Karen Read Jurors Speaking Out to Confirm Not Guilty Verdict

Opening Statements with Julie Grant >> I disagree Excuse me this is funny Missouri we have been unable to reach a unanimous verdict signed by the foreperson we find ourselves deeply divided by fundamental differences in our opinions and state of mind. Your service is complete and declaring a mistrial in this case there are some things that you wish that you could. >> Clarify haha and a mask. ♪ >> Jurors in the care re trial are reaching out to both sides clarifying their position on the charges saying even if Karen Reid did hit John o'keefe the jury didn't think she knew it happened. This is Karen Reid is preparing to return to court this week asking the court to dismiss the case our legal experts are weighing in also this hour, the former officer who shot Sonia Massey is explaining his interpretation. Her review as a deadly threat plus reaction is pouring into the sentencing of a teenager who beat a teacher's aide. It is 5 years ♪ behind bars and appropriate punishment. It's all next right here on opening statements. >> Welcome to opening statements I'm Julia Janae filling in this morning for Julie Grant thanks for being with us. The show is all about getting you ready for the day ahead in court just like opening statements in the trial and we're bringing you courtroom coverage in multiple trials today Court TV is also tracking some important hearings that could be affecting the future trials that we watch so let's take a look at our daily dot. >> Mister Tao shot the male Yang. Then he shot pay more. Then he shot Kevin Maloney. >> Day 2 of testimony in the triple murder over $600 trial is set to begin at 09:30AM tower is back on trial for the second I'm in a year after his first trial was declared a mistrial and that's just one of the cases we're following today here on Court TV are also in Iowa where opening statements are slated to start at 10:00AM and the data in a ditch murder trial defendant Alan Jones stands trial for the murder of his father Dennis who died last April, his brother Nathan was charged with aiding and abetting both are being tried separately also in Kentucky, the father and son charged in the death of Crystal Rogers, we'll be back in court Joseph in Steve Lawson are both charged in connection Karen Read Jurors Speak Out with the disappearance and death of Rogers will monitor any updates in that courtroom throughout the day our top story today though the new developments in the Karen Reid murder trial. At this point multiple jurors have been reaching out to both sides even to a reporter saying that they are certain Karen Reid is not a killer according to a new defense filing from Monday a jury juror rather called it attorney David unity revealing that the jury had not reached and again this verdict on manslaughter but had reached a unanimous not-guilty verdict on 2 of the 3 indictments. The second-degree murder charge as well as leaving the scene with injury or death, here's a look at the document the affidavit but her first to the person as jurors be not revealing if this is a man or woman juror B also told the des fence that even if Karen Reid hit John o'keefe with her SUV quote no one on this jury thought she hit him on purpose. This comes after 4 jurors reached out to the prosecution last week leaving voicemail and emails for the district attorney's office confirming they were unanimous on charges one and 3 unanimous on not guilty this could explain why the jury said they were hopelessly deadlocked leading to judge can ony declaring a mistrial. >> Judge can ony despite our commitment to the duty entrusted to us we find ourselves deeply divided by fundamental differences in our opinions and state of mind. The divergence interviews are not rooted in a lack of understanding or after it, but deeply held convictions that each of us carry ultimately leading to a point where consensus is unattainable we recognize the weight of this admission. And the implications it hold. >> We're gearing up for Friday when carried is going to be back inside the courtroom for a motion to dismiss hearing in front of Judge can ony let's bring in our panel to discuss this. We have 2 excellent attorneys who can break this down for us attorney and former prosecutor fronts Burkhart and in Massachusetts trial attorney and former homicide prosecutor in Norfolk County where this is all happening Richard Grundy is with us as well it's great to have you both on this morning from the start with you when you hear that Judge read the note where this jury saying we're hopelessly deadlocked is there any explanation, your mom and why they didn't submit a partial verdict, hey we're unanimous on some of the charges but there's just one where we are hopelessly deadlocked. >> I think that you have you have a few you have the fact that the defense and the prosecution nor the judge none of them told the jury that's number one and the question is going to come did the failure to poll the jury create an obstacle to what we call a tacit acquittal. On those 2 counts if in fact she was tacitly acquitted. The 4 may have been can. >> You sing, but they clearly knew I asked questions I think clearly were articulate with there feelings and thoughts in their I don't know why they didn't just say look. We agree as to count one in 3 that she's not guilty had they done. But we will be having a different conversation. >> Totally different