Is Jamal Murray Worth $208 Million & PCL NBA Debate Reactions | From The Logo

Introduction and welcome always on time even when we're a little late welcome to another episode of from the logo uh Hayes and gifted in the building today ZZ will be joining us shortly oh man we got a lot of topics to get we still going to be going division by division eventually get to the Northwest we're also going to talk a little bit about the PCL the debate league but we got some news from around the the NBA that we're going to get into first this one that happened uh over the weekend Jamal Murray fouryear $28 million extension with the uh Denver nug I think the last time we talked uh we actually talked about how the Nuggets Discussing Jamal Murray's contract extension with the Denver Nuggets had not extended Jamal Murray yet will they go ahead and do that locked them in we know that they've lost a lot of role players over that time they want to make sure that they did not even get to the point of of risking losing one of their key pieces how do you feel about the deal gifted well first off what's good with everyone shout out to W Hayes and W gifted we'll get to what those mean later in the episode had to flex a little bit but in terms of this topic for Jamal Murray first off I want to say the nuggets are extremely lucky and I feel like a lot of people aren't talking about this a lot of people are saying is he worth this amount of money is he that good but people have to remember if Jamal Murray ever was a Allstar or all NBA caliber player that number wouldn't be that low it would be like 300 range and then it's like Denver's really in trouble if they have to give him a super max the fact that he was unel for it and got that rate honestly I think Denver comes out as a winner as much as you can win right obviously maxing him out does impact the way that you want to build your roster but if he was at a higher number it would be almost untenable and you might have to trade him so this at least gets him locked up if their option is to let him walk for nothing then you pay him so I'm not really mad at them honestly you do what you got to do especially in this new climate for the NBA yeah what we're seeing that happens in the NBA is that you lock in a player you get you get them extended I mean if you do need to move them later on you can still do that at least you're doing that without uh you know them the risk of them being a free agent so the the other team would have to include something not that I'm saying that they would they're looking to move Jamal Murray I do not think that that's the case but you uh you get them locked into a contract like you said it's for where the NBA is going it's a reasonable contract uh of course you know we're talking about a couple of years ago how that money looks like then it's a it's a lot different of a scenario but the question I want to throw to you here on this gifted is do the Nuggets to you have the flexibility or are they at a place where they can realistically still go after winning a title they didn't last year um they've lost some key role players ever since winning the title kyp Bruce Brown those guys they don't have any real cap flexibility this now puts them above the first tax apron regardless of any other thing that happens unless they make a a pretty big change with the roster both next season and in 2025 26 uh the next time they'd have anything beneath the the first apron is in 2026 27 how what what type of flexibility you think they're going to have going forward and is it even needed for the Denver I think it's going to be rough man I do I think that they're in a very tough position because as you said they're going to be officially over the first apron no matter what they do I honestly think the two names that have to pop up in this have to be Aaron Gordon and also Michael Porter Jr for two vastly different reasons right obviously because they paid npj all of his money he has to come up in terms of trading him for expiring contracts to get some cap I would say relief right but the other side of that is Gordon is gonna want a contract extension which would probably put you closer to over the second apron if you keep this team overall together so I think some tough decisions regarding their core have to be made Beyond this overall season especially now if I'm the Nuggets I'm trying to get a Gordon to locked into contract as soon as possible I'm really trying to do that yeah I mean yeah that you make a great point there uh Aaron Gordon who does have a player option for the 2025 26 season for $22.8 million he's an unrestricted free agent in 2026-27 um yeah I mean something has to give at some point unless they're just not going to worry about going over the the the second tax a which I don't think the Nuggets want to do if they did that they wouldn't have lost some key role players and they would still uh have those guys here so you know Michael Porter Jr $38 Analyzing the Nuggets' roster flexibility and future moves million in the 2526 season AAR Goran 22 million on that on the player option every other contract that they have on this roster is all reasonable uh Naji 8 million uh Dario s SAR $5 million so Russell Westbrook $3 million so they got some reasonable contracts outside of those top guys they're a very topheavy contract team and I do think hey while Michael Porter Jr is still 26 years old or Aaron gornet 29 it could look to move on for one of those guys in the upcoming future yeah and it's hard man cuz this core with kcp literally won a championship not too long ago it was very like extremely recent literally 2023 and now we are speaking about them breaking up their core even further again for Denver this season I think based off how their roster is the over the overall development of their young Talent has to be a core point that they focus on yeah and speaking of that young Talent when you look at that is there anybody that you have penciled in that you think could Ascend out of that young talent and and maybe help uh push push push that bench over to where they're back to having a solid overall bench um I'll give you a couple of uh players and real quick I gotta go open I gotta go open up a door real quick but before doing that um I want to say Christian Brown is a player that I'm really looking at his overall explosiveness and his defensive profile is the closest thing they have to replacing kyp's uh production um I would also have to say Peyton Watson becoming a more complete offensive player with his defense could also be a huge thing to me those are the two that really have to highlight Denver's young core because of their athletic pop especially Brown because we saw Brown play meaningful time for Denver during their Championship run even though it was a much more I would say offensively down roll he can still perform at a high level so his development in terms of an allaround player on both ends is really what I would highlight I'll be right back give me one second you're good you're good uh while gifted goes and take care of some business uh I I'll kind of follow up on that Christian Brawn is a player that is 66 220 pounds playing that guard position play on the wing I mean if they can get Christian braa to being that player that could be a solid two-way player of course that will help the overall development up the ceiling of that but one guy that I really look at on this different Nuggets roster that they just drafted this past year 22nd overall is Don Holmes I really like his athletic profile when you look at that draft yeah a little bit undersized to be a center at 69 but I think he has the wingspan at over 71 he has the athletic profile and he has the rebounding ability to kind of really be um potentially kind of a a defensive anchor for them uh you know if you're looking at the high level potential that he has the question is is he's going to hit that I always have a saying that all potential is not always realized and that's just what it comes down to but Don Holmes is a player that I look at um on this Denver Nuggets roster and say that if they can hit on that pick if donon Williams ends up being a player that they can bet on as far as being in their core going forward then he can help a lot like change kind of that and we've seen it a lot too like if you have that athletic profile that that that type of Center that can play next uh to to yic or definitely be a highle Defender while he's out it could really help that a lot so uh what's going on gift I was just talking about uh don Holmes as being one of those young pieces they just drafted him 22nd overall really like his athletic profiles a young developing Center a little bit undersized but he has that wingspan and that athleticism I think if you can develop something with Don Holmes I think he can help a lot too yeah he's he's also interesting like yeah these are the players that Denver is banking on with joic the answer to win is to have size length and wings guys that can do different other things especially with their younger core slowly getting more and more productive Potential rift between Nuggets coach Mike Malone and front office minutes my question is how do you think this plays out with their head coach because Mike Malone doesn't really want to do that he would much rather play guys who are proven to play now but the front office is not trying to do that and that that takes us to the next topic that we had on the list is that there have been some Rumblings this is according to Zack low that uh the the Mike Malone and the Nuggets aren't seeing eye to eye right now on that roster I think you pulled out a great point of that like when you have a head coach who's been there for a while who stuck it out you they've stuck it out with him as well um through the ups and downs of that Denver Nugget team they eventually win win a title but you lose key pieces of his rotation and you're replacing those with young unproven guys I can understand why uh Mike Malone has has some issues there especially letting KC play uh Casey P go after letting Bruce Brown go the year before so it's like I get it that at coach in development is part of coaching you cannot try to sidestep development usually as a coach especially if you want to have sustained success over time but at the end of the day like um you've get you've gotten rid rid of a lot of his veteran pieces and another one could have to go which we