Big Blue Kickoff Live 8/7 | Giants Unofficial Depth Chart

it's time for a big blue kickoff line nobody can ever tell you that you couldn't do it cuz you're dead on giants.com you know what I saw New York Giant Prime and the Giants mobile app 174 is the final one touchdown we are world champion believe it and it will happen part of the Giants podcast Network let's go down like a bunch of crazy dogs have some fun hi everybody and happy Wednesday and welcome to Big Blue kick off live presented by Cadillac the official luxxury vehicle of the New York football Giants I am John schmel is Paul datino get on the phones give us a call 201939 4513 uh we'll wrap up everything going on with the Lions we'll talk a little bit about the game tomorrow night but a big part of our open the Giants released their first unofficial team depth chart that's up on giants.com go check it out and we'll figure break that down a little bit see what we see if there's anything interesting uh that we could talk about it isn't important the stress though Paul this is not the internal coaches depth chart this is one that they released to the public just for the use for broadcast preparations for the first preseason game correct so keep all those caveats in mind as we discuss what this depth chart looks like that's why it's so important you said unofficial because that's where a capital u it is as unofficial as it can get yes so honestly and this is a question that is going to be on fact or fiction on giants.com which I'm not sure if it's up yet and the statement Dan craford was there were no surprises on the Giants unofficial depth chart and I got to be honest I put fact there was nothing on this unofficial depth chart to me Paul that really surprised me that I was like huh that's weird or wow I can't believe that nothing really I got to be honest nothing really jumped out at me is all that surprising I'm curious to see what you think well I totally concur with you but let's not kid ourselves as you said the public relations department does this more for procedure purposes to help the media identify players they don't consult with the coaches and nothing on this depth chart is official so basically the pr people who work here are watching the same practices we're watching and they're basically saying okay so and so's taking a bunch of reps there all right let's just slot him in there at that spot and so I don't think by the very nature of how this thing is produced that we should see any surprises right now I will say I think there are some things that I would turn to be interesting or noteworthy even if they're not surprises so why don't we go through a couple of those here Paul one and again I think it's not a surprise because watching practice I think this makes sense they basically have Jaylen hayatt and Darius Slayton both listed as your first team I guess that would be the zwide receiver uh next to WAND Robinson who's the number one slot and Malik neighbors who's the ex receiver um on this list and given how we think this is going to go Paul and how they do have some level of over overlapping skill sets hide and slate it does not surprise me to see them as the two guys that would be considered co-starters and we talked about how they were going to distribute snaps at the wide receiver position right during the year and I think both of us thought that Robinson wasn't going to get really touched in the slot much he was going to be in there most the time Lord knows are not taking neighbors off the field so I think it makes sense for those two guys to be you know sharing that Z wide receiver spot I I totally Concur and I think one of I'm going to give you example of something I'm not going to mention the player because I don't want to do that but several years ago when these depth shs started coming out and it got to the point where egos started to get involved and sometimes players have ego-driven emotions and I can remember and and I'm not going to name the player oh by the way by the way just for the record like these players want to know where they stand too so they see oh there's a dep CH on the website I want to see where I stand and they don't know that the coaches are not doing the dep chart correct and they're unaware of the mechanics of how it works so they see the depth chart and John's absolutely right especially a guy who may be fighting for a backup job and he looks and he sees on the on this unofficial depth chart all of a sudden he's like the fifth receiver or whatever the case may be well I knew one time of a player who was very angry he let his ego getting away and he got very angry and he's like I don't understand and we went up to a coach and said why am I like third string on the dep chart and the coach said to him whoa what are you talking about because the coach the coaches don't even see it they don't even know what it is and they're like no no you don't understand we had nothing to do with this so don't read anything into it calm down and so I think that's why the public relations department when they put these things out John and even on the team websites they put that word unofficial right in the front because it's not just so that the public doesn't get duped into thinking it's real but it's also some of the players or the agents that don't want to don't want to believe something that is actually not necessarily true so a couple other things I'll just throw out there so fans know what's on there Wanda Robinson is the number one slot Isaiah McKenzie is second there gunar olvi is third and the undrafted rookie air Sante is fourth there not a surprise uh miles boyin he's technically the second string receiver behind hiy and Slayton but given there's two guys ahead of him he's really the third guy even though he's listed as two uh which lines up exactly where Alan Robinson is uh behind Malik neighbors Isaiah Hodgins is the primary backup behind neighbors I'm not surprised that's exactly where I thought those guys would be and then you have the younger guys Bryce Ford weaton John Giles those are the guys standing towards the back of that wide receiver depth chart see now and I'm curious what you have down in your notes for the camp so far yeah I think Dennis Houston has been a very productive deep depth CH wide receiver and quite frankly as part of the regular offense of sets been more productive than Miles boyin yeah he and Bryce Ford weaton they are the fourth guys at the two outside wide receiver spots and I agree I think Dennis Houston probably has been of the non primary wide receivers maybe you could throw Isaiah hodin in that conversation too just consistently getting open and catching the football he's been pretty good he's been pretty consistent nothing you know nothing spectacular where he's running by people and getting over the top and making these huge plays but short intermediate range that dude gets open and that dude catches the football would you buy the terms steady and reliable I think that's a great way to put it so she saying might be smart tough inde Dependable good line John uh so if you really wanted me to like look for a surprise I suppose the fact that he's behind boyin on this list that would be something just based on the ey test where you would say to yourself well I think he probably could have been a spot higher and again you see boyin and Robinson lined up those guys are more veteran than Bryce Ford weaton and Dennis Houston that just might be also a tip cap to the vets we'll have them ahead of the younger guys on the unofficial depth chart because they've earned it because they're veterans and they've been in the league for a while uh at running back will go there next dein singer a no surprise to one and then again I wouldn't take too much out of this but they have the running backs listed as gray 2 Tracy 3 Miller 4 and sers fifth on the running back depth chart there and again I wouldn't take too much out of that GRE has been here another year Tracy's a rookie and of course single Terry is the one and then at tight end Daniel Bellinger is listed as number one not a surprise Lawrence ker right now is dealing with the hamstring injury