From Catwalk to Design - Alexa Chung

When I was younger [Music] I'm Alexa ch um I'm from England know clothes are important and do have a political and a social political resonance that said um I think this kind of appetite for consuming stuff uh to buy a cheap cache into having people on your social media think that you're quote unquote cool is a dangerous sport if it's something you're doing because it's coming from a place of insecurity about who you are or not knowing what's the right thing at the right time then I don't know I think everyone has a capacity for having their own style cuz it's their own opinions their own self-expression and the most interesting people out there those that have kind of embraced themselves and are authentic to their thing friends are cool it buy them allig Granddad trainers and white socks and those glasses come on guys everyone needs to have a word with them oh we do rock and roll again it was much better five classic items for me um I genuinely think an animal print of some variety is quite classic so it would be something along the lines of this leopard print shirt and or snake skin somewhere not actual snake skinin like print great jeans once you find them hold them dearly in your arms and don't let the butt wear out lately I've been living in white t-shirts since I became a creative director okay how about an ankle boot how do you like them apples I've always loved clothes so I've always um been an avid Shopper and someone that likes to kind of go through all the Vintage racks and look for unexpected things but also enjoys really beautifully put together in curated stores now that I understand the change of how things are made and Chain of how things are made the provence of where your clothes are coming from I have become slightly more responsible in the way that I shop because I understand how much something costs and why it costs a certain amount whereas I used to go into like Isabelle or something and be like why I think the older I get the um happier I am to um seem sexier in the way that I get dressed I think I when I was younger and I was modeling and then on I think I was actually just a bited out by being looked at so I was keeping everything very buttoned up and sort of keen for people to think about what my what what I was saying or thinking rather than what I looked like so I was like nothing to see here I'm just a grandma that's very serious now I'm like seriously though guys like what's up so I just undo a lot more buttons these days I did try and do a social media detox recently um to no avail because I the thing I love about social media is having a window into other people's lives and being able to see things outside the parameters of my experience personally I made um a decision to do quite a big cull recently of things that weren't making me happy or things that no longer had relevancy to my life so I got rid of quite a few fashion accounts that were making me paranoid or making me you know they're affecting the work I was doing and the vision I have for my brand and instead replac them with I don't know pictures of cats and or um a lot of Interiors actually I think I've realized I've aged because now I'm attracted to Pottery so yeah I think just you have to be mindful no one else you can't be like social media is bad it's like well then you're bad just take responsibility for your own man but still follow me you good afternoon everybody and welcome back to build I'm your host Carrie justic today I'm sitting down with Alexa Chong and tan France who are two of the biggest names in fashion but in their latest Netflix series they're looking for the next household name designer the show next in fashion already has people Next household name designer buzzing and binging and for good reason please help me and welcoming Alexa and tan yes I am yeah you should be yeah we've I've never referred to myself as one of the biggest names in fashion but I'll take it okay well I that just kick it off with that because I do want to talk about that I mean Alexa people have known you for a long time very old not old experienced thank you and tan I mean obviously you're a fan favorite from queer ey people are obsessed with you but with this show obviously you two are the authorities in this I mean you are a designer now you're judging designers and I mean I'm also a designer just to clarify like that is actually my background I also on query yeah she is U here's the thing I I keep saying but I'm going to keep on saying it is I think people just assume I'm a stylist because of what they see on query I'm actually not a stylist I'm actually designer first and foremost you're just good at everything even just thinking about yourself as a household name I'm sure that's a weird thing I'm literally a household name cuz I am Alexa I already occupy a great space in most people's homes so now I'm just pleased to bring the Chong to your favorite device that's amazing um but what has that been like for you guys like you you know like being designers who are now judging designers I actually initially uh like a modern person does these days I've switched careers quite a few times um so I actually started out as a TV host in England so I was 22 when I started being on TV and before that I was a model from 15 so like I've never really known a different experience necessarily so I I'm pleased that people like the show uh but I yeah I didn't I don't know I've just been I've just been in my studio because I really I have a fashion line uh we're basr sorry we're based in East London so so my reality now is just like actually being the creative director and doing that so it was lovely to do this show and flex some kind of judging muscle but I've never done it before um I hope to do it again let's hope so I'm actually going to speak for her Sor that was a rambling I just ate loads of pasta and now I've got um carbonara brain which is an Affliction I'm going to say this uh so she's it was very well respected in the fashion space for a long time and then she created a brand that a lot of people I I wear