertson sort of as some added insurance for that slot yeah I mean I don't know if it would be connected to any uh concern over Cowen um I think kind of the reports that I've been hearing and there was an interview with uh the London nights trainer who was also kind of been doing a lot of like individual training sessions with cow in this summer and he just like was speaking glowingly about kind of his preparation his training and the fact that he um skipped out cow and did on London night's training to kind of get himself more prepared for training camp I I would still have the same I guess prediction related to Cowan in terms of the likelihood of him cracking the lineup opening night whereas I would almost still put him at almost like a 95% close to 100% chance that he makes the team and it might just be that nine game trial because obviously he can't just show up and be underwhelming and play 82 games in the NHL that doesn't happen for anybody but nine games I think is happening yeah I think he'll get the nine gamer um we'll see if he sticks but with him in the lineup who does that bounce so are you have you have you got n you got McMahon got Cowan and then you got Patti yeah you have Patti there you got duer there and there's obviously guys you know you could say could play rightwing could play left wi they kind of rotate but yeah where we were like a week ago or even 48 hours ago let's say where we're like who's play is there any Lea fan who wants to play left wi like we were almost at that point it was like you had Matthew n and Bobby McMahon and then God knows who else but then you go to like doer yeah obviously if you wanted if you were as Bull on yeah I left Robert from that that lineup so one of those four isn't going to be isn't going to be a lock no 100% And I think just before I kind of show the lineup like the thing with Nick Robertson and I agree like I was kind of shocked too to hear the news just based on everything that was reported and then I think like 48 hours ago Darren drer was like yeah I expect a deal with Nick Robertson shortly like what what he he doesn't want out anymore right yeah and then when he signs like one year at 875k my first reaction was this might be the worst ever hold out by a player you know like this guy held out till whatever you you said uh 10 11 more sleeps until preseason yeah and even less for training camp opening but like he held out and then what his agent said no just take the onee 875k from the team that you don't want to be with like so that's why and follow me here and let me know if you think there's anything to it and I have seen I think Frank Celli tweeted out uh something very very much in the same kind of with the same idea yeah Nick Robertson has resigned because there probably is a deal that they are close on but for the leavs to actually execute and complet it they needed or at least it helped them get that deal done to have him signed to a contract so the acquiring team gets that cost certainty to know what they're acquiring to fit in their cap but I almost believe that unless it was just like the as I said the history's worst alltime hold out and Robertson just woke up one day and said okay yeah 875k is good and yeah okay I want to play for the M Lees again I think there might still be a trade happening with inter with the player yeah now now do your sources do they have any trade destinations no no and and my sources are the same as everyone else's yeah there it's the Darren dregers the Frank selly and this one in particular just Sarah valelly I think he even said and I'm paraphrasing but he think he said it's definitely more likely that Nick Robertson is traded than he plays with the Maple Leafs opening night which I thought was very bold for him to go out there he's been known to have some bold takes and yeah kind of like Darren drer Elliot Freeman all them on any of their hot takes or predictions they're probably around a one or two% hit rate it just kind of I think the uh nature of that business you hear something and you feel you have to report on it you got it tweeted because that's your job see something you say something right's totally totally parent parent Association block parent thing exactly I've read I've seen a lot of Rumblings of that too that they think he might complete a trade but you're right there's no real discussion around what that trade might be might actualize into um what I'm setting uh 50% off 50% over under you think it has to do with Mitch Marner what are you gonna say over under that that his resigning has to do with Mitch Marner if there is a trade package that's Brewing that could be attack on to included in that I'd say under unfortunately at this point I um and it pains me to do it but I've obviously uh lost a little bit of confidence in a Marner trade happening before opening night yeah I don't know if that's more because Marner you know obviously difficult but exercising his right that he has within his contract to not wave his no movement I feel that's probably where things are at but I think it will be something that we do revisit a month from now when Mitch Marner has had the camera and microphone shoved in his face and being asked the exact same question over and over again he might and if he doesn't you know he not at well over a point a game the first first 10 games and everyone be like oh what's going on here like he's probably not enjoying his time here he do you want out Mitch no I love it here okay but I I'll ask you again you want okay but really Mitch like what do you really mean yeah you say no but you really mean yes please trade me yeah that's probably will do it over a point a game like those are the numbers I know that he he kept last year but that's like still pretty big stuff yep yep for sure for sure so yeah I mean I I guess I could see that maybe there is something like the Robertson could be kind of the added piece to a Marner trade but I don't know at this point I think it's probably independent of that but okay yeah but yeah I think just with Nick Robertson it just feels like the timing of it something else is going on and we're we can talk about the max Pat signing and then maybe show the entire forward depth and probably bring up again the likelihood of Robertson showing up yeah so with that I mean obviously uh Max petti former captain of the Montreal Canadians so you know you kind of love the idea or just a possibility of seeing him Excel as a maple leaf specifically in the games that we play against the Montreal Canadians that would kind of be a dream for Lee fans but it feels like that that's only a oneway road it's only the guys we trade same thing yeah the reverse happen totally teams that acquire our guys then they come in here and they definitely like the lamp they get a hatrick yeah always always or if it's a goenda if he's ever played for the Maple Leaves If he if we play against him down the road he's gonna have a 45 save shut out totally easy so hopefully we can reverse that Tren and you can't deny the obvious connection that we could see Max petti wearing