Francisco Lindor & Sean Manaea Lead the Mets To A Successful Roadtrip

e [Music] [Music] this is a Willet Point Shea Stadium bound 7 Express train the next and last stop is Willet Point sha St oh yes it is the subway to shet podcast Anthony Rivera here with you talking about all the news and happening surrounding that team from Queens the New York Mets it's episode 158 live from the subway to Shay studios in my office make sure to follow the subway to Shay podcast on X Instagram and Tik Tok at Subway to Shay you can follow me at ant Rivera 86 onx and please make sure you're subscribing to the subway to shape podcast not only on YouTube but if you want to listen to it on Apple podcast and Spotify rate the Sho rate the show give me some reviews helps out with the algorithm for people coming and joining in and we got 29 people already in this room joining us leave your comments leave your questions I got Brad in here Daron Rivera Carlos Ortiz shout out to all you guys my guy top buunk sports is in here Jeff Cohen Douglas barns hello everyone welcome to the subway to shet podcast and look the last time I spoke to all of you we were getting set and getting ready to head to San Diego right after Jesse Winker big game-winning home run and uh look I I gotta say uh going seven and three could have been better right could have went nine and one if it wasn't for a couple blown saves but we can't look to the past they went seven and three had a winning home stand and that's what's important here to join me to recap that talk about all the news that's coming out of the Mets preview the Boston series is a good friend not only to me but to the subway to shap podcast my guy Mike Silva host of The Talking Mets podcast now that's talking Mets with no G and you can follow him on X talk andms no Mike it's been a while my friend I know I I always love coming on you're one of the few that I get to see my mug on uh so I had to make sure I comb my hair I actually the reason with five minutes late is I had to go get a cup of coffee for my Carrick and Anthony had to delay the show so if you're angry about me you know five minutes late I was finish up recording talking Mets and I had barely enough time to you know take care of the dogs real quick and get a cup of coffee so I'm the reason why we're five minutes late so welcome in uh thank you for having me not welcome in I'm on the other side of the mic this time thanks for of course yeah and you know we talked I was like the last time that we talked with each other on like obviously I've been on your show a couple times during the season but the last time you Subway to Shay was right at the beginning of the season the Mets had started off one and six on the season and you know there's been so many ups and downs this roller coaster ride that this team has put us on this entire season the good the bad the ugly and right now sitting a game and a half we don't know the end result of Phillies and uh the Braves because that game is in progress at the moment so you won't hear that if you're listening to the podcast tomorrow you won't hear that part but we will keep our eye on that see what's going on and we'll get into the standings a little later on but Mike what a turnaround uh for this team and and we'll recap this series but from be from the beginning of when we talked last to now uh you gotta kind of be happy with where this team's at a team coming in with no expectations right there was no thought of of them winning a division possibly getting a wild card spot and when they started off off it was a rough and Rocky start they had that awful May where we were thinking will they be sellers at the trade deadline that's been a a turnaround for this entire team absolutely and I was talking about this earlier on in my show when you look at the math of where the Mets are and where they need to go it's truly been multiple Seasons within a season forget about may they you know we we saw the 1962 Mets in front of us in Chicago this weekend the Mets in May played like the 62 Mets and we've seen that before last year in June they played like the 62 Mets uh a couple of times during the Mickey Callaway era they had months where they played like the 62 Mets so we saw that but for an 81 game span which is May 29 till now this was on X this morning they're 50 and 31 they're on 100 win Pace every bit the team of the 2022 team and then you look at August and they finish 15 and 13 which is essentially you know people go ah 15 and 13 if you do that over the course of a season you're on Pace for about 91 wins so um you know even with the blown saves on the road trip they were winning about four out of every seven games which is good for about on average you know a 92 win pace so this team ranges out where realistically I think we all felt if they got moderate contributions from the the guys they signed the man the sabrinos ETC they'd be an 85 win team 83 win team I think that's the floor now the question is can they go on a run like Arizona like uh San Diego and and get themselves in that 88 maybe 90 that's maybe stretching it a little bit and so far they haven't because of walks and home runs out of the bullpen or you know they'll get a stinker of a performance from a starter or the offense doesn't show up there's always one component the bullpen has been the biggest culprit so the question I guess in September is which Mets team will we see the 