#17 Dwarfism Doesn't Define Me, Fats Timbo

[Music] hello welcome to be my guest with me Rory Smith I have to be totally honest with you here before talking to Fat Timbo I had some very preconceived ideas about online content creators or influencers as they're called very old-fashioned very naive views but fats has totally changed my view I think it's brilliant what she does and there's no difference in what content creators are doing than what anyone else is doing on telly on radio magazines books in fact fats has made me think that content creators actually do better and more meaningful work than any of that it's not about the platform it's about the work that they do on it so when it comes to fats that's the first thing that she taught me and now the important stuff this episode was to be honest once again a huge education for me if I met Fat's Timbo before this interview there is no way I would have used the word disability when describing her condition in fact I actually wouldn't have used the word condition but she taught me why it's important for people to see and to acknowledge her disability but also to see that there's much more to her than just her disability now this all sounds very Worthy but fats did what fats does best she taught me all of this in her very downto Earth and very funny way people like fats are the true role models that young people should have today and here's why you were born in London with acondroplasia which I hope I'm pronouncing right you are great good start and it's a form of dwarfism now I have to be totally honest when I was researching your story I was quite surprised to come across that word on the NHS website because I would have thought that that word is offensive do you find it offensive the word uh dwarfism or um a conr plure dwarfism dwarfism you know what because it's the medical term the the term dwarfism itself is not offensive but to me someone just saying oh she's just a dwarf kind of gr like grindes my gears a little bit because it kind of reminds me and makes me think that I'm a mythical creature which to be honest what why I prefer the term little person mhm I prefer that way more than dwarf or the the really offensive word because it allows me to sound like a normal human being who happens to be a person and um it it says what I am a little person mhm it's quite difficult that isn't it because I think there's a lot of I hope there's not but there could be a lot of naive people who would say well if it's on the NH website then I can use it and it just it it has taken me so much by surprise that that's there is that something that anyone's in your community working on to change um not that I know of but I I think that actually um I take that back so I think that other little people shows like little women of Atlanta Little Women of LA is basic basically a franchise um reality show in America where a lot of the Little Women Express how much they prefer the term little person mhm rather than dwarf because of the exact same reason I stated and um I'm glad they have said that on their show because it made me validated it validated the reasons why I felt uncomfortable with the term dwarf so um yeah there is a few people that are um championing to change that you know I know it will take some time and I I know it will the message will take longer because there's fewer of us it happens in one in 3,000 birs so we are very rare but slowly but surely it's it's going to change good and with watching that show on television that's a relatively new show did you see a lot of people with the condition growing up on TV that represented you uh growing up no not necessarily whatsoever um I usually see little people in comical characters like um Umpa Lumpa in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory Mini Me in um Austin Powers so all these characters are mainly comical characters that made me feel like okay I see myself in them but they're not seen as real human beings they're just seen as fictional funny characters that um later carried on into my life where people would see me as that and I had this certain conf confusion in my life where I think okay people are comparing me to an Umpa Lumpa because that's what they see and then I'm just living a regular life where I just want people to see me as fats not um not this dwarf you know not this mythical creature so it was very challenging growing up with those representations of myself mhm it was it was very difficult because I was often bullied I was ridiculed um with with name calling um so many time if if I was if I had a pound for every single time someone called me an umpalumpa I'd probably be a millionaire to be honest with you but um yeah it was really difficult not seeing myself in media in a serious way but slowly and and and surely it kind of changed um there was a show called The undata bles which I actually um later joined um and that was the first time I ever saw a black little woman ever in my life and I thought to myself wow there's people that look like me I'm not the only one so that's why I express so much why it's so important to have representation in media for for um marginalized groups because we need our voices to be heard we need our stories to be heard and we need to see ourselves in traditional forms of media so that we don't feel as alone in society see you've you've summed that up perfectly because so many times we hear that word representation and it's it's almost diluted over the past few years perhaps because