Alice Yeh | Wharton to Google to Coach: How I Finally Found My Career Clarity | Implementors #23

hi I'm Ted wolf presented by guide wise welcome to the implementers podcast where we connect you to the stories and insights of people who have mastered implementation why because ideas are easy but implementation is hard join us as we uncover the secrets of successful implementation so you can conquer your implementation [Music] struggles welcome to the implementers podcast presented by guide wise where we focus on the topics of implementation because ideas are easy but implementation is hard today my guest is Alice yay I'd like to welcome you to the to the podcast Alice thanks Ted I'm excited to be here Alice your background is pretty uh Star Struck in many ways you went to some pretty prestigious colleges you've had great experience working with big companies but all of a sudden you kind of felt stuck so let's talk a little bit if can bring us up to date what's your journey and your career like since you were a career coach what's your experience been and how did you get to where you are now yeah um like you said I'm I'm a bit of a overachiever um so after graduating from undergrad I started my career out on Wall Street and I was there for a couple years I got to work internationally I worked uh I spent a year in New York a year l u sorry a year in New York a year in Hong Kong and three years in London um but through that journey of climbing the corporate ladder I still felt like something was missing so most people say you go to business school to reset your career so I did that followed that um advice went to business school and after graduate from there I came out here to San Francisco where I worked for Google so started at Big Tech um and I was there for four years and after the objects iner more off I I felt like something was still missing with from my career um and while I was at Google I no matter how hard I worked how hard I tried I spent um I worked overtime worked on weekends sometimes checking in on on holidays the you know what what people do when you want to be the best and and do your best and no matter how hard I worked and tried I couldn't get promoted and I actually ended up getting laid off uh after working there for four years um and I was very burnt out and I decided I wanted to take a year off to really find myself and figure out what made sense for me in terms of next steps for my career and after that year off I traveled I focused on some personal passion projects I um did things like started travel blog I did yoga teacher training um so things that really filled me with joy personally and and when I went back to work uh at corporate I started working at a couple startups um and through life and and changes in the market I went through two more layoffs um and through all of this experience it was always this feeling of trying to chase something where I felt like um purpose and meaning was a bit lacking from my career and I was always just following what people said of um you know what we hear from our parents our society where you work hard do as best as you can get a good grades go to a good school get good jobs and that's how you'll find success but even on paper even though I looked successful something was still F missing from my career and so um I actually decided to work with a coach where through the work with her I figured out that to me what purpose meant to me and where I felt meaning in my work and that to me personally was this idea of mentorship and and helping others and that was the role that I enjoyed the most throughout my entire career in terms of helping others and coaching them um throughout all of my career so coaching was something that I really liked and wanted to explore more of and the other thing that I found when I worked with a coach was that living here in San Francisco there's a lot of talk about starting your own company and and the startup mentality and so I always felt like I had to have this brand new Innovative idea that no one's ever thought of in order to start a company but working through the co with my with the coach at the time uh she pointed out that that's not necessarily true that's a false belief that I had and you don't it starting a company doesn't have to be a brand new idea um it's it's like what people say when you uh the the analogy she used was thinking about you starting you're opening your own restaurant there's lots of restaurants that's not a brand new idea but people still do it because they enjoy that idea of sharing food that they love with with people so that really opened my eyes and that's where I decided to become a career coach um because I I've always given advice to friends family co-workers um junior members of my teens around career and and helping them succeed and so so that led me to kind of where I am today and what's funny is that once I made that decision to start pursuing coaching as a um as a essential what idea originally as a side hustle um it a couple weeks later I got laid off so I took it as a sign from the universe to go all in on this journey and that's where I've been uh for the past year and a half okay so if I could summarize you had the ideal life in many respects and I I think the lesson to learn and correct me if I'm wrong the lesson to learn is don't buy into all the hype because if I can give a little more detail your undergraduate uh was from Princeton and your MBA was from warten yes two Marquee colleges you've worked for big big name companies so people can put on paper all these great attributes that they think will open doors for them but in a fact you still felt stuck which a lot of people do yes so you went through the Journey that helped clarify what you need to do and you call yourself a CL a coach a career coach that is really geared towards Clarity tell us a little bit more and enlarge that concept of clarity if you could yeah for sure I think um often times when people think of career coach they think of someone who helps them with their resume review interview and and things like that which is great and definitely needed for for some as for some people but I always felt like um what's missing is that that step you have to take before you start working on your resume and and take um you know practice interview interviewing um