number 67 right that's his number that's his number is he the one who reverses the curse are you hockey Illuminati all of a sudden I know as I was saying that I'm like this is if it's not already a hockey Illuminati video it probably will be by the end of tonight yeah for sure at right up his alley yeah no it's it's funny yeah so I mean Max Peter ready I I think obviously the initial reaction that I've at least seen on X is everyone's like okay great he's 35 years old how can he help he's always been hurt um he hasn't produced in three four years why are we doing this Brad not the right guy let the young guys play while you bringing in a veteran that's kind of been the majority of I know I know please continue I have a a take on that after you introduce yeah no I'm just going to say like I don't um I'm not completely against that as being like a you know at least a rejection or a uh you know disatisfaction of the move but to me I think it's you know it's a PTO especially so it's very low risk at this point you're bringing in a guy who's got a pedigree he's performed yeah sure it's three years AG go now but it's not like and we talked about it earlier it's not like you have a leftwing group that is formidable that like not a lot so I mean for me I think you're giving a guy a chance to uh show he still has enough to uh contribute that he can still be a productive player with the right opportunity so so I like the move I wouldn't say it's something that like I'm like overly excited about or predicting him to you know come in and have a rebirth and get be a 30 goal 40 goal guy absolutely not but this team for a while now for a few years now has always complained about or fans have the secondary scoring beyond your core guys your top two lines no one's putting the puck in the net so why would you be opposed to bringing in a guy who as recent as three years ago has been a guy who was on a 30 goal Pace yeah so I don't hate the move yeah um I just want to pick up on what you were saying about sort of we have become a bit of an older team um even our our star guys Matthews Marner neander they're getting into their late 20s like we don't have a huge crop of young 20 mid2 year old players um we're sort of we're sort of becoming like a bit of a a reti folks well we're not as old as the Edmonton Oilers the oldest team in the NHL that's true but we also everyone just showers with praise Edmonton's doing everything so good but the maple are too old yeah that's fair what I don't love that we're seeing right now is the competition for roster spots is basically going to somebody that's aging out of their career or they're injured or they're trying to make the team these are two very diff beasts that we're kind of looking at to to fight for a place and it's going to be really interesting to watch preseason no doubt but you got to be wanting for more guys that aren't really in those two opposite spectrums um but as for as for Patti um yeah I think that there's a lot of mov moving pieces when it comes to him we have you know where is he going to land is he going to be on the third line is he going to be on the fourth line um yeah so that was my point is that we're getting a little old we don't have that coming up crop of young 20 mid2 year olds we do have those eastn cows Fraser Mitten call it Cade Weber um nce that's fair nce we have um yeah and I think that's where like these moves are very reactionary and I think it's obviously a product of not having you know a lot of internal options to promote yeah and I think Tre living recognizes that well we're in a wi now window so I can't exactly just you know continue or run it back right I and I can't run it back with the same group who hasn't gotten the results and clearly isn't looking like they're about to get the results so yeah external kind of ads has to be the way to go yeah you're not going to be bringing in a young upand cominging promising 22-year-old unless you're going to pay a big price for that player so like I get it it feels like you're just like putting plugging playing round peg in a square hole type thing you know um but I think that's kind of where they're at where they recognize we're in a win now window so we have to try to maximize the peak years of the nander Matthews Marner Riley um but we also have to find those ability or that ability to improve on what we've done which obviously hasn't been anywhere near nearly good enough so yeah I think exactly and I think what we're seeing now is the Fallout of trading all of those draft picks that we had when DUIs was in town um we're having to do that square peg in a round hole plug andplay situation which being reactionary is not effective in a business sense in a hockey sense even in a day-to-day you want to be prepared you want to know what's ahead and I you know what as as long as the chips can work out that's that's good we're we're really trying here we're obviously bringing in obvious like everyone um but I still do wish that I don't know that we didn't need to be like picking up all these older guys picking up guys that are potentially injured that have one knee um no that's completely Fair like that's where I think the reaction you know it it's valid it's like okay Max pater ready that doesn't excite me Yanni Hawkin paw I haven't been excited about anything the Le have done this summer except for Chris Tanis Anthony stars and Oliver Ean Larson didn't do it for you huh definitely not o o stellars no Al no I really didn't like the stellars move because what I well I've wanted for a number one I wanted I've wanted for a number one goalie in Leafs Nation since like the Ed Bell for days can can I show you some video highlights of uh the brick wall can I show you are you interested in seeing some highlights of Joseph wall no I've seen him get injured enough times to know yeah I am just a realistic lease fan Josh here somebody needs to be someone between the two of us has to be and I'm not about to be that one no yeah okay so why don't we take a look because we've obviously been talking without kind of looking at all these names here so I've got the forward group here chance you can zoom that actually I'm sure fine I'm sure it's fine it's just small for me on my little I can do that and then perfect is better okay thank you thank you umov good work so so this is actually obviously you're seeing uh how many we got here 21 forwards that I feel are probably in terms of the pecking order these are sort of in order from not necessarily a potential line combinations and who's gonna be playing with who but just pecking order depth chart so I put in Max pater ready uh ignore the 1.1 mil I kind of just predicted what a contract could look like if they do sign him got Stephen Loren down there behind Cowan Alex neander who we still don't even know if her get at PTO um but yeah there's a log Jam an absolute Log Jam of quality fors you put in at Center e thought he was a Winger yeah well he's played both and probably when he if he does make the team out of Camp he will be on the wing I just kind of put him in here