Around The Horn - 09.27.2005

[Music] you're looking at four of America's most ticklish Sports Riders and today c-h-a-d dun dun dun Return of the Swiss cheese defense for the Chiefs and LSU's Rocky finish that put the balls on top there's 10 topics but just one winner one time [Music] it's around the horn presented by Nissan here's Tony reali all right welcome back to the show that scores the argument let's say hello to our national panel a returning champ in the city of Boston espn.com's Michael Smith I had a full day to think about it Tony and I have nothing clever to say but then again why does that make this different from any other day right all right we got the point trying to knock him off at the LA Times Tony would you like to tickle my monkey oh that didn't say oh it's a mute right there on the road in Detroit city today Jay Marriott is the all-time wins leader in this program it's time to win on the road I'm not trying to have any of that and live from New York the pizzas Woody page I pulled a hamstrings guys let's make it happen right now j-e-t-s gulp gulp gulp New York's worst fears realized yesterday when Chad Pennington was lost for this season with a torn rotator cuff second straight year with shoulder problems for him and after a quick perusal of The Usual Suspects the team today sign once in future green head Vinnie Testaverde who had been residing at Del Boca Vista gentlemen we all know this is a team that plays to win the game do you foresee much winning with Vinnie at QB let's start out with Michael Smith that's the question I think they will with many Testaverde or with Brooks Bolinger or whoever they play a quarterback and here's why with Chad Pennington I like Chad don't get me wrong we're not talking about a special quarterback this isn't like Atlanta losing Michael Vick or Indianapolis losing Peyton Manning Chad Pennington is an average NFL quarterback let's let's be real about it so when you're talking about the New York Jets in the winter they play football they're going to win with whoever is under center turning around handing the ball off the number 28 Curtis Martin they're going to win with defense and John Abraham is playing as well as anybody in the league everybody's sweats the right Dwight Freeney but Abraham is playing like a man possessed they're going to win out defensive special teams keeping games close and playing to win the game at the end their quarterback position does not require a guy with a big arm they're not they're not trying to win so let me get this straight Michael what you're saying is the Jets in the AFC can win with Vinnie testaverdi or Brooks they can win about nine games with this team that's supposed to Constitution yes Woody page what do you think well Michael I loved that argument I thought you made so much sense but let me give you a few things to consider how about at Baltimore at Buffalo at Atlanta against Tampa Bay if you looked at the schedule you'd see they're going to lose the next four games how are they going to win nine games how are they going to be a factor in the division how are they going to be a second wild card team they got no chance to even finish the season they might as well call it quits right there Marriott go ahead what are you talking about this guy wasn't in any training camp he had to pick up the phone and call them they didn't call him come on they're going to stack the the line against Curtis Martin and they're deep they've been doing that brave about Smith their defense has been very inconsistent remember week one they were fighting on the sideline that team is cooked take it from me reality bad quarterbacking situations unfortunately this kid's career may be over but we'll get to that in a second all right you know what you have to do you can't sit there as an organization and say we're gonna tank it and hope for Matt Leinart because they have too much talent there to do that they have a responsibility in New York all right they're done they go ahead no there's no point in beating mediocre that's the worst thing it could be right now and I think when Testaverde gets up to speed speed being relative term right here I think they can win a few games just enough to keep them out of the matliner Derby they're not going to the playoffs though Michael Smith here's the problem you want to be in the derby you want to get mad liner you need to start thinking long-term replacing now this is the second time paying attention again so you need to work on finance do we think that's why I pray Brooks Bollinger who oh well enough of Brooks paulinger they have any testivity they're going to play Benny testaverdi do we think the Jets future is with Chad Pennington Michael Smith you think he can be their quarterback for the future well financially he's going to be the be on the team I mean to give him 23 million dollars and bonuses last year a 64 million dollar contract what a mistake it looks like that was but they have to start looking long term and figuring out they can get a young guy in there to start developing maybe give Chad one more shot Woody Paige what a problem in New York physician said this morning that the second time you have this sort of injury very diminished arm strength he didn't have much arm strength to begin with accidentally fear of having another one no he's not the future they have got to that reactively if this is a serious injury Chad's career is probably over you have to try to keep winning with veterans but somewhere in the draft next year you've got to find a Young quarterback and groom this kid to eventually start that's where the donde why not try to find Matt leinert then yeah anytime you're on a first name basis with the people in Dr James Andrews office that's a bad news it's quick and easy to say Matt leiner today adanda who knows when the Jets are drafting next season don't forget this was a team that went into the playoffs won a game last year was a play away from going to the AFC Championship game with Quincy Carter lasted a