Mauricio Pochettino to USMNT DEEP DIVE: Targets, release clause, 2026 World Cup & more! | ESPN FC

so Jeff Carlile Casey Keller Julian luron with us to discuss this Now official hiring uh and Jeff I want to start with you because you got a great article over at espn.com that explains kind of how this all came together um from that article what was most impressive most surprising to you about how the US soccer Federation was able to at the end of the day pull this off well I mean I think it was just the level of interest that there was in this particular job I I think that's always been uh a bit of a history just just how attractive this job was and you know to hear uh some of the ussf higher-ups describe it you know they they put their candidates into three buckets I mean you know bucket three was kind of the the kind of candidate they've gone for in the past uh you know bucket two was was kind of a stretch and then bucket one was what they called super stretch and that was the urgen kops of the world and the Mauricio poos of the world as well and um such was the level of Interest uh even in in the tier one bucket uh that they didn't even get through all of the tier 2 candidates so that to me was was a little bit surprising um you know the money was was a little bit surprising as well you know pochettino from from what we're told is going to get uh six million a year but he's also G to get a chunk of money from Chelsea as well I mean he's going to be made whole in the end um and then also just to see the ussf kind of employ uh donors and sponsors to to make up uh the difference as well in terms of money so it really was a team effort um you know the the Federation had hinted prior that you know they they had the money to do this they they this was not going to be an issue where you know they they just couldn't afford their preferred candidate and you know in the end uh they they pulled money from from quite a few buckets and they were able to get this deal done but just the level of interest for me uh was the big surprise herk there's probably not a show out there in fact I know there's not a show out there has criticized the US soccer Federation uh more than this one but you look at it now certainly on the women's side you can say they got the best manager in International Football you can at least try to start and make the argument that on the men's side if you're going off resumés they've got one of if not the best managers um in International Football how much credit we got to give this Federation a men's credit and you're right we've criticized US soccer the US Men's National Team and the women team at times probably more than any other show around or any network around um but we have to give them their flowers when they're deserved they went out and made MAA poino one of the highest paid managers in the world in the international game in the international game if you run the numbers from last World Cup hzi flick no longer around he was the highest and it was about six something and after that it was everybody else here you have maici poino 6 million annually you go around and you look at you know Marcelo Vela 4 million Doral Jr 4 million you just went out and said we want to do something important we have to do something important now the investment and they went out and through Ken Griffin was a CEO of Citadel was a hedge fund do your research if you want there if you guys uh go if you guys know about uh GameStop and all that good stuff great stuff um political backer MH and said hey we need some we need this money can you make it happen and he came through when people asked where would the money come from US soccer found a way and in finding a way you give this team that I think has Rich material the best possible resource to explode said material so we could sit here and and fault them for the many mistakes of the past many mistakes but they completely knocked it out the park on the women's side with Emma Hayes highest paid manager in the world on the women's side best manager in the world I would say and now have done so on the men's side as well so this news has kind of been percolating for a while and Casey I know you've been hesitant to talk about it you said until it was official so now that it's official how much better do you think maricio poao can actually make this US Men's National Team well I think the thing that I really like about this hiring is that it kind of hits the complete reset button that it's there there's not winners and losers in this it's it's it's simply a guy that comes in from a level of experience at the highest level in club football and is then able to use that experience to and and and not with guys oh I coached them at the Youth Level or I did this or no he's coming in and I think it's a complete reset which is what we've seen since the World Cup exactly what the US Men's National Team needs is a complete reset so there's going to be veteran players who maybe won't get the opportunity straight off because they're kind of a known quantity there'll be young players that get opportunities because this manager and his staff are going to have to kind of look a little deep deeper than maybe he's had to look in the past because there's guys that that clearly there's going to be guys in this program that he knows nothing about he's going to be doing a bunch of research I mean the rumor is he's going to be staying in Europe which probably makes the most sense right now in particular because 99% of his his his Squad are playing in Europe and so he's going to have to spend a lot of time going around meeting players watching them and kind of seeing you know kind of what he feels he has to work with because there's been a lot of talk and herk you just alluded to it as well that there's a lot of talent here but let's be honest that Talent has not come to the Forefront in the last or let's just say since the World Cup there was this this thought that there was going to be this step forward well it's been a step back and so now it's going to be up to to pochettino and his staff to see if he can get you know some of that potential onto the pitch in in in the form of results Jules I wonder about