The Queerplatonic Brilliance of Kevin Can F**k Himself

Courtney: Hello everyone and welcome back. My  name is Courtney, I’m here with my spouse, Royce,   and together we are The Ace Couple, and today, oh,  we are talking about a show that I am very, very   excited to talk about; one that was a little under  the radar and certainly, I think, under-discussed   in the ace and aro communities, because there  isn’t explicit ace or aro rep in it. But from our   eyes, there was absolutely just a queerplatonic  brilliance to it that we need to talk about. Royce: So, speaking of the show being somewhat  under-recognized, I believe it aired on AMC   and I’ve read somewhere that it suffered  from something that a lot of shows suffer,   where it had a curse word in its title  and then either wasn’t advertised enough   or performed poorly. [Courtney’s uhm]  I don’t know if we’ve just organically   come across to other people that we’ve  mentioned this to, who have heard of it. Courtney: That’s true. I feel like every  time we recommend it, people are like,   “I’ve never even heard of that.” But it is  called Kevin Can Fuck Himself or Kevin Can F   Himself. In all of the title screens they censor  out the U, so it’s like Kevin Can F-ck Himself. Royce: The title on– Courtney: The good old fashioned cable censoring. Royce: Yeah, the– The title, at least on  Wikipedia, has asterisks for the U and the C. Courtney: Kevin Can F asterisk, asterisk  Himself. It’s so good! It is such a good show. Royce: But it is starring Annie  Murphy of Schitt’s Creek fame. Courtney: Also such a good show! And more  recently, Black Mirror. What was that episode of   Black Mirror called? I think that was everyone’s,  like, universal favorite of the season. Royce: It was the first episode  of the season: Joan Is Awful. Courtney: Joan Is Awful, yes. How to describe  this brilliant show. So I think it is a   masterpiece in subversion. The main premise  that you’re able to tell from episode one is   that they are trying to subvert the sitcom  genre, which, now that I’m thinking of it,   is kind of a trend in media I like. If  you can present and subvert the sitcom   genre with a lot of additional depth and  trauma, I’m probably all about it. Because   that’s also a way I would begin to describe  Bojack Horseman, even though that’s a fully   animated series. That one’s also a subversion  of the sitcom, but this one is live action. Courtney: And in the very first scene it’s very  recognizably a sitcom. It’s got the bright sitcom   lighting, it’s got your standard, like, here  is this family’s living room, here’s the couch,   and the stairs, and a doorway that goes to the  kitchen. And you get all of the camera angles   that you normally see in a sitcom, and you’ve  got the laugh track. So it’s going old fashioned,   cheesy, corny sitcom. But you also have the good  old fashioned sitcom misogyny. Like you have this–   this main character of the sitcom, Kevin, who  – spoiler alert – can go fuck himself. [laughs]   And so it’s all very lighthearted and jovial,  and it’s got the laugh track. But it’s also got   the like– If the laugh track wasn’t there and  the show wasn’t telling you what to laugh at,   the jokes are a little mean, and the main  punching bag of the show is his wife, Allison. Royce: I feel like they use the  laugh track so much that they were,   even in those moments, just making fun of sitcoms. Courtney: Oh yeah! I mean– Royce: Because it was– it was overused. Courtney: It’s definitely a parody, yes. But yeah,   so you sort of get exposed to the main cast  of this – quote – “sitcom world.” It’s Kevin   as the main character, his wife Allison, who’s  the main punching bag. Then Kevin’s got his two,   like, sidekick goofs, who is his father, Pete,  and his best friend Neil. Now Neil also happens   to be his neighbor, and Neil has a sister named  Patty. And Patty is, like, teetering the line of   goofball accomplice with these other three guys,  but also still kind of a punching bag as the other   woman in the room, but not nearly as heavily  weighted as Allison, as the wife character is.   So the big subversion happens though where–  They’re also, they’re in Worcester, so they’ve   all got this very northeastern accent, which is  way heavily exaggerated in the sitcom version   of this reality too. It lessens a little bit.  But they sort of– I can’t call it breaking the   fourth wall because that’s not correct, but they  break through the sitcom wall when Allison is,   you know, in the room with these other four people  who are alluding to the fact that they’re always   kind of dumping on her. She exits through the  doorway that goes to the kitchen, but instead of,   like, a normal sitcom where she would just be gone  and the scene would continue in the living room,   it follows her into the kitchen where, once she  is alone in the kitchen, everything changes. Courtney: The– the lights change, the laugh  track is gone, and it is just visually distinctly   different. And the first time it kind of gave  me chills, because there were so many years   where people would, you know, laugh off the  casual misogyny of a lot of sitcoms and like,   “Oh, it’s just a joke, it’s just lighthearted.”  And now that people are starting to look at it   with a more critical lens, I feel like  some of those older sitcoms have been   ruined for a lot of people. Because now  that you look back at them you’re like,   “Oh no, these people are just mean, they’re  just mean to each other.” They’re cruel,   they’re– you know the expense is usually at the  woman or the wife character in these situations.   So to see this character transition from a  sitcom world to dropping the sitcom facade and   responding as if those things were actually said  to her, where she is visibly in distress, she is   tired, she is over it, what– It, like– It gave  me chills the first time, it was very cool. Royce: The first cut was pretty hard too because  it was accompanying a quick camera change and the   slamming of the door. And the show moves between  these two viewpoints frequently. There are some   characters that are always, or almost always,  shown in sitcom mode and some characters that   are always shown in drama mode. Which is:  sitcom mode is a multi-camera filming model,   a single camera model is what tends  to be used for everything else.   The lighting, the style is what  you would think of for a drama. Courtney: Yeah, very dramatic and much darker  lighting, so a much more somber tone. And the–   the laugh track sort of also gets replaced  with more, like, suspenseful sounds too. Royce: Yeah. Courtney: Like a ringing in an ear or a buzzing as  a transition or as thoughts are worrying. So you   do get all of these, like, video and  audio cues that this is different. Royce: Right. And beyond just  the– the lighting and the sound,   the characters acting, their posture,  their facial expressions, the way that   they word their sentences. Because some of these  characters, and particularly Allison and Patty,   you see both in drama mode and sitcom mode and  the contrast between them, those two under those   two different camera settings, is drastic, like  everything about their character is different. Courtney: Yeah, they– Like I said, the strong  accent is, you know, a little less pronounced   in drama mode. The way they’re interacting with  people, they’re interacting more like real people   and depressed people and traumatized people  in drama mode. But in sitcom mode, you know,   if someone makes a joke at their expense, maybe  they’ll have a cutting response back to it and,   you know, just sort of ribbing each other. And  so, like I also, just– I commend the acting for   everyone in this show because there is range  between the two versions of reality. Now, since   you do mention Patty as someone that we also see  outside of sitcom mode, she is the first one we   see outside of sitcom mode and I didn’t even fully  appreciate that fact until we watched it through a   second time. Because Patty is not friends with  Allison. And Neil is not friends with Allison. Courtney: Basically it’s like Kevin and his three  friends that are around him, kind of all ganging   up on Allison, but she’s not friends with any of  them on her own. She– she’s the punching bag of   the sitcom. And so it didn’t really strike me as  heavily how profound it was when Allison has– in   another scene later on, outside of sitcom mode,  she– she’s like going through the living room,   so it’s all happy, lit up, sitcom mode, but  then she exits out the front door and it’s   all drama mode again and she’s just walking down  the sidewalk. She’s going somewhere. And she sees   Patty just on her front porch smoking a cigarette.  And they’re not friends, they’re not friendly,   so they sort of acknowledge each other, you  know, give a hey, but they’re– they’re kind   of side-eyeing each other at the same time. And it  didn’t occur to me until a second watch through,   when I knew where everything was going, how  telling it was that Patty is the first and   for a long time the only other person in this  main cast that we see outside of sitcom mode. Royce: Yeah, the sitcom bubble  very much revolves around Kevin. Courtney: Yes, and there will be situations  where you know, maybe Patty and Allison are   in the same room and they’re in drama mode, but  Kevin bursts into the room in the same scene and   everything changes instantly. So it does very  much follow this one guy. But for a very long   time we don’t see Neil or Pete without Kevin,  so they’re just always– And sometimes we’ll   even get scenes that it’s like just the three  of them and Allison isn’t even present there,   and you’ll see, like, old fashioned sitcom  hijinks. Like they’re making bad decisions   and they’re getting into trouble, but  they’re being very goofy and making you   know funny mistakes. Or what we’re being  told are supposed to be funny mistakes. Royce: Everything in sitcom mode is– even if  it’s a serious matter, ends up becoming a joke or   ends up being very neatly resolved in a way that  doesn’t cause serious harm. And there are a couple   of times where Kevin is off screen and Allison  is in drama mode and Kevin’s actions bleed from   sitcom mode into drama mode and you see, like,  the real life effects of this person’s behavior. Courtney: Yes! Because he’s– I  mean he’s played off as, like,   the buffoon, right? Like he’s the silly guy, he’s– Royce: He’s the sitcom husband. Courtney: He’s the sitcom husband! Royce: Like that’s the trope. Courtney: He’s getting into hijinks. He’s  making elaborate plans and schemes that go   awry and run amok, and all of these  negative ramifications are funny in   sitcom world because they’re hamming it up  that way. But a lot of the actual things are   like causing serious harm. And sometimes  we don’t even get to see the hijinks,   sometimes they’re just alluding to past hijinks as  the type of, like, a joke. Like they’ll joke about   how Kevin’s, like, accidentally set a bunch of  fires and we don’t let him play with fire anymore,   or something like that, and that’ll  be like a laugh track moment, but… Royce: There is an escalating series  of back and forth with new neighbors   that all happened off screen. You’d see  them in the house talking about what the   neighbors did and what they just did,  and this back and forth and scheming.   