I believe it is right he's number two uh Chris manherz is third the big blocker Theo Johnson fourth and then Jack stol and Tyreek Jackson behind Theo Johnson your thoughts on running back and tight end well I think we have also commented on the shows that we've done together that uh Tyrone Tracy has has shown a lot of flashes at running back and Miller's speed has popped too and you can't ignore that you can't gr had been great the last week or so I think gra had been practices correct totally concur with you he has been on the swing but as of a week ago uh I thought that gray was maybe the third or even potentially fourth most impressive and productive running back gray has made a move lately but um yeah for him to like be number two on this chart that that would be something that would scratch my head but again you know the PR department they're they're looking at the number of snaps and they're probably saying well he's been on the field more you know and that's probably why they put him plus he's a holdover and they really are yes correct and to me and and then I'll let you comment on the tight ends they basically the non Singletary reps they split them it's really been evenly split so I really think that's a wideopen competition so sure uh kager again he's been here so he's an incumbent and I'm sure that that's why they listed him there because you know the old adage you can't lose a job due to injury PR's probably going by that adage where they put him there in in passing situations he was with the ones a lot and he was until he got hurt right and and as stands now you know I mean I think the the interesting part is since kager went out I think we would both agree Theo Johnson has certainly stepped up his game in the past game yeah he's caught a couple passes he hasn't like he he has been spectacular I mean against the Lions he only had a couple catches over a c but he's done everything they've asked him to do sure he hasn't failed he hasn't dropped anything he hasn't like out there I don't think he's passing Daniel Bellinger though anytime not at all I don't I don't say that at all but to this point while cra's been out Johnson to me has assumed the number two role I think based on based on what I've seen yeah I would say that I still think man Herz would be their blocking tight end though in situation so no he's a big man boy is he big and that's why they brought him in right y all right on the offensive line going right to left this is how they have him listed J lumor right tackle Aaron stinny Right Guard John Michael Schmidt Center John ran now left guard that's where he's been working at more recently in practice obviously spent the spring working at Right Guard and then Andrew Thomas at left tackle again they want these guys to back up multiple positions so I would you know take with a grain of salt where the backups are listed in terms of spot uh zudo right tackle van Ren Right Guard of course he's been the starting center with John Michael Schmitz hurt with that shoulder Jimmy morrisy the backup center ahead of schlotman which I guess is a little interesting Jaylen Mayfield at left guard Yan kajus at left tackle and then Joshua miles third string right tackle Jake kubas Right Guard schlotman Center marcelus Johnson who came in as a tackle they're using him at a guard in Camp this year at left guard Matt Nelson a left tackle then Marcus mckian sitting back there at Fourth straight yeah and quite honestly over the last few days we've seen van Ron take so many Center snaps that would it surprise you if he starts at Center against Detroit on uh tomorrow night well and I'll say it's interesting now too does that with Van Ron here being able to be the backup center John runan is Tak some emergency center snaps as well does that mean there's a chance that neither morisy nor schlotman are on the final 53 that could be a place where you steal a spot right I I think that's a great thought I I really do and especially when you consider they may need to steal a spot for one of the the tackles they may need to steal a spot for a third quarterback if they want to keep one they may need to steal a spot for an extra receiver if they decide they want to go want to go there or have out corner or fourth tight end ball absolutely you could so you know if you're looking for some place to steal John you make a great point that that backup center spot could be a really good soft spot to steal a PL a spot and I'll be honest of the backup offensive tackles Paul once you get past to lumor and Andrew Thomas I think Joshua miles has been the best guy I think he's had some really nice reps over the past couple weeks if I had to if you ask me right now one of those guys that gets hurt who's the guy based on what I've seen in practice I have the most confidence is putting in there to pass protect on a third down situation for me it's Joshua miles the coaches might not feel that way I don't know how they think but from what I've seen that's my opinion well you know what he's done more and more in that spot recently when audu had some of his issues and and he had gotten dinged up and then he had gotten dehydrated the other day and had and had to come out and and missed a practice uh miles has had more and more reps out there I will say this he's definitely had of mat Nelson on my book he moves I agree with that he's got Good Feet man he moves really really I I don't I don't know I don't know how I feel about him overall going into opening day I suspect they probably still would put a zudo out there first I think they would well based on what we've seen in Camp it appears that's the case I think so um but I don't think the zudu would have a very long leash well look that's the important of the preseason games now right you know I don't think and you know we'll know more tomorrow when you're hosting with Matthew saac maybe in terms of who's going to play maybe we will maybe we won't who knows but I don't think we're GNA see many starters Paul on Thursday night probably not because of how many competitive reps they had in practice that's how they handled it last year so if they handle it the same way again this year this is going to be a lot of snaps for those second and third string offensive linemen and how they play in these games is going to help determine what guys are on this final 53 man roster it's hugely important for these offensive linemen to do well in their snaps in these preseason games yeah the shame of it is and you know my feeling about trying to get five and then trying to get them some work I I I think it's a shame that the Giants have had some issues with the injuries already obviously Evan Neil is still nowhere near ready we've seen him on the side with the trainers he was jogging I think the other day and then he came out to the field again yesterday but he's he's really doesn't appear like he's going to be putting pads on anytime in the next couple of days so you know that that situation it it it's getting to the point where as the clock ticks more and more you have to think illuminor is is kind of putting his foothold onto the right Tackle Spot yeah and you know I've been very effusive in my praise I think stinny has done a really good job in Camp I thought van roten was better than he was against the Lions yes I concur but but also because van Ron did well in the center snaps and you figured he'd be better at guard that's where he's played I know but he was better at Center I thought he no he did a nice job at Center absolutely so right now if Neils not back and schmidtz is back at Center [Music] given brillo's experience with Van Ren I think I think he might be ahead of stiny at Right Guard now I don't know I think either that's something that we're going have to keep an eye on moving forward to see where that competition is going to be between stiny and Van R I think both are on the team I just don't know you know once they get more reps in some games and you know van R's only been here a week he might they not they might not be ready to put him into a game situ yet see which and if V Ron's not going to play We Know Schmid isn't going to play if alumor