Another Investigation at Michigan? | Kalen King and Cade Stover Join | Duke vs Florida State Preview

Intro: Michigan Investigation [Music] welcome to Andy Staples on three huge weekend ahead huge game in the Big 10 and we're hitting it from both sides we got kayn King the best cornerback at Penn State one of the best quarterbacks in the country the guy who will be responsible primarily for covering Marvin Harrison Jr on Saturday we got him we got Ohio State tight end Cade Stover one of the most interesting people in college football and a very important player in this game we got him too but before we get to that Titanic matchup in the Big 10 we need to go elsewhere in the Big 10 the other member of the trium the group that is competing for a college football playoff birth or two because two of them got it last year Michigan under investigation by the NCAA again this has nothing to do with the recruiting case that Jim Harbaugh got suspended for earlier in the season this is a completely different case this is an accusation of stealing signals and it's an interesting deal because you can see the signals coming in on the field if you can decipher them that's fine it's do you do anything more advanced do you do anything electronically do you Scout Games before opponents before you play them with in-person people those are things you can't do and we don't exactly know what Michigan's accused of but we do know that the NCAA is investigating it so we we'll find out what happened with the sign stealing and and whether Michigan did it or not or what exactly was done but I think it's interesting because this particular accusation brings up a couple of issues with the governance of college football with the way the NCAA works with the way rules are handled with the way rules are implemented or or not implemented I broke that down right after the news broke I got a little little heated because it's it it brings in a pet issue that I've had for several years you'll know when I hit it yet another NCAA investigation involving Michigan but this one a little more on field the Big 10 received notification from the NCAA on Wednesday that the NCAA is investigating Michigan for accusations of signal stealing now this is very interesting because this is not the same investigation that Jim Harbaugh was suspended for three games for earlier this is something completely different and this is more of an onfield thing that there's a little more of a time element to and that makes it a problem there are two problems here actually and we we'll get into both of them one of them has a long complicated solution and one of them has a very simple solution that can be instituted by the start of next season so we'll start with the longer more complicated solution and that is that the NCAA is investigating a competitive Equity issue that could potentially move move the Line in games now now according to the the Big 10 and a statement they released on Wednesday after Ross delinger and Dan Wetzel of Yahoo broke this news they've notified Michigan State which is Michigan's opponent this weekend of what's going on they've notified future Michigan opponents of what's going on and that's great but we all know how long NCAA investigations take and if this one takes as long as most of them do there's 's no resolution this season there's no resolution for a long long time so I don't know that that actually helps anybody in this case because again this is one of those things that can move lines this is something probably if it were possible that should be handled at the conference level but conferences are not equipped to do this remember the SEC used to have its own investigator but they don't do that anymore the conference has let the NCAA handle investigation so the long complicated solution to this is the NCAA does not need to be running Big Time college football we' we've known that for a while but that's especially true in situations like this where there needs to be a central governing body for this not necessarily the conferences themselves because in this situation what if some of the opponents are non-conference opponents that their conference are want to know about it too want to do something about it but they're going to want to do something quickly again because this is a competitive Equity thing it affects the line and especially given all the issues since Sports books have become legal in in Most states this is something that everybody's going to want to deal with and deal with quickly so this is where if you wanted the conferences that run the FBS or that make up the FBS and run the college football playoff if if you wanted them to band together and form their own governing body for major college football that would be a good reason to do it because they might be able to come up with a better set of rules and a better set of processes that would allow them to handle things like this in an expedient fashion the NCAA is not set up to do that they're just not and this issue it seems small and it's it science stealing is a weird one for me because you're giving these signals in a stadium full of thousands of people so lots of people can see you you're also on television in front of millions of of people but you notice a lot of teams when they signal to their offenses and their defenses they'll put some sort of boards up behind the coaches that are doing the signaling to block it from the the fans behind them to block it from the TV cameras so the the issue is not what you can get from just watching if you watch it with your eyes and you decipher it that's perfectly legal if you happen to see it on a TV copy and you can decipher it that's perfectly legal it's do you send some to film the people doing the science that would that would cross the line so that's that's the issue we're talking about that but we don't know what Michigan did if Michigan's guilty you got to be innocent to Pro proven guilty here the thing is the case is probably going to drag on long past this season so you got that issue and the solution to that is complicated you know deciding who governs college football is a big big big picture issue not something that you can decide this off season however there is something you can do this off season to fix this particular problem now and it's something that college football should have done decades ago put the freaking radio in the freaking helmet the NFL has had oneway communication between the sideline and a player on the field since 1994 since we were using fax machines since only rich people had cell phones that's when they started doing that that's how long ago an offensive coordinator or a defensive coordinator could call a play in and the player on the field could get it and relay it to the teammates that's how long it's not a financial issue anymore in college football everybody's got enough money now I've been told that the biggest issue is getting the helmets certified once you have modified them you you're a multi-billion dollar industry figure that out that's not that's not a prohibitive issue figure it out the other piece of your a multi-billion dollar industry is we don't need to see five gas in five different color polo shirts signaling and then we don't need big boards on the back of the the behind the coaches that are blocking the view of the fans with the most expensive seats by the way we don't need those that's stupid it makes you look amateurish and I realize you claim to be an amateur sport but you're not you're a multi-billion dollar industry put the radios in the helmets and then nobody can steal the signs yes well you still have to have signs to to alert a player maybe a cornerback near the sideline what's going on yeah we talked to Marcus Freeman from Notre Dame about that where he he's adding a sign to have a player commit a penalty on purpose to stop the clock if they only have 10 men on the field that's the solution because what happened in the Ohio State game but we don't need the play going in every time in the complicated fashion that is evolved into in college football we don't need that put the radio in the helmet you won't have to worry about how long it takes to investigate this because there will be no investigation to be done because nobody will be able to steal it because it will go to the quarterback with the Green Dot on the back of his helmet or to the linebacker with the Green Dot on the back of his helmet stop making everything so hard whatever happens with Michigan will happen this is just throw that on the pile with the other investigation involving the recruiting stuff but the solution here to make sure you don't have to deal with this again you could form an entirely new governing body and you probably should but you don't have to do that now but what you can do is by 2024 when you're making all these other changes to the sport when a bunch of new teams are entering the Big 10 and new teams are rering the SEC and you're expanding the playoff have another new thing a radio in the helmet it's 30-year-old technology at that point it'll work I promise you can do it it please do it just a crazy crazy story Michigan in the news again another piece of that story the Athletics Brendan Quinn reported that Michigan State initially mentioned that it might not want to play the Michigan game this week out of fear for the health and safety of the players now I'm really hoping that nobody was actually serious about that because