Damien Harris Speaks Out About The 'Doomed' Matt Patricia And Joe Judge Years

Intro joining us now it is former NFL running back Damen Harris Damen how you doing man appreciate you doing this man I'm blessed and highly favored how you doing I'm doing wonderful uh back from vacation excited to be back having these conversations a little quieter time in the offseason now otaa is winding down what did you typically do in that six weeks did you get away for the whole time how did you treat the post ota's pre-training Camp stretch in the NFL calendar um you know you definitely want to enjoy it right because you know especially when I played in New England you know Bill bich used to always say you know once August gets here you basically take everything else that's important to you you put it in a drawer and you don't open that drawer until February hopefully so you know I always just tried to maximize that time you know whether it be trying to see my family um you know trying to just escape and kind of unplug at times um you know go somewhere nice kind of enjoy myself you know just anything I could do to just enjoy some time off because you know it's this Craft um you know the game of football Sports in general I mean you just put so much into it so really anytime you get some time off like you want to enjoy it so you know I just tried to get away as much as I can you know take my mind away from football but while also you know trying to work out and try to maintain um you know being in shape because you that's the worst thing that could happen is you know you got some guys who you know after OTAs and mini camp and all this stuff they don't really do anything for six weeks and then they come back to training camp and it's like pulled hamstring here pulled quad there you know missed your conditioning test you know you don't make weights so you you know you definitely want to enjoy yourself but you definitely want to keep yourself in the right train of thought and the right you know the right routine you know it's all about having a routine in the National Football League so you know as long as I can stay in my routine you know I was going to see how I could have fun and stay in my routine at the same time this is the first year in a while that you haven't been prepping to play an NFL season AG of the calendar and you retired a couple months ago and in your retirement announcement I thought you said something that was really pointing you said you were grateful that you found the strength to walk away from the game because I'm sure that wasn't easy mhm ultimately what made that decision what led you to that decision and when you decided to do it like how did it feel in the moment to say that and to kind of ultimately land there yeah um you know it was a whole surreal situation um I mean obviously like the decision came because of you know the injury that I had last year you know where I messed up my neck pretty good and you know ultimately that just wasn't something that I could come back from and you know in that statement that I made you know having the strength to walk away you know the reason why I thought it was important to say that was because you know I see a lot of guys you know I've played with a lot of guys and you see it all the time guys who you know chase that dream for unfortunately way too long and they put their bodies through too much they put their their minds and their brains through too much you know whenever their career is basically telling them telling that it's over you know what I mean and you know for me I never wanted to be that guy like once my time was up I wanted to have the mental fortitude to be ready to move forward and you know luckily you know the injury like obviously that wasn't a fortunate situation but it came at the at the most perfect time because you know I just got married and you know my wife was pregnant and you know now we have a two-month-old son so you know I was really just able to have that mental fortitude to shift my focus from okay something that I have loved for 20 years something that I've G given all my attention um you know every ounce of my being to for the past 20 years you know I can flip that page because I got a beautiful two-month-old son I got a wonderful wife got a beautiful home and there's so much life left to live you know every day every morning whenever my son wakes up you know and he opens his eyes I'm just like man this is this right here is the life that I want to impact you know my life is you know I've already accomplished so many things and had so many experiences and been able to do so many things meet so many people have so many different experiences and now when I look at my son like that's the life that I want to that I want to impact that's the life that I really want to touch and and mold and you know help become you know a great person not just I'm not looking for my son to be a great football I'm not looking for him to be this out of the thir you know I'm looking for him to be a great human being and everything that comes with that you know is extra so you know like I said God blessed me with an amazing Foundation here at home and you know it really allowed me to mentally process you know what was happening and be able to move forward and move on and you know just start living a normal life through all the whole season's offseason to me now so and you know like I said I'm just so grateful um you know I said that when I retired you know expressing gratitude is what I'm all about right now you know I I'm grateful for all the time that I had playing ball and you know like I said all the experiences that I had but you know that that time comes for everybody and you know my time came and so because of you know the mental fortitude because of you know all the great things in my life I was just really able to flip that page it's it's always interesting to me to talk to people in moments in transition just because there's a lot of reflection that goes on you're kind of taking stock of everything as you look back and not not just your NFL career not just the the years you spent in the NFL but from the time you started playing until the time you stopped if you could do one thing differently as it relates to football what would it have been man nothing absolutely nothing not a single thing not a single thing like and because obviously I thought about it like you know okay my career is over like you know just for shits and gigs you know what can I think back if I had done this differently maybe this would have happened if I had done this differently maybe this would have happened but dude I I was so blessed man I came from literally middle of nowhere Brassfield Kentucky I was fortunate enough to be the number one running back back coming out of high school I was fortunate enough to play for Nick shv at the University of Alabama win two or two national championships three SEC championships I was able to be drafted by the world's greatest New England Patriots you I got to play with Tom Brady for a year I got to be coached by Bill bich you know then I went on to play with Josh Allen Stefon Diggs you know coach mcder Buffalo Bills I mean I mean if anything I can say oh maybe I wish that I hadn't hurt my neck last year and you know had to that's out of your control though other than that nothing dude like I said dude I'm so grateful for just the opportunities that I had man you know like like I said looking back to where I came from to where I am now and you know the not just the experiences but now like the effects that I had the platform that I have you know the ability that I have to connect with people the ability that I have to you know speak up for certain people and you know voice an opinion that you know might not be heard if somebody else says it you know I just there's so many parts of this this journey of life and so many things that this game of football has done for me and brought for me that I really cannot look back and say I would change a single thing I mean I I love the life that I lived I loved every second of my career I enjoyed every second of it you know even the hard times you know it wasn't always easy playing for Nick saving bill bichette you know what I mean but every single thing that happened from the time that I was eight years old until the moment I'm sitting in front of you today I've just been so grateful and so fortunate um you know with the exception of one you know one major injury but even with that like I said you know that's kind of helped me transition into being you know a very present husband a a very present father a very present you know member of the community um you know I'm looking to do my first Kids Camp back at home back in Richmond Kentucky so you know I'm just dude I'm blessed you know what I mean I know I keep I I sound like a Rec a broken record but I don't I don't have anything that I wish I could go back and change I just I'm loving life and you know everything that God has brought me through the game of football through life in general and you know every day