of brilliantly how much it's being used but perhaps it then loses its meaning in some sense but that's exactly what it means to me it's that you can see someone else like you on TV or on Tik Tok or on social media so that when you are younger that you don't feel so alone you don't feel like the only one exactly exactly which can be so damaging as a child how how lonely was that for you not seeing people like you on TV in your in your teenage years which are difficult enough already it was very very lonely I found it hard to relate to people and it kind of turned into self-hate which I didn't even realize um when my parents asked me if I wanted to go to Little People conventions where I could meet other little people um I refused because it felt alien to me to meet other people that looked like me when I wasn't used to that but when I actually faced my fears and met other little people that were like me as an adult it completely changed my life and it made me regret as a child to not meet other little people um because I would have probably had more confidence um as a teenager so Ju Just just to clarify your parents aren't little people right no they're not they're both average height and um actually 75% of people with dwarfism have average height parents so it's very common but it's very rare at the same time so it's common to have average height parents but it's rare to have a child with orphism have you ever had the conversation with them about how they dealt with you growing up and learning about it themselves but also teaching you um my my dad he actually works in mental health or used to work in mental health sorry um he used to work in mental health and um I think for him it was really important to have my mental health in check so he put me in counseling so that any things that would happen in the day or that week um I I didn't have to express it to them every single time because for them as parents having a child with orphism was really hard um trying to relate to me trying to be understanding and trying to give me that love and encouragement that I needed every single day as a child because of the Discrimination that I faced every single day um and then when I when I did have that that that that helped me and then it helped me through um being in dance school they put me in dance school and that's where I could express myself uh creatively and not think about having dwarfism it made me feel like I belonged it made me feel like I was somebody that had this Talent not somebody that has a disability so they tried their best to find ways for me to have Outlets where I would Express this confusion and anger and and and hurt so um and I think they did an amazing job to be honest with you because even though I'd have a rough day I'd come home and it would be Be My Safe Haven it's interesting that because I think with parents they will feel that need to a lot of times try to fix everything but it sounds like in your case that they weren't out there to fix it but to find ways to help you to find external things like counseling or the dance classes just to give you that space at home to be able to find things yourself and discover things that would help you and then eventually lead to discovering yourself right exactly and I think that was really really important for me like to find myself to to be comfortable in myself to be confident you know they really helped me find confidence within myself instead of wallowing over the fact that I have dwarfism M did you have a big friendship group in school I did actually I did and they were really supportive very protective over me especially when it came to bullies um sometimes even getting into fights because of me because people would try me and then my friends would be like no no one's messing with that so I'm glad I had that growing up I I was I was bullied um in my darks School uh because I felt so isolated um a lot of the kids didn't really chat with me and um some did but a lot of the popular people didn't and it was the same in college I was isolated again um I think a lot of young people are trying to navigate their own selves and um when they're learning in life sometimes they don't don't realize that some people are scared to to approach them and scared to express themselves so I just kept myself a lot of the time um which I regret but at the same time it made me a very strong person where I can be alone in a space but still be fats you know what what impact did the bul in the name calling the Laughing have on how you viewed yourself I I think I felt very secluded I felt like I didn't belong I wasn't a happy person when I was outside because it made me feel like what's the point you know so I came to a point where I was almost um suicidal because I felt like every time I step outside it's like I'm wearing a funny costume everyone's looking at me and what's the point of living what's the point of living if people are looking at me people are making names at me every single day because of what I look like um and I was in a very dark place very very dark place where I just hated being outside that was like the outside fact but in inside my home I was happy because I was showed love so if I didn't have them I don't know where I would be I don't know where i' would be if I didn't have my family because I I was going to ask you for for people listening who are in that dark space and we hear so many times of well here's the darkness and here's you know there's light at the end of the tunnel but