7 takeaways from Packers offseason program: Jordan Love contract, Anders Carlson update, draft class

hello everybody Welcome to the green9 podcast Green Bay Packers chatter from packersnews.com jsonline.com my name is J.R Radcliffe and joining me again is Ryan wood reporter for packersnews.com he's been at miniamp OTAs all the preseason the words that we use Ryan they they actually run together in my head I'm not sure which phase we're ever on is this the OTAs the mini camp the offseason program offseason program preseason is what happens when they actually start playing football that doesn't count well that part I get and training camp happens before that OTAs and many Camp are all part of the offseason proog yes and this is where we are but just as interesting are some of the things that are being said in the locker room which we'll we'll talk about we'll discuss some of the position battles here uh but but obviously we're always goingon to start talking about Jordan love at this point he uh he of the looming contract uh potentially one one would think that's going to happen soon he had a really interesting interview session with you with others sort of being asked about the contract being peppered with questions and giving the most short I don't know glib would be the wrong word to say but just clearly not interested in engaging answers the answers were very short and to the point one to two words uh somebody suggested oh it sounds like you're close and he said nothing but it's all about reading body language and you know I I read it initially it's like oh maybe he doesn't like maybe maybe it's going badly I don't think that's the case but give me your sense of the room there give me the sense of where you think they're at and how what timeline there might be to get a deal done with Jordan love you know if I was about to be paid 50 million I I feel like I would have a really really hard time not looking excited yeah that'd be really difficult for me to pull off $50 million a year plus uh I would I dare say I'd smile there there'd be a smile at least if if that was my reality obviously it's not my reality not close sorry yeah yeah got into I should have I should have thrown spirals instead but Jordan love there's no Smiles he he you do not want to be at a poker table with this guy he will absolutely Crush you um so look it's gon here's how we know it's going to happen he's he was at the entire offseason program and there's clearly no beef for animosity with the team we know that because we've seen beef and animosity between Green Bay Packers quarterback and a Green Bay Packers team so it's going to get done it'll be fine even if he's not smiling about it even if he's really holding his cards close to his chest uh there's no reason to panic I think it'll be interesting when it gets done I mean Brian gakin has said he wants it done by training camp and Jordan love the little that he said said that you know he he thinks it's going to be soon uh I don't think it needs to be done by training camp I think it needs to be done by week one if it's not done by preseason week one you're you're not going to see Jord I can't imagine you're going to see Jordan love on the field playing any kind of snaps and meaningless game so and I think that you if if you're the Packers you would like him to have some preseason snaps this year I think ideally you you would like to to see him in this young offense it's still a young quarterback young offense have a little bit of preseason exposure so when it gets done will be interesting but it's not it's it's it's not nearly as interesting as Jordan love being able to really not smile about it that's that that that's impressive yeah let me ask a question that's more General probably for people who maybe don't follow the Packers quite as closely but is there a logistical hurdle that comes next after if he does sign this contract which we again we assume he will does that change anything that they can do with the roster for this year for the short term and then in an even broader more sort of like how you feel about it how does it change Jordan love like you've been around him enough obviously he he doesn't come across as somebody who's going to change anything he does about himself both on and off the field but do do you that there is there's going to be an evaluation period afterwards where it's like well let's let's see how he reacts to this because this level of success is obviously something he hasn't had before yeah I dare say that a a man who could avoid smiling for the cameras on the cusp of receiving generational wealth might not change all that much when generational wealth arrives that's just a guess it's a hunch there's going to be a lot of pressure for sure um like there is with any time a quarterback gets paid franchise quarterback money the first word is franchise right that you are the franchise at that point the hopes and dreams of everyone within the franchise rests with you that is the nature of being that role for an organization so yeah there's going to be pressure and he's going to have to go out and perform and there's going to have to be a hell of an on Encore in 2024 but we watched the last two months of 2023 and I don't think there's any real reason to think he can't do that so uh yeah how he faces the pressure not just from opposing defensive coordinator that are have a whole season now to prepare for him and and and scheme him up but the the pressure of expectation and and the the contract will be worth watching as far as how it changes the cap I the Packers historically traditionally the way they structure things with those signing bonuses and they they can lower the the the cap in the first year and then have it increase incrementally thereafter I would imagine you're going to see something like that okay how has he looked in in training camp I want to ask you about some of the position battles that includes backup quarterback which we'll get to in a second but you've seen Jordan love throw a little bit I know that doesn't tell you a whole lot because you know it's not not full-fledged football but but how has he been so far it doesn't tell me anything this is I think very important okay um they have not started