just talked about an mpj or Aaron Gordon just because of how close you are to that tax apron and if that's really a thing that's that's getting there where now your head coach and your front office that have been on the same page for so long are now starting to see there that concerns me if I was a fan of the Denver Nuggets rightfully so I mean you only get so many chances to really win joic is still viewed as the best player in the league right now and even if some people don't think he is he's at least in the running to be that so you don't want to waste these years especially with the new contract that Jamal signed now I think the expectation for Jamal has to be you have to be All-Star level yeah in the regular season at some point because they paid you mainly because of your value overall to the team and the franchise and all that stuff for sure but at the end of the day if you're going to be paid that dollar amount you have to show that value in some capacity so we want to see him become a better player as well I think that's a very important piece for Denver moving forward too he has to reach and Rise himself up to those types of real conversations if Denver is to have any chance to win another championship to me yeah he definitely has to step up his game and you know even though as long as Murray's been in the league already he's 20 27 years old so there's still something that he can ref refinement of course that he can do over his game still I think we've seen a bit of that the key thing too that you got to ask with Jamal Murray is staying healthy he's played over 60 games once since 20189 they're gonna need more than that from him you've now got you got to stay healthy and no player wants to be hurt right it's not like I'm I'm saying like he he wants to go out there and be hurt but like this what this team needs is they need you to be on your best they need you to play at an All-Star near very close near to All-Star level but all that doesn't matter if you can't stay on the court one season of playing over 65 games just 201819 that's not gonna cut it that's usually cut it bro n yeah so um but yeah when if if it gets to this point where there's such a big rift that Rift grows between the front office and Mike Malone is it realistic that they change if they ever have to change coaches not going would hope they they don't but they that they change coaches and they're and you think that they can keep on that path or do you think if they change a coach they're going to have to make other further CH bigger changes to the roster depending on who that coach is see this is a hard thing for me right because I think coaching in the NBA matters I also think some people might over leverage that my problem is I normally don't recommend firing a coach if the coach has won a title there but more importantly if the coach is still a good coach and I think Malone has shown you he is still a very good capable coach he has flaws every coach has flaws almost every fan of every team thinks their coach is the worst you know coach in the league yeah I think Mike Malone still has value and my whole thing is if you're gonna replace him for a newer head coach and you already don't have the same Talent now that takes time to Jael and I feel like if your best player is joic you don't want to be changing too many core pieces around him if you can help so I really hope they're able to come to a compromise and really figure things out because losing kcp losing Malone and then potentially having to lose Gordon or mpj would drastically affect this roster tremendously yeah do you going into next season do you if you had to put a percentage I think this the easy way to ask this question percentage on it how what chances do you give the Denver Nuggets to try to win the West next year percentage chance okay Chances of Nuggets winning the West next season [Music] um I'm trying to do like the math in my head because I think there's a lot of good scenes but I think they're still I'll say one of the best teames probably 40% 40% yeah okay I think that's fair yeah all right I'm not mad at that I'm not mad at that at all um but yeah we'll see what happens with the future of the Denver Nuggets it's it's it's going to be really interesting to see how they thread this needle between the avoidance of the second tax apron while still putting out a roster around yic that can still compete and you still have to keep your head coach healthy I mean happy as far as a having a roster out there yeah it's it's it's a really really interesting thread of the need they're going to have to do there but we'll see uh what happens there uh let's move into the next topic from a team that's trying to keep things together as much as they can to a team that is actively trying to just probably Shed off everything so we got it that the uh Brooklyn are expected to consider trades including cam Johnson Dennis Schroeder Doran finy Smith and bojn bogdanovich Brooklyn Nets trade rumors and rebuild strategy over the course of this NBA season as well as that they have a very high asking price for cam Johnson if they were to move him how do you how do you feel about the the Nets and what they're trying to do with the roster we also got word if it matters that uh Ben Simmons has been cleared uh for five on five for the 2024 25 season still not g to see him a lot but you know it is what it is there but how you feel about the Nets trying to still go through this rebuild and sell off these pieces I'm very happy with the Nets I said this already I think the Nets did the greatest heist in the NBA to make people think for several months they literally wanted to build a team around a role player Mel Bridges then traded him for more picks than were traded in the Kevin Durant trade which is wild they got more picks from Mel Bridges than trading away Kevin Durant it's crazy that's crazy that's crazy to me so so I would say for you to trade KD get male back as a piece in the KD trade with unprotected picks and then also trade male for even more picks to me that's an absolute W absolute win I don't think the winning matters at all for them this year I think it's about trying to get a high draft pick and also trying to develop some of your younger Talent cam like I have a lot of questions for how good cam is because I think he's a very talented scorer I think he he can score with the best of them at times but is he a viable player can he be a six-man player on a team that's very good right can you develop some of these pieces also I think the Nets are going to be a very important team because they want to be bad so the teams who don't want to be bad and are actually trying to compete could poach off some players off of their team to have value I think the Nets are going to be like the fire sale team of the NBA especially when it's close to the trade deadline I think that's going to be a huge swing piece for every team in the league no I agree I think when you look at it this would be a fun team to play buy or sell with who ends up on the on on the roster on the uh the last day of the Season that who's going to be on there on the open tonight roster because a lot of these guys could be gone Dennis Schroeder could be gone cam Johnson we already talked about Doran FY Smith I even think that in the right deal depending on what they get back they'd even consider moving Nick Claxton who they just signed to to a contract exension on top of all of that um bovic is another one Ben Simmons as as as a contract that maybe they're looking to use as an expiring contract or something like that like I don't other than cam Thomas I really could see a world in which they trade just about everybody else in the roster if the price is right yeah I don't think anyone is safe at all like I wouldn't be surprised if any of these guys go but bro imagine if Ben Simmons comes in and looks the best he's ever looked since you know his days what is his value at that point I don't know I don't think he's gonna be high because he doesn't play basketball like that but you know still they have options to go to here and my point is they they chose a Direction they chose a path and they're sticking to it that's what I like because beforehand I'm like what are the Nets doing we have no idea what's going on here they have all of these Wing players that will look great if they had like a Trey young or or like a joic like like like a top five player is you know thing on that team looks dangerous but instead it's just a whole bunch of role players with no clear Direction no like real coaching you know staff so to me this is this is a good direction for them for sure yeah I mean and if if for anybody that's looking for any kind of positivity to come out the the Brooklyn Nets this upcoming season not only to mention how many trades how many more first round picks that they get but cam Thomas is just gonna be shooting like he's just shooting bro cam Thomas May out the most shots per game in the league next season he just gonna be shooting give him the minutes yeah why not why not you know yeah I mean other than that man this this this Brooklyn is gonna be how bad can the Brooklyn Nets be over under 15 wins for the Brooklyn Nets next season oh okay do you think okay do you think the Nets are going to be worse than last year's Pistons yes yes yes you might not be wrong that's actually crazy oh man 15 is so so little man 15 is so little yeah it's not crazy though it's not crazy it's not crazy bro because at the same time like they're a team full of role players like you said they got some some Talent on the team but like you got talent of all role players nothing to really bring that together unless cam Thomas hits a crazy leap this year and if they do that the Brooklyn Nets May sit him they may walk in there and say Hey you pulled a hamstring I feel fine coach no you pulled a hamstring um because like they're they're clearly the leaders in the race for the flag as far as Cooper flag they gotta be right they gota I can't think of no no team that is set up perfectly to be bad off the rip more than Brooklyn I can't think of one it's going to be ug the Wizards are going to be close to they're going to be a weird Wiz be close where it be close the only thing with them is like like they have the whole Jordan pool thing where he can have like a bounceback season they got the number two pick in the draft they also draft oh and by the way valent