Shattered Lives: Government set to ban XL Bully dogs; a knife murder in Dublin.

hello and welcome to shattered lives reach Ireland's crime podcast I'm Paul Healey I'm crime correspondent for the Irish mirror and the Irish Daily Star and I'm joined by Michael otou our crime and defense editor how's it going Michael hello Paul how's things not too bad not too bad reporting from what looks like a basement here but I'm just in a different location today no we've decided to keep he prisoner he's never getting [Laughter] out well it's been um an interesting week really we've been following up um mostly on a lot of the um horrendous events of last week and and in particular we want to just um note uh again the the very tragic death of Nicole Mory um the investigation now has progressed significantly since uh the terrible events last week in County Lim uh where Nicole was attacked by two of her dogs one of which an Excel bullied dog that was shot and killed by guardy at the scene and she she sadly lost her life her funeral has since taken place I just want to briefly mention that there were very emotional um pictures um from the funeral that took place and there were poignant Tri tributes from her family she she has 10 siblings and her father paid tribute um at the funeral and her sister also and the funeral heard how the family are broken um by her very tragic loss and then as as her body was released to her family the remaining dogs that were involved in the incident H the other three dogs were were put down um you know look that that we kind of expected that to be the case anyway that would be the policy that something that would happen in an incident such as this but um there have been quite a few developments since hav there just in terms of the political I suppose conversation and and what needs to happen next as regards to the law here in Ireland um to do with bully dogs and our colleague Louise burn uh was involved in this story yesterday um when Minister Heather humph um basically she has stepped up and um the the process of possibly Banning the XL Bully Breed here in Ireland so um there has been conversation around that and certainly the minister last week had indicated that she had a working group and independent group run by a a retired um G of superintendent looking at the possibility of restricting breeds and what can be done but now she seems to be taking it upon herself to to go that step further and to look at Banning uh the XL breed quicker uh than was even expected as a result of this incident and a number of other incidents that have happened in the last couple of weeks um so yeah we're going to see a possible legislation change very soon and uh just like we always seem to be following the UK but just like the UK and Northern Ireland we're now going to have a ban on the XL Bully Breed here in Ireland two questions arise here do you think it's fair on all the EXL bullies and all the owners of XL bullies that this is happening are they right they feel AG grieved because I think they will be grieved I think it's fair to say they will be grieved I think they will be grieved and certainly they're very passionate on social media those owners of XL Bully uh breed dogs um again as I said on the previous podcast I'm not an expert about dog breeds but I would point to the people that are now coming out speaking about this issue where we far more educated on the topic than you or I and you know there have been veterinarians and people who have been going forward and talking about how this breed is very specifically uh you know powerful enough to kill uh a human being and that's the issue here um that when sadly something goes wrong the dog I think is just too powerful and has the ability to kill it just latches on and and won't let go and I so while I understand why those owners might feel grieved in my own personal opinion which means very little I think this is the right move uh the facts are born out in in a number of attacks that have now happened there was an incident there in limr um in 2022 which we covered which um sorry in Wexford where a young boy Alejandro Misan was very very badly injured by an XL Bully Dog you know the owners were prosecuted in relation to that and then even just within days of the incident with Nicole Mory last week there was another dog attack incident in in in Cork uh where armed guardy had to put that dog down so dog attacks are becoming more frequent um and and look I think something just has to be done about it that's just my opinion what do you think I don't know I I I'm not a dog owner I was a dog owner when I was younger I'd love a dog but I I wouldn't be getting a breed like that or or a pit or anything like that so I I and if you look at last week's part I think an awful lot of dog owners and specialist breed dog owners did watch it and they're and I I mean I did read an awful lot of comments I don't know if you there were almost think four three 400 comments and a lot of people they're very very passionate about this I there's one thing that has jumped out in me and I noted what the Heather Humphrey said yesterday she said is's going to consult with Rossa Fanning who's the Attorney General about banning these dogs now that tells me that there's this is going to be a legal mindfield because in other words the government aren't just bringing this in they're going to have to go and talk to the country's top legal officer and that is an indication because I was reading I know that it's it's Denmark they're banned and I know in England they're banned and up north they're working on similar legislation but there have been legal challenges to this and the one thing about Ireland we have a written Constitution and it's it's absolutely fantastic but people do