plan well it was Pennington at the end of the season now over to last night's Monday Night beatdown Broncos all over the Chiefs sorry about that Chief Denver with a 30-10 win return of El Matador defense from KC brings the Chiefs back to the pack in the AFC West tied with the Bronx at 2-1 San Diego is one and two and the Raiders are over so fellas here's a question with Endless Possibilities what do you like in this division Woody page what do you like well who's laughing at me today go ahead laugh at me I mean the Denver Broncos showed you last night why I thought this was a Super Bowl team before the season started if summer plays under control limits limits his turnovers gets outside the pass rush he throws great on the Run they got their running game back last night did you see Rod Smith did you see that defense Trevor price who was one of the best defensive linemen in the league a couple years ago was hurt last year was a dominating Force last night those former Cleveland Browns rejects played well you've got a team with the best set of linebackers fast linebackers overall in the entire league they exposed the Chiefs the Chiefs still cannot stop the running game that was the problem last year we're going to stop your running game right now Don they go ahead who do you like in the game stop running your mouth Woody I'm not going with the Broncos Woody you're probably jumping around your apartment you're so excited about your Broncos you probably didn't even notice that Champ Bailey went down to hamstring injury and his shoulders hurting him that's going to affect their secondary you can talk about one week linebackers or your defensive alignment whatever the secondary he's going to be hurt for a while that's going to happen so who do you like so what happens when someone I like the Chargers with the running game it's all about steps to run the NFL what happens when you take away the run from the Broncos then you put the ball in the hands of Jake Plummer every time I see him it reminds me of that weather forecasting term cone of uncertainty that's what a Jake Plummer pass is like all right Michael Smith go ahead adanda you might like the charges but I'm sure if you looked at their schedule you wouldn't like the schedule then before in the next four weeks they play three of the finalists from last year two of them on the road they're coming to New England this week and then they got Philadelphia and they go to Pittsburgh I mean listen guys this schedule for San Diego is murderous okay and look at this division Denver every single year is always there we like to talk about oh Mike Shanahan has a one with John L well since John Elway retired and all Jake Palmer is not a good quarterback in this state of them but every single year Denver makes the playoffs and they get blown up by Indianapolis but that's not the point they'll witness the witness division they already gotta run in game what are you talking about they got fast linebackers Billy's is tougher cornerback as there is this team has too much talent they'll be there so you do agree that you agree with Woody page then you realize that I do yeah all right sorry for you go ahead Marriott you know he who uh thinks that Jake Plummer is a good quarterback is going to have his heart broken how many times have we seen Plummer have three interception games he'll play great Monday night for 400 yards when he's running out of the pocket and look terrific the next game he'll throw four interceptions I don't trust this guy I don't trust the Broncos anymore the Chiefs have Run problems against the Run no doubt about it defensively Trent green is not the quarterback he was a couple of years ago tomes looks like he's getting old I go with the donde I agree that if you get the ball to LT LaDainian Tomlinson even though they have a tough schedule I like that running game against especially against Kansas City and San Diego win it about 10. back to you wood man well let me ask the two people who picked the San Diego Chargers okay who did the Chargers lose to last week the Denver Broncos and would you trust a guy who would tell you Chargers while he is standing in front of a shower curtain in his motel room I don't believe you Mariana all right I do the a questioning here and here's the question now let's talk about these Kansas City Chiefs what happened to this defense looked great for two weeks and it died last night Michael Smith what's going on well again it's very early in the season I wouldn't write off Kansas City's defense they're going to be better but they're not going to be the 85 Bears overnight Denver runs on everybody and especially Kansas City when Kansas city is in Denver one last thing about Denver they wilted into Miami Heat they opened a game that's a better team than their record indicates all right I've done their last word yeah we've seen the Chargers are not the Colts when it comes to improved defense and Michael if you want to play the Patriots this week coming off the big win in their first game without matlight Rodney Harrison this is the time to do it very good point we're going to take a quick commercial break when we come back I'm back with Buyers sell and coming up the Pats lose a key ingredient to that winning formula Marlins play the blame game and and involuntary choke job stick around the horn presented by Nissan who reminds you to shift the way you move through the world and in part by Garnier Fructis for hair that shines with all its strengths [Music] another season another defensive back loss for the year with injury this time Pro Bowl safety Rodney Harrison he gone with three throwing ligaments in his left knee Harrison had started every game for the Pats since joining the team in 2003 guys buy or sell the Patriots being able to overcome this injury this year donde I'm buying this system system remember this is the team that overcame the injury to its starting quarterback franchise player Drew Bledsoe and wound up winning the Super Bowl that year he used something