Tunis is about to be a fantasy demon this year if you play fantasy basketball lock in valon Tunis is GNA put up some crazy performances bro for those reasons I think they'll probably be better than Brooklyn okay yeah I mean I I can definitely see them being better than Brooklyn I say Brooklyn is going to is clearly the the race uh for for tanking they're they're the flag bearers there because I don't see anybody being worse than the Brooklyn NS next season and if they are better than expected oh my God watch out for the Bevy of Trades it's gonna be absolutely so absolutely um but uh I guess uh moving on from that before we get into the division by division we're hoping ZZ be in but if he comes in we'll go back to that we got to talk a PCL (Peer Competition League) debate tournament discussion little bit about the PCL gifted because uh yes man let's talk about it man because as the 11th and what you were 15 seed 14 seed 14th seed the 11 and 14c we're in the we're in the the last eight there we're going into the next round we'll be uh debating again next Wednesday you have uh who Mars you got Mars next I got uh Dion from Ohio up next unfortunately zez didn't move zez was robbed because I don't know if you guys go back and watch those videos a lot of the people in the chat say zezy should have won that 21 Rob my boy they my boy easy but how have you felt about the PCL so far hey man hey man listen I can talk about this for hours it's it's like y'all are lucky that we only have this slot from 6 to 7:30 because there was a lot going into this right so a first off this is the first official PCL right things aren't perfect we've gotten crazy questions it's been a process in terms of people really figuring out but I'll say this what the PCL is showing so far to me at least especially in the playoffs is who can debate and who can't I'm G just be real with you right I said this coming in me being a 14 seed and Hayes not being in the top 10 is crazy when to me objectively we're some of the best Debaters in this league period right yeah no shade to Dion I think Dion's cool I don't really know Dion like that but me personally Dion being number two is crazy yeah I'm sorry I'm sorry right like like there's some people like like listen number 16 seed is Jack respect to Jack if you watch the Mars debate he looked like a 16 seed that's a fact in all of our battle saves do we ever look like below 10 Debaters at any point never in all of our debates never no so so like it didn't really make much sense um but we really showed up and we had grit and we had will I'm not going to lie to you like I spent a lot of time on Ax I just gotta be so real with you right I like I spent a lot of time mainly because it wasn't about Ox it was the disrespect to being 14 and not taking nothing for granted a lot of people just like Yap or they practice their things 25 minutes before an hour before no I'm spending a week preparing day by day by day I'm going back I went back and watched film to confirm my takes to make sure I was right I'm not sure what you do but that's how I took it yeah no I mean you're right that the SE and and that's one thing that I hope if the PCL continues and becomes a yearly thing is that the fact that Dion and no no shade in this but we're just talking about the pure debating right nothing on these guys as people or anything like that but as Debaters the fact that Dion was number two and Ox was number three if you watched the the the op the the preliminaries in this PCL as Debaters I don't understand that and that's where you know the I get it wanting to incorporate the fan vote all that type of thing but some of the fans got so wrapped up in like it's almost like they wanted to make they wanted to make a story rather than watch the debate that's why I'm glad that now in the playoffs it's not just about the fan vote it's also about having judges and the committee and things that their on and knowing that criteria because like I think that what you're seeing through this are people that can give you stats but can make a debate and sometimes like for example in my debate with pen is that there are a lot of things that if I had my choice on the topic that I would have absolutely agreed with pen and that I could even say pin was right on but it's about how you present that information in a debate and I think that's what some people are failing to be able to separate between that is that you have to understand the fact of what who's debating the better points who's making the more sound judgments who's responding to the other a little bit better and I'm glad that the judges were able to pull that through through both of our debates because that was a key part in actually you know showing who's the actual debator you do have to plan much like you I don't wait till the day before and just look up stats I actually like to plan out which where and when I'm going to bring up certain stats as well that way each round tells a story right and that's not something that a lot of people are doing in the debate they're not worried it's having a like a structured debate will will stand out so much more than somebody who's just making points at you for three rounds and and that's a big difference in the debate is you have to be able to structure it and so that's why the way that I looked at is this gifted I don't know I'm I'm a huge battle rap guy so I look at me too me too yes yes that's where I got my blueprint from yeah as and as in a battle rap you want to make sure that each round you're telling a structured story and so that's the way that I try to put it together in this is absolutely telling that structure story and and setting up how it needs to be set up and setting no my points so no yeah I think that stuff matters tremendously because again to me I don't just view these as random debates I view this as if someone types in my name or whatever and they're watching me for the first time I want people to think hey I'm not a dumbass like I can actually articulate myself and get my points off Win Lose or Draw it's less about me like outright dominating even though I want to outright dominate anyone I face because I'm super competitive but it's more so about people saying damn he's really good I like his points I'm going to choose this guy but at least he was in the running it didn't look so so overall lopsided and I have a lot of experience because even though I'm not a professional debater I run Twitter spaces and for my Twitter people the amount of times you have to deal with people on a day-to-day basis who just say [ __ ] and talk basketball and you have to check things here and there you know here and there when you add a timer to things where you can't cut nobody off you get the chance to get all your points off it adds more structure and layer to the conversation to the overall debates also I like the judges specifically because they have a a specific criteria you can look at the criteria and make sure your points are Importance of debate structure and preparation aligned with that criteria it doesn't just come down to well I don't like who car Malone was off the court so I'mma give the win to swiper when the debates in terms of the arguments people are making are different from the player right you can argue that Kevin Durant is a better player than LeBron James just because someone has LeBron doesn't mean they win no it's about the argument you make to say why he's better or not you have to do that and I think we showed that because again we were low ass seeds and we dominated our competition we we earned our spots undoubtedly yeah yeah that's that's 100% fact and um it's it's just been a fun series something outside of us which we'll get back to that I have to point out about this PCL the fact that people waited to the playoffs and then didn't show up for the debates and crazy crazy to me like I don't get why wait till the playoffs like one thing that I I do think that and you know in talking to Ron and everybody on the side if we do this again next year that I'll make sure you point out you got to have alternates because I don't think that in the playoffs it's you should just have a free ride to the next round even if somebody doesn't show up yeah I kind of feel like if you make it to the playoffs you should be W like there unless some like crazy things happen you can't make whatever but even if there are alternates I feel like the system at how we're looking at people and evaluating them like I really want to know what their process was to create these seeds because again for us to be as low as we were again I'm not even going to argue that I should have been top one top two top three I just know for damn sure I'm not 14 that's cap just like you know for damn sure you're not under the top 10 it don't make no sense there's no yeah there's no way in hell I'm not in one of the top 10 Debaters in in this PC it's just not it's you know it is what it is but I think I've proved it and one thing that I think we've both had to do uh me a little bit less than you but I'd say that it doesn't matter we still had to do it is that I'm new to PC I'm still less than six months into being on the police PC platform right so like one thing that I love seeing through this debate I still remember when I showed up to my first debate with chill there was so many people that were like who the hell is this guy in the comments go from that to my last debate against pen where before I even started talking in the first round you see people in the comments like Hey I Love the Way Hayes uh uh uh puts out his his thoughts and so like just seeing that kind of EB and FL of course you still have your detractors and things like that like has been really fun for me to watch because I'm always somebody you know like I'm I'm somebody who like I'm always leading shows right like I've especially Chicago Chicago media [ __ ] in Chicago media know me I don't even say that to like brag or anything like that so to come to a new platform where people are like who the hell is this guy and to win them over in the debate process that's H especially when people come into the battle saying he's battling my favorite Creator there's no way he's going to win it and they're like Dam like people were in the chat saying ax ax ax ax is dope and then at the end of it he was like damn he really dominated him that's crazy like even that feeling of it shows that if you're focused