have the right to challenge things in the courts so I think it's inevitable this will end up in the courts yeah and I I it's it's a complicated issue I mean the minister is Consulting to see whether there needs to be legislation brought forward and that so she even she is not exactly sure what step she needs to take but she is certainly indicating that she is personally in favor of banning an XL Bully Breed now the other big thing that might happen that'll get in the way of that between uh now and next march and even before that and it's looking increasingly more like it'll be well before that is a general election so that's going to just Hal that completely so it's all well and good politicians after a poor woman has lost her life now saying hey we got to do something about this but I think it's going to be you're not going to see it happening tomorrow are you well unless the uh Mr Fanning Russ Fanning gives legal advice that there doesn't need to be legislation that it could be you know call it a in instrument and they can just bring it in but I do think that people will go to court about this and here's another question just I was just thinking about this today if the breed is banned right and I only found out reading today that they're a crossbreed so if the crossbreed is banned does that mean all the dogs have to be destroyed straight away so guards I presume are going to have to go into houses and take these dogs off owners it's a complicated one and I think even still there are serious uh legal challenges in issues with that in the UK um you know so it's something yeah you're right I think owners will vehemently Challenge and here's another question just say you're three quarters EXL bully and one quarter annual station or whatever is there a threshold do you have to be 80% this dog breed to be destroyed you know what I mean so I think this is fraught with real problems but look a lady lost her life and if you remember last week in the P I did think that you know there's a there's always I've always noticed that things just tend to happen in pairs or threes and there were two was it two dog attacks after our part when I spoke of my f that does happen because these things do happen like that two separate incidents including an incident in County Cork where I mentioned that that again armed gardy had to shoot the dog dead um so I mean that shows you the power of some of these breeds that it it requires Armed Force um thankfully that that was it was not a fatal case two people were taken hospital with injuries H it could have been much worse um look I mean there've been several local representative and stuff now coming forward expressing that these these they're hearing more and more of these incidents there's been an increase in these incidents in recent times in fact I was surprised to discover uh that limi County Council had actually issued a warning uh only the the month prior to this tragic incident with Nicole myy in the same county there was a warning specifically about XL Bully dogs and dangerous breeds and keeping them muzzled keeping them on leashes H so there were concerns about dog attacks in limi um within a month of when this fatal incident happened so it wasn't news necessarily to the local body anyway the local Council I I tell you what I think it's going to happen and I mean EXL bully owners probably won't want to hear this but there's an old saying you can't beat City Hall and more often than not the State wins so even if there is a legal Challenge and it goes to the high court or whatever I predict that the state will get its way and unfortunately for owners these dogs will be banned and then then that's the headache of what happens the dogs are there and I don't think it looks good for the for those dogs I'm sorry to say I just think that's what's going to happen really that they will probably be destroyed should we talk about the murder in fingas yes so um this was interesting I was uh working on Sunday morning um was my weekend off but somebody messaged me and said why is nobody talking about this murder and I went what murdered and they filled me in that there' been a stabbing in fingers and it hadn't really come out so we made a few inquiries and we we ascertained that yeah a man in the scribbles town area had been stabbed 1:00 on Sunday morning now eventually the the per victim's name emerged on Sunday afternoon he was a man called Mark arol known as Marky 34 year-old father of two very well known in the area very well respected in the area and looking at the the tributes online there's been a huge amount of tributes to him and we know that there's a goof onund maybe we did a piece in the mirror in the star but that's and it's still open people are trying to help the family but with the funeral cost and the the aftermath of this I suppose so yeah it's a pretty he was stabbed I think he was stabbed times but they have uped it the murder so that's obviously very very serious but of course the suspect in this case is on the run as of the recording of This podcast now on Wednesday um he's several days missing at this point the the main suspect in this and of course he's well known to G uh we know who he is we're not going to say his name on this podcast you know for legal reasons obviously but um this person is a convicted killer himself uh did prison time for the killing of a woman and uh as I said he he has served time in prison and he you know I suppose in one sense it might to to his family come as a shock that he's got involved in yet another violent incident but our understanding of this the background of of this is that the victim uh Mr Carl uh would have been I suppose an associate or friend of the suspect in this case and that they had H something of a verbal ril