Patriots Catch-22 8/29: Positional Rundown of 53-Man Roster, Jacoby Brissett News

this is the Patriots catch22 podcast with Evan Lazar and Alex bar I'm EV Lazar laar hello everybody nailed it joined as always by our that's a bit that's a mat risk 22 here is Evan Lazar and Alex I remember when when they came here for joint practice last year like he did a scrum yeah but he was like he looked kind of confused as to why the reporters were talking to him sure he did it I think he always looks confused it's just Robbie Anderson's face did I ever tell you that I saw Robbie Anderson in AR rubba one time no yeah I was walking out of a hotel in uh in Aruba you know my family this is going to sound very like rich boy thing it's okay uh and I I and I I was like is that Robbie Anderson I and it it sure enough it it was uh anyway I saw you Donis hm at a Dunkin Donuts in Fort Lauderdale Florida once that's not that's kind of the same thing right yeah well I in the me and my brother we were little and our parents were like somewhere else in strip mall and we wanted to go Duncan yeah and there's like a this is when Hummers were like the coolest big yellow Hummer with a mic custom Miami Heat license plate said Haslam I'm like you think that's yonis Aslam and we go to Dunkin Donut and there's yonis hlam we're like oh yeah saw your car he was just he had no time for it well now we we don't like Adonis hasm No No at at the time he was like this would have been probably like 200 I don't even think the Celtics had their first big three the the Garnett yeah uh Pier Allen big three second big three yeah we're just not old enough for the first right one but yeah we Joe moula at Patriots practice was here today and then we have to get on the rails cuz we don't have as much time as we normally do I we have to be an hour and 30 a little tighter today uh cuz uh it's my fault I'll take responsibility for it uh anyways uh let's get into it because that was totally off topic and had nothing to do with what we were starting the show with today we even mention we're using the other set yeah that too we're going to use the other set today was just a busy day here as you guys could imagine at your Leed stadium so uh this is our our for people that don't watch unfilter which doubt is a lot of people that don't watch bu shows but this is our usually our unfiltered setup uh this Lounge setup here that that's growing on me I'm more comfortable on in the chairs and everything than I than I was at first so we're going to use this situp today just a little bit easier and uh on that note let's get to the news of the day people in the chat think you have your own Vacation House in Aruba absolutely not I mooch off my parents and that's about it who mooched off their parents and that's about it um anyways news of the day uh gerro Mayo naming jacobe brette the Patriots starting quarterback for the season we'll get to that in a second yeah obviously that's a loose term I I want to start by saying this I know there's going to be a lot of people out there today probably on your station uh that are going to be critical of how this whole situation was handled uh in terms of this 8:30 a.m. press conference uh obviously there's a lot of local media here that weren't too pleased that the national guys broke the story 20 minutes before the press conference I totally understand that there's an element to all of this a public facing element to this that fans and media types probably maybe more media types even than fans are going to critique and it was inefficient it probably could have been handled a little bit better in terms of that but I honestly I try not to be selfish about it you know this morning I was fired up about it just as much as anybody that I had to come here at 8:30 this morning and you always do a good job of not letting me get away with those types of things poor Evan has to show up at work on them right right you know I don't I don't want to get bogged down by that kind of stuff on this show yeah cuz at the end of the day the most important thing is is that this does feel like the right football decision for the team right now in week one but it almost misses the mark to me to a criticize the press conference and how all that went down like who the heck cares like really and B uh it the decision to start toobe BR almost misses the mark to me as well a little bit if you're going to be critical of that in it in a vacuum in itself because the biggest thing if you want to be critical and I want to be here for a second is the reason why we're in this position that jacoi brette is starting and Drake May isn't starting is because Elliot wolf and the Patriots front office did not do a good enough job in the off season with this offensive line like that's why we're here yeah if the Patriots and the Bears switched quarterbacks and Caleb was here and Drake May was there still first and third overall right just switched quarterbacks Drake May is starting in Chicago week one yes he's starting in Chicago week one and it'll be interesting to see it's a little bit of a litmus test the commanders have a similar roster to the Patriots they have Terry McClaren but their offensive line kind of stinks and outside of Terry McClaren they don't have a whole lot going have a much more mobile quarterback not that Drake May is not mobile he he's more Mobile in a different way though he's like in structure mobile like Drake may I think is a better improviser than Jaden Daniels Jaden Daniels is better at running away from people yeah that's fair I guess my criticism is not about the press conference or the fact that I had to wake up early to get here on time cuz you're right like that that stuff is selfish like that stuff is not you know what the term 9 to five means yes that stuff is not well not really because we don't really do n to five that's what I'm saying the one time you have to do nine to five my criticism which is really nine to four and where I get angry about this whole situation is that they did not set up the roster in a position where a rookie quarterback could could succeed and that's where I feel like we should be pointing our criticisms not to the fact that they called a press conference at 8:30 in the morning like get over it the fact of the matter is is that this offensive line and the way it was handled in the off season was not good enough their big signing and I put that other than Mike on wenu which is a retain right their big external addition and I put that in air quotes because big is very subjective was chuk soror who was in the preseason game last week against the Commanders probably their worst lineman in that game didn't look like a roster B player not even just probably he was yeah and now we're at a point where gerod Mayo is going up there on Wednesday and he kind of reiterated the same sentiment today what's best for the team in the short term might not necessarily be what's best for the team in the long term and then he also said that prioritizing winning games in the short term is not necessarily what's best for the team in the long term right and so basically what he's telling you is is I think Drake May is a better quarterback I know that Drake May is the future of the team regardless if he's better today or tomorrow but we're not ready for him and the fact that they're not ready to play Drake Made To Me is a critique on Elliot wolf in the Personnel Department I don't disagree with that I I would say though like you you know you should know as gerro Mayo coming in that that's the case the offensive line should not have snuck up on anybody's a surprise by how bad it is maybe it did it shouldn't have I still go back to and this is a question I get a lot why did gerod Mayo keep calling it a competition yeah if that clearly wasn't happening and we did this last year with M Jones and bayy zappy again you want to talk about my station saying like oh it's a quarterback competition because Bill said they're both competing but like that's coach speak for participating yeah a quarterback competition is an actual like tangible thing you can Define where both or any position battle but like a quarterback both players are getting opportunities with the whatever unit you know top unit in this case and not it doesn't have to be equal 50/50 but close things like that there was never competition and I feel like if Gerard Mayo had just said that or not said that from the beginning you wouldn't have the circus maybe you don't even have this press conference today because outside of that one thing I think we all pretty much knew jacobe Bret was starting if they had just gone through without this press conference we would have all assumed it was jakobe brette in week one right so if if they just hadn't labeled it a competition and this is perfect for this show cuz half of our arguments we making the same point we're just arguing the semantics of the argument and it's a semantics thing yeah there never was a quarterback competition so there was no competition for Drake May to win so naming Drake May the starter or or sorry there was no competition for Drake May win so name Jobe brette the starter in some ways is redundant I guess or unnecessary but they called it a competition so you had to go through this whole thing they could have avoided that by just not calling it a competition that part I still don't understand I understand wanting Drake May two compete yeah and I think there was a competition in the sense that he it's Drake against time he's competing to show the coaches and in a and also the other guys on the roster that he can be the starter sooner rather than later even if it's not week one and I think he did that in that sense I think he won the competition remember I came in talking about Halloween I came in talking about weeks 11 12 13 now I'm sitting here telling you weeks five or six because I think he showed tremendous growth over camp but that's not what a competition is and leaving the door open for week one as much as they did I understand you want to have an element of nothing's given everything things earned every job is up for grabs you're coming in here every day we want you earning that roster spot right uh uh success isn't uh success isn't given it's it it's whatever it is uh leas and rent is due every day that that's stupid cliche right I get that but also at a certain point now you've created a Cirus and a distraction around the team that you probably didn't need to create yeah I I I totally agree and I actually again probably a little inside baseball but I I went up to jacoi brasset in the locker room after we talked to him today in the scrum and I was like I guess congratulations like it was sort of awkward to even congratulate him because he had been running with the ones all summer and like to your point the only way that it something were to change would have been at of nowhere like it would have been out of left field and I I agree with you I feel like the press conference this morning was put in place because they didn't want it to look like Gerard wasn't going to be accountable for the decision right and so they wanted he wanted to be out there he wanted to announce it he wanted to a answer a few of the top questions about the situation so it wasn't looking like he was kind of running away from the media on the subject but would any of us have been all that bothered by the fact that Ian and and uh Adam schfer tweeted it out said you know this breaking news per sources jao brassette Patriots week one starter maybe on patriots.com at that point we do some sort of release about it too you know an article or just a tweet even just to say qb1 jaob brassette and we all we didn't even need this press conference right like we didn't even need to go through this it felt like they were calling a press conference for a formality and that was a little bit awkward too so I I agree that sort of do your point where like it was making something out of like out of thin air that it didn't really even it was it was it was they created this whole Saga they created and so you needed an end to it you needed to put a cap on it and I think