And you would hear that they left something on  their porch or stole something from the area,   or I believe at some point that ends with Kevin  setting something on fire. Arson is a theme. Courtney: It is, and if any of you have watched  this, I am curious to see– Because on a second   watch through, the writers of this show were  masters of Chekhov’s gun, because there would   be things that would be mentioned off handed  in sitcom mode, played off as a joke that   several episodes later would be like, “Oh shit,  that actually had a major ramification.” And I   would have never seen it coming. Because it’s not  like oh, someone pulls a gun out of their pocket,   so when is that gun gonna go off? It’s like–  Because you have these two different modes,   so sometimes when something from sitcom mode  bleeds into drama mode, it’s like jarring. Royce: And it’s also because so much of  this story does revolve around Kevin,   and Kevin is– his life is sheltered, he’s  kind of protected in what is visualized   as the sitcom bubble. A lot of his actions  don’t have consequences for him, but they do   have consequences for a variety of people around  him. And it’s not until we see them bleed over. Courtney: Everyone’s cleaning  up his messes for him, yeah. Royce: Kevin has a little, like, dry erase  board on his wall that he tallies points,   it’s like: ‘Kevin’ this many points,  ‘Life’ this many. And throughout the   series this number keeps going up, but near the  end it’s like Kevin: 700 and something, Life: 4. Courtney: Yeah! Well, for– The first time  this is pointed out exclusively, he’s like,   “I won this one!” And he– he wipes off  the Kevin, and he’s like, “Kevin 660,   life 3!” And we don’t get to know what those first  three life’s were. But that’s a funny number. Royce: It’s showing the pattern we’re seeing that– Courtney: Things always work in his favor. Royce: Things always work in his favor, he  kind of sees himself as untouchable. And when   you really start to think of the ramifications  of a lot of these behaviors that we, again, do   often see in sitcoms, if you actually take those  literally sometimes they’re really, really bad. Courtney: Really bad, yes! And here’s one example  from the show of, like, one of his sitcom hijinks.   He’s like, let’s, let’s find a way to, you know,  get a bunch of money. And this isn’t a get rich   quick scheme, this is a get wealthy fast plan.  And he convinces Neil and Pete to help him set   up an escape room in their basement. And he’s  like, “What we’re gonna do is tell people that   they’re gonna win this huge prize money if they–  like, jackpot, if they can figure out how to get   out of this escape room. And we’ll build it as  this very hard thing.” And so it shows him making   these incredibly counterintuitive, nonsensical  clues for this escape room in his basement. Courtney: And again, to go back to the fire,  when people were, you know, making jokes about,   like, “Oh, Kevin, starting fires!” was just a joke  played up for the laugh track. Allison is leaving   for the day and taking his car and she’s saying  you know, “I put a– I put a roast in the oven,   take it out in a couple hours.” And he’s not  listening to her. He never listens to her. This   is a theme. She’ll say something and he’ll, like,  have forgotten a couple minutes later. And so   she’s just fighting to say, like, “Just take the  meat out of the oven when it’s done. Just do this   one thing. I am leaving!” And she sets an Alexa–  and says you know, “Alexa set an alarm because I   don’t think he listened to me.” And the last thing  she says before she leaves is don’t burn down my   house. And then Kevin gets himself locked in the  escape room with these other people and then all   of a sudden the house starts getting all smoky.  Because the alarm goes off. He doesn’t know why   the Alexa is going off. And he can’t get upstairs  to the kitchen now to take the meat out of the   oven. So he actually does almost burn down the  house, and she knew that that was going to happen! Courtney: But the actual plot aside from these  sitcom hijinks, because those are very much a B   plot for the purposes of this show. In drama mode,  Allison, as this wife who is in this relationship   that nobody is perceiving as abusive, but we’re  seeing the fact that she is constantly the butt   of the joke. She is constantly needing to clean up  after Kevin’s messes. He is not very kind to her,   he is not very attentive. She decides that  she’s going to kill him. And I’m very here   for it. But she’s also very much, like,  white sheltered suburban woman who is like,   “I’m going to kill my husband because he  is terrible and he can fuck himself.” And   she doesn’t know how she’s going to do  that. So once she resolves to kill him,   part of the plot is her just trying to  figure out how she’s going to do it. Royce: And that plot spans most of the  first season. This is a fairly short   series. It’s two seasons, eight episodes  each. The episodes themselves are about   45 minutes. But the plot of the first season  is mostly Allison trying to figure this out,   I believe. She decides she’s going to  kill Kevin in episode one and settles   on a drug overdose being the easiest way  to accomplish that and then goes through   a whole series of situations to try to  find the pills to cause the overdose. Courtney: So Allison is looking for drugs to  try to make this seem like an opioid overdose   and she doesn’t know how to do that, so she’s  trying to figure it out. She kind of has a wild   night where she ends up doing some “coke-caine”  [laughs] which she says at one point. She says   coke and then has to explain, “-caine?” to someone  and they’re like, “Yeah, I know what you meant.”   And just sort of going off the rails partying.  And this actually has a lot to do with, like,   the neighbor feud too, because she has  now learned – because Patty told her – on   the front porch that their life savings that  Allison thought they had is gone. Kevin has   spent all of it. It is gone. Because she  was dreaming of actually buying a house. Courtney: They must be renting the one they  currently live in and she wanted to move to,   you know, a suburb, buy their own home. This is  something very aspirational for her, so she’s   fantasizing about what life would look like in  this suburb. Which wouldn’t have happened anyway,   because her fantasy of living in this suburb was  very, like, pristine 50s housewife. Like lovingly   pouring a beer for her husband and he looks  great and they both look happy. And it’s like we,   as the audience, know that’s not how that would  work anyway. So it’s also just sort of a– showing   a coming to the realization that everything in  the American dream, or every relationship we’re   told we’re supposed to have, isn’t always a  good thing for everyone. But she’s decided,   you know, “We have been married 10 years  now. We have saved up money for 10 years   now. I want to buy a house. Let’s talk to  a realtor, let’s get serious about this.” Courtney: And that’s when Patty, outside of  sitcom mode, kind of feels really bad for   her and is like, “Hey, Allison, there is no money  in that account.” And Allison’s like, “What? No,   that’s not possible.” And she’s like, “No, there’s  no money in this account.” Like, “Your husband has   asked my brother for money because he doesn’t  have any,” for all these like sports jerseys   and sports memorabilia that they’re buying. And  she even says, “How often does a package come to   this house? How do you think Kevin is paying for  all these expensive things that he’s getting?” And   she’s like, “Yeah, when Kevin asked Neil for  money, who do you think Neil went to for money?   Neil came to me. So that’s how I know, and this  was a couple of years ago. You don’t have any   money.” And so this was obviously all the more  reason to kill him. [laughs] But that’s sort of   the first conversation they have. And Allison  starts warming up to Patty and starts saying,   like, “Oh well, aren’t we friends?” And for a  while Patty’s like, “No, we’re still not friends.   I just felt bad for you and that is why I told  you that. But we are still very much not friends.” Courtney: And it’s in this episode too  that Allison realizes that Kevin had   just ordered a sweater that was worn by some  professional athlete and that that’s coming   to the house. And so Allison decides that  she’s going to steal that because fuck him,   right? And she took the package and was  like, “This is my sweater now.” And she   just wore it on her bender where she went and  did cocaine for the first time. And Kevin thinks   the neighbors stole this package, so that’s why  he’s feuding with the neighbors now. But it was   also in this episode where you get a moment  where Kevin is talking to Patty about how,   like, oh, he’s going to win this feud with the  neighbors, and Patty mentions offhandedly, like,   alluding to something else, and she’s like,  “You got the mail carrier deported because of   some minor thing they did that annoyed you,” or  something. So that’s also played up for the laugh   track. That’s passed off as a joke, in the way  that line is delivered is as a joke in the sitcom   world. But then you start thinking about that with  everything else that’s adding up and it’s like oh,   this guy is actually like ruining a lot of  people’s lives on a whim or over petty feuds. Courtney: And so in her quest to try to find  these pills, she meets a couple of dead ends,   but she gets a tip with a little business card on  it and is told, “Hey, if you go to this hair salon   and ask for a wash, like Bob gets, like that’s  the code, this owner of this salon is actually a   dealer and you can get some pills.” And so Allison  goes and finds out, in that moment, that this is   Patty’s salon. Patty is actually the dealer.  So then they have a moment of like, “Oh shit.”   