playing football yet and every year I see uh the mistake being made of of trying to take any football observation any meaningful football out of June and it's just not the way it is football's played in pads if they're not in pads they're not playing football and they've been in shorts uh with some some's a little loonier than others um when you start evaluating running backs this time of year oh boy because what's the number one job of a running back J.R like you but yeah number one job of running back is is not to get tackled like you could be the worst pass Pro running back there ever was but if you never get tack anytime you touch the football you're going to play every snap because you're going to take it to the house every single snap and who cares if you can block or not they're not tackling so how do you know if a running back can play or not when they're they're not tackling I that's always alluded to me uh I think with Jordan love the thing that's interesting is a year ago and I was guilty of this too because a year ago there was so much Intrigue we did not know who he was going to be and it was kind of a big deal who he was going to be coming off in in the wake of a four-time MVP the the transition franchise from one one quarterback to the other it was a huge we we I charted play byplay last June which is about the dumbest thing I've ever done because it's not football uh we've seen Jordan love at this point the good the bad we've seen it all in between whatever we see from him in June is not last October week week eight against the Minnesota Vikings this is a quarterback and an offense that couldn't get a first down until the very end end the first half they ended up being one of the best offenses in the league down the stretch what happens in June doesn't matter it just not not being D it just does not matter because what happens in September and October often doesn't matter um Jordan love did hit nine straight completions in practice in the last day of mini camp cool it's not it's not football um you know so I I think when they strap the pads it's going to be very interesting to see okay well all that said let's let's make more evaluations from the non football portion of the offseason program oh I know I I want to I want to be stubborn with this so yeah give me your best but well it's a rule I have I I I don't make football observations off June yes I don't do it there are some there are bigger issues than backup quarterback but while we're on the position Michael Pratt and Sean Clifford I think are interesting and it isn't even just about what they've done on on the field or whatever whatever we consider on the field is at this point but you're talking about a guy who you know has experience in the system versus a guy who drafted and seemingly a very you know mature leader type quarterback who may not have the measurables but I don't know if sea Clifford is thought of as a as a measurables guy either so in that sense they have some similarities do you have a have a sense of would the Packers I assume they're only going to keep two quarterbacks but I don't know would they would they be willing to go to three and if so who would maybe be the guy to be more likely to land on the practice squad I I don't know if you have any sense of that at that operation thus far at all I don't know how you draft Michael Pratt when you have Sean Clifford on on on the roster already if you're not willing to keep three quarterbacks on the 53 now there's a massive difference between being willing to do it and actually doing it right um that both those guys are GNA have to earn that but what's the upshot here of having you know you've got a a young stud starting quarterback and he is Young and he's talented what's the upshot of having two developmental projects behind them if you're not going to actually try to develop them you know if you're going to give Michael Pratt a look for a couple months and then set him off potentially into the wild uh releasing him letting him clear waivers and yeah if he clears waivers you bring him back P Squat and very likely very he he he might clear waivers if you release him but then you're you're risking a drafted quarterback getting signed up by another team uh so I think that they they'd be they'd have to be willing to to keep three um I think it's going to be a fascinating battle you know one of the things that this time of year does it's it's when I say there's no football going on it's not like this time of year is worthless it's not like there it's useless it's certainly for the team for the team it's a classroom on the field right it's not football but it's taking their classroom studies especially with the new defense Jeff Halley new scheme but taking their classroom studies for young players especially and and converting that onto the field and and really practi so that once training camp H begins once the real football starts they they've got the the mental acuity to to go out and play it in in in this system but the other thing that this time of year does is it it often sets up a lot of questions uh that get answered that a lot a lot of mysteries that get unraveled early parts of camp and for me this backup quarterback battle is about as fascinating as anything on the roster because Sean Clifford looked like he looked real good in the preseason last year I don't want to overhype it but you saw him in Cincinnati I mean he had this Gunslinger mentality that kind I think took people by surprise he's a he was a surprising fifth round pick in the draft last year out of Penn State had played a lot of football in college but as you said the measurables weren't really there and then he comes in he just he just slings it around the yard has a good preseason some spot garbage time Duty last year you know he hit hit a big pass wide open to Bo Melton Minnesota had a had a a solid rookie year and you know under other circumstances the draft went differently I think would have expected right now to have a strangle hold on the backup job except Michael Pratt comes in and and he was a surprised at a seventh round pick because everyone thought he'd be drafted higher and so now you I don't know if Michael Pratt gonna be a quarterback or not but he can