it's very easy saying that but when you can't even see the light at the end of the tunnel what are sort of the things that helped you to get through that things that I would change about um getting out of that dark space as a teenager um I would I would now listen to other people's stories I would follow people that would make me feel good where I could relate to their stories um currently now in fact uh side note I'm talking to other um people with dwarfism other Little Women um they're teenagers now and I think it's really important for me to support them as they're going through this journey um because they're discovering so many new things life is a lot there's so much support that's needed and um I'm giving them that um space that I didn't have growing up so it's really important to to um follow the people that make you feel good follow the people that you relate to um have a counselor I know right now it's it's quite hard to even get a counselor because of the waiting lists but I think it's definitely worth the weight it's worth whatever it takes to get one because um without having that space to talk about your emotional feelings it's really hard to just bottle it up and keep it to yourself it's it's so important to not keep it to yourself it's really important to look out for your mental health um read books about self-development um I read a book called The Secret mhm that helped me how to manifest what I want in life and manifest feeling good about myself um and it gave me the the best tools to to develop into a person that I never thought that I would ever become or be um so and I I think yeah I think that's really important when you're talking about your mental health and and about talking to someone because again it's just one of those things that thankfully he been out there the message is talk to someone but even that can be very very difficult when you're in those dark moments but speaking to someone perhaps outside of your circle outside of your family outside of your friendship group that might be a professional is actually a really healthy step forward because you might be in a place where you want to share those intimate details feelings Thoughts with those closest to you because you may feel wrongly that you're a burden to them right exactly and um that's that's the reason why I think it was so important to have a counselor instead of talking to my family all the time and and putting that burden on them when um yes I would tell them a lot about my day but there was some things that I had to hold back on because um I didn't want to I was thinking about their emotional uh well-being as well mhm but it's really important to have um someone to talk to outside of your um Circle M was there a moment in your life a pivotal moment where you decided that's it I'm no longer going to allow this to affect my life negatively when it it was when um I read the secret by Ronda Burns and um I had to or actually before that I was watching videos about life as a little person and um the lady said that she was reading self-development books to help her uh gain the tools to be the person who didn't care about what people thought and and and have um a lot of mental or emotional stability cuz I was thinking I really want to be that person I want to be that person that doesn't care about what people think and just and just be who I've always dreamt of which is somebody that helps others um so that was the moment I think for me because like I said before I hadn't like watched other little people before and this was the time when I was actually really intrigued to see what it's like for other people that look like me um what their lives are like and if they are in a positive space I want to be in there I want to be exactly where they are in that positive space so um I think it was being tired of feeling like I wasn't worth anything tired of not feeling confident and tired of just the same um reality negative reality so once I started to do that um I felt better about myself a little bit just a little bit and I saw an ad um one day a casting call about modeling and I thought to myself okay well I've done dancing in the past um and if this helps other people to see little people and it helps other disabled people think okay let me get into modeling let me give it a go cuz my parents have never ever like made me shy away from doing things for the first time I kind of thought you know what I have nothing to lose absolutely nothing to lose more to game um yeah so I gave it a go they picked me and it was in my it was an underwear shoe MH so I was very hesitant at first because it was like okay this is really out of my comfort zone but I thought what do I have to lose maybe I can manifest something who knows so um yeah I posted the pictures from the shoe on my Instagram MH that was scary as well I bet that was terrifying but um yeah again I just kept having the same mindset what do I I have nothing to lose I'm at rock bottom so there's nothing that can like you know make me feel even worse about myself I just want to find that place where I'm just Brave where I'm just uh positive so I did whatever it took and that video not video that picture um really really did well where I didn't really expect to get that response so many people were like oh this is the representation we need to see love this picture and I thought wow this is so cool I'm kind of getting addicted to this feeling of of of trying to build a community and trying to do new things now