92 plus win version the one that plays more towards 500 I think they need to be at the 92 plus version I think they need to go 15 well they got 25 games left I think they got to go like 15 and 10 I think 17 and8 is asking a lot of this ball Club a lot if they do that they'll be in the postseason maybe not by a lot but they win 90 games they'll be in the postseason I don't see that happening you know you look outside uh outside the line when you say 15 and 13 in August with a team that's trying to get into the postseason you think you know what that's just not good enough right but you look at their schedule and I I get it they played the A's they played the Angels they downplayed to them but you remember August started off with that quirky road trip where they had to go to Los Angeles come back to St Louis go back to Colorado sure and then come back home oh no go to Seattle after that I'm sorry Colorado Seattle and then come back home and then they have this road trip on the west coast which we all hate we all hate going to the West Coast trips and those are always a struggle especially when you're playing you know the Padres but this team has somehow been able to you know stay into themselves and not let and let's be honest they have had some massive losses this season losses that would have broken so many teams and the fact that Carlos Mendoza who's uh slowly becoming one of my favorite managers since maybe Bobby Valentine um how he has kept this team composed and gets them to turn the page so quickly I mean they could have lost and and got swept in Arizona if it you know off off of that Monday game that they should have really won right and then you look at the game on uh the the second game of the series where Diaz comes back and blows it again another game where they could have lost and and even lost to the white socks but somehow Mendoza keeps them focused and keeps their eyes you know on the prize in trying to get into this postseason yeah I think it helps having uh good veterans like El glacius Lindor which I know will talk about uh JD Martinez uh guys like that that you know it's about moving on and Brandon nimal put him in there I think it was Howard Johnson was talking about on X how players look at gut punching losses a little differently they dissect what they did wrong and move forward and it's not because they don't care because they almost have to be robotic about things but I agree with you that Diaz blown Save which I had fallen asleep for all truth be told guys I saw it on replay the next morning and it was as agitating on replay as it was I'm sure for those who stayed up and watched it live had all sorts of losing streak written all over all sorts of losing streak and you got David Peterson who we're not so sure who he is the next day not only does he go out and give you what seven Innings or six and change in front of me big double play with Runners the corners and one out uh they scratch out a run in the ninth inning Diaz comes back the next day this is the same day not that he's reading my stuff over at talking Mets beyond the mic the substack subscription where I said hey I don't know if he's a champion should closer I still have those doubts and he's gonna have to dispel that because we've seen every bit the 2019 Diaz uh this season for spurts I mean what he did in May that's 2019 Diaz what he's done this road Pass road trip a lot of 2019 Diaz but he's rebounded to be uh uh 2022 Diaz right after which is interesting so um yeah I I I think there's a tremendous amount of character this team has shown and it's going to come down to where I think they have better players than we we've all given them credit for but it's that it factor in the Mets Mojo versus cold hard Logic the Braves have really good starting pitching Ken rosenfall talked about it during the broadcast yesterday they believe if they get into the postseason with their three starters if healthy s freed and Lopez they could beat anybody I agree the postseason a tournament good pitching good defense a really good closer which they have I think anybody could be beaten that's why I think the Mets are a dangerous team of the postseason I'm not saying they're gonna go to the World Series but with the way Mani is pitching srino is a little bit shaky but he could give you enough I'm not ready to anoint Peterson I don't know what his role would be in the postseason and whether Singa would be available or I'm sure they would probably lean on kintana over him but they're got the formula you could go back to our show from early April starters getting into the sixth inning you got six you know six to eight outs bridge to Diaz that bridge has evolved since April yes is it any better I like Nunes to be healthy and be part of it he's not but it's not bad Garrett seems coming along maton maton has been I mean outstanding Sterns talked about bullpens being fungible he went out and everybody talked about the deadline his deadline was week week or two earlier with stanic and maton stanik hasn't been great but mayon's been lights out and uh he saw something uh the way he was pitching and the Rays wanted to dump salary so you know it's Mets Mojo versus Braves pitching it'll be fun um I think you know I know the fans don't want to hear this and it won't be acceptable with their payroll not to make the postseason but if they walk away from this season 86 87 wins with everything that was