conversation and we wouldn't have jurors reaching out about a verdict that didn't happen in a case that's already been declared a mistrial Richard you've got insider knowledge is to this courtroom perhaps the jury instructions out their written I don't think I've ever seen a jury instruction about partial verdict instruct thing the jury on how to deliver a partial verdict but what can you tell us about why you think the jury seemed to be very confused. But now really emphatic about know we were unanimous on not guilty for 2 charges. >> So I think the first thing we have to remember is that the jury. >> No matter how our late It unless of course there's an attorney on me and then jury which were not aware of. So this is new to the group at and they rely on the court and the attorneys for the guidance into how they do their job so I think it for the jurors sake I think that they were looking at this is we have a whole it will be before us who led it it's our job to take care of the whole case that's before us. And we've chipped away at it, but we have not accomplished that and that's what they read according to the court we cannot reach 8 verdict on this case and that's what you've asked us to So. >> The idea of a partial where did the idea of chipping away at it that was never really broached with them. I think they understood that when they got to that means order they had to work down through the lesser included. But again that was a piece of the hole which they didn't complain so I think that's what their mindset that was. Now this doesn't get the prosecution and the out of the defense's argument that they're presenting now I think it was clear just as far as mentor a mindset of the defense was as we put our best case forward here that the prosecution did not. >> We were expecting a pretty quick not guilty on this and from the first 10 that the jury was hung when just attorney and that he was there and immediately said given to a robbery goes which is the first step necessary step to working towards a hung jury that they wanted to get that home. I hung jury is not a conviction so it is a for when for the defense and they were hungry to get that so I think in response to France's. Question with respect to what everybody was doing. I think that their mindset was we got to get this hung jury and live to fight another day. >> It They have written a emotion that brings up some salient points that are going to have to be addressed and they're not going to be easily in this matter and I I think you're going to see this go to the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts at a minimum. >> Such a mess after already a difficult trial. The jury unable to at least tell the court about unanimity on some of those charges still hung on one of them. We haven't gotten that cleared up at all it seems like they still did not think that she had him on purpose regardless that's a difficult position for This prosecution to be it and want to go back to trooper Joe Paul this was there Reconstructionist who talked about how the crime scene the accident scene look at how it related to John o'keefe injuries was play that want to get your reaction on the other side. >> So the Vigo was traveling in reverse and how fast was vehicle, traveling, you know The vehicle traveled up to 24 miles per hour and approximately 62 feet what if anything occurred. The right rear of the Lexus struck the pedestrian John o'keefe. >> And postal Asian what if occurred with regard to >> it Mister Keyes is projected for it into left along the front yard of 30 for Ferry road. >> Fronds if these jurors are corrected the reports that we're getting out now which I think we can we can take them at their word now because they've reached out to defense attorneys to the district attorney's office even independent reporter has heard directly from a juror saying we were unanimous on second degree murder for not guilty meeting we don't think there was this murderous element to it that means they completely didn't believe what trooper Joe Paul had to say about the speed and about the distance your thoughts. >> Well, that's that's the pickle look the commonwealth's going to be an right gives in fact the judge says or the core or higher court and I agree it's going to be a higher court that makes this decision says you know you can't Trier for for second-degree murder that she's been acquitted for that they can move. >> For possibly for the lower charge but you're absolutely right what they have to kind of do is pivot. >> From she wanted to hit him, she meant to him and she hit him too. Well maybe this was an accident or maybe this was something else and and look in any work else in the world this would be a case that was resolve itself with a negotiated plea that's not going to happen in this case. It will likely be another trial, but yeah they did not believe that expert of course the other side of it is they believe the conspiracy that the that whole bunch of people like jumped in and killed him either. So that didn't work for the defense so it's going to be interesting to see what happens as we go forward Richard Grundy. >> prosecution we always say with the state with Commonwealth they are supposed to seek justice not just a guilty verdict even if the judge does not throw out the second degree in leaving the scene of a crime a in the murder charge in this case. Do you think the issues of justice if prosecution knows that