I'm just looking at you know how can I continue to be a better version of myself how can I positive positively affect people you know obviously along side being the best dad and husband that I can be all right let's look back at some of those connections some of those relationships you had with those those people as you go back through the I don't know how long did you play football 10 15 years what would you say 20 years playing football what would you say is the best whether it's piece of advice Little Nugget of wisdom that you got from those pretty Heavy Hitters that you managed to come across during your entire career yeah um I don't even know if this is usually I wouldn't share this but you know this is true so back when I was at Alabama and you know we had Scott Cochran as our strength coach the best piece of advice that he always gave us and it was you know no matter what the circumstance in the weight room on the field whether it be not you know showing up the study hall not going to class he would always look at you and say be a pro not a hoe and that was some of the realest invite should I ever got you know because even you know in college you know they were teaching us to be professional right and not just professional football players but at everything you do be professional at it whenever you're supposed to go to class be professional show up on time be respectful give the you know give the teachers give the administrators you're full of undervalued attention and just be professional or if you're out doing community service doing work in the community be professional be polite be available you know so on and so forth so you know at an early age when I was 18 years old and got to tuscal Lua and the first time I heard him say be a pro not a hoe I was like oh wait a minute okay I like first of all I was like okay I like that be a pro not a hoe it's catchy you know what I mean but then you know obviously once you get past you know how funny it is then it's like okay seriously like there's two ways to do it there's either being a pro or there's not you know what I mean so be a pro just be a pro and so you know that helped me with my transition from Alabama to New England and then New England to Buffalo and then ultimately Buffalo to now you know just trying to be professional and everything everything that I do at all times um you know whether somebody's watching me or not whether I'm on camera or not you know just be a professional at every at absolutely every aspect of my life yeah that that's a good one that it's very simple it cuts through the noise it sticks with you it's concise I I appreciate that that that's something that I think a lot of people could take and move forward with all right I want to have a conversation with you that RB Market I've had I don't know a hundred times on various pod over the well the difference is we we've talked on every show I've ever done over the last decade or so you know I I first football podcast I ever hosted was in 2011 and if you think about the way the game was in 2011 to the way the game is now we have hit every step of the running back value discourse over those 13 years but in all those conversations I've had about the devaluation of the position how do you understand it's fit within the modern game I've never had that conversation in a platform like this with somebody who played the position in the NFL so I want want to go back about a year you know March June July of 2023 when you were a free agent but there was also everything happening with that entire group of guys saquan Josh Jacobs Tony paard who had fantastic seasons and ultimately didn't get multi-year contracts so as you were kind of setting back and thinking about your next step and about the market for all those guys was there a moment as all of that was happening where you finally just said come on like this this has just gone too far was there a Breaking Point anywh hell yeah absolutely cuz I remember you know last offseason when I was going through free agency and you know nobody was really signing multi-year deals nobody was really getting you know high level extensions and I was even talking to my agent like yo what's going on because it was such a it was such a surprise because I remember that was supposed to be the class that was supposed to reset the running back market like everybody was looking at you know my class that was you know coming up in free agency like this is going to be the class that kind of reshaped the market for the running back position they're going to get guys more paid or paid more they're going to get guys you know more guaranteed money more extended deals you know so on and so forth and it just wasn't happening and it wasn't because obviously my phone wasn't ringing and so I was in touch with my agent like you know what's going on he's like bro nobody's phones are ringing because just the market is just not doing what everybody thought it was going to do and it was the weirdest thing you know for a lack of better words I didn't really you know describe it as that at the time you know I thought it was a bunch of [ __ ] but you know it was just the the Str strangest thing because you've got all these guys who were expected to do it so then basically all these teams gave him a a tryy out year and then eventually paid them anyways but when you do that then you only have you know a couple guys who are getting paid you know versus in my class it was supposed to be like start with the guys up here and then it was supposed to trickle all the way down and a lot of guys were supposed to benefit from that but you know that's the thing with with the league unfortunately like with running backs it's like okay you've been a great player for three or four years okay prove it again because you just have to we're not one we're not going to pay you we're going to send you somewhere else and they're probably not going to pay you so you just got to keep proving yourself year after year after year and then once you finally get to the level of proving yourself then they're like oh [ __ ] well you're too old now and now your career is going to start going like this so you work so hard to prove yourself and once you get to the mountain toop of like okay finally like finally I'm about to get what what's owed to me and then they look at you and they're like ah you know you've been in the the league for about five years now six years now you know you've already kind of surpassed the average lifespan of a running back so you at any year now you could could be your last year and you could be gone so it's such a weird such a weird dynamic man you know obviously it was great to see saquin get paid Josh Jacobs got paid mil Sanders got paid um DeAndre Swift got paid you know they all got Tony Good Year Tony par got that deal Mixon got a new contract team get you've seen some guys get some good deals but it's such a like there's so much I don't want to say politics but it's almost like there's so much politics that goes into it right because you have some teams who are like you know what I'mma pay my back like this is my guy I'mma pay him I'm G keep him I think that kind of ended in like the kind of like the Todd Gurley age and you know that's when it kind of started to transition out and now you've just got teams who are just like prove it prove it prove it prove it that's what a franchise tag is it's just a prove it deal they're willing to sell you out you know one year worth a good dough to prove it to hope that okay this is going to be his last good year and then after this we won't have to pay him anymore so essentially we give him one good year as opposed to one big long lucrative contract and if you look at it even the guys that got deals over the last year or so Jonathan Taylor saquan Josh Jacobs saquon's deal I think it's like 14ish million a year that's less than 5% of the current salary cap if you look at the deal that CMC got when he signed it that's like 8.1 and chimra is at 7.6 and the Jonathan Taylor contract is really just like a slight Improvement on what the Nick chub deal was three or four years ago so even these guys who are getting rewarded at quote unquote what has become the top of the market it's a significant decline from what guys were getting three or four years ago and I think the general conventional wisdom about this is running backs are replaceable you can find them there are guys that you can slot in and you can get him in the third fourth round with that discourse and that mindset of viewing the position what do you think people are missing about some of the guys that can transcend that idea well I think of a guy like Sequon Barkley right and so obviously like saquin is an incredibly incredibly incredibly talented guy right when he's got the ball in his hands he's electric right but then you also got to think okay well how many times are defenses gonna line up in an eight-man box because they don't want saquon to rush for 150 yards and you got two receivers streaking down the field you got a quarterback that can get on