Michigan State hasn't been great at PR this looks terrible if if that happens it looks like you're scared to play the game don't you're more than a three touchdown Underdog anyway like nobody would care if you lose the game and they would care a lot if you didn't play over this so hopefully that was just a very hypothetical thing that was brought up and not something serious but go play the game we'll see what happens Michigan will probably win by a lot that's that's how it goes before we get deep into the Penn State Ohio State game let me tell you about prize picks the most fun daily fantasy you can play it in a bunch of States including Florida Texas and California you download that prize picks app use the referral code Andy they will match your first deposit up to a 100 bucks so I won last week on a play involving three sets of quarterbacks I had it I I I like these com combined pass rush receiving TD plays that they have the squares they have which they start to populate on Friday and into Saturday morning so you can take a look at those but it it's fun because if you got a QB who's kind of a dual threat like Jaden Daniels from LSU it accounts for his rushing TDS Jordan Travis was one I had from Florida State he ran for a couple and and that helped me so I'm looking at some of the early squares that they've already put out and there's some fun here first of all that Penn State Ohio State game kin King will be trying to keep Marvin Harrison in the less than column on this one the number they put up for him 85 a half yards so they they are respecting Penn State's defense here uh Keandre Lambert Smith for Penn State 51 and a half yards Theo Johnson 19 and a half Tyler Warren 19 and a half so they are expecting a defensive struggle another another place in the Big 10 where they're expecting a defensive struggle we had some fun on our pick show with Iowa and Minnesota I have not seen a quarterback passing number that was less than a hundred until now Deacon Hill the Iowa starting quarterback who said the pass game is gon to click any minute now 99 and a half you go on more than or less than on that aan cak monis the the quarterback of not much different 116 and a half that is going to be a slog everybody that's what they're expecting but interestingly enough it feels like that's what they're expecting in Alabama Tennessee as well and we've talked about that we've talked about how Alabama struggled to protect Jaylen milro Joe Milton has struggled at times this year all you need to do is look at the receiver projections in this game and you're thinking Okay this may be be a lowc scoring Affair Germaine Burton Alabama's top deep threat and remember Jayla moo throws a beautiful deep ball 59 and a half receiving yards you going more than or less than on that Isaiah Bond 39 and a half you go over to Tennessee RL Keaton at 38 and a half and squirrel white at 48 and a half those are not numbers that you see when you're expecting a massive massive game you're you're expecting a defensive struggle in that game back over on the Ohio State Penn State Side Kyle McCord's number 233 and a half that is again respect to Penn State's defense right there if he's less than that I think Penn State's winning that game Dylan Gabriel Back In Action by the way for Oklahoma they they were off last week after beating Texas they're playing UCF 306 and a half against his former team you going more than or less than and remember with Dylan Gabriel especially this year you have to account for him running the ball one other thing to account for if you're playing prize picks in the next few days the NBA season is starting and prize picks is celebrating by giving you a Steph Curry Square so if Steph Curry scores a point in the Warrior season opener you win that square so you might you combine that square with at least one more up to five you're going to win that one if he scores a point so good luck to that one it's it's available through October 24th so sign up for prize picks today use the referral code Andy they will match your first deposit up to a 100 bucks so you deposit a 100 they deposit a 100 give it a shot there's so many options and again they're just giving you Steph Curry right there all right it is now time to talk about the biggest game of the week Penn State's CB Kalen King Joins one of the biggest games of the year Penn State heads to Columbus to play Ohio state is Penn State a legitimate college football playoff Contender are they a national title Contender are they a big 10 Championship Contender all of these things are kind of the same thing and the only way to prove you are is to beat Ohio State or Michigan or both they got Ohio State in Columbus kin King draws one of the toughest assignments he's the number one corner for Penn State he's personally offended when quarterbacks throw to his side he's got some great receivers to try to cover Marvin Harrison junor eka abuka he's played him before now he's got to play him with a lot of eyes on him millions of us watching plus all those NFL scouts because Marvin Harrison Jr is a first round draft pick probably a top five draft pick kin King plays well against him he's probably a first- round draft pick too here is kin King we are joined Now by kayin King who's one of the toughest jobs in America this week you got to cover Marvin Harrison Jr and AA abuka how exciting Is that ah it's very exciting you know any any opportunity for me to guard players like that talent that you know with that much skill it's always it's always like like exciting for me because like you know I can test my skills and you know I can just compete with the best in college football so like I never have a problem competing with the best because I consider myself one of the best as well so well and that's the thing you are considered one of the best corners in America like when you saw people in the off season was it this game they were always asking you about yeah definitely I I definitely got a lot of questions about this game a lot of you know questions a lot of people asking me things about people so yeah definitely how much fun is it when you're playing because you played Marvin last year you had to you had to guard him several times how much fun is it playing somebody of that level man it's always fun because like you know just just having an opportunity to go against just really just having an opportunity to play this game that I love every day is it's just amazing but like once once it's like once I get to go against somebody of that type of caliber of of like guys like Ohio State receivers you know they always had a history of really good receivers so that's always a big game for me and just for the team is personally so yeah definitely the the mentality of a good quarterback is always amazing to me because you guys have to be so self-confident like you have to believe that you are the best player on the field no matter what how do you how do you make yourself even even when you have a moment of Doubt make yourself believe that I mean really with being a cornerback man I feel like you have to have a a short mentality One play mentality because like being a corner in my position is the hardest position in football and because we have the guard the opposing team's best athlete backwards so you know just that alone takes a lot but then once you add you know once you add you know getting beat once or twice you know you just got to keep a a oneplay mentality to where that you don't let that Trickle and effect and just keep carrying over throughout the game because one play can really mess you up but the more you learn to you know forget about that play worry about the next one and I feel like it becomes easier to develop that mentality that is a great description though like you have to cover a complete athletic Freakazoid almost every week except you have to run backwards and he gets to run forward yeah so I I saw that you you you I heard you talking about talking to yourself in another interview where you have these affirmations that you'll tell yourself on the field is that is that kind of in your head or do you actually say them out loud when you're in practice in the games no I see them I see him out loud but like only only really I can hear it so like okay it's it's something that I definitely say out loud but like no nobody else can hear it because it's usually happening right before the snap or either after a snap or you know like leading right and leading up to a snap so only only I can really hear it because I know I'm saying it what are you telling yourself a lot of things like I tell myself like for example I tell myself like you're the best in the country you're the best in the country you're the best in the country or or say it's like um third down or something and we need to we need to stop right here it's a big down I usually say like it's money time it's money time get off the field get off the field just just repeating things to myself just so I know like the more I hear it and the more I hear myself say certain things then the more I like start to believe it so and obviously you're known for your coverage skills but I I was rewatching the Ohio State game from last year there's a play where you just fire in there and they they throw a little you know they throw it to a Mecca real short you Dart between two guys who are trying to block you and just drill him like how much pride do you take in your tackling a lot man like