Ritchie Torres | Full Episode 6.21.24 | Firing Line with Margaret Hoover | PBS

- Only in America. Young, gay, Afro-Latino, and a passionate Zionist serving in the U.S. Congress This week on "Firing Line." - I am fired up, and I'm looking forward to causing good trouble. - [Margaret] Growing up in public housing in the Bronx, raised by a single mother, Ritchie Torres never imagined he would one day be elected to the United States Congress. - My mother taught me that the most important lesson in life is to never forget where you come from. - [Margaret] When he was elected as a Democrat in 2020, at just 32, Torres became the first openly gay Afro-Latino to achieve this milestone. - I do not fit into the typical profile of a member of Congress, but what I feel that I bring to the table is the wisdom of lived experience. - [Margaret] In Congress, he has blazed his own trail. Notably, Torres is a staunch defender of Israel. - America has a duty to stand with Israel. - [Margaret] And he has sparred with the progressive members of his caucus. - The fundamental problem with the modern progressive movement is that it has let progressive purity be the enemy of progress in the real world. - [Margaret] With Trump making a campaign stop in the Bronx. - We are going to turn New York City around, and we are going to turn it around very, very quickly. - [Margaret] And polls showing trouble for Biden with minority voters... - The greatest challenge we face starts with I. It's not Israel, it's inflation. - [Margaret] What does Representative Ritchie Torres say now? - [Narrator] "Firing Line with Margaret Hoover" is made possible in part by Robert Granieri, Vanessa and Henry Cornell, The Emmett Family Charitable Foundation, The Fairweather Foundation, The Tepper Foundation, Peter and Mary Kalikow, The Asness Family Foundation, The Beth and Ravenal Curry Foundation, The McKenna Family Foundation, Charles R. Schwab, The Eric and Wendy Schmidt Fund for Strategic Innovation, and by the following. Corporate funding is provided by Stephens Inc. and by Pfizer Inc. - Congressman Ritchie Torres, welcome to "Firing Line." - It's an honor to be here. - You represent a multiracial working class district in the Bronx. A confluence of issues that are important to your constituents also lie at the center of the debate about the future of the country come November. Immigration, inflation, Israel. How is it that your district, which is a democratic district, is so on the nose of the issues that are most animating our national debate right now? - So I have the honor of representing the Bronx, which is arguably the poorest county in the United States. It's ground zero for racially concentrated poverty. It's full of single mothers who are struggling to put food on the table and pay their bills and keep their family afloat, and who have been hit hard by challenges like inflation. But it's also a borough that's rich with resilience. And my belief is that if we can make government work for the poorest congressional district in America, we can make it work anywhere in the country. - How are we doing? - We're making progress, but, you know, far from mission accomplished. But, you know, one of the great achievements of the Biden administration was the expansion of the Child Tax Credit during the American Rescue Plan, which cut child poverty by 50%, not only in the South Bronx, but throughout the country. I see child poverty as one of the greatest challenges we're confronting. - How did that influence your district? - It was a game changer. I mean, there were families who were receiving $300 per child every month, which meant more money to pay for utilities, pay for education, pay the rent. It was a much needed source of support in an age of inflation. But unfortunately, the expansion of the Child Tax Credit was left to expire in December of 2021 because of obstructionism from the Republicans. - You grew up in public housing, raised by a single mother. How does your experience inform how you lead the 15th congressional district today? - I do not fit into the typical profile of a member of Congress. I do not have a net worth of a million dollars. I do not come from a political family. I do not even have a college degree. But what I feel that I bring to the table is the wisdom of lived experience. You know, I know what it's like to face food insecurity and housing insecurity, inequality, and poverty. I was born and raised in the Bronx. I spent most of my life in poverty. I was raised by a single mother who had to raise three of us on minimum wage, which in the 1990s was $4.25 cents an hour. And my greatest hero is my mother. When I won my primary in June of 2020, when I knew that I was on a trajectory to enter the United States Congress, I publicly said that, before I'm a congressman or a councilman, I'm first and foremost the son of my mother, Deborah Bachelet. And the Bronx is full of single mothers like mine, who struggle and suffer and sacrifice so that their children and grandchildren can have a fighting chance at the American dream. So for me, representing the powerful mothers, the wise Latinas of the South Bronx, is the honor of my lifetime. I got my start in politics as a housing organizer because I grew up in public housing in New York City. So we have an institution known as the New York City Housing Authority, commonly known as NYCHA, which manages a housing stock that houses a half a million people. It's the largest provider of affordable housing in the country. In fact, if NYCHA were a city unto itself, it would be the largest city of low-income Black and brown Americans. And it's been so chronically underfunded, that it has a capital need of $80 billion and counting. So there are children in public housing who are struggling to breathe, who have asthma, in the face of leaking and molded conditions because of federal defunding. There are senior citizens who have to deal with the colds of harsh winters because their boilers keep breaking down because of federal disinvestment. There are disabled residents