is the idea of where what career you actually want to have um what you said earlier is is exactly what happened with me we're we're told to go down down a certain path or we pick a job right out of college because that's based on what we studied and and you start going down this path and people feel like they have to stay on that path and they end up in a place where they're not happy they don't feel fulfilled they're unsatisfied with their career but they don't know where they want to go next and so my role as a career Cy coach is to help them figure out what makes sense for them in terms of where they want to go to make that career change and sure you can work on your resume and all that but if you don't know where you're going or you want to go that's really hard um and so I focus on that really that first initial step of helping essentially my clients find that Clarity so tell me a little bit about the process of finding that Clarity how do you actually help them go through that Journey yeah the there's really three main pillars I call it that I work with clients on and it's purpose alignment and mindset and so with purpose it's really figuring out what what connects them to the work they do what would help them feel like the work they do is Meaningful and gives them a purpose and that can be very esoteric and vague especially if you don't know how to think about that I struggled with that through all my changes and it wasn't until I started working with Coach till I really figure that out and and what I do with clients to help them figure that out is to really focus on what their strengths are so what are they good at what are they naturally good at what their interests and passions are um and what they where they feel like they have impact um where they have felt like they've made impact that felt really fulfilling um and it doesn't always necessarily have to be in your career sometimes that's through volunteer work or or other things they do outside of their career and figuring out the common themes across those three areas or the intersection of those three things is really how you can figure out what that that purpose looks like for for each person um and then from there we can start to think about okay is there a career out of that or what types of roles can offer that um and so that's that's the purpose piece the second area is alignment and this is where we think about our values and what's important to us so oftentimes when people are thinking about careers the very first thing naturally that people think about is obviously the salary how much will I get paid what is my title going to be and and that oftentimes there's other things that are as important in thinking about a career opportunity that often gets put on the back burner or the person doesn't think about how important um those areas could be so things like um the company culture are there growth opportunities within the culture what does the support look like um where what is work life balance or how does that play into your your overall life those are all areas that are also equally as important to think about and I think a lot of people often will focus on one of those I call them career core values one of those career core values and not really consider the others and so helping the client they helping them figure out what are their priorities um and that's based on their definition of success oftentimes the definition of success is tell told to us through Society or parents um and so each of us have a idea of what success means to them or it looks like to them and that can be different from what it looks like to society or or you know what your parents have told you so helping the clients kind of differentiate between what they really think is success for them and what's a priority for them in terms of what they want that career opportunity to look like and making sure that that's aligned with the opportunity whether the their current role or future roles that they're they're considering and then the last piece is around mindset and this is around the fears and self-doubts that people often have and one of the common things I hear especially from high Achievers like me where this idea of you've been on this path for so long um you've experienced a lot of success on paper and now this fear of starting over or the fear of the uncertainty um ultimately it comes down to a little bit of the fear of failure and through those fears that can really hold you back um and so by kind of giving into those fears the clients are hesitant to make changes so this last piece around mindset is really helping them identify what those fears are and what's what they're struggling with and find ways to overcome that so let's start unpacking these three items because there's an awful lot here to talk about how often do you have a client that you run through the process and they end up saying I never thought of these things so I think I value my present position in my career more so maybe I don't want to make the change how often does that happen uh it actually hasn't happened but I could see that potentially happening because they think that they want a change or they've been glamorizing you know other roles or or other opportunities but once they go through this process they might find that new ways to either appreciate their current role or um ways that they find that that it it is actually an alignment um so it is possible um but for the most part I haven't personally encountered clients like that okay purpose let's talk about that how does somebody actually find their purpose we talked to other people on the podcast and they say that the clouds don't separate the lightning comes down and all of a sudden you got your god-given purpose how do you help people find their purpose how do they know when they found it yeah it is definitely not uh an overnight thing as you just mentioned it it is a bit of a process um and the first part is really to look within to really understand yourself and I think a lot of people don't spend a lot of time really really thinking deeply about themselves thinking about what motivates them what drives them um and really understanding what what makes some tick um and so really having that self-awareness uh is really the first step um and the so in terms of figuring