that sadly current violent um and Mr Carol lost his life was stabbed by this individual who's now fled and um I suppose I had a story in the star in the mirror today just that I suppose guardi now have their suspicions or their fears that there are individuals helping uh the suspect in this case uh to to stay hidden effectively shielding him uh from G um sometimes when we use the word Manhunt I think it kind of sounds like they're actively going around you know banging down doors and and driving all over Dublin trying to find this person I think the guard involved in this are mounting a very um sophisticated surveillance operation and I would say to say they probably know where their target is and they're just biting their time um possibly trying to work with people who would know him they're obviously hoping that this person that they're able to apprehend him in a in a safe way and that they're able to question him and so there are you know there have to be all kinds of considerations taken uh when somebody is involved in an incident like this they they did search at least one property linked to this man but it's quite rare for someone to go on the run really and I was speaking to some people I was going you know is there a belief that he may have gone up north or try to get to Britain and they I I no I think they're they're said they're happy enough that they believe he is in the Dublin area maybe he's been shielded by somebody or protected by somebody maybe he might hand himself in you know he might you know who knows but I'd be I'd be quite surprised if this Manhunt and it is a Manhunt if this Manhunt goes on much longer I think Dublin is a small town and I you know and even he where he is he's you know I'm not being factious he's hardly going to go and hide in Fox rock you know what I mean he's going to know he will have haunts I just get the impression reading the tea leaves or reading between the lines that they that they have a very good idea of where he is you know and they're just biting their time but this individual also has form uh for for fleeing um you know again I had to be careful not to identify him but it also didn't uh wasn't immediately apprehended after the original killing that he was involved in a number of years ago as well but yes but but that was that was resolved very it was resolved very quickly shall we say yes it was it was and look more will come to light if this individual is arrested and and uh you know and possibly charged so we'll see what happens there it it just is interesting the guards have upgraded it to murder so that indicates you know that it was more than one stab that it was they the guards believe there is a threshold for it to be a murder inquiry not a fatal stabbing or a fatal assault that they would call it you know so that that does tell you something yeah and look I mean this is a very complex thing as I said the the victim and the perpetrator the alleged perpetrator in this case were friends there were connections between families and as I have my story today you know there have been tributes online to Mark Carol including from family members close family members uh of the person who's suspected of carrying out this murder H they have actually paid tribute to the victim so it shows you that the the interconnectivity of this and I suppose the tragedy of this H in a sense as well yeah yeah but I I I I would suspect that by the time our next pod comes out the matter would have been resolved and even by the time the this pod hits the whatever it could be resolved as well quite possibly should we talk about Jonathan dll let's talk about Jonathan dll well Jonathan D I like the kenens and the Hutches and I suppose he is tied up with both of them is a story that just keeps on giving isn't he um this is something that I think has been on every journalist radar uh I can't tell you how many times a week I have typed in 270 naven road because I've just been waiting for the moment where he actually went to sell this house of course the day that I was off is the day that the ad goes up I I want to tell you h i i I broke the story I was just slightly ahead of you you know what I think I've never searched for 279 Road it just fell into my lap these things happen you know you know the way you have previously on this pod uh you know talked about how you've cursed other journalists for getting ahead of you getting a story before you when you put into that uh work WhatsApp group I went not the [ __ ] but I I know do is your speciality so I leave that to hey but look you know that's the beauty just you know Things fall into your lap and thanks very much to whoever told me so anyway yeah I've received a few messages about it myself as well um obviously a lot of people were keeping watch on it but I suppose you know on a more serious side to this um I mean look Jonathan Del doll is a serious criminal um he is a torturer a convicted torturer he waterboarded a man in his home um he was involved with you know serious disent Republicans and then with the hutches um is is a liar uh someone who can't be trusted and and someone who appears to have had vast amount of wealth throughout his life uh despite kind of I would say modest uh upbringing was an electrician yes he did employ people um but the wealth that he already possesses uh is incredible I don't know where the money came from I mean obviously he done very very well in life but now to see him you know still in prison uh serving time for his involvement in in the uh the plh I suppose the Regency Hotel murder of David burn uh now selling his home H for a serious serious sum of money 800 Grand is it it's close to 800,000 Euro yeah and I mean you know it probably go for even more than that uh it's in a a prime part of