these jurors did not believe that they across the board 12 people believe that she was not guilty of that should they sue spotty on their own should they decide to drop the second-degree charge. >> So generally let me and I've said this from the first day at opening statements with Vinny this case is over charge there was no second degree to be had here. >> I think made their job that much more. Call it distracted. The jurors you know at the end of the according to one of the jurors it was 9 p both who are ready to convict on the To second degree. >> Should have been excise that some point in time so now I think the difficulty is is that they don't want to set a precedent that. >> They you know everybody out there was a case tried Norfolk County that results in a hung jury or guilty. Round up your jurors get a handful of them to say no no that's not what we want on it and then maybe we'll get rid of that charge. There certainly is an interest of justice there we've got to also appreciate here that it if my reading is correct. There are 2 parties have heard directly from 2 part happes 3. Jurors directly. And the the other is this other the people who spoke to a juror spoke to somebody who spoke torture. >> I don't question the information that's being presented at this time. >> I'm but the process by which. >> This decision is going to be made is going to be precedent setting. >> And at a minimum I think what the courts are going to first have to do is decide. >> What >> these 12 jurors all say we had reached a firm decision ready to deliver to the court the missing he says that report to the court. The opportunity to poll the jury the opportunity for either party as each juror to be told. That they reached a conviction or this decision to quit on these 2 charges. If if we're going to find that is presenting. We are given that it's right to be allowed then we have to hear from all 12 jurors I don't think they can take the word from any 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, jurors I first decision is if those 12 agree is their meat on the bone to go word in the answer that question is yes, then we're going to talk the 12 jurors. >> So you're saying we could see something similar to what we saw in the Alec Murdock case where every single juror came into that courtroom to testify about what had been happening in these filings leading up to it. We will see there's always surprises in this trial Richard Grundy thank you so much for lending us your time. This morning sharing your insight. We know we have to say goodbye due fronts sticking around we have a lot more ahead we're talking more about the state later in the hour, but also how this week's motions hearing could tip the scales for Karen Reid still ahead we're talking about a deputy is accused of gunning down Sonia Massey claims Ian she intended dead the harm when she said the words quote I rebuke you in the name of Jesus is that defense going to work at trial will break it down plus murder charges announced against strip security officers at a hotel. They're accused of pinning down and killing a man accused the Sonya Massey Shooting Update Now for what's trending in true crime the former Illinois deputy who shot and killed Sonia Massey. >> Does he believe that when Massey said quote I rebuke you in the name of Jesus that she intended deadly harm. That's according to the deputies field report released this week. The now-fired deputy Sean Grayson said quote I interpreted this to mean she was going to kill me end quote video of the controversial shooting was captured on body camera shots were fired when Massey when to remove a pot of boiling water from the stove. >> This morning we're asking how could rebuke you sound life threatening as this officer is now claiming in his report, let's bring in our guest criminal defense attorney and former prosecutor Francois car still with us criminal defense and civil rights attorney Casey it early is joining us and domestic violence expert and former law enforcement officer cloudy King with us as well good to have you all here Casey let me start with you we could hear her saying I rebuke you in the name of Jesus. Her voice doesn't sound threatening to me your thoughts on whether or not this could sound life-threatening. >> It never sounds like and it's unfortunate because that I have you in the name of Jesus. It's not only about her view is known about it plus a Alexa dictionary but it's in the Bible that's when the board PT so even if you didn't know the terminology just breaking down that term just basic English, we view it expresses strong this approval and if you heard the conversation price. There he assumed that she was going to do something negative with that point and water. But even so even if she had made it will wreck did she have prices ability to to throw that water. There's no way that this is going to fly and it's unfortunate because when I want to get into his history as a deputy or is history the prior criminal history. But that is not only a weak I'm looking a quick and sweat. >> Guilty. >> Liking former law enforcement your thoughts on this field report from the Illinois officer. >> Absolutely ridiculous I can't even imagine that he wrote that down because in all of my training and practical exercises never was review a weapon that could have been used against us. She did not have the bility to cause any harm to him in that moment and even though we