it got to the point where like I said before I if they hadn't said anything I think you could have just gone on we all would have assumed 90% of us would have assumed jaob Bret's a starter and we would have gone into week one we would have been like yeah's starting okay that's what it looks like all along but I think when they open the door a little bit they then felt they need to close the door because game week do you want it lingering over the team you know do they want Wednesday Thursday Friday us coming in so who's the starter what's it look like and they also can this is something that bill did towards the end that I disagreed with as well um they can't force the players to speak on behalf of the coach so like what happens is if you don't do a significant if you don't tell people that K BR a starter and you just kind of you know Mosey on along then every single time we talk to the players it's that's going to be do you know who's starting do you know who's starting and that's sort of what happened with M Jones and Bailey zappy so I get wanting to have like kind of a united front and having Gerard Mayo be the one is is actually all really fitting I I don't want to talk too much about all this politics stuff though because that that's not this show like this show is about the about the the football minutia but the last thing I'll just say about it and then we can I you want to make a different point but it's unrelated to this to all this stuff I just want to hammer home the fact that to me this is this is Elliot Wolf's fault this is Elliot Wolf's fault that we're at this point because if you ask me you went you said that this is sort of the plan all along and that that sort of thing totally agree with you I actually think Drake May exceeded expectations internally I I think he did externally also frankly yeah I believe that they were prepared to red shirt him for the entire season they knew the roster probably wasn't going to be close enough to compete anyways and he had all these issues that they were going to have to work through and they were G to have to build them up and all that kind of stuff and then he got they got into camp and at the beginning of camp it actually looked like we were trending towards that then all of a sudden the Eagles preseason game happens the light switch flips on and he's like a different guy after that and all and gerod Mayo turned into a Believer like he he convinced gerod Mayo that this was a true competition I I really do believe that and at that point it was kind of like all right it's it's too you know we got to be a little bit more open-minded about potentially playing Drake M sooner uh than we expected and maybe that took them a little bit by surprise but the main thing I I I really feel and this is what you know kind of my big take on this this to me is is Elliot wolf in the Personnel Department's fault because if they had properly equipped this offensive line to support a rookie quarterback then Drake May's Ascension happens exactly the same way and he quicker and he's in there week one against the Bengals because you feel like you can adequately support him on the field and they can't tell us that they feel that way anymore because then there's no reason for the guy that per the head coach outplayed the other guy in the summer and clearly to all of us that are watching him can see that he's the more talented guy at least at the very least I don't know about all the mental stuff you know all that kind of thing but he's easily the most talented guy and now you're telling us that he's not starting well he's not starting because of your roster like that that's why he's not starting how much of that do you think was just the default defaulting to the Packer way and and you know we don't play quarterbacks right away and just assuming they were going to Reg him look I'm with you everybody knows where I am and I I I'm sick of hearing that what would Jonah Williams have done that that these guys don't line up yeah literally line up on sides yeah that's what he would have done that's where the bar is right now for this offensive line coming off of Sunday night I know you don't think it was maybe as bad as some people are making it out to be cuz they were setting some blocks and they were making some plays on tape I don't necessarily disagree with that but if you can't get the ball snapped and you can't line up correctly nothing you do after that matters right the microphone can be over here Evan we can do a great podcast but it's going to sound like crap because we're not lined up correctly so hopefully people could hear that I try to project a little more to make my point but that is my point like you see what I'm doing that came through we're good yeah all right perfect so people get my point so yeah it would have been nice if they invested more in this it would have been nice and look I like Jaylen pul I think he's a good player I still go back to tackle should have been the second pick yeah agressive that or be more aggressive moving up you know i' say I like Kaden Wallace too their other other tackles I like more or not even more just left tackles guys who had played the left side and then you could put chuko cor for he's comfortable you put mik on wenu over there or something like it's a lot more clearcut and he might play over there anyway but that puts puts chukes on the left side you you lose that third round pit or he's not like a factor in it so no they was Soo this off season or last offseason that was last off season which is when I I I also want to for those who don't remember Soo meant sign one draft when when it came to T the plan and I'm glad you brought that up because I wanted to bring that it back to that for a second as well because as much as I'm not trying to I I just said it's Elliot Wolf's fault like I'm not trying to make excuses for anybody but really this started with tackle years ago and just to kind of hone h on recent it really started last offseason because the last offseason in the draft they didn't draft a tackle they drafted a GU two guards in the center well remember City so was supposed to play tackle that was the whole thing well that was they're full of crap with that too never was going to work Jake Andrews is on injured reserve Antonio mafi's gone yeah Chad Ryland your fourth round pick gone who was drafted just ahead of dwan Jones yeah so Bill didn't kick the can down on tack we did this a couple weeks ago this all goes back to when solder left in 2017 2018 and they basically used Trent Brown as a stop gap for years and years years so they could fill other positions which they did need to fill but the eventually they ran out of stop Gap years on Trent Brown so when we I believe it was the show after the joint practice Yeah and uh I was pretty upset right I I was pretty upset with appalled I guess is a better word of what I saw in that practice and I I remember saying to you something along the lines of we are at this point now that they can't play Drake M even if he's the best quarterback because of how terrible they are front and when when Alex velt says that Jai brassett is is better equipped to handle pressure because he knows the tools in the offense to get them in and out of things or to read Hots or whatever the case may be and this is so much better you know he's so much better at all that it's like well that's also just a big factor because you can't block anybody or to your point you can't even line up right so like it it just that's the frustrating part that I have right now as a Patriots fan it's not the press conference it's not how the announcement was handled it was the fact that they never were put Drake May in a position to actually win this job and they never gave Drake May a chance to play early on and play week one because the roster is not ready for him so to kind of put a cap on that point because I don't think either one of us has said this yet definitively and I do think it needs to be said starting jacobe brette week one is the right call yes I yeah I thought it said off the top of the show I'm not I'm glad you bring it back up if I didn't it's the right football decision just just to and cuz I think some people are losing track of this point you can be disappointed yeah that you don't get to see Drake may you you can absolutely be disappointed and upset by that and you know some of the points we're making and look at why this happened and also acknowledge here's where they are we can't change any of that we can't they can't go back and and redo the moves from the offseason and add offensive lineman but this is the right move the team's not ready for May yet I also do think it it helps May a little bit to see things behind the scenes and Matt doof my call at 98 my colleague at 985 the the sports club.com has made this point a couple times it's a very good point what can so people say oh you're not going to ruin May by putting him in too early you can't ruin a quarterback by playing him too early which I don't think is true but people make that point okay can you ruin a quarterback by sitting him like what detrimental could happen to Drake May from him sitting there's one sort of answer that I think is legitimate to that question which is well does he become frustrated with the coaching staff in the franchise yeah Drake May does not seem like that kind of guy if so far the other way four or five years regardless of if he's frustrated or not like he's under contract we don't want him to check out but like no I hear what you're saying and and he does not remotely seem like that kind of guy at all so if anything he seems that kind of guy maybe likees to under him in a good way so you're not losing anything like none of us are under the illusion that they're contending this year even with him you're not losing anything by not playing him there really is no downside there's no not a ton of upside to not playing him but there's no downside to it you just make sure he stays healthy and you allow him to develop a little bit more well and this is another one I I tweeted out this morning that okay well you know this gives time to figure things out on the offense people R their what are they figuring out they're not going to figure out the line it sucks they not going to figure out the receivers it sucks oh I to an extent we tal we've talked about this a lot there has to be a best five yeah I don't know that the best five is I get to that in a second but finish your point so I don't know if the best five is good yeah but there has like there has to by definition be a best five right right it at least gives you time to find that it gives Jaylen pul and maybe Javon Baker some time to develop and become a little bit better as Weapons it gives you time for City so to get healthy for hun Hunter Henry to get healthy for Vian low to get healthy like thinking they'll make no progress regardless of the quarterback from week one to week 18 is crazy will it it it might not be Monumental progress It's still might not put them in a spot where they're going to be a top 10 offense in the NFL it won't but they'll start to figure a few things out and that can only help Drake May once he does become the starter so there's two ways I want to go about this the first one I think is what you just said so I'll just go there uh directly now it's twofold one they they need to figure out how they're going to move the ball offensively and I know that sounds so rudimentary and like or Elementary maybe is the better term for it but they literally need to figure out what are they good at on offense that take away Drake May's like you know the KJ Osborne touchdown that never was like take away the Off Script oh they took that away we don't need to take that away for ches a COR took that away do you think out of all people who I have been waiting since April since April to see Drake May roll to his left throw back across the field 50 yards down the field for a touch I've been waiting since January to see that play and as it's unfolding I see the flag go in the air and I see Drake May hunch over in disgust and just be like I know what the flag