on the actual debate and not the other not the name [ __ ] but but basketball what we talking about it can elevate it to a whole other level honestly and that's one thing that's great about the PCL bro and I I actually considered not even getting into the PCL and I was I was glad that I went ahead and decided to do it um and yeah player the the whole thing of players even from the logo to to less degree as well like we're the unknown show here right the show that got to continually prove ourselves so we are you know it is what it is I'm glad that we've been able to move forward man and that debate with Ox brro that was a master class of debating I I don't know if you saw it in the chat like I was in the chat where you made a it was I think it was the the the your second round in the first topic and I was like oh no you see gifted face there's no he's not shaking at all he's lock lock bro I swear to God listen because how I did my [ __ ] is like I think about okay what is he GNA say and Northwest Division team analysis: Oklahoma City Thunder then how can I counter it so when he brought up the chair like oh got his ass so he saiding 2019 he's saying 2019 Kawai is p Kawai when really it's 2021 or 2016 he won the championship in 19 but that was not the best version of Kawai so once you say that on his head on his ass I was waiting for that you know what I'm saying like I had the numbers for that year I'm like I'm I'm waiting for him to bring up Championship like please say when he said I'm like got his ass yeah great like said if y'all want to see a master class of debating man uh gifted gifted complete like and I listen like I said no shade anybody but you cook Ox that that whole debate bro bro he didn't show up on on he didn't show up on the panel the next day and I'm like damn ax where you at where bro when like I you know crazy crazy but but listen it's less about Ox for me it's like oh I'm 14 this debate is for y'all hey just like Hayes versus pen I love watching that [ __ ] because a lot of people saw pen numbers guide this that this that this that and you box and you had topics that a lot of people overwhelmingly think the other side like most people feel like Luca is a better player than Shay right and you were making your points through through and through you took Anthony Edwards over wmy that's a tough ass R that's tough that's tough yeah that's a fact that's a fact I think in those type of things and having those type of uh topics like cuz like I said in in the pin debate I I I would have I would have I agree with a lot of what he said and what his points were but like I think that that that shows the debate when you can say hey I agree with the other side of this but I'm G to make sound points of it and that uh I'm really proud of that ant round bro because I was like you got wimy the generational Talent the unicorn but I'm fa to convince people walking away from this that ant can be the face of the league and it was really great and and and I think bro I think your strongest move too is when you baited him by bringing up Lucas's defense you threw him off guard so he started to talk about Lucas's defense positively to try to make up for and it's like no what you should do is side step that and double down on how the offense is so drastically different it don't matter because Shay's not some like crazy like top five Elite Defender but he's a good Defender like yeah you threw him off off his game with that I'm like oh Hayes is good because even though you're an underdog in that if you make someone Yap and not be on the point you can win you can win you did that well that was good yeah that that shade debate I had to pick an angle and that's why literally I I came right out the gate defense I was like defense defense defense because if I make this a offensive argument there's only a couple of routes that I so many ways you can go for it got to be the defense is the thing that I have to anchor on and then I'll get to the offense but I'm gonna I'm going to talk about defense so much and the separation between those on him because he started focusing on no actually Luca isn't a awful Defender he was a awful Defender he's been a a I'm like why would you say he's not an awful Defender and then tell people he was a awful defend it's like bro like don't don't even say that don't yeah bro on once he said once he said that I was like oh yeah when I see that I'm like hey got it and then I'm reading the CH like damn heyes got I'm like oh [ __ ] they got the chat in there too like oh man it was tough yeah yeah it's it's been fun man but I uh yeah so I'll be up against Dion from Ohio next you got Mars next um bro that that that is going to be a death match of all death matches I feel like personally I'm going up against like the face of PC right now yeah so it it's like it's like a lot a lot a lot a lot like I got a winwin to win type [ __ ] so we locking in chat you vers Dion's gonna be fun I want to watch that I beat Dion already once I beat him in earlier in the in the debate so like they saying he's like the people champ this and that I'm like all right just I just I just want to see the debate when it's here man I'm curious well you know I mean listen Dion's been been better prepared like that that first debate when they said he won I was like I don't know how he's he's been better prepared but uh all I got to say is definitely defin yeah yeah yeah y'all gonna see a battle uh in the one against Dion and uh we gonna have a lot of fun is all I can say so absolutely I may I may even have on a specific t-sh see I'm I'm thinking about battles at different levels you thinking a little yeah I may already have a t-shirt that I'm going to have on during that debate to kind of you know send a shot early so you know see see look I was so locked in I thought about the same [ __ ] I said you know what I'm gonna wear all black this is gonna be a funeral I want to kill ax as much as I can and as soon as Ron said gifted you didn't bring your gloves it was like I brought this and I I'm like okay let's get to it so I'm hype for sure for sure man uh but y'all make sure y'all stay in tuned it's next Wednesday PCL going down again live do you know if you're Wednesday or Sunday yet um I'm Sunday I'm Sunday are you Wednesday are you Wednesday I think I'm Wednesday yeah I'm Wednesday okay where so uh y'all make sure y'all stay locked in man it's gonna be fun regardless of when lose or anything else it's going to be a lot of fun but uh you got two people here now once gifted said he also studies b battle rap it's like yeah y'all got y'all got to be ready for you got to you literally have to that that bro battle rap literally gives you the foundation for what a strong three rounds are it really does you see bad ones you see good ones and you see the elevation as you go for sure that's a fact that's a fact all right man damn I was hoping ZZ would be here by now but you know it is what it is going yeah yeah with that said uh let's we're going division by division we've been doing this for the last couple of weeks uh going division by division we're in the Northwest division now uh this is the division that includes the uh Oklahoma City Thunder dver nuggets it's Minnesota Timberwolves Utah Jazz Portland Trailblazers um let's start off with the Thunder how you feeling about the thunder season next year just did a podt on them shout out to the thunder man um I gotta say one of the most dominant off Seasons without having to give up any assets ridiculous um to again I'm sorry but to do the Josh giddy trade for literally nothing for Alex Caruso straight up is crazy and then for you to make a key signing in hardenstein for free as well and also the craziest part about horenstein's contract is it's lined up perfectly so when they have to pay their younger guys and Chad and Jay dub more money his contract is expiring off the books to me it's just genius you know what I'm saying so I'm really really excited for what OKC gets to cook up and build up this year I think they are the team in the Western Conference who's going to be extremely well I I can't wait to watch them yeah and I I look at the I at the uh the OKC Thunder as well like what you added with Alex kuso a player who is coming off one of his best three-point shooting years with volume and and percentage um on top of that we've know how disruptive of a Defender he is and one thing that I can't wait to see on this OKC Thunder team is being a bulls fan I've gotten seeed a lot over the last three years is that he generates so many fast break opportunities with his deflections and that's something that's not talked a lot about before they're not always registered as steals but with his deflections and when you when you factor in Shay's as well in that his link that's going to be fun to see and I can't wait to see the lineups defensively when they have to go to a defensive lineup with Alice kuso and L Dort out there at the same time that's gonna be a monster defensive lineup that they have and so they have such a good balance between when they need to go offense where they need to go defense and Isaiah hardenstein being there and being able to move CAD to the four man this could be a really dangerous team next year especially with the inner development of their players again Cas Wallace off their bench I keep talking about him because those are the players that move needles for championships they just do we saw Christian Brown years ago play a role where in a spot rle he played well for them right K Wallace definitely fits that profile if he can knock down shots and be as good defensively as he was last year for sure yeah and so like it's just and then you got to factor in the thing that's uh it's kind of hard to Define but like this team is so young that it's not outside the realm of possibility of a Chad and a in a in a in a Cas Wallace or anybody else take a considerable leap from what they were last season just as far as their growth in the NBA game and if you get that going with one or two of those players taking a considerable step forward on top of the refinement you've added with hard hardtin and Alex Caruso this could be a team that I that I think could I won't say it's the Western Conference so you can never really say run away with the west but I think they could they just have so much balance to this team that it's going to be hard for a lot of a lot of other uh teams to be