‘Roman candle of anger’: What it’s like to play Donald Trump in debate prep

Intro THE EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW ON MORNING JOE, MONDAY MORNING, THAT STARTS AT 6:00 A.M. EASTERN ON IN THIS NBC. JOINING ME NOW, DEPUTY Debate prep ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE AND SPOKESPERSON FOR HILLARY CLINTON. HE PLAYED DONALD TRUMP DURING HILLARY CLINTON'S DEBATE REHEARSALS. GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN, FELIPE. LET'S TALK ABOUT DEBATE. IT IS USUALLY SHROUDED IN SECRECY, ALL THE PREP. BUT WE KNOW THE PRESIDENT IS SURROUNDED BY MULTIPLE ADVISERS, SOME OF WHOM YOU KNOW VERY WELL. DESCRIBE WHAT YOU THINK IS GOING ON IN THAT ROOM IN CAMP DAVID THIS WEEKEND, AND HOW DO YOU EXPECT BIDEN IS PREPARING FOR THURSDAY'S DEBATE? >> WELL, I WILL START WITH THE CLIP YOU JUST SHOWED. BECAUSE THEY ARE STARTING FROM A POINT OF SAYING EXACTLY WHAT VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS SAID, THAT IT IS A CONTRAST AND SHE LAID OUT THE ARGUMENT PERFECTLY. IT IS BEING LED, THE DEBATE CAMP AT CAMP DAVID, BY SOMEONE THAT IS PROBABLY THE BEST AT THIS, THE PRESIDENT'S FIRST CHIEF OF STAFF. HE HAS DONE THIS FOR BIDEN IN THE PAST, FOR HILLARY CLINTON, FOR PRESIDENT OBAMA. THE OTHER HAND FOR THIS, THERE IS SOMEONE THERE WHO, WHILE KAMALA HARRIS, IMAGINE IF WHILE SHE WAS SPEAKING MIKO IS JUST YELLING AT HER, EVERY COUPLE OF SECONDS SAYING THAT IS NOT TRUE, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT, I DIDN'T SAY THAT. I DIDN'T DO THAT. THAT IS THE CHALLENGE HERE. NOW, OBVIOUSLY THERE ARE SOME TECHNICAL FORMATTING DIFFERENCES TO TRY TO MITIGATE THAT. BUT I THINK THE EASIEST WAY TO THINK ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON AT CAMP DAVID IS MOSTLY CONVERSATIONS BETWEEN THE PRESIDENT AND HIS ADVISERS, WHERE, PROBABLY A FAIR AMOUNT OF DO I REALLY HAVE TO DO THIS, WHY DO I HAVE TO DO THIS, CAN I GET OUT OF DOING THIS. YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER, IT HAS BEEN 1400 DAYS SINCE THESE TWO MEN HAVE BEEN IN THE SAME PLACE. WE TALK ABOUT THEM ALL THE TIME AS IF THEY SPEND DAY IN AND DAY OUT ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL TOGETHER. THEY HAVE NOT. THEY NEVER SEE EACH OTHER AND THEY REALLY DON'T LIKE EACH OTHER. THERE'S A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF GROUNDING THAT HAS TO TAKE PLACE, WHERE YOU COME OUT AND YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER, THERE ARE 90 MILLION PEOPLE WATCHING, OR 100 MILLION, OR 70, WHATEVER IT IS. THERE WILL BE NO BIGGER AUDIENCE BETWEEN NOW AND ELECTION DAY. THAT MEANS YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SAY TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK, BUT TO THE LARGEST AUDIENCE EVER. YOU ARE TRYING TO DO WHAT KAMALA HARRIS SAID. YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY HEY, LOOK AT ME. THIS IS WHAT I WANT TO DO. LOOK AT HIM, THIS IS WHAT HE DID. THAT'S INTERESTING, BECAUSE THIS IS THE FIRST TIME IN 134 YEARS WE