is for already I know this doesn't count it still counts in my in our eyes okay we all still saw it happen you know what I kept thinking of immediately after that play remember the clip of Matt Ryan like late in his career at the Falcons when he was they were trying to motion and get things he has to yell at that time L the up I just kept thinking in my head and that exact hands line the up oh God it was that was the play that we've all been waiting for cuz it's it's his it's his superpower he's Alan esque like he has that off platform arm Talent is just silly like guys on that play and I I didn't want to go down this roow but I have to for a second on that play The Deep safety it splits field right it's like it's like Tampa two the Deep safety on the left hand side of the field he latches onto the intermediate route and not the clear the clear out route by KJ Osborne is just a vertical to clear out the sideline on the flood concept and he latches on to the to the uh number two receiver the the intermediate route because he's says there's no effing way that this guy is going to throw this ball rolling to his left 40 yards down the field he can't nobody can make that throw this kid can make that throw right like that he just the as long as he's healthy and upright the safety turns around and it is like no freaking way just like it's like yeah like that that's that's what we've all been waiting for uh so you go back to the offensive line for a second I want to start there but the big point is with the offense as a whole Alex velt needs to use this next F month six weeks eight weeks whatever it is because if they even think about red shirting Drake May at this point I am going to freaking Riot on this show I can promise you that so they whatever it is whatever their timeline is for Drake May being ready to play five weeks 8 weeks whatever this is a information gathering Expedition this is yes it's about winning football games and you want to try to win and I'm not trying to say that it's bigger than winning but you need to figure out what's your core offensively just your skill Talent your line who's your best five who's your best five in the skill group how are you going to move the football how are you going to run it you got to be able to run the ball with this offense so is it going to be outside zone is it going to be more Gap is it going to be what is it going to be how are you going to run the football how are you going to move the ball in general who's going to play the Five Guys on the offensive line what do you have in Jaylen pulk and Javon Baker I think that's big if one of those guys and it's it's trending more towards pulk at this point if pulk ends up being like a really good player I'm not ready to put a ceiling on him yet or a floor but let's just call him a good player like you hit on that pick and that that's something that you can find out still too Brett's not a total a total bum they can find out if Jaylen pul can play or not a little bit with him he's good enough for for them to be able to develop the rest of the offense round right so that's a b part of it then I want to talk about the the five along the offensive line now injuries always play a role in these kinds of things so I can't they can't control injuries so if they if V Daran low and City so aren't healthy and they can't play week one then I can't get my best five on the field but it goes back to your point from earlier of like it's no secret offensive lineman get hurt and I've been saying this in the beginning it's not just the starters that are a question mark we don't know who any of the backups are either they are bringing a center today they don't have a backup center right so I want to go down with what I believe is their best five and it's two things and I I know I always bring up Dante scaria but I think he's the best guy that's ever done it so I as as you should whenever you talk about offensive line his his word is probably better than most if not probably better than all to be honest one of the big things that he always uh used to say and what he's told me before is that you want everybody as best as you possibly can to be in their natural positions you want everybody to be comfortable in their natural spots and then you roll with that and you try to build the continuity right and the line that they've been working with might be out of necessity that they're working with the line combination that they are right now which is from left to right ches uh Nick lever today but City eventually David Andrews Robinson Mike on wenu but what I feel like is that you're really playing with two guys out of position because on wenu is out of position at right tackle and CHS is out of position at left tackle I think it's three wasn't Lan Robinson primarily a left guard in colle no he's actually a Right Guard I looked this up so you're playing with two guys your tackles are at a position yeah on both sides and that's the worst spot to have at a position so the way I look at it and I know this might I'm not telling you that their options are great their options are not great but again we're trying to find the best five it's not necessarily a good five but there is by definition a best five vidan low to me has been the best left tackle they've had in Camp it's been really the only left tackle they've had in Camp but I agree with you best left tackle they've had in Camp you can you want to say only who I mean who else got a shot CHS Kaden Wallace but those guys even I I I'd like to see more K Wallis so here's and I know he's out of position I get all that but this is I don't know that now I'm backtracking but it's I wish they'd experimented with more combinations during Camp instead of getting to this point where it becomes a fire drill week before the season so here's what I would but yes it it has been Vian low I'm just being a smartass I would put Vian low at left tackle I would too honestly at this point I think he's your best left tackle yep the one sack that he gave up in the preseason against the Eagles was more of miscommunication like poor execution of a chip than anything it wasn't like he just got blown by by Nolan Smith and gave up a sack right like it was more something that is it's easily correctable and he lines up correctly and he lines up correctly Vian low at left tackle yep left guard and this is maybe the one spot where somebody could be at a position technically but to me that's a two- horse race between City so and leaden Robinson I think I mean City so is not out of position there right but leaden Robinson technically would be but he practiced a lot this summer at left guard sure I I'm comfortable with either of those guys there we know who's at Center y David at Center better be I I'll I'll tell you this as we go through the line I don't know that there's a player that this team can afford to lose less than David Andrews yeah it's a fair it is and especially because I I I don't think it's a coincidence that he doesn't play and they have trouble lining up and they have trouble with delay of games and things like that all the calls go through the center all the checks go through the center not all the calls all the checks go through the center right the line all the line calls go through the center in their system and he's just a veteran with a bunch of young guys and I I think his presence is I would like to hope they also don't have anybody else that can snap the ball yeah that's a big thing I would like to Hope SN with him out there he looks to his left and he looks to his right and he would say to chukes can you get on the freaking line right you know I I would hope Center David Andrew Yep this part this part I feel extremely strongly about and I'll die on this on this hill I I know what this is and I've even come around to it Mike on wenu is a Right Guard yes he is Mike on wenu is a Right Guard he has when he plays right tackle he can be a he can survive he's fine at right tackle he can survive he can dominate on the interior he is a All Pro Caliber guard he is a borderline starting right tackle he is a Right Guard and at this point you're doing him a disservice it's your roster construction that's doing him a disservice that he has to play right tackle cuz you don't have any other better right tackles to play you they clearly don't think Kaden Wallace is ready for whatever reason right so uh just to kind of add to that I remember all the people that said you have to pay M play Mich and went to a tackle because you paid him as a tackle and he's an overpaid guard don't care I I never cared but now you look at it all right he's the fifth highest paid right tackle in football but where would you rank him ability wise somewhere middle of the pack 15 16 17 somewhere right tackle he I to me he's he's in the bottom half of the league I'm not saying he's 32nd but he's so-call 20th sure so you can pay the 20th best right tackle the fifth most of any player at the position or you can play you call them all pro so let me say bottom of All Pro the fourth best Right Guard yeah or the fourth best guard sorry second most and we also just just to I want to get to something with on wenu too with him personally but let's also just think about for a second that if you have an interior of let's just call it City for the time being right cuz he's probably the more ready guy if he's healthy over leaden Robinson City so David Andrews Mike on wenu you have a piece of the line that should be above average to maybe even good yeah the yeah the interior's fine right and so you have a decent interior of the line do you know how valuable it is for quarterbacks that they can step up in the pocket and have that what you know what they call the shelf right yeah have the Shelf clean to step up in the pocket not to mention the the Run game advantages that it brings to the table too with anenu particularly what I see with him when he plays tackle is that he has a short corner so every single drop that you make that the quarterback that the rule of thumb is that the quarterback needs to uh drop to 10 yards so the linemen need to push the guys behind them 10 yards right if you get to 10 yards the quarterback's at 11 and he gets sacked at 11 yards and it's on the quarterback it's it's because you have to control the depth of the drop right so with Mike on wenu he has trouble when he plays tackle with getting to that 10 yard landmark and the CT the The Edge rushers turned the corner on him a little bit faster than they would it's not his fault he's just not a tackle right like and yeah I'll allow for the fact that maybe if he plays it for 17 weeks he gets better there's no doubt about that but when I watch him play I am watching a guard play tackle like I'm not watching a tackle play tackle yeah last Point move on from that right tackle two horse race again y cha cor for Kaden Wallace two actual right tackles by trade that have played right tackle and it goes back when you put the whole thing together low so Anderson on wenu Andrews to say Anderson yeah and Andrews on wenu a COR for let's just say for now and I think that's right like you you build up to the rookies you don't start with the rookies and go back to vet right and then eventually at some point you hope that Kaden Wallace overtakes a core or four yeah and maybe leaden Robinson's better than cityo right allow for that we go back to the point of now next year you draft Will Campbell he plays left tackle and now all of a sudden you actually have some an offensive line you have to find a new center in a year or two but like you have the pieces there you have pie together so that to me is the best five not not only do I think it's just the best five players on the roster at their you know that on the line but it's also everybody in their natural positions like nobody in that line is playing out of position and yeah you might be a little bit weaker at tackle still just because of the talent on the roster but that there's nothing you can do about that the players are the players and what people who defend the line will say is you can have four strong spots and one weak spot and cover it