because in terms of now the left wing which after today has become a great position for us all of a sudden yeah yeah um if you're a fan of Nick Robertson and Max Patcher already but yeah I didn't want to put him like behind doer over here but I feel like these are probably your top 15 guys competing for a job so I just didn't want to put him any further down than I needed to so okay and the line combinations here okay I think this is an interesting thing um maybe we can talk about like can you run down for our audio listeners who's on left wing right now and we yes absolutely that's a good call so from top to bottom left wi dep we would have Matthew NIS Bobby McMahon Max petti Nicholas Robertson Connor derer Alex Steves and Alex neander Alex nander obviously still not signed to an NHL PTO so probably not even fair to include him in there but I think enough people are predicting he will get a PTO yeah you needed a 3 by six anyway 3 by seven 3 by seven excuse me um yeah so I would say with that lineup the only two I would reverse I don't know are you kind of obviously they've paid your the salary that you have match pet ready getting would be one million is that just what's predicted on on cap wages no I I just totally throwing a dart there just throwing a dart and actually when I did the lineup here on pedia like in order to add the guy into your lineup you have to sign him to a contract so you get to actually be a full armchair GM you can't just add a guy you gotta sign him to contract yeah I just see him more on the fourth line patch ready for us and I see Robertson more on our third line I yeah you can EAS flip I that's what I that's my only feedback on this left wing s call it a depth chart I I really don't think sorry to off I really don't think either guy has a chance to be the fourth line left Winger like on a Craig baru team you're not gonna have a onedimensional offensive player on your fourth line I don't think then who do you think is gonna fill the fourth line it would probably be I think your fourth line left Winger would be derer yeah really but again I'm just doing it based on quality of player kind of okay can you explain that a little bit more build that out build out your argument and I mean I think in terms of the fourth line right now if there's no more moves it probably would be Connor derer David camp and Ryan Reeves they had that line a lot last year was pretty effective yeah but doer from a skill set and a capability he fits kind of what you'd be looking for in a fourth line Guy where you have someone who's more defensively accountable exactly that's why I can't see Robertson on the fourth line correct yeah and I think I think Max the same way too I think if you're if you're bringing Max pater ready in Camp I think you're wasting his time and your time if you're not playing him with a John tarez or a Max DOI at some point to see what he has to offer so that's why he say ignore the lines really so to paraphrase you're saying that Pat ready and Robertson are bringing a similar skill set to yeah to the lease and I'd even go so far as to say they both aren't on this team opening night what I disagree with that I think well the good thing is about patri is that we have the flexibility not even to sign him to a contract right he's just coming over on a on a professional triy out basis so if he's not making the team on opening night wouldn't you say that we part our ways we say a we say orir to Patti well yeah I mean if Max petti is competing for that third line left wing spot I would say he's competing with Nick Robertson Easton Cowen probably and I don't think all three of them make it I don't even think two as I said I don't think both patre and Robertson make it which goes back to our earlier conversation where I think there could be a Robertson trade still happening but to me I just don't don't think you have your bottom two left Wingers be Max petti and Nicholas Robertson no I completely agree but do you think that we'd sign pater ready to an AHL contract you think he would agree to that or you think it's AHL contract Yeah clean so he would what would he do then if he doesn't get a contract with the Leafs after his PTO well I have a feeling that because they were there was some talk that there were a couple other teams that patriti was talking too I heard Detroit being mentioned a lot the way I see it he's only signing the PTO right now because the Leafs have probably assured him that he will get a contract in Camp that they just have to sort out their cap situation AKA they have to find a way to trade somebody Robertson or whoever yarn croak yeah you name it but to me I think Matt petti is in the opening night lineup so when I said I don't think both of them will be really saying Nick Robertson is gone okay so then Patti stays as our third left Winger third line left Winger and der goes up to our fourth line left Winger I think that's more likely Robertson's traded Steve stays in the Marley's neanders and Marley's yeah at least to begin the year if I had to guess I mean that's obviously H very speculative of course but that's kind of what I would expect to happen because I just think Max Pat ready he didn't have to take the PTO he definitely had it seems like he could have got a standard contract and I think at his age I think it's either his long it's his career long dream to be a maple Lea so he would have taken anything they offered or he was truly promised like look it's a PTO today it's a contract in two weeks all right well play Devil's Advocate we did say the same thing about the Alex neander contract we haven't seen as a PTO or a Leafs contract yet but um I would think that a guy like Patti wouldn't accept a PTO like he is not just a sort of a another name that's available like he's match Pat he's like a big dude like not a actually physically big he's not that phys but yeah no he's a big name guy he's been yeah very productive player he doesn't want to get cut I would think his ego is a little bit too big for that so I I can totally see where you're coming from um and that you know that point is really well received is that that might be extra fodder extra fuel to the mat to the Nicholas Robertson getting traded yeah and I mean obviously I mean this is what we do on leaves unfiltered we throw out takes and hope that a couple of them actually will stick at the end of the year or whatever and of training camp we're talking about here but to me just seems like those two guys have a very similar offering or what they can bring to the team you probably don't need both could there be a path for both of them to make it sure I think Robertson being it 875 opens up a lot of uh options if you do decide to keep him because he's not obviously a huge burden for your payroll but it's about being competitive too okay I will say one thing I think we've kind of put Max Patti and Nicholas Robertson like very as we painted the picture that they're quite similar players would you not agree that Robertson has a way higher upside or higher ceiling than Patti I mean being a young player