in front of them with this supposed to be in a reboot year with the Spectre of Cohen maybe going after stto and burns and taking a good bones roster and bringing in big free agent acquisitions like he did a couple of years earlier with verander and then the year before with Sherer then you know next year looks all that much Rosier and brighter and uh the doom and GL from a year ago when they fired Buck on the last day of the Season uh you know goes away personally I think they would have done this last year if they kept the team together I'm not going to question them tearing it apart but um the bar for the wild card is is low and look 15 and 13 every month any kind of team with you know somewhat decent players should be able to do that and be a wild card Contender look at the Cubs de bar now they're back in it you know you look at the postseason now and it's kind of been turned on it side because you know all these teams have an opportunity not only to make the postseason but anything can happen in the postseason it's more like the Wild Wild West in hockey you watch the hockey playoffs any team has the opportunity to win uh the Stanley Cup it's kind of turning into like that in baseball you talk about the comeback that the Mets had shout out to the chat we got 108 people in the room right now shout out to all you people Yuki Matsui saying the M the Mets bounc back like tyr own Taylor Spider-Man catch Jeff Cohen saying whether they make the postseason or not the team showed fight after tough defeats and we kept our interest all season and I like to go back to Carlos Mendoza because look at some of the tough defeats that they had in 2021 uh you even go back to some of them they had in 2022 at the end of the season you talk about uh 2023 under buck and the other one was under Luis roas in 2021 the Mendoza's just so it's different I mean I ever since I heard him speak in in spring training I I liked him I thought he got off to the rough start I I don't know if everyone was prepared coming into the season it felt like extended spring training for a lot of those guys uh when they got off to that one and six start at home right but he has been able to like I said I don't know what it is is it they they have latched on to him because you remember Francisco Lindor was very disappointed when they let go of buck they were so yeah they were tight and and Carlos Mendoza had to win them over Y and I feel like he did that in Spades and it's a whole totally different team they're they're they're one unit now whereas in the past it didn't look like they were playing for each other it's totally different uh look Mendoza he's not a guy that gets a big profile because he's just going out there and he's you know I hate to use the term baseball lifer because to me lifer is like you know you've been in a chair for like all these years and you know you uh you just exist you know I think I think he's better than that right yeah uh but he's gone out there and he's done the things he's he's got the clubhouse behind him he's managed up with Sterns they have a partnership they have a trust it seems like in each other uh I don't think Sterns would have necessarily had that with buck and buck was not a long-term solution I think the vision there was bring buck in see if he could uh develop somebody on his staff like an Eric Chavez and maybe have that succession plan Mendoza has interviewed well in the past you know he has a New York pedigree he sat right next to Aaron Boone he saw what this town is all about he saw the es and flows of his season the Yankees have had all those kind of es and flows during his tenure an are still having it and uh I'm sure he's partnered with the the best players on the team because clearly they're out there playing for him I think it's helped that he's had those veterans I you know that that makes the transition that much easier and uh look his ex's and O's which I know there's been some questions about there's nothing that he's done so egregious that bothers me you want to say not bringing in Diaz in the eighth inning not pitching Diaz at a Yankee Stadium when I was like why can't he pitch back-to-back days now you know he's pitched four out of five days he's not he's not gonna win those he's not gonna the ex and O's of the bullpen because if you remember I I remember a lot of people on X were saying oh man why didn't they bring him in early to get the F four out save then they do it in San Diego he blows it why did they bring him in too early so there's a lot of things we have to understand they have a lot of information that we don't we don't know who's who who got hot and doesn't feel good the following day you don't know what metrics they're playing against that particular team that particular player they game plan this thing out you know there is a certain amount of going with your gut I mean I don't believe the manager in the front office could script the game perfectly you know doing 3,000 simulations before 7 o'clock and know every iteration of what they should do there's a certain amount of eyes you know like looking at canani yesterday saying can he get through five you know looking at you know pushing a Manaya um like they did in Arizona and they did a little bit today you know when he was starting to to bend but not break you know those are gut and those are are decisions made in a way that you and I don't have that information we just