The finals mix is still UP IN THE AIR! Unpacking a wild Round 23 - SEN

Why are clubs where they are? David King hello welcome back G good to see you uh back in the uh back in the premises we've had to manufacture it for the last couple of weeks just to pretend that you're actually here um but o good morning I didn't think he was brave enough to play that for a second I know you've been taking lities I had to eyeball him just then to play that you got them all scared around you aren't they it's amazing you're about the only one I can't get around to be honest I'll tell you it's uh it's been different with that you good to have you back but um there's so much to talk about isn't there oh been listening with great intent to the means test which really is the best encapsulation when you're trying to follow from afar so give me a king's gamit because you can go in any direction with one round to play well everyone's either going to their own business or going to a business today and foot is no different and and there's I think when you look at the ladder you can ask the same as as as as your day-to-day issues why are we where we are what's the reason we are where we are so if you look at 18th on the letter Richmond why why are they there well they've had an shocking injury run they're down on Talent they're coming off the back of of a seriously um amazing patch of of of six or seven years so we understand why they're there and as you track up the ladder you pick your own reasons as to why you think you're clubs where they are is is it is it the talent is it the performance of that Talent is it the leaders is it is it injuries are they mitigating circumstances or is it is it coaching is it the motivation of the coaches is is it the tactics game day is it is it the strategy that's that's been embedded for 6 to 8 months through a pre-season is it the has the build gone arai um why are you where you are cuz I look at I look at some kilder at 1th and they're the one that's really sort of I'm struggling to get my head around how they finish 1th this year when you see them play the way they did on the weekend look at Collingwood who are outside looking in who have missed it now and have had probably one of the best seasons from a player for a little while in Nick Doos who's fought against the odds to try and get this team of the F so what's gone what's gone wrong is it too simplistic to say that it's injuries or is that real you know for they were all in the same sort of area and they have been banged up without the go you can make you can make the excuses but if you wrote them all down and said okay let's treat this like it's I'm running a a Milk bar right and you've got to work out why you're making money why you're losing money what are what are things that will come and go and what a deep seeded issues that you need to address cuz in 3 weeks time you're going to be making stacks of decisions and you're going to say where where are we at are we a contender so what what decisions the Freeman will make if they miss what decisions do the cartton make if they miss do they get aggressive and try and find that you know that that next player or they back to the draft are they doing a bit of both what this is this is AFL footy and this is why I think Sam Mitchell has probably been ahead of the competition he's known exactly where hathorn have been at and has made you know it's always done in site right so we're critical of him at the time but now looking back to to purge those players and put those youngsters in and challenge them to get better in a hurry has been a boom for him so now now that de is okay so you've stepped through that phase are you into this phase or are you actually into the contention F like all those sorts of um assessments take you to what October looks like and October is the most critical month for full Club not just the coach not just um oh not certainly off for the players but not not not just the strategy it's it's who have you been chasing who have you been able to land have you got us the right type I mean some clubs were lucky to miss out on some players they went after last year lucky to miss like what raler really help um Hawthorne now like they get they end up with they end up with Char they end up with you you can go through the ones that they got but the ones that they miss are just as just as impactful so I think that knowing why you are where you are and just think about your own team and why you're there is is a a fascinating discussion and what can be resolved in a short period but what's endemic and there's a few that there are endemic issues I reckon okay so some of those teams are going to feature in our categories as we work our way through I just the big issue is clearly Carlton Caravan of Courage go across the country the fascination was Carlton got it done qu a team with a critical mass of understudies reinforcements and seat fillers go and save their season seat fillers now they were aided and abetted by a shameful West Coast but they got it done the one certainly you knew Patrick Crips would lead the way but they all went with him tells you a lot about the character of a team I I'm a nod to Calton today yeah and what it would have done hadn't this happened now what's the other side of the coin look like today for Caron get on that plane come back and the airport's packed with media your season's gone to ride you here now you're here and and it it all still is there in the background because the same thing's on again this weekend so nothing's really dissipated it's still there um but but you're right sometimes you just have to have you have to know whether those players are the is Patrick Crips going to be the man when they need when you absolutely have to have it is he going to be able to deliver and he he did it so emphatically and so early it took the stress out of the game it had five in the first three minutes in the manner that she go okay that's going to be fine yeah that's changing no as long