up which is another scar philosophy which I generally believe in I do think there are two caveats to that yeah yeah one I don't think that fifth spot can be left tackle I just don't two what wherever the spot is beyond left tackle I do think there's a baseline to cover up so to your point Mike on Wen who is an interior player is going to be a big part of helping cover up that weakness yeah wherever it is miche's going to be a big part of it because he is a blue chip player yeah I would AR David Andrew is great and he's been a great Patriot he's not quite the player he once was M go W is their best lineally in pass protection right it might go and W is their he is their one blue chip lineman yep if you play him at tackle you lose that he is not a blue chip tackle correct so a good way putting if you're going to scheme this whole thing around covering up for a spot wherever it is ESP it's going to be a right tackle you need Michael andu with guard to help you with that he can hold his own at tackle he can't hold his own and help somebody else yeah and you're going to need him to do that wherever he's playing in order to get the best version of this line again maybe it won't be great but to get the best version of it you're going to need Michael and wenu to help out it's just it's unfair to him like they they they've forced him to play right tackle because they haven't stock the roster well enough at the tackle position over the last two two to three years that it you're sorry Mike but you're you're the best we got so we got to play you here like it's just it's such a bummer I I I want to talk a little bit more about Drake May especially because we're not going to see him now for a little while but before we do that we can take some of the phone calls cuz I know you guys have been waiting on the line here uh Patty is in Agawam what's up Patty what's up jent I'll make it quick because I know you don't have much time today but uh yeah I couldn't agree more about Mike and wenu I think they just got to figure it out at right tackle and just let him play Right Guard and really quickly I I wanted to bring up something you guys said last week that I was I've been thinking about for a couple years and I know it's off topic it's not the Patriots but it's got to do with Joe Toney and not this past year Super Bowl but the year before when they beat the Eagles I started thinking in my head I'm like this guy might might be a Hall of Famer and then I thought back to the uh the Super Bowl where the Pats played the Rams and I know for a fact because I saw it on NFL films like sound bites where he did get one-on ones with Aaron Donald and not only like he didn't dominate him but like he held his own and like the biggest game on the biggest stage you know of his life so to me I I think he's a Hall of Famer and yeah let's let's figure it out let's get unu at at Ray card where he belong and Bre May in there as soon as possible guys yeah wa thanks for the call Patty I think uh get Dr M Drake mate in there as soon as possible is enough I think we heard the last point in that there but yeah Jo is a Hall of Famer he's trending he's trending that way he he blanked Aaron Donald in the Super Bowl I think he blanked him in that Super Bowl right he didn't have a sack yeah one-on-one um yeah on that drive on the game-winning Drive the pass to gronowski hos Juke pass to gr gronowski is uh Joe tuny Aaron Donald one-on-one in pass Pro so he had that dominated Fletcher Cox in another Super Bowl one of the more underrated player Cox I'm saying I think as high as highly regarded as he is one of the more underrated players of his era yeah um you know that Niners defensive front last year he held up well yeah yeah he he's he's the first battle Hall of Famer to me so I it's and I we don't have enough time today this is not the show for this but it's really tough for interior offensive lineman to make it into the Hall Fame like it's really tough like you have to be you know John Hannah like you have to be on that level but I think what helps him CU there's no stats and people need something to latch on to Super Bowl rings not just Super Bowl rings but you know Joe tun is maybe not a name the common fans familiar with his interior lineman you know who are common names Aaron Donald Fletcher Cox you show him beating up on those guys in Super Bowls you put that film on I think people are going to warm up to him as Hall of Famer pretty quickly I forgot to pay the bills I was so fired up about the jacoe brassette thing uh Hey Patriots fans if you want to see Toyota's best offers including those Not Seen On TV go to BU toyota.com it's a Toyota's official website for deals from the official vehicle of the New England Patriots Toyota Let's Go Places and easy to drink easy to enjoy budlight the official beer sponsor of the New England Patriots and uh Alex do you need something to do before next week next week's kickoff always why not get your living room game ready by playing with the Bob's ton Furniture Dare to Compare challenge When You Dare to Compare Bob's Renegade motion sofa with the competition you'll get customizable modular design Bob opedic power reclining seats charging ports and plenty of storage for hundreds less than other brands now that's a winning play so stop in and see how much you can save When You Dare to Compare with Bob's Discount Furniture the official Furniture Store of the New England Patriots all right let's take uh Jeff oh wait sorry Jeff just one second Sam is in Connecticut I like to go in order Sam what's up hey can you guys hear me yeah go ahead Sam uh okay uh so I had a question about uh something you were saying uh today Evan um you mentioned how you were frustrated uh with wolf how he didn't do enough for the offensive line uh this off seon I just I just kind of wanted to ask um were there any particular offensive lineman that became available that you wanted us to pursue um and if not would you rather um us have gone for offensive um lineman in the draft rather than doubling down uh on wide receivers um and yeah that's all I have yeah thanks for the call Sam I look the way I look at it Jonah Williams was an option yep it does sound like Jonah Williams struggled a little bit in Arizona in Camp and again did he line up correctly fair enough and they also they decided that CH s cor for for about $5 million was better value than Jonah Williams at about 10 or whatever that contract was I think it was around value is not the point that that's the point yeah I'm totally with you get good linemen it they looked at it a little bit to bellaiche in I would almost say yeah and I know this used to work out for Bill all the time so I I understand that but bill would have done the same thing he would have said the value is better here right uh the other thing that I would say I was a huge Kingsley Su Matia fan yeah in the draft the Patriots took Kaden Wallace I want to say about like 10 picks or so even if that uh after Kings Leo matio went in the draft that's the second guess to me I like Jaylen pul as a player I could be talked into the fact that they should have been been tackle at that pick as well but where The Tackle board fell the run a tackle in the first round had kind of already happened the run a tackle at the second round didn't happen yet or hadn't started yet it started with Kingsley who the Chiefs drafted of course because they don't no it started with Patrick Paul yeah Patrick Paul went first but that was a little bit earlier I think it was like end of the second and then Kingsley went a a little bit after that it was also end of the second that to me would be the the second guess so is 68 is where they took Kaden Wallace they should have moved up from 68 and taken it if they weren't going to take a tackle took Jaylen pul which I I would have been fine taking Patrick Paul there I said that if they weren't going to do that they should have moved up from 68 let me put it this way and it would have cost them an extra pick who would you rather have we use Kingsley CU that's your guy yeah Kingsley period or Kaden Wallace and Javon Baker yeah and and those are look those are the tough ones in the draft right is these are the either ores or whatever you want to call it the coin flips in the draft is a I usually like to call it that two years from now Kingsley Su Matia might be a bust and Kevin Wallace and Javon Baker might be stars for the Patriots right but I would just feel a whole lot more uh you know better about this offensive line uh mainly because kingley Kingsley is a a left tackle now he played both sides at BYU but he has played left tackle in games in college and you know has worked out there right like Kaden Wallace had never done that so that would be the second guess your guy was Patrick Paul that that that's fine too somewhere on in the draft they needed to jump on their tackle run and specifically a guy and here's I lik Kane rall in the draft for them and I thought they needed two tackles and I liked Kaden Wallace I thought he was going to go in the fourth round yeah but I thought he would be a guy like ideally chuk a COR for is you're starting right tackle and you're developing Caden Wallace behind him which might end up happening anyway yeah but I wanted a true left tackle not a guy that was a convert yeah I wanted a true left tackle and that was Paul that was King kley I would have even settled for Blake fer who played right tackle at the end of his career in Notre Dame but had some left tackle experience yeah kayen Wallace I remember correctly played five snaps that weren't at right he was a four-year starter in those four years he played five snaps that weren't at right tackle and they were all at right card yeah and uh the last one was was uh Coleman from TCU who yeah they had a visit with him I think so he might have been a guard though I well he but his Scouting Report was really similar to to Kaden Wallace is in that like some people viewed Kaden Wallace is a guy that might needed to move inside uh Bren and Coleman at TCU two years ago when they were in the national championship game he had an outstanding year yeah last year he was injured he kind of tailed off a little bit didn't have as good of a season in his draft eligible year so that hurt his stock but he was a left tackle at TCU also so just these guys sure he had that experience you those are the guys that I would just look at all right uh Jeff uh is in Maine what's up Jeff hey how you doing guys good so uh first of all I completely agree with what you said on the line um with low and then either so or Robinson Andrews on wayu one of Wallace or troops um but uh on a slightly different note I had my fantasy draft last night would you guys like to very quickly hear the Manhattan Project sure oh you you tweeted me you or no you called in or something said your fantasy team name was the Manhattan Project yeah for that name Sher absolutely all right so Jaylen it's a three wide receiver League 10 team PPR uh so Jaylen Herz uh jir Gibbs and Kenneth Walker receiver Aman ra Nico Collins Cooper cup Delta and King Kate at tight end I have Rashi rice the flex and insurance on the bench uh when he almost inevitably we can move past that uh Dolphins defense Jason sand is a kicker and on the bench DeAndre Swift Perry McClaren Tai J Spears Jake Ferguson Jaden Daniels had to get Jaylen pulk in there uh Jaylen Wright and I have Jonathan Brooks on IR nice good squad How You Gonna name it the Manhattan Project though and not draft Joe Milton uh listen we'll get there all right all right fair enough we'll get there listen if I have a quarterback go down well here's the thing Alex you have to keep Joe Milton behind closed doors or he's not the Manhattan that is true that's a good point you got be there now he's really behind closed doors Jeff CU like we not going to see practice anymore like we do in Training Camps so oh yeah absolutely it we rename Fox for a l i mean he is I love it I love it thanks all right thanks guys thanks for the call Jeff good luck with your fantasy league I I drafted my first fantasy team last night also by the way really quickly Jeff I