super listener West Coast Jewish Chris writes in loved loved loved the Deep dive into the magnificence of rod karo's red headband but Rabbi I was a little surprised that during the last episode you didn't mention anything about Rodney Klein's conversion to Judaism well right you are Chris I didn't and uh I went back and double checked and um listen I have a confession to make and I'm as surprised as you to say this Rod Karu not Jewish you know all my life I thought Rodney Rodney Klein he converted I know that he was married to to his wife first wife Marilyn for a long time she was Jewish but like Adam Sandler said OJ Simpson not a Jew but guess who is Hall of Famer aan Karu he converted I like Sandler like you thought Karu was Jewish but it turns out Karu actually never converted quick word on conversion so Judaism is both a religion and a people so there's a religious conversion that involves uh taking on religious practices religious responsibilities religious commitments and there is uh the peoplehood part which I think is best understood as um kind of like a natural naturalization someone who immigrates and becomes a citizen probably the best way to understand the peoplehood part is is this naturalization as an analogy so you become uh you take on the religion and you take on the the peoplehood and uh always among the Jewish people there always people who who are let say Jewish adjacent people who uh actually all the way back in the time of the Bible and the days of the Torah there people who were not Jewish but would would live among the Jewish people and still to this day uh huge number of families in North America are multifaith families um lots of folks in our congregation are of course and and really for all intents of purposes uh we're their spiritual Community even if they're not Jewish it's we their their spiritual home so so Rod Karu was very much like this during his marriage to Maryland they were longtime members of Temple Beth Shalom in Santa in Orange County all those years with the angels and Karu was quoted as saying you know that he really embraced uh Jewish Heritage and Jewish Traditions he went to many many bar and B Mitzvah and Passover saders and high holidays and Hanukkah but he actually never converted Karu was born in Panama and raised in New York and and because of his upbringing Karu is quoted as saying that he could really relate to the struggles of the Jewish people but he did not and he does not consider himself Jewish he considers himself a Christian and a Panamanian and has a beautiful quote in a in a autobiography he wrote not long ago called one tough out Karu writes a prayer to God is a prayer to God whether it's said in a synagogue where in a yamaka or bareheaded in a church to which is say Rodney Klein amen the amain one God one mountain lots of paths up that mountain but they all strive to reach the same thing which I believe is a life of meaning