sure but are we talking about just for this upcoming year no for the career for for I think when you bring on a player you want to be longish sided like it's a one contract sure but yeah you know you you start a relationship with somebody you're not dating them for the first week or the first month like you're hoping that things can really work out and I wonder if the same thinking will apply you know if we sort of extrapolate that concept Max petti is see where you're going y it's fair is he 36 max5 35 a young 35 I I've actually heard he plays like a 34 year old well then you know that's way younger than most Leafs so um but Robertson is Young he's a he's sort of in that age bracket that we're really deficient in and I think look I just I can't get his brother out of my head to be perfectly honest like Jason or you still think he's as good as his brother that's where you're I think he could be I really think if given I I don't want to say if given the opportunity he's had the opp opportunity but I think that he's got it um he could have it we just don't really know and so right you said he's got it then you said he could say that but you know he old what do they call him this season Old Scratch and score like we'd scratch him for a game and then he'd score the next game no he had a good habit of that for sure yeah and I think like just going back to like the question you pose about who has the higher ceiling like yeah I guess because of pater ready you know maybe at best he's got two more years to play so yeah he's obviously not going to be someone who you project to be contributing even Beyond this coming year but I think this move when you're comparing patri and Robertson who makes the team if it is between those two guys as I sort of suggested it's more about well who helps us win more hockey games in the 2024 25 season you're absolutely right you're right this is and I think I think if you ask tree living right now he would have no problem saying it's Max pet yeah no I I'm with you so and and also we know Nick Robertson really didn't want to be a maple so the idea Nick Robertson right so the idea of well Nick Robertson has a a more promising future in the league is obvious and correct but Nick Robertson has basically shown he doesn't want it to be here anyways now he might have a change of heart but uh for right now I would assume that the leaf front office is like yeah either way whichever guy is making our or getting our third line left wing spot it's a onee kind of trial yeah experiment yeah I like that and uh I like your call that doer could be our fourth line lock just because we want our fourth line to be consistent and like if you have camp and you have Reeves you know and they also signed doer almost like 1.2 mil so to me he's on the team yeah like he makes a team obviously just based on how I did the pecking order I have him behind Robertson it's more just in terms of quality of the player but in terms of what they're GNA actually choose I think doer is a lock to make the team okay okay I think we've baked out our third line what it let's move are you ready to move over to Center yeah yeah let's do it okay so I'll run it down for uh the audio audience we've got Austin Matthews John tarez Max doy David Camp then Easton Cowan Steven Loren and Fraser Minon just in terms of dep chard who's competing Cowan as Caroline correctly alluded or pointed out yeah Cen probably doesn't begin his NHL career at the center position but I just kind of have him on the Fifth Line because to me he's that like bubble for coming into camp where he easily could push for an opening night spot totally um totally well this is interesting everything everything beyond the third line is interesting again oh yeah that's where it gets interesting I agree yeah I agree yeah like Austin Matthews obviously John he's probably making the team you think he'll be there yeah I think he'll probably be there John tarz yes DOI yes so now we have Four Guys three guys let's you know potentially if cow's you know moved over to the flank um camp lorence and Minton um I guess important to call out that Minton did get that nine gamer or the 11 gamer last season with the Leafs he uh I think he only made it to four I think they gave him four and then uh sent him back down he was kind of underwhelming sorry about that so he got four um four or five yeah I like I in my in a great world I guess you got to hope that we we trade out Nick Robertson maybe here I'm I'm contradicting myself from earlier but hey this is what it's all about all we're doing here is workshopping this is a workshop yeah no this is session yeah I don't really know where Houston cow fits though because as you said derer looks good on the fourth line with the fourth line mates MH being camp and Reeves we haven't gotten to right wing but wait who that player you said before Ryan Reeves Camp gone has to be has to be gone or or yard croak or yard croak I I you know how I was saying I'm about a 95% C makes the opening night lineup yeah I would almost be not at a 95 but I would go 75% David camp or yarn cro traded before opening night and then what are we looking for in return for them I don't think you get much because of their contract so Camp is at 2.4 yard broke at 2.1 yeah that's the expected reaction bad contract that's a really bad contract very bad so you're going to have to add something to even move those guys so maybe you talking about could the robertsson be a sweetener for a mitch Marner trade maybe Robertson could be a sweetener for a David Camp Trade and that still might not be enough to move them but and we're we're gonna still probably have to retain some of that salary right I can't imagine could be or we add like a draft pick which is easy for us because we have none yep yeah sure yeah like I have no idea how tree living will do it and I think it would be very impressive if or when if and when because I'm saying good chance he does find a way but I'll be very impressed to see how it gets done but it will be worth celebrating when one of David camp or kyar and croar moved because to me you've now found what this mapela team the organization should have been doing all those years when they had the core and I think to an extent dubis did do it where you're finding guys to come to your who you know you don't need to overpay them because there are going to be those guys like we're seeing with Steven Loren now Max petti we even saw tanv maybe taking less we saw Max DOI taking a discount players will come to Toronto not that Toronto is the only place they will come but Toronto is one of those places that they will come and play for less money to be able to you know forget about because they think they can win a cup that ship has sailed but well I think we have the luxury being in the conversation not that we're winning a cup as a contender sure we're a playoff team right now a contender and it's a great hockey market and not that it means H something to every hockey player n but there's enough hockey players like a Chris tanev that probably want to play in