HAVE HAD TWO GUYS THAT HAVE SERVED BACK TO BACK. SO IT IS NOT A HYPOTHETICAL ABOUT IF THIS GUY IS PRESIDENT. IT IS REMEMBER WHEN THAT GUY WAS PRESIDENT, THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED. AND WHEN I AM PRESIDENT NOW, THIS IS WHAT'S HAPPENING. A VERY DIFFERENT DYNAMIC. BUT THE VERY BASIC IDEA IS YOU ARE GOING THROUGH SCENARIOS, WHETHER IT IS TALKING OR WHETHER IT IS AT THE PODIUM, WITH, I BELIEVE, BOB BAUER, ONE OF THE PRESIDENT'S ADVISERS WHO IS PRETENDING TO BE DONALD TRUMP. AND IT IS NOT AN SNL SKIT, IT IS MORE SERIOUS EVENT. WHAT YOU WANT THE PRESIDENT OR, IN MY CASE, HILLARY, TO GET USED TO STANDING NEXT TO THIS ROMAN CANDLE OF ANGER THAT IS GOING OFF AROUND YOU WHILE TRYING TO KEEP YOUR HEAD, AND SPEAKING TO THE CAMERA, TO PEOPLE. Bob Bower clip IT'S VERY HARD. >> YEAH, YOU MENTIONED BOB BAUER. LET'S PLAY A CLIFF. HE SPOKE WITH MY COLLEAGUE, ANDREA MITCHELL, ABOUT DEBATE PREP. TAKE IT AWAY. >> TO BE HONEST, IT'S HARD TO SAY SOME OF THE THINGS HE SAYS. SOME OF WHICH ARE VERY FACT FREE. AND IT IS HARD SOMETIMES TO TAKE ON THAT TONE, JUST BECAUSE IT IS NOT AN ACTUAL TONE FOR ME. BUT YOU ARE PLAYING A ROLE. YOU ARE TRYING TO MAKE THE EXPERIENCE AS REALISTIC FOR THE PERSON YOU ARE WORKING WITH AS POSSIBLE. >> YOU MENTIONED SOMETHING THERE THAT IS CRITICAL. FACT CHECKING. THAT IS HARD TO DO UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. LIVE, OFF-THE-CUFF, KNOWING IT. IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN WILL, NOR WILL FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP HAVE CAMPAIGN ADVISERS OR ANYONE AROUND THEM THAT THEY ARE ABLE TO SPEAK TO DURING COMMERCIAL BREAKS. THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO HAVE ALL THIS RIGHT THERE TO BE ABLE TO FIGHT BACK. HOW HARD IS THAT, HOW DO YOU PREP THAT? >> WELL, IT IS INCREDIBLY HARD, AND IT IS INCREDIBLY HARD BASED ON WHAT I SAID A COUPLE OF MINUTES AGO. BECAUSE THESE MEN PASSED THE BATON OFF TO EACH OTHER. WHEN THEY DEBATE ABOUT INFLATION, DONALD TRUMP IS NOT YELLING ABOUT INFLATION IN A VACUUM. SHE HANDED AN ECONOMY TO THE PRESIDENT, AND THE ECONOMY CAN THEN SAY WELL, THE SEEDS FOR ECONOMY STARTED AND HOW YOU HANDLED COVID. DONALD TRUMP CAN SAY WELL, THE GAINS YOU HAVE MADE IN EMPLOYMENT STARTED WHEN I HANDED IT TO YOU. AND THERE IS A LOT OF WAYS YOU CAN CUT DATA. YOU TALK ABOUT THIS ON YOUR SHOW ALL THE TIME. YOU HAVE PEOPLE ON, ECONOMISTS CAN LOOK AT IT DIFFERENT WAYS. TO SOME EXTENT, THERE IS AN HONEST DISAGREEMENT. NOW, WHEN YOU PILE ON AND LAY HER ON DONALD TRUMP'S DISHONEST INTERPRETATION OF NUMBERS, YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE A REAL PROBLEM. BECAUSE DONALD TRUMP'S STRATEGY, TO THE EXTENT THAT HE HAS ONE COMING IN IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE TO TRY TO CONFUSE PRESIDENT BIDEN. BECAUSE THAT IS HIS OVERALL HOW HE TRIES TO PAINT THE PRESIDENT, AS NOT CAPABLE AND NOT WITH IT. AND HE WILL, I THINK, USE THIS BARRAGE, THIS AVALANCHE OF NUMBERS IN THE CONTEXT OF THE ECONOMY, IN