and ran and Thomas don't play I mean stinny is going to have to you know you just don't have enough guards at that point to to do it so mckian will play too yeah so so so so I think that'll be a good combination good spot for those guys to to try to perform here here's one thing like and and I appreciate what you just said a minute ago too about van Ren because the one advantage to having van Ren here is that if he does get slotted in at Right Guard because he played with alumor last year in Vegas and they are both braillo guys your Chemistry should be fine there yeah that that won't take a lot of that's just add water and those guys know each other so that won't take you a lot of time you could probably even make that decision in the week leading up to the Minnesota game to be frank I wouldn't want to but you probably could John so so that alleviates some of the chemist puzzle if you will and that may actually give van Rhoden uh a little bit of of a leg up because if that comes into consideration in terms of how much have we had guys playing together well the easy way is to just put him at Right Guard because that helps yeah and you could just slot them I I I really like the job this front office has done bringing in guys that are back stops for players right theoretically right now Paul if the Giants went into week one and this is not going to be the case because John Michael Schmitz is not that far away based on everything Brian D has told us right if they had to roll into the week one and their offensive line from right to left was illuminor stinny Van Ren ran Andrew Thomas wouldn't you feel okay about that I would to be thrill but I would be all right I think they can hold up this isn't a situation where we're going into the Seattle game last year right where you're like oh my gosh we have absolutely no chance three practice squad players against Miami well right so you know even though you're missing two frankly first and second round picks that you expected to be starters right they've brought in enough guys here where look are you you know you give multiple all Pros in that fiveman lineup no but I think you have enough experience veteran players that can hold up in the NFL guys with a legitimate NFL resume yeah and they STS stars but they're legit correct guys go subscribe to the Giants hle podcast you can find it on the Giants app giants.com podcast or just search for Giants huddle on your favorite podcast platform uh lot of good episodes up there right now uh what's up there right now pearon we have the next top oh Shan oar's up that's right Shan oara sat down to me for about 20 minutes or so and we broke down everything that happened at those two lions practices Shawn was out there so got Shan's inside and everything you saw practice most of it was talking about what was happening up front not surprisingly uh but we do have a chance to to slobber all over how good Malik neighbors was over the course of the two days that too and uh have some paper towels ready yeah we did and and and Sean looked ahead to uh what is like for a player going into that first preseason game so go check that on the Giants podcast the pre the next 10 up in the Giants 100 is up there too and I believe Pearson I did not look at it but I was told that that was a longer episode I think they got up to like almost 30 386 37 was there debate no but this no no this is the interviews with the actual players so you have the ones that Bob did right with the guys so yeah it they've been loosened up a little bit a little bit longer which is what I said we were going to do last week and it has happened well they had more to say about that that's good exactly so uh go check that out in the John subtle podcast um and then we'll have a rapid reaction after the first preseason game with PA and Howard so that'll come your way right after the game on Thursday night so a lot coming your way in the giant hle podcast go check it out you can also run or walk with giants Legends the Giants Foundation is hosting a 5K race and kids run presented by Quest on Saturday September 7th at 9:00 a.m. at metli stadium that proceeds will benefit the Giants Foundation all participants will receive a commemorative t-shirt and after the race stay for a postrace festival with appearances by Giants Legends and a live DJ register now at giants.com 5K all right we have a couple people on hold here Paul so I want to get to those two calls then we will hit the defensive side of that depth Charco we have a couple people holding I want to make sure we get to them so they're not staying on hold for another 15 minutes or so let's go to Elliot in Puerto Rico he will lead us off hello Elliot oh wow Puerto Rico oh hi guys what's up long time what's going on Elliot oh everything's fine oh at least is it's better now um it's been a while since my last call because um heal of my pop well I'm last year but he's he's doing better now so that that is great to hear Elliot what do you have for us what do you want to talk about well um I was heing the show on Monday and first of all want to thank you y for all the information that you did in the hoto war with the two producers from Haru yeah yeah I thought that was a fun episode I really enjoyed talking to a lot of information it was it was great uh what amazes me is that almost every caller that call with the consy theories about the Haru they didn't listen first the hle why hey look look Elliot I made a point all of the you know things that fans had kind of said that were crazy on Twitter at the end of the episode I threw it at the guys I'm like I'm going to throw you guys conspiracy theories and you shut them down and they shut them down it was great on Monday show there's a lot of people like making crazy things or or questions about that well listen to the hle first there you go there you go Ellie that is a great promotion checks in the mail baby cut that up for a spot Pearson and I want to put all my two dark horses for this year one on offense one on defense and both of them will be rookies I think that Thea Johnson will be great uh maybe it will take him like four or five games to get uh his feet wet and on defense I think that Drew Phillips is going to be is going to be one of the better players on defense hey look I I I think I think you got a better shot with Drew Phillips Elliott than Theo Johnson and I think you're right that if Theo does emerge this year I think that's something that happen a little bit later in the season yeah Drew Drew Phillips has really impressed a lot of people here in the last month and you know it's one thing to be a smart player it's another thing to be a physical player but this guy has confidence and maturity far beyond a lot of rookies John I mean you've talked to him as as I have he doesn't seem like he's fresh to the league he he's got a much more experienced aura about him yeah he looks really good to me I think his strength right now in that slot spot is the short passes and stuff around the strage and the Run game and the screens I haven't seen him and maybe this is a product of the Giants playing a lot of zone so he hasn't had to do this to track deep carrying guys down the field in coverage I haven't seen a ton of that yet I still want to see that especially against faster slots to see how he handles that but from everything we've seen instinctual physical smart uh good awareness toughness he checks all those boxes Elliot I wonder how much he's going to beat opposing slot receivers up to also kind of eliminate some of their ability to get out on the release yeah you're right maybe right maybe that's going to be part of what we see once we get him in real games it depends how much press they play I don't know how much press they're we don't know that yet but I'll tell you what I would trust him to be able to do it yeah well he has the mentality for he certainly does 100% agree with with you guys I know that the tiend position is is like for rookie is one of the toughest positions but I think that the is very smart and you know maybe it will take him a while but I think that he will become our first Titan maybe by the end of the year fair