a market where hockey means something yeah and obviously he's played with Calgary Vancouver Dallas so it's not like for Tan Toronto's a first team like that for him but just in general I think players enjoy playing in a market like that and Toronto is one of those top three four five markets where players will go and to me that's where tree living now coming in I know he's the one who signed the David Camp contract so obviously he's got to fix his own error in judgment there but you don't need to pay third fourth liners 2.1 2.4 to play mediocre hockey for you when you're Toronto like no especially exactly like you said like when we've been able to pull in a guy like Patti for what you're predicting to be like 1.1 yeah I would take patre over David Camp sorry 100% And they obviously do different things so if you don't have David Camp you got to find a guy who's GNA take your defensive Zone face offs going to be on your PK unit so it's not a one for one exchange but yeah I I agree I think when you look at the value return of David camp in 2.4 versus petti at maybe around the 1.1 Mark to me I think it's a no-brainer and you also have three years remaining on David Camp so can't keep that I'm I'm sick um but okay back to the back to the center conversation I'm gonna put Steven lorence as a lock at our fourth line Center I like that take I like that I I agree I agree I think that's if you're saying that camp is gone that's our obvious slot up that's yeah like it might not I mean her have to perform I mean I don't know if it's a 100% kind of lock but I think it's pretty close to it as long as he shows up and and laces up his skates I think he's on yeah and we paid him right like we didn't pay pater ready we've given Steve lent a contract no no he's also PTO oh so sorry oh God no no all good no because I I have him listed at 935 but again that's just the puckpedia requirement they won't let you just add a PTO yeah they you're right everybody on this what we're looking at here it's a you know a seventh line seven line depth chart is has salary attributed to them yeah you have to to make it work here on that PTO as well yeah um so he's not guaranteed anything by any stretch but to me that would be the obvious we bring him in and we find a way to get rid of Camp yeah I fully agree easier said than done though it is it is easier said than done you're not leaving a lot of room for East Cen no no we're not we're not and and that's why this is like fun to kind of like talk through because it's like I'd love to just be a fly on the wall when Brad Dre living in the front office was saying Okay so we've got Max petti good okay we've got Steven Loren okay Nicholas Robertson perfect yeah oh wait hold on a second here we we want cow in the lineup how do we do it can you play right wing Easton just kidding um he I believe he has I think he's kind of shifted all around I think he may have played more rightwing than left wi I can recall now but he does shoot left um but yeah kind of irrelevant for now but I think on that yeah um okay before I have a hot take to to bring in let's run through the right wing chart that you have here you go top to bottom Mitch Marner William neander Cali yarn croak Ryan Reeves PA Holberg Nikita gonin and Jacob quillet Holberg also not really a right winger more a center or left Winger but again it just to kind of have it by priority sort of pecking order nothing's locked here this is this is more of a we're fluidly looking at all these columns anyway yeah um all we're doing is throwing names on the Whiteboard here pretty much okay just like my first take after you read that we've now introduced every player on this three by seven depth chart holy moly our Center looks good you like yeah we we've really dialed our Center our Center chart well this also presumes that Max doy would play center and not ride shotgun with Austin Matthews again which is what I would like to see I'd like to see do back with ausome Matthews yeah I mean they were really they were really firing the playoffs but yeah I think that he I you're right like he he probably would love to be in the top six um good face off guy trustworthy dude um when our bottom six is is as sparse as it is I like his name down there yeah totally fair I think when if you've added a Winger Like Pat jetti you can probably build a case more that yeah that third line can actually be decent offensively so I could see that happening too for sure um Okay so so let's go back to our right Wingers Mitch Marner so Mitch Marner Austin Matthews reuniting not that they're not that they've been separated but um they were well yeah and I think they're both I think Marner and DOI will both get a look whatever one preseason game Marner will play with him the next maybe DOI so I I think they try both uh scenarios out yeah um Willie neander a rightwing looks pretty good so far yeah not bad not bad K Yar crook you think he might be trade bait yeah like I don't know how they could if it if tree living moves both yarn croak and David Camp without giving up Easton cow what do you have against the sweds no it's only only yarn cro talking about yarn crook Swedish yeah yarn croak is but I thought you meant uh Camp as well he's Czech oh he's Czech I always get that check yeah yeah okay yeah I mean we do have a lot of sweds neander yarn cro Holberg now uh Oliver Ean Larson Timothy lilligren there is definely a lot of swedes wow Camp is not one of them we have no fins though I remember Yanni hawen paaw oh my God Yanni hawen paaw yeah how you forget yes I mean he signed four hours ago you already forgot about him I already forgot well actually he apparently signed three months ago but officially yeah or twoth I didn't see it on social it never happened just kidding true that was so funny that back in the day back in July Josh and I were talking about how the social team had been so quick to post all the leaf signings and there was no Hawk and paaw but like Hawk and paaw had been announced everywhere and we're like um did that social person just forget like did they leave in their drafts totally that's that's what I do for a living is I I I do soci for uh for a brand and it it would be like my worst nightmare to be called out for not posting something in a time yeah can you imagine if that Toronto map Lea seidenman gets the call from briad tree living um did that go out yet did Haw PA signing go out yet I did it a long time ago and your boss should have told you to send it out oh Brad shoot it was in my drafts I'm sorry I'm sorry I assumed it it sent but I must have logged out of my email too early or whatever I got banned just kidding okay so I mean we want to still look at the D but any final thoughts on the uh forwards like it's obviously I mean we're not going to solve anything here but there's a lot to get figured out yet absolutely and yeah I guess rightwing is a little harder to nail down because well they're all hard to nail down because there are some there's some serious trade bait in there yarn crook um but what do you see the fourth line if you had to call it