me personally the way I grew up and like the way I was brought up with football I I try to be like as as complete as possible like I try not to be good at one thing and then not good at I try to like make my game as complete as possible because like me growing up in Detroit man it's a very tough area so like I feel like I have that natural like competitive toughness off like just for me being where I'm from how much of that competitiveness and comes from having a brother who wound up being a 240 pound linebacker with you at Penn State well I feel like a lot a lot comes from that because like growing up Kobe was like the my first competitor like I I competed with him in everything like like when we first started working out when I first started playing football my dad used to take me and Kobe to the field and it was on and I always had to go against him so he was always much bigger than me much stronger than me so like I had to I definitely had to bring it every time since a little kid so I feel like just having him uh on this journey with me and and just us doing this thing together man it's like it's paying off and I definitely uh credit a lot of that competitive nature to Kobe because it was a lot of times where I was losing and I was getting mad because I could I just do nothing with him well those those I mean when you're young like that are you just having your dad throw it up there and playing Moss yeah like so we first started out I was probably like I was six years old we was like five six and he used to take us to the field and he used to throw the ball super high in the air and and the first one to catch it like and and and we end up probably going for like a month straight until somebody finally caught the first one and that was me I caught the first pass so I was hyped right there he was was hype and he always used to throw like so high in the air used to hurt my chest when I when I tried to catch it and all that so yeah would Kobe because Kobe was bigger would he just try to throw you out of the way yep he try he throw me out of the way like so when I first started playing football and we first got our equipment Kobe was actually the first person I ever tackled so like I was tackling Kobe as soon as I got my equipment to start playing football so and he was always kind of linebacker size right he was always way bigger than everybody our age that incredible yeah and so when when you get recruited the idea was to go the same place but but I I did hear you in an interview say that he almost went to Wisconsin how'd you talk him into into coming with you well it it wasn't really me talking him into coming with me it was just more like we came to an agreement as like um like together because like um he he like Wisconsin a lot lot and you know he we went to a Wisconsin game I think it was my junior year and they played Michigan at Wisconsin and it it was it was lit they was playing to jump around the whole stadium was fil and Wisconsin ended up winning that game so man he he he was he fell in love with it ever since that moment and me personally I just felt like I can't be a Wisconsin not I a really like I a really I a really like the vibe I like I messed with the school they was a good team at the point at that time but I just couldn't see myself being there so you know we just we just took the process slowly he was ready to pull the plug like right after the visit but you want you wanted to visit everywhere else and yeah I wanted to keep wiing the options and then I guess um Wisconsin ended up getting like four linebacker commits in our class and then he was like yeah I'm not messing with them no more because he he felt like they wasn't treating him as a priority so you know we started to take more visits and take more um we started to go more places with each other and then had to talk with our family and each other and we just felt like pen state was the best place for both of us so you got an actual relative on the defense but it feels like you guys are are kind of a big family when like you and chop are close uh what's it like with chop Robinson and Adisa Isaac and you know Abdel can Rush a pass for two like how much does that help you as a corner oh my God it makes my job much easier because like just just me being out there knowing that I got guys who going to get after the football and I really only got to cover for like three seconds three four seconds and it it just gives me like a sense of comfort like when I know everybody around me is on the same type of you know um same type of like timing and path that I'm on it just it just only makes me feel more comfortable in what we can do so this is you know this is a good group but you you lose Joey Porter junr after last year when did you realize this particular 2023 Penn State Defense was po potentially special man the the spring in the springtime right after our bowl game so after the bowl game you know everybody dispersed got guys going to the NFL you know I was I was super attentive during that whole process because like you know I I wanted to soak as much information I could with Joey being heavily like um involved in all that stuff so when that time ended and Spring ball came around and we just started practicing and just just how we looked practice like we we looked like dominant like like it looked like a whole it it looked like the same defense but a little better and it was a whole different group like it was it was a lot of lot of younger guys stepping up a lot of guys who weren't really in in a in a fold last year stepping up and making plays so I was like yeah this this definitely like we we gota we got something with this defense so definitely Spring ball who are the guys that surprised you that that when they they stepped up you're like oh okay I wouldn't say surpr one thing I would say was a couple guys who took like a a major step from last year to this year is KJ Winston he's definitely one of those guys who he looks like a complete different player like whatever he did in the off season man he he was on it because like I always seen signs in it but like that that that whole this whole off season leading up to the spring and fall camp like he was just he was just different like he was on a different type of time and another guy is Cam Miller cam Miller is one of those guys who's very attentive he's very he's very assertive he's very he knows what he wants to do he and he's he's so focused like he probably he he's probably one of the most mature guys we have on our team and he's only a sophomore so that speaks a lot and another guy I would say is um uh kiah isard you know he he's a guy who isn't really talked about but you know he he's starting to you know get into his um get into his um body of work and then Kobe King like Kobe King didn't really he he played last year but he wasn't the starter and I feel like this this whole offseason from the spring to the fall leading up to now man he's just he's a whole different person like he he's took that step and he's he he's is showing on the field so so before I let you go I gotta ask you about your your talking on the field we've talked about talking to yourself we got to ask about talking to other people we had terion Arnold from Alabama on and he he took us deep inside the trash talk that goes between corners and receivers during a game like are you a talker or you feel like I don't need to say anything I'm G okay I'll just put like this I'm I'm usually not a talker you know I just get I just try to do my job every play but the only way I would talk is if somebody starts talking to me so if you if you start talking to me and I'm just keeping it cordial you know because I'm I'm just out there to do my job but once somebody start talking to me then I'll start talking and like once they escalated to that point then it's on like it's on from there all right you you hear that Marvin and AA if you if you want to have a chat you can you don't have to kayn King thank you so much I appreciate it thank you for having me sir thank you to kayn King and I if I'm an Ohio State receiver I don't know if I'm gonna talk any Trash to that dude that dude will hit you so we will see what happens but one guy who I don't think would be afraid to talk to Kin King though probably he's going to be matched up more often on a safety Kade Stover the tight end for Ohio State he has had an incredible journey of a college football career in terms of position but also he's just one of the most interesting dudes playing the game right now grew up on a farm works on the farm any chance he gets has a dream of going and expanding the Family Farm using whatever he makes in the NFL and he's going to play in the NFL to expand the Family Farm raise more cattle grow more corn incredibly interesting dude and you come away from this going man that dude would be the best teammate ever here's Kade Stover we are joined Now by Ohio State Ohio State's TE Cade Stover Joins tight end Kade Stover Bucky playing Penn State this weekend Kate is is the energy around the Woody a little different in in weeks like this yeah I mean we try and keep it similar but uh it's hard not to be especially when you know what's all right on this game do do you have to tell yourself hey we got to treat it like every other game or is that something the coaches are doing or is that you're telling the younger players that no I mean we're definitely we're definitely ramped up around here