Dublin on the naven road there um and it look I mean I think it's quite tacky the way he's done it up but it is a beautiful uh sized house and there's plenty that you can do with it and I'm sure that some uh but he's going to make a serious amount of money when he gets out of prison he will well he already is in my opinion a very he will be an even more wealthy man so I think um okay despite the fact that he might be looking over his shoulder for some time I think Jonathan delal uh will be is a very lucky man still a very very lucky man um I wonder does this mean how long has he got sorry how long has he got left in prison well that's the golden question isn't it um I I think we will be seeing Jonathan delal come out prison next year okay does this mean so we remember from The Trial that he was being I think the phrase was being assessed for the witness security program do somebody speculated that this means that he may have difficulty getting on that program I don't know what what do you what do you think Paul well we've both been hearing varying theories on this haven't we but we've we I mean we've not got a definitive answer on this the only thing that from a couple of conversations that I've had I I would speculate that he has been uh either refused it or he hasn't got it yet but I think at this stage at this stage I mean you know he he he should have been considered but I spoke to um a couple of very kind of uh good prison sources shall we say who have said to me uh that if the guardy had come looking for him and said we need him now uh that if they he would be given temporary release almost immediately and he would be allowed to leave limi prison if he was signed up to the Witness Protection Program and that was something actually that certain prison people within the prison authorities were expecting to happen might stand corrected on that but that's my understanding of the situation is they were ready for a situation where he would be taken out of prison early and it hasn't happened yet which says to me something's up there it seems to me he's been refused it or he just hasn't been accepted into it yet for whatever and the difficulty is it's the funny fellas as I call them the people in security and intelligence and leers and they no chance of anybody them talking to anybody that they'll probably arrest you first if we asked so that's going to be a difficulty but you remember that story we had that there was S I sort of got an indication there was a difficulty because what country would take him because he was involved in waterboarding somebody so the way it works is guard of shakon have to persuade another country to take this person on that's what happens in witness and you know what happens vice versa crime security and security intelligence look after people who come here so what country in their right mind is going to let somebody in who water boarded somebody in said he's going to going to shoot them and all that sort of stuff I mean was it was a pretty bad torture he carried out so yeah maybe that's a problem now the alternate theory is he selling his house because he's expecting to leave the country very soon and he you know so I mean that's that's another theory but of course I think whether he's staying in this country or not I don't think he can go back to that house can he or if he was in the Ws or not can he stay in Ireland maybe he's just going to have to scadoodle no matter what you know what I'm saying maybe just it'd be far too hot for him here and especially you know he's living in North Inner City Dublin you know so there' be a lot of people in that general area who would not be his biggest fan exactly I want to read out just some of the the ad here so uh it's it's it's Flynn uh estate agents who are selling the house and the I'm looking at the my home. ad here it's going for 790 5,000 it's got three bathrooms it's got four bedrooms um I'm going to read all of this out but it says upon entering 270 you are greeted with a spacious hallway marble tiles throughout the kitchen extending boasting prep uh plenty of natural light and additional worktop space perfect for all your culinary needs a spacious garage provides secure parking for your vehicles um there is a video of the interior of the property and you can see that garage I just want to remind people that this is the same garage that Jonathan dowall and his father tortured a man and waterboarded him and filmed it um but yeah it can be yours just for € 795,000 there's also a I what would you call it a fish pond an exotic fish pond out the back Garden it really is it has to be seen to be believed you have to look at the pictures of it like it is his the back Garden is basically set up like a Japanese garden there's Buddha temp uh Buddha temple type Vibe and Bud Buddhist type statues and this huge big fish pond exotic fish pond um it's extraordinary are you on a commission Paul you did a very good job selling it um you know it raises another question obviously a very serious crime has been committed in that house yeah I wonder would people have difficulties buying a house where a serious crime took place say for example the house where Rachel orelli was murdered would that personally I wouldn't like to live in a house where a serious crime has been committed yeah well I think I i' get the heie jbi with the with the um the the the the garage part of it anyway C knowing what happened there and you know the victim in this case did you know did suffer uh what whatever be the circumstances of the incident you know no one deserves to be um you know tortured and be told that the you know they're going to be killed and to be waterboarded um yeah it's you know horrific I mean sometimes we look at johon Delo like he was a bit of a