the reaction over in Europe especially in England where we know that portino certainly in the last couple weeks was linked to the the national team job what are they saying about this appointment over there and are you at all surprised that he ended up here in this job given the the resume that he has that he shouldn't have maybe gotten a a better job or a club job I mean the reaction here and I did a a BBC Radio Show not that long ago tonight and the question was is this a step back for him or is he a step forward in his own career and I think there was a time where you could look at International Football coming from Club football and thinking okay this is pre-retirement you know and back in the day you could have maybe seen that way I I think in this case and I think the World Cup being on home so in the US was a massive appeal for him I'm not sure if the World Cup had been anywhere else in the world if if he would have taken the job and I supect of all the interest that Jeff mentioned if that was also the main appeal for all those guys from klopp and benitz and zidan and Chavi and T and ran Potter and whoever you want who all in a way or another way connected to this job it was mostly because of the World Cup on homeone because this will be something very very special to experience and to be part of especially if the US men national team does well so that's the first thing personally I don't see as a step back I see more as a step forward or at least something different that P after two let's say disappointing experiences the one at PhD was okayish because he had a front three of Neymar Messi and mbappe and in the end in 18 month he won one French cup and one league league title which is good but we expected more especially in the Champions League and let's please let's not bring the bab and what happened that night I was there and I'm still I still wake up at night having so but and Chelsea was a failure it was not all on him I think he was probably more of a victim of the system at the club and what didn't work at the club but I'm not sure we can put everything that happened in Chelsea in the last year just on portino so I see more as a step forward or something that he wanted to try differently than a step back see Jules that that's why I think it's a it's a step back and a massive gamble if you're maricio portino this isn't you know Hollywood actor who does movies goes to TV type of deal this is a massive gamble after everything you just highlighted if the US Men's National Team experiment doesn't go well for him that that's a blow up in-you face scenario for man poino and the next job what if it does go well well if it does go well he's he's Beyond 2026 right and they're probably bigger national teams who are going to look at him and US Men's National Team will have to protect themselves in that way if he was already on the radar of a England what could come about if he does great things with Casey mentioned a good sense of material but certainly not the most talented in terms of world football if he does well certainly others will be knocking but if things go wrong mhm as the host country for the US man's National Mar pochettino we could be looking at a situation where pochettino is going to be finding it very difficult to find a job yeah you're talking about his future though if we if we focus on his past and kind of the resume and you see the clubs where he's coached and Jules is just going through it there obviously Southampton aside but when you're talking about Spurs when you're talking about Chelsea my gosh when you're talking about what he had at PSG you know he's he has the best players in the world he's coaching the best players in the world Casey he's not going to have the best players in the world when he's manag in the US Men's National Team is that at all a concern for you well I think what he's going to have to really do is he's he's going to have to go back to the days at espol and the days at Southampton where you had you had good squads but you made squads better than what people thought they could be you know obviously Jules mentioned you know the the disappointments at PSG where the idea was was he going to be the guy that was going to finally win the Champions League with the players that he has okay he wasn't able to do that he did some great things at Tottenham look Tottenham was in that situation where they were the seventh or eighth highest payroll and they got them into a Champions League final fighting for League titles qualifying for Champions League you know kind of punching above the weight let's say and I think that's really what I think the US what US soccer is looking forward to is this a guy that can take a good squad and make it a great team or is it a you know we know it's not a guy right now with this squad let's say you go into the fr the French squad or you go into the Brazil squad right now that is struggling and there's an expectation immediately that you can win a World Cup I don't think that's the expectation with this squad the expectation is can you make them better than they've achieved with the players you have and the big difference as we all know between Club football and and International Football I can't go sign 10 players from 160 different countries I have what I have who have passports and I have to make the best of who's available for me at that point in time and I think some of the difficulties at Chelsea you know some of the the political stuff dealing with Daniel Levy at Tottenham you know some of the stuff that that obviously happened to him at at Chelsea and PSG he'll have to kind of dive into the difficulties of some of these last couple years I think to really you know take the most out of a squad that is you know significantly different you know based on Talent level again if you're the the manager of the French Squad you have a different talent pool to choose from with the US team maybe somebody's not playing in their club team but they're still the best option for you with the national team that isn't necessarily the case with the probably the top 10 to 15 countries in the world uh Jeff to the case that uh Casey is is making there about the