So now they both kind of know that the other  one’s kind of up to something. Patty’s like,   “Why do you need these pills?” And Patty’s  getting supplied by an old friend from school   who’s a pharmacist now. And for the most part  she’s just been selling some here and there   to some of her clients, a lot of whom are, like,  middle-aged women, elderly women who have, like,   knee pains and hip issues and, like in her  mind, she’s not part of a big drug ring at   all. She just sees clients who have chronic  pain and she knows someone who can get them   pills. So she very naively is thinking that  she’s just doing this to help out these clients   of hers. But when she goes to get a restock  on the pills so that Allison can have some,   the pharmacy gets raided by police and that  pharmacist gets arrested. So her supplier is   now gone, which we also found out was  kind of accidentally Allison’s fault. Royce: Yes, that’s true. Courtney: Because when she was on coke…caine she  was also trying to just spill her guts to this   guy she was doing cocaine with, and he turned out  to not be listening at all, and since nobody ever   listens to her, she just absolutely lost it and  slapped him. And he got really angry. So when she   asked him, like, “Hey, sorry for slapping you,  but do you know anyone I can get pills from?” He   decided to mess with her and tell some guy that  she was a prostitute and set up this meeting   with these incorrect intentions. So she got mad  enough when she got set up like that that she   decided to call the cops on that guy and say, “I  saw this guy selling drugs and he works at this   mechanic shop,” and, “Please get this monster  off the street.” But since he got arrested he   decided to give up another local dealer, who’s  this pharmacist, probably in exchange for some   kind of plea bargain. And so that came full  circle. And now Patty can’t get any pills. Courtney: So Allison decides to lie to Patty and  say that the reason why she needs these pills is   because on this night that she went on this big  bender, she made some awful decision and stole   some pills from a guy who’s some big, serious,  tough dealer, and now he’s harassing her and he   wants his pills. So Patty’s now concerned  for Allison’s safety and is like, “Look,   I might know someone in another state who can get  us some, but we’re gonna do this once and only   once.” So they kind of go on a little girl’s trip  together, a little girl’s trip to get some drugs.   And that’s, you know, a series of unfortunate  happenstances too because the guy they thought   was gonna sell them drugs didn’t have the  right kind. He ended up bringing something   different. And then they say, “Who can we get  these particular pills from?” They send them   to someone else, but that person didn’t  have drugs either and, instead of drugs,   gave them a gun. And they were like, “What am I  gonna do with a gun?” And Patty thinks, “Well,   this is great, you can use it for self-defense  for this guy and get him off your back. Just   point it at him.” So they end up going back  home, no pills in hand, but they have a gun. Courtney: And they stop to fill up on gas  and Allison sees a trucker filling up his   semi who’s kind of limping, and she goes, “Oh,  I wonder if he has a prescription.” So she goes   and tries to buy some pills off of him in  a back corner. And Patty comes out of this   gas station seeing that Allison is gone. She  is now starting, because of this road trip,   to take a liking to Allison. They are now actually  starting to become friends because of these chats   that they had while driving. And she sees a guy  with Allison in a back corner and she’s like,   “Oh no, this is the guy who’s been threatening  her.” And so Patty comes up behind this guy and,   trying to defend Allison, just knocks  him out cold, just absolutely, like,   pistol-whips him from behind. So they run away  real fast. They steal the bottle of pills, or   Allison steals the bottle of pills that he dropped  when he got unconscious, and they head home. But   that is when they get picked up by police.  So of course Patty’s like hyperventilating. Royce: So it’s at this point, they are on their  way back home, they have a stolen bottle of   pills and have an unregistered firearm in the  car, and they are pulled over by the police. Courtney: And they recently assaulted a man  in a parking lot in the middle of the night. Royce: Yeah, and they find out that the reason  why they have been pulled over is because the car   that they are driving has been reported as stolen  by Kevin. Kevin ignored Allison when Allison told   him she was leaving and was taking the car  and then tried calling Allison repeatedly,   and when Allison didn’t answer– I don’t  think Kevin specifically reported Allison   as a missing person, but he did report  this car as stolen as a response to that. Courtney: Yeah, it was just the car. I  don’t think it’s anything about Allison. Royce: But this is a moment of, I think, clarity.  A moment of insight into their relationship in   the drama sequence outside of sitcom mode. Where  Patty, in disbelief, is like, “You didn’t answer   your phone earlier today and Kevin reports  your car is stolen,” like that’s all it took. Courtney: Well, yeah, and in this moment too,  Allison isn’t surprised, and she’s like, “Patty,   this is what he does, this is him.” And  Patty’s even like, “Well, you know Kevin,   I mean, he’s a buffoon.” Like, he’s a goof, like  he just does silly things. And Allison’s like,   “Oh, no. No, no, it’s way worse than that,  and that’s why I’m gonna kill him.” And so   she tells Patty, right then and there, that  that is what she’s planning to do, and– Royce: I think it’s at that  point in that conversation,   she also goes through a list of small things like– Courtney: Not small. She goes through big things. Royce: What I meant was she very quickly  moves through a list of things without a lot   of detail of, like, things that Allison has  tried to do, career choices, friend groups,   things like that, somehow Kevin has gotten  in the middle of all of them and isolated   her. She’s at a point in her life where she  has a job at a liquor store. She basically   doesn’t have a friend group. She doesn’t have  a career path. Every time she has tried to do   something for herself, Kevin has done  something to cause that to disappear. Courtney: Yeah, he sabotaged it. And she wanted  to go back to school. She got a job that she   was really proud of and she was like, “I was  proud of myself. I felt like I was, you know,   doing good and making something for myself.”  Was it like a paralegal or something along   those lines? I’m trying to remember. But,  like, Kevin absolutely sabotaged that job   for her and she lost that opportunity. And,  like with the job at the liquor store too,   there comes a point where Allison actually quits  that job and gets a job at a diner. And that diner   happens to be owned by not formally an ex, but a  past love interest of hers from back in school,   that they maybe had a little fling but  weren’t in a formal relationship at   the time. And he’s recently moved back to  Worcester, after moving away for a while,   and opens up a diner there. And so she stumbles  upon his diner, reconnects with him and he ends up   giving her a job in this diner. And it’s in sitcom  mode, so it’s all played for laughs. But Kevin,   like, confronts her about quitting her job  at the liquor store because he wanted that   employee discount for liquor. So like, even  something as seemingly innocuous as changing   your job from a liquor store to a diner,  he is upset about it and confronts her. Royce: I pulled up the transcript,   and Allison did get a job as a paralegal.  That caused her to start working a lot,   and Kevin convinced everyone in their friend  group that Allison was having an affair,   and then poured sugar in her boss’s gas tank,  which ruined the engine. And then she got fired. Courtney: Yep. So yeah, when she says that to  Patty in this list of like, “No, this is what   he does. He ruins my life, he  ruins opportunities for me. I   am 0% surprised that he reported this car stolen.” Courtney: So now they’ve kind of got this  like Thelma and Louise situation going. We   got these two women doing crimes together  who are getting in a little too deep and   are starting to develop this bond of  friendship now that was absent before.   And you start getting these additional nuggets  of when they’re talking together. Like Allison   picks up hamburgers, at just like a fast food  joint, and gets an extra one and gives it to   Patty. And as they’re eating that on the porch,  she’s like, “I used to eat hamburgers every day   after swim practice back when I was a competitive  swimmer, and I haven’t eaten one in years.” Like,   “I have changed everything about  my life since I married Kevin.” Courtney: And this new boss, old love interest  of hers, kind of becomes a new love interest too.   They start kind of having an affair. And this is  the thing that’s very, very interesting, because   I said at the top of this episode that there  is a queerplatonic brilliance about this show,   and there absolutely is. And it didn’t get enough  attention that I’m seeing like a ton of think   pieces on it, but some of the op-eds that I saw at  the time this was coming out– First of all during   the first season, they’re like, “Kevin isn’t  actually that bad and Allison’s way worse than   him because she wants to kill him.” And it’s like  I don’t know. I could definitely see the little   nuggets of like, no, this is intense manipulation.  It is just being glossed over by this sitcom   bubble of a brush. So I at least kind of always  sense that there was more to the story of Kevin   than what was overtly being shown to us. Courtney: But there are still some people who,  as– like the two leading women, Allison and Patty,   who will either say, “I’m so disappointed that  they didn’t turn out to be gay,” or they’ll say,   “I’m so excited that they did end up becoming gay  and in a romantic relationship.” And I don’t– I   disagree with both of those assessments.  I don’t think anyone has seen it the way   I see it. And I think it’s so much more complex  and nuanced than a will they/won’t they of Allison   and Patty. Because in my eyes neither of  them ever expressed a sexual or romantic   interest in one another, but they did express  those interests towards other outside people. Courtney: Allison starts having this fling with  this boss of hers, and Patty at first, we learned,   has been in a relationship with the guy for  a while, but there’s very much no real spark   there. They’re very much in a rut. She seems very  bored, if not outright annoyed by him, and he ends   up proposing to her because he’s like, “We’ve been  together for long enough, this is good.” And she’s   like, “Whoa, why do you gotta do that? Why don’t  we just keep doing the thing that we’re doing?   ’Cause this works.” But he really wants something  more than Patty’s giving him. So they end up   breaking it off and Patty instead starts dating a  police officer, who also happens to be the first   woman that Patty has ever been in a relationship  with. And also happens to be the officer like   actively investigating some of the shit that  they are involved in, in some way. So there is   kind of this, like, added level of tension and  tiptoeing around things because of that now. Courtney: So during the course of all this,  a much grittier drug dealer just shows up   in Patty’s salon one day, and is like, “Hey,  I’m the nephew of someone you’ve been dealing   to for years. And I get it, sometimes it’s good  business to not ask a lot of questions, but did   you really think that all of those pills you were  given to my dear aunt were just for her knee pain   or whatever?” And he’s like, “Come on, you have  been– you have been increasingly giving her more   bottles. You really didn’t suspect that there  was something bigger going on here?” Like, you   were supplying my aunt, and I was supplying the  rest of the town. And so then Patty realizes that   she’s gotten in some deep trouble as well. And  now he wants pills. He’s like, “Figure it out.” Courtney: So after hearing all this, Allison  decides to not use these pills to try to kill   Kevin. She decides she’s going to  give those pills to Patty to try to   assuage this drug dealer who wants his  pills. And so now they need a new method. Courtney: What is the new method of killing Kevin?  