fool yes he was but I mean that crime that he committed was horrendous really really horrific and he did prison time for it um some would argue not enough prison time but I still think it's extraordinary that we're talking about now this man is going to be released potentially within the next year uh you know um being a potentially A Millionaire still well there was one thing he was a fool for Paul and that was filming it and keeping the SD card what an idiot bu and to to have an associate of his uh you know filming it as well uh you know while him and his father did it really horrendous crime and not not not anything that can ever be you know Justified I think I and I think we can be sure that okay so it's I think it's 795,000 the asking price but the Dublin property Market is so hot at the minute it'll go for well over that well over yeah yeah well over could be 20 30 40 50 Grand more yeah so I mean he's he's in for a serious payday now look uh you know whether he's admitted to the witness protection program or not yes there there is Potential Threat to his life from multiple different factions let's be honest he's no friend of the hutches at the moment um you know obviously the kenahan although he has tried to mend fences with the kenahan he certainly tried that during the trial of Jerry the monk Hutch and then obviously among dissidents even he's H highly highly unpopular so yeah I think he's always going to be looking over his shoulder for the rest of his life so I feel more for his family in that than him really absolutely but I think it's fair to say he'd be looking over both shoulders yeah this is the thing um I'm Cur this obviously when I saw the ad I was curious has he been released you know so I did go to check but he is still yes very firmly in limr prison on a he was on a landing compl by himself there's now a couple of people on the landing including um Barbie Kardashian well-known violent uh prisoner is on the exact same Landing as him and a couple of other but but basically he is locked up for about 23 hours a day he gets time for exercise but he's there in limc prison serving about a four-year sentence which he has done he's in his second year of so maybe by the end of this year but I'm I'm saying I haven't really done the mat saying next year would be the release date unless something happens in the interim where guardi have admitted him to the witness protection program and then he's given a temporary release we'll see what happens but moment I think next year so I want to ask you something so just to refresh our memory he was charged with the murder the Regency murder and then he pleaded guilty to facilitating the murder yes and then he gave evidence against Jerry Hut and Jerry Hut as we know was acquitted by Miss Justice Tara Burns in the special criminal court and the two other judges and Jonathan Dow's evidence was highly uh you know yes it completely fell on its face it was highly criticized by the judges and and not accepted by the judges of the special criminal court and one of the things he he claimed was that Jerry Hut had confess to the murder my question is this do you think he's sitting there going what the hell have I done I I I used to think that that like oh yes he must be but but in a way I think he's after getting away with murder in in in more ways than one like I mean okay yes he's G to prison but a relatively short period of time for facilitating uh probably the most high-profile murder uh Gangland murder in the history of the state um you know and then okay yes as I said look his life is he'll be looking over his shoulder in one sense but I think just in terms of the law he's got away with an awful lot and now he's selling this house for several hundred thousand I think he might have the last laugh in a way but he will as you say he always will have that a threat effectively and several POS possible threats against him for the rest of his days so he won't have A Moment's Peace when he gets out of prison no matter where he goes well I'm not sure what his endgame was I mean the second that he took the witness stand other than I think he thought he was going to get a sweet deal with the state and that he would be protected and that he would get away with the crimes that he had committ committed um and in particular I think he thought that he was doing this for a tradeoff for a witness protection and that he would he would get this great mansion out in another country and he would be protected till the end of his days it's looking increasingly like that's not the case that's not going to happen um so yeah but I I I still think protection or no um with the money that he'll make from this house I think he can get away and start a new life for himself no problem yeah but see look it's an offense to say people are living but he's not on in the witness security program but he's not in it but just say he went somewhere you have to buy a house and houses aren't cheap no matter where you go you know what I mean so 800 Grand I'm sure he has maybe he's got a bit of a mortgage or whatever to pay off or he's got other things so you know it's not it's not enough to retire on I would venture and he's obviously a man who enjoys the high life or the perception of the high life I mean if you look at the interior of the house um you know he's got what would you call it a cinema room up the top in the Attic um now I think it's hideous personally horrible red couches and a big screen TV um but he obviously enjoys the finder things life the kitchen is huge uh I mean anyone would dream to have a kitchen that size and as I said he he's able to have the luxury of a fish pond and out the back yarden so he clearly is a man who enjoyed the the Finer Things in life and he had very expensive