The Incredible Shrinking Trump | The Coffee Klatch with Robert Reich

and it is the Saturday coffee clutch with Heather loft house and yours truly Robert R and Heather what is on store for today lots of news this week let's do it so let's talk about the Harris walls interview Trump's latest Antics where does the election stand I think those are some good topics well they are and I thought that Harris Wall's interview was actually just fine I know it's been criticized in some quarters is uh not substantive enough uh but she did did I think exactly what she needed to do uh exude competence and uh TR of a solidity and not get into details not stir kind of stir controversy what do you think that's it I would completely agree I think it was a tick the box right everyone had waited so long and the right had put so much pressure on it and it's all so silly and she was rehearsed and she had good sound bites was she the most amazing interviewee I've ever seen no did she need to be no and also it's a TV interview on a Thursday on CNN next let's do the you know that's right next well there's a kind of a next quality to all of this because uh know so many Democrats uh that I speak with uh really across the Democratic Spectrum are saying we don't want her to get too specific on policy we don't want her to to put herself into a corner we don't want the typical Democrats list of of policies for this and that and for everything else uh we want her to get elected we want to get rid of Donald Trump will do anything and I think that's that's the spirit and we've talked about should take this right but it's also new so we haven't seen them together in an interview so that was a sort of test they're doing message testing you know what sounds good what lands how does she you know how does she frame things um so I think all of that was terrific and what I love is Donald Trump on Truth social boring is what he declared in the middle of it which is a win as far as I see it I think it's a big win because you know this whole week Donald Trump what has he been talking about he's been talking about trans boxers and uh I mean I I I it it was it's amazing bacon he went a whole thing on windmills uh he's been diverging onto Al Capone you remember the the little Riff on Al Capone uh this man is is actually not only is he un getting more and more unhinged we've known him he's unhinged for a long time but he's he's not talking about Poli at all the only thing he he mentioned about policy is that he thought IVF should be free I mean hello yeah I mean think of this as Donald Trump how far he has come he's trying to get as far away from anti-abortion as possible saying IVF ought to be free or mandated as part of people's Insurance he's going off the deep end and Heather he cannot find an attack line uh on kamla Harris I mean he can't make it that she's part of the Biden Harris it's just old stuff because she represents such new energy and a new beginning he can't make it the Border because she's coming across as you know the prosecutor and she's done a lot on the border uh and uh he he's he's flailing he can't find it yep and this week it's been so much I mean Qing on and amplifying sexist messages on the one hand none of this is surprising this is all old news on the other hand it's so exhausting to watch it again and again and again and then he says oh six weeks for abortion maybe that's a little you know I don't know I think I'm going to vote against that in Florida I mean this is a man who is on his heels right I think at the RNC he was feeling confident he was in this I mean he had had a whatever it was this horrible um assassination attempt but he was a he was confident and this is a man who is not feeling good about where he stands now whenever we get into this kind of discussion it gets me a little bit nervous I I worried that we're going to jinx something but polls you know to the extent that polls can be believed are looking better and better uh in almost every state uh you know even in states that uh well in Nevada I think there is a tie uh no Arizona is a tie Nevada that she's she's slightly ahead uh in many of the Swing states she is now moving into the range of three or 4% in uh in in advance of trump uh but these are not huge differences and I'm not going to relax until we get to see something like six or 10 or even 12% are we going to get I mean I would love to see some 12ers in there that would be incredible well Wisconsin is almost there but we we need to get there because you see the post the post-election strategy for Trump is obviously to contest this election and get it the house of representes so the biggest I mean a margin of 10 to 12% may be necessary in order to late to rest any of that no of course and then there's the electoral college right and we've talked about this and we're not the only people but it's so interesting to see what's happening in Texas right all red and Cruz are closer than people thought probably and it's interesting it feels like the Republicans are on their heels there too we have um attorney general Ken P is sending people raiding homes of Latino Democrats and activists some of them it's so interesting what's happening there how much attention should we put on Texas uh well I never paid much attention to Texas in terms of in terms of the presidential vote uh but obviously uh if Texas starts getting into play that is big news in and of itself that would be terrific now Heather we also have the September 10th debate coming up I think that's going to be a big big tent pole in terms of where things stand and giving the public another opportunity in fact their real first opportunity to look at Trump and KLA Harris together right well if we look at this past week I mean we'll have someone on stage who is rehearsed and sane and thoughtful and empathetic and highly intelligent speaking of disposition she said Joe Biden has the disposition to be doing what he's doing and then we'll have this man I mean what happened in Arlington Cemetery this week is yet another example of the Mayhem go ahead well it's it's it's it's actually important U I'm glad you brought that up because the Army on Thursday the US Army uh rebuked the Trump campaign for uh violating the law uh they were told when they went into the you remember they went in on Monday they went into the Arlington National Cemetery uh for a photo op Trump wanted to it was the anniversary of the the third Ann iary of the exit from Afghanistan and what he wanted to do is talk about how what a blunder Biden had made and he wanted to indirectly blame Harris for the same thing uh but what happened is they blew up into his into his face because he was told by employees of the Arlington National Cemetery which is the most hallowed G ground almost sacred ground to army veterans and to the country