They’re like, “Well, actually, word on the street   is this drug dealer killed his stepfather  or something and got away with it.” And so   they’re like, “Maybe we can hire him and take out  a hit on Kevin.” So they try to do exactly that. Courtney: And it’s kind of  interesting because during this   first period of their blossoming friendship,  when they’re put back in sitcom mode, Patty   will reflexively make mean jokes at Allison’s  expense, and then Allison will be like, “Hey!” And   she’s like, “Sorry, reflex.” Like she just can’t  help it. This environment, like, is so toxic and   so carefully curated this way by Kevin. So  we start seeing a little less of that. We   start seeing Patty distancing herself from the  main group with the three guys a little more.   And since they came home with this gun that is,  as you pointed out earlier, unregistered, made   in a very seedy backwards deal, they decide to  just, like, bury it in their backyard. Like this,   “I just wanna wash my hands with this. I don’t  want anything to do with this gun right now.” Courtney: And so, after they hire this guy  to kill Kevin, there is this moment where   Allison is really distraught. She has, like,  got a bottle of wine and she’s drinking in a   bathtub and she’s crying. And Patty comes to find  her and Allison’s just sort of lamenting like,   “I’m not going to have my house in the suburbs,  I’m not gonna have my kids.” And Patty even says,   like, “Do you even want kids?” And she’s like,  “Well, yeah, of course it’s what you do.”   So that’s also kind of hinting at the fact that  she probably hasn’t actually thought about it   that much, but she’s probably been looking at  her miserable relationship and thinking, “Well,   this will be better when we have a house,  this will be better when we have kids,”   despite that absolutely not being the case.  And she’s just lamenting the fact that she’s   gonna die alone cause her husband’s gonna  be dead, and this is just how it’s gonna be. Courtney: And so Patty ends up like – and  they’re fully closed, they’re like in their   jeans and normal clothes – and so Patty gets in  the bathtub alongside her and they’re drinking   the wine right out of the bottle together and  it’s a really sweet moment. They just sort of,   like, lean their heads in together and just lean  on each other and drink wine in the bathtub. But   I think that was the first main moment where the  concept of being alone and dying alone was seen as   like the worst possible outcome, which does come  up with other characters later. So the end of the   first season – this is a two-season show – the end  of the first season was kind of jarring because   for the first time since Allison and Patty, we  see the next person break out of sitcom mode. Royce: Yeah, well, let’s back up just a little  bit because, leading into the finale here,   things are trying to get set up. So the  drug dealer will break into the house   and kill Kevin. Patty has buried the  unregistered firearm in the backyard,   which is very quickly thereafter found during  sitcom hijinks involving a metal detector. Courtney: Yeah, Kevin finds it. Royce: Yes, Kevin and Neil find it while they  are messing around with a metal detector. And   so the drug dealer breaks into the house ahead  of schedule because he is– has just committed   a parole violation and needs to get out of town  now, basically. Kevin whips out this gun from,   like, under a pillow or under a mattress  or something – Allison had no idea he had   the gun – and somewhere off-screen, he  confronts the drug dealer and shoots him. Courtney: Yeah, and can I just say we were  watching the show on a weekly basis as it   was coming out and it was agonizing. Because  we just hear an off-screen shot, and we know   that both of these guys have guns, and they leave  you hanging for a while before you find out who   actually shot whom. And just the nature of this  show like they would often leave on cliffhangers   and they’d often do like a coming up next week  with like a best of reel for various scenes that   would have us going like, “What context is that  in?” So it was an agonizing week-to-week watch. Royce: This was also a show that I think was in a   very shaky “Is it going to get canceled  or completed?” state during season one. Courtney: Oh yeah, after the first season left  off on yet another cliffhanger. I was like,   “I swear, if this show gets  canceled I will be so mad.” Royce: But rounding out the first season,  the drug dealer is hospitalized after being   shot. I believe is unconscious  in a coma or something like that.   The season ends after a couple of verbal  confrontations. Neil had been bothering   Kevin more than Kevin liked, so Kevin had told  him to go. They told Neil to basically go hide   as some sort of, like, large scale game of hide  and seek that apparently they’ve done before that   Neil really wanted to do. So Allison and Patty  believe that they are alone in Allison’s home   and begin very loudly talking about everything  that has happened, and how the person that they   were hiring to kill Kevin is now in the hospital  and might wake up at some point, they don’t know.   And sort of their whole plan is in jeopardy,  they’re in danger, and Neil overhears this. Courtney: Yeah, and it was kind of a big  confrontation of, you know, relationship   strife too, because Allison is concerned about  Patty’s new girlfriend officer being suspicious   of her and suspicious of their plans and she’s  investigating all these things. And she’s   always kind of side-eyeing Allison when they’re  together in person. So she’s like, “I think your   girlfriend’s on to me. And she’s constantly like  writing notes down in a notebook. Why don’t you   steal that notebook and read it and see what she’s  saying, and see if she’s on to us.” And Patty does   that and learns that she’s just really jealous of  Allison, and is concerned that Allison is like a   threat to the relationship. So then Patty feels  awful that she just violated her girlfriend’s   trust, and she’s like, “How could you ask me  to do that?” So that was the context of this   argument and Patty kind of ends up storming out.  And then we see Neil fall out of a closet, like   stuffed behind blankets and stuff, and confronts  Allison and was like, “I just heard all of that.” Courtney: And at first he plays it off pretty  goofy, like the goofy sitcom guy, but then he’s   like, “I’m going to tell Kevin.” And ends up like  throwing Allison down on like a counter and like   grabbing her throat and like very violently trying  to, like, take his phone back from her. And then   Patty, who we thought was gone, like, smashes  a bottle over his head from behind and he falls   down to the ground. And then it’s the darker,  moodier lighting again and he drops the funny   guy act. And so now he’s not fully unconscious but  he is, like, bleeding from the head on the ground,   and then Patty and Allison standing there just  like grab each other’s hands and stare down at   Patty’s brother who is now bleeding on the ground  and knows that they were conspiring to kill Kevin.   And that’s how that season ended! So of course  I was like, “I am going to riot if they cancel   this!” Because now we’re like, Neil broke out of  sitcom mode. What’s going to happen with that? Courtney: And all throughout this,  like, plot to kill Kevin too,   I did want to point out that, in line  with just like imposed aspirations,   after Allison’s dropped the, “Oh, we’re going  to live in the suburb and live the perfect like   50s housewife life,” she starts fantasizing about  what her life’s going to be like after she kills   Kevin and she’s like, “I’m going to go to cafes  and have tea and a scone and read a book by the   shore. And I’m just going to love my quiet life,  reading books and going to coffee shops.” And so   you see all these like dreams and these fantasies  about the fact that she’s going to do that. But   season two comes and now that they’re out of  options for killing Kevin – the pills are gone,   the guy who was going to kill him is still in a  coma in the hospital – the new plan then becomes   Allison’s going to fake her own death and take  someone else’s identity and just move far away. Courtney: And Kevin, of course,  I mean this whole time he’s just   failing upward all the time. Like  he even starts running for, like,   a political office because the whole town loves  him for standing up to the vicious drug dealer   and defending your home. And so like the entire  town loves him, and they’re even showing like   police officers on his side, and everyone  just enabling his bad behavior all around. Courtney: And you sort of see the messy  implications of these other relationships   that these two women are in, like– I really  liked Patty and Tammy, her cop girlfriend,   as a relationship on TV too that was, you know,  two women. Because I think a lot of queer couples   on TV kind of fall into either there’s like a  tragic kind of we can’t be together because of   our respective situations or we have to hide  what we have, or it’s a very like – I mean,   this is an adult relationship so it’s not  the same – but it’s like Heartstoppery where   it’s like we’re doing the very aspirational,  like, this is the perfect relationship, they   are happy and lovey-dovey and they’re going to  have a happy ending and live happily ever after. Courtney: But this relationship just felt so real.  Like even aside from the fantastical situations of   like, yeah, Patty’s hiding all these things, she’s  committing these crimes, she’s Allison’s cohort,   the moments when they are together there are  real moments of, like, Tammy being envious of   someone else, feeling threatened by someone  else. They have normal fights that normal   couples have. There’s really good moments where  you’ll see them just sort of being, you know, fun   and cutesy together, but then you’ll see issues  that they’re going through. And it just felt so   real in a way that I don’t see a lot of queer  relationships on TV looking. Because normally   people are very concerned about, you know,  portraying queer relationships the right way.   But this felt like the real way.  So I really appreciated that too. Courtney: But then Allison almost has a moment  where she thinks maybe she can leave Kevin and   just be with this other guy she’s having an affair  with. And that kind of almost seems to be the   dream for a little bit and they kind of talk about  what that would look like. He’s also married,   by the way, but there’s a moment when he leaves  his wife and he tells her as much and is like,   “This is our chance.” But he says a couple of  things that– she has now had enough character   development through her, not only her relationship  with Patty, but now her growth as a character   just trying to identify what she actually really  wants, where Patty has said things like, “I like   who you are and I don’t want you to change.” And  “I like this version of Allison. I didn’t like the   submissive housewife version of Allison. I like  this version of you.” And this guy that she’s   having an affair with occasionally will drop  something like, you know, we can get better,   we can be better people if we’re together and  we can become better versions of ourselves. Courtney: And Allison finally has  a realization where she’s like,   “There are some people who like me exactly the  way I am. And I’m not a charity case.” And it’s   very clear, just based on dialogue, that she  is talking about Patty. Patty is basically   the only one who has ever told her that she  has self-worth just for being who she is. Courtney: And so they do all the necessary  preparations to fake Allison’s death. They   get a– they sort of destroy the death certificate  for someone whose identity she’s going to take   that sort of roughly fits her physical description  as close as they can get. And they have a guy who   can forge all the appropriate documents for them.  