Vehicles as well a huge big driveway um so yeah that's the only thing perhaps whatever life he does lead in the future now will be a far more modest one um but I still think considering everything that he's done and the kind of people he got involved with I still think he's getting off lucky yeah I I you mean well would if he so he was charged with Jerry Hutch said weren't they all charged together with murder right yes so the case the case was effectively dismissed by Miss Justice tab burs So when you say what was the alternative for him the alternative was probably he had a very good chance of beating that rap that murder rep I don't know I suppose it's it's on tested we you know his his involvement in it I is is clearer to me than than that of Jerry Hutch now okay Jerry Hutch got involved in in weapons there's no question about that and I think even he probably would openly admit to being involved in some sense in the transfer of the weapons but he wasn't charged with that so but in terms of the overall involvement in the conspiracy itself I actually think there was more tying him to us okay tangental so but still than even Jerry Hutch I mean the hotel Key Well I mean he literally walked into the hotel room he he he got the hotel room for one of the key players in the murder plot that to me is pretty clear evidence that you're involved in the conspiracy now I know now they don't really charge people with the conspiracy to murder um the facilitation charge is what he got done for but usually they just if you're involved in the murder now they charge you with murder um yeah he obviously he wasn't the gun man and he wasn't even involved in the shooting of David burn but he booked the hotel room okay he might say innocently but I mean he it's for him and his father to get involved in the sense that they did with the characters that they were involved with um how could they have thought it was for anything other than something nefarious and that's a good point so say for example people in recent weeks have been done for facilitating murders before the Kenan gang and they've been jailed for doing things like buying phone credit okay that was used in a phone used in a murder or part of a murder hit getting a hotel room is a much higher level and get into a shop and getting 20 quids worth of one credit is it not it is and I I mean and again even if he wants to say oh I didn't know somebody was going to be murdered I think he knew full well that there was an offense going to be committed and he was involved in that and so I I I don't know I it's we'll never know because he they end up on trial for that but I I think it was a much more crystal clear case than the one they tried against Jerry Hutch because they tried to say that Jerry H was one of the men involved in directly involved in the murder that may have even pulled the trigger and killed uh David burn I mean it was just no evidence for that there was absolutely no evidence for that it was a joke to ever try him for that in my opinion um I mean I sat there for the entirety of that trial waiting for even a sliver of evidence of that and I I don't know how anybody even if he had been tried before a jury how any jury would ever have convicted him of the murder of David burn with that evidence I it just wasn't going to happen but that but that clear was Central to do all I mean he effectively introduced that that the claim that Mr Hutch which the judge rejected that Mr Hutch had had killed shot David burn himself that really came from him that I don't think that would have been the states case if he hadn't turned TI or turned Turtle well maybe they wouldn't have said he was the shooter but they had still charged him with murder at that point before they had dou all as a witness oh no that's my point that the the introduction of what of do's evidence ratcheted that up that that's what they went for I would argue because of what doal was saying so we talk about Angelo pandeli uh he's an Infamous Australian mobster um who who now it appears uh has gotten into bed with the Kens yes so we go from the dolls and the the sort of the hutch criminal case the prosecution to the kenin who are obviously Target number for the guards I think and perhaps we're guilty of this as well we might be focusing on the kenahan activities in Ireland so in other words whenever there's a big drug seizure you know say there was one in freaking bonless loan they got 30 million quids worth of of heroin What or cocaine where always go is it the kenin right but we've known for quite some time that the kenin are an international cartel that they don't just limit their activities to Ireland in fact some sources might suggest that Ireland is increasingly less important to the canans we all know there there there's there's the drugs kind in Clint and called the family who sources have told me are Ireland's biggest drugs gang so the kennons are involved elsewhere and this Angelo pandeli fella there was a a really good investigation International investigation I know the Sunday Times were involved in it on various Australian media I think 60 minutes and they did this story about Angelo pandeli who's the head of the Hell's Angels in Australia and he has now fled to Dubai and has linked up with Daniel Kennan and is now involved in a super cartel with Daniel Kennan and the upshot of this story was that kenahan and pandeli the allegation is are sending cocaine all around the world including to Australia and I I was really interested to find that the the belief would be that the cookan market around the world is 110 billion Euro a lot of money and the kennons are centrally involved in that with this Angelo pandeli fell wow and he is a serious serious player as you said Hell's Angels um I