uh that you can't do a political event here it's against the law it's against our regulations and what happened was the Trump's people evidently uh this employee a woman she she tried to stop them from going in uh they used some set of abusive epithets we haven't seen or heard exactly what they were but it was reported I'll again it again and then they shoved her now I want you to think about this Heather I mean think about shoving a woman abusing her verbally uh to get what they want in terms of kind of using military the military Heroes to advance Trump's cause I mean think of how many particular uh triggers this sets off in terms of our memory of the worst of Donald Trump you know abuse of women and abuse of and and and talking down and demeaning military Heroes uh and and being and violating the law I mean it's all there it's all it's all Trump it's so shameful and the whole I mean one would think that the goal was to set his records right to to do some spin on the fact that he's calling our military veterans suckers and losers but then he goes in he botches the whole thing the video they did so the whole thing was right they were not supposed to do campaign events of course at this Cemetery but then also you're not supposed to just be willy-nilly taking photos with your thumbs up of everyone and then they put this video out on Tik Tok which was not a great video I mean really a bad video so the whole thing was for a video and then he pretends it's not well you know in my experience Heather in in political campaigns and you know this is my not my first rodeo uh what happens is that that relatively small things like the Arlington Cemetery Fiasco get blown up why do they get blown up because it's not so much the thing itself uh it's what it represents about the candidate it's the story behind the story and that's why all of this became a big deal in terms of everything from harassing women to violating the law to using violence shoving uh to get his way to to violating a Sacred Space and violating norms and laws it's all there it's all trouble right and I want to go back to this Tik Tok idea so this video goes up on Tik Tok it's been so interesting to watch Tik Tok in particular are you watching Tik Tok I mean here and there it's part of my day job I'm not doing it for funsies um but so recently the the Harris campaign is spending way more money on social um and social ads than the Trump campaign and other Republicans which are doing more traditional media buys which is we could talk about that but I think the Trends on Tik Tok are so interesting and Tim Walls we've talked about This lends himself to a meme it's glorious I mean it's basically Tim Tock instead of Tik Tock at this rate I mean he's doing well on the platform he has way more I think he's at 1.3 million and JD Vance is at half a million I think in terms of followers and Tim walls' likes are way higher than JD Vance's but what's interesting is of all there's similar kind of view counts to the Trump related content and the Harris related content but 2third of the Harris related content is positive and 2third of the Trump related content is negative at this point on Tik Tok well this is important particularly with regard to younger people um and hopefully younger people are going to vote like mad uh in this election uh because they are not only seeing uh the truth about Trump and the anti-trump uh ads but they're making these ads they're creating this content for Tik Tok and for other social media uh and it's a wonderful thing to behold I mean it's creative it's uh it's relative to they're all be you know they're all becoming part of our political culture not just as voters but as producers that's it and there was lots of content creators at the DNC and that created a little um kurer fuffle in terms of traditional journalists and verses allegedly I'm not sure there's a verses but these content creators and kind of who was getting special looks and who was getting more attention um so that was interesting now so we've talked a little about where the election stands we've talked about some of these polls the Bloomberg poll that came out I mean it's interesting you know Trump is watching these polls you know he is oh he's not only watching the polls he's watching you know all of these metrics that he uses a crowd size uh the number of donations the number of people who are actually volunteering uh the enthusiasm every on every metric he has ever used he is falling further and further behind and it must be driving him absolutely nuts it must be the walls campaign 540 million raised in their short five weeks is it now the Harris walls campaign yeah 540 milon what did I say 540 million is extraordinary and in a way you can look at this as kind of three acts a three act play I mean act number one uh she gets uh you know Biden drops out and she creates this extraordinary campaign uh including picking walls act number two is she unifies the Democrats behind her and that happened at by the end of the convention and act number three is right now she is trying to unify the country behind her uh this tour of Rural America I mean a lot of Democrats initially you know scratch their heads and say why rural America well I think part of it is that she wants to show that she is the candidate for all the people this is no longer just the the you know the trumps against everybody else or the Republicans against Democrats this is a new beginning uh and it you know it almost feels I don't want to get too enthusiastic but it almost feels uh as as it did before your time in John F Kennedy in 1960 Heather where you know you had kind of an old politics give way to a New Politics John Kennedy said we're P we're passing the torch to a new generation and I think I in a way that's what that's what Harris epitomizes for me and I think she's so terrific at a rally I mean I really like seeing what she did in Georgia and I think there's going to be more of that um the debate you and I will be watching it everyone at home or not at home on your commute whatever it'll be night time you're probably at home you can watch with us have you been following how the debate inside the debate over over muting the mute button the this is actually fabulous uh it's very indicative the t Team Trump wants the rule to be that when Harris is speaking Trump has to be muted uh and when Trump is speaking Harris has to be muted uh now that's team Trump is insisting on that team Harris says no when I'm speaking when Harris is speaking Trump ought to be the microphone should not be muted Trump ought to be allowed to be heard so in other words team Trump doesn't trust that Trump can control himself when Harris is speaking and is worried that the public is going to see somebody out of control oh for sure and you know they're all and he'll