have logic in front of us which are numbers and and our belief of what things should be so there's I've never felt x's and are are the big determiner of a manager I think how he handles his Clubhouse how he manages up and then how he presents the organization to the media I don't think he's actually he's kind of been non- discreet like I don't hear the media get mad at him they don't they don't go after him they don't they they give him some praise but not a lot I think he's winning over some of the veteran beat guys the Harpers and the Shermans of the world uh I wonder if his Yankee background gives him somewhat of a a not a pass but like like it gives them some some credibility because of that yeah think been here which was smart I don't know if that came into play with their decision- making but all I've asked pretty much since uh Jerry Manuel was fired and they went out on their search for uh you know when Sandy Alderson took overs can you find a younger is manager that can grow with the organization and be their solution for seven to 10 years like a DAV Johnson to a certain degree Bobby Valentine was around a while Mets haven't really had a lot of that in their history and they need that who's there Ron Gard who's there Dusty Baker when Dusty was with San Francisco who's there you know laugh about Aaron Boone he's been there a long time laugh about Joe gerardi he was there a long time laugh about Joe Tori and how you you know this and that he was there a long time Mets don't have that and this idea of higher fire it's bad for an organization it's bad for a culture now they're starting to set the foundation if they could do that and get in the tournament and make some noise which I really think them just making the playoffs I know this is you know with their payroll and it's not just about making the playoffs it's about winning but getting into that tournament making noise whether they advance or not is a huge success compared to where they were when we came on first week of the season with all the negativity at City Field fast forward six seven weeks later where they were at Memorial Day a total mess I mean I was talking about hey it's not going to work everything was on the table trading Lindor trading nmo trading Pete ripping it apart I was even open at that point to a rebuild I've never talked like that before I listened to Lindor in Cleveland it sounded like he was making googly eyes at his old team what you don't want to be here he misses winning and everything since the 29th of May they're 100 win team like 20122 it's amazing you got to give Sterns credit for remaking the roster in certain parts uh sticking to his convictions on guys Mendoza for what he's done and then obviously the leadership of those guys because let's face it Anthony other than Lindor who's having a career year manah that's it right maybe Mania nobody nimo's not alonso's not McNeil's not I mean he's good in the second half he's come back down to earth a little bit too and of course he is JD Martinez is showing a decline I don't know if it's because of his back Mark ventos maybe yeah he's been a big benefactor team got some big hits and without him they're nowhere near where they where they are I mean batty can't we don't know what batty is baty can't do it so you know they've done this where I can't turn around and say like 2022 nmo career Year Pete career year Lind Lindor at that time career year Diaz career year you know still have deg Gro pitching like uh Playstation deg Gro they don't have any of that this year I mean you want to say Vientos adding the offensive component that has been missing that even Eduardo Escobar didn't have third base I'll buy it you know Todd Frasier didn't do it you know met had kind of a revolving door there you want to say maniah now pitching like Chris S since he dropped his arm angle down uh Late July yeah I could say but other than that it's been the Lindor show and he was horrible for two months it's not like from day one to now they've had jayen Brunson having a career Year from the start to finish they don't they haven't had that they've had this and they've been able to I mean geeez if they had won those two games I know that that's not you know healthy to talk about that if they won those two games to go and one on this trip could you imagine where they'd be right now they'd be in the playoffs and I think we'd feel even better about them but um I think that's what's holding us back every time they get on a roll something happens and their limitations in their wart show and that's walks and home runs out of the bullpen or one aspect of their uh uh of their team completely not showing up that game showing inconsistency basically theater theater forever says Mendoza has been steady and will go with gut feeling over an analytics I think he's a he's a little bit of both I think he is trying I don't think he's a puppet I don't think he's I don't think he's gab kapler I don't get that impression you could see the wheels turning when he's talking to Hefner yeah in The Dugout um he believes in his guys he's very you know what I like about him in the post game just talks baseball yeah it's no like you know spin like he's on Meet the Press or goofy platitudes you know that's what got Mickey Callaway in trouble with Goofy platitudes he had a lot of that Jeff torbor on him buck got credibility because of his standing in the game but Buck