able to fight with him for a full 48 minutes 100% it's going to be a constant Battle of trying to outwit OKC's rotations and also being able to keep up if they're able to rebound the ball better especially if Chad in the two-man game is more dominant offensively at attacking those mismatches if he can do that they're a much more dangerous team and I think it's a lock that they'll probably be top 10 in offense and defense yet again yeah I I believe so as well and when you look at it as well with um with you got to talk about coaching right cuz the pieces that you have on the roster is only as good as how the coach can bring them all together when you look at Mark dangel how do you feel about him as a head coach especially with all the talent he's going to have on this roster so so I got a couple things to say man um I think he's one of the better coaches in the league I think OKC has one of the better coaching staffs in the league but I will say in a series where they played against Luca and Kyrie and of that competitive Mavs defense Mark D has some areas where he could be criticized again overplaying Josh giddy when he was a clear floor negative on both ends for them um kind of could lead to why they had some slow starts against the Mavericks in those games times right not making certain adjustments defensively like here right prime example PJ Watson he shot 48% on on a3es a game in that Series right fake shooting [ __ ] whatever in my opinion right Boston never let PJ get into any rhythm shooting those over threes in the corner Boston eliminated the above the break threes right right they said you're not getting the corner threes we're making you shoot above the break threes where you're also under average at that and generally that's harder shot quality than conceding a wideopen three in the corner that's what Boston did I feel like making that adjustment alone in itself could have swung the series more but at the same time it's hard to judge because again if PJ is gonna shoot that high you're gonna lose and they did so I feel iffy about it but I still think in a vacuum he's a good coach I still think he understands how to get the most out of his players and also he's also very young so everyone has to get better as they grow to me that's what OKC is which makes him so dangerous because if this is their floor and they're only going to get better and better and better they're going to be a problem for years to come for sure yeah for sure and then they still got all those draft picks that they still got coming they still going to be able to add considerable Talent down down the pipeline for years and years and years to come the OKC Thunder is set up to probably as far as young Talent coaching because like you said uh Mark D is still a young coach as well like and then also their salary cap situation as well like this is a team there there's seven as much talent as this team has has on it $177 million belief the first tax apron and they got all the resources in cap to do whatever they want in terms of trying to sign players trade players and they have many draft picks coming in to give them more ammo to do whatever they need to do I just think this is the most prepared team in the league for the harsh reality of this upcoming CBA for sure you're looking at a team that is going to have at least three first round picks for between now in 2028 crazy that's crazy at least that's minimum they could have more they could have five first round picks this season depending on how things shake out like they have just done such a masterful job at competing now while still maintaining extreme flexibility for the future so that they can make changes and alterations to their roster as they see how these players grow and and whatever together so like the OKC Thunder are the team to watch for a long time and they're going to be good for a very long time yeah so um but moving on from them to the next team which we T we kind of touched on a little bit so we may not spend as much time here the Denver Nuggets how you feeling about the Denver Nuggets yeah Denver we talked about them earlier I think Denver is still gonna be a good team I think yic is gonna have to do a lot more this season to make up for the loss of kcp spacing I think the young Denver Nuggets outlook for next season players have to be the expector for their season if they pop they will be a better regular season team than they were last year but both of them have to take considerable leaps on both ends of the floor specifically I think offensively for Peyton specifically pton Watson offensively needs to be able to do more in terms of catching and shooting the ball at a good clip in terms of just understanding how to attack Closeouts consistently and also passing if he was a good passer that changes a lot because again when you attack a close out the answer should not always be I'm going to dunk the ball or I'm going to basically turn the ball over if you can pass the ball too it opens up more angles more opportunities for the offense to get to that quality shot that's why connective passers hold so much value in the NBA so Brown and him taking leaps in those areas and just being more consistent Shooters is a big role for their season it it directly impacts how good they're going to be to make for sure I agree with that I mean we talked a lot about the other aspects of them you know losing role players and needing the young players to step up but one thing too that you have to ask yourself is that with the Denver Nuggets they are such a good defensive team and they had one of the the they had the second best defense in the league against top 10 offenses in in the NBA last season which is nothing to over Overlook at at all but the one thing with the Denver Nuggets and I know you have to kind of play this this way as long as you have jic on the team they were 26 in the NBA in Pace do you think that that benefits them or does it hurt them more in the playoffs as things slow down that they play such a slow pace compared to the rest of the league the pace point is an interesting one um I feel like the pace is going to shift with Westbrook on the team I think Russ is definitely gonna make his imprint known on the game in terms of speeding them up and I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing either I think Russ pushing the pace for the young players is how they're going to have more success because if there's more possessions and you have a guy who can pass the ball and get downhill you now have your young players in a spot where okay we just have to run our roles are a lot more easier there's less uh offensive thinking that they have to do especially around a player who's going to get them the ball and Russ so I think Russ really changes that entire equation for him now how that will translate to the playoffs um really depends on Russ's decision making in the half court and how consistent he can Elevate the pace in that setting with his efficiency at the basket those are things that I really question and those are fair things to question I think that uh you know that that's those are all fair questions to come the Denver Nuggets have gone from a team that and we still like let me be clear here I and me talking about them I'm talking about the the fact of that I do think this is one of the better teams in the Western Conference they just have some really big flaws and when you look at what they've been over like the last three four years in the league they cly are now a ring a ring down from that whereas teams around them have consistently gotten better they've kept losing pieces that were part of what made that team so special as what it is so they're going to have a hard go of it but uh you know overall I think that that that nuggets still go as much as yage uh as far as yic and Jamal Murray now can take them and so um you know we already talked about that Jamaal Murray now that he's locked in he has to step his game up he has to stay healthy and the sky is the limit for the Denver Nuggets at that point yeah for sure all right next team the Minnesota Timberwolves it's a team that almost made the finals last year um added Rob Dillingham lost Kyle Anderson other than that everything's staying pretty much the same tan Shannon Jr is another Minnesota Timberwolves roster and expectations player that I think is of course not gotten talked about a whole hell of a lot because of where he was drafted and things like that but I think tan Shannon Jr if he's given the the the opportunity to to put up shots on this team he can help this team so much with their B scoring how do you feel about the Minnesota chimber Wes that's exactly what I was going to say guys like that like their scoring Off the Bench projects to be a lot better than it was last year I think what they are losing though is Kyle Anderson did know in some games how to get their offense going better he did have moments off the ball where he did that but we also can't be blind Kyle Anderson was also damn near unplayable in the suns in the first round and he's an older player right who is the offensive negative so to me all in all losing that hurts but your tilt is with younger guys who can score also defensively they still have guys who could do very positive things as well I think the biggest X Factor for this team to me has to be Anthony Edwards taking that true Superstar leap I think he's right on the edge of maybe becoming that truly but I still think he's far away from like actually realizing that clearly he's close he's you know there but the other thing has to be carony towns to me carony towns has to be the number one X Factor on his team because we saw it last year when C was at his best he was guarding joic in isolation so Rudy Gober could play his role defensively and take Aaron Gordon out of the series down the stretch when cat is at his best he's another offensive positive that can take the pressure off of anony Edwards to have to have 45 points or 50 points in a game seven by the way when they're down 20 cat is the one scoring the basketball getting them back into the game right or keeping them keeping them above water right that's what cat did also he can be a negative X Factor as well when you're facing the Dallas Mavericks in keny tals is not getting to the paint he is settling for shots he's not really moving the ball well he's shooting the ball awfully he can't throw a rock into the