They’re like breaking into City Hall and stuff.   But this whole time they’re getting  closer to one another and they’re also,   I mean, they’re trying to deal with Neil,  because now Neil knows what’s going on. Royce: Throughout this entire season,  Neil is just on one big downward spiral. Courtney: Very much so. But throughout it we  also learn, and we got kind of inklings before,   like “Kevin came to Neil for money and Neil came  to me.” We start getting a better picture there,   where– The house they live in I get the impression  it’s kind of like a duplex kind of a situation,   because they live in the same building that  belonged to their parents, and so they inherited   it from their parents. But it seems like Patty  has been covering a lot of Neil’s expenses and   the payments on the house itself, and that she  also just has to clean up a lot of his own messes,   and that he can’t really function on his  own without her. And so we see more and   more of that and she feels an obligation to  do so because, you know, that’s her brother   and that’s family. But you start to see more and  more how it’s been taking a toll on her as well. Courtney: And Neil even starts getting  like a little bit saucy in sitcom mode,   like you almost start to see the facade begin to  crack with some of the way he delivers his lines,   like he’s only half-heartedly  delivering lines comedically,   but there’s like a little venom of  truth and spite in some of his lines. Courtney: And throughout all this on his downward  spiral, he’s still very much clinging to Kevin   and still wants to be on Kevin’s good side, but he  feels a lot of resentment, especially for Allison,   but also for Patty, for the things they  did to him and for the fact that, you know,   he knows what they were trying to do. And he just  really starts losing control. But it’s while he’s   losing control of this that he falls into a  relationship with Allison’s former boss from   the liquor store. And there’s a bit of an age  gap there, she’s quite a bit older than he is.   So once that relationship gets revealed, there  are a lot of, you know, a lot of shock and awe,   some jokes at their expense,  of course, from Kevin. Courtney: So we also have a running theme now  of people getting into romantic and or sexual   relationships at very vulnerable points in  their life, and we see through flashbacks   even that Allison was really really affected by  the death of her father and that her, you know,   sort of falling into this marriage with  Kevin happened pretty shortly after that   happened as well. So we start to see  that, we see Patty getting into this   relationship with Tammy during a very  stressful period of time obviously,   because they’re committing lots of crimes.  And now Neil, who’s on a very self-sab– Royce: Self-destructive? Courtney: Self-destructive path, thank you. Is now  also starting a new relationship, and that woman   is also married and it has also been revealed  that she’s in a very abusive relationship.   Was that confirmed to be physically abusive? Did  she, like, show up with a black eye at one point? Royce: I can’t remember definitively, but I  feel like that was the case. At the very least,   she mentioned to Neil that it was  dangerous for him to be found out. Courtney: Yeah, and she even, like, almost kind of  tried to leave him at one point, and that kind of   opened Allison’s eyes like, “You can just leave.”  But then she goes back to him and everyone’s like,   “Why did you go back to him?” And she’s like,  “It’s just not that easy to leave. You don’t   understand.” So she decides to go back and stay  with her husband, but to continue this affair with   Neil. And so– And also in this season, another  fire that Kevin starts actually causes, like,   a power outage for the entire city, and he ends up  bringing his crew to this diner because he’s like,   “Oh, the diner is a great place to be at during  a power outage.” And he brings this generator   and he’s like, “Don’t worry, we’re gonna hook up  a TV, we’re gonna have power here. I’ve got this   generator.” But he doesn’t realize that it runs on  fuel – he assumes it runs out of batteries – and   he states that he brought batteries that he  took out of the fire detectors at their house. Royce: The smoke detectors? Courtney: The smoke detectors. And then,   of course, everyone groans and they’re  like, “Kevin, it doesn’t take batteries.” Royce: I didn’t catch that on either watchthrough. Courtney: You didn’t?! Oh my gosh, that– that was  part of where I was like, “This is brilliant.”   Because there are so many like, that’s just  a one off like, “Oh, that’s Kevin for ya!” Royce: That’s just a very stupid thing  that of course Kevin would say. Like one,   a generator that size isn’t going  to run on a whole bunch of smoke   detector batteries anyway,  even if it was electric. Courtney: Yeah, he’s like, “Oh, I took the– took  the batteries out of the smoke detector.” And   everyone’s like, “It doesn’t run on batteries! It  runs on gas!” And– and like, yeah, that’s, that’s   basically the extent of that line. So– so many of  these things seem like throwaway lines. Even a lot   of the previous examples of, oh, he started a fire  doing this, or “Don’t burn down my house,” that,   “We don’t let him play with fire anymore.” Like  all of those seem to be throwaway punchlines. But   when you take them at face value – which in sitcom  mode in the show, it’s not training you to do,   it’s not telling you to do that – you have to kind  of piece it together after the fact, and be like,   wait a minute, there is a pattern of behavior here  that we’re not supposed to just disregard and and   take it face value. So that happens at one point.  But other things just start catching up with them. Courtney: For instance, Tammy – Tammy Ridgeway,  Officer Ridgeway – has now been trying to sort   of solve why this drug dealer was in their house  with a gun and he’s clearly in a coma. But they   think he’s related to just other drug activity  in the area and they want to catch this other   dealer and figure out to, like, tie up all the  loose ends with that case. And as part of just   general investigations, Tammy gets her hands  on security camera footage from the gas station   in – I want to say – Vermont, when they went on  their road trip last season, early last season,   to try to get those pills, when they ended up  getting that gun, when they ended up assaulting   that trucker. And Tammy at this point is invested  enough in this relationship that she’s more   concerned for Patty. She’s like, “I don’t know  what’s going on yet, but I think Patty is in some   trouble and is in some hot water and is doing  some shady things.” But she is not immediately   planning to turn her into the precinct, but she  is trying to get to the bottom of what’s going on. Courtney: So she tells Allison that she has  this footage, and asks Allison what’s going   on. And she’s like, “I know you’re Patty’s  best friend,” and you know – I don’t know if   she outright says it, but the context clues are  very much: even though I don’t like you. – “I   know you and I both care for Patty. And so  what exactly is going on here? Do you have any   other information? Has she been acting strangely  around you?” And Allison kind of realizes then,   “I actually have to do this, I actually  have to leave for Patty’s sake.” Which is   really kind of tragic because just prior  to this, Allison goes to Patty and says,   “I’ve kind of been second-guessing things,  I don’t think I actually want to leave,” and   Patty says, “I don’t want you to leave,” even  though it would make a lot of things a lot easier. Royce: Over these last, I would say, I  think it’s two, maybe three episodes,   Allison starts to realize: one, yes,  there’s the pattern that she’s already   admitted that everything that Kevin wants  to happen happens, like he has this ability   to just make things go his way. But then  she realizes, “I can manipulate Kevin.” Courtney: Yes! Royce: “I can use Kevin to have him change things  about our world for my benefit.” And she thinks,   like, “Maybe, maybe I can figure out a way  to make this work so I don’t have to leave.” Courtney: Like, “If I can pit Kevin against  Tammy Ridgeway, if I can get him to have a bone   to pick with her, he can make sure she loses her  job.” Like then no one will take her seriously.   And like, yeah, it’s really schemy. But you  see Kevin starting to enact a plan like that   where he’s like, “Oh, I can present evidence  that she planted evidence at a crime scene.   And this is how we’re going to do it.” And so she  starts seeing things like that, where she’s like,   “Maybe if we can make sure we don’t get in  any legal trouble, maybe I can still stay   and maintain this friendship with Patty.” And  despite the fact that Patty admits, like, “Yes,   if we can pit all of these crimes on you but then  fake your death and you can just disappear, then   I will be off scot-free.” Like that is admittedly  the easier option for Patty, but despite all that   she says, “No, I don’t want you to leave.” So  they kind of resolve that she’s not going to. Courtney: But with this new piece of evidence and  with the target on Patty’s back, Allison makes   the decision, without even talking to Patty, that  she’s just going to do it. She is up and leaving,   she’s got the paperwork already, she’s going to  fake her death now. And it’s even in sitcom mode   when, like, cops come to the door to tell Kevin  that they, you know, found her stuff when she   was hiking and they think a terrible accident  has happened in the mountain. And Patty is just   distraught. And this is like the second to last  episode of the entire series. And then it sees   Allison looking for a place to rent temporarily  under her new name, Gertrude Fronch. Quite a name. Royce: We mentioned earlier that they tried to  find an identity that was close enough to be   believable for Allison, but it’s not close  enough to be enjoyable. [Courtney laughs]   Allison hates everything about it, like the  new identity ages her like 10 years and it’s   the worst name ever, and she doesn’t like  any of it. But also is, at that same time,   sort of panicking at all of this being real.  Like I think even if the identity would have   been better, she would have had an issue  with it somehow at that point in time. Courtney: Mm-hmm. Well, yeah, because  now that she’s actually developing an   emotionally fulfilling relationship with  Patty, she has something to lose now.   