used a lot of diversionary humor to disarm the press and I think that because of his standing in the game they weren't going to go after him but there were times i' be like Buck you got to expand on that um but that you know that's a style that some people use that works I mean bich used rudess you know for how long uh there's different methods to deal with the media and buck used this I think Mendoza just answers the questions yeah it's a stupid question he just answers it like well this you know matter of fact it was almost like when they asked him after the Seattle series what are you gonna do now he's like well I'm gonna get on a plane go home and we're gonna try to win tomorrow like what do you want me to do fly the plane off into the Pacific and you know commit you know Harry KY here come on you know like that's just silly so yeah you talked about the um credibility that came over with him from the Yankees organization which was you know under Boon I mean they've been in the playoffs every season something we want you know 100% of the time we take that and the fact that no one has heard him speak beforehand that's what got people worried but once you hear him talk like you said uh he seems like a a natural and I think we we see this collaboration uh that that has been missing right like you didn't all the worms came out between Billy Epler and Bug sha Walter uh after they were both let go you see this collaboration between David Sterns and uh Carlos Mendoza to a fact that they are not hesitant to make moves if they feel it's right and it's the time like Dominic Leon is not on this team more than a week whereas last year they had to drag him out for an entire season evaluations were bad right they were looking at you know he took some of the option ability of of relievers into heart where he's like all right you could have an optionable optionable reliever that's no good at that point um the money I mean again it's not just having the highest payroll the fact that they can walk away from Dean they couldn't do that during the wipin years no W years they uh Mone bringing Hower uh Hower you know I forgot about Hower and I was shocked that H because I thought Hower long man you know being able to get some out I think he got those final outs in the Yankee Stadium Subway Series yeah he hasn't landed anywhere right where I mean I don't know if he's I think he did he signed with the Braves some team just picked him up I I read it this morning up I'll I'll look at some team picked him up but with a guy like Hower with a guy like deakmann you're looking at Jose budo buried in the for an entire year yeah the Orioles got signed into Orioles yeah I mean good for them you know I don't think he's but yeah they they dumped on Hower um they they're not afraid to remake the roster in any way shape or form he was very patient you know I in June you know he could easily started to see what he could sell people off on yeah um you know maybe say let me see if I could jump in on this and he let the thing develop and he had a belief in that but I agree uh Harmon this is the first time probably since 2015 10 years where there hasn't been turmoil in the organization Terry khin's got fired Mickey Callaway and then they fired you know obviously Sandy Alderson got sick and they had the three GMS and then they brought you know Beltran and then Brody and what Brody was trying to do which basically used his agency skills to uh find creative ways to get people within the structure of financial chaos and then Co and Cohen's on board and Cohen's not on board and Cohen comes in and then his guys get fired right away because of off the field stuff and look uh Zack Scott think you know unfortunate situation I've listened to him on on his podcast that you know probably he shouldn't have been fired you know there was more to that story than was told and the cops don't look good when you really dive into uh what happened there and but sometimes that's fate you know it was all meant for Sterns to come here he wasn't a guy you could get four years ago but now the exciting part is whatever happens this season going to the off season there's stability you and I won't be talking about another new manager or you know Sterns having to go out uh he's he's been fired and have they have to go do a search again for somebody he might not even bring in a GM you know he might just be the guy for a while it sounds like so and the you know they got their business side it sounds like he's now started to clean up the organization he's fired a number of Scouts I I know that bothers a lot of people I've heard some bad things about that move and I am not an anti- Scout guy at all but if you're going to hand the keys of the organization to Sterns you gotta just sit back and say okay this is his ball game this is his show we don't know as much as he does after five years or some point within the fiveyear span of his contract I guess we'll know whether it works or not yeah and if it's not working in a couple of years uh as you get to years four and five of the contract then we'll talk about what they do then I suspect we won't be in that situation and Cohen to me is a guy that I think is going to stay loyal to his people if he believes that they're following a process that ultimately will lead to an outcome I don't think he's going to get crazy about variability within what he's learned as a wacky baseball