think Terry mcclaren's going to be in your starting lineup at some point because jayen Daniels is coming jayen danels is here he's got to throw the ball to somebody it's going to probably be scary Terry uh so I I I really feel like he's going to be in your starting La I I had my first Fantasy Draft uh last night and I've decided that I'm probably no longer good at Fantasy because all of my like fan emotions get the best of me like you know I told you earlier that I just couldn't draft Brock pie like I couldn't bring myself to do that uh I did draft the Bengals defense because they're playing the Patriots in week one so hopefully I wouldn't have admitted that if I were you well there you go uh that's where we're at Alex I have I haven't played fantasy in years cuz I just don't like doing it with this job cuz I can't sit down on Sunday and watch all the games I am back in a league this year I am doing a punters only league with the guys at clns oh God we are drafting next week so I'll have an update on that that's got you and Brian heiner and all over it oh yeah yeah I that's who who's going to get Bryce baringer is whoever gets the top pick I don't know how we're going to do the draft order it's probably going to be something stupid but I will take Bryce Binger 111 there we go all right I I know I see your calls there were I promise we'll get to you in a minute but there's a couple other you know items I wanted to get to on the show um I want to talk a little bit about Drake May because we might not we don't know when we're going to see him again in live game action so the preseason film is kind of the film at this pointed for now at least uh I know there was a lot JT O Sullivan in the QB school he he made a lot of uh of headlines here locally we go with this on some of his critiques of of Drake May uh in the game against the commanders uh just my two cents on the film I thought from the Commanders I it full disclosure I texted you I always text you on Mondays when I'm watching the film my I get I get the instant Panic reaction my my unfiltered no pun intended my unfiltered opinions not my patriots.com opinions but my unfiltered opinions and I wasn't I I didn't love what I saw against the command I was shocked to hear president of the Drake May fan club talking the way Evan was talking yeah I I the biggest thing that I I would say with what I saw on Sunday's tape look the throw the throw making that he has is is is special like his arm Talent is special you know he's a he's a a true shot maker like this guy has got that Gene in him uh the the throw to Jaylen pke on the crossing route is beautiful I mean that is just an absolute dime you know moving from right to left for right-handed quarterback is probably one of the harder throws to make accurately and he puts it right in stride on Jaylen p it was it was chef's kiss it was beautiful when I look at that play like if you're a Patriots fan and for those who are maybe disappointed by the news today and you want something to cheer you up or you're just looking for something from this preseason to hang your hat on in terms of what direction is the organization going what direction is this football team heading that's the play you go put on a loop yeah because that is your first round quarterback hitting your second round receiver on a play that is bread and butter for your new offensive coordinator when they Drew this whole thing up back in February when they hired their staff and what do we want this to look like in the end that that's it that and I'm not saying they're going to run that every play but what you know and obviously I'm not comparing the players but in terms of the the concepts within the offense the Dig route from Brady to Edelman yeah right or the the um the seam route from Brady to grungle those very Core Concepts that they could just go to and rely on and Hammer the old reliables under Drake May under Center play action Jaylen pulk intermediate Crosser on the backside yeah that if this all works out becomes one of those old reliables for them so you look at that it's the the the Squidward mean from SpongeBob right future like that's the future right there yeah it was it was a great play uh the off platform throw to KJ Osborne is like I said earlier is like I've been waiting six months to watch Drake may make that play in a patriot uniform that was great I thought some of his empty stuff was better this week like last week he looked a little bit hesitant on some of the empty throws uh you know the empty Concepts I mean that he was making um you know all that I thought was really really good uh there's a lot of really good things the scramble this on third down 17 yard scramble like those are the types of things too you know not to Pat myself on the back but the KJ Osborne throw uh that didn't count just gross and the the scramble on third down backed up scramble by the way yeah on third down uh those the types of things that when we talk about Drake May being a playmaker like that's what he can bring to elevate the offense he's not going to be and this is sort of where I want to get into some of the QB school stuff we've talked about in the past with Drake like macro and micro like what are potential fatal flaws for him in the NFL and what are things that are minutia things that he needs to improve probably to be great but it's not going to be the reason why he's Zach Wilson 2.0 right and some of the stuff that JT pointed out I wholeheartedly agree with but but to me a lot of that stuff falls into the micro box the fact that he invites pressure at times or causes his own pressure and uh with his pocket movement that stuff can all be fixable and correctable to me CJ strout had the same problem uh even just last year and he's actually talked about um you know working on that the biggest thing that I see with it with Drake May when it comes to that kind of stuff is that you he just needs to quiet his feet down a little bit and know when you know let's call it two steps is is better than five like if he feels pressure coming off his right side and the you know the tackle's getting beat you know and he's feeling the edge Rush coming around instead of hitching up you know three times like he keeps hitching right he's just hitch hitch hitch hitch hitch instead of doing that just hitch up once reset your base make a throw right and sometimes like it's the it's the Brady thing it's the subtle pocket movement his pocket movement right now gets a little bit demonstrative where it's not subtle it's like all of a sudden you know he feels pressure and he does a nice job of sensing pressure but that pressure becomes him moving like 5 feet instead of two feet and we just got to get it him to be moving two feet to get into the center of the pck getting rid of we talk about the slot with receivers but with quarterbacks you can apply it too getting rid of unneeded movement yeah wasted movement correct so that that's a big thing with him uh that he needs to continue to work on and when I look at his playing style and some of his warts it's not a great combination with the offensive line when you have an offensive line that's going to be giving up pressure and now you have a quarterback that also moves into pressure and has a bad tendency to move into pressure you're it's it's your yeah it's a perfect storm exactly uh so I understand that element of it uh but the arrow is still very much pointing upward but if I had to point to one thing with his footwork that still is a work in progress cuz I think his footwork gotten much better since North Carolina uh but the one thing that is still work in progress is is U managing the pocket and I think some of that I I would say the one area of growth I want to see from him he's still sailing like a few too many short passes from my liking he had one in the game last week I think was he had one to pop too didn't he that he put like yeah so that one was interesting like I that one pop gets like rerouted yeah by the linebacker coming over the middle and I I think pop actually would have ended up where he threw it are you sure that was like way over his head he he jumped through it which maybe he didn't have to so I guess this is my point like if he can just settle down and hit some more of those short throws like that would be cuz you start sailing those kind of throws they're going to get picked off that that that's a good point he he had one against the eag I think it was uh well Mitchell Willcox caught one and then he had another one that was incomplete I don't remember who it was too but he's still a little and this goes back to the start of Camp you remember the first week I was like my big critique was I think his adrenaline's running a little high I think he's a little too hyped up and the ball's getting away from him I just if he can settle down on some of that shorter stuff because I think what happens is on a lot of those throws I'm talking about I'm trying to remember like each one of them all index but yeah they come with pressure and I wonder if it's just everything sped up and there's an adrenaline jump from I got to get rid of this ball shoot here's pressure go and he ends up you know putting too much on it and that goes to the exaggerated movements as well he needs to be a little calmer under pressure and look no quarterback's perfect Under Pressure I don't think there's one quarterback that's better under pressure than worse but if he can just be a little bit calmer under pressure just kind of take that half second to to to breathe and just not overreact to it that'll go a long way it it I I know I always go back to Josh Allen with him uh but it feels really similar to some of those other quarterbacks that has you know Josh Allen Jordan love I even made in the after further review on Monday some of the things that he does is a little Aaron roders you're not the first person to do that it's been a big take coming away from that game early Aaron roders I'm not talking about MVP Aaron roggers I'm talking about Aaron Rogers rookie Aaron Rodgers right back with the Packers third year Aaron Rogers yeah sure uh third year Aaron Rogers back with the Packers he does things that you would tell normal Court like if M Jones was out there throwing the way that Drake May throws then we would all be like you know the coaches would just be up in arms like it it'd be like what you can't do this like he can't play this way like you can't throw off your back foot right I don't care how open Mike giki is in in Germany and Frankfurt and you know running into the end zone you don't have the arm to be fading away on this throw Drake May almost to a fault has such a gifted skill set in terms of his physical tools that he can sort of get away with some of this stuff and so now the question is is you know how much do you coach it out of him cuz you don't want to make him robotic either you don't want to make him fight himself I think this is something that's really important for for Patriots fans to understand here as we get ready to discuss Drake May for hopefully the next like 15 years yeah I don't think his mechanics ever going to be perfect like you said you would never teach a quarterback to play the way he plays but there are some guys that make it work and if it works you don't fight it Aaron Rogers is a good comp I also go Steph Curry right like you would not teach somebody to shoot a basketball mechanically yeah the way Steph Curry shoots it like you would if a kid showed up at a camp shooting like that they'd make a ton of changes but obviously obviously it works for Steph Curry he's the greatest shooter of all time so nobody's going to touch that but it works for him I don't think anybody else can can mimic that yeah so you know it's not just say Drake May is going to be Steph Curry but like there's just some guys where they suck mechanically for lack of a better term there's some pictures like this too some major league baseball pitchers just the stuff they do mechanically doesn't make sense and you would never teach it but for that one individual it works and it works and they can compete at a high level with those