can't see when she was knelt down and he claimed he move to see if there were any weapons at that point he would have been able to see that there were no weapons and yeah burning water could hurt and it could cause damage but it's not going to be death or extreme bodily injuries. So I think this is ridiculous this guy never should have had a bad in the first place and I hope he is in prison for the rest of his life for either got to get you to where you come. >> On the fence hat in this case, a minimum added element of this room poor this is being reported by the Daily mail that he indicated that he looked down to see liquid that it hid his boots and serves steam coming from the Cabinet area, something we can't see on body camera but if this is in fact in the report and if it is in fact something that happened is that and the possibility or way that a defense attorney could use this to convince a jury that he is innocent. >> A good defense attorney who's dancing for their launch is going to possibly not go all the way to self-defense what a better argument might the is a manslaughter. Heat of the moment, he thought one thing but he was wrong. I just it's problematic for the reasons already stated to argue self-defense not guilty. Now now look now look if that's what the client wants we can argue that it's just I think a better path for this the defendant is is I didn't have the intent to kill or was it was a heat, you know heat of the moment here passion, I didn't know what she was reaching for I panicked and that's why this happened it's not a great justification to be sure but if I have to play defense attorney I have to play defense attorney. >> I appreciate you least taking that role fraud. >> The difficult one and those are watching this video are really incensed by what Hotel Workers Charged with Murder happened we're going to move now to another trending K's another case of an officer-involved incident, this one with security officers for hotel employees have now been charged with being a party to felony murder in the death. Devontae Mitchell comes more than a month. After this father's death and the demands from his family for justice of the charges were announced late yesterday after a new video from it inside the Milwaukee hotel was released you see it here showing the moments leading up to Mitchell's death but what it doesn't show is the initial in counter Mitchell's death was ruled homicide by straight and 60 and toxic effects of cocaine and methamphetamine. >> Plus I was standing there with his hands up like this play dragging him to a hallway. Putin kicking hitting a little girls. I'm good cause coming off of him punching him in the face. >> Oh it was horrible you guys showed us all all these other videos. But the main the most important one you know like. >> Where's that video and why won't they release it. >> So this morning we're asking our panel should the hotel have to release all of the video including the initial moment to the from we're gonna start again with you what do you think about whether or not this should be released to the public and whether or not it's likely in the hands of police at this point. >> I think it's probably in the hands of police I hope it's in the hands of police at the very least I don't think the hotels under any obligation to publish anything at this point. >> Although. >> It's disingenuous if you start playing some of the videos and then not all of the videos that's why I always tell clients and entity's don't play anything let someone else do that work for you because now we have a very good question where is that video that's the most important video and if there's something on that video that doesn't look good for the haute tell it's going to be really bad for the case. >> Cloudy before you get you want to play some sound from one of them and who's involved in this incident he did so seek out the bellhop there at the hotel, let's listen. >> I never struck one to Mitchell. >> And a show no act of violence whatsoever tours devontae Mitchell all idea was hailed him to do. And if and if I'm wrong for the. I mean it treat me in in the proper way that should be treated. >> A client talk about this video and the acts of these 4 different people were involved in varying ways with the pinning down of devontae Mitchell. >> The gentleman that just spoke even if he was only holding him down if he was doing that while other people were beating davante Mitchell that's not okay then he was a party to the assault and ultimately to devontae Mitchell's death. So I just don't think that's a great defeat and we really need to see that first video because without it we have no context and I don't understand if davante was doing something wrong. Why did they just get him out on the sidewalk and go back in and close a mop those doors so it doesn't make sense to me right now at all. >> Okay your especially from the position of a civil rights attorney, we know the family is represented by Ben Crump a civil rights attorney and they're seeking to get this video how do you go about getting it orange Pippin pressing on a hotel to release it to the public. >> Well this is some of the civil case obviously wants to a lawsuit is filed. They get what's called the discovery. So it will eventually be released into the proper hands, I'm not so much concerned that being released to the public. Because that's not where the final word will come down. It's