THE CONTEXT OF IMMIGRATION, WHICH IS JUST SO DATA HEAVY. AND BY JUST THROWING THEM OUT THERE, THERE IS NO HUMAN BEING THAT WOULD BE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT THAT CAN ABSORB THAT. AND THAT INCLUDES THE MODERATORS. >> WE DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THE NUMBERS THAT DONALD TRUMP THERE IS I WOULD BE ACCURATE AND TRUTHFUL. >> I AM GOING TO GO OUT ON A LIMB AND SAY THAT THEY ARE NOT. >> THAT'S REALLY NOT A LIMIT. >> BUT IT IS WORTH SAYING, BECAUSE I THINK THAT THE FORMAT IS DIFFERENT. AS YOU WELL KNOW, THE LACK OF AUDIENCE. THE AUDIENCE, I DON'T THINK, THIS IS NOT A COLLEGE FOOTBALL GAME. THE KIND OF PEOPLE THAT GO TO THESE DEBATES DON'T WHOOP AND HOLLER. AND IN 2020 THERE WAS MINIMAL AUDIENCE BECAUSE OF COVID. THE MUTING, I WILL TALK ABOUT HOW IT AFFECTS PRESIDENT BIDEN AND FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP. FOR THOSE OF US TRYING TO WATCH, IT IS VERY HELPFUL. ANYONE WHO WATCHED THE FIRST DEBATE IN 2020, IT WAS AN ABSOLUTE MESS. THERE HAD TO BE SOME KIND OF MUTING. BUT WHAT I'M THINKING, THE GROUP DYNAMIC ON STAGE FOR US AS MODERATORS, THE TWO MODERATORS HAVE TO ALSO BE ABLE TO DO WHAT YOU JUST ASKED ME ABOUT, WHICH IS TO ALSO TRY TO STAY ON TOP OF FACTS, FIGURES, LYING. THE FACT THAT THERE WILL BE MUTING WHEN ONE PERSON IS SPEAKING AND THE OTHER PERSON IS TRYING TO LIE BUT CAN'T WILL REALLY WORK DOWN TO EVERYONE'S FAVOR. BECAUSE IT IS IMPOSSIBLE WHEN TWO PEOPLE ARE SPEAKING AT THE SAME TIME, AND ONE IS TRYING TO TALK OVER THAT, AND ONE OF THEM IS SAYING UNEMPLOYMENT STANDS AT 3.9% AND THE OTHER IS SAYING THAT'S NOT TRUE, IT IS A 4.6. THERE IS NO HUMAN BEING THAT COULD BE A MODERATOR TABLE THAT CAN KEEP UP WITH THAT. AT LEAST THIS WILL GIVE THEM SOME TIME TO BREATHE AND PROCESS. >> RIGHT, BUT HERE'S THE THING. IT'S A LITTLE BIT TRICKY, BECAUSE THE MICS WILL BE OFF FOR THE PERSON WHO THE QUESTION HAS NOT BEEN DIRECTED TO. AGAIN, WE PLAYED THIS MOMENT EARLIER, AND I HAVE TO SAY THAT I LAUGHED AND I THOUGHT THAT BIDEN WAS BRILLIANT IN IT WHEN HE SAID WOULD YOU SHUT UP, MAN? WHEN DONALD TRUMP WAS JUST BADGERING, BADGERING, BADGERING. IT WAS RIDICULOUS. IF HE WERE TO DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT MIGHT COME OFF ODD IF THE AUDIENCE HAS NOT BEEN ABLE TO HEAR IT. >> YEAH, I WAS JOKING AROUND LAST NIGHT THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN COULD BE TRYING TO GIVE A NORMAL ANSWER AND DONALD TRUMP COULD BE A LITTLE KID TAUNTING HIM AND SAYING HEY, JOE, WHAT'S YOUR FAVORITE FOOD, WHAT'S YOUR FAVORITE FOOD, WHAT'S YOUR FAVORITE FOOD, AND FINALLY BIDEN SAYS CATFISH! AND THEN YOU HAVE PEOPLE SAYING WHY IS THE GUY ALERTING OUT CATFISH? I BELIEVE THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP IS GOING TO PRESENT HE DID NOT KNOW ABOUT THE MEETING. HE WILL PUT THIS IN THE LARGER BEING TREATED BADLY. OH, THEY WANT ME IN JAIL. THEY MUTE ME, THEY GAG ME. THIS IS HIS LITTLE TRICK WITH MICROPHONES AND TELEPROMPTERS. BUT, ON THE WHOLE, IT