out purpose there's a framework that I like to use which is the ikigai framework it's a Japanese concept um it translates to a reason for being and so it's this idea of looking at four different areas I I talked about a little bit earlier so the first area is around your strengths so really considering and thinking about what you're good at what you're naturally good at and this could be these could be things that you hadn't thought about um in terms of what what you may be good at that others are not um so thinking about your strengths and the second area is around your your passions and your interest so what interests you what what keeps you in motivated and naturally just excited um you know what topics or what types of things what type of work keeps you excited and interested the third area is uh it's in the framework it's it's coined or termed as what the world needs and I always found that really hard to to to work on because the world needs a lot of things but where what is my specific role in that so the way I like to think about this specific area with my clients is thinking about what kind of impact do you want to have or have you had and when you think about it from that perspective it makes it a lot more uh more more accessible in terms of where you feel like you can have impact and versus you know just what the world needs and the last one is what you can be paid for and so um with that aspect it's it's often times that's that's where the the career piece can come in so not every passion is something that you can monetize um and not every you not every role is is necessarily a care a career that's possible so so taking that money aspect uh into consideration is is the last piece once we go through the purpose and the four areas then we start aligning our core values with that yes no different than what a business does and we say we have to find what our core values are that will make us successful that motivate us and keep us in a mindset if we will talk to me about how you keep people mindful of their core values and not forget about them yeah so I think one of the things I I like to walk with my clients through is actually uh before thinking about the future is really thinking about the past because your core values have always been with you from for as long as you can you know as you been in being um because they've really been driving your decisions and the core values are are are a little bit influenced and molded by what your parents have taught you what you've learned in school and and outside influences but there is still this element of what is personal to you and that's why they're called core values so so when I work with clients around their core values it's looking at Major decisions in their past to help them figure out okay why did they make that decision what was really driving them to make that decision what influenced them and oftentimes what when when working with clients what comes out is that there was always a few different ideas or or core values that was underlying all of the decisions that they made whether conscious or not and once you understand that that's one of your core values then when you think about decisions going forward it makes it a lot easier to to recall that aspect and when you're trading off um you know two opportunities to which both sound really good but one of them might align better to your core values so that's that's always how I like to present that to my clients and help them remember those things when they have big decisions or or questions about their paths is to think about okay how did you think about the decisions you made in the past and and why you made those decisions um and sometimes those decisions that you made in past maybe they're the you know looking back if you were to do it differently why would you do it differently and so that is can also be a learning as well and let's talk about mindset third area yeah Define mindset as you use it in your everyday life and with your clients yeah for me mindset is about really building that confidence and resilience um and so the confidence to do what you want to do and and make the decisions that feel right for you and resilience in that is as important when in times of setbacks and failures you are able to bounce back and recover from that so those are really the two things I really focus on when it comes to mindset is the confidence and resilience because nobody's perfect uh we will always encounter some sort of setback or failure and how you recover from that and how you learn from that is really what can help you move forward and then from the confidence aspect it's um it yeah that that just helps you believe in yourself and and and know that the decisions you're making or the things that you're doing are you're you're capable and able to would you agree then that purpose and your core values are investigation you're really trying to discover more about yourself self-awareness is the key mindset is where the work actually takes place though am I accurate in that yes definitely uh I know from my personal experience that's exactly what happened where um I yeah I I decided that coaching would fulfill my purpose um from like a meaningful work perspective and starting my own business aligned with a lot of my core values in terms of autonomy and freedom and and things um things along those aspects but the mindset piece is really the tough part in terms of okay now that I have thought about wanting to start my own business as a as a coach the take you know having that confidence to take action to to really take those steps to make to move forward on that and that's definitely been the hardest piece and I think that can be true for anyone where once even once you make a decision the hardest part is now to take action on that and so uh when it comes to careers oftentimes I hear a lot of people complaining about how they hate their job you know life sucks whatever but they're not willing to do anything about it and so having that mind set of okay I'm going to take control and take action that can often be the hardest step and how then do you work with them from a mindset standpoint to say here's how you overcome your fear of failure your fear of not being smart enough your fear of rejection how do you get into the mindset and how do you start