whip it the ball leaves his hand very impressively he's got some zip uh so I think it's going to be really interesting once Camp starts once they actually start playing football to uh to see this this backup battle here's one you cannot definitively answer based on what you've seen because both going to the the quarterback battle from quarterback to quarterback uh both with Jer Alexander unavailable you've had both Eric Stokes and Carrington Valentine on the field and as you wrote at packersnews.com one of them is not going to be starting games if once Jer Alexander comes back so the question is which one you've got a guy who is a seventh round pick that really you know kind of worked his way up into into good favor into a point where he could start and a guy who is a first- round pick who has all the pedigree but also all the injuries so it's a very difficult conversation how do you look at that one right now and and I don't know if you if you have a favorite in the clubhouse I really don't know I think that's a re you know it's and it's not backup quarterback either right because at the end of the day we know who the quarterback is we're talking about a starting quarter yeah and I I don't know between Eric Stokes Who Matt lefur said is mentally and physically the best shape he's seen a in that the injuries he feels that they really feel that the injuries are behind him and it was a year and a half this guy could barely play football it was brutal um not what Eric Stokes among anyone else wanted and he's back now he's been healthy throughout the entire offseason program he's taking first team reps a lot of them um and if they can get him back to what he was in 2021 as a first round pick which was a promising rookie Corner that very few things changes impacts this this Packers roster more than that that's huge uh with that said Carrington Valentine is the guy that Matt lefair said is stands out they charged him uh at the end of last season to go put on some weight go bulk up a little bit you're a corner you're a perimeter corner but just to be more physical just put on a little bit of weight and Matt lefur says night and day with Carrington Valentine he he looks thicker he looks bigger um so you got a you got a heck of a battle there because Gyer Alexander is going to be one of the corners and gy Alexander he was excused from mini camp mandatory mini camp but um there's a reason that he was excused right he's been everything the Packers have wed to be this offseason he was there until the the last couple days he was been there throughout the entire offseason program it was a reward for him to to not have to be at the you know which mini camp OTAs there's really no difference between the two it was a reward for him to get to leave Green Bay early um and you know he's he's going to be a stal word at at one corner I have no idea is going to be the second that's going to be really interesting to watch and Kean Nixon I assume is the slot Corner who we'll see a lot of or could I mean k to Valentine can't do that I don't think but I I don't know do that does that play into it as as well who's gonna be that guy no not between them Javon Boulder though sure and and and not just Javon Boulder Evan Williams I I have to think that kesan Nixon has a clear lead to be the starting nickel by virtue of he was excused from man mandator men in Camp him Xavier mckenny and J Alexander were all excused from from mandatory men in Camp both days Josh Jacobs excused the second day I don't think that kesan Nixon gets excused for mandatory mini camp if he doesn't have a clear lead for that starting job okay but I do think it's going to be interesting because there's a reason why he has a clear lead he he he had he he flashed a lot of potential last year there was a lot of Need for more consistency too so which one shakes out I don't know yet but if it's the Nixon that needs more consistency Javon Bard's part of his repertoire is playing in the slot he did that in college without kesan Nixon at mandatory mini camp we saw Javon bowler taking quite a few slot reps I imagine you're going to continue seeing that some in Camp but you can't move you can't you can't even entertain the idea of Javon Bard being eventually a slot corner for you even if you'd like him to be if Evan Williams doesn't develop as as a potential starting safety which is a big if for a fourth round pick it's the same issue that they had with Darnell Savage Darnell Savage should never should have played all these safety snaps and never been moved off that spot but they had no one else to play safety so if they have no one else to play safety Javon Bullard a safety and it's very easy and they're going to have obviously Xavier McKenna but that second safety spot is going to be Javon buler if Evan Williams can develop into someone that can play those snaps next to Xavier McKenna then the Packers might have the flexibility to get creative in that secondary I think it things get interesting at that point I think you answered the question here I was going to ask which rookie you think is going to make the biggest impact or at least will be on track to make the biggest impact I think it's Javon Bullard like you said starting safety presumably and if not that maybe you know maybe he moves around throughout throughout the whole season um you know that that maybe discounts with Jordan Morgan's chances are to make that first rotation of starting offensive linan we'll talk about o in a little bit but does that does that sound right to you that Javon Bullard is kind of maybe the rookie to watch at least in the early going I think the first three all are going have an impact but I if I say the biggest impact I'd have to maybe not go Jordan Morgan or Javon Brer I might have to go Ed Cooper I think Ed Cooper's going to play if he stays healthy he's G to play over 800 snaps this season he's going to be on the field all the time and nickel um again it's not football but we can see we can you know what we can tell this time of year is that whether you know a guy what kind of athlete a guy is right there's that athletic burst Edan Cooper's got some athletic burst I don't know how it translates in the confines of football when they start playing it