who are stranded in their top floor apartments with their elevators breaking down because of federal disinvestment. So for me, the living conditions in public housing represent a humanitarian crisis. And one of the cruelest ironies of our society is that the federal government, which primarily funds public housing, is arguably the worst slumlord in the United States. - Congressman, there has been some condemnation of New York City as a sanctuary city. As somebody who understands intimately the housing crisis in this city, how has it been impacted by the influx of migrants into New York City and the sanctuary city policies? - Yeah, so look, I embrace New York City's identity as a sanctuary city. You know, for me, immigration is the lifeblood of our nation. Were it not for immigration, we would have no essential workforce. We would have no entrepreneurial workforce. Immigration is what powers our country. But it is true that the wave of migration has been so overwhelming, that it's put real strain on the shelter system, on the social safety net of New York City. So we need to create a more orderly process by which we take in asylum seekers because the status quo is fundamentally broken, and it has put an unsustainable burden, especially in New York City. - Your district is one of the most diverse in the country, and it's also reliably democratic. Donald Trump came to your backyard last month for a rally. - [Supporters] USA, USA! - And a lot of people showed up. He made a lot of claims about the strong support he has in the South Bronx. And I wanna ask you about the national polling related to men of color in particular, Latino men and African American men, that suggests that perhaps Donald Trump is on track to do better with this key demographic of voters than any other Republican in several decades. How do you understand this polling and this possibility that Donald Trump is doing better with constituents who live in your district than any Republican prior? - Well, I reject the premise of the question. - Okay, tell me why. - I think if you examine the data rather than the anecdotes, the Bronx is Biden country. And I'm pretty sure Donald Trump is less popular in the Bronx than the Boston Red Sox. - Okay, but the premise of the question is actually about the national polling, not necessarily polling in the Bronx. How do you understand the polling, that African American men and Latino men in particular seem to have increasing support for Donald Trump and dramatically shrinking support for President Biden? Why is it men in particular that are so alienated right now? - Look, it seems to me that men are lagging far behind. Men are overrepresented in jails and prisons and underrepresented in the ranks of higher education. The opioid crisis has had a disproportionately destructive impact on men. We do have a crisis of men in our society, and I do see rage and disillusionment and anti-establishment sentiment. And it could be the case that there are men for whom Donald Trump is a middle finger to the establishment. But he is a snake oil salesman. You know, Donald Trump is loyal to one person and one person only, and that is himself. The ideology of Donald Trump is not conservatism, iI's not Republicanism, it's Trumpism. - In 1998, Republican Tony Garza, who had served as the Secretary of State of Texas under George W. Bush when he was governor, appeared on the original "Firing Line with William Buckley Jr." and spoke about the Hispanic vote vis-a-vis the two parties. Take a look. - I think one of the real changes, if you will, this election cycle, particularly with Governor Bush, was his willingness to get out, ask for the vote, and address issues that are of concern to the Hispanic community in a way that was not perceived as political, but with a certain consistency throughout the last 3 1/2 or 4 years that was very well-received. - But everybody asks for the vote, I assume, even in Texas. - Well, I've got to say, having grown up in Brownsville, from Brownsville to El Paso, along the border and within the Hispanic community, as a Republican growing up in that region, I saw a lot more Democrat candidates than I did Republicans. - Of course, the Hispanic vote is not monolithic, but the Latino vote in congressional districts along the border, particularly in Texas, but also some in Florida, the trend line towards increasing Republican support is going up. What advice would you offer Joe Biden and your party to stop those gains, or to change the attention and momentum back towards the Democratic Party? What could Joe Biden be doing better? - There's a tendency in Washington, D.C. to reduce everything to a messaging problem that has a messaging solution. And we should disabuse ourselves of the notion that there's a messaging problem. - So you're saying there's a policy problem. - The challenge at the border is not a messaging problem. It's a reality. - Yeah, yeah. - That requires a policy solution. The challenge of inflation is not a messaging problem. It's a reality. And we have to address it to the extent that we can. Now, the Republicans have been a stumbling block to problem solving. The only party in America that has a bicameral, bipartisan compromise on border security is the Democratic Party. All the leaders of the Democratic Party are for the compromise. Mitch McConnell was for it before he was against it, before he came out in opposition to a compromise that he helped negotiate at the behest of Donald Trump. And so Republicans have shown a greater interest in playing politics and demagoguing the issue, weaponizing it against President Biden, than actually solving the problem. But the best advice I could give the president is that recognize that it is a problem, and not simply a messaging problem. - Should he go to the border more? I don't think he's been to the border in Arizona recently. I mean, what should he do? - Well, there are limits to what he can do, because ultimately, the problems are so systemic that it can only be resolved by an act of Congress. He did issue an