working with them to address those areas yeah uh it's it's a little bit different for everyone but I would say often times it comes down to looking at past successes so um in times where if they're afraid to start over for example um it's it's not about starting over it's thinking about okay where where have you felt like you had to start over before how did you how did you move get through that what did you what steps did you take and so helping the clients see that they have encountered successes in those times of uncertainty really helps them build that confidence up where okay I've gone through it before I can do it again and this is no different from that past example um I'm sorry go ahead oh no I was goingon to say um and then the other aspect of uh the in addition to thinking about past uh successes is also now forcing yourself to to take risks um and so you know starting small with taking risk it doesn't have to always be this big scary thing um starting small with with risks and getting yourself comfortable with the uncertainty and that is the other aspect of really overcoming those those fears to um yeah to help overcome those fears is is working on those two areas you uh you have a a background where you were educated at Princeton and Wharton you worked with JP Morgan you worked with Google obviously statistics and metrics are not something that are new to you when you're working with an individual to help them process through purpose Define their core values and then finally work on the mindset and the mindset is where the change takes place change management how do you use metrics if you do in working and coaching with individuals to help them make that change uh that's a good question I hadn't thought about it that way but I guess in terms of metrics it's going back to that piece I talked about where you think about your past um experiences your past successes and while I don't necessarily you know make it specific numbers driven um you could think about it in that aspect for for people who are more more analytically driven like that um yeah I find myself that very often in talking with individuals they magnify one instance yes oh this happened and all of a sudden their entire mental mindset is overwhelmed with it so perhaps going back and being able to say well how many times has that happened and starting putting metrics around that can justify the need to change so going through the actual change management then how would you coach them and guide them through the actual work of doing the change changing Behavior yeah so um it's it's figuring out it's oftentimes that fear and and fear of making a changes because the change feels like it's such a big step and most people don't know how to take that big step and so they end up doing nothing um and that's that's generally what I've seen when it comes to career change they know they want to change their career but they don't know to what or or even what steps to take so they just stay in their current role because it's easier to be in the status quo so um when it comes to actually making a change is to is to really break it down um and break it down to more small achievable steps and things that are more more understandable of okay I can make some progress on this one step and once I've done that then you're just that one step closer to the ultimate change or or goal that you want and I think when you break it down to a to a smaller action plan then that's where things can feel a lot more achievable yeah you have a a saying that I saw on your website and other areas that I think is very attractive and that's normally alz setbacks yes what do you mean by that yeah so normalizing setbacks as I said earlier it's it's impossible to go through your entire life and not experience a setback or a failure um and what I think people often do is they that fear of failing or the fear of encountering failing or or coming across as a failure really holds them back from taking risks or taking the steps to to reach um their the specific goal that they want because they're afraid of failing and and and part of you know what I want to do with clients and you coming on podcasts like this is to spread the message that actually setbacks are necessary and failures are a part of success um in order to to learn from your experiences you do need to experience these setbacks and failures because that's how you grow that's how you learn from your mistakes essentially and and gain experience and and for every I'm sure every successful person that's out there they have definitely experienced their own share of setbacks and failures but that's often not talked about as much as as it should be and how often in your experience working for very well-known organizations or even smaller non big name organizations but in your own experience how often have you found people that felt the same as you they felt stuck they didn't know where to go they didn't know what to do but they just said I'm going to lead a life of quote unquote quiet desperation because the money's good I got some Safety and Security here and I'm just going to grind my way through it how often have you found people that felt exactly that way but they didn't do anything uh a lot more than you would than you think um I would say current my current life stage and and mid career I would say and this is the people that I generally work with the most is because they have experienced success up until this point but now they're like they feel stuck but this fear of taking steps or the fear of failure keeps them essentially makes them settle they settle for this they settle for mediocrity as I I often say um and so they they play it safe because they're afraid to take those steps to make changes and so I would say almost everyone around you know this mid-career stage of their life is in this not not everyone but most people I would say are in that state of I'm just I've been here for so long I don't know what to do next but because I don't know what to do next I'm just gonna stick you know stick with it so so you separated yourself from the normal her I'll say mentality what regrets do you have about about the choice you did make and you went out on your own and you're looking at your current life right now do you have regrets what regrets might you have about