as they go with him and this is the you know we wouldn't fixate on west coast today but get beaten by what you know how about you shut down the King as a starting point well he he refused to be shut down and I guess this comes back to look we we're round 23 right we we're putting a full stop on round 23 and we've talked a lot of footy this year and how many times have we said I just don't think he's as violent as what he's been and when you see him yesterday it didn't matter whether he had players tugging on his jumper arms around wrapped around half Nelson Full Nelson what whatever they were doing to him didn't impact him he would get the ball and it' be gone or he'd get a free kick or he you know he won 21 contested possessions yesterday and all of them had a level of authority about them so it was a different sort of performance and that to me is that's where they need to be and as soon as he does that you see you see hu come with him you think okay and then Elijah Hollands plays a bit one of the better games he's played for a little while and then forward of Center it works because no one's trying to do too much or or or too little if we just blast it in Charlie and Harry will fix it up right oh we don't have them down there so we got to work the ball up a little bit so if there's a shorter option let's take it maintain possession and not just give the ball back to mcgaven all of a sudden that kick goes to 55 60 from goal and you get a high quality entry or a shorter entry there was less blast yesterday from Carlton than what I'd seen so sometimes in these sorts of games you can learn a lot and take things forward I I think they look better smaller forward of the ball that's a discussion for for vosy and his coaching crew to work out how how that could potentially look we know those two Big Boppers are coming back in because their stars but it does it does make you think what can they take for forward from from their backline look I thought weering was superb I mean we've talked a lot about these guys because they're star Factor players but he was everything to all players down back and that when you see that you go W I hope he understands and reflects on that game so well that I I can do all of this I can still beat Oscar Allen when the balls come and Oscar I got him and then you're able to play and cover for th those lesser guys around you and not be as reliant on Mitch mcgu or or an Adam sard or a a camp down back you know actually have your star control the show it was a big day for Carlton but but you know what they get about 5 minutes rest and they got to set and go again for Saints and they have to set and go with their plans now declared yeah so the opposition gets to plan more for you is the camp move early on you're going he's got no forward craft and then he worked his way into that but an opposition gets a full week to plan against that now so yeah that's the trick is to do it again but how who who get so Crips next week right this is the F this is this is the footy lover in us right already looking forward to next week to be honest we're almost footed out but we can't wait to see what the attitude and the matchups like against Crips because he he's going to be that one man wrecking ball again isn't he so is it is it a jack steel and Jack steel be thinking Jesus it's GNA be on here I'm G I'm gonna have to bring my absolute aame you know and he may need help it may may also be another half forward trading up and and trying to get it you know to 2 V1 or an extra body on him just to deny clear run there's so many tactical things are going to go in from Ross Lon but when he plays like that you just have to you're just in awe of the player yeah so there's a meeting in a week's time to determine the all Australian Captain which I imagine is between Crips and bondon Pell and Robo makes the point today is that the recency bias of that game now this is both of them do this this is their stocking trade saddle the team to the shoulder and we're not leaving this field without the four points to do it in these circumstances so late it's probably on bot now in Bat next week to answer that against the Giants see where we are Sunday settle it it could do it could do like if one makes the finals and one doesn't that looks like a good differentiator where did you lead them too so and if one's the reason they make the yeah yeah so I think your your Bone Crusher our wavely star with 200 to go here and they're they're two of the finest that we've ever seen I get a sneaky feeling how Australian crew to go with co- captains Sam Dary went five and one out of bounds last week he goes 71 yesterday Sam Darcy dismantles the Roos the Bulldogs pummeled the hapless but oh he was a an awesome figure up front Brad Johnson got to him I think said we need to chat we need to sort this out isn't it great to see a young player with less than 30 Games experienced kicking seven goals and it's not it's not just the seven because you you can get goals in many different ways in lot of lot of some are a lot easier than others six marks inside 50 three contested marks he would just he was just taking the ball to in a position that no one could compete and it does send a message to the competition hey what you know one more preseason next year this could just go bang and it just could become a phenomenon um you know that he's made of the right stuff you see the way he moves you see the way he wants to influence games and impact games and I think it's a great sign that he is mature enough to to be able to handle last week's um last week's form um so as you said last week couldn't couldn't hit the side of a bar but a 208 cmet like they just you just don't see this happen to you so his character we've seen it twice this year it was the Collingwood game where he knows he's getting suspended from the early minutes and ends up kicking the match winner and then last week usually with forwards that that weak haunts for a few you don't immediately correct that he