right now you can even use player X on fourth line if you think that somebody's going to be traded who do you think is on our Leaf's fourth line and third line that's my question for you right now yeah so I think fourth I'll still well yeah because I'm still holding out hope for Camp being traded I don't think it's going to happen um I think it's gonna be too hard to make that transaction happen so I'll go do you said 95% he was gonna be traded like 10 minutes ago I think I said Camp or yard crup no or did I say Camp oh maybe I thought ant I heard an ant we're have to roll the tape back I think it was like four but you might be right maybe you slurred your words maybe perhaps yeah and perhaps maybe I was just kind of uh drinking the Kool-Aid and maybe just having this fantasy of Camp actually being able to get moved but now reality has kind of kicked in as we advance in the show maybe but yeah so even if I did say that I will kind of rephrase I think it's camp or yarn croak get moved so I think Camp probably more likely hangs around because of that three years of 2.4 so I'll go fourth line doer camp and Ryan Reeves okay and then I will go uh because he can play center it's very tough to Envision um Cowen as a third line Center but I would think it could be something like a uh whoa DOI Cowen pater ready so sorry but then I don't have stepen Len on the team I I you know what I don't think I can be I don't think I can be GM I can't be GM I thought I thought I could when I did this I can't no there's so many different variables right now like you would I don't know how you 11 sleeps until preseason that we could have something a picture that's a little bit more painted but right now living can do it I don't either I don't know he's like a mad Evil Genius maybe if he can pull it off because like yeah like if I'm saying Camp isn't getting moved like Steven Loren probably doesn't make the team or if like if yarn croak is still here um does that mean Max pater ready or Callen one of those guys probably doesn't make it so me I think yeah I used to think being GM was so easy like just like buy the best guys come on I mean it's not easy but like you have all all 12 months to put together a team it's like yeah I know like seriously only so many available people there's only so much available money just do it right like yeah and just do it better than the other 31 teams I don't get why it's so problematic for some of the me neither really like um but I guess here we are living the GM nightmare or living the GM reality yeah and I mean some of it is self-imposed right like I mean he signed David camp like I thought that was a ridiculous uh decision back when it happened you thought that was a ridiculous decision yeah yeah I uh I like Camp the first year when he was brought over from Chicago I believe but after that I was like yeah if you told me he was making 1.2 or whatever sure you could extract some decent value there but to have thought he had done enough to get a four-year 2.4 I don't get it even 1.2 I'd be like me I don't know you could probably still do better I agree okay so then we're quickly run down to D it's obviously not as many uh players to uh talk about here but this is kind of I would say what we got here the top 11 coming into camp and then the goal tening as well so I'll run down it quickly you got uh do it by pairings Riley tanv benoir McCade Oliver Eckman Larson and Timothy lilligren Marshall Rafi and Connor Timmons Dakota mermis and Yanni hawen paaw and then Philip Meers so I've got hawen Pro paw probably further down than he should be only because I still don't know what his status is I get it he signed the contract but is he just going on ltir to be begin the year I don't know yeah um I kind of suspect not like I think I hope not yeah I hope not too but just the way that they announced the contract right before training camp it's almost like they got some information that like okay green light sign maybe you know like you're not getting a green light that's like such an advanced green like yeah oh unless they announced a surgery or they announced some injury you know what I I totally agree with that because I think whe I don't think it would have come out from the team but you would think one of the Insiders may have kind of reported that when he got signed like but the least don't expect him to be in training camp expectation is he goes right to ltir so until we hear that I would say you're probably spot on he should have been in surgery and we would have heard that um but we saw him playing on the in that fin charity tournament or whatever like if he weren't going to be eligible for this season he's not old enough that he's going to go into like byebye land he he'd be in surgery and so I I would have expected we'd hear that he's in surgery the Leafs are not signing him or the Leafs are signing him but he will not be available until what you know halfway through the season so yeah I think he'll be on the ice um which is good like we had more dark thoughts about hawen paa for sure like just two weeks ago just a week ago well absolutely it was too easy to to have to not have those right I mean yeah everything that it was everything where we were headed with Haw and PAW was like yeah there's no way this guy's going to be a leaf or even play in the NHL again yeah yeah so if if that is because we are kind of a line there I agree that he probably is now expected to be in the lineup going on the uh the momentum that we had with the four words in terms of well who's getting moved off I will be looking directly at the Timothy lilligren name right now lilligren not Timmons I think he could get moved too but I think that they're if they think hawen paaw is ready to go I don't think you are signing him to a $1.47 deal to be your seventh defenseman so I think he bumps out Lily also holy moly lillig $3 million that's exactly why yeah that's too much for a guy who might be competing with hawen paaw and probably losing if hawen paaw is healthy absolutely um who signed lilligren and what's his contract like that that was Brad tree living they did that uh just before two years oh yeah oh yeah two years at three Mill so I think Timothy lilligren and Nick Robertson both feel like sign in trades I know Timothy lerd he signed a long time ago so maybe it wasn't meant to be a sign in trade but now that hawen paw could be available it feels like I don't think they're going in with those 7D given their like they're one million over the cap right now with the Haw and PAW signing yeah so somebody needs to go yeah at least one because you might need to bring in you might need to sign Max petti or stepen Len good point if you want to give them a contract so at least one probably two or even three guys have to move to make the room yeah well I would sure hope that we can package out lilligren because with Haw andpa I don't really see a need for him unless we swap Hawk and PAW for Timmons which is really what the social chatter has been saying yeah I think lad and I think it's fair to suggest that kimmons is I mean