a criminal matter or the civil rights matter of the bottom line just seeing that Smith, it is bad enough it doesn't matter what happened before or after its books what occurred at the hands of the employees of the hotel site you expect that there will be some liability not just for the hotel workers from the hotel itself. If they have any prior knowledge of the supply side to retain them all right. >> Negligent hiring of many things that could be on the table here Franz work hard and we have to say goodbye to you thank you for sharing your expertise this hour Claudia and Casey are sticking around we have much more on opening statements. >> Put your hands behind >> now watch this together yesterday and now the decision is in a Florida judge sentenced Brandon death of for a violent attack on a teacher's aide did the judge get it right we're going to spotlight this multi-layered case after the break. And later Kerry due back in court on Friday how Brendan Depa Sentencing >> I have 5 broken ribs and 3 of them were broken into twice. >> Put your hands behind your are. >> Every time he gets angry he doesn't assault somebody is just sometimes when he gets a previous also party. >> this >> morning we are shining a spotlight on the sentencing of Brendan death but had a lot of you talking on social media Tuesday was sentenced to 5 years in prison that will be followed by 15 years of supervised probation. Now a viral video showing his violent attack on a teacher's aide back in February of 2023. Push this team who suffers from autism a disorder. Pushed under the microscope after hearing from several witnesses the judge in this case sentence 18 year-old for that brutal assault. >> Based on the facts of this case I do find that Mister a Depo would qualify that is by age he would qualify for youthful offender, but because of the nature of the charge and how this incident actually occurred and all of the circumstances having carefully reviewed that I find that the youthful offender a sentence would not be appropriate here so we're left then with okay what do we do with regard to the Cannes. The context of criminal. >> Adult. >> Sanctioning the court sentences Mister to 16 Department of Corrections followed by 5th teen years Department of Corrections supervised probation. Now with regard to the initial the OC sentence giving him credit for his time served. When he goes to the reception center on directing that the D o C conduct of full mental health assessment. As doctor Klein indicated they would accept from that court and develop an Joel service plan with regard to all of the diagnosis that Mister Depp a has received. >> Let's discuss the fallout from the DEP a sentence with criminal defense and civil rights attorney Casey early is with us and come on defense attorney former prosecutor Shannon Archer so good to have you both here a sham let me start with you this judge decided that this was not a defendant to qualify for the youthful offender status even though he was 17 at that time and suffering from autism spec from disorder oppositional defiant disorder unspecified schizophrenia spectrum. All of that the judge agreed he was suffering from at the time open with 5 years your thoughts on this decision. >> Well I think one of the things that I focused in on was this idea that he had prior batteries or assaults in U.S. history and to the extent that he didn't deal with those when he have that and that's one factor that the sentencing court is going to take into consideration. When we look at this not only are we looking at the rehabilitation of the offender but we're also looking at the protection of the public and so for this It sounds like they are setting him up for success, the best way they can with the individual has mental health plan, but they're also protecting the public with that that term of incarceration. >> your thoughts on this decision not to go with youthful offender status. The 5 year sentence but also this 15 years of supervised probation. >> I think that the epa's hands were tied, but I would have liked it to be a youthful offender sentence because of the school found him there wasn't up in place wrap this all this incident could have been prevented and I feel like based on his numerous mental illnesses. This child be and that have a special meeting this occurred in the 17 years old he could have this could have been due to that case is tried as an adult so to put him in the adult system which is meant to punished as close as you can ask them what is next and we have built I just feel like they look at him, although they knew about his previous mental illnesses they cannot push that aside because he had numerous batteries yeah he had me for some reason because we have a plan, but no one assisted him and going through with that plan and 15 years of probation is entirely up to half of the sense that I think it was punished for having mental illness was not properly treated at the time. >> His dangerousness was something that the judge mentioned multiple times and he reference doctor. Greg Pritchard, this was the state's a psychologist, the expert who talked about his opinion about his ability to be rehabilitated let's listen back to doctor Pritchard and then the judge using that in his decision. >> Do you have an opinion as to whether or not Mister is dangerous. >> Yeah, I mean my life union is he is dangerous. I don't think that a professional can really see it any