making the change um I don't think I have any regrets per se I think I have definitely struggles um that I hadn't anticipated uh for me as as an entrepreneur I I underestimated how much of a grind it can be when it comes to as a solopreneur all the work is on you um and so I I am luckily a very disciplined person so I I know that I have to take do take the action and and take steps every day because I am the only one who can um but I I definitely underestimated that um and the mindset piece is is still struggle um there are days where I feel like I'm not going anywhere and did I make the right choice but when I go back to my why of you know this is where I feel like I can really impact people and and really feel like I'm making a difference and helping people you know live better lives and that really makes me feel we rewarded and fulfilled and so I just have to think back to that and and that helps me keep going um so I would say the the mindset is is often a struggle as as an entrepreneur and I've heard from others that it's It's Not Unusual I think that the experience that you just described is the typical normal experience of the entrepreneur and that's part of the weeding out process who has the passion and who has the gumption to be able to stick in and take all of the failures all the Nos and all the uncertainty really that there is present and that goes back to your mindset so what keeps your passion flowing you can say my purpose helping people tell me a little more detail what keeps that passion flowing in in days and nights of Doubt which if you don't have that you're not a real entrepreneur in my opinion yes um yeah for me it comes down to I I feel like I'm more most energized after client calls because I can see the work impacting the clients that I work with I can see the changes that they're thinking about the the AHA moments that they get in the calls and and that feels really rewarding and so that keeps me going in one aspect and then the other aspect is um kind of going back to the the values alignment and thinking about now I you I can set my own schedule I have the flexibility and the freedom to work when I want uh I don't have to work the standard Monday to Friday 9 to five sometimes I take a random Monday off but sometimes I'll work on a Saturday so having that freedom is very fre is um liberating and and I I do think about the in order to keep going during those times of struggle I I do go back to thinking about okay what do I have now that I didn't have before one of the things I don't have now which is which is amazing is I don't have to work for a manager that I disagree with or or a Senior Management whose Vision I don't believe in or or deal with politics in the office and bureaucracy so those are all things I'm grateful to not have to think about and then there's the flip side of well now I have to do everything myself well I think there are tradeoffs that are well worth taking and particularly if you have the passion for it and the purpose that for the for the freedom that you find valuable and the Integrity I'll say of living by your values so what lies in the future for yourself Alice yeah so I yeah my my role is um now I'm constantly looking for always looking for more clients to to help them um I am going on different podcasts like this to help spread my message of normalizing setbacks um sharing my story my my experiences and and if that resonates or or helps someone to to move from that state of being stuck and not knowing what to do next to okay let me think about you know making a change and actually taking action to do that and I'm I'm happy for that and great if they want to work with me or if they want to work with someone else uh as long as you know more people are finding that passion and and fulfillment in their careers rather than just feeling stuck and and unhappy is is motivating for me okay and Alice's house what's the best way to contact you yeah so my website is Alice coaching.com and people can if you know if anything resonates with them they can learn more about me the work I do um and you can also find me on social media I'm on LinkedIn as Alice y uh or Instagram at hey Alice and those are different ways to contact me um and oh yes I just go ahead I'm sorry oh yeah no worries I was just going to say um going back to the the whole values um considering what values you have and what's a priority for your career I do actually have a free resource for listeners if they're interested in essentially doing like a a gut health check on their career I call it a career checkup guide and that essentially walks you through different areas uh or factors to consider for your career things like compensation uh growth opportunities culture um and really help people take essentially do a pulse check on where they are in their career as well as what is a priority for them and is are they aligned um and that's it can be like a first step in terms of to making you know bringing that self-awareness into inate and understanding what their values and priorities are and and seeing how that matches up with their current roles and they get the evaluation guide book they'd go to your website and that's Alice y.com correct yes that's right and I was going to say actually for you can find it on my website as uh definitely and I actually did create a a bitly link so it's bit. Le implementers career check and that's another way to download the guide as well very good okay Alice thank you very much for your time today it's very informative you have a very interesting background and I think you have a lot of credibility as far as being able to bring Clarity to a person's career and their life so thank you very much for your time certainly enjoy talking with you and look future look forward to Future contacts thank you so much for having me Dad I really enjoyed being here thank [Music] you hi Ted wolf here I want to thank you for joining us for this implementers video the implementers podcast is presented by guide wise where we along with our vetted member Community recognize that ideas are easy but implementation is hard to learn more about getting things done with guide wise please visit us at guide wise. and to conquer your implementation struggles please like and share this video And subscribe to our Channel happy implementing