executive order-- - This week. - That will provide border patrol with emergency authority to control the wave of migration that is overwhelming the border. But again, the courts have a history of striking down these executive orders. So the president is doing the best he can within the constraints of his authority. Ultimately, there is no substitute for an act of Congress. Congress has to do its job. The Republicans in Congress have to do their job. - Well, of course, there was this comprehensive, bipartisan plan for an immigration bill that was scuttled, as you mentioned. You're on the Homeland-- - One side scuttled it. - That was scuttled by Donald Trump, that had the support of conservative Republicans and had been negotiated by conservative Senator Jim Lankford from Oklahoma, and then endorsed by the Border Patrol Union. They referred to it as the strongest border control reform that had been proposed to date. - And if I can add-- - Feel free. - The compromise took us as Democrats outside our ideological comfort zone. It was the first time in recent history that Democrats agreed to a compromise on border security without any immigration reform. Typically, we insist on the coupling of the two, and we decoupled. And the Republicans refused to meet us in the middle. - So then, I wanna ask you about something that Donald Trump said in the Bronx last month at the rally. You have been on the Homeland Security Committee. You're familiar with the issues related to immigration. In the Bronx, Donald Trump referenced his plan to deport millions of people from the U.S. if he becomes president again. - That starts with stopping the pouring into our country of millions and millions of illegal immigrants, which are causing a new category of violence called migrant crime. We will immediately begin the largest criminal deportation operation in our country's history. - What is your response when you hear that? - Look, we should see it for what it is. It's fearmongering and scapegoating from a dangerous, despicable demagogue. You know, Donald Trump infamously said that immigrants are, quote, "Poisoning the blood of our country," invoking rhetoric from the Nazis. - What is this new category, migrant criminal? - The narrative about migrant crime is more fiction than fact. It is well established that crime is far more prevalent among legal citizens than among migrants. And the overwhelming majority of immigrants who come here in search for a better life, in search for economic opportunity, simply wanna do right by themselves and by their families. - One of the things Donald Trump said in that rally was that, actually, the people who are coming here are people who are being dumped out of jails in various countries. - And we're not talking about just South America countries. We're talking about countries from Africa. Large numbers of people are coming in from China. And if you look at these people, did you see 'em? They are physically fit. They're 19 to 25. Almost everyone is a male. And they look like fighting age. I think they're building an army. There are 29,000 people over the last... I think they're building... They wanna get us from within. I think they're building an army. - There are some who think that Trump uses this rhetoric because he's laying the foundation for invoking the Insurrection Act, to use the military to round up millions of migrants if he is reelected as president. Do you think that's what he's doing? - We should never underestimate the danger that Donald Trump poses to our democracy. And there's no doubt in my mind that he is so authoritarian, that he is prepared to weaponize our institutions to advance his sinister political agenda. So do I know... You know, I will claim no insight into the psyche of Donald Trump. But I do know that he has no regard for the law, and he has no regard for the norms of our democracy. - This week, President Biden passed an executive order. You mentioned the challenge of executive orders is that they can often be overturned, but this executive order is one that protects the spouses and family members of legal citizens who are not here legally. Is this a helpful step for President Biden? - It's the right thing to do. You know, whether it's wise politically is a separate question, but... - Do you think it's not? - But there's no clear... I don't know, but there's no clear distinction. There is not necessarily a clear distinction between legal citizens and undocumented immigrants. There are countless mixed-status households in America that include people who have legal status and have no status at all. And it's in our interest to keep those families together. Like, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, we all should be pro-family. We should all be in favor of preserving the American family, including those that have mixed status. So I support the president's executive order to the extent that it strengthens the American family. - You have been described as Israel's loudest supporter in the House of Representatives. You're not Jewish, but you've been described as a loyal ally since you first visited Israel in 2015. How do you explain to folks who just have to think twice about a gay, Christian, Afro-Puerto Rican member of Congress who is so passionately Zionist? - Well, first, one need not be Jewish to combat anti-Semitism. Just like one need not be Black to combat anti-Black racism. And as you know, throughout history, there have been Jews who gave their lives for the cause of civil rights. 