mechanics and I'm of the belief when you have those athletes there might be things on the on the boundary you clean up here and there and say you know for instance one with Drake May that that you can clean up without I think messing with him too much is Just tightening up his release and getting the ball out quicker and less of a loop you can tighten that up some of the other stuff it works I'm not going to fight it if you get to a point where he's struggling then maybe you go in and you take a closer look but it's working for him and we're going to hear a lot here in New England that his mechanics suck and people are going to if he's good people are going to point to the and say no he's actually overrated look at his footwork look at this look at that I if it works it works with Rogers with curry I don't know why I'm blanking on the pitches but there's a bunch of them um if it work like Kenley Jansen has that weird hitch right yeah you probably wouldn't coach a kid to do that if a kid showed up doing that at a camp say what the hell are you doing stop doing that that's not how you throw a baseball but it works for him so if if it works for him then you know all the power to you you've kind of earned the right to do it yeah it's it's it's an interesting Balancing Act I guess with what to fix and what not to fix and i i i d TR Willis is who I was trying to yeah well it worked for a little bit yeah I definitely see some of the things um you know with his footwork that again you wouldn't teach a kid that you know an eighth grade kid that was trying to pick up playing quarterback for the and you wouldn't teach him how to throw it you know with his base like that um but he's so he has so much talent in his arm that it just doesn't necessarily matter for him as much and that's the thing that's going to you know the Rogers comp to me the biggest uh you know and I almost wonder if maybe I'm seeing uh some young Rogers uh because of Alex Vel like I I I don't dismiss that it's the footwork and the system that Aaron Rogers was playing in so like they might be coaching him similar but Rogers was Notorious and is still notorious uh for throwing with both feet off the ground like that is not something that most people do but Aaron roders does and the the pop Douglas one is like that exaggerated I'm not talking about those ones there's other ones in the game where both feet come off the ground and he almost like jumps into the throw and uh and you're like well you know why is he doing that and you look at the throw and it's like it's on the guy's hands right and so there's just little things like that at the end of the day Philip River is another one I'm thinking of more examples now yeah if you're putting it on the guy's hands I don't really care how you threw it in all honesty I I don't if you're putting on his hands consistently throw it behind your back for all I care if you're getting the ball there you're getting the ball there there's going to be a lot of this with him once he once he takes over as the starter this which so I I'm establishing my take now if the results are there I don't care about his mechanics yeah I'm like yeah he threw for 300 yard but did you see his feet yeah well I also saw him throw for 300 yards in the game so I I don't really care well as M Jones threw for 300 against the Eagles last year Well you you made the different the physical Talent is is let me rephrase that we threw for he threw for 4,500 yards this season did you see his feet yeah I saw him throw for 4500 yards I don't really care where his feet were he did it consistently thank you that is a better example season first game it's a tough one because you look for things uh on film a repeatable mechanics yeah and what you worry about is that some of the things that Drake does are not is not necessarily receptive to consistent repeatable accuracy down the field and we talk about some of the sprays and some of the things that he when he does have issues with accuracy you're like well if he was more consistent with his base and with his footwork and maybe that would clean up some of those issues uh but I actually I hear everybody on the sprays it it does look bad like the one to taekwon is not close that's not an NFL throw like NFL quarterback don't normally Miss Slants by 10 if he starts missing those throws then you take a closer look at his mechanics but yeah yeah but I also would just say with that and then uh and then we can move on from this uh that to me is also in the category of micro because like we're really talking about like two throws a game right so if he's missing a slant to taekwon thoron and maybe you know a pop pass or Li you know layup pass to pop Douglas there on the crossing route yeah it's not ideal that he's missing you know these short game throws or these uh you know these you know short throws but if he then follows that up with like a 15 yard completion then that's just it's fine what we are what I'm getting at is that for all of us myself included we all need to sort of get used to a different style of quarterback play with him he doesn't need to set Drew Breeze's career completion record to be a success yeah it's a different style even even though Mack was nowhere near Brady's Stratosphere yeah he was still more in The Brady mold in terms of what stylistically stylistically what he was good at and we are our eyes right now for as Patriots fans have been trained to the pocket Precision mechanically sound passer and Drake May is never going to be that you know I would go watch m holes Rogers love obviously Josh Allen like those are the guys that he's going to be mimicking at if he gets to that level it's not going to be Tom Brady it's not going to be if he fails it's not going to be M Jones it's not because going to be the same reasons that M Jones failed so that that is an adjustment for all of us like the touchdown that he threw to Kevin Harris when I saw him even live watching that I was like uhoh because I thought it was going to be a pick six and then you remember that he's throwing 101 mph right and it's like that's a throw that wasn't in M Jones's bag now I wouldn't necessarily suggest doing that often like I didn't love that throw to be honest but he has that kind of velocity in his arm so it's different it's just different and you told me you texted me on Monday you wanted Josh Allen you got Josh Allen yeah you don't get to you don't get to campaign for this exciting playground quarterback and then complain about the and then when he doesn't have the mechanics like no that's if that's what you wanted then you should have been J.J McCarthy guy but you wanted the exciting high ceiling Guy this is what like he's not going to be perfect you can't say all right well I want him to be the most electric playmaker ever and be the most tightly mechanically wound quarterback like that's just that doesn't exist yep all right let's get back to the calls and I do want to give our roster takes here in a second as well but uh Dave is in Maine what's up Dave hey guys how's it going hey good um so I'll keep it kind of quick I'm uh disappointed like a lot of people um I think actually Drake May is the one that gives us the best chance to win because um the only way the offense can overcome itself I think is with a little razzled Dazzle a quarterback and Drake May gives you that jacobe brassette does not and I guess my question to you is you kind of agree with that and also um what are you guys scared at all that Mayo can lose the locker room this way by riding it out with brette over May because you know the the players must see it we see it so surely the players see it and at what point does you think uh that becomes a problem and I'll take it off the air with that thanks you guys thanks Dave thanks for the call two good questions yeah to the second point it doesn't get to that point I feel like until they start losing yeah like right now maybe they saw see it in practice that Drake May is a better quarterback but they might say to them they can convince themselves yeah but jacobe is the more Pro ready quarterback I also think Jacob's a popular guy in that locker room I know a lot of fans don't like him which I think is unfair um that's crazy to me like there's he's such a a a good guy like I know that's not worth anything but he's stand well it's like he's standing in the way of Drake May and I get they're annoyed by that but that's not on him and he's a really good teammate he's a good leader he's a guy people gravitate towards he's always been that he was that Indie with Andrew luck yeah like he was a very popular player in that locker room and obviously Andrew Luck was the starter but um I think there's a level of belief in him and that kind of leads me to my first point to the first question about you know you need razzled Dazzle for the offense to work is Drake May going to give you the most razzled Dazzle yes of course I wouldn't say jacobe brassette doesn't give you that he he can do some pretty creative things with ball in his hands maybe not as regularly as Drake May and I don't know that he's going to be as spectacular but he's not exactly a statue he's not exactly a game manager either like he he can make plays out of nothing occasionally if he's given the opportunity yeah I I agree with the overall point that if you were just trying to put the the offense on the field that kind of gave you the best chance to win right now then I'd probably say that Drake May's uh improvisational skills is what I would call it that the the KJ Osborne touchdown only happens because it's Drake May and maybe those plays it it is it's easier on the receivers you know there's a yin and yang with the offensive line but it can be easier on the offensive line but in particular if you don't have great receivers when you have a guy that can do those kinds of things it's no matter what even if your receivers aren't great it's really hard to cover in the NFL for like five six seconds right so if the quarterback's moving around then it just gives the receivers time to to uncover and get open down the field so I I agree with all of that but I don't think that that's necessarily where they're at in terms of Drake May playing they're more worried about inst structure like how is he handling the instructure system running the plays that are being called and also obviously you know pre- snap and all that kind of stuff too that's more important in terms of checking boxes to get him on the field than just saying well he's just going to run around and make plays like because that's not as much as that's an element uh you know you watch Patrick Mahomes play I would say 75 to 80% of Patrick mahomes's plays are in structure it's just a of structure stuff are the highlights right those are the things that make it onto Sports Center so that's why everybody pays attention to that but for the most part him Allan like those guys play in structure a lot more than you think and so that's where they're trying to get with uh get to with Drake may all right let's uh alred is in North Carolina what's up alred hey Fells how yall doing good how are you all right Evan proud of you man I'm glad you did a positive RTI of our of your quarterback and I got to say I'm still in that Missouri show me Stak why you know like I said what you brought up is what we saw but I gotta admit he does look better he does look better than what he did in North Carolina but it still got them things where it's it's the short that's word you can throw it deep but it's the short thing but getting off of that let me ask yall a question okay yes sir um I got laughed at on pu for bringing this up so I'm going to bring it up again uhoh okay you got a franchise quarterback right so my question is why not I know you got draft capital and you got money okay it's a tackle like I said somebody told me well they already paid him the extension yes but they got another guy in this place that's going to take his place because he been hurt for a couple games he only miss like three or four games for the last three years but he's ranked number two behind Trent Williams I'm talk about durol