enough ell anything else and about prediction yes what do you got well I think that we're I'm always like half full glass um and I hear all the crazy things that's why I don't I don't go to Twitter that much but I think that we're going to win the division winning 11 games that's bold I think that that that Philly and Dallas there like uh this is I don't have facts but this is just a cut feeling that there's some kind of turmoil internal turmoil in in both franchises so I think that it will show up during this season Elliot good call my friend thank you for checking in man don't be a stranger yeah thank you guys appreciate it and look I do and we've talked about this and I actually just did an interview with uh Aaron Shotz who does the um Outsiders dvoa you that's the Funk now football Outsiders no longer exist he is now with ftn fantasy but all his dvoa stuff and all his analytics have moved over to ftn uh that huddle is going to be go up I think in a couple weeks and he actually his I okay based on all your metrics and your dvoa metrics What teams do you think are going to drop or maybe a little overrated in terms of you know Vegas puts the over under on wins out there and stuff like that his first answer to me Philadelphia Eagles he said even last year when they were 10- one or 9 and one whatever they were they were still only 9th or 10th in dvoa and he said then they absolutely cratered so he's not quite sure about Philadelphia he was more of a believer in the Cowboys but he he says Philly is a team that he thinks is going to be a little volatile and I'll just throw from Dallas's perspective while Philly has a lot of talent and you don't know what's going on what kind of the other stuff down there with the coordinators and the coaching and all that stuff right Dallas has just lost a lot of guys I mean they had a lot of guys that play significant snaps for them that aren't on the roster anymore so maybe they can make up for those snaps because they're a good drafting team we'll have to wait and see about that but there's certainly Dallas is not as talented as they have been roster wise as they were over the last couple of years I would agree with that now the whole thing with Kell Moore and Vic fangio is really the the Crux of the jigsaw puzzle for the Eagles I mean you know I I talked to to veteran coaches who are retired about the Eagles Swoon the end of last season and the consensus was and we could see it by looking at the tape when they played the Giants you know the the end of the year and you were watching their stuff and you're like their defense is looking older and slower and starting to break down and they have moved on from some older guys on defense they they're going to the youth movement on side too which is also a risk by the way you don't young guys are going to do and then on offense they looked lost they just did and did you read the SPN article today I did not see it so Jeremy Fowler and I think their Eagles reporter I think wrote an article together about how the syriani Jay and Hertz relationship might not be the best wow okay and how her Bas the the gist of the article Brian Johnson who was the OC last year that they eventually fired let go and Herz wanted to do things one way serani wanted to do things a little bit of a different way and they it it was hard for them to get that together and they can't get a sense of what Kell Mo where he lands right now they couldn't get a sense well they hope he's going to be a good go between and kind of merge what the two guys want to do wow that could be a little sticky correct so I do think them some vulnerabilities there the Giants getting to 11 wins in my opinion and I hope I'm wrong I think that's going to tough with the schedule being a little bit easier I think that's asking a lot very highing you're almost doubling your number of wins from last year to this year which is which is a lot again I hope they can do it I hope I'm wrong but do I think 11 games could 11 wins could win this division this year I don't think that's I don't think that's impossible um I was going to go further and say I think 10 might even do it better tiebreakers I think you better win I think you better if you get to only get into 10 you better be ready to win a tiebreaker yeah you're going to have to yeah you know uh so yeah I did not read that article but that's certainly very interesting and and here's here's the one thing for me that I still can't calculate and we talked about this during the off season when Barkley signed with Philadelphia if that line even though it's not what it was because obviously Kel's gone and that was one of the thing that chat said he say his people he thinks people are underrating the loss of Jason Kelce that was another thing he said just for the record that well we're not we we saw Jason Kelce twice every year we know what he meant to that line who did we have on the show last year it was a huddle I think pieron and they compare Jason Kel's pre-nap impact on the Eagles to what Payton Manning oh it's we mortale when marale said that in the press conference didn't he compare Jason Kel's mental approach on offense to pay Manning he might have I know he drooled about him I think I might have done think I remember that and so you know and we we've never underestimated Kelsey ever in this room so you know the fact that he's retired to me that makes the the lines dip very very cloudy I just don't know how far they might dip and Ken Jurgens might even be as good of a blocker but all the stuff you lose mentally that's the maturity the leadership all that stuff Jurgens is this is a second year Jurgens right he was a rookie and they played in a guard last year so so I don't know I I think again I lik him coming out I thought he was going to be a good player but again he's not going to be Jason Kelce now if the performs close to the level that they have in the last several years if it's just close yeah and I don't know if that's possible but if it is and you put a healthy saquan Barkley behind them that's going to solve a lot of their offensive slowdowns from last year a lot I agree a lot but you got the two big ifs is the line going to be still pretty darn good or is it just going to be okay and is saquon Barkley going to be healthy enough to give them the type of season that they're paying for and again I don't want to go too much off of training camp Clips on social media because you know how deceiving those can be sometimes but I saw last week uh somebody put up four straight clips of T Tyler Gan Dallas going oneon-one against Michael Parsons okay and he stoned them like four straight times did he really like of course to they find the starting left tackle a year after Tyron Smith flee like are you kidding me come on you think Parsons was was was giving him everything he had it looked pretty good like uh Bobby belt who covers Dallas for the radio station down there look it up I was I was pretty impressed by the four reps but again it's just four reps over two weeks of practice don't go nuts but you mean like people freak out here over an an interception or an incompleted pass don't go too far but as unfortunately we both know Dallas has a knack for developing offensive lineman so I wouldn't be surprised that's all the cattle fed linemen they got down there in Texas it also doesn't help and I think this is honestly I think this is a big factor you know Duke manyweather his offensive line Academy is in frisco yeah so they basically leave the facility all right go to Duke and they get not like I'm I'm only half kidding in the spring as we've talked about you only get what an hour couple hours of field work with these guys and then drill work even less than that so if you have the advantage of being able to send them AC literally AC cross the street m to the top offensive line trainer in football and you can get another two three hours of working daily and you're communicating with that guy and he's teaching the same way you are you don't think that's going to help no doubt and Cooper BBE is a oine guy that works with Benny weather too he does so it's just one of those things where you know