And she didn’t have that before. But this is why  I think part of the subversion of this entire   show is just societal expectations in a way that  I don’t think I see done this cleverly very often.   Because we saw the housewife fantasies fall to the  wayside. We got the discussion about expectations   around kids falling by the wayside. But now  Allison is alone. Everyone thinks she’s dead.   So she’s essentially a free woman now. And it  sees her at a little cafe trying to read a book,   just like her fantasies did, where it was  all like rose-colored glasses, everything’s   wonderful and glamorous and she’s feeling so  good. But this was hilarious because they have   her sitting there reading a copy of Ulysses and  she’s just going, [whispering] “What?” [laughs]   She is just cocking her head at this book  going, “I don’t understand.” [laughs] So   she’s absolutely not enjoying this book. And,  yeah, that’s not the easiest read in the world.   But at this point I don’t even know if Allison  genuinely even enjoys reading or if she just   fantasizes about enjoying reading, because it’s  something that she doesn’t usually get to do. Courtney: We adopted an orphaned copy  of Ulysses once, not long after we got   married. We were going to brunch in Kansas City  at this– I think it was the French place, a nice   little French brunch place. And it was just  in, like, a cute little shopping center,   strip mall kind of a thing. And we were walking  around the neighborhood after we ate and there   was just the weirdest thing, because it  was like in a doorway around a back alley,   on like a side door, it was just the book  sitting, like, propped up against the door,   and it had like just started to rain too. So we  were, like, trying to get back to our car and we   were like, “Oh no, this poor orphaned book, we  can’t leave it out here in the rain!” [laughs]   So we have a very used, very beat up copy  of Ulysses because it chose us. [laughs] Courtney: But no, it’s not the easiest read  in the world. And I think it had already   previously been established that Allison  basically only reads, like, once a year,   on Kevin’s birthday. Because Kevin always tries  to go out for a nice dinner with Allison. But   it’s also right next to an arcade and he does  the, like, two dates to a prom sitcom trope   where he’s trying to play games with Neil at  the arcade while also trying to have dinner   with Allison. So he’s constantly, like, making  excuses to leave the restaurant and she’s like,   “Oh, I absolutely know that Neil is next door,”  like “I know that this happens every single year,   so I just bring a book to read and I have a nice  night to myself and I enjoy it.” But she doesn’t   usually get to finish her book because then she  goes back to her life and doesn’t have time to   herself anymore. And there’s actually a very sweet  moment where Patty learns about this and is like,   “Well, that’s kind of sad, I– we didn’t know that  you knew that that’s what he was doing. But I, as   part of – well, I guess – the outside of the inner  circle, I knew that he was doing this every year,   but we thought he was pulling the wool out of your  eyes.” And she’s like, “No, of course I know. He’s   not slick.” And she, like, brings her a little  novella and is like, “Oh, it’s just a novella,   so you actually have a chance of finishing  this one this year.” And it was so sweet! Courtney: I think Patty actually does  like to read, probably in a way that   Allison does not. But while we also  see Allison like struggling to read   Ulysses and not enjoying her life and not  really having any other close relationships,   we’re also cutting back and we’re seeing that  Patty, six months later – six months have now gone   by – is using basically every spare moment of her  free time between clients at work and after work   trying to track down Allison. Because she didn’t  realize she was going to just pull the trigger and   do that to protect her, but she knew what the  plan was all along. So now she’s like looking   at news clipping, she’s like calling operators  in different cities and states trying to look   for a Gertrude Fronch, and she is just going  on this huge campaign trying to find Allison. Courtney: And it’s also at this time that officer  Tammy Ridgeway is like, “Hey, it’s been a rough   time. Why don’t we just move somewhere and start  anew? I’m not happy with my job. You can open up   a salon anywhere. We can just go and leave  Worcester.” And leaving Worcester is also a   big common theme, like everyone talks about, like,  “Oh, this place is terrible and everyone wants to   get out of here.” And– Very, very small hometown  vibe. Like, I definitely grew up in a place where   everyone’s like, “Oh, I can’t wait to get out of  here.” So I thought it was a pretty small place,   but you actually corrected me on that and  looked it up. Apparently it’s not that small. Royce: It’s not huge, but it’s the second  largest city in New England after Boston. Courtney: Mm-hmm. So– And in fact it’s actually   just Tammy who’s kind of the only  one who– during their first road   trip, where they first started  getting to like each other,   when Allison was talking a lot like, “Oh, I’d  love to leave Worcester and go somewhere else,   go anywhere else.” And then Tammy is like– Or  no, Patty says, “Well, I’ve got this theory:   everywhere’s bad, everywhere sucks. I bet  Miami is terrible. I bet–” I think they were   talking randomly about North Dakota, they’re  like North Dakota’s bad, every place is bad.   Which is, I mean, probably true if you see the  wrong sides of any given place. But Patty then   is the only one who hasn’t expressed interest in  leaving Worcester. It’s basically Patty and Kevin,   because Kevin– like, everything’s working out  for him and he doesn’t want anything to change   that he doesn’t control. So Allison’s not having  the best time, Patty’s not having the best time. Courtney: We do see Kevin and the gang,   and after six months we find out that he is in  a relationship with a new woman and they’ve been   together for four months. And he’s kind of playing  two sides of it. He’s kind of playing, “Well,   I have replaced Allison, so I don’t need her,” and  in fact sometimes, like, mixes up Allison and his   new girlfriend in ways that really shows that  it is not about the individual women. But then   he’s also using his, like, grief and mourning over  the loss of Allison to, like, hold over people’s   heads and further manipulate them to do things  for him. So you definitely see that duality. Courtney: And as Allison’s going about her own  new life as Gertrude Fronch, she starts getting   a little concerned, a little paranoid, because  she’s seeing like the same Jeep show up at a lot   of places where she is. So she gets the feeling  that she’s being followed. And this is being   interspersed with Patty finding or trying to find  her. So when there finally is a knock at her door,   the surprise reveal is that it’s actually Tammy  Ridgeway who shows up at her door and says, “Hi,   Allison.” And so Allison’s immediately thinking,  “You have figured all of this out. The rest of   Worcester PD is outside waiting for me, I’m going  to get arrested now.” And Tammy basically says,   “No, I figured it out. There’s a reason why Patty  doesn’t want to leave Worcester with me.” And I   think they did say that Tammy had moved in  with Patty, so they were living together,   but she wanted them to start fresh somewhere  else that was a new place, that was, like,   just for the two of them kind of a  thing. And alluding to the fact that   you know Worcester is haunted, we’ve had a  lot of bad memories here, kind of a thing. Courtney: And she said that Patty’s been behaving  very strangely, and now I figured it out it’s   because you’re not dead and she wants you to  come back and she wants to be findable if you   do ever decide to come back. And she’s kind  of had it at the police department. I mean,   she is not only a woman on the force, but she is  a Black woman on the force, and so she’s seeing   like white men get promoted over her who have been  doing the job for less time and all these things.   So she’s like, “I no longer have any loyalty to  this precinct, and I would quit and go elsewhere   in a heartbeat.” But Nick, the drug dealer who’s  in a coma, finally actually died for realsies,   and so she came to tell Allison that. And she’s  like, “Yeah, I’ve had someone investigating you   and looking for you, they told me you were here.  And as far as I’m concerned, you know, all these   secrets died with Nick.” So she was just kind  of telling Allison you’re– you’re off scot-free. Courtney: And upon learning this, Allison does  actually go back to Worcester. But she is not   ready to see Patty right off the bat. She said, “I  have to figure out how to have this reunion with   her.” She goes to see her former boss, her former  love interest guy she was having an affair with,   and he’s someone that Patty has now started  hanging out with, if nothing else just to have   someone else who knows that she faked her own  death, who she can spit ball with and be like,   “I’m trying to find her, I’m trying to find her.”  And so I don’t think there’s a lot of love there,   necessarily. But they have this one thing  in common that only the two of them can   talk about. And so when Patty comes to him he  spills the beans and is like, “Allison is here.”   And Patty goes, “What?!” And just the– the  acting is so good, like you can just see how   much care goes into this, let alone the difference  in acting style between sitcom and drama versions. Courtney: But we also start seeing Kevin with  his new girlfriend. But we also see all the   people around him sort of starting to get very  disillusioned with him and no longer playing his   game. And there are definitely allusions  to the fact that they knew earlier, like,   they knew he was problematic for a while but still  hung around. Neil especially, since we’ve seen him   in drama mode this entire season. But even his  father, Pete, at one point during this episode   grabs a suitcase to leave and is like, “Yeah, I’m  moving with my girlfriend to Florida. And you’ve   been taking advantage of me for these last six  months. I tried to stay around because you were in   mourning, but enough is enough.” And Kevin  says, like, “All right, well, I’ll– I’ll be   down to visit you in February, so I can keep up  my tan or something.” And his dad, his father,   Pete, is like, “Do you really think I’m going to  give you the address? Come on!” And just, like,   leaves without giving his address to his son.  