immediately corrected it if this was a straight out head-to-head vote take fairness out of it and next Monday you had to choose between Sam Dary and Harley Reid which way would we be going for the rising star yeah can we make the Australian panel do that regardless just for the exercise just for I reckon they'll be relieved they don't have to yeah actually that's a that's a good call this is a really hard differentiation to make I look the midfielders the gap between an absolute Topline midfielder and a very good midfielder is not as big is what a gap between a dominant key forward like we're seeing what Jesse Hogan is doing we'll talk about him later the gap between what he's doing and the rest goes on the scoreboard so when these guys are the full bottle and are just are just your answer for of the ball it it changes everything like if Sam Dari can Rod shotgun with Jamar and and Aaron noton that that could just destroy a final series everyone's got one good tall Defender some have got two no one's got three no no one's got three we were going through that earlier I think I would be leaning towards Dary yeah at the moment you've never liked West Coast the worst bit is clearly the Dan Houston's hit on Izak Rankine Houston bump which is what if we had probably a handful of actions that are just so far outside the range of what happens in the game now they stand out they have met maximum punishment throughout the year and now Dan Houston is at the mercy of that given what we saw from the the ranking incident uh not that long ago is that four was offered there so this feels like plus four yeah and I think that's where we're at I think everyone knows this now that that once you see that action and you understand that he's missing footy and you can argue whether it's does five versus 6 versus 7 versus 4 actually make a difference to changing Behavior I think it does some think it doesn't because it's it's a split-second decision um that that's made he won't play again this year I think we can all agree on that um it's it's a horrible blow for Port adela's opportunity to win the Premiership this year he's one of their Beatles they only got four Beatles the three in the middle and Houston they're their best four players so they'll have to do it without Ringo um which will be which will be tough because when you look at how teams have set up against Port ad we've shown the lots of vision this year about how they've addressed Farrell and Houston off halfback and remember Carlton facing the wrong way against the grain of the game to just deny them getting handall receives from the marking player to slide past the stand rule so they are he is a strategic influence on a game of footy whether he's getting the ball or not he's he's he's someone you need to address whether it be with a tag or a team tag type approach it's a huge magnet to take off the board and it is one I feel for Ken because I feel like right now this is this has probably been his best chance to win it yeah and he's he's gonna lose one of his one of his top four players um which is which is a real shame how do you think that happens so you've been out there and there's a lot of conditioning around that not happening anymore and it's a hospital ball so it it does create that moment of pause which sets up for it to happen why do you reckon that that can still transpire yeah this is we actually debated this off a yesterday so in a bygone era you you you when those moments arose you took them yep if if I can inflict some damage and some pain on on my opponent regardless of who it is you take you took it right and that's why we had so many problems back in the day and it it was an ugly look for the game even though it was there were times where we we'd make videos about these sorts of hits you know and and Lord these players and and but that was the day that was the game right I think now it's almost it's a rarity that a player takes this opportunity we're seeing we're seeing the adjustments across the game not many are spearing in low with their head anymore not many are charging in a contest without actually making some form of assessment before they go in which is what we're asking them to do and it's it's a difficult transition I'm of the belief that Isaac Ranken was a targeted player on the weekend and when you saw players up like that you can get a couple that it's not in their nature go over and above because they see oh that's ranking I've got to I've got to make contact I think that's what's happened now that I'm not putting any responsibility on Ken or Port all that that's just footy this guy we want to we want to affect as often as we can today because he is the reason that that we won't finish top four he he could take this game off us he's such an important player and when it happened ad labor a goal up and he was a significant part of them being a goal up so yeah understand all the reasons I think that's what's happened um but he he he has to he has to handle that now and the club have to just get on with it that this is their lot Split Second decision built up on the back of we've got to stop that guy the Confluence of events is he's leaving at the end of this season he's such a critical part of the next few weeks and he's not going to play a role in any of it so do you do you think they can win it without him yes but he's a big piece to miss and when you are tuning up like you can you have to wear injury but you shouldn't be wearing something like this this is a this is a huge unforced error yeah and it has big ramifications Tom Hawkins had to live with this a couple times yeah he did it in a semifinal and missed the the preliminary final against Richmond which was a really close game and he was missed yeah but to do it this far out and you and you're going to miss the expanse of the final series that it's that's a bit of one for Port the debate for New Vision clinics New Vision clinics Keyhole laser vision Next Generation technology Colin would are going to miss the eight