to that by the name Brady something like that yeah we got what you're doing there go ahead Marriott you know what I'll buy that they win the division because remember the Jets have problems Miami isn't that good buffalo has problems with its Young quarterback as well but Tony in the big picture you're not only losing great football players and Harrison and brewski but great emotional leaders they cannot overcome that they've got injuries on the offensive line I'm gonna sell that they win the Super good man well I I The Producers didn't quite put this code really properly but I I will buy that the Patriots will be fine since what I lovingly like to call the Janet Jackson super bowl there are seven different people on defense that are new there's only four remaining defensive starters from two Super Bowls ago so they continue to put in new pieces but they're not going to reach the Super Bowl this all right and the producers say mute you go ahead Michael Smith I'm gonna buy the pets overcoming this Marriott I'm surprised that's your first time ever talking about New England and not saying the word Belichick I was looking for that the fact is the coaches they don't just coach the starters they coach the backups this is what they do tie law goes down last year they plug in Randall gay let me educate you at the front seven puts pressure on the quarterback then the secondary won't have to cover as long they'll be fine the education of Michael Smith next up our boom goes the dynamite story of the day the Florida Marlins have lost four straight and wild card hopes are just about done and boom goes to Dinah matardo AJ Burnett said packing after some critical comments last week Miguel Cabrera benched for disciplinary reasons and then there's manager Jack McKeon not expected to be back in 2006. guys buy or sell this year's Marlin's disappointment as mckean's fault Marriott I know Mike Lowe's had a rough year he's hitting 237 and Pierre has not been getting on base the way he should but come on Tony 2003 I saw that team coming to Chicago they were fun they were loose they went to the Yankee Stadium won it all what happened now they're up tight that's the manager's fault higher Lou Panella so you saw that team in 2003 else saw that team go ahead oh I'm I'm buying it also when McCann took over in Florida he was the right man for the right job at that right time but now that time has passed that man has been passed by and that team still has a lot of talent if it's pushed in the right direction they were in the middle of a pennant race and McKeon let go Burnett shouldn't have been the guy who was dismissed McCann should have been pushed aside all right save the rest for your book go ahead Michael Smith this guy should be dismissed from this show you gotta sell this two years ago the guy comes in and the Marlins win the World Series now all of a sudden you'll know what he's doing Burnett goes 0-6 down a stretch and that's his fault I mean the injuries to the entire lineup Pierre Mike Lord what happened to those guys you tell me that's the manager that's not the manager's fault that team is floating man go ahead of donde yeah I'm selling come on what do you would know of all people that a couple years doesn't make an old guy suddenly irrelevant went 0-6 not as false Bullpen as a 4.83 era it's not his fault as everyone has to said Lowell is going out if Burnett wants pets on the back like he said try winning some games I'm sure DonTrell Willis gets plenty of pets on the back I'm sure you have a witty retort for a Don day no he doesn't he's not work what do you mean I don't of course I do all right enough everybody next up we go to college I wish talking about last night's Affair in Baton Rouge come from behind win for Tennessee who had volunteered a 24 Point deficit at halftime a loss snatched from the jaws of victory for the hometown tigers lsq outscored 30-6 in the second half in overtime all right guys what's your buying Stern comeback for Tennessee or LSU gag job Woodrow well I'd love to buy the Tennessee had a great comeback I went to school Philip Fulmer and he couldn't have done it it was a gag job by LSU here was a team the Bayou Bengals who had to ball within the 10-yard line with time running out in first half you kicked the field goal you throw the ball in the end zone you do anything but you don't let the clock stop it was LSU gagging at the end of the first half shouldn't have been again and the clock stops on that argument what he cut it down we keep things moving here Michael Smith go yeah but what is absolutely right that was a total gag job by my LSU Tigers never in the history of Tiger stadium has LSU ever given up a 21 point lead at halftime Tennessee couldn't score they went 17 positions at one point without scoring a touchdown they totally gave that game away can't believe it I'm buying this as a win for the Tennessee Volunteers they made the quarterback change brought in Clawson he was more effective than the age was and you saw LSU Tigers just wore down there they couldn't tackle they were having trouble keeping up gas them for air here came the volunteers playing in front of that hostile crowd is a mostly charged first big game in Louisiana after Hurricane Katrina they overcame all that the heat the cramping one give them credit for co-ed Mariotti now there was great emotion in that stadium and LSU and Les Miles the coach did not feed off that uh second half 21-0 lead you can't get the field goal unit in to make it 24-nothing then they went very conservative in the second half only two field goals and they lost the game Les Miles the coach lost again all right first cut time and it's time to drop a little dead weight and I mean that with the utmost respect Michael Smith that man is you today any last words yesterday I got nothing but love and today you got nothing Michael Smith goes home the arrest of you guys remains seated around the horn goes deeper next and coming up would you believe progress baseball's fight against steroids