more than normal uh there's no doubt about that so uh we're just trying to take it day by day right now and make sure we're ready to play on Saturday so I I was talking to to the Jim naggie the director of the Senior Bowl about you yesterday and he said that that you've gotten even better this year and and and really expanded your game and and look even better what has changed for you from from last year to this year in terms of just what you what you bring to the offense uh I think it started with offseason wise as far as um I mean changing your body a little bit uh we lost close to nine pounds in an offseason U me and Coach Mick and strength staff will help me with that and then kind of just established try to focus in on weak points uh being consistent throughout the game and just making sure you know uh just mentally wise what's going on more when when you decide hey I want to change my body do do you just go to Coach Mora and just say hey here's here's what I want to look like or or do you say what should I look like for for the position I play that that was him uh that was his doing he said that would be beneficial to me and uh so far it seems to be true and uh we look forward to keep building on that well let's talk about your position because it it it's changed quite a bit over the years you you know you you you played both both sides of the ball in high school you know you get to Ohio State as a linebacker you move to defensive end you move to tight end you move back to linebacker and then back to tight end was that just a case of hey I'm gonna figure out how to get on the field as quickly as possible oh yeah I mean I just wanted to I want to play uh you want to contribute you want to make sure that um you have a purpose here and I was looking for any reason to have a purpose and my heart was always on defense until I started playing tight end more and then I figured out that this is where I belong is was that for you know in terms of a future in the NFL where you belong or or do you just actually like it better uh now I do I can say I like it playing tight end better yes a year ago two years ago I couldn't tell you that uh but yeah I think longevity wise and uh just what's going to help this team more as me playing tight end we'll be right back with CAD Stover the tight end from oh Ohio State but first I want to talk to you about game time do you want to go to that Penn State Ohio State game I know it's been sold out for months everybody wants to go to that game but you can get tickets right now on game time you download the game time app redeem the code Staples you get $20 off your first purchase and you can get tickets to pretty much anything sporting events comedy shows concerts you name it game time has it and you can even buy it at the last minute as stressfree as humanly possible you're clicking through the app you say I want to look at Ohio State football okay Ohio State football let's let's go to the Penn State game here are the seats that are available you click on the one you want you can look at the seat that you would have you get the vantage point there in the stadium and you can say okay I like that seat with a couple more Taps it is yours and by the way on game day you need to transfer it to a friend via text message not a problem with game time it is so easy it takes all the stress at a last minute ticket buying you don't have to worry about walking up to that guy who's holding three tickets and not sure if they're real you're not sure what's going on with them game time takes the stress away so download the game time app use the code Staples $20 off your first purchase I I saw a quote from your your old position coach Kevin Wilson When so you you moved to linebacker after the 2021 season played linebacker in the Rose B came back to tight end that spring but I remember Kevin said in the in the between time he said I you know I went to Kade and I said don't give me this crap about what's best for the team I want to know what's best for you how did you handle that and and then how did you make the decision uh that's exactly how it went down too uh uh to be honest with you I have no clue uh if you know coach Wilson you know he keeps it pretty honest and pretty straightforward so uh I kind of came to him I was like hey I always felt like on offense I kind of had handcuffs on me um was never really free to go and play how I wanted to play the game and I told him I said if if you want me to come back over here like I mean we got to work together here a little bit better and make sure that there's not too much thinking involved and I could just go and play like a would on defense off play linebacker and that's what he did for me and it feels like the way the tight end positions evolved everybody wants to be Travis Kelce or groon but you have to be willing to block like those guys are willing to block it feels like you were already willing to block like that like that wasn't an issue because how you play on defense but how do you get yourself into the flow of the pass game uh that's really not up to me that's uh that's up to the scheme wise um progression wise coverage what we got going in that week and me just making sure I run good routes uh make sure I'm always open make sure that numers chicks trust me with that ball let's let's talk about the thing I know you you would rather talk about anyway uh you you're big into farming you your family runs a farm you have a dream of of expanding that Family Farm I'm curious what at what age were you when you decided this is what I want to be and this how I'm I've that was before I could even think there's never been a second thought in my mind uh I mean if you ask my mom she'd tell you that uh by the time I was able to walk basically she to make sure that she always kept an eye on me because I was always sitting on something turning something or doing something like that on the trackers outside so you your dad started this Farm while running an excavation company with his brother but started his this farm with a couple cows and a couple acres and now you're 80 to 100 head of cattle and and you're growing hay and you're growing corn how how did that evolve uh he just that's his passion too he's just like me except I mean our Farm's not big enough right now the way he can just do that so uh him and his brother started Excavating business together and that's his main job really and then on the side uh he farms and then so at night uh basically you want to spend time with pops like you got to be outside you're holding flashlight you're doing something and um that's what I look forward to every night was when he got home we can go outside and go back to work after he just got done with work so you guys would have the family dinner every night and then and then you were the designated flashlight holder while he's working on different pieces of every night every I can't remember one night where Mom did not make a dinner we did not sit down as a family and have dinner the the structure and the work ethic that that builds for you how does that help in in every aspect of your life uh just I mean it's not all sometimes of rainbows like even there like it sounds great but like there's days where I mean other days are much worse than others and no matter what like you're you know what you you know what to expect you know what who's going to be there for you so I mean when you come down and sit at the dinner table whether you had a horrible practice or you got cows sick or your crop sucks or something like that uh you still have those people they in hible with you uh to lean on and no matter what so I I was reading where you said that you actually had the the property picked out that you'd love to to buy to add to the family farm like do you drive by it every once in a while and just say someday every single time I'm home I will do it multiple times uh it's about 400 Acres it's old dairy farm and I've actually got very close with the guy that owns the place uh who's a really really awesome guy uh and hopefully one day or down the road here in a little bit uh he'll have the opportunity buy that place so do do you tell him hey know when I get to the NFL I'm I'm coming uh not exactly but I think we are he knows yeah I mean he's I think he's uh pretty receptive of that happening I think he still wants see that place be farmed and I think he knows that uh that place is going to be hard to be farmed by a better farmer than what I'm going to take care of it I I heard you talking about what you do out there and and I'm curious what is it what is the satisfaction like like for example a field you planted if it grows up beautiful and you cut when you cut it what is that feeling like to have seen it go from a seed in the ground to a finished product uh there's just so much that goes into just it's almost like footballing away just to where there's so much preparation that goes into even getting in the field getting your equipment ready getting your seed ordered getting your fertilizer ordered getting everything ready to go and then but then again you're relying on one mother nature to be good to you and if it is good to you you're so happy in that in the fall but if it's not you're like gosh like this is tough sometimes and just having the to see something come especially as a cattle wise like seeing something from a calf be born and then leave the farm of, 1600 lb like you're like wow like and you hand-fed