Grand Canyon right when he's playing like that they're bad right so to me a lot of this stuff matters especially in how goar and cat can work because again I kept saying this all year in the playoffs you heard me round by round by round like damn I like this wolves team but can they run more KY towns and go bear like twom Man games because when they do that you have Rudy go bear in the action with Anthony Edwards a pass away so now it takes pressure off of Ant to have to attack a defense now he has an angle to get to where he needs to actually get to I want to see them run more of that but a lot of that is on C really maturing as a overall decision maker and being more comfortable in getting to his spots a lot of the time he super undisciplined not very Orthodox and it's either okay crazy shot he made that or what was that shot what was that pass right like you need to see cat really become a more disciplined version of himself for the Wolves to have a good you know chance of success to me I agree with everything that you said I think uh uh just to add to it somebody else said I think it's hugely important to the success of this Minnesota timber team is Nas Reed like I look at NAS Reed as being like he's a guy that like he is is so good at what he does as far as being the defender for them scoring where they need him to like feeling in that when when when cat Rudy are out of games like Nas Reed steps in and just does his thing 13 points off the bench for that team last year like Nas re to being 25 years old still has another another level I think that he has to his game and he could be one of the reasons why that if the if the Minnesota timber have to make a move while they're a they they'll be okay to withstand that like I look at nazri as so important for that bench and this is say Timberwolves bench that I don't know about you I don't necessarily have the most confidence in they have Nas Reed they have Alexander Walker these are two really really good players to be bringing off your bench but I also look at like what Rob Dillingham could bring in his rookie year if he could stay healthy and play controlled and then we already talked about Terence Shannon Jr and his ability to score and be a two-level scorer for this team maybe even a three-level score like if they're able to do those type of things you have that type of bench unit where you're bringing in Rob Dillingham Nas Reed Alexander Walker and Shannon JR this could be one of the better benches in the NBA oh and sidebar the other exactor I'm happy that you said his name no one is really say much about him this is a pro here for nille yeah and I say this mainly because in the first route he was very good he was a very good player and then as the playoffs progress he was basically a non-factor for the rest of the playoffs they need nqu to be what he was in the first round more consistently as a spacer and a Defender the [ __ ] he was doing to Devin Booker in the first round in that back court when he played was big but it it didn't translate outside of that at a high enough level for me you got to see that more yeah for sure for sure he can be such a good player for them he just has to be consistent uh I saw an article I think it was a couple of weeks ago where they listed to him I think he was like number two as far as the uh best kept secrets in the NBA and I'm like yeah I guess I can get what you're getting at with that but we got to see it more consistent I gotta see more consistently bro yeah so I agree um but yeah um done with the uh with the uh Timber you ready to move on sure all right next team the Utah Jazz's confusing situation and potential moves Utah Jazz this is a team that I listen I'll start off with this one I have no idea how to look at the Utah Jazz this this season because they're a team that you locked in lari marketing you can't move him this year um you went out and got I actually like their draft I like a lot of the players that they drafted in getting Kyle fosi down there like a lot they have they're going to have like this team that has like some potential versatile forward play or whatever uh but you reportedly may be shopping Walker Kesler there you still got John Collins who God forbid John Collins is still a starter in the NBA at this point in time that's my personal opinion I'm not expecting everybody to agree with that you still got Jordan Clarkson a former six-man of the year one thing we saw with with Clarkson last year is that he's not a starter he's better coming off the bench but it's like they have so many of these pieces where you can look at this team and maybe think hey this is a team that's going to be trying to at least contend for the playin but are they going to make a series of moves that have them more towards not necessarily tanking but aiming more towards the lottery than aiming for the playin how do you feel about the Utah Jazz W they're one of the most confusing teams in the league um obviously not trading Lor Markin was a thing for them I'm not gonna say his name too many times pain um I feel like for the Jazz their goal is to be a fire Cale team team Lor's not getting traded I think a lot of these other pieces are going to probably be on the Move midseason and I think they're also a Darkhorse team to try to get flag as well keep in mind they also have draft capital from other teams in the donov Mitchell and gobear trade so I kind of feel like these are things that they're going to be looking forward to really trying to capitalize on um I think their other core goal is Player Development konay George having the ball in his hands a lot more in that true point guard role where he was he was you know had many games where he was lights out shooting the basketball during his first year is gonna be a big thing I thought Jordan Clarkson was probably the most mature veteran guard on the team last year the injuries hurt his value a ton but his Twan game with Lor Markin was very threatening and trust me as a Warriors fan watching them light our ass up consistently you know that's going to be a thing um I also am curious about cins sex in it and what's the word with him because his minutes got a bit confusing but he clearly still has game he had a lot of positive games where he played very very very well for them so so the starter role to me is very open for both of those guards and seeing what that turns into is very interesting but I think Utah is gonna do the same formula they've done for the past two years they're super competitive at one point last year they were like a top five team comfortably they have like a crazy hot stretch and then they calm down and then oh and now you at the bottom here's a high draic I think it's going to be the same process for them if you ask me yep absolutely I I like this comment a lot it says uh me neither the Jazz are in a uh peculiar place they have some good young to mid-age players but they are not getting no bigname free agents uh when was the last time they got a top tier free agent you're they don't like you right they're not they're not a free agent ation so they do have to develop and that's why you see them hold on to so many pieces or even make some trades where there's a little head scratching at first but it puts them in a position to maybe move some of that talent I still think John Collins sh was a mistake though yeah that John Collins that bro I said from jump to to trade for John Collins for a second round pick to me like I I just didn't like the front Court mix um I still think his overall decision making isn't that great I'm just kind of down on what John Collins can be I think he's still an NBA player yeah but I just don't view him as a part of the as his present direction if you ask me to me I think John Collins needs to be on a team with a head coach that sees his skill set and has a clear defined role as far as when you're out there this is what I want you to do and he hasn't really been on that type of Team yet and you know we'll see what happens with John Collins how do you feel about the the first I know I mentioned Kyle filipos he's a guy that I like I think they got really good talent at drafting where they did in the second round but two first round picks here and Isaiah ker and also Cody Williams here who aren't shaped up to be start starters in their rookie years but are definitely part of their future especially Isaiah Coler is like a pit bull at that point guard position um how do you feel about those two guys and what we can expect from them in their rookie season I think Cody Williams is very interesting obviously being related to jaylen's a plus obviously but seeing what his strengths could be at the next level is huge um it's important to get tweener types like that because those guys normally can translate at a high level especially considering like his background and obviously his tie to Jaylen I do think he could be a pretty productive basketball player I think a defensive gritty focus with size and length is what they're aiming for around Lori and that makes sense it just makes me it's hard to believe that Lor Markin is really the guy they're GNA try to build this around but I think Lor is a very good player so yeah it's either that or you just go broke for like four years five years and they would much rather try to compete and then calm down and they get a high draft pick this could be a team that randomly gets flag just because oh wow the balls went our way cool yeah I mean and if they do that they'll at least be bringing them into a situation where they have role players and they're not he's not necessarily going to a team that bought him out which would be crazy to see if that ends up being the case um yeah the Jazz watch the what the Jazz do closer to the trade deadline I think is that's going to tell us everything how we need to feel about them on the second half of this season like you said competitive they're going to be in some games they're going to there's going to be every year there's that what that 8 to 10 game stretch of lar marketing where he looks like a top 15 play in the league bro yeah and then it just it just falls off after that so you know we'll see what happens there um one last team to get to here before we end up wrapping up gifted the Portland Trailblazers or else is how I like to refer to them as Portland Trail Blazers rebuild and trade possibilities Brooklyn Nets West no literally literally that's what