the ball I mean that completely shapes a game plan that completely changes what a defense is going to throw at you or say you got the same saquan who obviously like I said electric with the ball in his hands but who's gonna protect Daniel Jones or you know in this case Jaylen Herz so he can throw to AJ Brown like there are so many things that running backs do that are transformative to the entire game of football don't get me wrong it's 100% a quarterback driven League I get that but at the same time you have to have one a run game to balance out your run pass option you got to have a running back that's going to at least draw the attention of a defense you want a seven man box you want a eight man box then what does that set up that sets up your play action because as soon as you fake to somebody like sequan all three of your linebackers are gonna come shoo in the gaps like oh I got I gotta go hit this dude I gotta fill my Gap I got Gap responsibility I gotta do this oh snap the quarterback still got the ball in his hand so then what do they do they just turn and run and like that's what linebackers do they just turn and run they have no no clue where they're going they just turn and run trying to find a receiver to cover and by that time when you've got guys like AJ Brown Devonte Smith like just just the plethora of options that that Philly has that transform and a complete game plan as a defensive coordinator okay do we want to stop sequan from running the ball do you want to sit back and let let our coverage handle you know the Deep part of the field and then let sequan run for 150 yards or what are we gonna do every time he play actions what are we going to do whenever they run screens like that's an that's what goes on through a defensive coordinator's mind a defensive coordinator is not going to sit and look at a receiver and be like okay I have to design my entire game plan around this guy if anything he's gonna be like we're gonna run one double1 which is two guys cover AJ Brown and that's it special yeah you know what I mean it's nothing you got you designate two guys to him try to eliminate him from the you know the other half of the field and that's it but you got such a dynamic player at running back who can not only run the ball can catch out of the back field can block can bring draw Defenders and play action like you literally have to base your entire game plan around this guy so whenever you think about it in terms like that why are running back so undervalued I think a lot of it the argument that people would make is a lot of those resources and a lot of the defensive structures that teams kind of match with are based on personnel and based on alignment right if you're using 12 13 Personnel we're going to line up with heavy Personnel we're going to put more guys down in the box but I think that framing of it where it's really just X's and O's on a chalkboard X's and O's is dismissing the human elements of this and the the example I go back to is you look at like the 2019 Titans and like what that play action that downhill play action game looked like if you're the Mike linebacker it is a different sort of mindset when that's a 250 pound Derrick Henry back there and they're under Center and you have to worry about him coming at you with a full head of steam rather than you actually trying to meet him in the hole there's something about that that it has to be in the back of your mind and I remember talking to a couple Lions players at the Super Bowl about the way they approach the Niners and if you look at the defenses that the Niners play against the amount of cover three the amount of heavy boxes some of that is structural right 21 Personnel that's how you're going to match it but at the same time those guys have CMC in the back of their heads before the game even starts and I think those are some of the more ineffable qualities of this and the hard to Define hard to pin down elements of it where there are human aspects to this that probably have more value and more impact than we can understand based on the way that we think about the position 100% cuz you know to your point I remember Bill bichette used to tell us all the time don't go out there and be robots don't Don't just run you know the line on the piece of paper like use your instincts use your eyes use your you know whatever God blessed you with to play this game use it so naturally like yes you're saying like Okay well if there's 12 Personnel out there this Personnel is gonna be out there on defense or if this you know if this guy's lined up here this guy's lined up here but as football players if we're using our instincts like if I'm a middle linebacker I don't I don't care what what personnel is out there if Derrick Henry's in the back field like you just said this is what's going on through my mind as soon as he steps downhill I got to start running because I got to hit him before he hits me right or same with Christian mcaffrey even if you're not thinking like oh I gotta go thump this dude like okay well if he just has a sliver like a sliver of space like he can make you missing a foam boot you know what I'm saying he can make a Miss tack on a foam boot so he's just got that little silver space so I gotta react like right right now but like you said that's not because they're in 12 Personnel that's because Christian mca's is in the back Fest because saquon Bartley's in the back Fest because Derrick Henry's in the back Fest because Josh Jacobs is in the back field like like you said there's a human element to this like we're not I say we I'm not I don't play no more but football players are not comp you're still a member of the fraternity the running backat but like football players aren't robots it's not going to be like okay they're in 12 Personnel let me just key the exact Personnel they're in in this exact formation and like okay that that's it like no like no TJ wat right I'll take this as an example whenever we play the Steelers TJ wattt will line up all over the field so it didn't matter what defensive Personnel they were in it didn't matter what front they were in because it's like okay if TJ watt is on the left side our protection needs to go to the left side if TJ watt's on the right side then we might need to chip or help on this we might need to tight end the jam or something like that so to your point you're you're 100% correct I think people are missing the human element of what does Squan bring to the field and how does that affect the team that he's playing like just just playing as simple when you were slight pivot here because I want to ask you about this with TJ wat in New England which defensive player do you think sucked up the most oxygen as you game plan for them the guy that was just kind of loomed the largest in the week before a game during your time there yeah man we played some guys um couple times when we played the Browns and you know we had to face miles Garrett and it was just like this is just gonna be a problem in a half like this dude is gonna be an absolute problem and like we would do that like every week when you know whenever we would play teams like as soon as we would sit down in our first kind of like overview of the team we were playing like Josh McDaniels you know when I was in New England he would Circle this guy is the guy we cannot let him wreck our game like we cannot let him wreck our game like I said miles Garrett sometimes Mason I would say not Mason Max Crosby probably was like the guy of guys because he has like a a supernatural motor like his skill set is off the charge don't get me wrong like he's got the same skill set as every Elite pass rusher you know and recent memory but dude his is motor I've never seen a guy with a motor like this guy and it and that's what we would say like you can block him with two or three guys you literally cannot block him or you can't stop blocking him until you're going back to the Huddle because he will find a way to get to the ball if if you let if you turn him loose for a split second so I really don't think we appreciate what he is right now the fact that he's playing a thousand snaps a year he never leaves the field he's as impactful and as scary on early Downs because I think he gets as much enjoyment of blowing up a run play he does out of a elite run Setter like when it comes to setting the edge like he's I remember it was funny it was we played uh we played Vegas when I was in Buffalo last year and I had a run on Third and I think it was like third and two but I ended up like busting it for you know a decent game like 20 yards but the only reason I did that was because he blew through the line of scrimmage so fast that by the time I got the ball like I actually had a split second to make a move because it happened so fast like as soon as I got the ball I was like oh [ __ ] I got to go over here and you know he he penetrated so well that he just collapsed that entire side luckily you know I was able to make a move and get around him but like that dude is like he's super super natural like I said his