expectations that the Federation might have obviously you shell out 6 million bucks a year you'd assume there'd be some big expectations what do you get a sense are the expectations for what maricio boino will be able to do with this team from the Federation side well I think at minimum it's to make the quarterfinals of a World Cup um you know basically the squad made it to the round of 16 in in Qatar uh and the expectation was that okay they're going to take the next step they're they're going to they're going to grow they're going to be more cohesive as a team some new guys are going to come through and on home soil they're going to at least make a quarterfinal I mean there was talk during Greg berhalter's reign of even making a semi-final you know going further than than any team had gone before at least in the modern era so yeah I think that's the expectation um it is an expanded World Cup so there's a round of 32 um uh game that they're going to have to navigate um you know and then they'll have to win two knockout games which is something that uh you know that that that would certainly be a new territory in the modern era so I would say those are the expectations but also you know to grow this team to to to dip into the youth national teams and and try to have an impact there as well I mean I'm not saying he's going to be managing those squads or those camps on a day-to-day basis but I I think there is an expectation that he is going to be able to help uh set a direction uh at those lower levels and and make for a little bit more cohesive style of play now we've been hearing that for an awful long time it seems like every new manager that comes in they're promising that but certainly when you bring in a manager of atino's experience uh you know you're hoping that he's going to have an impact not just with the senior national team but at all levels on the men's side Jules give us the outsiders perspective on those expectations for US soccer quarterfinals with this team under micio pochettino is it reasonable for a home World Cup I think quarterfinal is fair I do I mean a lot would depend also on the draw and etc etc but if you just look like that as a as a blunt objective I think quarterfinal is is fair and to go back to the question that you asked Casey just before the counter argument what happened at PhD with the front three of Messi Neymar and mbapp for example and the squad that he had of superstars he didn't really feel that comfortable and let's not forget that this is a manager in in in the best time of his career who took a squad as spur that was a start and average squads that's sign young players or the hard young players coming through that he then made into a superstar Squad really because that's what happened and if you look at the Times where he had the Superstar Squad already to start with it didn't work out a PhD was very simple the work that he wanted to do tactically especially could not be done not with the players that he had not with the egos that he had in the dressing room at Chelsea we've said I mean the club signed him a thousand player it was almost impossible to work with very very different but right now I think if you were ask if you were asking him would you rather have a superstar Squad where sometimes it could be difficult to work with because they're Superstars and because they're big EOS or a squad of young talented players or with potential let's put it that way I prefer with potential than talented with potential but with the right mentality with the right work rate and with him at the helm I think this could work and just to finish I thought politics said something very interesting after the the New Zealand game which by the way was Dire that one- one draw he said we need him now to change the culture and you guys know better than me obviously that this has been a problem for a while now changing the mentality of this team of this roster of this organization as a whole I guess and and and his culture and I think he could be the right guy because he's different to anybody that the US men national team had before why don't we take a look at the comments from Christian pic this was after the 1-1 draw um against New Zealand in Cincinnati speaking about what maici pettino could bring to the team quote I hope he brings a culture that is willing to fight take risks and win there are a lot of things that need to change just in the mentality and the culture of the group I think we have the quality hopefully that's the first thing he's going to want to change Casey I'll start with you here what do you make of the comments here from the captain well what have we been talking about for a long time is how many fans have been frustrated that that the US lost the chip on their shoulder the thing that always allowed the men's US national team to punch above their weight was just saying you know what maybe you're not taking us for what we think we're we're good enough we're we're still being oh you're an American you know you don't know how to play this Sport and so I think we all took that personally and fought for everything now as supposedly this talent pool is more talented you still have to have the fight and the fight's been lacking and that's obviously what ch is saying now what I hope that he wasn't saying is is to continue take this undue risk out of the back because every time they try to pass the ball the back I fear they're going to concede a goal but but maybe risk in the uh attacking half of the field can a manager provide fight can I mean that's what we're talking about a willing to fight take risks and win is that is that does that come from the team or does that come from the manager I I believe it comes from every individual player if you don't have that self-respect is not going to solve the problem in theory no but maybe you can crack the whip and get him in line which is what these players are asking for and it amazes me and listen we hear so many times and we've heard so many times these players defend Greg Balter we want Greg BR halter back he's our buddy da D well specifically what they defended was the culture and the culture and now they're saying the opposite the