say what what do you mean the mic's muted and then they'll say oh I mean we didn't I wasn't sure who did that and then they'll run behind him and try and say mute the mics mute the mics I mean of course and he is not going to want them muted and they are praying that they are muted well that's actually that's really one of the sticking points right now on having the debate uh is it muted or unmuted and it's fascinating in terms of which side wants muted I'm very excited for that debate but again this age of anticipation it's kind of this roller coaster of ADR my adrenal glands are you know tapped out it's oh I'm sorry to hear that I mean how are yours mineal glands are just great I mean I don't want get too too personal but thank you for asking I always care about your adrenal GLS so that's the future more about the future is Labor Day is coming up and you are a former Secretary of Labor so I'm excited to have a coffee with you always but this seems particularly exci listen listen Labor Day is my day I used to say Labor Day this is the day of the American Workforce uh and uh it's a it is a big deal I mean the American workers have a lot to celebrate still uh you know in real wages in terms of real wages they are coming back uh but it's very important that and I I don't get too wonky here but it's very important that the FED start raising start lowering interest rates as soon as possible well I do think things are looking good in that department but in terms of Labor I mean you've talked about these larger arcs of history when so let's think about defense and offense right it feels like we've been labor has had to be on defense for a long time are we moving towards an offensive position is it getting better what's happening well it's getting slowly but I just want to give you some some framework to understand this in 1935 uh you had about 20% of American work American Workforce re unionized by 19 uh 50 you had 35% of American Workforce was was unionized uh now today 6% 6% of the private sector Workforce is unionized you still you now have some public sector unions uh but uh this is a huge drop in terms of unionization uh it's very hard for American workers to do better if they don't have the negotiating and bargaining power that comes with Unions that's it and you've talked about this over the years the power between corporations corporate power and the power of workers and the need for counterveiling power what's happening with the latest in terms of these this antitrust and this there's been some some such interesting stuff Kroger and otherwise this is fascinating uh because the Federal Trade Commission where I used to work uh has taken on Kroger this Giant grocery machine and Albertson's and they want to merge and they would be if they merge I mean the two the two largest grocery chains in the United States want to merge talk about lack of competition talk about monopolies and the Federal Trade Commission is saying no you can't do that not only it would drive uh consumer grocery prices even higher than they are today and even result in even less competition in the grocery industry but you can't do it because it would also harm the 700,000 workers where Kroger and Albertson's workers because if you merge together they would only have one take it or leave it giant Corporation to negotiate with uh this is what's fascinating here is that it's this is the first time Heather to my knowledge that anti-rust authorities in the body this is the Federal Trade Commission uh have said workers and worker power is part of what we care about that's it and really Quantified it in this way and talked about these individual workers and the lack of power and bargaining power that they'll have it's a very very big deal this trial went this went to trial this Albert Kroger's merger went to trial uh last week uh it's it's going it's it's going to have huge implications uh and just a few days ago uh you had the key people and I want to make sure everybody knows we're talking about Lena Khan and we're talking about Jonathan caner at the antitrust division of the justice department and jenan Jen Jennifer abuso who is the general counsel of the National Labor Relations Board all of them got together signed an agreement which is historical uh in terms of working even more closely together on issues of antitrust and worker rights and worker strengthening unions right and then of course we have kamla Harris talking about um putting regulations around price gouging and Kroger admitted this week as part of the trial that they were price gouging as it relates to the cost and what they were charging for eggs and milk can you imagine aded it can you imagine admitting price scouching when you have when you have KLA Harris saying she is supporting legislation against price gouging and you have so many millions and millions of Americans who are saying we can't afford the price of of groceries and the price of food which is a huge deal uh and U you know Trump obviously is mum about all of this yep exactly I wanted to try a new something at the end of our coffee clutches yeah that's I me it's not it's not a segment it's not a I don't know let's just try it so what it is it's rapid fire questions and I'm going to come up you I can give you rapid fire questions or you can give me well because this is my vision as I see it I ask you the questions but we can but maybe next week if you suggest something you can ask me the questions but so I was thinking it would be fun and then I was thinking if the other people have questions they want me to ask you they could throw those in the comments um but so what if I said to you let me come up with a good one oh we're going to do it now okay yep I'm bracing myself okay brace yourself and thank you for being down um okay describe America in five adjectives go um upbeat idealistic um uh exhausted uh uh courageous um one more ambitious wo good ones and they skew positive and hopeful yeah it's because my head is now positive and hopeful yeah I was I wasn't there if you would asked me you know a month five weeks ago it's only everyone else yeah well it's only been it it's amazing July 21st marked a a different era in American politics and economics we're not just talking about politics we're talking about the culture and the feeling that people have uh and uh yeah also my mother's birthday oh congratulations well that was July 21st well well this anyway to your mother okay I'll let her know let me give me five adjectives about your mother God gorgeous thoughtful intuitive kind and maternal oh I love the maternal adjective that's really good listen everybody uh Heather thank you so much uh and uh Kyle thank you for your help on the technology side uh we will see all of you next week next Saturday for another coffee cotch thanks for joining us [Music]