it is what it is it is what it is all right let's go to uh Tim and Charleston he's up next hi Tim hey John Paul how you doing I have not looked at your email yet Tim I'm getting ready for the first radio broadcast I am way behind but I will get to it I promise I wasn't even I wasn't even gonna bring it up I I was preempting you on that ptim that's okay um but I got a compliment SL suggestion and and then some predictions you can decide which ones are bold or not um first is I also love the uh the Huddle uh podcast with the folks from uh hardox that was that was great and it was really cool was at the end finding out that the the lady was actually a Giants fan which I guess was a surprise to you too from your reaction yeah I I I had no idea that that Emily who is Emily Lightner who is one of the producers on there um she is grew up a huge giant fan she said it was a huge thrill for her to be able to to do this and and she's like I was worried that I was going to get jaded but then I was actually really lik the way the organization functioned so I was really happy to do it it was very funny and the suggestion I had is that was so good um I was thinking could could you maybe put together a brief huddle you know like 10 to 20 minutes say range where you get together and talk to uh Joe Shane and Brian da about their experience with the Huddle kind of as a as a supplement to the hard knock's interview I think that would be cool uh if you could get I know everyone's busy but if you could get that time I think that would be a great follow up so it's just my little suggestion no I think that's good Tim and I don't think that's going to happen um I think it's a great idea so I will go and promote a different podcast if you do want to hear them talk about it there actually is a hard KN podcast that is hosted by Peter shreer and he actually did interview Brian D and Joe Shane on different episodes of that podcast so if uh if you want to listen to it go go listen to that if other fans are interested Jo Shan yesterday and I said oh that was my idea but anyway so so I got four quick things and one of them is kind of if then so it's not really a bold ition but the first one is our sack differential last year was 51 our sack differential yeah I have I have a huddle coming up Tim with with uh Warren sharp and he went back as far as he could it was the largest sack differential that he could find in the history of the league that's three a game exactly so my prediction and I I don't know how bold it is but that our sack differential this year will be less than 10 between the number of sacks get and the number that we allow I like that allow number because we're going to be in a passing game and I also think we'll be playing with more leads make it a little easier I don't know how bold it is Tim but I like you attacking that stat with a prediction so Kudos I like that I'm going to go one further the Giants will have more sacks defensively than they give up this year oh that's bold put that one down Pearson put that one down that's because last year they were What minus 40 51 last year oh m is 51 thank you you I'm I'm gonna do it I'm gonna do it I'm gonna say that yeah I was I was going to go there and I looked at the number and I said no that's freaking impossible I I could ttim I can imagine you sitting there looking at the numbers and you hear like Lance's voice in the back of your head you can't expect the stats to change that much in one year no because I I think that last year was such a Confluence of events such a perfect storm that I I think to rationally uh try to interpret and extrapolate off of those numbers doesn't really hold as much water as it usually would I don't know if Pearson if you can look this up if you can great if you can I understand can go back and see if you can figure out the last time the Giants had more sacks then they allowed sacks I'm curious when the last time is that happened what else you got for me Tim so well if I ever start hearing Lance's voice in the back of my head I'm going to start taking sleeping pills so well actually you might not have to take sleeping pills now again I don't know that this is so bold but I think our our three stes will have 10 picks a minimum um and then I think our Three Edge rushers uh Burns Tibido and oari will have over 25 sacks so okay so tibo and oari over 25 sacks combined Burns right wait with Burns or not including Burns with Burns all three of those guys 25 plus and then the safeties only will have at least 10 picks right okay put those down Pearson I think those are pretty bold I can I dig that that's pretty good they qualify they qualify cool so you know I list 100% of the content promote it all I know the today's check's already in the mail to the guy from Puerto Rico but you know that's all right um only one check for show Tim that's I'll call back next week I appreciate it man good stuff T we'll give you a coupon Tim for a free handshake when we see you at the stadium free handshake at the stadium Tim now has four bold predictions okay that's right I got much how I'm not sure how bold they are but I like how he kind of goes outside the box and thinking some stats that maybe other people don't think about MH yeah so Pearson while we talk about the defensive death J see if you can figure out when the last time is the Giants had more sacks than they had sacks allowed I'm curious I'm going to here's my bll prediction 2016 I'm not sure I understand 2016 is the last year that had more sacks than they had sacks allowed that's a really really good strong guess that's my guess I would think that's probably right I thinking it's possible in 2022 it's possible see but I don't think they had many sacks in 2022 no I I don't think so either I'll I'll go with 16 also because you see the thing about 16 Not only was it a really really good defense but the other thing was Eli really had to rely on the pass game in 16 Rashad Jennings was the lead back and that that was not a very strong running game Eli really did it on his own and of course Beckham but because with the quick releases but because the defense was so good they didn't have to try to do a lot on offense like they were not a high-scoring team in 2016 no but it was a lot of short to your point you just said it a lot of short quick passes so I think the sacks were down that because of the way they were able to operate offensively and whether or not that was the last time I'm pretty sure that probably was the case now if it was the last time that's the only doubt and I don't think that we had any other team that we've watched here that could be in that ceg the underrated part of why 2017 went so bad is that the defense fell off a bunch which required the offense to do more and then the off couldn't do it and they fell apart yep correct 2011 939 4513 guys we have a couple open lines if you want to get in over the last 20 or so minutes of the show feel free uh Paul let's jump over to the defensive side of the dep chart here that was a good interlude I'm happy we took some calls there in the middle um not a ton of surprises here looking at it to me sorry I do have an answer oh what you got uh Bears 2022 we got six sacks they only had one against oh no I mean season long Pearson oh oh okay sorry that's my bad not game by game I was like there's plenty where they gave up one or two or zero oh yeah no no no yeah no I just mean season long the Giants had more sacks than they had sacks allowed that'll take a bunch of clicks to find yeah I think you almost have to do it individually you could probably find the list of total sacks and then you have to just line to each other yeah every year it'll take a bunch of clicks yeah if you go nfl.com and there on their team stats Pearson they will have sacks and sacks allowed in their defensive and offensive splits you just to compare them make it easy go right to 2016 first and then work upwards because we think 16's probably a good betat that's not a bad way to do it all right so on the defensive side of the ball here Paul uh they do have the Giants um nickel defense as the primary formation which makes sense you're going to be