conversation that will surely get a rise at a Marriott if you stick around do that thing I like it's around the horn presented by Nissan all right two rounds are in the books and years how they stand on the Woody page you're in the lead with 21 points Jay marriotti's um what do I want to say here um bring it up bring it here with 20 points Michael Smith they got nothing but love for you but love don't get you through today he gone [Applause] MLB players Association said on Monday it's all for a stiffer penalty for first time steroid offenders liking 20 games instead of the currently agreed upon softball of 10 days plenty though still falling short of commissioner selig's proposed plan of Fiddy so the league said the player's proposal was unacceptable but at least they're talking guys time to play negotiator and it's a question with literally Endless Possibilities how many games in your opinion for a first-time offender Marriott I like Bud selig's playing 50 games do you realize reality at the Olympics the world anti-doping agency won a fence and you're out for two years I think Bud's playing with 50 games is an effective deterrent how dare this player's Union with all the dirt in their house Palmero and eight other players testing positive this year how dare they try to narrow this down and negotiate it down all of America everybody's on the side finally of Bud selig I hope that bud the commissioner does not turn into Bud Light and get wishy-washy here stand firm bud we're with you for a change what a man well I I think that it's clear that I'm totally opposed to steroids like everyone else here but I think 10 or 20 games is not an issue what the issue is what we saw with palmeiro he was totally humiliated totally embarrassed probably won't play the game again I think that's more important than 10 games or 20 games I think what is critical here is the second and third offenders that when that happens that might be the first time would be a one-year suspension and then the third time you're caught that would be a lifetime ban so the first time doesn't bother me as much because we're uncertain about the testing we know that there's humiliations plan go ahead of Dante yeah Woody Palmero was humiliated afterward but obviously he was not deterred enough to use the steroids in the first place so you need a stronger deterrent at least half the season I think why stop at 50 games obviously this is all about just keeping Congress off baseball's back you don't want to see a bunch of All-Stars dragged onto Capitol Hill again like that scene we had in March so celix is trying to capitulate the Congress just to keep them happy and I think it's worthwhile we do not want to see another embarrassing scene like that you also need to do something to change this pharmaceutical culture then it goes baseball even if they're walking around with legal stuff in their syringes everyone's trying to get an edge if it's if it's going to cost you half a season or more it's not worth pushing the line pushing the envelope because we all know the crooks are ahead of the cops in this game John McCain wins three strikes and you're out I respect the man he's absolutely right Congress needs to keep the pressure on all right good conversation and now it's time to eliminate somebody from this good conversation to donate very well played not enough points today sorry to say you have to go home I'm not done conversating let's go conversate with yourself I mean I think that's gonna be all right the dream is over for a Don day Showdown Mariotti and Paige two men enter and one man embarrasses himself less gummy up Shield versus mother nature and the trumpster's next Apprentice stick around the horn presented by Nissan who reminds you to shift the way you move through the world and in part by Sheraton Hotels and Resorts visit charity.com for best rates guaranteed all right Marriott and Paige in Showdown this is for everything let's go Yanks won Sox rained out last night so Boston a half game back in the standings the rain out forces today's double header and seven games in six days Boston also forced to shuffle the pitching rotation Shield was scheduled to pitch yesterday and Saturday against the unit instead today in game 162. guys will the rain help or hurt the Sox Mariotti start us off oh come on that's going to hurt them that's extraordinary pressure to put on a team in the final week of the regular season win a doubleheader plus Randy Johnson goes six Innings last night Wakefield goes today Johnson will be rested against Wakefield on Saturday at only three days rest well let me first of all start with the fact that there have only been 17 double headers in major league baseball this year and the home team has won only five of those in fact so as a result of that it's gonna hurt the Red Sox yes okay that almost made sense when he paid the point goes to Jay Mariotti very well largely next front page news in New York today Donald Trump and his hottie wife Melania are expecting baby could look something like this gentlemen for the game I need you to name the baby Woody paid this is for the game well there are a lot of cheap possibilities like Apprentice or you're fired or Tower or something like that but I think it's very simple you name the baby [Music] all right how am I supposed to respond to that you know of course it's The Apprentice book I could name the kid because of the hair and hope that he comes in season pretty page you're going to get in trouble for saying it but you're going to get the point and you're going to get the win and what does that make you time for the all-time lead Woody page let's see your victory speech after almost three years and over 500 shows to finally reach the Pinnacle to Ty Mariotti I want to thank the ninjas I want to thank the producers I want to thank everybody else I want to thank mariotti's for being such weak me today and mostly I want to thank myself that's enough out of you we're done see you tomorrow afternoon let me thank myself