because clearly this is what I need to do MH so I did more modeling shoots with the company new nude um I I decided to do more videos online as well um I decided to talk about more my disability um because clearly that's what people wanted to see so I thought okay let me give it a go and my followers started to grow my community started to grow and I was like I said I was addicted to the feeling of of of building something that I don't know what what is going to be in the future so um yeah that was that Pinnacle moment for me it's interesting when when you when you talk about that and you talk about those first posts that you did on social media and you're sort of thinking to yourself well people are liking them that's fine this is all well and good but now you know at the moment at the time of this recording you've got 2.9 Million followers on Tik Tok 55.6 million likes was that intentional or was that accidental that was absolutely accidental um the P the pandemic was an accident so that was an accident during the P so so we went into lockdown and I heard on the radio that there was an app called Tik Tok that people are absolutely obsessed with and are spending hours on it so I thought okay I want to venture into comedy videos because on Instagram I'm mainly doing modeling pictures um I'm mainly doing dance videos but people don't know my funny side mhm so I kept talking to my family about this for weeks and weeks about possibly venturing into comedy videos and because Tik Tok was new and just started I thought okay this is my opportunity to show my funny side on Tik Tok MH and um that's exactly what I did and it wasn't a thing where I want to have millions of followers um or anything it was again to build a community cuz I didn't actually um monetize my social media M it was mainly for fun at the time I was working as a dancer and an accountant I know two opposite jobs but it was very fun at the same time very opposite yeah so at the time I was I was working two jobs and doing social media for fun and seeing where it goes at the time I had been on it for like two three years um um so I thought okay let me Venture into Tik Tok now started making comedy videos and um yeah the small small following of like 50 followers for how many months um was loving my content that one commenter was loving it um and but I saw it at the time as I'm learning how to use this app mhm this is just a way for me to learn how to use the app before I blow up somehow um by then I would be a professional you know that's what I was saying to myself um because I learned through Reading um self-development books especially in um how to not give a f uh by Mark Manson um the the basic understanding of self the positive selft talk so um I kept doing that as well so just just thinking okay um this is this is this is a negative thought but let me counteract of a positive thought so um yeah one day one of my videos blew up insanely I woke up my phone was super hot I was thinking oh my god my phone's going to explode what's going on and then um yeah literally I saw that 11 million people had seen my video I've got over 100,000 followers um and I just thought oh my God what is going on that was an insane day um every time I was refreshing a thousand a thousand followers um following and I thought wow okay yeah yeah I've really blown up happened sooner than I thought but okay you got there so yeah I got there and just kept posting during lockdown and I think lockdown was The Perfect Storm for me to to blow up do comedy videos and and people to see what I'm about because they have the time I think I think there's still a slight stigma around particularly around the older Generation Um with content creators thinking that's not a real job all you do is just post videos online but it's it's so much bigger to you isn't it it's so much more meaningful than that whenever you're thinking about a post and using your platform as a whole what is your intention behind it my intention is whoever's watching this video the message I want to send across is I want to make them laugh I want to um show them that people with disabilities especially people with dwarfism can make you laugh can do makeup Whatever video I'm doing whether it's Beauty lifestyle or comedy um my my goal is to represent and those that are disabled I want them to look at me and think oh I want to get into content creation as well you know so for example if it's my um relatable comedy videos about being annoyed with your African mom you know like I just I just want to make you laugh being me yeah you know not just because I have a disability I just want people to to to um look at it and have a subconscious thinking oh okay she's got a um she's she's got a condition but she's still funny you know and and that normalizes my condition and disability in general and those two words that you use there condition and disability I would have thought before researching you I would have not use those words around you because I wouldn't have thought naively that you have a disability and even a condition as such um but I know that you you're a big advoc to say yes it absolutely is a disability why is that it is because simply using the example of can I drive your car no I can't because I've got little legs and I would need to adapt it so the reason why I call it a condition and a disability is because I'm in a world where everything is for average height people not everything at all is for little people so I struggle to use bathrooms