a nickel most of the time so you have your two inside guys on as starters Dexter Lawrence and rakee Nunes Roz nacho not a surprise the two backups Jordan Riley behind Dexter Lawrence and Ryder Anderson behind nacho which again I think if you just looked at playing time last year and history you'd be wow wow Ryder Anderson he was you know he barely sometimes he didn't get jerseys last year but he's done a good job in Camp and he's been their best pass rushing three technique so he's the backup there and that would be the three technique spot right with Dexter and nose uh DJ Davidson is the third string nose Jordan Phillips is a third string three technique and then Timmy horn who I think has actually had a pretty good camp along with Elijah Chapman and then Casey Rogers as your fourth and fifth stringers yeah horn had a pretty good last week too I think Horn's been good and they've actually used them outside as a big end a little bit as well as a tackle so if they like that Flex he might have found a way on to the roster and I you know the other day when I chuckled I I forget who was were you with me when uh Elijah Chapman's name came up yeah and and I chuckle and I chuckle because he doesn't look the part right he's a fire hydrant no if he's if you watch the defensive line drills and watching him stand next to the other guys it looks like they pulled some high school football player out and like had him work out with the pro guys just again not because of his like just this small he's right correct he just doesn't look now he's thick correct real thick like a fire hydrant think about a lot of times I mean Paul he's six' 278 lbs yeah how many defensive linemen that play inside are 278 I mean just forget about it all right so here's the thing so I chuckled and I know some people took offense to that that was I wasn't chuckling at him I was chuckling at the look that when he's standing amongst these bohemuth linemen it just looks kind of funny but the truth is boy does that kid have a motor and his he doesn't stop John it reminds me of when in Camp and I said this I think I said to Pearson remember when the Giants would put Nikita Whitlock at defensive yes and he was his he had such natural Leverage that offensive lineman had trouble dealing with a guy that was so short they couldn't get their hands on him because he was so low to the ground and it's kind of the same type of deal we're seeing with Elijah Chapman now they had a spot Whitlock because you know he couldn't give you a whole lot well he was only 250 right he was very very undersized at least 280 yes he is thank goodness for that um and and with a guy like that you can only spot him and to be honest I think Chapman's going to be a terrific practice squad player I don't have him on my 53 as it sits today I haven't set that up for myself yet I'm going to start doing that next week but it'd be hard for me to think that they'd show him the door and Usher him out of the building I think they're going to want to keep him around well I think it was Shane Bowen that said they're going to have trouble cutting down at this defensive line spot there's there's a lot of activity in there these guys you know I had talked way back when in the offseason about I thought Ryder Anderson was a sleeper at three technique and a lot of people rolled their eyes at me oh did they really oh yeah I agree with you on that one I I was with you on that well and I think he's proven during camp that he's a legit guy who should be in that rotation no I mean look I I think nacho has been a really good all-around player especially against the run but in terms of pure pass rush Ryder Anderson has been the second best defensive tackle I think I think so too you know so um yeah you look at these bodies and look I know Jordan Phillips has the history with the bills and dble and Shane but you know he has been cut three different other times in his career and he has had a lot of injury and he's like four years removed from that nine sack season that he had this is Phillips you're talking about right J yeah Phillips I'm sorry Jordan Phillips so I don't know how all of that will come into play and how much does he have left I don't know the answer to that John we're gonna have to see in these games but um DJ Davidson's been here he's had some moments too and he's absolutely had some flashes now I will say this I thought the line Lions did open up some nice siiz holes in some of the Run drills against the Giants the last couple of days both days second team Rush defense to me was was bruised it was it was a problem and you know how do you interpret that do you put a lot of value in that do you say okay we're not game planning we're not scheming is that part of why that happened or do you say you know what those guys weren't physical enough they didn't do what they were supposed to do to be in those holes I don't know how the coaches view it neither do I because we were stressed the coaches stressed to us D in particular said we don't game plan for these things remember this is a practice it is a joint practice we do get an evaluation against a competitor and we do get an evaluation of a certain type of intensity skill set uh reactions and instincts but we still don't game plan he was stressed it's still a practice and so I don't know I don't know where they're putting the value there yeah it's a good question at the edge not surprising Brian Bird's on one side Boogie Basham backs him up who I also think has had a pretty productive Camp I think he's going to be a real solid another one of my offseason sleeper guys but we'll see and then o AO and they've actually moved boogie in to the three technique spot a little bit too so he might be a third down pass rush in there did Wake Forest we have not seen Burns Tibido or oari move inside at all on third down if we're going to see that over the next couple of weeks we'll have to wait and see that may be a little card in the back pocket yeah but I feel like they're going to want to work him in there a little bit before just slide them in I don't know maybe not we'll see don't know um and then on the other side you have Kavon Tibido aiz oari behind him who has practice every day and look pretty good so far this summer correct uh Tom and fox and Bon Whitley uh the guys behind them so again I think you know who your top four guys are it's Burns Tibido bash of oari I'd be shocked if all four of those guys Paul to me aren on the final 53 right and then the question is do you get a fifth guy in there somewhere I don't know again this comes down to the Giants have at least you think it's fair to say at least four different positions where they may have to steal somebody I I have not done that I have not done that thing yet where I try to get down to 53 so I don't have a great answer for you to be I haven't boxed out of 53 but I I was up at 3:30 in the morning this past morning no no joke I had somebody messaging me at 3:30 in the morning we're messaging back and forth what are you going to do at receiver what other idiot were you messaging at 3:30 in the morning somebody from the West Coast going to say they had to be at a different time Z going to say they better be at a different time zone they were and and and basically what I was contemplating with with with my friend was what are you doing at receiver when you got a Pros Pro like Alan Robinson and a Pros Pro like Isaiah McKenzie both guys would love to sneak on to the 53 but well I don't think that's the competition though Paul give me give a second let me follow through me follow goad I'm sorry because well first of all how many are you keeping six at most okay at most okay and one of them better be a special teams player I think osfi in my mind I can't cut oepi I think well what I what so you're think it's Tim against McKenzie right I think that's hands down onfy I think it's hard Brian D loves him isah mck I know he does he loves you heard him talk about him I know he does I I watched too much oi and and and now he's running pass routes and he catches everything have you seen him drop anything gunar has looked very good and he can give you kick return