that thing with five gallon a bucket this whole life uh it's it's a very special rewarding Feeling So you you're you're studying agricultural management at Ohio State what is it like having all that practical experience when you're in those classes uh it kind of gets me in trouble sometimes because yeah they like me to think a certain way and necessarily I have uh couple other ways I've done it my whole life and though they might not be by the book they still get the job done have you like debate you so you've debated with professors about yeah yeah had a concrete class they got pretty little B I I I was gonna say I doubt I doubt there are many people who have as much practical experience as you do no a lot of these kids uh I mean like for me it's still amazing a lot of these kids come from 1500 2,000 Acre Farms and basically they said I just want to get off the farm and come and experience college and in my mind I'm like gosh darn you're living my dream right now you're in college what are you doing it's it's interesting when you to hear you talk about the the dream of of running the farm it makes football almost seem like a means to an end is it like that or is it you just love being out there I love playing football there's no I mean I love being around everybody here and team wise and having coming in somewhere and like we're all working for the same goal and that's kind of what farming is like in a way I think that's why I've drawn the football so much because it's hard constantly every day it's hard like there's no practices are hard basketball you can kind of get away with hey this practice is that bad or just you're working on shooting today you're working on your jump shot today like every day is a grind here and every day on the farm is a grind here so I've taken a l of football and I'll play football as long as I can so I I heard you say in an interview that basketball was was your first love in terms of sports was that just you know you come to realization hey the future's in football yeah basically I mean I still love playing basketball in all season I play we play basketball the time here but yeah I was a I was a decent basketball player in high school though and we had a good time with it how how much of it is is kind of the science of hey here's here's my ideal height you know my ideal size I'm this height I can be this weight and this is the best position SL sport for me all of it has to do with that I mean if I was 68 if I was 67 I'd probably be playing basketball right now because that's probably the best decision for my body at that point but at my height and size now I mean that's football's definitely the best route and 20 years ago you probably wouldn't have been a tight end right you're probably a Mike linebacker somewhere I been a throwback middle linebacker he you had the neck roll You' had the the the brid like the BL bloody Bridge of the nose like I can I can see it oh yeah how big would your neck roll have been as a m lineer my popor massive one I'll just make it bigger than his that's all that matter all right Kate you've got some of the more fun nil deals and and I've heard you talk about NL and and you definitely have a very mature attitude toward it but what has it been like having basically you've got a seed company that that helps you with Seed corn at the Family Farm you you know you work with the Ohio beef producers it what is that like uh it's awesome uh fs and vision is a seed corn that we plant and it's I mean it helped our farm definitely more and it just benefits me personally but it's all in one in my mind so I'm always looking I'm honestly looking more towards helping the farm than financially helping me at this point just because I know down the road that's what I'm going to want to do and hopefully I can continue those relationships down there but uh having an FS Envision to supply us with that seed and US basically promote them and see how well that seed does for us is crazy and then agpr on top of that the helping us out with equipment and stuff I mean because we're not huge Farmers yet um we've came from basically lower-end equipment uh to sending us out brand new stuff that we're using it's insane and helps my dad out tremendously especially when I can't be there every day during the week and season well that that's what you said the the dream at Big 10 media days you said was have the the equipment company so that's like I I know you you mentioned last year during your your off week you had you had a combine sent out and you got to got to mess with that and it was a lot bigger than anything You' gotten to to use before what what is what is driving one of those things like I've always like I've driven past him you know in the fields and wondered like what's the power feel like I mean like just like people think of sports cars like you see a you see a two $300,000 sports car down really like gosh like that looks must be cool like then you sit in one of these things that is $600,000 and you're 20t up in the air you're like oh damn this is this is the real deal right here I was going to say it's it's got a little more power than a Lambo even if it's not about the same price so um so I gotta ask you before we let you go this is a question I usually only ask the offensive lineman but you're very good blocker and you raise cattle so I have to ask you this perfect steak cut and how do you cook it uh ribey no doubt about it medium not not medium rare a little red for me too much uh but okay I'm definitely a medium guy with there's a seasoning it's called like charcoal black or something like that we put on at the house and we like it a lot well listen everybody else I've done I know they've eaten a lot but you're the only one who's Ever Raised the cattle himself so I I I will take yours as as the most expert advice Kade thank you so much and good luck against Penn State appreciate you thanks a lot thank you to Kade over enjoy all those combines you may be driving in the future and good luck in that game that game is going to be huge Penn State Ohio State that is what you watch college football for another team that's hoping to play one of those teams down the line the Florida state seminal we talked a lot about Florida State at the beginning of the season because they started hot beat LSU beat Clemson but we haven't talked about it much lately because they've just kind of been rolling over people now they get Duke which is one of the surprise teams this year Well coached Mike Elco does a great job with that defense Jeff Cameron from warchant.com gonna help us break down the seminal as they get ready to play against the Blue Jeff Cameron from Warchant on Duke-Florida State Devils we're joined Now by Jeff Cameron host of The Jeff Cameron show on on thre's war chant the greatest place for Florida State fans to gather what's up Jeff hey Andy how are you man good to talk to you good to see you again oh it is this has been interesting because here Florida state is having this great season undefeated and it almost feels like we've just sort of forgotten about them since the Clemson game because they're just rolling over people but they've got Duke coming in this week and it feels like a good time to check up on the seminal because I don't know about you Jeff nationally it feels like they're on a collision course with North Carolina for maybe the best ACC Championship game we've ever seen and then perhaps the winner is in the playoff does feel that way doesn't it Andy and I I think you know if you go back to the start of the season I went to every practice in you know in Camp in the fall there same with the spring they were gearing up to this point where the thought was and I think amongst the Florida state faithful the thought was okay you got all this experience coming back you added to it through the transfer portal you felt good about the way last season ended for State ended up winning 10 games won seven straight going into the year and all that um and and I think the thought was okay look you got to survive you know the two big ones in your first four you've got LSU at a neutral sight and you got Clemson on the road and I think the fans kind of thought if if we go one and one in those two games we're going to be set up to maybe make a run at the ACC Championship but what happened was they won them both as you just noted and all of a sudden those expectations got ratcheted up from an ACC Championship Game to could this be a college football playoff team could this be a team that competes for a national title I think every week that goes by you see how much vol ility there is in college football it's a good year to be one of those teams in the mix because you feel like on any given Saturday right I mean that's not always true when people say that but it feels like it this year yeah and and Florida State feels like it has the pieces that if they were to get in that position and play against some of the better teams on the right day they can beat anybody and that's the the part that that is interesting to me because I think even in the middle of last season if I had have told you that that's where they they'd be that's the position they'd be in Midway through this season I think I don't think a lot of fla people would have believed us no I think they recognized that there were a lot of holes to fill but they've raised the floor of talent here considerably everybody knows the Norvell story and how well he got