because I can't see myself in the mirror sometimes the sink can be really high so I need help um washing my hands even in my own kitchen um I have to use a step stol to um to to cook MH um and if I was in a world where it was fully accessible then I wouldn't be classed as disabled but because I am that's why I I am classes disabled I hope that makes sense it it it absolutely does make sense it's because it's because of the accessibility around you not because of the condition yes exactly that Ah that's interesting exactly that because you you you you are getting the sort of wheels of my head turning here and I'm thinking like when you go on a plane that must be difficult like the steps must be difficult or put your luggage up above the I I even I get um I get disabil is it disability help yeah I get disability help because of the distance because of my little legs um I'm practically doing double the steps as an average person so I get tired easily yeah so I get a wheelchair to to to um help me go around so my boyfriend fiance I should say pushes me around or um the airport staff will push me around and then um they will help me uh with the steps as well so um they'll help make sure that they use a machine to boost me up if if that makes sense like a vehicle yeah but if not then I'll just walk up the stairs but because there's a lot of stairs it's a lot yeah so but this is this is exactly why you do what you do because these are the things that people don't think about including me 100% And even with my um disability um there's certain weird let me not call it weird but like side effects um symptoms that I get as well so some often I would have um ear infections with my condition because there is fluid in my brain it goes to my um ears and causes deafness um when I have my frequent ear infections so as a child I'd often uh get surgery in my ears to make sure that my ears are fully in check if that makes sense yeah yeah so um um luckily I don't have sciatica as of yet because I go to the gym mhm but if I didn't I probably would have by now um is it is the gym difficult for you the gym the gym is somewhat difficult for me because a lot of the machines I can't use or I have to really adapt or I try find a way in my own way to use it so for example like the leg machine the leg extension I can't fully sit back so I have to use a really lightweight to um push the weight up because I can't rest my back on it if I if I did then I could do a heavy weight but because my back is involved as well um I have to um do a lighter weight and then with the bike cannot use any bikes because I can't reach it with my legs um sometimes with the treadmill if it's too high depending on which treadmill I use I ask someone to help me press the buttons because I can't reach it um are I'm just I'm just thinking of of all the things in life now are clothes difficult to buy clothes are they're not difficult to buy but I have to strategically shop so in the sense that I need to think about what material I'm using so let's say if it's not stretchy um then I can't buy it because it wouldn't um how do I explain this so let's say for example people might look at me and think oh she's wearing kids clothes but kids clothes don't fit a a body like mine where I'm full chested yeah I have I'm a curvy body I've got a curvy body so I have to wear adult clothes but the problem with adult clothes I have to cut the sleeves I have to cut the sleeves and cut the uh bottoms of trousers so I have to strategically look at clothes that I I can easily tailor or easily roll up mhm so yeah it's not hard but I strategically do it yeah you've learned over time yeah yeah I've learned over time what works for me and what doesn't work for me yeah it it must be a it must be quite a tricky balance in doing what you're doing in order to show people that it's a disability and to make people see it but also make sure that that's not the only thing they see exactly yes so I find it easier to to make comedy out of it because then I'm not preaching about it but at the same time I'm educating people so in one of my videos I um did a video about how parents react to their kids staring at me and I kind of ruffled a few Fe feathers because um a lot of parents were like yeah let's teach our children and then other parents were like oh but they they're just kids you know and I and I said see that's the problem you're not you're if you're allowing the issue of them um staring at me and pointing and laughing right in front of you you're basically saying it's okay but if you told them off at the time and said you know some people are just different you don't need to stare at her wave or something if you're intrigued simple simple thing like that could change their ception forever mhm with with adults doing that has your reaction changed over time with adults doing that to be honest I do it for adults nowadays because they still don't do that they still just keep quiet or just maybe look at me as well with their child so when I say quite frankly oh it's not good to stare that's when the the the parent will step in because they probably have their own Prejudice going on about disabled people and when I speak up that's when it's like oh okay now I need to do something MH are you through all of the work that you've done on yourself you know when you see your reflection now in the mirror what do you see I see a fabulous brave fun and loving black woman that's who I see I see someone that's gone through so much in their