from Minnesota yep why not give up a first and a player to go get that guy and then my other question is uh Brown uh from from Cleveland on the right hand side t uh somebody jumped over him they both young they both got got uh NFL experience and maybe you get uh get out of out of brown cuz Dar all you ain't got to worry about because he's the NFL quter he's the NFL tackle left tackle why not shoot for and I'll take your answer off the air thanks thanks El I appreciate it I mean off the top like Christian deras is an excellent player he's not getting traded I don't think he's getting traded those types of players I mean Trent Williams got traded I guess that's the exception to the rule Trent Williams aggressively shot his way out of Washington yeah AG like that wasn't even your typical player talks his way out like that makes what Brandon auku is doing right now look like child's playi and I don't fault him because that organization's a mess like don't I don't want this I don't want this to come off as me picking on Trent Williams but um yeah if attack shoots his way out of his team the Patriots should absolutely make the call short of that darow is not getting traded yeah darau is a great player I I I think he's one of the best tackles in the league I love darasa in the draft too I mean you could just see it yeah remember that you know there's when you watch guys like that in college and they just like look like they're Varsity against JV against Power five competition like this guy's going to be really really good uh when you turn on the film with darasa you you knew right away oh that's that's the guy I'm supposed to be watching like you didn't even need to look for a number uh he's he's a really good player I I highly doubt that Minnesota with I know he's hurt but JJ Justin Jefferson under contract uh like they're they're thinking of him being JJ McCarthy's Blindside protector for the next five years right like that that I would have to think that that's where they're at but if he's available then I obviously all for it I just don't necessarily see it who is the guy also I real quick I just want to clear it up because I phrased that wrong I forgot the exact situation Trent Williams didn't exactly shoot his way out of Washington um he had cancer the team doctors noticed it and downplayed it oh and then it turned out to be serious and he was basically so mad at the organization rightfully that he said he didn't want to play there anymore so that's that Situation's not happening every day so who was he talking about the brown I I don't know I said on the Browns yeah so the Browns have so I think Conlin so they have Conklin and they have Dean Jones I think Conlin got passed on the depth chart I think he lost starting job maybe to dwan Jones because that's who they're they maybe he was talking about dwan Jones I'd love dwan Jones yeah may maybe Conklin uh because dwan Jones they just drafted last year and maybe he's coming and I I think Conklin was on pup for a little while too I I I would take Conklin but I don't know that I'd give up I like if you're going to give up a third round pick for Jack Conlin right which I don't know am I off in that assessment of price probably not because he's a starting tackle in the league so you just and Conlin's a right tack he's a right tackle he's not playing on the left side yeah yeah you just used to third round pick on a right tackl and Kaden Wallace yeah at this point I'd rather see what he has and and if not you just blew two top 100 picks and and now there's no path for Kaden Wallace and you burn that pick you know I I know people would be like well you're complaining they don't have enough offensive line Talent now you don't want them to trade for somebody well I do want them to see what they have in the guys they did draft because what happens if Conlin like ages out you never developed Wallace now you blew two third round picks for nothing so I would at least see what you have in Kaden Wallace at this point if if Jack clonin was a left tackle I may feel differently but I they don't need to trade a third round pick for left tackle right now for right tackle right now they just don't need to do that that's fair let's take this last call and then we'll give our our roster reaction to wrap it up uh Mark is in Connecticut what's up Mark Evan Alex how you guys doing today doing great thanks for calling uh thank you uh Donovan Smith the uh tackle who used to play for Kansas City what is the uh deal with this guy he's been on the open market all over the off season I would have thought that we would have picked him up because I believe he's a left tackle any idea on what's going on with this guy yeah he's he's just done he's like and a lot of people ask about David bakari Charles Leno who's the other one who's with the Cardinals with the Cardinals there's another tackle oh DJ humph DJ humph and those guys had serious injuries last year Bak already last like three years so Donovan Smith's the one guy who's healthy and so you'd think maybe he's the guy he was really bad last year yeah got called for like a million penalties if he takes another step if the step back he took from 22 to 23 if he takes the same size step into 24 I actually don't think he's better than what the Patriots have yeah thanks for the they may see that too thanks thanks I appreciate it sorry to uh get you off the line so quick but we're we're up against a little bit yeah with uh with Donovan Smith it it did sound like just talking to um you know some of the Chiefs reporters that I know that he got better towards the end of the season last year and was like okay in the playoffs obviously won the Super Bowl so he couldn't that bad uh but it was rough there for a while with him especially with the penalties I mean I wouldn't be opposed to them signing him I just don't think he's a guaranteed answer I just feel like if he was if he was still good uh you don't just leave left tackles like that available you know on the open market like if teams thought that he could still play uh then I'm sure that he he'd be on a roster yeah um all right I really uh you know just wanted to wrap it up 53 man roster this probably would have been what we led the show with until we got the quarterback news but frankly it wasn't all that interesting I'm just going to be honest and uh some of that has to do with the state of the roster like I it just got to call Spade to Spade there wasn't a whole lot of NFL talent that they were like oh man we got like all these really good players we got a pick from all these guys so I was wasn't a ton of surprises I I the one I would even call him a surprise I just think if you had to say you know Evan what was your biggest surprise cut I would probably say Kevin Harris uh but he ended up back on the on the practice squad he clears waivers and they probably we okay with rolling the dice there thinking we'll get one of Terrell Jennings or Kevin Harris back on the practice Squad as kind of like a between the tackles you know um power back in that capacity so they they get him back I wasn't really uh too shocked by anything else no I Josh bledo would be the other one I thought he had a really good close to the summer good final couple preseason games and um more surprised he's not back on the practice squad he may look at it and say hey look I played well yeah I'm going to hold out I'm going to wait till I get a roster shot um and he has every right to do that obviously but besides that I mean I wasn't you know some other names people know obviously but I wasn't super surprised by Shawn Wade Jaylen rager they cut he's back and I think he'll be back on the actf roster at some point how many of these waiver claim guys so none of the waiver claim guys Eric Johnson is a fine depth player yeah um deantre Hunter I like as like a project tackle but I put him in the same boat as like Tyrone Wheatley where yeah he's starting games this year I'm worried maybe you see what he is down the road but how many of those four waiver guys do you think are still on the team like week 10 it's a good question I I agree with you with uh Trey Hunter by the way you don't have to call is that what he goes by yeah is it Hunter why yeah because they have two guys named Hunter the linebacker's name is Hunter too I thought the linebacker's name is Curtis Curtis Hunter Curtis Jacobs Curtis Jacob oh no there's two Jacobs it's Dem monre Jacobs that's what it isz you're throwing Jacobs I've struggled with this for two days now we need to learn these Nam uh yeah Trey Jacobs is the tackle the other tackle they signed as a guard yeah he not really Zack Thomas which is easy to Zack Thomas which is easy not but Zach Thomas is not the linebacker which also confused me cuz Zack Thomas is the linebacker why do I feel like your names are wrong right now can you pull yeah can we pull this up anyway like I I just it doesn't sound right to me uh but the Tyrone Wheatley comp I think is really good for Trey like I I feel like that's uh that that's where I'm at with him really like big dude like 66 315 320 like looks looks the part coming off the bus athletic uh can get out into some space like there's some film of him from the preseason on in space you know on toss plays you know pin poles things like that that's pretty impressive with his movement skill but he he's raw and and is going to have to develop yeah all right Trey Jacobs Zack Thomas Curtis Jacobs and Eric Johnson really I don't know where I got hunter from Jesus Christ you're all you're all over the place I think there is another guy named deantre Hunter who was in the draft recently that's probably I'm thinking of but I I I can't stress it enough with waver I know everybody's jonesing for the the next like gem toine on waivers it hardly ever happens that these guys turn out to be anything uh so I I've I've learned my lesson in that respect a little bit over the years uh you know I used to you find out about new guys I write big film reviews on them and I dive into their tape for hours and and then they so you did your job and they no no this was like no that's your job no it's your job excessive no it's your job and then in 3 weeks they be off the team yeah and so it just it is what it is with waivers but the one that kind of confused me and uh with the waiver claim cuz like you have four you claim four guys you have to put them on the roster so they had to create these spots and now in all is well that ends well in hindsight like they're probably going to get everybody back on the practice squad that they cut they they just have to wait on yeah three of the guys are back B ni clear waivers which we'll know in 10 minutes yeah so it it's probably going to end up being you know you know water under the bridge yeah in 10 minutes uh but the main thing I look at is I I really thought that uh that Tristan Hill had a nice Camp he did and I thought that he he's an NFL caliber ad depth defensive lineman like is Eric Johnson that much better than Tristan Hill I mean he's got more experience recently that would be the one thing it's a young group up front for them and he's played 28 games the last two years but outside of that he's also much smaller yeah I think he's like 64 290 yeah um yeah he's definitely more of a penetrating yeah I wonder if they play him a little bit on the edge too kind of like they used to use not the edge the end yeah like uh they used to use Lawrence guy yeah uh but not a bad player but I'm with you like I I don't know Tristan Hill made made a lot of progress and they have both of them like you said no harm no foul and it's not a bad spot to have depth guys get hurt and maybe they both end up on the active roster at some point but I don't I don't know they like needed Eric Johnson like they could have I don't know if anybody else claimed Eric Johnson do you just risk him getting through and Sig him on the practice well that's the thing is like now they get both so that's the that's the that's the reason why you do it right is now you have both guys uh and then just you know with Jaylen rager I I I keep saying this take because I want to I I know it's going to