people to buy in to what he was selling but also how well they've really gone out and hit the portal and and they you know I've said this before one of the things about Mike and his staff is that they don't take just anybody because the guy can play they have a they have a very distinct or I I think a concerted philosophy that they utilize that they Implement um and and that is that yeah you got to be able to play they're not calling players that aren't better than the ones that they have of course you want upgrades when you go into the portal or you want stability of depth something along those lines but you also have to be willing to buy in to what that locker room is bought into which is selflessness and service and all the things that Mike repeats over and over again when given an opportunity but I think it's real because if it wasn't real you would not see the way uh that that he has succeeded and the way the players fight for each other so I I do think that's probably true he's created a culture through having that standard but he's also utilized the portal and held people coming into that same standard well and that's the thing it's hard when you're bringing in as many new people as they have over the years to keep the chemistry right and they have managed to do that and I don't you know I don't know how much of that is the coaching staff how much of that is having some some veteran leaders like Jordan Travis who can kind of help that a where they can kind of guide the new people and say Here's how we do things but they've they've not lost anything from a chemistry standpoint which is hard when you when you have that much change I'm surprised frankly I mean you've had a lot of guys buying for a lot of spots the competition has been awesome you know Andy once the competition gets ratcheted up those practices become more intense that can bleed over sometimes get physical sometimes feelings are hurt sometimes you wonder like hey I've been working hard here for two and a half years and they go bring in this guy from whatever University he's going to come in and start over me now and I was promised this or promised that it hasn't happened you know and I think that there's a lot of reasons for that I think you're right they have a veteran Presence at the most important position on the field in Jordan Travis who's turned into a good leader he wasn't always the guy right he was right very bashful didn't really want to talk much didn't like to talk to the media didn't raise his voice to players or anything like that I think somewhere along the way he turned the corner and knew it was incumbent upon him to play that role and then I think he's got defense guys along the way that have done that as well and they've somehow been able to kind of capture a sense that your time will come just keep working hard and they've also been very fortunate I think that this is one of the better collectives in town uh you look around the country I know you've covered this Andy and it's big part of college football now I mean what does your nil do what does your Collective do you know how well does that work how well does that function how well does that operate and there has to be a Synergy there so I think that's been in place too yeah I think they've been really good also and people don't ever talk about this but when there's a player who's deciding whether they want to stay or go yeah they identify the ones they need to keep and the ones they don't need to keep they call their Bluffs and tell them to go and I think that that's a skill that will be developed by a lot of programs over time but they seem to have it already yeah I guess that would be certainly understanding the market right what a player's worth is and what's not and you know I think that has ated sometimes by the position the person plays right it's much much easier to maybe go out and get let's say a defensive back than it is a defensive lineman yes and so I I think they recognize where to put the onus uh in terms of retention yeah it's it's funny because I remember when nil was starting and I I'd you know be talking to people and they say well what's going to happen when the backup quarterback's making more than the star left tackle like they're they're not going to no because that's not how it works like right people aren't stupid so but yeah I think Florida State's done a really good job with that but you know on the field this year it does feel like they have a lot of the pieces and they can do different things I heard you on your show on Wednesday talking about how does how does floor State handle this Duke defense because this is this is a really good defense this is athletic we've seen them against Clemson where they they basically shut them down or if they didn't shut them down they forced turnovers that that allowed them to not score and then we saw them against Notre Dame where they did lose that game ultimately but they were they were right in it how does Florida State attack this group which really seems to limit how well you can run the ball so that's why I think if I'm Mike norell and and Alex Atkins I'm spreading them out and throwing it because I'm not real sure that there are many defenses around the country that could line up and deal with the versatility and athleticism Florida state has that's really the strength of the team you know when you think about the tight end room which has seen a massive overhaul of talent Jem Bell is a matchup problem for anybody um he's going to the league at some point you've got Keon Coleman as you know and we all seen what he's done this year at wide receiver Johnny Wilson will be back this week so you got yeah that that was my question is Johnny back because he missed the last game yeah Johnny will be back so you have 67 and 6'4 and you got 65 and then you got 66 Kyle Morlock and you I mean you got a lot of dudes and Trey Benson's back there so they got a lot of weapons is my point I I don't think that Florida State and I'm gonna give Duke a lot of credit here I don't think Florida State can line up and run traditionally against this Duke team in fact I don't think Florida state does that very well period if we're going to look at an Achilles heel I think Florida state is really highly dependent in the Run game on big plays they've created several big plays but a down to- down efficiency they're not very good they get behind the chains a lot uh it's why you can see these crazy stats where they're in the top five in uh big plays and explosiveness and all those kinds of success rates on on plays over 30 yards and all that but they're they're like 111th in the down to down running the football in efficiency so they really rely on big plays on the ground game and I don't think that's GNA work against Duke because Duke doesn't really give him up yeah yeah and that's what elco's done such a good job there you know people forget he's only in his second year and they they've been fantastic but you know I Florida state has been a lot of two tight end with with Morlock and Bell yeah you kind of wonder with Wilson back do you do more one tight end and this because Wilson you know can give you a lot of the same things a tight end does as a six7 receiver but then he's more Dynamic than that too yeah and I you know last year when Florest state was really getting the offense going after that three-game losing stretch well documented they really kind of turned it around part of that was competition was not as good but also I think they figured out kind of who they were within the realm of what they had you know and I think one of Mike's strengths is that from week to week you really never know how he wants to attack somebody and I I've been giving him over the years credit for game planning even when things didn't work out even when they were losing games you could see what the intent was and why they were attacking certain teams that way and he's never been a guy that says well we're just gonna do this or we're just going to do that yeah he wants to run counter he wants to do a lot of those things but he's been a guy that's been recognizing early in a game or even going into a game this isn't going to work I got to spread these guys out I don't think they can cover us or I think we got to run the ball and keep our defense off the field he's done those things so every Saturday Andy I kind of go into the game really unsure of what they're going to do because he does change it up from week to week I don't think that they'll line up and try to run traditionally maybe the first series or so just a prod you know every team kind of does that with a jab early on in a game just to get a sense but I think he knows they got to throw the football here to set up the Run yeah it's well and it's interesting that in this era of head coaches who call plays dialing that back or giving it up entirely I think you know this year we've seen Eli drinkwitz have a lot of success turning things over to Kirby more you know Eli was was one of those that was like I'll never stop calling play then oh yeah I'm gonna stop and and you got at Florida you got the pressure on Billy Napier to give it up after this season and Mike seems better when he's calling plays I talked to to Michael alord the the athletic director about it and after Kenny Dillingham left I mean he he recommended to Mike he's like please keep and plays like it works better for you when you do that I don't think there's any