some of her stuff I love her I wear some of her stuff I lovr her stuff stuff you've got my jacket on people wear her stuff and so it makes sense that Alexa would be judging uh or she has a right to judge because her her aesthetic is uh wonderful and it's an aesthetic people really gravitate towards so she's an authority thanks T it's all right my love you know you you've had the pastor you can't concentrate Alan I just love this already because I mean the what are we English Queens this I think was looking at your Instagram from when the show launched and you were very much like I'm nervous like how will people receive it people are freaking out over this and I personally think it's because of you two and all the people on the show just the relationships and how human it is I mean you obviously worked with a group of guys for queery what was it like making this connection and this relationship yeah it's nice to have somebody really nice to work with as opposed to those mean mean mean boys you know them they're just no it's a that it was such a relief honestly it is a concern when you uh being TV for a long time also when and you've had rotating castmates host whatever yeah I'm not a loyal lover yeah it's it's nerve-wracking thinking I don't know what this person is going to be like I've gotten so comfortable with people that know me so well and that we Vibe really well and we clearly have a very strong chemistry to working with somebody that you don't really know thinking gosh how that works out and we're bloody lucky cuz it worked out real well it's a leap of faith cuz they kind of put you together we had actually already met very briefly at a party and I am a huge fan of tan anyway so I I had high hopes that it wouldn't be a disaster but from day one we got on very well so it's been it's been so nice yeah and I mean even with the contestants your relationships I love seeing those because especially for a competition series you kind of think of the hosts as maybe you know like not always SE entity yeah and you guys I mean you're rooting for them we were all up in their business yeah annoyingly uh present it was great cuz we got to see them in the workshop actually doing the patterns and sewing this stuff together but a lot of the time you know they they're really up against it they have a day to complete that so we were just interrupting them and asking them questions and sometimes we would get short shrift and they'd be like sorry can you please go away and stop doing gymnastics like sorry we have to make TV out of this so we have to talk a little bit but the reason why I think it's different for us on our show is because again we are designers we know what it feels like to have a deadline or to know that something's not going right or the fact that you've chosen a fabric and it's too late to chase that fabric like that's an intimidating process so I think that's why we were able to connect with our contestants so greatly um because we just we wanted them to succeed it was never a case of well that one needs to fail cuz we need we needed to succeed if that one needs to fail you have experience of doing it yourself you can be way more um empathetic yeah I love that and just hearing you say the part of where designers that obviously that hit me after the street wear episode and I don't want to give too much away hopefully you all already watched it cuz like I said it's so good and binge worthy um but there was a really human moment there and you got emotional and you did kind of plea with them like we've been in your shoes and we still struggle with these things can you tell me a little bit about what happened there and how you kind of hit that point yeah I think that is one of the the points of beauty of our show is that we we decide based on what that product was or that design was that episode whether this person should move forward or not and it it really does show that it's an honest experience for us where we couldn't come to a unanimous decision and we do actually care and you if you know me from K you know I don't actually cry very often in four and a half Seasons I've cried once on the show I'm not a very emotional person um and so when I got very emotional on uh next in fashion it's because I really did that decision was so hard for us uh to make and I needed the designers to know that we aren't trying to say that we're separated we don't understand understand your story we don't understand how difficult this is I want you to know that we're taking it so seriously and so that's why it was emotional yeah and week by week obviously it got harder and harder because you're weeding out people and by that stage in the competition everyone's kind of amazing so it was we kind of uh created a problem for ourselves really by the The Producers did so well at casting it and everyone's super talented but it made judging almost impossible yeah as we got towards the end we it wasn't it couldn't be based on are they a great designer cuz every especially towards like the last four I was what I watched again some of bit last night and to I know like spend the day doing press go home watch it again nice it's been a while since I watched it so I wanted to watch it again and really understand what people were talking about online and I watch that again thinking it wasn't that any of them wasn't a good designer cuz they were all Wicked towards the end it's just that wasn't their CH we had somebody called Carly um I don't want to give too much away but on one of the channel challenges she doesn't do very well she is a formidable formidable designer but that just wasn't her Challenge and so I think that's what makes it interesting it's not that they they're not good designers they are they can all do this very easily it's just that sometimes that's not then that's not their genre well the challenges also were incredible and I loved it because even before watching you just look at the titles of everything and what they're going to be making and they're some of the most difficult things to pull off they're going from undergarments