other way. Mister Depp us history and what I mean by that is. >> No it's it's just this across a chronic aggression. It's it's occurring since he was really young. You know I saw his mother said he started having the 8 years of 3 I'm not sure those aggressive behaviors but certainly when he got to school initially part of the reason he couldn't stay there is because the aggressive condo so aggression in the school initially aggression and the aggression in the community aggression the Springbrook of Russian an echo of Russia but Kansas odds, so what that tells you is that part of the this the that was. Response style this physical aggression. So in that so it's yes I believe the stage for us. >> Shannon the judge incorporated that in the finding when talking about this sentence and why you decide the way that he did. But I want to ask you about the other The cost the blame because the really weren't that many options for this judge but we have had our viewers asking about why this defendant wouldn't be placed in a mental health facility where he could get treatment and not perhaps be in the prison system. What are the options when you have this criminal offense. You have a victim and you have charges that he pleaded no contest. >> I think each state jurisdiction are different. >> About what mental health services that we provide a lot of mental health hospitals don't have the security. >> In place that would be able to protect the rest of the patients and the staff from somebody who has it aggressive tendencies to this extent so even if there is an option for mental health there would need to be that increased security to ensure that everybody is safe during the course of the treatment. I want to listen back to a particularly poignant. >> Part of testimony yesterday because the defense did put on the adoptive mother of Brandon She had him since he was 5 months old and she pleaded with the judge as to what an ulterior option could be. >> He's going to be and invites first family and he felt abandoned. Yes when I send the South Carolina. >> He struggles with autism behavioral issues. >> But other than that year. Where we had. >> Just extreme chaos for the medical stuff going on. I was able to manage friend. Because I did and I knew as traitors. His knees and his chains. Let him come home with me. I want my son back. >> What he did reach out to Brenda Perez mother she declined to talk publicly at this time she said she didn't want to make things tougher on her son at this point we're going to let you go since I want to get your reaction to this mother in court and just what can be the takeaways from a case like this. But I understand I'm a mother to of course you're going want to do everything that you can to help your children. >> But. >> War. >> Khan was someone with this level >> concern and aggression that does not put her in a good position either and that she doesn't have the capability to care for them. For him to the extent that he needs that her love can only go so far and while I understand that he needs something more than what she can provide. >> We certainly heard that through her testimony that she's had difficulty throughout managing him. Shannon, thank you so much for weighing in for us for this story we have to let you go Casey you're sticking around for tipping the scales that still ahead Karen Reid and her attorneys return to court on Friday hoping to get 2 of the charges against her dismissed what could tip the scales in her Karen Read Back in Court Friday >> And she just repeated the phrase over and over again I hit him I hypothermia Google how long it takes to die in the cold. >> Did you read show card when it I caught a couple of broken. >> I observed a damaged rear right tail light, you know Newt so far I hate that manager Liam. These injuries. Yes. >> As Karen Reid's team heads back to court on Friday there in Dedham Massachusetts we are wondering what could tip the scales in their favor. We know the defense has filed a motion to dismiss 2 of the charges the second-degree murder charge and the leaving the scene of a crime involving death or injury charge and that some jurors have come forward to say that the jury did reach unanimous verdict of not guilty on those 2 charges, here's one of Reid's attorneys David genetti talking about what comes next. ♪ >> Appealed to the highest court. He says the defense could ask the judge the trial judge at this upcoming hearing to interview the jury or to poll the jury which could mean those jurors would have to return to the courtroom and sit in the witness stand could this tip, the scales and forced the judge's hand to dismiss these charges, let's bring back in our panel here to discuss criminal defense attorney and civil rights attorney Casey early and domestic violence expert and former law enforcement officer Claudia King want to get your thoughts on where we are at this Karen Reid case week. All watch this trial. The up posing size the opposing theories about what happened. And now we're hearing jurors say they had actually come to a decision on 2 charges. What do you think judge knee is going to do when she hears those oral arguments on Friday. >> You know there's a possibility that the judge can subpoena the jurors and get them to test if I oftentimes just don't like to get involved and jury deliberations but this is an important part because yeah was unanimous vote on that early just got a child there was