question you know and it's it's kind of a young man's game to take on that many roles right he just had a birthday this past week I think he turned 42 right he's a young coach he's got a lot of energy and a lot he's always been an offensive mind that's how he made his bones and worked his way up pretty quickly as being a really bright offensive guy I think one of for my calling plays for now makes total sense maybe 10 years from now I don't know you know who knows where he'll be but right now it does make sense he's got such a good relationship with Alex Atkins too I've I've had a chance to ask Alex about that relationship and he talks about the symbiotic nature that during the week leading up to a game they sit down together an awful lot and Michael say what do you think about this and he allows his assistants to come back with well you know I think maybe we should do this and he actually gives everybody there a voice and then he kind of incorporates all of that but on game day it's Mike it's definitely Mike well and Alex is such an interesting case because a lot of times the the OC in a situation where the head coach is the is the offensive play caller is somebody who's just kind of the most trusted assistant they've not really called play but Alex has been a play caller he was a play caller at Charlotte before he came to Florida State and I I'm just gonna kind of give you the floor to tell other people about Alex Atkins you know lots of fan bases watch the show there's some fan bases that their team is going to be in need of a a new head coach uh Alex is going to be a head coach so tell everybody about Alex Dynamic leader Dynamic personality really hardworking very very bright interesting to watch work uh he will he will instruct you he will sit back and put his arm around you and tell you one second this is how we do this this is why give it another go and rip your head off the next instance but the guys all love him for it because they know it comes from a place of love and I think that's the key right whenever you have a demonstrative coach who will scream and yell at you but also teach you you got to believe that it's all coming from a good place for you to listen to it and take it in and all those guys do so I think he's got the makings of a great head coach he's a really smart guy he's a really a meticulous guy he's thoughtful he spends a lot of time uh not just with this offensive line group but talking about that offense like if you ask him one question I know you have you ask him one question about offensive football you might be there 30 minutes for him to break that down so that's a bright guy who's done a lot of time thinking he's put his put his his his work in uh and the players all love him they respond to him that's the thing too it's like like he's a he's an ultimate motivator it's not just the X's and O's he's a guy that can really I guess press the right buttons for certain guys yeah and that's the thing I mean what what makes it so interesting with Alex and and really this entire staff is Florida State's offensive line was in a position where it felt like it was never going to get any better shambles it was a deep hole that had been you know created over two coaching staffs and the fact that they are now serviceable to above average depending on the day and headed you know even higher is pretty incredible well Andy I'll tell you uh not last year but the year before when we would do game previews on Thursdays and Fridays on my show or when we'd be doing the pregame show that I work on with Tom Lang I I we would talk all about the x's and the O's and the strategy of this game and where we match up and where fora State doesn't match up and then towards the end I'd get depressed and go it's not going to matter for State can't block them and that was the most depressing thing in the world you could talk about all these things that had to happen but none of it matters if you can't block them and so you are absolutely right to point out that they have flip that room and not only have they flip that room they are a plus offensive line they're not Elite but they're a plus offensive line yeah they they they they add to the mix as opposed to taking away and I I remember I think it was Mike's first game 2020 against Georgia Tech and they had kind of stitched a line together and I forget who it was who got hurt but it's sec got hurt in like the the second quarter the third quarter second he got hurt done and they had to dip into the bench it was over the game was over and yeah that's that's the part to me that has been the most amazing flip because you can go find skill position players the portal is not the easiest place to find good offensive lineman they but they they've mixed and matched portal guys and guys that they they brought along been a good balance and they have a couple of young guys that they've since recruited from the high High School ranks that they feel very good about stepping in here in the next couple of years so that bought them some time to your point was they found a way to get serviceable that in turn led to recruits being interested it was no longer a black hole you're no longer going to go to Florida State and be forgotten about and not be able to succeed if you were an offensive lineman now you knew you had a chance to go and you had a chance to develop because you didn't have to play right away you know for a long time there andy if they got a halfway decent offensive line recruit they had to start them their freshman year yeah that's not ideal um and guys would get hurt and they'd never have a chance to recover because the second they could even put on their CLE they put them back out there because they had no depth so you never saw anything building towards something and that's what they've been able to change now guy goes out now they'll sit him out for two weeks and say get healthy big guy we've got you I mean they've done that all year long Robert Scott's missed a lot of time bless Harris missed last week they've had you know different players have to miss time but they haven't panicked because they've had other guys they feel good about behind them the other thing I find interesting about the the recruiting strategy and we talk about Florida State and the portal a lot because they've done it so well but it seems like they they've used the portal to make themselves better to make themselves deeper but that the success that's come with that is also now made them more attractive yeah to high school recruits than they were and they're kind of finally back to where they were in like 2012 2013 where they can attract that level of player it's pretty cool too it's been a a nice mix I mean you bring up what those portal guys have done for this program and it's expedited the turnaround there's no doubt about that a lot of those guys though were here like a year Germaine Johnson's a good example playing in the NFL now on Sundays with the Jets first round pick Jermaine Johnson is back in to I see him every time I'm at practice it feels like Germaine Johnson's always here and he talks to guys that are looking at fora State be it high school recruits or portal guys and he'll talk about how it changed his trajectory I don't know if that's true or not I he was a talented player already was at Georgia for goodness yeah he he actually may have been a first round pick at he stayed at Georgia but he wanted he wanted to show he was an every down player and he wasn't going to be an every down player on the greatest defensive line in college football history because they had too much other Talent so it all worked out for everybody in that one but yeah I think and and he kind of I mean he kind of kickstarted it I don't know if do they get Jared verse if they don't ever get Germaine Johnson I don't think so I don't think so and and I think you can look around at several guys like that that they've brought in some are less uh welln that came in and did a very good job of just filling their role you know just being I'll ask you about one like Fabian love it it feels like he's been there forever but he's a transfer he's a Mississippi State oh you can go on and on with these guys there's transfers everywhere out there for Florida State at least amongst the starters that's for sure Travis I mean he's a transfer Jordan Travis is a transfer Johnny Wilson is a transfer Keon Coleman's a transfer uh Jem Bell is a transfer I mean we can go Benson is a transfer most of the offensive line is a transfer it's unbelievable now what those guys did is they bought in they got here and they succeeded and then they in turn told people that one of the things they liked about the program was that the coaches said what they meant meant what they said and they lived the life that's see I think Mike has been smart about this because I've asked him specifically about this because the fan base is always asking how come Mike does this well and other places have had you know some success and some failures along the way and I said again I think Mike has a belief that the way you do this is you hold guys to an even higher standard maybe they think they're going to be held to so Germaine Johnson told me and you we were at the same dinner I believe yeah um that when why did he choose Florida State because he was being asked to come to Clemson and they were winning at a much higher clip than Florida State and he said M norell and I said what about M norell