so what are we What do we make of Collingwood? to make of that is to to be there on Saturday during the Twilight and to feel that is that was the high point of their Premiership defense there's been nothing easy about this year for them but that was the high point and then as it turns out it's the Final Act of it sort of a bit in the Reckoning I really enjoy listening to other commentators and their their their phrasing or their wording and and and how they see the game and and I think it's um it's sort of like their own little review if you like and how they seeing the game what they're saying I I'm fascinated by Gary talking about the grind he talked about I think it was Essen heal referred to they weren't prepared to to to get involved in the grind of footy happy to play when it's on their terms and all that I think there's a little bit with Collingwood when they're three goals down they're Unstoppable because it says we' just got to attack we got to get flat out and they love that they love playing that game but when it drops back into the the the dayto day of footy the other 100 minutes of the game it's it's just a bit much they're just not really as invested as what they were I know they've been injured I know they're are aliis but I don't see the invest in in the same game so let's just talk about the 23 that are selected they can go from a 4 out of 10 sort of energy level to 10 out of 10 in the same game and you say well how does that happen and it's it's the psychology of the game this is why it's so hard to be up for for six months for the 30e season on the back of a preseason that all you've done is talk about getting to that last month of Madness and then once you've had success doing it again is hard to repeat and I it just looks it just looks tired for the 100 minutes that they are not really engaged in so they F they can play some brilliant footy they got this this little fellow that just goes mad which he did in the second quarter and has one of the best quarters we've seen for the year but they just don't do it for the other 100 minutes do you agree with that yes I do so and I think this is the lot of the Premiership winner now and there's I think there's a lot of different aspects to Callingwood season the first is that they had the shortest offseason the game has ever known they played the longest and then we brought the season forward and we jammed them in and they missed the start they weren't physically ready for the start of the season and they are paying a price for that now because any win through those early games would still have them in contention and potentially making it and then I think the other aspect which has played out so gram right we learned today is not coming back when you win it the reality changes if they' lost by half a kick to Brisbane there's no way known all of those positions within the club would have changed they would have locked in and gone right this is am men's double down on everything that we do but they want it and you go well I want to be in this position and we're going to move that person to this position so they shuffle all the chairs around to give everyone a reward and to make them happy and to give them different portfolios and the footy manager has granted extended leave which he clearly personally needs great doesn't happen if you've lost by half a kick in the Grand Final because the edge is so raw that and there's there's no critic in that that's just the reality is they tasted the air at the top of the mountain it's different after that it's good point then Dennis Pagan always said the hardest players to coach are the ones that have had success they they've got all the answers they they you can't tell them anything they already know so and and they're not those messages don't sit with you at the time but years later they do and I think there's a component in footy at the moment that it's so well tracked that you have an advantage on the competition with a mode or a method for one season only it's a one-time offer and you got to win the flag when you have it and credit to them they've done that and they everyone stealing little bits of what they've done or they're aware of what they're doing so it's you get picked apart it's hard to repeat not many win with the same game plan the second time so you got to evolve and that's I guess collingwood's lot now is this the talent group that they need to evolve with is it the system is it the health of the player or or is it or is it time for a refresh this the off season at Collingwood be fascinating yeah so they're going to stay with what they've got why are we where we are and then the most interesting part of watching that back yesterday was so the only reason they were there was because of Nick deos yes but he didn't do it in the end the who done it ran through Loy Schulz John Noble Isaac qu Darcy Cameron and Bo mccre so there was a moment in the game where you're going okay is anyone G to go with Nick deos Scot pend BR still side bottom here and then the answer in the end was yes so yeah I re can what what comes next is really hard to answer with them are those components going to return them next year with the hunger and the ferocity to pick up the chase or just to touch on your previous point there right so I reckon it's hey we need to score three goals now what are we doing and those players get excited because they've got a role in that the game's normally set up for four or five guys yep to influence but when you need three goals in five minutes everyone's aggressive and everyone can be a match winner so a porn has a major hey you can't don't worry about your man you've got to create a goal for us that that's not a that's not something they have the luxury of for the other 100 minutes so I I'd love this discussion and we could do this discussion on Collingwood for an hour um but what what they tell us in the offseason will be of absolute fascin we will do how many how many hours reckon we'll spend on what they do