ability but his motor that's what makes him different man that's something that can't be coached it can't be taught you're born with that and I think that he he he takes the he takes the pass rushing game and just playing The Edge playing the position of a edge rush or he takes it to a whole another level if you going back to the running back value thing for a second because I wanted to ask you this is somebody who understands every little Nuance of how this works I think for some people on the outside there's an understanding that okay or an idea that the offensive line drives this right the offensive line is the engine of most running games Y what can a running back do to make the guys in front of him better or to put this in another way maybe transcend what is blocked for him what are the things that maybe were missing that allow specific guys to do those two things you gotta you got to think the way they think you have to look at the first of all you have to understand the Run schemes the way that they that they understand it because to be honest it's it's not coach the same it's two totally different positions whether it's offensive line and running back you know they're taught differently it's not necessarily the same but you have to find a way to find that middle ground and what I would always do is you know even in college like I remember when Brent key was our offensive line coach at Alabama like I just went in I just went in the Run whenever we have run game meetings I would urge our running back coach like please let let us go in there and watch watch film let us do whatever we need to do whatever install you know going to the Run schemes whatever let's go do it with the offensive line and so we started doing that and then you know I realized as I got to the league you know that was really kind of how it was done whenever you do run game meetings it would be the running backs would sit down with the O lineman whatever the play was they show it on the screen then the o line would make their calls and then the running backs would be like okay I see it this way like if you want to block it this way whenever you hit this I'm ready to do that or whenever you know I get the ball and I take this fifth step I'm expecting you to be here so it's a little bit of give and take right what do the offensive line think what is their like how do they see the game but also you know we're the guys with the ball in our hands so you know we kind of have some say so too but you know once you have that relationship and you know I've seen guys where you know running backs where they come in they're just like listen this is how I want it block this is how I want this this is how I want that like I'm this I'm that and so either block it this way or we gonna find new linemen and everybody's looking at him like that's that's probably not the note you want to start that right right but I've also I've also been places where you know I've seen offensive line you know they like to kind of dictate the running lanes and they like to dictate where the the where they think the ball should go and although that might be true as a runner like not only am I seeing that but I'm also feeling what's going on you know from sideline to sideline you know I'm also looking at the linebackers I'm looking at the safeties you know back 20 yards deep so it's like yeah you might have blocked it and you might have thought the hole was right there but based on what I saw I had to take it you blocked to go right you know B gap on the right side but I got to take it D Gap all the way on the left side but see that's where you got to have that camaraderie you got to have that trust that way you can go after a drive sit on the bench and be like all right this is what I saw and I just this is what I had to do they look at me and be like all right yeah trust your eyes trust your read we gonna block for you we gonna do this you know you use your use your eyes use your instincts whatever and then I vice versa I'd be like okay I might have missed a hole right here because I thought I saw something or I felt something that wasn't really right I need to just trust you guys a little bit more you guys are doing your thing up front you guys are the anchor you guys are setting the the the identity you guys are setting the line of scrimmage I need to follow you guys so a lot of give and take uh a lot of film sessions uh a lot of backdoor cookouts and and and you know Hangouts and stuff like that you know but that's that's what is so great about this game you know not even to Pivot away from the question but that's what's so great about the game of football is you know the camaraderie that you can build the Brotherhood that you can build and and you know through football you can learn more about guys outside of football and spending time with guys outside of football can build your bond on the football field so it's just such a transparent game you know what you get into it is what you put out if you bring good energy and you know you're willing to work and you know be um Co not coachable but be able to adapt and adjust with the guys around you and vice versa you know that's that's what's made up some of the best teams that I've been on I want I want to get a little bit granular here because I'm curious about this as we move away from maybe the physical Talent aspects of the position explosion strength things like that what do you think is the hardest aspect of the position to hone that maybe is a little less physical I know vision is such a nebulous word but is it aiming points and kind of timing in the zone Run game is it understanding how things are going to unfold in front of you in gap scheme runs like what is the element of the of the of playing running back that you think takes the longest to kind of hone that has nothing to do with the physical side of it um I think your ability to balance when to use your Instinct versus when to use your coaching I think that that is the most because to me other than quarterback running back is the most reactionary position if you're a receiver you've got a route you run at this depth or you convert versus this right but with running back it's like like I said the pole can be blocked over here and you got to go over here or you know they like to they want running backs to be able to play all over the field right so you got to be able to do this you got to be able to play receiver you've got to be able to do play all these different types of positions and there's just so many things that can go on in your mind and it's like okay when do I listen to my coaching and when do I just use my instincts because there have been times where I've done exactly what I've been coached to do and got mother MF you know because it's like well why did you do that and I'm like well I thought I was supposed to do that based on you like well don't be a don't be an idiot don't be a robot like just because I say go jump off a bridge that don't mean you gonna do it but then there have also been times where I've made a humongous play using nothing but instincts gone exactly where the ball wasn't supposed to go and had a huge success and there have been times where I've been coached like okay yeah that worked out that one time but that just because it worked out that one time doesn't mean that it's going to work out every time that's why you have coaches that's why you have rules that's why you have X Y and Z so I think for running backs the the biggest thing is trying to differentiate when do I use my instincts versus when do I just revert back to my coaching because like I said as soon as that ball turns over like there ain't much time to think so you either got to do one or the other instincts or coaching and so that's my question can you learn that or is that just something that's that's just innate you either have that or you don't and truly I think so because you know some guys are just wired to be like okay I've been coached to do this this is what I'm gonna do come hell high water I can't be wrong if I'm doing what I'm told so that's what I'm going to do and you got some guys who are just like man God blessed me to do this I got to the NFL without you I got here without you and I'm still going to be me without you so as long as I'm playing ball I'mma play it my way I'mma use my instincts and I'mma do it kind of how I see fit and you have you see guys having success both ways so you know it's it's really just it depends on the guy from Guy to guy I like to be right in the middle of both I love to do you know what I was coached to do but at the same time I knew I had great instincts and I like to use them so it's really just overtime I mean maybe you can develop it but it's usually your one the other yeah it's a fi thing and and I think that you see that with certain guys this would be hard to answer because you're not in the room and you don't know whether it's one or the other but as you're looking at guys in the league right now who stands out as somebody that you think has a really good understanding of