well he challenged me he told me he was gonna force me to work harder and develop the areas of that that he had been weak in including leadership and he didn't tell me that hey you're just going to come here and start he told me oh you might start but oh by the way you got to do this this this there wasn't much choice I was at the spring game the year Germaine Johnson was there I I saw his first rep as they were warming up and was like wow that is the easily the most talented player on this field so you better be a leader at that point yeah yeah it's true but he that's the cool thing those guys have all said oh yeah he he made sure that I understood that just because I might be more talented than what I was coming into to replays there was going to be other expectations there were going to be other expectations and so I think that's probably one of the secrets that Mike and his staff have been able to incorporate as as it pertains to the portal anyhow well let's see what they can do against Duke this is probably their toughest challenge till Miami and then I mean if they can get through both of those you gota feel I think you nailed it by the way buddy can you imagine you and I just football fans it doesn't really matter our allegiances we're football fans yeah the ACC Championship game has never had the sort of residence that if you project right now North Carolina Florida state with the star power uh for both quarterbacks obviously and in particular you got a top five pick over there at UNCC at quarterback so it's crazy to think about how much fun that could be nationally oh and and and think about the star power on the field because you'll have Jared verse you'll have Keon Coleman uh North Carolina is dramatically improved on defense they're really good on defense right now TZ Walker is a potential first round guy and and so I can't wait for I hope you know it if neither team has a up along the way and they meet as undefeated like that's the acc's dream scenario that this is what they dreamt when they created that championship game 18 years ago and it never happened this is what they've they've been working toward we had Matt Brown on the show the other day yeah I mean he's having as much fun as he's had since he was at Texas because he knows he's good on both sides of the ball now it's probably a lot of fun to go into a game knowing Drake mejor quarterback I it's well and and the NCAA just made a a I don't know if TZ Walker's a first- round pick he's a first round type talent and so when they just make that guy available to you and you you've watched him torch your your starting defense all year on Scout team you know what you're gonna get when he plays you got a chance every week when that's the duo right yeah so I think he's probably having a lot of fun and to your point they've also gotten better on defense um that number 33 at linebackers of stud they got they got a lot of guys that I've enjoyed watching lari Bernie getting it done there yeah yeah now this is all of this has been fun to watch because I don't know if you're a fan of the conference if you're a fan of the ACC specifically let's say I don't know that you could have come into this year thinking to yourself that you would have uh Louisville knockoff Notre Dameon the way that they did and Florida State be undefeated in the top five the way they are having swept LSU in Clemson North Carolina being a team that has a quarterback that could go one or two in the draft and now an elite receiver to go with and Prospect of an undefeated season you have a Duke team that we're talking about right now that is every bit the top 20 ranking that's next to their name because of that defense and Mike Elco is dynamic as a head coach we can go on Andy this this has been a fun conference this year absolutely oh Amari Gainer former seminal by the way Amari Bernie former Florida Gator I knew what you meant to manyari to many Amari in those hybrid positions on the defenses but yeah but yeah no I I think I think the acc's been a ton of fun this year I I you know it's weird with Clemson Miami playing this weekend yeah one of them will be handing the other their third conference loss in mid October but it is yeah it is also representative of how well the rest of the league or some of the rest of the league has come up and and gotten better without question and and I think this is the kind of thing you every League wants this every League wants five or six deep you know if you're the Big 10 you know you you want Penn State Michigan Ohio State and somebody else to be really really good yeah you want an Iowa or Wisconsin or you need somebody else right yeah pack 12's doing it right now that's a ton of fun to watch we can see that every weekend but you know you that's what you want you want depth of uh you know to me not just talent but you want a depth of competition in all these leagues that speaks to uh the credible schedule you lay out there when you're making the case in the beauty contest that is college football's playoffs I I can't wait now I wish it were next year with the 12 team because I I would hate to see if if an undefeated North Carolina and undefeated Florida State go to that championship game and only one of them is in the playoff like it would be it would be more fun next year when one of them's playing for a buy and and the other one's in but yeah I'll take I mean I'll take the stakes of this one of this version of it because it will be wild how many times have you played the wha if game with your friends this year on about you know you look ahead so we got Penn State Ohio State this weekend obviously fora State Duke this weekend you can keep going and try to find the every week but this has been so fun to kind of say okay is this an elimination game did Southern cow just get eliminated because of that loss where are we looking you know what's going to happen with Oregon in Washington because we all can see a scenario by which we're frustrated it's the element of the game that has always bothered us as Die Hard fans and that some of this is subjective yes and that's that's what I worry about because I think if we're being realistic about it it's probably not five undefeated conference Champs it's probably 5-1 loss conference Champs and you got to pars them and somebody's getting left out and that somebody's gonna get the shaft and it's GNA suck yeah it's gonna suck I that there's no other way to say it correct and and the thing is like if you're the ACC if you're the Pack 12 you're worried about that if you're the Big 12 I if it's Texas and Oklahoma I feel like those are big enough Brands they're probably not gonna get shafted yeah but I don't know it that's why I would I just wish it were next year already CU at least then you're not not screwing somebody that they're going to they're going to have a harder road but they're going to get to try first time in a long time that college football has had this kind of competitive depth you know there was a spot a number of years ago Andy where I was starting to get a little frustrated for years and years and years I'll use this analogy real quick um women's college basketball okay it was a sport that was ascending and Tennessee would beat everybody then Yukon would beat everybody and that was it that was it and you would have Elite 8 games where somebody got beat by 50 yeah that's not good for a sport that's trying to grow and I would watch college football and there was a time where Alabama and a couple of other teams Ohio State Clemson whoever you want to look at were doing the same thing you felt like realistically there are four teams that could win a National Title that's not good for the game when there's three or four legitimate contenders for a title some might want to argue five or six but there were some years where it was maybe two oh yeah I mean it's it's it's been two or three more years than it's been four or five yeah and now I think think you can legitimately argue on a neutral field for 10 to 12 teams maybe more like I think you could argue for Washington in Oregon and Texas in Oklahoma in Alabama in Georgia in Florida State and North Carolina see we're going we're going we I'm already up to 10 yeah and you haven't even mentioned Michigan Ohio State and Pen State yes yeah exactly it it is so much fun and it's it's fun to see some of these teams that have been out of it for a little while get back into it or or in North Carolina's case kind of be in it for the first time really because they had good Seasons under Mack the first time around yeah but it wasn't like this because you always knew they were gonna face Bobby Bowen in the seals and that was going to be the end of that it's not the same anymore not the case at all not the it's it's right now it's a tossup so that's all you can ask for if you love college football you want as many of these kinds of matchups as possible where the outcome is in question yep Jeff Cameron thank you so much we will be in touch because uh we talk about the NES quite a a bit down the stretch Andy it's always a pleasure buddy be good man good job thanks yeah thanks that's it for the show thank you Conclusion, Wrapping Up to kayn King to Cade Stover and to Jeff Cameron for joining us guys it is a huge college football weekend Penn State Ohio State Tennessee Alabama bunch of other great games let's all go watch let's have some fun hey hey hey hey hey hey hey hey hey hey hey he hey hey hey heyy