at the trade and draft yeah yeah um uh periods of the of the postseason are they going to be significant players there the Brisbane liines are the other side of that equation so they buy themselves a place on the pressure index Pressure on the Lions they'd won nine in a row they had the game against the Giants under control they had the game against Collingwood under control they lose both of them they've got they're there's two flaws in their DNA I reckon and that you can become obsessed about they do miss critical goals at critical times that's just part of who they are their inaccuracy and they they have this eternal struggle with teamsmanship and we've seen them try try to correct it try to cor and it doesn't always suit them they bungle chances when they're trying and and then you don't do it and they twice didn't kick the ball to Charlie Cameron in the third quarter Joe danur and lman they both end up missing their shots it was totally the wrong thing to do and they leave two goals on the table and they end up going under right at the end so they're going to in all likelihood miss the top four they certainly forfeited any chance of of home field advantage all the way through yeah I see different and and this is this is really critical right and we're talking about people's job so we going to give them bit of respect and and I said this weeks ago and and and you wear your wax people come at you if Chris Scott was coaching the talent levels of the Brisbane lines they wouldn't be fifth I'm I'm I'm signing off on that I'm guaranteeing that now that's not as I said at the time I'm not being disrespectful to Chris Fagen whilst I'm talking about his job right I'm trying to say that strategically in moments that matter and setting the game up to maximize what you've got and deny the opposition Scott does a better job so those moments that matter there's no way under a Chris Scott plan that Harris Andrews would be able to be taken out of the game as regularly as what Collingwood are able to do in the Grand Final they put Frampton on him right so these are the last five meetings between uh Harris Andrews and Collingwood he's been able to intercept the ball 5 6 8 seven and four times that's that that that that is not him right against every other team those numbers will be will be two or three times that number so they've been able to do it with Frampton reef mcginness and will Hoskin Elliott they haven't even used a premium piece and Craig McCrae says there's one component I don't have to worry about everyone says oh but we got to five you got there right you got there but you didn't get it with your Trump cards I I'm I'm big on this and then the game needs to be one and you see the Strategic sort of side of how Collingwood orchestrate the game in motion the game at speed the opportunity to score and Brisbane don't are not quite set they're not quite as they should be it's not quite the right players it's D Joyce loose when he shouldn't be loose it's it's instead of Harris Andrews or Zoro or stovich so there's there's components of it for me that come back to the coach's box now that's not just game day that's in the the instruction and the education over a 4 6 8 we block or a pre-season how should it look when we're points up how should it look when we're five points down they don't just drop into that mode for me so until they get that right they'll run a ground in a in a small margin game at the point end of the year now they got Elite Talent they can win any game they could win they could go 10 goal 10 goal 10 goal in the fin Series right and we'd say Well done but if it comes down to a close structural head-to-head matchup three minutes to go in a f I'm I'm backing the other team because I've just seen this fail too often and that's hard harsh but that's a reality um and you can say that it's accuracy that the most inaccurate them in the competition at the moment is the dogs but they seem to get through it they don't talk about it as much as what we do and what excuse makers do so they they don't kick the ball to Charlie Cameron twice and have the strolling goal so whose fault's that who is that is that meant to be a system issue is it is it a is it a is it something you stamp out during the week we we had this discussion about them at the start of the Year being selfish I think they have strived for it but they don't fundamentally they haven't changed fundamentally Jared so when when it when the opportunities arose they didn't do it so they weren it's not natural and instinctive to them I do think that the other element of what happened at the end was Macker gave away two clumsy free kicks which cost them a field position out of the middle and danaher did as well there so there's a level of of not quite being button down in those moments yeah and we all disagree on this but I think those players own that I think Oscar's last five minutes if he ends up being the all Australian rman you're going to have to excuse a bit when the game was on the line against another good BL this is the five minutes that you had and that wasn't okay um and danur plays in this sort of flighty way which sometimes is funny and probably their best player don't give that free kick away just don't so the kicking the goal is one thing but don't give that free kick away so there are 100 reasons right but and you can pick your poison you can go wherever you want to go but how many times have we seen this Jed in different forms lose lose big games or or runs of game runs of goals against in in close games yeah and then locking knels with them at the end and I reckon you can you know what's being said there so I think there's a clear path back to the Grand Final for Brisbane I'm not giving up on that home elimination final say they play jalong in a semi I just think they better than jalong and then they go to Adelaide and potentially play Port Adelaide where they won by 15 goals not that long ago so there's a path there but there is these flaws in their makeup