And it’s just gone now. And then Neil leaves. Courtney: There was a very particular moment,  too, where Patty was having a conversation   with Allison’s ex boss from the liquor store. I  can’t think of her name off the top of my head,   but she’s the one who’s been having an affair  with Neil all this time that’s still going on   by this point. Diane! Diane is her name. So  Patty’s talking to Diane, and Diane kind of   lets the L word slip. She’s like, “Oh, I  love him.” And she’s like, “Wait a minute,   you love Neil?” Because for a while  she’s just been seeing this as like a   very weird relationship, maybe just a, you know,  situation of convenience. There’s kind of that   age gap there that she’s feeling perhaps  a little strange about. But she’s like,   “Wait, you love my brother?” And Diane just  sort of says, “Well, I mean yeah, maybe,   or maybe I just don’t want to be alone, and maybe  there’s not always a difference.” And Patty has   this deep moment of reflection that you can just  see in her face when she says that. And so it’s   this just running theme of people who are just in  relationships because they don’t want to be alone. Courtney: Allison is with Kevin. Patty was with  whatever that guy’s name was earlier and then was   with Tammy. And I do think she genuinely liked  Tammy. They had some cute moments. They also had   a lot of very fraught moments and very, like,  definitely had their relationship issues for   sure. But then they also had big talks where  Patty’s like, “This is new for me, you’re the   first woman I’ve had feelings for.” And so even  though I do think there was some attraction there,   the relationship itself was just not quite right,  and I think they were hanging on longer than was   beneficial for either of them. And now she’s sort  of hearing it from Diane, like she doesn’t know if   she loves my brother but she doesn’t want to  be alone and he’s there, and she’s wondering   if that’s actually what love is. And I think  that is such a small line that I think a lot of   people might discount in the grand scheme of the  plot here, but I think that line is everything. Courtney: I think that is one of the main themes  of this entire show. That and the final line of   the episode we’ll get there in a moment. Like,  those are my two main pieces of evidence that   I am putting forward that this is queerplatonic  brilliance. So we do also have in this episode,   Patty is reading a book called My Brilliant  Friend, and it’s something that a client of   hers gives hers as, “I think you’ll really  like this.” And that is a very well-esteemed   Italian novel about a very deep, important female  friendship. And in fact – from what I understand   of it – the narrator of the book, who’s writing  this, begins to write the story of My Brilliant   Friend after her friend has vanished inexplicably.  So there are definitely some–Like, they chose that   book for a reason. And it all sort of builds  up to the fact that, like, despite marriages,   or boyfriends, or girlfriends, or fiancés, or  lovers, or affair partners, whatever is going on   here, like, that is the relationship. That is the  relationship of this show is Allison and Patty. Courtney: And Allison learns that Kevin now has  a new girlfriend, and finds out who she is and   where she works. So she just shows up to have  a conversation with that new girl. And we don’t   get to see that conversation. We get to see the  shock on that woman’s face when her boyfriend’s   dead wife shows up at her place of work. We get to  see her be like, “I thought you were dead.” But we   don’t get to see what the actual conversation  is. And I actually kind of like that because I   can imagine what that conversation was. And so  next we see Kevin still in full sitcom mode,   but everyone else around him is gone. His dad has  left, Neil is gone, he is alone in his kitchen and   he’s talking to himself still with a laugh track  going, and he’s like, “I am just going to keep   talking, because if I don’t keep talking there  will just be dead silence and I will be alone.   So I’m just going to say silly words.” And he  starts spouting off words he thinks sounds cool. Royce: Yeah, his exact line  is, “It’s a little too quiet,   so quiet that if I stop talking it’ll be  complete silence, which I cannot handle.” Courtney: Yeah, “Which I cannot handle.” And his  girlfriend pops in and he’s like, “Oh my gosh,   am I happy to see you!” And she’s like, “Really?  Because last time I showed up unannounced you   accused me of being too clingy.” And he’s  like, “No, no, no, no, no. But good news,   you’re moving in with me!” [laughs] He’s like,  “Let’s move in.” She’s like, “Okay, isn’t that   a little fast?” And she, like, very clearly, like  nopes out of that situation. She’s like, “I gotta   go pick up some cigarettes.” And then he’s like,  “Oh, okay, good, see you in a few.” And then you   see him have a moment of realization dawn on him  and he’s like, “Wait, she doesn’t smoke.” And the   laugh track is going, of course. And so he walks  from the kitchen into the living room and you see   him lightly drop his facade when he goes into the  next room and he goes, “What is with everyone?” Courtney: But then Allison is there in the  living room waiting for him. And, oh my God!   And I had been saying for several episodes at  this point, while we were watching it live,   I was like, if and when we see Kevin’s facade  drop out of sitcom mode, it is going to be a lot. Courtney: I was waiting for this moment  and it did not disappoint. It was   so subtly chilling. And I think anyone who has  ever experienced a manipulative and emotionally   abusive relationship like this is going to  just feel it on another level. Because you   not only have the dialogue and the actual  situation transpiring, but the difference   between sitcom mode and drama mode, and the way  people break out of it is such a brilliantly   artistic way of showing what it can actually  be like. If you are with an abusive partner   who is so skilled at manipulating the narrative  and situations around them and other people,   how– You can know how horrible and toxic  it is, but everyone else around you would   not believe you, or they don’t believe you if  you try to speak about it, because that’s not   the narrative that they have been spun. So it’s  brilliant. It’s brilliant! It really really is. Courtney: And the laugh track is still there  and at first it’s still on Kevin’s side. And   this is another very subtle thing that I wanted  to watch through a second time to see when exactly   the shift happens. Because it doesn’t drop the  sitcom facade yet. But he’s like, “Oh, Allison!   Is so good to see you and you have great timing,  because I think maybe I just got dumped?” Like,   “Perfect timing. You can just– we can go back to  the way things were. I need someone to be able   to pay attention to me and clean up my messes and  humor me.” And someone I can control, essentially.   And she starts saying, you know, “Six months ago I  ran.” And then he’s just still joking. He’s like,   “Ran? I thought you were on a hike when you fell  off that mountain.” And the laugh track is still   going for him. But then, as he’s joking, she  just finally yells shut up and listen to me.   And then the track gets on her side, because then  the audience goes, “Oh…” They all have that, like,   oh, this is serious now. And from then on out  until it fully drops, they’re on Allison’s side. Courtney: So we see a progression in a very  interesting way where now she’s saying,   “You listen to me, I’m gonna say my piece.” And  she ends by saying, “I want a divorce.” And the   live studio audience – [laughs] allegedly – like,  they’re cheering for her now, they’re rooting for   her, and they’re like, “Ooh, yeah.” And he says,  “Oh, you don’t want to do that.” And she says,   “Of course I do.” And the audience cheers  her. But then it flips on a dime and it just   goes dark. And Kevin is a goofy looking dude,  like the way the actor plays this character in   sitcom mode. His eyes are, like, bugging out of  his face and his facial expressions are so big   and exaggerated that even those expressions,  like, drop and he gets more serious. And a   lot more subtle. And his voice lowers. And my  pulse was racing the first time this happened. Courtney: Because it was, like, so much scarier  than if he was just yelling at her or if he just   decided to throw something. Because now it’s  like we are seeing how terrifying this man is,   but I have no idea what he’s about  to do. And he just says, like, “Well,   you get all these silly ideas, like the  time you thought you wanted to buy a house,   or like the time you thought you wanted to go  back to school. You get all these silly ideas,   but eventually you come to your senses. So why  don’t we just skip this part where you think you   want to divorce me?” And it’s like– [groans]  it’s so effective, not only for the dialogue,   but just the incredible stylistic choices  of this show that really drive it home. Courtney: And he does end up getting real up in  her face. He does end up, like, hitting a dresser,   like a wall that’s like right behind her, and does  get very physically aggressive. But she ends up   standing her ground and walking out and saying,  “No, this is– this is done.” And she even says,   like, “Where is everybody? Everybody knows that  you are a terrible person.” I think she says   a goddamn cancer, “Everyone knows your goddamn  cancer.” Like, “Where’s Pete? Where’s your dad?   Where’s– where’s your best friend, Neil? Where’s  your new girlfriend?” Like, you are alone here. Courtney: And one of the last things he says to  her as she’s walking out of this house is like,   “You can’t leave me, because if you leave  me, I will ruin you. I will destroy your   life.” And he makes that an absolute threat and  we’ve seen every evidence that he means that,   and that he can, and that that is true. But  she leaves. And then we see him just grab a   bottle of liquor. He starts drinking right  from the bottle. He’s going on a rampage   and you see him picking up his phone and  trying to call everyone. He’s like, “Dad,   pick up your goddamn phone. Neil, where the  hell are you?” And calling his girlfriend,   he’s like, “Hey, whatever just happened,  that was weird, but let’s talk that out.” Courtney: And just like desperately trying to  get anyone and– anyone back into his you know   bubble of control. And as he’s doing this, he’s  drinking heavily. He’s collecting every bit of,   like, Allison’s belongings that are still  in the house and putting them in a giant,   like, trash bin. And he grabs her old passport and  lights it on fire and throws it into the garbage.   And this is why all of these subtle throwaway  lines about fire is so good! Because this is   the first time we actually see him lighting  a fire, and it’s when he is drunk and raging.   And when we see how miserable he is, and how  much he needs to control and manipulate people.   So if that in retrospect, all the other times  we’ve had a throwaway gag about a fire he lit,   it’s like he has been doing this this whole time.  This is the real Kevin. And this is how this is   all happening. And he drunk passes out on the  couch with this fire lit in this garbage can. Royce: Presumably with all the  smoke detectors battery-less still. Courtney: All the smoke detectors battery-less.  