same players and it may sound hypocritical and I'll go back no player is ever going to shoot himself in the foot and speak ill of their manager it's just not reasonable but when the players are asking for this change and there's certain ways of leading and Christian pic is the team captain by the arm Bend but he's not really the leader of this team he leads by example but that's not the same way as a Tyler Adams being the locker room and holding people accountable now in this camp and I told you what I thought about this camp or this window you didn't have Tyler Adams you didn't have Weston mcken you didn't have Timothy WEA you didn't have Anthony Robinson you didn't have Gio Raina Matt Turner didn't start the first game there there are situations here where there are important players who could be on that field who can lead in many different ways but certainly and I I know it's not just one person's responsibility if there's a Tyler Adams in that locker room there's a Tyler Adams in that locker room damn well sure that the halftime of the Canada game there's being something thrown there's being something said there's a finger being pointed after the New Zealand game he's irate because he has that pride in his game the pride in himself the love for the jersey and Casey's right you know the the US Men's National teams of the past never had people question that way they can question them tactically technically they can question you know if they were good enough but you never once questioned if they had the spirit the fight the pride they always had a chip on their shoulder the biggest player they had Clint Dempsey had the biggest chip on his shoulder so it's a Trinkle down effect this gener Generations that every resource given to them every opportunity at their disposal and yet here we are talking about an attitude talking about mentality talking about culture I I don't understand it and one manager coming in does shouldn't have to change that but that's where we are today uh Jeff has been around the program a long time obviously covered the US Men's National Team for quite a few years uh how far off the right mentality is this group's mentality right now and do you back Jeff poch to come in and fix it well I think one thing that poatina can do is is set standards um you know if the standards are slipping of course some of that's on the players but you know pettino has the ultimate you know weapon he has he he he's the one who's dealing out a playing time you know he can bench guys you know if they're not performing up to the standard if they don't have the right attitude you know it's it's hey let's try somebody else so you know I think that's one thing that is going to start doing right away is setting those standards setting expectations and hopefully you would you know the rest of the the the team the rest of the player pool Falls in line um it's it's kind of a mixed bag in terms of how far off they are because you saw how they played at the World Cup um you've seen how they've played at times it seems like whenever Mexico comes to town this team is up for it so they are capable of bringing that chip on their shoulders they are capable of of having that right attitude but it it comes and goes and so you know that's you know that that's where it's kind of a mixed bag because it shouldn't be that way I mean this the attitude the the pr preparedness uh the fight should be there all the time and they've the players have admitted it themselves they admitted it at Copa America and you know they alluded to it in these last two friendlies so uh I guess I would say they're not far off because they're capable of it but why is it not there consistently I think that really is the ultimate challenge that that poatina is going to face just speaks about that standard I'll tell you why they play against Mexico that way because that's a standard that they've been told since they were 15 years old youth national teams this is our rival this is the biggest game we have you see that green jersey you have to win you have to fight and that's why they're held to that standard it amazes me that they don't realize that that same standard should be held every single time you put that Jersey on all right so there it is Macio poo now in officially charge of the US Men's National I do have one more question for you Jeff I I saw something in an article I believe it was reported by the athletic I want to give them credit about a potential buyout clause in this contract which might make some us fans nervous but there I didn't see any details on it do you know anything about that that buyout Clause whether it exists and what's in it yeah I was able to confirm that it does exist uh you know a federation source told me that it's in the quote tens of millions unquote so I interpret that to mean that it's you know 20 million at least uh now I can think of some entities out there in the soccer World for whom 20 million would not be an impediment at all to trying to to rest away Mauricio platino but uh you know it could be more than that so you know there is a little bit of a gray area but that is a considerable amount of money and I think that would scare away the majority of national teams out there but you know I can think of a few that it wouldn't so uh but I I think both sides you know and I say both I'm talking about pochettino and the ussf they want to make this work I mean obviously poino is taking a big leap uh into the international game with not one of the traditional Powers so uh you know he's going to be very motivated to make this work and the Federation has taken the big swing that everybody wanted them to so uh you know they're going to do everything in their power to make sure that poatina a success so you know obviously the hope is that this this this Clause never has to be invoked or is never tested um and that this is a marriage that that ends up working out very well for everyone involved all right great stuff as always you can read more from Jeff carile over on the website espn.com you can do the same for Julian luron Jules thanks for staying up late with us same for you as well Jeff great to have you with us on football amas [Music]