are there at these moments and it was there again on satday sp sp and we we agree 100% on that they're better than jalong and then I look at the ladder today and jalong a fourth Y and I say well this is half the point this is the discussion how the hell are they fourth and Brisbane a fifth looking in you're not going to win four finals in a row I know I know it sounds good on the path winning four has been almost impossible for any team for 30 years so in a season that's as tight as tight getting on the road is such a such a a disadvantage they had it there it was there three four weeks ago was it was there it's not there anymore so they're going to have to do it the hard way and if they do we we're going to clap our hands and say may well done but right now they've got so many little flaws that need addressing but that's been the case in big games before David King yes the curiosity is silda Oh I Was that the real St Kilda? thought I was a curiosity for we thought coming into the year the red dog was back and we got our evidence early in that game against coling would you go right and that's s kilder that's why we think they're on the rise and we've had to live with them being 14th throughout the year you look like a bunch of mugs there and then the Red Dog after halftime on Saturday night go is that silda could that be silda and if that was s Kilda where would it put them in the scheme of things J was good one um they've probably been my my big disappointment for the year the Saints I just thought they had better Talent this year than last with the same sort of setups same coaching setups same a little bit more luck through the preseason they were healthier coming into this year than they were last remember last year they played with all that without their tall forwards for a while C was the main man cuz King wasn't there and we just thought they'd have a better year this year bit more growth and it just hasn't been the case and I can't I can't really work out why except for everyone says oh they just lack a midfielder you another boom midfielder but I think since they put Sinclair just back as a permanent halfback alongside s and Miller they've looked a better product on counter punch so on the weekend and this is my frustration with them I I don't know whether the methodical buildup play has consumed them and yes it works and you get the ball inside 50 but you can't score so you can move it and it's never been easier to move the ball Ross has told us that never been easier but but has it been easier to score no so you can get it there but if you get it there slowly you can't score so on the weekend in the first half they go through the corridor 40 times 40 disposals in the corridor I should say not 40 times 40 disposals second half 94 so that that's when they play Express like they look brilliant and again those Playmakers getting involved so if you're talking about score out of the defensive half they scored 67 points on the weekend out of the defensive half they've only had three better performances than that since 2015 in 10 years of football three better games than that they've had some pretty serious footy teams in that in that period um and if you're just specific to the to the second half it's 51 points in the second half so is that them and if if that is them then why haven't we bloody seen it and I I don't know what they're going to do with the off season because once you see this you start thinking okay well are we going to be a more aggressive team next are we going to be a Hawthorne telling us that's how we have to be or are we still going to stick with the model that is protect first be hard to play against be difficult to score against and playing 10 goals versus eight goal games now that's that's a philosophical discussion are you Sam Mitchell or are you old Ross are you 10 out of 10 are you zero where are you on the the sliding scale so we don't have the answers and we don't move the magnets so we just wait and see but I love that version of silda and if I'm a Saints fan I'm going to watch that every week and I don't care if it wins um if it's considered the winning finals method because while they're sort of growing this list that's a great way to play where do you sit and it's so well suited to their home ground yeah like that's the winning football of Marvel and that the majority of their games are there so that's the team I thought they were going to be this year yeah same we agree and saw it in the Collingwood game at the start and went right got them right n n and then it was back there on Saturday night and then what I think you know messages come through about what does it mean for Max King I think that's so interesting they they have thoughts to confront what what is the best version of them they clearly need they need currency in the door for highend talent in the Midfield and I suspect the battle scenario is going to give them that not ideal to lose him by any stretch but it gives you the Dual picks where you should be out to hit midfielders people are asking is could you package Max King up with picks and get pataka for instance is that sort of thinking at the moment what do they want to be well I I wouldn't be purging Max King necess I mean you could do that that's that's sorry there there are options right that's one of them if you thought you were going to be a better product small ball for of Center you could do that but if you get those decisions wrong the fallout's pretty severe I just wonder whether you can you can be a little bit smaller forward of the ball with Max down there and maybe mry or or someone like that replaces the loss of battle with battle you get a pick what's it going to be pick six or something so you end up with two high-end picks there's your there's your two star midfielders nail those picks which has been the problem of the Saints for years just getting those picks absolutely right you get those two picks right you get a chance in three or four years get them wrong and