to Suits to den um do you guys have any say in what those challenges were uh not really they had already laid out what they how they wanted the episodes to take form but we definitely were vocal about ones that we thought were preferable yes um or a little bit off I think or a bit off or maybe not that different from one I don't know um but it is you know in the modern world having a fashion line it is uh indicative of that experience that you might want to roll out um a product line which includes sports wear and active wear but at the same time you might need to do tailoring so it was more about testing The Gauntlet that they would have to run were they to set up this own fashion company yeah and they can't just be good at one thing like you know it's typical that you might have a denim line or so yeah it was good but denim is weirdly very very Was good but denim is weirdly difficult very difficult and it's all well and good if you do one thing very well but that's not going to make an international brand that will make you successful to a certain extent but you need to C to more of an audience than just that one particular thing yeah and so you were just saying you rewatched cuz you wanted to you know be part of the conversation that's taking place right now what has it been like going on to social media and seeing everybody's reactions I I've you know it can be scary I haven't done a show that's been you know on an international platform ever so I was a bit frightened but actually least on my Instagram which is the one I look at everyone's been really supportive and really kind and it's been lovely yeah we talking about this earlier it's funny a lot of my friends we communicate through DM instead of text and the amount of people who have used the word actually is funny like they were saying oh it's actually really good I'm like no I had the exact same thing like my family are so sweet of course they support everything I do but I could tell that it was actually watchable show they were like we've actually finished the whole series what were you planning on doing watching like a few episodes to tell you that they are no I watched one and then I watched more yeah okay well thank you related by blood to do that well I mean honestly if you're thinking about it like I haven't seen a show like this that's been so revamped in a while like you've seen this type of show and so it's kind of like as an audience member you're like okay what are they going to do that's different you know and like I said it was so refreshing because of the relationships the challenges and then my personal favorite episode was the underwear episode oh yeah I like loved it but I also loved it because I mean even with different body shapes and sizes it was so seamlessly integrated into the conversation the episode and it wasn't it wasn't a conversation there's no although a bit that they cut out of that episode was tan when you were teaching the girl to walk in heels in heels this girl heels and she was like actually every model every one of them female models was going to wear heels and two of the males and they couldn't do it I was like how is this even possible so I came back from lunch and I like found tan out the front just like okay follow me he had his he loves to heal anyway but he had his like tall issues on him was like use your hip yeah like swing it around swing it so Dan was using his spare time to change the model that was my lunch break no because you know you don't know tan but he's really cares about people and he's a very nurturing energy and I think he just wanted them to look their best and they were beautiful these girls but it's intimidating to wear underwear on a television show even if you're a model you know you're used to doing Stills or whatnot this is a cat walk in front of a live audience so I think they were maybe a bit nervous and they also trusting designers that just put these undergarments together yeah so that's think of that I know they were so brave I was like wow I wouldn't have been able to here's this underwear super high car Put this underwear God I was like these ladies are really taking care of business down there well some of the models I was thinking from what I saw they all seemed like they super knew what they were doing and which I loved because sometimes the design could be like oh she like didn't know what she was doing and she made the Garment look bad but I was like no no they said that in our show our show others that's what I'm saying like it's kind of like you they all looked super professional give me a surprise my dream actually is that someone puts a bouncy castle in my garden brilliant I've never been able to do this but I have watched YouTubes of Justin Bieber doing it oh my God I thought I nearly did it then I never leave the house without my handbag basically it holds my life in it and then it slowly just collects more and more stuff and so I'll find like a mini Mars Bar stuck to the bottom or like half a contact lens so it just kind of becomes a bit of a merry popping situation I'm definitely enjoying more in my 30s it's kind of not true there's nothing really I'm enjoying more than my 30s pajamas I'm definitely enjoying pajamas more I wear old gentleman's ones that I bought not that I stole from an old man right now I smell like right now I smell like tuna no I don't right now I smell like well hopefully right now I smell like my rose and leather perfume that I put on this morning but I can't guarantee that the most beloved thing in my wardrobe is do you know it's probably my Alexa Chung dongar which is the first uh collection that I made with my company I'm really pleased with them and I wear them all the time and it's very special that they're from our own brand let me tell you a joke Bono in the air Edge walk into a bar and the barman says you to again I regret as a teenager I regret wearing skin colored tights as a teenager which is what everyone used to wear at school and I don't really understand why I don't even is that edable it's pretty amazing it's like an alien a very sweet