clearly he would be the man out for sure first and foremost over lilligren over hawen paaw but I mean can you move him or you just have to eat that salary and use him as your seventh I don't know but yeah I mean it's you know I don't know if you could add multiple guys like we're talking about like the camp the Robertson The Lily the uh yarn croak is adding all those guys in a trade proposal to a team any more enticing like well we can give I don't think so I think you're you're literally giving them our gar our compost garbage pretty much no compost let's let's garbage we're upcycling them but but I still think like yeah these are guys that don't fit on our roster because we've replaced them with better guys teams know that um yeah yeah like I don't think yarn croak has any value but if you were saying well we're give you Robertson or Timothy lilligren if you take yarn cro then it maybe looks a little bit better okay probably not much but a little bit okay so now that we've run through this for audio listeners please name me our defensive pairings left and right as you see it as you imagine it my opening night prediction and you can use player X if you need to no that's not Fair no I appreciate you allowing me to do that but that's not what we do in Leafs unfiltered we okay so you're assuming you're assuming that these are our defenseman I was just saying if you think that lilligren is gonna be traded somebody else is gonna go in there you can use cacks okay yeah and this is you know this is obviously for money Josh if you get them right absolutely yeah for sure no like I for me I think that's the obvious move if hawen paaw is healthy it's Timothy lillig Gren out hawen paaw in okay start from from the top okay so I would have as it is Riley tanv uh Simone benoa and Jake mccab then Oliver emman Larson and haw andpa nice okay in an Ideal World you've got healthy and the ability to trade Timothy lilligren that is my opening night blue line and what if we cannot trade lilligren what happens then well then you've got uh probably more money tied up in your D than your prepar to have like if you have to keep like hawen paw is obviously signed to a deal the only way I could see them not moving Timothy lren is as we were talking about earlier if hawen Paul opens up on ltir which we sort of said is probably not what's happening but if he's gonna be on the active roster come opening night I find it hard to believe that both him and Timothy lilligren are on this opening night team I mean I guess I could see it but then you're for sure moving a yard kroer Camp because right now you can't you can't fit it in you can't so do you think a guy like Timothy lilligren would sort of pack his bags for Roby do Island if he needed to no I don't think you'd have to Roby do him like I think there's enough I think there would be interest like probably not every team knocking on H tree living's door but he's a young defenseman you've got enough teams that won't you know Fred about absorbing being the salary and maybe thinking that it's a little bit much for what the player provides but you know there are teams whether it's your Anaheim your Columbus uh you know um San Jose that you know they need to fill some roster spots they need to get over the cap floor so I can see as long as the mate beliefs are giving them an incentive um but yeah I don't even think with Timothy lilligren you need that much incentive I think he has some value sorry so yeah so if we were trading T Timothy lilligren in return you expect like draft picks right you're not something decent a prospect a draft pick I mean I wouldn't you're not looking for a roster you're not looking for a roster player right like clearly we don't have spots exactly yeah probably not at this point I think whether you're moving yarn cro lilligren Robertson um Camp you're just hoping to get cap space back and maybe you don't need to get anything else other than that back but sure a draft pick would be always desired yeah okay okay well I like those lines as you've drawn them up I think that's what I would think too I feel like we have too many names right now we have too many too many names too too many names too many too many mid lower quality names names look at you being a gen Z mid right as the kids say Caroline he's so mid I know so funny mean I think that's where tree living is adding these guys that he thinks might be a little bit more than mid the max petti the Steven lorett obviously hawen paaw because he probably feels like there's some lesser players holdover players that he hopes to move okay so we shall see we shall see and I think I think we can re oh I was like wow what just happened oh sorry were you gonna just as I removed that were you going to reference something no not at all I was going to say something that's not on topic at this moment but I did I I wanted to bring it up it's a point that I've personally held I hear a lot on podcasts in the media about just give that player a shot like bring EAS tow up bring Frasier minum up give him NHL experience like I just don't think that's the right attitude I think that these guys can get equally good experience in a league that's higher level than the league they've been playing in call it the AHL call it the OHL in Europe like don't sacrifice a roster spot to give a guy experience in the NHL I don't think that's necessary like I think these guys can develop if that's what they need to do yeah elsewhere I think it's a combination of playing training and you know mental maturity and I don't love this whole like let's sacrifice a guy like petti who might be more of an immediate performer to put e Cowan in that leftwing position because he needs to develop and we should develop him like I don't know like there could be a lot of case studies I could look at in any yeah like you're basically saying you don't want to see a guy rushed right no I just don't think a team needs to do it for the sake of a players's well I mean yes a player needs to develop but I think there are other ways to develop a player let's look at Austin Matthews Austin Matthews went to Switzerland he did and I just don't love that argument we're like oh we're sacrificing all these players development by bringing in chips like like Lorent or like petti those guys can develop on their own terms they don't need to be up with the best guys in the they're not performing up to the best guys in the world level anyway put them in the KHL put them in the the Swedish Elite League where they're already gonna be up against some really good players but what do you think about that like do you want well I mean yeah I mean like if your point is more like with e Cowen that yeah you want to obviously do what's best let's not it's not mutually exclusive to East count it's more any player they're like bring them up like just bring them up they need the NHL experience like I think they can get that experience elsewhere and not sacrifice potentially a win not a win But A team's yeah no and I think in terms of a general you know argument I think that's fair I mean I