you stay where you are but if we're just talking about game plan I think that's the version that the that the Saints need to embrace jalong got it wrong at the worst moment they How to confront Jeremy Cameron looked like they had a game under control at halim you're spin-off to that and you've been preaching this God damn you for doing it is how to confront Jeremy Cameron J and the teams had been getting it wrong and then a team got it right yeah well battle he a good matchup for him isn't he it's it's a perfect you know like for like he can go he went everywhere with him and just just tried him you know five 10 minutes in front he still kicked a couple of goals late um and walks out of it with a reasonable looking evening but he was a non-factor really Jeremy Cameron and they they they operate off those top two or three more than more than most jalong um if if you can disarm them then you leave it to guys that are not really capable of of swinging games um that are sliding so it was a great coaching and a good a perfect matchup and I think it's a view to to going forward through a final series don't get beaten by this mismatch you know we' saw Freeman will try it and get it wrong we've seen Adelaide try it and get it wrong we've seen North Melbourne try it and get it wrong um probably the most two effective people that have got this job done have been Rory lob and Josh battle so what do you learn from those two I think that Vision the vision and the reviews of those performances will be heavily tracked um there's no perfect way to play against a a given player but Josh battle has shown another another renue all you can do in a week like this David King is go out on Unpacking Gold Coast v Melbourne the field and show that Clarity and unity of purpose and that was the way in which they played yeah and that's usually just just win go win the game of footy but I think there are ways to win a game of footy and there there are statements made in that game and I admire the leaders of the of the Melbourne footy Club I do I I I constantly talk about Max gor and the next three or four um being out to FR and they've all had their challenges this year but to see what Max Gorn and Jack FY did as a Twan war against against that Midfield of the Suns they just destroyed them they ripped their soul out Jared gor was everything for them in the rck and it was a good really good battle with wits because wits is a serious a serious Ruckman right in the competition he's a big boy he kicked a couple of goals he tackled Max for one and he grabbed one out of the ra out of the rock um so he he was he played a reasonable game but outside of those two moments if you look at scores from from clearances which is where we always go so this is just Von and gone Rivers did a little bit but this is Von and gone against mty ra who's been the hardest head in football for for 8 months um Anderson Miller these guys they scored 75 points from stoppage and there's only been two better results two better games than that for Melbourne in their last four years and they've been in the Premiership mode in those four years they've been a serious footy team that's had Oliver and Petra in there as well so without those guys these two were able to go and do it against a pretty good clearance team so let's not talk the Suns down they were poor matter of fact they were awful in the in their want to work and and vany was creative and proactive post um post clearances more often than not and challenge ra to defend him which he failed on challenge Miller to defend him which we all say he's been the best two-way runner in the game where you know what he's got lot he's got some work to do the review for toke Miller will be pretty poor today um there was a moment which St Britton highlighted in the in the call which was terrific where Noah Anderson had a chance to just lay a block for one of his teammates to continue to carry the ball further down the ground and give a high quality inside 50 entry and rather than take the physical punishment of the block he allowed that player to step around him that player ran down and impacted the kick going inside 50 now it's a small moment but it's a window into the psychology of the Suns that I'm not really prepared to take the the physical trauma to allow you some some time I'm not I'm I'm okay if it happens but I'm not really going out of my way to do it and that that to me was a moment that summed up their year when things are going okay we're all in we're all with you we're all rolling we're downhill skiing we play at home we we we're happy to do all this up here but when really I need to absolutely do it for you I'm going to weigh it up sometimes I might sometimes I might not and that that's one of your leaders that's no randerson I I think Damian hary could be lied with that and I I guarantee if they showed three edits for the whole review that'll be one of them so they got a lot of work to do and they're another one like ilda who've who've promised so much you know and have so much to work with the sons and haven't delivered and I think that's that that the weekend um was so whilst being so good for Melbourne was so bad for the Suns did gor lock in all Australian honors fog fog thinks he has over the past two weeks playing on one leag yeah it's a good call um we've talked a lot about Tristan Sherry who who's been very good Big O didn't have his best weekend but Max is Max I mean he's just such a an impactful toall he just does it all and um yeah I love hearing him speak Melbourne fans are are frustrated at the moment and I can understand that with Petra and and what's happened with Oliver and what's happened to their footy Club that's bought him so much joy in the last few years they're frustrated that this season's been the the way it has but I think they're thrilled that Max is still there having him resign and lead the way he does um all credit to you PFI the Giants so I just when we were together on Wednesday Jesse Hogan & the Giants night