they are no like no [ __ ] a lot of people said last year the N were hard to watch the Portland Trailblazers were harder to watch for me cuz a lot a lot of the time their guards were injured I watched Delano banson go for 38 and eight I watched that no [ __ ] I watch theano banon get traded from from the Toronto Raptors to the Blazers and start hooping um however I will say this I do think the Blazers are interesting because they got Denny Denny is a player that to me is one of the like most kept secrets in the NBA for sure yeah because no one really talks about him his role never really materialized in DC and just when he started to really figure some things out DC trades him to Portland also scoot Henderson I think he's way better than what I saw last year because holy [ __ ] what we saw last year was Far like like bro we got to be honest and I'm fine to do this again I am not a draft expert Hayes knows way more about the college level than I do but the common sentiment was scoot Henderson is going to be a generational player we're just not talking about scoop because wemi is in the same draft right that's what that's what people said Jordan was crazy to draft Brandon Miller over Scoot and last year Brandon Miller cleared scoot by far not even it wasn't like like not listen scoo was one of the worst players in in the League last year but I'm not giving up on you want to know why because you can say the same thing about a rookie or sophomore season Garland Darius Garland was also awful his first you know two years and then he turned into what Darius Garland Allstar caliber type of guard so to me scoot Henderson needs to have a development in his shooting I think the passing is there I think the turnovers sometimes are kind of iffy but I like the profile of the young guys I'm praying that they do something with this Anthony Simon [ __ ] are they goingon to trade him or just keep all these guards it's a weird team also DeAndre Aiden like are you a man or not I don't know cuz like he was ass for the entire year yeah man he couldn't make it to a game because his driveway got completely frozen over but then after that point he was hooping he was playing very good basketball at the end of the season when [ __ ] didn't matter no more so what version of DeAndre Aiden are we getting I don't know I got questions hay I do I mean listen listen you look at the the last three months of the Season DeAndre Aiden I'm sorry last two months of the Season DeAndre Aiden averaged 13 points I'm sorry 13 points 23 points 12 rebounds and and over a block per game that's good that's really good good he did that for March and April can we get that from you for a full season DeAndre can can we get that right but a reason why I call them Brooklyn Nets West as well isn't just the talent and the fact of how bad they can be this is also another team to watch out for as far as who do they move at the trade deadline because I look at it and I say this you got Anthony Simons that could be moved you got Jeremy Grant you got DeAndre Aon and then there was an article that came out I think last night that said that they're actually the that the Portland Trailblazers are getting more call uh trade calls on on Time Lord than DeAndre so that's another player that could be moved as well so they got four players that could absolutely help teams as they look to go on their run on the second half of the Season that the the Portland Trailblazers couldn't look to move so I I like you bringing up Rob will because I think Rob will is a guy that we completely forget about because for the majority of last year he was hurt right Rodwell is interesting cause the durability makes a lot of people give up on him but when he was on the court dude was good dude was good for Boston but that that was literally over a calendar year ago so I get people not being as high on them but bro imagine if the Knicks trade for Robert Williams that's good yeah that'll be great for them like there there are legitimate teams to where they need like a backup big or whatever to play minutes and Robert Williams could absolutely do that at a high level on a title Contender because we saw him do it on a team that went to the finals with his defense in the front court it's just how healthy can he be that's the question to me and the thing is too I look at Robert Williams and like when you see the way that the contracts are going and don't make no mistake about it I think over the last two two seasons combined he's played like maybe 30 games if I'm if I'm not mistaken there 41 games in two seasons as he played so uh not to undercut him there but you look at that contract like it's a mid-level exception basically now it's a 12.4 million contract that's the mid-level exception now if I'm a team that if he's healthy at the trade deadline and I need some defense Nicks are a perfect team that you mentioned there a great and it's $12 million and he only has one season left after this season that's not a like even with the risk of him not being on the court that's not a bad one in my opinion yeah like I I am specifically looking at teams that are like some pieces away the biggest question on the Knicks is how consistent is their front Court going to be I'm assuming Randle is going to play a much more expanded role where he's gonna have to play five at times for that team but adding Rob will who literally his profile is is a Nicks player grittiness shot blocking toughness rebound like that's what Robert Williams can provide For You especially as a RoR looking to block shots around a basket to me it just screams Nick because they also don't have many assets to give up and I think he's the right guy to where because of his injuries you might not have to give up much at all to get him you know yeah I mean yeah I mean you look at and and you very well could um and the Knicks it's not like they don't they don't have picks that they that they can give up on it they have quite a bit of picks in next year's draft actually they have uh their own pi which they could could look to move they also have a a top 12 protected pick from the Detroit Pistons so they got some picks that they can that they can look to move so and if you're the Blazers it's like okay we don't have to trade Robert Gams but at the end of the day if we are this young team he's a injury-prone player if there's any value you can get from him you have to get it at some point so you know yeah we'll see there man um but yeah Portland TR blers is definitely a team that I think is going to be in the Cooper flag sweep sakes I also think they're going be trading off a lot of their Pieces by the trade deadline and we'll see what happens there man but uh that's the Northwest division any any thoughts coming out of this this is this is such an interesting division because they have such a different every team here like of course you got the Thunder the nuggets and the timber wolves that all trying to compete for a title but then the Jazz are a team that could go either way the Portland trebl is a team that's clearly tanking um yeah I guess my question would be is what happens if scoot Henderson has another bad year at least they own their own first round picks that's fair I mean I guess that's something that you're looking at and saying like I mean technically they owe a first round pick to the Chicago Bulls but it's Lottery protected meaning that the Bulls wouldn't get it unless they make the playoffs and we all know the Portland Trailblazers aren't making the playoffs in the next five years so uh that's not a concern there so I mean if sco Henderson does end up being a bust yeah it sucks that you that that pick would would that you ended up wasting but luckily you own your own first round pick so it's not the end of the world but you know it is what it is you could have had you could have I mean I don't know what to say there bro I hope not man because again I thought scoot had a lot of moments where okay he's starting to figure things out yeah but the injuries and all that really impacted his first year I believe next year he'll look better but man I don't know man this whole division very interesting there there's a lot of teams that can really go in either type of Direction a lot of teams are trying to be bad on purpose to get high value draft picks and Cooper flag is gonna probably end up on one of these teams right like yeah Cooper and Brooklyn make sense if scoot Henderson can be a very good player Scoot and Cooper make sense right also what DeAndre a trade value could be if he balls out this time in the first two months yeah H yeah I mean this is a team that could have a lot of assets we could see uh I just uh listen I hope this scoot works out for them scoot is a player that I like I liked his uh tenacity and things like that he finished the season uh last two months of the Season averaging 14.9 points in March 19.4 uh points in April so there's some signs of him turning things around also 18 points in February he only played four games in February though that's that's injuries but like first stay healthy and then let's see development and um also I have some doubts about Chi as a head coach there but you know I won't make those judgments yet I mean I've had us doubts for for like a while now um it's a bit weird because they're a young team so I think cha is going to be giv Grace which I think is fair they are a very young team but I just don't see much hope in Portland outside of the draft and just seeing some players develop because again a lot of these players are really trade bait I think the only player that's like untouch is really Henderson but everyone else can go you think you think Sharp's I forgot about sharp no no sharp is the other player though those are the two players that they probably don't want to trade but I'm gonna be honest if you're trying to develop sharp then you have to trade Simons I like I would really consider doing it because again you just went through a decade plus right of Dame and CJ as your back court that as good as they were ultimately they were never amongst the elite of the elite to where they had a chance at all to win and in my opinion you should learn from that hey maybe this small back court [ __ ] doesn't really work out well normally and it's harder overall to build around to me maximizing his current value with Simons even though he gets hurt a lot as well could really get you some more