when to choose one or the other um you put me right on the spot if I honestly I would go Josh Jacobs truly because I saw it when I played with him but I also I've watched game I've love watching him um ever since you know obviously we we graduated and you know went our separate ways but Josh has always been so good at like if there's a hole there if it's if the play is blocked perfectly and the hole is there and it's exactly where it's coached to be he's going to hit it and he's going to take it for 80 yard touchdown if he can but I've also seen Josh take some absolutely like crazy crazy pass of the most resistance and next thing you know he's making six or seven M for and six or seven missed tackles and ended up gaining 35 yards everybody's like that's one of the best runs I've ever seen so I would definitely look at Josh Jacobs Josh is a guy who is very much you know he very much so does you know exactly what's needed within the scheme he does exactly what's needed within you know whether it was in Vegas whether it was in Alabama and I'm sure was going to be in Green Bay you know whatever fits their system whatever fits their scheme he can provide that but that's another thing about Josh is he's got such an explosive element of just using his instincts and his God an ability that if there's no play like if you if you run 10 plays and all 10 of them are busted plays I would guarantee you about five or six of them he'll make a huge play out of it just because he's instinctual he's crafty he's explosive and he just has that god-given just ability to just make plays when you were having those conversations with the offensive line or sitting in some of those meetings whether it be in Alabama or New England what jumped out to you or what maybe popped up about the way that offensive linemen think or the way that they see the game that you wouldn't have understood before you started sitting in those meetings and being a part of those conversations well you know I might be exposing myself to a little uh football um or not being as knowledged in the subject as you know I once should have been but you know back in the day I thought when I was you know growing up high school and you know before I really got to college I was thinking okay tackles are coach to just play tackle guards are taught just to play guard Center taught just to play center and so on and so forth what surprised me was the tackle was supposed to know what the center was doing the center was supposed to know what the guard was doing the guard was supposed to know what the tackle was doing but it was because they were all working cohesively it wasn't because like okay well I just need to know this dude's job just you know for shits and giggles like no I need to know what he's doing because we're GNA have a combination block because the D tackle is in a two ey not a two technique so we're gonna have to combo and because this other guy's in a shade that means on the back side these guys are going to have this combination back there and it was just like layers on layers on layers I was like whoa like wait what so you mean to tell me that the left tackle knows what the Right Guard is doing if the balls going left that's crazy to me and so just once I that was when I really started to understand like just how much goes into the game of football you know what I mean because you know I being completely transparent like growing up you know I was fortunate to just be able to just if they handed me the ball I was just running for a touchdown you know what I mean I was going to find a way I was zigzagged 10 15 times but I find a way to get to the end zone and you know once I got to college and truly once I started sitting with the offensive lineman I feel like that's when my my knowledge of football really just took off was there something that you feel like you it took you a while to get down whether that's again like aiming points angles what was the thing as you had to be a little bit more nuanced and thoughtful about the position that was the toughest part of a transition uh well if you ever asked Josh McDaniel as my old offensive coordinator from New England he would tell you that I was the absolute worst in inside Zone Runner because I could not turn my shoulders on my tracks and aiming points to save my life and the thing is I would be perfectly on track I would be perfectly I would be there at the exact perfect timing but my shoulders instead of being exactly parallel were just a little just like instead of going from here there just like this just a little just a little cocked a little bit and he would MF me and he would do it again do it you know what just get out just you don't want to do it right just get out get out so I would say the the tracks the aiming points and just the ultimate like just the really SM small fine-tune details of small nuances of the NFL and I think that would be at any position because there's such a huge transition from college football to the NFL just on every every guy you play against in the NFL is the Absol he was the best guy on his team he was the best guy in his conference you know he was one of the best players in the country so in college it's just like the best players on the best team usually win but in NFL it's like got the best players on all 32 NFL teams so those nuances and those small details become incredibly incredibly important so I think that just trying to shake the okay I am the best player and I just got drafted to oh wait like I gotta I gotta be on top of all of my [ __ ] like literally every single step like from counting steps in your head at practice to like okay I'm supposed to get the ball on my fifth step okay one two three four okay I got the ball like just those small details like that that's it's a hard transition man it really is all right let's chat a little New England Patriots bit about that New England coaching staff and about what the last couple years were like when you saw that bill bich did not get a job in this cycle what was your initial reaction I ain't gonna lie I wasn't surprised um and listen this isn't is I'm not saying that to say anything bad about Bill bich but I just wasn't surprised because he's been in one place for so long and I think that just at the stage of his career that he's in I think that what he was expecting uh to be handed to him if he were going to be coaching again versus what people were willing to give him uh in retrospect I think that maybe they just didn't align and you know that's something that I could have I could have obviously um seen coming because you know bill was like Bill was the head coach Bill was the GM B bill was damn near the offensive coordinator damn near the def a coordinator damn near the Special Teams coordinator damn near this damn near that and you know if he was going to go coach for another team you know it would have probably just been head coach you know I mean or just been this or just been that you know he wouldn't have had the full reign of control like he had in New England so I think without that you know it's a little tough for him to just go somewhere and just be like okay I'm just I'm just feeling the spot like I'm just feeling this coach's spot like he needs full fullon control like that's just the kind of guy Bill bichi is but at the same time can you blame him because in the 20 years where he had full control he had a lot of success so you can't blame him I me you definitely can't blame him when you saw how things worked in let's say a more traditional environment in Buffalo where you have a head coach you have a GM the setup is just like it is around most of the NFL how different did that feel daytoday than what it was like in New England during your time I felt like I was on a different planet honestly and the people the people you know all the staff in Buffalo were so surprised at how surprised that I was the [ __ ] was so different it was just like night and day different because like in New England it was like usually unless it was something like nonf football related unless it was like some off the- field stuff you would just go to bill you know what I mean like it give me an example something that maybe would sound strange to someone else but in New England that's what you did you just went to B Che about it um you okay I'll put it you this way so usually so in Buffalo whenever it's like okay if you want to understand why you're not playing or if you want to understand why you're not you know here or there you know talk to your position coach if you guys don't kind of work it out if you're still feeling a little uneasy then you can talk to the head coach and then possibly the GM right so it's like tears of who you kind of go to because everybody is in charge of their own Department right so running back coach for Buffalo Bills you know he's GNA determine how much I play so if I got a problem with me not playing as much I go to him whereas in New England you know bill has a little bit more say so of like okay I want this running back in the game at this time so if I'm a running