he can give you pump return he can give you punk coverage I get it Brian da loves him I know he Mackenzie all right so I I've kind of in my mind as I've tried to this is why I'm up at 3:30 in the morning well can you well if you keep both can you make Gunner your seventh okay I've wrestled with make Gunner my five and now there's one spot and it's McKenzie or Robinson in the number six spot so you're already taking Isaiah Hodgins out I'm thinking Isaiah Hodgins can't make the team wow okay you Robinson that far ahead of Hodgins huh well I got I got Robinson ahead of Hodgins for two reasons number one he is more I know hodin has some size too but much more of a proven commodity over the years to be not only a Pros Pro not that hjin isn't but with his length and his height his smarts he's off the chart smart he is a very good run blocker and and I think that that room that wide receiv in there could really use a grand papy grand papy okay I really do Grand I'm sure Al Robinson would love to hear that you just refer to him as a grand py the the dude's a Pros Pro he has seen it all he's been around forever wouldn't you love to have him helping out uh Robinson and Hyatt and neighbors so not not not that Slayton doesn't because he's been around too how about your man number six Bryce for weaton well I love Bryce Ford weaton but I think he can go practice squad because I don't think anyone's going to claim him all right well you see he better not have a big preseason game I know I know but I I'm saying now I think he gets through okay so I'm I'm I'm I'm banking on him being here as he sneaks through so my thought was they keep six and how did I wrestle I wrestled with the chefski's five who's my six and it came down to me Robinson against McKenzie now here's how I weighed it all the stuff I just said about Robinson but he doesn't play specials Isaiah McKenzie does play specials he's a Pros Pro he's a returner I don't think he's in on coverage units is no he's he's just a return guy so if you as a returner then McKenzie's really not playing specials that's why I'm leaning towards Robinson because I looked at it and I said well what Robinson doesn't have he doesn't have special teams but you don't need McKenzie's returnability on specials if you're keeping Gunner McKenzie to me is more of a similar player to osfi to Robinson right uh and they've already got two of those guys at least on my sheet do I need a third guy out of that cookie cutter and if you're keeping Tracy he could be another return guy for you too we got to do first names with Robinson's but yes you yeah Allen Allen Allen Allen Allen Allen Allen okay so so that's why John that's why John I wrestle I'm I'm up at 3:30 in the morning this morning with my friend on the west coast and we're wrestling with just the receiver core what's going to happen with this wide receivers room and what are the factors that will weigh more heavily with Brian dable and I kept in mind what you said about his love for mckenzy all I can say is this he was a big Cole Beasley guy in Buffalo too and Cole Beasley wound up getting hammy or calf and then wound up gone but if he didn't get that hammy or calf what do you have been on the team I don't know the answer to that yeah neither do I but I also took that into account and said hm it did save Cole Beasley uh the preseason games are going to be obviously hugely important I'm leaning right now towards possibly Allan Robinson sneaking in as number six all I don't know how we got from the defensive dep chart to wide receiv I'm sorry really really quick 2016 was correct 22 22 sacks allowed 354 only 22 sacks allowed that year 148 get it out baby get it out holy wow yeah well that your playoff team you know sack avoiding sacking players it's it's it's it's important um real quick before we hit the rest of the defensive dep chart sidac and I had this argument on Monday show okay combined running backs tight ends how many do you keep since you went through this process I'm well I've I've gone through it at the receiver spot I didn't go through the other spots it was just enough of a headache just looking at the wide 3 a.m. tonight you can yeah exactly right um I I went into this week thinking that Max is four running backs and if nobody's dinged up I might try to go with three and sneak turbo onto practice squad because I don't necessarily believe that he'll get cleaned okay you okay with me on that I don't think you're keeping four running backs I think you can only keep three now if I don't remember the last time the Giants kept four one no but if somebody is banged up at the time of the 53 you may have to fine then how many and that's that's where I'm I'm waffling all right how about tight ends okay tight ends I'm look I'm looking at three I think you have to keep four and I said that to SCT I don't think you have a guy that can take enough of the snaps as a two-way player I who you letting go if KAG is your receiving tight end manit is your blocking tight end Theo Johnson's your upand cominging rookie and Daniel Bellinger is your all-around guy which which one of those guys can you go without if kager doesn't do enough for me he is on the fence well he's got to get back healthy obviously and and right now I don't I don't know how I feel about where he's at I'm a little concerned so he'd be the guy that would be off for you and I and I hate to say that because I've been a c guy since he got here I wanted him here and he has looked good in Camp too I know he has I know he has but if it comes down to that I've got to keep the fourth back and again this is where you have to Waffle on positions right if I got to keep the four backs I can't keep four tight ends if I can afford to only go three backs and go Dante Miller to practice squad now I can consider the four tight ends that also means there's no way in the world I'm keeping the seventh receiver which some people think you might try to do I had seven between running back and tight ends with four tight ends and three backs that's how I had it so all right uh rest send your asps to me by the way care of the New York Giants because quite frankly folks I do spend up all hours of the night trying to figure this out or you could just send unbranded acetamin or ibuprofen too that works also so we don't send branded things to people well aspirin is branded that is a brand name yes aspin itself is actually brand say say it one more time I'm product again I'm sorry I I did not I thought that was a generic name no I don't think so I think I think that's uh I think that I don't think that's the name of the medication okay I could be wrong though maybe WR I really I didn't do it on purpose I actually thought it was a generic I know you never do this stuff on purpose doesn't mean I can't give you stuff for it all right linebackers Paul uh Bobby oer and Mikey mcfaden not surprising Deontay Johnson who was kind of split time on mcfaden with the ones behind him not a surprise and then I think Carter coflin is with the twos Matthew Adams and mua with the threes and then Beaver is behind mua was the fourth string I thought was a little surprising to me I think beavers has actually done some really nice things and he's even gotten as High Reps as with the twos uh and you know I've always been a beavers guy and I'm not giving up on him at all um I also believe that uh that mual for me looks like more of a project than he does a guy who would be you know counted on as part of the depth chart so I would I would put beavers ahead I think Deontay Johnson had a really good preseason in a summer last year and he's having another good one so I'm not surprised that you know they you know the the pr staff listed him as high as they did as right behind mcfaden and it would not surprise me if he makes the 53 okay so here we go aspirin is a generic trademark in many countries yeah but there is an aspirin with a capital A that is a registered trademark uh of Bear in Germany Canada and Mexico and 80 other countries so you were kind of half right and half wrong at the same time okay I'll bu there you go just want to throw that out there to you does that mean the next