value back to build around those two guys and then whoever else comes through in the lottery if they get Cooper flag it's up also Denny Avia right whatever Denny can become in the proper role which I hope to God he's utilized on this team in the proper role that could be big for them I love them trading basically nothing to get him that was big to me yeah and and you look at it now like if you do trade Simons which I think you you should do while his value is high and he still is a fairly young player himself at only 25 years old but even if you do that you still you have scoot at the one your future that you're hoping that you have more clarity on that going forward you got Shaden sharp there as your two you got Denny as your potential three going forward if you can add Cooper flag to those guys oh and you drafted Donovan kingan this past draft I forgot they got kingan too right that gives you a nice core that you can look at and say hey we don't know how many of these guys are going to be pieces that we can build around around but at least we're trying to build with them right now to see what we have so yeah I realistically don't think Aiden is going to go anywhere as mid as he is sometimes because of that reason because if you have Aiden and Clingan you have something in the works I would say to build around and if Aiden can actually realize himself Aiden and Scoot can make a lot of sense it really could so I get it but his motor gives me a lot of questions honestly yeah you gotta question his love like how much he actually loves basketball I do question it yeah and that that's something that I think is one of the worst questions that you would have that you can ask about a professional player in any sport how much do they actually love it because that's the last thing you should ask of yeah because if you have those questions on that that opens up a whole new can of worms that just puts you in a situation where you're just like God damn it like and unfortunately he's getting money he's getting paid and you got to deal with it at this point so is what it is is what it is so yeah we're gonna have to see what shakes up with Portland um hey I would say out of these teams which one do you think is the most interesting to monitor for this upcoming season Most interesting Northwest Division team to monitor um I mean from a winning aspect I think the OKC Thunder I think that they could be such a special team this season um and then from a a standpoint of like what's the next phase of their roster definitely Utah Jazz yeah the Jazz are are are a very interesting team um I would say for me I honestly think the team that I'm going to probably monitor the most is probably Brooklyn just because of the amount of good players they have that are going to be fire sailed and also knowing how bad the team is going to be like I think Brooklyn is fascinating just because if they get Cooper flag in one season that means they went from KD and Kyrie had a bad two years and they get a generational player right back with their draft picks right back by trading a role player for seven first round picks to me Brookland could be riding the biggest Underdog swing thing where we saw sign the two biggest free agents of our franchises history and we had the most hall of fame generational pivot we've ever seen in front office half that's why they really fascinate me oh yeah yeah if you're talking about generally around the NBA like yeah the Brooklyn Nets and where they can go with this roster uh it just hey if they get if they get lottery luck if they get flag it's up because at that point like you have you've you've done so much turnover with your roster you've wound up with a player that many people think could be a generational Talent um and then it's just how they build and then if you do let's say the Brooklyn Nets get Cooper flag yeah this this draft Yeah you still have so many first round picks that are coming up that you you could be in a situation not I won't say similar to the OKC Thunder because you're not going to be as good as them right away but like as far as you have so much weight lateral movement that you can do as far as what you want to do with your roster because the asses do you want to if Cooper flag comes in and we're talking about byye two Co Cooper flag looks like a guy that's like oh no he's ready to try to start pushing teams for playoff contention now you can move some of those picks bring in some some Talent that's ready to go now and then off to the races potentially yeah and I do want to say this I do want to watch more Cooper flag it's I might have OD take about Cooper I think he's good but I'm not sure if he's like a wemy do you want my hot take you want myot take on that yeah um my hot take on Cooper flag is that he's going to be a good player don't make no mistake about it and I think defensively think is what makes him more special than anything else watching him defensively but I think Discussion on upcoming NBA draft prospects that we're seeing Cooper flag not to say that he's not a good player but as far as the the level that he's being talked about is because the league is ready for the next Great White Hope honestly I I don't think that's wrong I don't think that's the wrong thing to say um there's a player that interest me more than Cooper flag and this is for for sure a hot take I don't even know if he's in the same year because again I don't keep up with you know high school as much AJ is a Hooper yeah I think he's very good like I watched him play a couple of games overseas and I'm like damn physical hard body athletic really like he seems very interesed I'm not sure what year he is though I think he would be the 2026 draft I'm not mistaken okay word up okay yeah I think I think he'd be 2026 draft but there are a lot of player like of course Ace Bailey is I think a ace Bailey Ace Bailey's nice I heard too he he's nice hella nice in this draft Dylan Harper is the one that I think is starting to get overlooked as well but um yeah so there's there's quite a bit of players in here that I really do think in this draft that uh and that's why you see a lot of teams kind of trying to figure out what they're going to do with the roster because there's a lot of players that I think could be um I think I told said it before here if not I'll bring it back here the player that I say could be the underrated I'd say he has a chance to be top three players coming out this draft but he's probably not going to go until almost middle Lottery Hugo Gonzalez out of I remember I remember remember name off our podast y I am telling you guys watch out if I know I'm 18 years old he'll be 19 when he's drafted I'm telling you guys right now look out for hug go Gonzalez in next year's draft and two years whatever down the road I think he has the one of the opportunities to be one of the best players to come out of this draft Yeah Hayes put me h on our pod and I looked him up no he's nice I actually I actually like aot I'm not going to lie he's nice he could develop he can definitely develop I feel like for sure yeah and that's all it takes all the wrong if he goes to the right situation the right Coach and he's given an opportunity in the green light to work it out and they have the right development around him I'm telling you Hugo Gonzalez I think he has the chance to be one of the best players in this draft for sure so yeah well we'll see how that all pans out overall but I think by next week we should have the PCO results are you debating tomorrow no I don't think there is one if there they haven't given me my topics so if if I'm yeah I was about to say if I'm debating tomorrow and I still win y'all I'm the goat at that point I'm telling y'all so yeah I no we won't yeah we I don't think we'll have uh you know what I think we're before you because I got my topic so mine's is on the 14th on Sunday okay yeah I don't unless sent it to me today I don't have it yet yeah yours is probably the Wednesday after mine okay yeah so okay fair so y'all stay in tuned with that man make sure Closing thoughts on PCL debates and outro y'all checking out the PCL it's a great debate series gifted is cooking over there I'm telling y'all man this man gifted is a n don't let the nice face fool you bro the dude's nasty bro he's mean I'm telling you the dude's nasty bro I'm telling you like I haven't felt the way in a minute where like I was just so like listen bro R was trying to joke I was trying to joke I I I wasn't say lock in bro that was crazy that [ __ ] was crazy I said it when you showed up with the all black and the turtleneck bro I was like oh yeah that was all purposeful that was all that was all purposeful bro I'm like I need to tap into this this this like darker F Focus side did you have on black forces too while you was debating bro listen I had on all black I had on black black shorts I had on black I was locked I swear to you I was locked I was locked bro real man that is funny man um but yeah man gift's been on a hell of a run y'all make sure y go support this man he debates this Friday y'all make sure y'all go out and show out for him man but uh this is from the logo thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of from the logo man we will be back next Tuesday as when the season gets back starting which we're what 40 40 something days away from the season opening up we'll be back to three uh three days a week uh one day a week from now so you catch us every Tuesday at this time man but guys thank you so much for tuning in make sure y'all go support gifted over at gifted Hoops as well he's been killing it going team by team bro the fact that you took on that undertaking all 30 teams that's crazy bro bro two years in a row we did rpod um I had to reset my entire setup so I had to to basically OS reinstall I had to redownload Elgato stream deck the lighting uh OBS I lost Premiere Pro I had to like go figure that out so I had to put the podcast on on Hiatus but essentially yeah bro every team I'm like I think I'm like 12 teams away from being done with the entire project so we working up for sure we cooking that's what's up y'all make sure I go support him there man you guys can follow me at CEO Hayes man we'll see you guys next week right here from the logo hopefully we got ZZ backed in we talking about even more of the PCL and another Massacre by Gifted Man I'm calling it right now man we out here have a going y'all