Stuart name BL would be my signature dish with blank for dessert Yorkshire puddings would be my signature dish with creps for dessert so I don't have to change the batter okay blank was definitely the best decade I think the' 70s were the best decade the '70s laidback style great denim Angelica Houston in the' 70s blank is my favorite accessory my Gucci bag is my favorite accessory love is um Love is very rare I really think people can only really be in love maximum three times in their lifetime so when you find it you should nurture it and appreciate it and be happy about it buy sell yes I don't know how that got in my bag but there it is I have the best of all my friends the best ass don't know that seems like a mean one doesn't it cuz I'd be like boyfriend not sure I'd call it a party trick but I can these sound like dodgy jokes I don't know why do you know I can um shuffle cards quite well lank always gets me up dancing pretty much any song I'll get a straw and wear the like headphones set and then like try and encourage people to be the backup dancers I'm a a frustrated pop star stuck in the body of someone that can't sing if I could body I'm frustrated pop star swap with anyone I would choose Rihanna just straight up even got to the end of the sentence thank you for watching that was Fillin the blank I had a lot of fun hope you did too I'm going to go now hi know I'm leaving weirdly I feel like we've shared a really intimate moment and and now I'm being awkward cuz we've slept together cool they were really nice and they just a few of them were recurring uh guests so yeah they've put up with a lot as well long days long days just like standing around in like leard yeah there was the one um with the dress that was like impossible to open and she couldn't go to theath she being so polite about it though nothing came up I kind of needed to go to the restroom for a while now hours bless her she so obviously like with that conversation that I was just saying like different sizes more inclusivity all these things I mean even the contestants are international from all over the place like what were some of the things that really excited you about the show and maybe how new and modern it is and how it reflects the fashion industry Now versus what it could have been I'm yeah I'm really pleased that Netflix I I kind of had no doubt that they would approach it with that tone but my experience of even in my own office there it's such a diverse uh group of people and really I employ people that have the best skills and quite often they've been trained not only in Britain but overseas maybe it's antp Australia wherever so I don't think it was even necessarily an effort to do something special it was more that if you want to do a show about fashion you'd be remiss not to reflect it properly and in this day and age there is more diversity that people are making clothes with all body types in mind and people designing them and working behind the scenes really are from all over the world so it was more just an accurate representation yeah I think same and for for people who don't know much about the fashion industry and like the logistics of it it was crazy to hear about like ghost designers and these people each of the contestants has created incredible products and Brands and companies and like you said you were like which one of you is a household name like what is going on in the fashion industry right now and how do you think this show is kind of like helping these designers well it's even like with my company I'm a creative director of my company but I'm not the head designer so it's quite typical that in a fashion house there's all the different uh jobs there you'll have a pattern cutter you'll have a knitwear designer I actually don't know a designer brand that you that everybody would know there there's not one place I know where the design the person that you are aware of of being the head of that house they're actually making every one of those it's just not physically possible they have a whole team of people and if they did it would probably be quite one note and so you have a collective of wonderfully talented people and so that's what these people are our our designers are they are part of those teams at those fashion houses so they do design that product but they just don't have the platform that lot of these people havea Fel yeah I think another thing the show gets right is showing how uh challenging it can be to work alongside someone else so the the idea of having teammates put together in twos working towards one common goal is really reflective of what happens like you have a Vision but someone else's taste might you know change the course of that design so I I liked that it's been really interesting so the response online has been wonderfully positive on our socials but that's the one thing that people say that's not fair that you put them with a stranger I'm like that's what happens in the real world you don't get to choose who your partner in design is like your boss Alexa would hire somebody at the the boss Alexa chonga of the world yeah and um and yeah and they they've chose is really reflective of what happens that they think is wonderful and then you have to work with them and make it work and we found on our show that uh that it didn't matter really if somebody had worked with that person before you could still get to the end interesting part about that too the Dynamics is none of them really went sour there were definitely disagreements or at least from what I saw but they all handle it in a really constructive way and it's not like anybody's getting kicked off and people are like good riddens like you guys re everybody is rooting for wouldn't you say it's also kind of a bit oldfashioned now to put mugs I just think there's a spirit of I mean whatever's going on in the world is crazy as well so maybe that's why this is the kickback to it but it seems kind of uh oldfashioned to people to be to one another and whatever like we're now living in an era where it's better to be uplifting and try and find