saw just coincidentally I you know I saw your story and and I went oh I was only just kind of watching a documentary about him maybe a couple weeks ago a 60 Minutes Australia documentary um it was fascinating they were looking into um you know his his basically his assets in Dubai and how he and a number of other associates were buying up properties this sounds familiar doesn't it buying up uh properties in the United Arab Emirates including I think like an entire skyscraper was just complet occupied by all of these gangsters these International gangsters it wouldn't surprise me if the kinin are also among them um as you said they're involved in a super cartel we tend to focus a little too much on their activities in Ireland but it just goes to show you they're all getting into bed with each other all over the world now there is one interesting aspect slightly contradicting myself about the Irish International link and that is that Ireland appears to be a hub for the transportation of drugs now there are a couple of cases that I can't really talk about because there sub Judy but I think there's evidence to show that drugs have come into Ireland Mega shipments of drugs have come into Ireland and they were destined for elsewhere and I can think of two that the belief would be we're we destined for Australia yeah where pandelia is active now I remember doing a story in 2018 about the kenahan cartel sending drugs to Australia in postcard in birthday cards but that was you know grams and bits there they've obviously up the game since then and the belief would be that drugs from South America are coming to to Ireland we all knew that like the MV Matthew most of that drugs most of that cooking was destined for Europe but now the belief is that it's coming to Ireland for onward transit to the far side of the world so it's really really interesting that Ireland has effectively become an international hub for cooking and Other Drugs wow I I mean it we're we're we're small for compared to maybe some of the business the kenin are making worldwide it's just phenomenal um I just want to say the other aspect of this is just remember we're talking about extradition and how difficult it is for the Irish to get I know that people have been extradited to Holland and we know Italy the Netherlands and Italy but from memory I think there was somebody extradited to Australia from uh Dubai a couple of years ago so I just wonder again I said this in the last couple of PODS you know sunlight is the best disinfectant and the Dubai authorities are obviously unhappy about this International Spotlight on them so I just wonder will pandeli be the next one to be like you know imper rafaeli Imperial Al and ran tagi you know they were kicked out I wonder will they go for pandeli and will they go for Kenan or the kenins yeah I I I I think the kenins are still operating out of Dubai um I don't we haven't seen any evidence to to the contrary we have we um and why would they go elsewhere at this moment in time I mean they business seems to be going quite well for them still so I mean they have no reason beyond all of the talk that's happening here in Ireland which I wonder how how tuned into they into it are they even they have no reason really to leave Dubai do they at the moment well I think I remember I think they're well aware of what's happening in Ireland and I think that they do observe things very cleanly and obviously look we know that there is a a file being prepared for Daniel Ken and uh the guards W have asked for him to be charged I think was over the murder of NTI Hutch Jerry Hutch's brother and then there there's also the investigation into directing a crime gang both of which carry life so you know that's very serious so I think they will be watching very very closely as to what happens but you know maybe you know that remember the film hate maybe they're just like right we're going to stay here but the minute there's hate we're gone and maybe they can just they have a way get night maybe that's what it is we don't know we don't know look we'll see what happens there shall we leave there well so we just mentioned briefly that really horrific attack in clinten over the last couple of days um and I know you were doing that story I I try not to watch videos that I'm not working on because they they're Grim but I did see that one Jes he got a hell of a doing you might tell us what happened or what we know yeah we work on so many horrendous things that you you kind of lose count I actually completely forgot about that uh and I was working on it yesterday and a bit today uh yeah this I mean this is an attack that happened in broad daylight um I'm just getting used to this now where daily I'm being sent videos of another violent incident that's happened in Dublin and it's it's sad to see but this happened in the neilstown kundaan area yesterday afternoon as I said in broad daylight uh youngsters involved in a bit of a melee and one of the very young men I I wonder is he even over 18 I'm not entirely sure H was brutally attacked with a machete and as per usual there's video footage of it somebody filming this on their phone while this young lad is getting slashed effectively multiple times in the legs uh with a machete uh by equally as young Lads um and he was hospitalized in relation to it and as seems to be a bit of a trend now as well uh the individual who was attacked uh or certainly someone on his behalf took photographs graphic graphic photographs of his injuries and shared them all over social media I've Had The Misfortune of seeing them we obviously didn't publish them because they're horrific but really bad oh they're really bad really but they do I suppose they do show the reality of because I mean the clip I mean the