but he's a letic uh you put him next to Quay Walker and the nickel oh boy that's uh that's a pair right there um so I I I would say it's Edan Cooper but I think Jordan Morgan look I I I've seen offensive lineman with this team able to play any spot Elton Jenkins can play any spot all five Zack Tom can play all five I've never seen a rookie offensive lineman come in and learn four position at once before training camp that's what Jordan Morgan's doing I even asked Matt Le like where's the balance for that because that's a lot that is a lot for a rookie you're an offensive lineman just just transitioning to the league and transitioning to blocking full grown men every play that's regardless where you line up you got a full grown man across from you that you gotta block that's enough of a transition but then when you got four different positions when you got both guards and Tackle spots which we saw him play Everything But Center this off season you got very different full grown men between those four positions right you got you know your interior defensive lineman you're uh your big beefy guys with with good you know good Gap pin you know quick twitch Gap penetration and then you've got these these fast these Twitchy athletes on the outside that that that cut the edge it's it's a full plate for Jordan Morgan I think that that's a sign that the Packers think he can handle it yeah and I think that he's going to have an impact and then Javon Bard yeah he can play multiple spots as well and at the very least I would expect that he's going to play a lot of snaps next to saier mckin is starting safety but no for me I would say Edan Cooper because I just I he's he's gonna play over 800 snaps he's he's gonna be on the field a ton of nickel do you have any other takeaways from the offensive line from what you've seen so far they're very early and and figuring this thing out I thought it was interesting that they're giving Andre Dillard a lot of reps yeah uh I don't I'm not going to make anything else out of it from that all right because again one of the things that you can tell this time of year is who's getting the Reps that that's significant uh you can't tell why they're getting the Reps I don't know if they're just trying to get a really large bulk sample size look of of Andre Dillard after bringing him in kind of late in the off season uh or if they see something there that they really really like and he's a starting candidate but he's got a lot of first team reps and that'll be interesting to see once camp uh starts uh but that there's there's I think there and I I asked Matt lefur this specifically did you make much Headway finding your best five he's like oh no no obviously they didn't why did they not biggest they haven't even seen him in padge yet so you're G to see a lot of different configurations early in Camp and they're going to sift through to find their best five but they this is an offensive line that's so many options I think we saw that during this offseason program there's so many options for what they can how they can line up up front uh it's it's very interesting you know you mentioned Quay Walker earlier and he said something that I that caught my attention having himself played for a championship team in in Georgia how he could feel the the way that the locker room came together the camaraderie that the sort of bond that they had which you know I anytime I hear that it's always like well yes when you're a winning team you have camarad Rin Bond but he did say that he felt that with this team way ahead of where they had been in the past and you know I think when you have a bunch of guys that are all young and all got good together at the same time that makes some sense is that just smoke or is that something that you think is is legit is tangible something that they can actually use to their benefit or or is it just like hey we know we're a good team and so erir go we are all best buddies right now because we know winning is gonna follow how do you feel about that it feels tangible right now um I we don't none of us are actually in the locker room full time so we don't really have any idea what it's like inside that locker room fulltime because once those doors shut to the media it's an entirely different ecosystem that we are just not provy to so I I don't try to make broad statements on locker room culture when I'm not none of us are are fully in it uh but you know I I I do see yet last day of mini Camp Jordan love goes up to Christian Watson and his locker they're talking about something I don't even think it was any it didn't have the vibe of like anything football related just chatting uh then Jord Love goes back to his locker Bo Melton comes up to him says something to the effect of there he is like hey you know and like they're saying their goodbyes and like you they're they're they're you know presumably leaving Green Bay um a lot of friendly Vibes that you can Pro you know perceive um I'm not making much of a a deal out of this other than to say these guys seem to like each other and I do think that's important and and Quay Walker's not the only one that said there's a lot of good vibes around here a lot of good Vibes in in the locker room um I I think it's especially important at receiver because we can say all we want they don't have a number one receiver they don't really need a number one receiver unless human nature takes over right the they have multiple guys they have so many guys that can go out there and get you 100 yards week in week out you g given the game plan give the defense given the snaps they can go out there and get get you to the sentury mark and be your number one receiver um the human nature though this is a business at the end of the day this is the opportunity means dollars and if you don't have that number one opportunity you don't get those number one dollars so you didn't see last year you saw a lot of camaraderie on that receiving group you saw a lot of guys that just they just didn't that genuinely didn't care who got the credit who got the glory if that's the case this season watch out this is going to be an incredibly dangerous offense but at some point I think you have to wonder like when does human nature kick in