Common Ground rather than uh agitate the other differences and that's a tone that we really desperately want to Def Foster on our show between between us also um and then with us and the contestants and the between the cont contestants I think somebody just trumped good for you let it out and sorry oh it was you I thought it was from that area so uh yeah I do think that it's um I do think that it's important that we set the tone from the top and make it clear that we're not here about to Champion aggression or negativity we're designers we don't have to be we don't have to fight enough of that around yeah there's no reason to get nasty with each other like I said I think that's why so many people are loving it we just want something good to walk something good and happy and nice and then on top of it these people are creating incredible things wouldn't it be funny if you if you had watched Quai and then you watched our show and I was just nasty to everyone like that would be great I hate you get well that's I mean it's crazy because you again so seamlessly go into this competition atmosphere and I think people have an idea of what that can look like but you guys are just I mean you're like their loving siblings and friends thanks for not saying mom and dad cuz you would have made us feel really so thanks but you get the job done thanks um I do also want to ask you just about the designers that you had come on and guest Jud you had an incredible lineup of people how exciting was that for you how was it to How exciting was that for you work with all these different people I think it was it it was really valuable to have them in the room because they acted also as mentors to the contestants so even even if it was a week where those people had to go they managed to have conversations with those people like Philip Lim or pral or um Chris for kanaine and these are people that they really respect within the industry so again it's not like a made for TV fake fashion designer it's someone that really understands and runs their own house and understands the trials and tribulations uh that come with it so we were really lucky to get such great people and it wouldn't have been fair if it was just alxa and I judging um we do like that aspect but it it really helped to have a couple of people who could see it with fresh eyes cuz we got to know the contestants so well it was nice have people come in and who didn't know their previous work and just judge it purely on that episode that lock I think that really helped us stay focused we loved Phillip as well did love wearing Philip pants right are you yeah yeah he was lovely I was very inspired after watching never met Christopher he Kane he's a very um very very big designer in the UK you were already friend never met him and now we DM and it's very nice I made friends yeah oh he's the best yeah he's fantastic I love that we're going to hand it over to audience Q&A we have five questions and the first one is on Twitter hello to Alexa I'm a model in the midwest who is looking to go into the more typical East Coast Europe industry do you have any advice tips or tricks thank you so much yes Alexa you're one of the reasons I began modeling in the first place can I take this one cuz I'm model first um where I yeah wait yeah she's going to have to move there isn't she I mean I'm sorry to break it to you it's going to be great but pack up that sack we're going to Paris um I think we're living in an interesting time where I mean I wish I was modeling in this day and age because when I was modeling you had to stand on your mark stay quiet they encouraged everyone to wear kind of the same uniform to Cas things whereas now I think after social media we live in a world where um eccentricity celebrated or being different or just being yourself so I'm excited for her to start modeling now hello I'm Alexa Jung and I I'm a TV host and I write features for British Vogue and I design denim sometimes or collaborate with people to make clothes and I DJ things and I stand in parties in outfits fashion industry is ridiculous it's like Zoolander if Zoolander was a documentary it is a documentary right do you know what I really hate champagne and my least favorite part of fashion is that that's the thing that they love to give out free everything and I always think wow I wish whiskey was associated with beautiful dresses because I'd be having a much better time things have changed so rapidly so there's loads of different new ways to get involved and obviously we've seen that from people like Tavy who got involved in fashion just from the comfort of her own home and a Blog and a computer so I think it's the landscape's changed I think I think you just have to to find your voice and have a unique perspective on things and whatever you're doing whether it's design or photography or art direction or anything just have a Clear Vision that's um new and fresh there's also people that are rubbish at stuff that just like slamming hot that get to be There's also people that rubbish at stuff there uh I guess it's about maybe being in situ cuz they need to see you so I think she should move to LA oh no the East Coast New York come on over come on over okay and then we have um in our audience hello hello hello um my question you guys both have had very expansive careers um was there a moment in y'all's careers where you were like I've made it you know or has that happened yet or I've made it yeah I have okay go on this so when I was younger I used to have a dream thinking that if I if I hit the certain point if I could do that thing then that's when I think I would have made it yeah yeah and mine was this was quite a while ago it was the first time I could afford a first class ticket not just the upgrade it was the first time I could afford a first class ticket when I had I had a few design business brand um and it was the first time that happened I was like I've made it and then I realized that wasn't making it but it felt so fancy at the time I uh would say I did a collaboration a few years ago with maidwell and I made