you told me that Jesse Hogan's Wayne KY there you go you laughed at me Jessie I no I think Jesse stop laughing at me on a Wednesday please you were I've had a feeling you were telling me and this is why it won't work but you go I think Jesse Hogan's Wayne car could he what he's doing right now could he carry it through a final Series and win it as the command Landing forward presence that's so rare in a final Series so when we spoke on Wednesday we said we haven't seen a team Channel everything into one guy so the coach's box sets everything up for him they block they instruct the the rest of the forwards to clear out to block for him to let him get the M mismatch that that he's chasing to to let him let him maneuver around so that he can orchestrate the matchup which is frightening how he gets away with this and then when we go forward of Center and we drive it in it's EX exclusively going to him there is no other Target in there so you look at and you think okay GE that's a risk isn't that like what happens if he loses form but he doesn't lose form his contested marking has become such a feature and his his aerial work if he doesn't Mark it it's a soft drop so those Smalls up there are going to town on the soft drop it's the most dangerous ball in the game the soft drop because those Smalls are ready to crumb and Defenders are always chasing tail and they got to get everything right to deny that opportunity he he is he is a Colossus at the moment six goals four he only took three marks inside 50 he only took three took one of them I reckon 30 seconds into the game so it's not it's not one way that he's getting you I thought Freeman's planning was was awful for this game awful they've allowed the biggest weapon out there if we can skim the game across 18 teams and present that on Wednesday night what the hell are they doing what what are they tracking they got fleeced by a guy that is a known product that's been able to do this mismatch thing for a few weeks and even if you even if you're not getting caught up in the mismatch and it's just you've just got one player you want to lock on him just just see it through it was gone the first center bounce Hogan walked out of the C the goal square and got a mismatch 10 seconds into the game I scratched my head I'm thinking well that's that's bizarre cuz I didn't see the game last I'd to go and watch it on on review I just couldn't believe it but to stick with the Giants for a minute they're the number one pressuring team in the competition right that's an asset I think they can take them a long way so they put you into into trouble and and Under Pressure immediately they put you into uh into a turn over game and I don't think their ball movement is as fluent as what it's been over the journey I don't necessarily think their back sixes are as good as what they've been over the journey um they've been in better form but their pressure is keeping them games and winning them games of football they haven't lost their head-to-head pressure battle for seven weeks um so if you play the Giants expect heat expect that real confrontation that's finals footy this is why their game travels they're the best traveling team in the comp in in in finals as well over the last couple of years this is why because they're difficult to play against um but to be specific on everyone's going to talk about the game of Brent Daniels Jeremy call him Wayne Hogan let's just call him Wayne Hogan from H in Wayne Hogan could be the man of the final series and we haven't had a big man do this for a while yeah yeah they've got PFI every which way I look at it all right we'll bring it home with the Wayne Hogan or Jesse Cary probably Jesse Cary let's go with does quite sound right it doesn't see right does it interesting what to do Seedings with the seatings what do you want to do it four w i I've I've CH I've scribbled and crossed the have three teams here I'm I'm putting Brisbane at four on Blind Faith that the uh the talent will get rolling and that that then the last couple of weeks will sting what are you thinking you haven't done you haven't done them for three weeks properly come on I haven't I've got Sydney at 4 at four yeah just they're in hold mode so I don't take a whole lot at face value at the moment they've been waiting for the finals forever and they're still waiting what what will their approach be to this week I want to see Thursday night selections I don't want to see Warner in the team Heeney in the team papy won't be there I'd be resting Grundy I I wouldn't take any risks no contact injuries this week from Sydney three I'm going with the dogs but it's a bit like the hoam handicap this week I could put money on the dogs at 12s and they could lose this week and you lose your money before the finals even start get they didn't even qualify yeah they didn't qualify for the Melbourne cup um but they are the number one profile in the comp right now y I got the Giants at three Giants love what they're doing building ominously I got Giants at two I think they're playing great footy uh they know they know their product they they're in such good form such they're in unison at the moment I love what they're doing forward the ball and the Midfield getting better I've got the Bulldogs at two so same risk but I think they footy over a couple of months now it's hard to go past and one I'm sticking with the swans given what we've seen from the the Midfield spiking Heeney spiking last couple of weeks six votes Jared he might be he might the asteris might be back in he he will have receded from View and then just gone straight back up going to have to put up with Cory mcc's tweaks all night Brown night I've still got Thorn at one the Hawks they're playing the best footy they date back to May so and I so enjoyed that the first 25 minutes of what they they just don't disappoint no so come in watch the the Alien Invasion movie and just go what a great opening 25 minutes I've let myself down with now hwks highly provisional