a holdout juror ultimately reach they reach a verdict of not guilty to have the opportunity of speaking to the warming. >> And you really get that opportunity to speak to the jurors, especially percent. You know that's usually a charge of the deliberations so I do believe that it these jurors are subpoenaed, there's a possibility that the state is not going to try however I do believe they're going to wait for the final hour to make that's going to just half an inch. >> Cloudy King your thoughts on where we are with this trial you did analysis for us throughout the Karen re trial. Did you think we would be here where we have jurors to actually say they did come to a unanimous decision. >> I definitely did not think we would be here this was not on my bingo card for but I agree with I think you know the judge has the opportunity to potentially speak with the jurors and if we're truly after justice then I think that's what she needs to do we need to figure out if that's what the jury intended. You know I agree they probably should have put that on their notes are in dictated that they had come to a decision and in some parts and not on others, but they didn't and so here we are at this the point I also think that the prosecution needs to look at potentially dropping these charges and moving forward with the lower charge because again if there after justice then they need to listen to what's being said right now now by the jurors that we've heard from. >> It's probably also going to be under scrutiny is how judge could Noni handled things there when these jurors are sending notes and then they were dismissed, let's listen back to one of those notes being read and ultimately the declaring a mistrial. >> Judge can ony despite our rigorous efforts we continue to find ourselves at an impasse. Our perspectives on the evidence of starkly divided. Some members of the jury firmly believe that the evidence surpasses the burden of proof establishing the elements of the charges beyond a reasonable doubt. Others find the evidence fails to meet this standard in does not sufficiently establish the necessary elements of the charges. The deep division is not due to a lack of effort or diligence but rather a sincere adherence to our individual principals and moral convictions. To continue to deliberate would be futile and only served to force us to compromise these deeply held beliefs. I'm not going to do that to folks your services complete and declaring a mistrial in this case will be in to see you privately in a few Thank you so much for your service. >> And with that the jury was dismissed There wasn't a lot of time for the attorneys to put anything different on the record and here's a look at this video of what was unfolding after this happened, you know David you that he had already said we need to declare a mistrial they need to be read the dynamite charge we need to move on and there was some interaction between Karen Reid and Paulo Kiev she hopes her father you see that there are those moments that this was what happened immediately after this the judge is going back to talk to the church she said it there on the record but there is a divide in terms of what prosecution wants to happen and going forward they say it was a mistrial there was no asking of a polling. The defense saying they were owed that opportunity your thoughts kaseya. >> I agree, especially when there is a mistrial just want to put everything on the record and if you were denied that opportunity. Then you know we should err on the side of the fence again that is something that in a sense. They're called the presumption of innocence. So I do believe that if the defense did not have that. >> The again this should be in. >> First for the it's important that we come back to this but again I do believe in the search of justice the prosecution to take a real hard look at their case and make that just a termination that's what I try this case again. >> I know looking at the video doesn't look like they are concerned about trying to make sure the record. >> Is preserved. >> Client key you just some final thoughts on what the state case may look like if these 2 charges are well whatever the judge decides. There's going to be a different case in front of them once they retry this case mainly because their lead investigator Michael Proctor he is now no longer lead no longer on this case moved to a different department other officers who took the stand are now under investigation. How does that impact the state's case commonwealth's case rather going forward. >> I think it impacts it very heavily because now they have long aust or have ethical issues surrounding the lead investigator and some other officers who were involved and so. The state has really got or the Commonwealth has really got a look at how they are proceed because if the murder charge is taken off then they can't talk about it in 10 they can't talk about how angry she was and she purposely hit them so it it's going to be an entirely different case and I just don't know if it's one again that they'll be able to win with all of the additional things that have surfaced since the original trial. >> So we will be a different trial. Casey early Claudia King. Thank you very much for all of your insight this hour we'll see you again real soon that's it for opening statements you can watch or share this episode just go to court TV dot com click on the show's tab up next