back and I'm not necessarily happy with you know my my reps my playing time then I just gotta go straight to Bill bellich che's office and be like um hey uh Mr Mr coach bellich sir um why am I not playing and that shit's intimidating you as opposed to going to my running back like and buffalo I had a run back coach name we called him skip Skipper The Flipper one of the coolest dudes I ever been around and you could just go and be like shoot this sh like like skip yo like what's up why am I not playing like tell me something tell me what I need to do tell me what I need to fix you know whatever a man you know maybe maybe some of this you know what I'm saying or maybe you know the season roles get defined they're like you know blah blah blah wo this that the third where is it with Bill it's like you know this you're not doing this good enough and like you know this and blah blah and it's it's hard man it's hard because you know like I realized that once I got to Buffalo there are people for everything as opposed to the one person for everything you know what I mean so that was a that was a big transition for me do you think ultimately that became a problem where he's just spread a little bit too thin especially when you consider how many people left the organization who had been pretty trustworthy lieutenants over time I mean it felt like beyond having that sort of purview the people who he could maybe lean on in some of those quieter moments started leaving at such a clip that there was even more that had been thrown out to his plate yeah um I wouldn't think of it as a spreading himself too thin I would think of it more so of having I having an idea that you know obviously all the success that was had in New England was because of one person and it wasn't Tom Brady um and that one person was Bill bich because there were guys like Matt Patricia like Joe judge who left and went other places and you know whatever however their situation worked out they ended up coming back and you know all of a sudden Matt Patricia goes from defensive coordinator to offensive coordinator well why is that it's because we're all just Pawns in Bill bellich che's game of Monopoly and we can all be moved we can all be interchanged we can all be like okay well you coached here all your life screw that you can go coach here because as long as you imply and instill what I am teaching what I am coaching the then the team will have success and I think that is what led to kind of the trouble starting to you know the tide start to turn trouble started to arise just because then you start putting like I will and I'm I'mma die on this hill and people might be upset with me people might be happy with me people might be somewhere in between what happened to M Jones in New England was not because of M Jones what happened in New England to Mt Jones was because of the fact you took away an offensive coordinator who coached him to be a pro bowler and almost coached us to winning our division with a rookie quarterback in his first year and then you take whenever Josh M Daniels left then you take Matt Patricia who's coached defense his entire life Joe judge who's been a special teams coach you know coach receivers at some point and then you just throw him in there and be like hey coach this kid up he's a first round pick you know but as long as you teach him what I say everything's gonna be fine and [ __ ] was fine now Mt Jones is in Jacksonville now they're on to Drake may you know they're on to a whole it's like M Jones the breath of M Jones in New England it came and went and it's shouldn't have the way that it went and the only reason that it did was because Bill bich being stuck in his ways was very much so like as long as I am here as long as I am along with Robert Kraft the top dog at this organization no matter who no matter where what position where they coach whatever we will have success I think that that kind of started with the you know with the Cam Newton situation where we brought in Cam Newton because everybody was like yo W the [ __ ] is this like why Cam Newton Bill thought that he could make it work it didn't really work then we drafted mck we had a hell of a year that year my was at my third year in the league um his first year had a hell of a year went on a seven game win streak started off R started off kind of Rocky went on to went seven straight we were at that time we were kind of looking at ourselves like we might have a Super Bowl run right here like as long as people keep playing well you know so on and so forth and then the next year after that you replace like I said Josh McDaniels with Matt Patricia and Joe judge and then look at the year that we had that year and then the following year and then now Matt Jones is all of a sudden gone and I think that everybody can look at you know what I just said and ultimately look at look at it and just watch it for what it was and kind of say that maybe Bill bich did not do right by m Jones yeah it's not like he was throwing to Randy Moss and Wes Walker that year either I mean it was I I like uh jacobe Myers I think jacobe Myers is a really solid NFL player but Jobe Myers was by far the most targeted player on that team and you guys finished sixth in points per game that year I I think it was a pretty remarkable achievement overall exactly so and and to get to your point because see that just got me worked up because no but I I I was going to ask you about this so I'm glad that you decided to go down this hallway before I asked you to yeah well what I was going to say is you know to your what you just said it's the same dudes that he was throwing into the next year when everybody was talking about he didn't have anybody he didn't have any help oh M sucks because he doesn't have like everybody made every excuse in the book for why mat Jones was not having success other than you know what could be the obvious right the bill bellich you know kind of whatever that was and like I said from one year to the next nothing changed except for what Bill bellich did like obviously we lost Josh McDaniels like that that was beyond our control but there are how many great offensive coordinators could we have gone out and gotten like how many countless you had been an offensive coordinator had been offensive you could even go down to college how many college like there's guys from college that get brought up to the NFL all the time but then you bring a defensive coach a special teams coach and it just it it was a debacle it was truly did you know when did you know that it was just oh we knew we knew that we knew before our first game we knew during training camp we knew we knew we knew it was there were a lot of conversations um between you know some of the leadership group in you know at the time like I was one of those guys and you know we just had a handful of guys that whenever problems or things kind of came around you know we would kind of sit down and talk about it and kind of handle it whatever now granted I was only in these meetings because when once it started talking about offense then that was when I was incorporated you know I wasn't like a captain or anything like that but you know I remember OTAs like mini camp we were having these meetings where we were sitting around talking amongst each other like yo who's how are we going to tell Bill that this [ __ ] ain't working like how are we going to tell Bill this [ __ ] is not working at all I tell you a true story me and my running back coach got into it at the time uh it was training camp and we were having I think this was like right before our second no no no this right before our first preseason game going into my last year in New England and it was like we were practicing and the defense was kicking our ass not just every play every practice like every time we stepped on the field defense was kicking our ass and it was just day after day after day and we were just getting tired of it on offense and so finally I just look at everybody I'm like what the [ __ ] are we doing we've had a game in three days I don't care if it's a preseason game I don't care if it's a tuneup exhibition we gonna be on live television why with millions of people tuned in to watch us and we look like this we look like the Bad News Bears of the [ __ ] NFL and like we're supposed to just be cool about it and then you know at the time it's like well we're figuring it out we're figuring out it's like we have a game in three days we have a game in three days I don't care that it's a preseason game I don't care because at the end of the day this is my job I'm supposed to show up perform practice do all this stuff and like I don't feel like I'm doing it at the best of my ability because of all of these this isn't working that isn't working like so how am I supposed to go out and be the best version of myself because selfishly I was going into a contract year not only did I want the team to have success I wanted to have some success to I wanted to get paid you know what I'm saying so I think that it was very obvious for a long