clip just looks like somebody's just hitting somebody but I mean if you can imagine if you're getting hit multiple times in the leg with a Machi what your leg is going to look like um I mean I just think it looks horrendous but yeah uh and that's maybe the second or third time um in the last two weeks that I have been sent graphic injury photographs from attacks that have happened all over Dublin um but I suppose another thing that's of interest to us in relation to this incident is that the victim in this attack is um somewhat associated with uh the mob boss John Gilligan um now that's not to say when we use the word associate uh sometimes it might be interpreted like as though he's a henchman John Gilligan or something like that no that isn't the case for legal reasons I can't you know give you more specific details than that but this person is associated in I suppose in a tangental sort of way to John Gilligan and is very much I suppose the next next generation of young gangster um want to be gangsters yes but very very dangerous gangsters because okay yes they haven't got guns but they're going around with machetes for [ __ ] sake and broad daylight attacking each other um that's and they don't seem to care they have no there there was a shoo in there uh I don't know even if it was reported but I was I was talking to somebody today this fud has been this incident has been G on for a long time there's been quite a lot of arson there's been I didn't noce there's been more about six or seven arson attacks but there was one one shooting um so they do have access to firearms and they I I this is a feud that we're going to have to look at because I think it's got real potential for serious injury it does I suppose that's why I'm following up on it today even I'm just trying to get the screenshot that I'm looking at here so the individual who was attacked um has since posted to social media as I said injuries and uh also I suppose a bit of a warning um where he has referred to the people who attacked him as rats and uh said that uh they're mad um till they get smoked so very much I suppose a threat uh to strike back so I'm sure that we probably haven't seen the end of that field and as you've mentioned yes there have already been arson tax incidents in relation to this but they kids this the sad thing like they're they're they're they're children in my eyes they look like kids um if they're over 18 they're only barely over 18 and they're shooting at each other and attacking each other in the street with Masis that's where we are so we did see I I did I did watch the video pretty bad and you're right it just looks as if you're they're smacking them but obviously it's a machete but did you see the other video of the Two Fellas in the bike waiting for him yes now that was that was chilling just sitting there I think if memory W was the pon passenger was holding a machete [ __ ] hell a an old lady walked past and these two fellas are sitting there waiting to Ambush somebody in broad daylight and dman yeah yeah and then I mean in another part of Dublin entirely I was only covering uh another I suppose I hesitate to call it a feud but a dispute in fingas involving a an Infamous mobster um associate of an INF mob St that we all refer to as Mr flashy who was involved in a dispute over a woman and there was a a horrendous pipe bomb attack there in fingas uh only a couple of days ago as well um and so you know yeah there's violence happening all over Dublin with people I suppose who are going to have to pay a bit more attention to now younger gangsters upand cominging gangsters been interesting I want to mention the Q&A actually we we're going to do a Q&A pod and we've got lots of interesting questions and one of the questions actually surrounds this you know are there other people on our radar that we can't talk about the truth is yeah there there are multiple people that we now probably need to get across and start learning who they are and this is an example this Feud now in Claren is another thing that we have to get across because it looks as an entire generation of criminal Now isn't there um coming up coming up the ranks yeah and Ju Just to mention the Q&A so way we're doing it is we're asking for anybody who has a question you can do it publicly just on Twitter you can mention is I think it's called or at is I'm Nick the hack and Hy is Hy hack I wonder where you got that name from anyway um H or you can DM is and it can be anonymous there's no problem we've had some fantastic questions one slightly off message was asking where is the best area to do a post office job weren't really asking for questions like that W be answering that sort of stuff but some really there was one question I I won't spoil it but you and I looked at the question and I mentioned somebody and you mentioned somebody but we we'll get into that but with had a really good number of questions but the more the merrier and it can be about any crime or defense issue absolutely no problem far ahead and we really love the interaction and the questions have been fantastic it's questions have been great so far so we're just going to keep Gathering as many of them as we can but it's great to see the interaction we appreciate that we have an audience and I mean our video last week did incredible I think it's got 60,000 views now so you know yeah clearly people have an interest in what we have to say I I don't know why but but it's great and so we really enjoy doing it so uh we'll have that Q&A pod or maybe multiple podcasts depending on how many questions we get um in the com I know why it's great content and it's free there you go it's not the love exactly exactly so we'll talk to you next week thanks very much all right thanks everybody