this collection and it was in New York and um Anna winto came to look at the collection and when she arrived I was with my agent and we just like got got some takeouts we had like literally plastic bags in our hands and we weren't prepared for her yet uh I had to show her the collection on my friends who were modeling it so like my friend pixie and Poppy whatever and it was a groupies collection so I'd made like hot pants and like and I was like you know Anna it's just like what you want to wear on the road like you can stick your AAA thing on your butt there like boom and I just remember going having this out of Body Experience where I was like I'm showing a fashion collection to Anna winter like that's the weirdest thing I've got a followup did you eat your takeout whilst you were giving the present to hear the thing yeah yeah yeah sorry sorry burrito burrito myth sorry guys um no so I think you know actually interacting with the woman herself was probably the moment I was like this is mental yeah yeah quite the difference from the first class ticket I know she's like Anna went tour sh Alex I flew go to sleep Alexa our next audience question hi I'm Natalie nice to meet you to meet you thank you guys so much for being here love your sweater love your shoes amazing um love you on queer ey and dressing funny you helped Pete Davidson out so much God thank God for you um I wanted to ask you guys what are your fashion icons and where do you get inspiration from do you get it from walking in New York City do you get it from watching movies where where does It Strike yeah I uh definitely I find New York very inspiring uh I lived here in E Village for 7 years so that was kind of my stomping ground never went above 14th anyway uh for me it's I've always been heavily inspired by men's wear and my style icons are kind of rock musicians from the 60s and 70s so still now with my brand we always have like Brian Jones on the board or um Iggy Pop MC Jagger basically everyone in the Rolling Stones um so that's my vibe or that attitude and it can be transferred into a dress as well which is why I wear a lot of uh fairy tale dresses but with flat shoes I just want to feel like could go on stage in it and wield the guitar not I can play the guitar I don't have uh like a solid icon that I look to for inspo but um yeah just walk in the streets of actually mine is London because I I live in the US so it's nice to go over to London and I I was in China a lot um like a lot a lot Shanghai and I thought their St was incredible so I was wildly inspired by them um honestly as far as fash ion it's not the person I want to look like but I will always love Anna's look or Anna Winter's look like I just love that she stuck to that haircut for like 20 years I'm like you go my mom has that haircut yeah it's a good one it's classic and actually the reason why I started doing my hair like this my hair has always been this gray it's gotten grayer and grayer but I before I turned 30 I was like I just want like a classic look that I don't have to think but you know that's how you build an iconic brand yeah repeat like Carl agel you can imagine it's the wig and the glasses and thingy or Anna it's the wig and the glasses and the no so I think you've got Iconic Hair now I was going to say that's like the way of an icon yeah you guys got it down pat don't worry and then we have another question hello hello everyone's very stylish yes thank you I mean everybody came dressed to this just for you guys um so for Alexa I recently watched a video of you giving a tour of Williamsburg oh my God yeah that's the problem with the internet that stuff hangs around huh it was like from 7 years ago but I recently moved to Williamsburg and I was wondering what your favorite place to shop in Williamsburg is yeah so back then I remember making that video it was a Shopping Guide then so I haven't actually been there since my last trip but Stella Dallas is that still going that was great and it's uh by it's like North whatever fifth go on go ons love Ro going Dallas great vintage shop and uh out the back things are more reasonably priced and then next door it's forget about it yeah and then our last question right up right up FR hi um so we're Parson students and I was wondering if you had any advice for fashion students looking to go into the industry my dad still wants me to go to Parsons so I I should be asking you I think is I was a student also many many years ago many many many I got I can barely remember I did it um what I will say is um I know know that the dream is always to be like the next Alexander McQueen I think you have to accept fact that that's not possible for literally everyone cuz everybody wants that and so maybe find an area within the fashion industry that you truly could make your own that you could make work whether it is in uh Mass apparel retail if it's in a a a luxury sector sector just find that area of expertise that isn't the same thing that literally millions of fashion students are going for and then make that your thing that's how I created my businesses as finding a more niche market that I could design for and learn how to do something called a tech pack if that's the only advice you take away from what I'm saying today learn how to do something called a tech pack I have different advice go it's uh just be willing to make coffee and tea and just that's it I did this whole series on uh with British vog about how to get into the fashion industry and really the takeway advice from every designer photographer whoever it was in the industry was actually an attitude of being willing to help is what furthered their career and ultimately got them to where they were they didn't mind uh about to swear then they didn't mind shoveling they just got in they got stuck in there so being as helpful as you can will get you noticed and then you can move into the next bit but as much experience as you possibly can get I think yeah guys thank you both so much for joining us I had a ball with the English Queens everybody go check out next and Fashion on Netflix for