time and just being honest and [ __ ] bill bich will probably tell you the same way um if anybody had anything to say about it it was a very very quick Swift shut the [ __ ] up I know what I'm doing and that's it what was the the biggest disconnects like the way an offense and the way offensive meetings and the way an offensive plan should work versus the way that it was working what were the things that were most OB obviously missing um structure structure um AC like just a correct offensive system being put in place um what does that mean it seemed essentially like imagine imagine I was playing Madden and I was slipping through Madden and every time I saw a play and I ran it on Madden I was like oh that works let me put it in my coaching Playbook and let me give that to a group of professional football players and create an offense with Madden plays and let's just see if it works because I tell you there were conversations that we had amongst each other where we genuinely felt like our intelligence as football players was being insulted like if you're gonna present this to me and think that I'm gonna go along with this and just think this is gonna work like we there would be times where we would be presented with information we would just be right off the like this [ __ ] ain't gonna work this play that we're putting it's just it's not GNA work I don't want to run it I don't like it it's not gonna work but there was just nothing that could be done or said about it because you know and rightfully so I'm not trying to take away from Bill I'm not trying to say that he was wrong or you know whatever everybody has their opinion but again whenever you have somebody who has that much success for 20 years when they feel like they were the sole reason for it I understand why he did what he did but ultimately I feel like it led to us being at a disadvantage and I felt like you know when players aren't confident in you know what's what's being coached of them what's being presented to them then we don't have confidence in ourselves then we don't have confidence against the guys that we're lining up against and then obviously the result was what it was we started losing games and then losing more games and then guys stopped playing as well and then ultimately you know the Patriots and Bill bich ended up you know going separate ways let me betray my ignorance here and I'm sure it's not as easy as this why not try to just do your best to copy and paste what you guys did in 2021 and try to trot out the same sort of ideas even if you didn't have the same person at the center of it um because this is an ego- driven business and everybody be the answer everybody's got egos everybody has um yeah there's no other way to put it everybody's got Egos and that's what it was it's a it's just a battle of the egos man and and you know I if I had to guess you know obviously Josh McDaniels and I can say this because obviously watching them play and you know whatever like he took that offense to Vegas and you know he implied it there and you know whatever had success sometimes sometimes he didn't but you know it could have just been a situation of Bill bich being like well I don't want to run the same offense that another team in the NFL is gonna be running you know what I mean because we were Pro style offense with Josh McDaniels and there are other teams that are pro style but the way that we did things in New England was way different than you know any other offense in the league any other Pro style offense spread whatever and so maybe Bill bich didn't want to have the same offense or maybe he just looked at Josh McDaniels and was like okay you went from friend to foe so F you and everything you stood for and I'm just gonna do it my way and because honestly we didn't take a single thing from if anything whatever was left over whatever was carryover from Josh McDaniels to I guess the Joe judge and Matt Patricia they completely changed the names they changed the you know the the thought behind it like it was just like we know it's the same it's the same thing just like why why are we why are we trying so hard to just make it different just so we can say that it's not Josh McDaniel's system like it doesn't have to be that way and ultimately I can say this again not trying to get back on the Mac Jones conversation but that was everybody's biggest gripe about all of that because every everybody saw the potential of Matt Jones everybody loved Matt Jones like Matt Jones as soon as he stepped in he won the locker room immediately and everybody was in this Kid's Corner me especially because I've been friends with him for a long time we played together in college like I was in this corner just like everybody else and we just saw the disservice that all of this disorganization and all of this basically [ __ ] hitting the fan we saw what it did to ma not only for his career but we saw what it did for him mentally like obviously he you know the mental side of it could have affected how he played but let's just take football away for a second like we saw what was happening to this kid mentally just as a kid you know what I mean like as a kid and we like this ain't this ain't right it's not right obviously the football side of it it ain't right because we ain't winning games we see like this kid he's supposed to be our young leader our young leader who we're supposed to stand behind him lift them up and it's like when we got coaches who aren't even literally doing anything like any anything Nathaniel not a single thing to help this kid progress and make a jump from year one to year two it was disappointing to watch I'm Not Gon to lie it was really disappointing if you look at teams around the league that I think are going to have consistent success and are having consistent success in the NFL it's places that have created an ecosystem that is hospitable to a Young quarterback what can I do to ensure this guy's development growth success and if you can build that you can be really good year after year it was the opposite in England during that time so with that in mind as you think about what Bill bich che's next opportunity might look like do you think he's capable of creating that sort of environment at this stage and would you be bullish on what he might look like at his next stop if given another chance well I think that I think that coach bich is in a in a very special situation because one like I said he was in he was at a place where he had boatloads of success and he thought that you know he was the only reason why and you know be that as it may right wrong IND different he had the success so he could attribute it to whatever he wanted at the same time he also had the same quarterback for 20 years like the same guy who was pretty who was pretty good you know what I mean pretty good so I think that again like whenever like I like to preface everything about Bill belich with what he's accustomed to because it's like well if he's accustomed to all this how can you get him especially like no you can't teach an old dog new tricks and he's about the oldest dog in the game right now so like to expect him to get another opportunity and completely just shift and change you know the way that he's been for the last 50 years that he's been coaching I think that that would be a little bit crazy to expect I would hope that if he does get another opportunity that he would you know make a little bit of adjustment that way because I I love playing for Bill bich he was the greatest one of the greatest with Nick s greatest coach greatest Mentor greatest teacher of the game of football the greatest teacher of professionalism I don't want his everything that he built to be tarnished by these conversations of did he ruin the Patriots his last few years there did he ruin M Jones did he do this like I would love to see him get another opportunity and I would love to see him have just as much if not more success than he had before which obviously that's probably not possible but like that that's just what I want from him because I respect bill bich I appreciate what he has done for the game what he's done for not only myself but you know teammates of mine peers so on and so forth that I would hope that he would make the the necessary adjustments to kind of write some of the some of the obvious wrongs that have kind of come to to light over these past few years I want to ask you about this because I do think that there is a slight disconnect between my understanding of how it worked in New England where he was this figure had at the top of it what he said went and maybe some of the more Kumbaya Centric thinking that has gone on in NFL buildings where there's more emotional intelligence among coaches now there's more communication between players and coaches now yeah when you think about the interpersonal Dynamics between belich and you guys when you you were there do you think that style can consistently work in the NFL right now no I I I don't think so especially because of the the New Prospect that they're getting into the NFL