time I take one I have to break it in half the Giants don't have an official pain medication so it's not like we're going to get in trouble for that or anything so it's okay good did you guys know Kleenex is a company name yes I always thought it was just a generic Kleenex tissues no no Kleenex Kleenex is a is a b okay now see both you guys have now violated the rules oh we we also do not have a a official facial tissue of the giant so we're not going trouble with that yeah because you have Puffs right like Puffs is one brand and then you have kleenex which is another that is true and then some of like you know you can get the generic brand in too so yes I'm glad we're squaring this away do you like the ones with the lotion on them I'm not a big fan of the lotion ones no I always find my wife wants to get the ones with the lotion but she feels like they're softer and I'm like no you get the soft ones that don't have the lotion and and those are better oh I could not agree more John somewh on the same page there you go all right let's go to the secondary which I think Paul is going to be one of the things that these preseason games go a long way towards deciding who's going to yeah 53 Drew Phillips already in there as a starting nickel not a surprise given what we've seen Deontay Banks and flat they've been the starters outside not a surprise it's still kind of weird seeing Isaiah Simmons listed as a as a nickel corner but that's what he is on early down that's where he's at uh Nick McLoud the third guy I think Phillips Simmons and McLoud are all on this team I'd be shocked if all of them weren't uh behind Banks you have Trey Hawkins and then David long behind flat you have darney Holmes and Brion borders and those are the guys Paul Hawkins long holes borders hearnden those are the guys that are going to be fighting for those backup quarterback spots no question John and it may not just be a fight amongst themselves it could be a fight amongst somebody else who turns up on the waiver wire let's not kid ourselves if they if if if they if they see somebody out there who kind of Lights the lamp for them or is just a free agent hasn't signed yet no question about that either there could be a late arrival here that unseats one of those guys on the back end and that would not surprise me at all I know they're going to want these guys to get as much work in these games as they can get because they truly want to see what they have but I would not discount somebody else coming in and then it's safety Dame Belton Jason pinck Tyler nuban obviously your top three there and then all four of these next guys Paul have all made plays at different times in Camp Elijah Riley is listed with the twos javarius Owens the second year safety he was a late trffic last year along with haes with the threes and then Alex Johnson who's had a couple picks as the fourth stringers and all four of those guys Paul have made plays at different times in Camp games will be key for the safety position I could not agree with you more about that too um Alex Johnson had that one day with two interceptions in one day which which was obviously a very big thrill for him at least one was off of deflection where I kind of just right to him but still but he still made the play you know you could drop it he didn't um yes you could drop it look I I honestly don't have a a handicap on any of those guys right now as to who has the inside track and I you would probably agree we need to see the games javarius Owens last year it was disappointing to me in one regard that we didn't get a chance to see him because I know when they took him they felt very strongly that he had tremendous upside and they were excited to get him as late as they did in the like his athleticism and coverage ability it was he had tackling issues in college which were a problem he did but they were hoping they could get that together with him as by the way we can't see and Camp practice we cannot so he I got to see him playing games correct which is why it was important and it was disappointing that I didn't get to see him but here's the flip side to that pinck and mckenny didn't want to come off the field that's true too and and when they went through safeties D Belton flashed and did good things that is true so there was never a chance because of the guys in front of him for him to play you're right I'm with you so we've got the same question marks about Owens can he take his game to an adequate level with tackling at the NFL level we still don't know the answer to that and guess what in the first couple of weeks of camp we still don't know the answer speaking of dropping things Pearson had a rough day yesterday uhoh we were packing up gear uh for the for the game yesterday what did you break and you know that like big you know that big tall black case that we put a out of the stuff on one of the doors which also has a table attached to it Pearson dropped it on its toe oh wait what I don't see a boot no no boot he was bleeding he was bleeding was he really just a bruised up toe blood a little bit well turf toe has ruined a lot of careers Pearson I'm just telling you turto has has has table toe has had done anything never heard of taable toe just walking around a little slower I'm I'm fine all right he's tough he's playing through pain very good very good hurt not injured we we will uh we will make note of this are you probable or questionable for the game tomorrow probable you're probable okay are are you up and down the sidelines with me tomorrow night uh no I'll be up top shooting okay he has it easy tomorrow exactly you know try try coming down to the field running Endzone to end zone in the middle of the rain Paul nobody wants to be with you on the FI no not even Howard no nobody I I I said nobody for a reason Howard's very scared of me on the field a big because you hit people he's a he's a big man fans if you don't understand when something good happens or bad depending on the play he will just go up behind you wind up up and whack you in the shoulder or the back and you don't even know he's there do you know how I mean you've seen Howard on the show largest human being on the planet Paul like I'm not going to say Hurtz I think that's maybe a little bit strong but Howard does not enjoy when Paul whacks him after good or bad plays there there are times he's actually run for me I'm going something to smash you next time there's a lot of there's a lot of energy coming through those headsets and stuff it just energizes to make like the heart you know like the cartoon where you just Bonk on the top of the head you put into the ground okay I think that's what he needs to do to you anyway Giants TV all our highlights all that other stuff that we do content blah blah blah uh Roku Apple TV Amazon Fire TV Jo check it out it's free which is the most important thing uh and then of course you want giant season tickets take your fam to the next level giants.com tickets season and single game tickets are now available lot of exclusive member benefits go to giants.com tickets to check it out limited inventory folks people are excited um and by the way great job by the fans out of training camp this year uh practice are no longer open to the public but fans uh really energized practice out there the heat yeah man we had some real burners out there big time I I don't think I think I looked at the 7 day forecast not one day over 85 over the next 7even seven days so all this rain that's coming is bringing in a cold front which is which is quite nice for Paul datino I'm John thanks for joining us on big blue kickoff live presented by Cadillac we do have a show tomorrow dintino and saac live at 1 and then we have the game tomorrow night go check out our pregame coverage on WFAN FM the Yankees are on am we will be on FM tomorrow starting at 6 pm and then after the game Jonathan Casas and I Paul's other stuff going on he might pop in and out of the two shows as well we'll see how it goes uh and then of course on the call will be Chris Corino and sha O'Hara Paul will be on the sideline during the game so make sure you go check that out we'll see you tomorrow