life but has turned it around in such a positive way and hopefully can change other people's lives by doing what I'm doing now and a person who is helped you in your journey is your lovely which you slipped up on no longer boyfriend your fiance yes yes congratulations that's incredible news thank you so so much um yeah Alan's the love of my life we met five years ago and he's actually got a disability himself he's got s py and I think going out with someone um that has a disability as well really changed my perception on love because the way we look at each other and and and support each other um through life we have that understanding mhm that no one well not no one but other people with uh disabilities might not so um yeah it's it's been the best with him and yeah love him I can with all my heart I can tell because you did a beautiful little video when you're in Thailand where you got engaged and you said on the post you said from the day we met I knew you were my person over the last four years you've changed my life for the better I can't wait to be your wife so yeah in what ways has he changed your life for the better he's given me the love that I never thought I could have in my life mhm um that unconditional love where even if we're fighting even if I'm mad or he's mad at me we have that love for each other because we we have that understanding we we have so many similarities yet we are so different as well um yeah and I can't wait to be his wife I can't wait to be his forever um person you know so and I can't wait to have children with him not yet you know we're still waiting yeah but I think having CH children with someone like him where he's so understanding because before um I actually didn't even want to have kids cuz 50% it's a it's a 50% chance I could pass on the gene to um my my CH my Offspring my child um which was a very scary to me because I thought all the things that I've gone through in my life do I want my my future children to go through that but he made me think because of who I am today and because of the strong unit that we are we're capable of that MH so he gave me he's given me that belief that I can I I should have children and we are going to do the best that we can if they do have dwarfism wow that's incredible do you do you know when you're going to get married hopefully next year mhm that'll be good um in the summer in Cornwall um I didn't want to make it a destination wedding because I want everyone at my wedding I want everyone there I want it to be a big Affair yeah I know that you're such a huge role model for so many people as we discussed all those followers and Tik Tok and social media and everywhere but someone like you still needs someone to look up to Who's Your Role Model my role model probably has to be Mary Russell and you might not know who Mary Russell is um she is the first black disabled little woman that I saw on the undata bles that really changed my perception on how I see myself um I think she's an amazing woman she has a child with DSM and he has had a child as well so she's a grandmother and I just look at her life and I just think I I I want My Future Self to be you right now so um she's in her late 50s and I think she's she's killing life right now what do you because if if you're looking at someone like Mary Russell who's such an inspiration to you and all that she does for people and it sounds like you just love to help people to get the message out there and improve enrich people's lives what do you get out of that what I get out of that is a sense of gratitude I get um a sense of relief as well because that that little girl or little little girl I should say that little little girl that was urgently searching for that representation is is providing that for other Little Women other disabled people you know so it's it's providing that sense of relief that sense of um Solitude for other people when people feel good around me or because of me that makes me feel good and I think that's all I need in life and that's all that that I want to give to people making them feel good about themselves and I think a lot of this comes from your parents and the love and the acceptance that they showed that little little girl what 100% what do you think is the most valuable lessons that your parents taught you um how to love myself how to be disciplined um how to eliminate outside voices because they really taught me how to not react I have never seen my parents react to any person that's looking at me funny that's um saying mean things they have quite a p poised attitude and that's something I've acquired now where I've literally learned how to just block out the noise and focus on what I'm doing if I catch someone looking at me um I'm I'm staring at them back yes but I don't take it personal I don't take it to heart anymore and that has really helped with my emotional stability in life yes sometimes it does hurt I'm not going to lie but I'm glad I've got to a place where when I go outside I know I have this Invisible Shield where most things don't hurt me if you could go back and talk to that little little girl what would you tell her I would tell her keep doing what you're doing you are on the right path to where you've always wanted to be and please do not take anything personal see it as there's always a reason for something so all those stairs all those people looking at you all this times that I was isolated it was to make me a stronger person which I didn't realize at the time [Music]