nowadays I think that that whole that old school like lack of emotional intelligence lack of adapt adaptability to guys personalities to guys you know having different ideas having this having that or wanting to express themselves in certain type of ways I think that you know one it would already be hard uh in today's just because there is such a discrepancy like there's one team you know well former team with Bill bich and the Patriots that was very much like okay it's this way or no way it's here the highway like no if hands or buts about it but then I would say probably like 29 30 teams in the NFL they have a little bit more like you said emotional intelligence a little bit more of adaptability around guys personalities and kind of tailoring what they're doing as an organization with the group of guys on the roster who they have the personalities they have the talent they have etc etc well now you're bringing in these guys who are making five 10 $15 million in college and then going to the NFL and they're like I'm top dog so I'm going be loud I'm going be me I'm going be unapologetically me and whatever team pcks me they gonna have to deal with that I don't necessarily see that and and Bill bich kind of vibe and all that well I don't I just I don't see it somebody can make me a liar but I don't I don't see it and in Buffalo it's not like Sean mcder is this warm cuddly guy but you still think that there was a pretty big disconnect between how things and what the en felt like in Buffalo compared to what it felt like in New England absolutely and like you said Shawn mcder was by no means like a hey let me just come give you a hug and like oh how was your day like let's yeah he's not Mike mcdy no no no no no no it's not like that at all but I think that that also just highlights like how how stuck in his ways coach bich is because it you can take a program who is pretty pretty up to date with like you know like I said obviously being aware and being adaptive and being so on and so forth but also like there's a way to do things like the old school traditional method of hard work Blue Collar get you what you want that is still alive and that's still well and I feel like Buffalo was a healthy combination of both but New England is just very much so it's just blue collar gray rainy days you just put the work in you clock out and you go home you know and there's no there's no if ends or butts there's no there's no other way there's one way and that's just the way it is I want to turn the tone of this because I I want to end this on a high note talk about something that you enjoy remembering yeah what favorite favorite Tom Brady story from from that year that you got to play with him favorite Tom Brady [ __ ] um the well the first time I ever met Tom was at uh we were having those NFL I think it was like one of those Play 60 camps where we had like the fans and the kids come out and they were on the field and so this was kind of like during the time of like U volunteer workouts or voluntary workouts and so Tom hadn't been around but he showed up specifically for the play 60 thing and I remember I just saw him walking across the field and I was like oh my God it's him there he is and he just like was walking by and he like was looking around and he saw me and he like immediately walked up to me like Damian my name's Tom Brady like you know we just drafted you super excited blah blah blah blah blah and I was just standing there like you talking to me like I know you said my name but are you talking to me you talking to me thanks for introducing yourself I I appreci seriously like people like I don't know if people will understand the magnitude of something like that but to me that was like Monumental like six time Super Bowl champ literally like the greatest of all time and here I am a rookie haven't even you know I'm Still rocking number 53 because I hadn't even earned like a legitimate number yet uh that was my high school number and I don't really appreciate the running back it is a little bit different it's a little bit running back but you know he really like he just walked right up to me and D he just introduced himself and like that level of like humility and just like like I could tell it was just like one he was just a normal guy and it was just about the team like no one guy was better than another and you know that was that was just that he was just a nice guy I loved always seeing him walk through the hallways not because I was just [ __ ] staring at him but because I watched and he would speak to literally every single person that was within 10 feet of him hey how you doing today hey how's your day going today hey how are you doing today hey how's your how's your wife how's your daughter who's doing this how's your son who's got baseball camp today oh your son had a soccer game two weeks ago how many goals did he score is he loving it or oh well if there's anything I can do you know let me know that was the kind of guy that Tom was hell even one time he had like said something to me in kind of like a serious way like we were having like a walkthr and like you know me being a young rookie and I wasn't really playing so I would just like had my hood up and I was just kind of like chilling off in the back and he just yells at me like hey take your hood off and I was just you know yes sir and I'm very like very quick matter of fact and everything and so after the walkthrough is over he pulled me aside and he was all like hey you don't have to call me sir like don't yes sir me or anything like that he was like you know I just wanted to let you know that there's a way there's a time and a place for everything there's people that are always watching there are people who are always assessing you on everything that you're doing and I just want to make sure that you're always putting yourself in the most positive light no matter who's looking at you no matter what you're doing that way every time somebody looks at you you're always doing the right thing and so on and so forth and I was like damn that's real and he ended the conversation by saying and don't again do not with the yes sir stuff he's like did you call did you say yes sir to Tua and Jaylen Herz when you play with them and I was like no he's like all right well treat me just like you would treat Tua or Jaylen Herz and I was like fair enough so yeah those and and there's a lot of things you I was gonna say there's a lot of things like that Pro yeah exactly and there were a lot of things where he was just just like that like if there was you know if it was time to be serious Tom was very serious like I definitely saw Tom serious side but other than that whenever it was time to just be laidback and just like he was just he was just another one of the guys it's pretty remarkable and and I think that when we look back on it you know we've had a million conversations about this but I think that as he's out of the league a couple years and we get a better perspective on what his career was his ability to go to Tampa and instill in a single year that sort of mindset that sort of standard and the power that comes along with that I don't think we have a proper appreciation for what that was like in real time really not even three four years later I still don't think we do no truly because and that's what you that's what happens when you get so accustomed to something right like obviously Tom had a lot of success in New England he won he won he was great but then once he to be able to leave and go to a completely different franchise and like you said within a year accomplish what he accomplished like that it's not talked about nearly enough because like that was like people too busy doing roast and stuff other than like talking about how great that was you know what I'm saying but it was just like the that was a supernatural ability and Tom is a supernatural human I hate to say it because at the end of the day we are all just humans but he you know he was picked he was he was one of the chosen ones truly and he has the ability to you know clearly whatever he touches you know it it flourishes so more power to him awesome well that's all I got for you Damien sincerely appreciate the time thank you very much for joining us I thoroughly enjoyed this I hope you enjoyed yourself as well yes sir I appreciate you having me thank you so much I enjoyed the time I appreciate the chat and um yeah thank you again for having me sounds great hopefully we'll do this again yes hope so that's all we have for today we will be back on Friday with our next installment in our lingering questions from 2023 series fittingly enough we're doing the AFC East on Friday so going to chat about some things we want answered about the bills the Jets the Patriots uh who's the other team in the FC the Miami Dolphins as we get there to the end of the week so please come back and check that out thoroughly have enjoyed these shows we've got a few more on tap for you over the next month or so for now that's all we've got appreciate you listening we'll talk to you soon