come regardless of how many times I say it but guys like Jayvon Baker and kaan booty it's on my radar that they might be healthy scratches week one against the Bengals and Jaylen rager goes to the practice squad uh he he's a vested veteran so he doesn't go through waivers you tell him this is just roster mechanics right roster minutia we're going to send you the practice squad we're still going to pay you your Freight because you're going to be on the game day roster for week one my guess is is that Jaylen rager gets elevated to the game day roster on week one he's active on game day to return kicks and play his role in the in on special teams and then be the backup X receiver to tawon thoron and a guy like kaan booty or Javon Baker is probably a healthy scratch maybe both are healthy my guess would be Reger week one week two and week three and then they revisit it when they run out of elevations week four right so this is that that angle of the roster is a little bichan like the way that they kind of every every team kind of manipulates those those practice squad elevations now I don't think that's just bill yeah so I I I can see that uh with Jaylen rager who's your other elevation it's a good question um it's be Mitchell will Cox it could be will Cox if he's healthy I also think it could be one of the running backs maybe Kevin Harris um you know I don't know where they view it right now at jichael Hasty in terms of like if they really F like I feel like jichael Hy is a player like I think that it's not just like a a a situation where you know they're going to play him in the kicking game like I actually think he could contribute a little bit well I I do wonder if they have him return some kicks and maybe that buys him some time on rager yeah that that that could be as well uh so that that's the roster so far um you know I I think the biggest thing though when you looked at at at this 53 man roster uh for the Patriots I liked what they did at receiver and Corner because that was the two spots where it felt like they had some surplus of NFL Talent yeah and rather than just worry about like positional thresholds and like you you're only supposed to carry five receivers and five corners like traditionally or whatever they kept the extra bodies at those two spots they seven and seven at both spots I was a little bit surprised that they went dial over Wade I think they wanted the whole rookie class to make the team I don't think that happened by accident I wonder too if it's just a little bit of like upside versus known commodity like Shawn Wade is probably is what he is at this point he's going into year four uh he's a fine depth Corner well I also think and I mean he got cut today so we'll see if he comes back I think Isaiah Balden kind of push Shan Wade off the roster with his ability to play in the slot yeah yeah Del Pettis good story undrafted free agent makes the team uh so that that was my biggest takeaways from The rosters there's only one more what is it how scared should Patrick Mahomes be and Kansas City I zappy fever knows no bounds I'm a little confused by that decision I'm not going to lie well you know who their backup is no it's Carson Wentz oh their quarterback room right now is just Patrick Mahomes Carson Wentz Bailey's zappy what a room lot of stories in that room he's very different from those two guys like even Carson Wentz has a little bit of that like Mobility athleticism size like you know like that's that's not baely zappy I I what happens to Taylor Swift get zappy fever I was a little surprised about that because I I thought he would go someplace where he at least had a semi shot to compete like he obviously 0.0% chance of zappy fever knows no yeah I I I was a little surprised by that you just know you just know it's not me rooting fory but you just know Mahomes is going to get hurt at some point zapp's GNA like win a big game for the Chiefs and it's going to be ridiculous you're not wrong in the media like well because they I mean they have a much better roster than the Patriots oh no they're not going to win because of zappy but yeah they could go into a game and like Andy Reid could could put together the Patriots won games with Bailey Zack remember when like 38-year-old Chad Henny won them a playoff game you remember that like something like that oh I remember the last thing I wanted to ask you about just we knew this was happening uh kind of like jacobe starting at quarterback but Joey Sly winning the kicking competition just your thoughts uh thoughts he earned it yeah he deserved it yeah I'm happy for him uh I do think they'll they they will and they should bring a kicker on the practice squad just in case yeah I'm kind of surprised it's not Chad Ryland I feel like it was going to be we would have heard by now CU they Ryland closed the gap there late didn't completely close it but he narrowed it um but the one thing with Joey s is a big leg I think they took those last two kicks on Sunday night to really get a gauge of where he was at and they know points are going to be at a premium and you know fourth and 10 from the 40 can we kick this thing right right so he gives them a little like obviously I like Nick Folk but Nick Hulk Nick Folk's whole thing was 40 and in he's automatic anything beyond that you're probably playing on going for it anyway you know if it's if it's close you're just not going to ask him to step out that much Steven gustowski was honestly kind of the same thing especially late in his career bill was always I just just make the gimmies I'm not going to ask you to make too many of the hard ones but I need you to make the gimmies Joey Sly is a little more we have more field goal range than the average team and you know are they going to take advantage of that if you have a kicker like Joey Sly I would hope they look to take advantage of that not that I want them to be super conservative and you know fourth and one from like the 35 maybe go for it right but for a team where points are at the premium expanding that field goal range it's Fourth and 10 from the 35 that maybe now is a little more of a a realistic field goal kick than it was before so I know you hate that concept no no I hear you first thing on Sly you know you kind of just said it but I I was looked at your numbers I put your numbers in my my appr yeah my write up by the way the numbers are big this year um love the numbers that might have I think they were bigger than the Hang times the 50 plus was not close in terms of makes right so I don't I did it was three of I think it was three for eight for Ryland and like seven for eight for Joey's no Ryland didn't have as many I thought that's what it was maybe it's was three for seven P it up it was not close that's the point right it was and really 40 so Ryland also struggled in the in the 40 range too yeah so that that was the big thing with the kicking competition I hear three of seven versus eight of N and then it was oh 40 to 49 it was only one difference 16 to 22 for Ryland 17 to 22 for Sly now let me ask you this because then we have to wrap up the show how how much we in the preseason we didn't get to see what Gerard Mayo's fourth down decision- making is going to look like yeah we're going to argue on this show about this this year I can tell because I if he's like Dan Campbell and he's just go for it go for it go for it it's going to drive you up a wall and I can't wait for it cuz we don't know we don't know we don't know yet wa you want me to get mad at him for something hasn't I just want to know if you're like if he's like an aggressive it doesn't have to be Staley but like if he's so much about the decisions as much as it is the philosophy behind the decisions if he's going for it cuz his gut tells him to go for it as a former NFL player great I love that if he's going for it because the data says then I'm out I hope he goes for it like I hope they're like go from cuz with Bill they were one of the least aggressive yeah knocking the microphone they're one of the least least aggressive fourth down guys decision makers in the league I hope that they're the most I hope they're Brandon Staley just to piss you off I think they're going to be pretty aggressive because defensive coach is going to trust the defense yeah that that's probably Fair like I I I think they're I think they're going to be pretty aggressive I do but I don't think it's going to be because of the math I think it's going to be just the former player coaches are generally more aggressive all right um there's a lot of emails and normally for our full 2our show I would have brought up some of the the concern about route spacing that we got in these emails uh I I just will say this really quickly about it because we got like three emails about it they people they they they we our audience knows us it's on my radar right I'm not ready to like Panic about it yet like this isn't two years ago where it's regular season games and guys are literally running into each other let me ask you this one question about it yeah obviously they're not running the full playbook in the preseason yeah how much of it do you just chalk up to it's preseason they're just running scratch stuff uh not maybe a little bit but like the biggest issue that I see is that like they're running routes into each other over the ball like I don't know any playbook in the NFL that has mirror dig routes running directly into each other over the ball there is a play like that in cfb2 that actually works super well I it doesn't exist it does in cfb2 that's one of my like goto that's one of my like goto third and Long play s careful what you say about they're Crossing like on a Crossing pattern or or it's mesh and it's at the it's at the shallow level right DRS right exactly then okay but angled dig routes at each other over the middle of the field never seen it that's not an NFL play like that should not be on the film so it's on my radar you know there was one with uh with Jaylen pul and uh Jem Bell Drake M forced it over the middle of the field like late throw over the middle of field not one of his better decisions in the game and uh Bell's the first through and the the the buzz Defender the robber he goes with Jem Bell and so what Drake Made does the right thing and he throws the second one in right because he takes the first one in like Jem Bell's got to get out of Dodge like you got to clear that out you got to clear the picture out for the quarterback so there are some route spacing things that are on my radar I know that some people I guess I haven't gotten a chance to watch Curt Warner yet you know JT svin and Kurt Warner did breakdowns I haven't watched Kurt Warner's yet but I know that was a lot of the Sation on Kurt Warner it's on my radar I'm not ready to hit the panic button yet because it's the preseason if it it's happening in in September then it will be something we will talk about trust me but I wanted to address that because there's a lot of emails about it and uh next week uh we will do the full two hours I promise a vet appointment actually for Alice that we got to get to but before we wrap it up uh football season is here almost and Sullivan Tire and Auto Service kicks things off in a big way with our exclusive goats Tire sale now go now through October 34st score big with Incredible savings on Bridgestone tires save $100 instantly $100 why am I talking like that save $100 instantly with the purchase slow down of four eligible Bridgestone tires Bridgestone the official Tire of the New England Patriots suvan tire.com for complete details go Patriots easy to drink easy to enjoy budlight the official beer sponsor of the New England Patriots will'll be back next week same time most likely 2:30 it looks like going to be able to lock that in two hours so we see you guys then to talk about the Bal thank you for downloading this podcast subscribe on Apple Google Play and everywhere else you listen like the show please rate and review us listener comments and ratings help keep us high in the podcast rankings so new listeners can find us be sure to check patriots.com for more news and more podcasts e for