because this is this isn't a game this is a business they get paid for this I it's just it's something I think you have to wonder well I can't let you go without talking about kickers we've uh We've we've seen Andre Carlson do pretty well that the competition that he brought in is also doing uh is also doing pretty well so uh so give me your thoughts Ryan on the kicking competition I think it's very interesting that they uh they are putting the field goal Nets up this this offseason um call me a conspiracy theorist if you want I usually don't lean that way at all but it's extremely difficult when you're standing on the sideline of a football field to tell if a kick goes through the uprights or not when there's not a net okay um we we've all gotten I think better at it it's been a lar for I'm talking about the entire beat it has been a learning process for us things we have never had to do before like okay do they where's the guy that's catching these kicks where's he standing when he catches them um how did the kickers react uh all kinds of different tricks to see okay did they make it or not when you can't tell by the perpendicular angle um it'll be interesting to see if they keep three in training camp I think Greg Joseph is the clearest uh competition for for Andre Carlson uh instead of you we'll we'll see Jack PN has an opportunity so long as he's here uh but this is a team that is absolutely determined clearly to not repeat the kicking sins of of 2023 and did not really reveal diddly about it until they they figure out who their kicker is because when you have three kickers on the offseason roster you don't have one yet and they need to find one when Carlson missed that kick in San Francisco sitting in the Press Box I I don't often go to Packers games so when it when it went up I was like oh that's good it's clearly good and the only reason I knew it wasn't good is was because the fans started freaking out in the end zone they were excited about it's like wow it's clearly not good and then you go back and see the video like wow it wasn't even close to good how did I think that but you know that angle you don't know so if the if the writers don't know who's making and who's missing it's a little bit less to report on or I don't know it's all I'm saying is it this is my 11th season covering this team it's the first time they've never had the field goal net up that's all I'm saying yeah I don't know something something a foot there maybe uh okay the uh before Before I Let You Go like one last thing any any injuries that that Packers Fan should be concerned by I'm looking at Tucker craft with a peck injury and that feels like a pretty big deal but obviously we're a long way away even from training campus we're still another month away so uh I'm not sure that that's anything to be concerned about but anything that really jumps to mind that you're you're monitoring not from an injury standpoint yeah I think you know they they expect Tucker craft Zack Tom to be back at some point in Camp and once they are you know it it it's easy for Zack Tom to just jump right in not saying Tucker craft can't but he's still a really young guy that hasn't played as much football clearly as Zack Tom and and and Packers I'm sure would like to see him get as many reps as possible so earlier the better don't know when that'll be um yeah the most interesting conversation I had all of the offseason was with Zack Tom not about the injury but I I just I I think the most fascinating positional decision ision looming for this team that now knows it has its quarterback involves Zack Tom do you keep him right tackle do you move him inside and I talked good five minutes with Zack Tom about this and he said it basically it boiled down to I'm not going to say no if they want to move me inside eventually I don't know what my agent would say because when you're talking about Zack Tom potentially moving from right tackle to Center you're talking about a wide receiver one moving to tight end and they get paid like it the top paid right tackle in the league right now vuel is 28 million a year his teammate Frank ragnow is the top paid Center at 13.5 million a year not even half of what the top paid right tackle gets Zach Tom's a really good right tackle you don't move number one receivers to tight end for that reason I have a hard time seeing them ever ever in z told me Point Blank I wouldn't say no ever seeing Zack Tom move to Center given the difference in money it's a massive difference uh and this is again this is a business it's not a game um so I I that's not a 2024 problem because he's going to he's going to compete at right tackle he's going to start out at right tackle in Camp if Jordan Morgan or Rasheed Walker can kick him inside it would be Right Guard Josh Meers is the center for 2024 the coach has made that clear but I think long term I think starting next spring when oh by the way Zack Tom is extension eligible because he'll be going into his you know his final year of his rookie deal then I think it'll be very interesting to see uh what what his future is because he's going to be on the line but where at I love the Diplomatic way he put it well you know I don't mind I'm up for anything my agent might not be my agent might mind I love I asked I was like isn't there like a business side of this he's like uh business perspective for sure yes he because here's Zack Tom's not dumb he's a he is as smart of a football players they having that locker room he is a cerebral guy he gets the business side uh he he it's that's going to be interesting all right anything else any maybe who the odd man out would be in the receiving room if it were opened up today I don't know if there's any other takeaways that you have thus far no I think receiving room needs to needs to sort itself out all right he is r find everything he has at packersnews.com of course uh as we get closer to I think July 22nd it's a early uh training camp this year I believe so uh we have a month before before more Packers news will come flowing out although of course there could be Jordan love news between then and now we will see but thanks for tuning in to this episode of the green 19 podcast we'll be back with you again very soon tataa