think there's obviously a lot of teams who maybe try to rush young players because they feel they're ready and they uh probably aren't doing right by the player but you know when you talk about uh certain players especially ones that don't have the opportunity to bridge the gap between their current league whether that's a Junior League like the ol WHL the Quebec hockey league and the NHL I think that's where it becomes a more difficult argument and maybe a little bit less black and white right where it's like yeah we want NHL if East going back to the knights or playing for the Leafs right hugely like I think if you had that like with a guy like a Fraser Minton I think it's going to be a very a much easier conversation for the maple Lea brass to say okay where is Fraser Minon right now after training camp he played in all our preseason games he did whatever he overwhelm he looked overwhelmed he he underwhelmed however you want to describe his performance and then you can say okay there's an option for him to go back to his junior team in the WHL yeah probably show it in on camera um or he could go to the AHL and kind of maybe get some experience there and maybe not in a as high profile situation as it would if the Maple Leafs or he could play with obviously the big Club the maple leaf so little bit more options I think easier to say well what bucket does mint and fit in in terms of his uh current uh progress his development whereas CN I mean I know he weren't going to do specifics but I think with CN it is kind of where it goes against the argument of well just let the kid figure it out send them back to Junior with cow it's kind of like if he makes your team better and you're in a win now win window unless you think he's totally not ready but obviously that's going to get hashed out and figured out through training camp and preseason and if e and shows he's forget about one of your top 12 forwards I think if he shows you that he's one of your top nine then you don't just say well sure he's better than half the guys that we might actually be playing on our opening night lineup but let's send him back down anyways because that's what we're told to do to help the guy development he might develop better playing against men in the NHL could he not go to a a European League I suppose he could I don't think he'd have an appetite to do that I mean if the guy's dream is to play in the NHL it would be NHL or OHL but just for a year if it were better for his development than the OHL he just laid up the NHL the OHL he's already the MVP he did of the playoffs I think yeah so I would say you just don't see it very often like especially with top prospects you don't see them take that path like if their team says but maybe that's because they're like they're like kind of you know little younger boys that aren't being like but yeah Austin did it yeah well well Austin Matthews he did it before his draft year that would be the difference like as soon as he got drafted it was right to the NHL yeah like I think after you're drafted expectation for especially if you're a high draic like Cowen was expectation is I'm going to the NHL as soon as I can as like as soon as I can get all Junior Team yeah but but it's almost like a throwaway year for him if he's going back to the OHL not a throwaway year I think that's how he'd probably be looking at it now I agree yeah I mean he's already a peak performer y anyway I think I'm digressing far I just wanted to bring that in that like a lot of things a lot of people have been saying like come on give the guy a chance like let's bring them up we don't have a big pipeline of prospects give him some NHL time um and I'm like no like I want to feel the best team we can I don't want to worry like you said this is our window well I and I don't think like he's not gonna make the team if he's terrible in training camp like like I don't think it's a situation where they've already decided he's making the team I think and as we saw with like the depth chart like he's got to prove or he's like tell baru he's got to tell tree living that yeah yeah you need to find a way to get yarn croak off to team because I've just dominated him on every shift in training camp and I can help your team win more games than he can and he makes double the amount that I do how can we watch training camp can we do we have to go to the Coca-Cola Coliseum is that where they play uh I think it's now Ford performance center they've AME yeah Ford performance Center in tobaco wherever it is um but I don't think all I don't think those practices are open to the public okay yeah like I think in the old not old days but when they had Leaf's TV Leaf's TV would sometimes show like the training camp now I don't think you can uh watch any of it unless you're actually there somehow okay yeah okay well I think we need to close it up here I've been too chatty no no let's get it it's obviously a good conversation and it's obviously a Hot Topic like what do you do with kin so we're have a lot more to talk about as we get closer to training camp and then uh yeah we won't talk too much about this just the uh what to look for obviously Prospect Showdown the this is these are the players cow included that will be uh going to Montreal this weekend to play the you are you're going oh no no I'm saying these guys going I I'd love to go but I will not be going no um apparently it's at the Bell Center but not clear if anyone from the Leafs is going to be there covering so we might be sort of stuck with the Montreal broadcast like which I don't even know if we'll get on anytime on Sports oh that's interesting I hadn't heard that yet interesting but anyway it's probably on it's probably on like Leaf's YouTube channel at the very least could be could we have to look into that yeah because there will be obviously fun hockey and I think um if you're a Montreal Canadian fan these games Saturday and Sunday are probably the most meaningful games your team they're gonna crush us they're gonna crush us well they should they should because if you ask them they have the best Prospect pool in the NHL Oh you mean they'll just tell you you don't even ask you don't need to ask them yeah yeah they're they're they're very polite they volunteer that information that is that's correct we we yeah we we okay all right well this was awesome it was fun obviously a lot of uh you know interesting conversations obviously we didn't solve anything tonight but Caroline I don't think that was the objective absolutely nothing we we created more questions than we answered we we we probably confuse people more than we help them in terms of the audience especially our audio listeners yes and that's what we do every week on Lea on filter chalk up a dub yeah but this was awesome for the audience thank you for uh tuning in and viewing obviously as always drop us a comment if you have any feedback for us anything you'd like to see going forward but we will be back next week to break down some more uh topics for you yeah thanks for tuning in everybody have a good one yeah bye