That’s why I’m saying they’re a master   of foreshadowing, because there are silly  throwaway one liner gags from episodes ago,   if not an entire season ago sometimes, that ends  up having these major ramifications later. Which   is also just so, like, that’s the style of  the sitcom, like we’re taking everything so   lightheartedly and as a joke. But if you actually  take a step back and you remove the laugh track   and you remove the exaggerated facial expressions  and the goofy humor, it’s actually terrible! So   much of it is actually terrible! And this is  such a brilliant way of illustrating that. Royce: I mean there’s even one point late  in the series that’s done in reverse,   where Allison gets in a car accident  and she’s like I swear there was a   stop sign there. And it’s not until a  fair amount of time, real world later,   where she finally gets home after being, like, in  the hospital and she opens up the front door and   there’s a stop sign sitting in her living  room. And she’s like, “Oh, goddamn it.” Courtney: Yes, like– Things like that happen so  often in every single episode in this show. And   so now he’s passed out. He doesn’t have batteries  in his smoke detector. He has now lit another   fire and he has nobody there to put out his fires  now. He has been abandoned by all of his enablers.   And so the house burns. And he burns with it! He  dies! And it was all his own doing. Allison didn’t   even have to kill him in the end. He literally  fucked himself! [breathy laughs] Roll credits!   But don’t. Because this show isn’t about Kevin.  This show is about Allison and Patty. So Patty   is – I don’t even know where she is at this time  – but she gets a call because she’s next door   neighbors with them. So she gets a call that’s  like, “Hey, your neighbor’s house is on fire.” Royce: As this is winding down. It shows  a couple of people, like Neil included,   walking by and looking at the ruins  of this house and just walking on. Courtney: Yeah. Well, Patty also confronted  Neil recently as well and basically told him,   like, “I can’t keep taking care of you. You are a  grown man, you need to learn how to take care of   yourself.” And she asks him to move out. She’s  like, “I want you to leave. I don’t think you   should live under my roof anymore.” And so he is  literally walking like with a duffle bag of his   things, trying to move out, and he just stops and  looks at this burning house and then just sort of,   like, shakes his head and keeps moving. Which is,  like, so telling. I like to think– Because Neil   definitely is not without his faults. He  was complicit in a lot of bad things. It’s   even alluded to a lot that he’s  like taken the fall for Kevin,   like directly taking the consequences or  the blame for things he’s done too in the   past. So like he is very much a victim  of Kevin, but he has also been, you know,   manipulating his sister, he has also contributed  to a lot of negativity in this bubble as well. Courtney: But the way it ends when he is  asked to leave and get his life together,   when Patty tells him to leave, he goes to Diane,  and that was when Diane said, “It’s not safe for   you to be here.” Because he shows up at her house,  and she’s like, “My husband is going to see you,   and that cannot happen.” He sort of says like,  “Leave him, let’s– let’s go off together and   let’s–” And he’s like, “I know I’m a mess right  now, and I know I’m drunk,” and I know all these   things. And he’s like, “But you can fix me.”  And Diane puts her foot down too and she’s   like, [emphatically] “That’s not my job.” She’s  like, “It’s not my job to do that for you.” So   Patty basically tells him to leave, Diane tells  him to leave. And the thing is he actually does.   He– He doesn’t push back on it too hard and he’s  definitely having a bad time, but he does pack   his duffel bag of things and he does leave. And  so I would like to think that, postscript, he is   redeemable and is able to get his life together  and find his own way and find his own happiness. Courtney: But Patty still has not spoken to  Allison yet. She has heard that Allison’s in   town and she’s looking for her, but now she  hears that Kevin’s house is burning down. And   earlier in the episode we see Tammy moving out  of Patty’s place. They’ve finally come to the   revelation that this relationship isn’t going  any further. And so Allison comes to Patty,   as Patty– Like the house is burnt black.  It’s got the caution tape sectioned off,   the fire is gone, but the house is unsalvageable.  Patty just sits on the doorstep of this burnt down   house and Allison shows up and sees her.  And they sit on the doorstep together. And   it’s such a beautiful moment, it’s so good!  And Allison says, for the very first time,   that she wants to stay in Worcester  and Patty looks over at her and says,   “Let’s die alone together.” And they smile and  they hold hands and they sit on this doorstep. Courtney: And if that is not one of the  most beautiful depictions of a queerplatonic   relationship that I have ever seen in media,  then I do not know what is. And I don’t even   think that I need the word queerplatonic to be  spoken, because of the fact that it’s not just a   will they/won’t they. It’s not as black and white  as is this a romantic relationship or not? Or is–   Are they going to become a couple, or are they  a couple? Is this gay or is this not? It is not   as black and white as that. Because the text,  throughout the entire story, the entire plot is   all about breaking societal conceptions of what a  good life is supposed to be, what partnership is   supposed to be, what marriage, what relationships  are supposed to look like. What actually makes   you happy and what are you supposed to do? Are  you supposed to have the suburban house with the   husband and the kids? The entire show is rejecting  all of that or reframing it and showing characters   who think they want that for their life, that  that is actually not what they want at all. Courtney: Allison did not actually want this  marriage with Kevin. She did not actually want   that house. She really didn’t even want to leave  Worcester, even though that was one of the biggest   things she’s been saying this whole time. What she  wanted was an emotionally fulfilling relationship,   and what she found was not in the guy she  was having an affair with. It was not with   her husband. It was with her next door  neighbor, who has now become definitely   a best friend. There’s nothing sexual about  this relationship, and we know that because   the two of them have sexual relationships  with other people at various points. Courtney: And so I would argue that not only  is this a subversion of the sitcom genre,   it’s a subversion of what life partnership can  look like, what fulfilling life partnership   could look like. Because, even using the word  ‘alone’, that has been the concern. Diane has   been concerned about being alone. Allison’s been  concerned about being alone. Patty kind of has her   revelation when she hears, like, is not wanting  to be alone kind of the same as loving someone,   sometimes? Like, is there really much of a  difference when you get right down to it? Courtney: I think these two women,  throughout the two seasons of the show,   have come to learn that the definition of ‘alone’  being not having a spouse or a romantic and sexual   partner is not the end of the world. That’s  not the worst thing that can possibly happen.   And it might not– You don’t need that type of  partnership if you have fulfilling relationships   in different ways. And yeah, I don’t know what  to tell you. I have seen some people make the   argument that this is romantic and they’re just  going to be a couple now and they’re just– they’re   just going to be gay. And it’s like it’s not that  simple! This is– Look as someone who has been in a   queerplatonic relationship, this is what it feels  like. Especially if you don’t have that language. Royce: There is a point earlier in the season  where Tammy specifically asks Patty what her   relationship with Allison is like, and Patty  kind of pauses and isn’t sure how to answer   it. Like she says, like, an abrupt no to, like,  being attracted to her or something like that– Courtney: “Is she someone I  have to be concerned about?” Royce: Or being involved. But when I feel like  there’s a slightly more pointed question there,   and Patty just has to like, pause  and isn’t sure how to describe it. Courtney: Yeah. Royce: What the words are. Courtney: Like I don’t– I don’t really have the  language for this, but she did at one point say,   “She’s my favorite person.” That was a  line that Patty said at one point. So we   know Allison is her favorite person.  They use the word let’s die alone,   which in the context of this show, it’s been made  very clear that that means like without a spouse. Royce: That means being single, yeah. Courtney: That means being single. And they’re  saying let’s be single [emphatically] together.   But they’re also like– they’re in their  early to mid thirties. I think Allison’s   35 and Patty’s like 33 or something. And  to now imply like let’s die alone together,   they’re like, “We are going to be  what we are for the rest of our   lives.” And they’ve got quite a bit  of life ahead of them, presumably. Courtney: So this is the kind of thing that I  actually crave from genuine ace rep, where we know   that a character is ace or a character is aro or  both, because it’s not just being aspec in label,   in word, it is subverting amatonormativity,  and it’s reframing what relationships are.   It’s reframing what family is and what it can look  like and what it can mean. And it’s just good TV!   And it uses clever means of  storytelling that I haven’t   seen done in this way before. So I  have nothing but good things to say. Courtney: If you haven’t seen it yet – and yet  decided that you wanted to get spoiled on pretty   much all of it – I would still recommend watching  it because so many of the little tiny things,   the one liners, the foreshadowing,  the brilliant way that they portray   relationships of all kinds – toxic and positive,  romantic and sexual, or only one or the other,   or neither – is brilliant. I think it’s absolutely  brilliant. So I do still think it’s worth a watch,   even if you know how it ends. Maybe even better  if you know how it ends because, like I said,   the smoke detector thing was something I picked  up on the second watch through. You didn’t even   pick up on that yet until I brought it up, but  there’s so much more. I’m sure if I watched it   through a third time I would pick up on new things  too, which is something I found very nice also– To   bring back to Bojack Horseman again, every time I  watch that show I learn– I pick up on new things. Royce: That is an incredibly dense show. Courtney: And incredibly clever.  Things that seem innocuous in the   moment actually tend to have a very  important reason for being there.   So that’s definitely– that’s a show we’ve  wanted to talk about for a while, but I think   we’ve probably got a couple other examples of not  necessarily aspec rep, at least not in vocabulary   but definitely in feeling and in spirit, that  we might get around and talk about some other   things along these lines. Because they are out  there. But on that note, thank you all so much,   as per usual, for being here. Make sure  to subscribe to The Ace Couple on whatever   platform it is that you enjoy your podcast on,  and we will talk to you all next time. Goodbye.