60 years ago, Michael Schwerner and Andrew Goodman, as well as James Chaney, were barbarically murdered in the Mississippi Burning so that Black Americans could live freely, unencumbered by the cruelty of Jim Crow. And so for me, the lesson learned from history is that we're all in this together, and we all have an obligation to fight extremism and anti-Semitism, no matter what form it takes, no matter what direction from which it comes. But I will confess that I am an improbable Zionist because for all of my childhood, I grew up in a community that was exclusively African-American and Latino. I had no engagement with the Jewish community, no knowledge of Zionism or Judaism. But a turning point came in 2014. I was invited by the Jewish Community Relations Council to go on a delegation to Israel. It was the first time I had an opportunity to travel abroad. And when I went to Israel, when I went to Yad Vashem, the Holocaust museum, when I went to the Masada where Jews famously committed mass suicide in order to escape enslavement at the hands of the Roman Empire, when I went to the Gaza Envelope, it was a transformative experience. And I remember speaking to the mayor of Sderot and the Gaza Envelope in the south, who said that the majority of his children struggle with post-traumatic stress, because families like his live under the threat of relentless rocket fire. You know, I come from the Bronx, where people live in fear of guns, bullets. But no one in the United States lives in fear of rockets. Like, none of us worry that Mexico and Canada are gonna fire rockets into American homes and communities. And so I came to realize early on that Israel faces a level of insecurity that has no analog in the American experience. - You recently were slightly critical of President Biden for withholding or pausing arms from Israel, and at times suggested he was pandering to the left. Are you concerned that his support for Israel is wavering? - President Biden, for me, has been the most pro-Israel president in American history. And he has managed to sustain support for Israel for more than eight months, which no other president has ever had to do. And, you know, my concern was not so much about the withholding of the weapons. It was publicly signaling declining support for Israel. Like, we have to recognize there are two wars unfolding. There's the war in Gaza, but there's also an information war unfolding on social media platforms. We have to be mindful of the words we speak. And if we signal to the world that American support for Israel might show signs of wavering, then we are unwittingly playing into the hands of Hamas. So I would ask all elected officials to be mindful of the information war. - It may surprise some people that you've recently split with the progressive movement. You said, "I didn't leave the progressive movement. "The progressive movement left me." You received some pushback for the comments. - I'm shocked. - And, clearly you're used to this. A New York magazine column said, quote, you had "Chosen the powerful over the powerless." How did the progressive movement lose you? - Well, first, when I entered public office back in, when I first ran back in 2013, the progressive position on policing was police reform. Today it's become defunding the police or abolishing the police. Back then, the progressive policing on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict was the two-state solution. Now it's BDS or one-state solution to the exclusion of Israel. And so I have felt alienated from what the progressive movement has become because it has become radicalized. And in the end, you know, I'm here to represent the sensibilities of the people of the Bronx. And the people of the Bronx are not ideological, they're practical. They're not radical, they're moderate. You know, what people want in the Bronx is not under-policing or over-policing, but better policing, more accountable and more transparent policing. What people in the Bronx want is peace between the Israelis and Palestinians. We all want Jews, Christians and Muslims to coexist in peace and prosperity, which is why I'm so passionate about the Abraham Accords. So I'm far more pragmatic. The fundamental problem with the modern progressive movement is that it has let progressive purity be the enemy of progress in the real world. - You have spoken really poignantly about your own struggles with mental health. You reference that you dropped out of college. Of course you had been enrolled at NYU. You had been a stellar high school student. What have you learned about mental health that impacts how you think about public policy related to mental health? - Well, for one thing, mental health is nothing of which to be ashamed. You know, I've been honest about my struggles. About 15 years ago, I found myself at the lowest point of my life. I had dropped out of college, NYU. I found myself struggling with depression. I even attempted suicide. I underwent hospitalization. I felt as if the world around me had collapsed. And as a result of receiving mental health care, you know, I rebuilt my life. And I put myself on a new trajectory. And seven years later, I became the youngest elected official in America's largest city. And then seven years later, became a member of the United States Congress. Every day, I wake up and I take an antidepressant, and I feel no shame in admitting it. I'm living proof that mental health care can enable you to be the best version, the most productive version of yourself, even in a highly pressurized environment like the United States Congress. And so I feel like the central lesson of my story is that, even in your moment of greatest despair, never lose hope. I feel like only in America is a story like mine possible. So I feel like the most grateful person on earth. And I've risen on the strength of mental health care. - Representative Ritchie Torres, thank you for joining me on "Firing Line," and thank you for your service. - It's an honor to be here. - [Narrator] "Firing Line with Margaret Hoover" is made possible in part by Robert Granieri, Vanessa and Henry Cornell, The Emmet Family Charitable Foundation, The Fairweather Foundation, The Tepper Foundation, Peter and Mary Kalikow, The Asness Family Foundation, The Beth and Ravenel Curry Foundation, The McKenna Family Foundation, Charles R. Schwab, The Eric and Wendy Schmidt Fund for Strategic Innovation, and by the following. Corporate funding is provided by Stephens Inc. and by Pfizer Inc. [upbeat music] [upbeat tune] [gentle music] - [Announcer] You're watching PBS.