world yeah and you know you look at what Sterns did with those Scouts you know I honestly I don't even have a problem with it because this team has I'll say drafted well but when it comes to developing these players it just not has not worked out to where it should have should be right I mean we're still still in the I guess the Brett batty uh Vientos Alvarez phase yeah and right now the best of the three it's got to be Mark ventos right now and I love Fran show you you don't know what guys project to be till they till they play it out I remember people telling me how bad Michael conforto was going to be in the Outfield and he wasn't he wasn't a bad outfielder at all had a good arm and we heard about how Alvarez never learn how to catch meanwhile Hall of Famer and Max Sherer applauded him at the start and that's what's kept him in the big leagues and and and I talk a little bit about this on tonight's show I mean there is a pathway where you could say torren deserves especially after what you saw him do today again with the arm I mean the catching game has really become the arm now because of the the rules on stolen bases and you know Alvarez can't hit a curve ball can't H an off speed pitch no one's going to throw him fast balls unless it's three and0 like Sir Anthony Dominguez and you saw what happened there and uh you know he's not he's not developed into the player that we thought he was going to be Brett batty looks like a 4A player now he's injured you're not g even know how to evaluate him yeah Vientos uh although I don't think he's a good third baseman I think he's passable I'd say serviceable right you know passable yeah do I think you need to bring him a defensive replacement in uh I I certainly think glacius at third is a better option uh do I think his is his Futures at first if pet lonzo's not here that's a possibility but I don't think could replace JD Martinez yeah I don't even know if that's fair I mean you know if he does unlike JD who can't play any position at least you know you could put the guy in the field y you know you can play two positions so um yeah the development hasn't been good the development on the pitching side still is a work in progress look at Scott being hurt Nunes being hurt um you know I don't know if that has something to do with the development or what the repertoire is you know I'm questioning you know the walks and the and the and and are they now falling into the same trap that a lot of the teams have where it's about spin rate and stuff over command I don't agree with that I can't say that's the case because um Hefner has been here where they've had some very good staffs like 2022 that didn't walk a lot of guys but they are very Drive Line Centric over the last couple of years so you remember the director of pitching development is from drive line so that that's a drive line thing um I don't know I mean it could be I mean I'll tell you the one thing about this team that's amazing is the way at which they're walking hitters which is not far off from Chicago that they played this weekend they're one they're I think they are right behind Chicago they're the worst in the National League but Chicago's worst in all the you told me Anthony on April 1st or March 31st whenever the first game was that that's where they'd be pitching step wise I would tell you they're a second division Club no doubt I would have put money down that not only are they a second division Club I would say Anthony they're gonna lose 95 ball games yeah the walks have been outrageous and I everyone on in this chat everyone who listens to or watches Subway to Shay knows that I am not a fan of Jeremy Hefner I think he has lasted way too long through multiple regimes here and outside of 2022 with veteran pitchers let's be honest you got Basset deg Gro uh all these veterans huddling in a corner talking with themselves about how to fix them each other cof yeah the cof I don't know how much yeah I don't know how much credit to give him for that but you know if if they're going through a process where they're going to keep him it is what it is but he's got to work on this team with the walks it has to be fixed they can't be the worst like the worst team not only in the National League but to be behind the Chicago White Sox who are possibly the worst team since the 1962 Mets you can't have that somehow that has to be fixed and I I don't know how they do it whether it's getting better pitchers in here or what but uh that that's something that has to be fixed um it' be interesting to get his uh philosophy on on that I mean there's also aspirations of him going into the front office so I think they see him potentially in a larger role than maybe what he is now it's hard for me to say I mean he's well respected well regarded he'll get a job if he got fired it will be interesting to see how things play out what Sterns does uh after the year is out I just want to wrap up the conversation about Mendoza Carlos R was saying for Mendoza's first season he has exceeded expectations in his opinion still has a lot to learn specifically in-game situations and having a consistent lineup but he is well on his way to be a good manager and I've talked to Carlos offline about the consistent lineups and stuff and I said I haven't seen a consistent lineup like one that we would see maybe for like a full month probably since that 20067 team and like those guys knew their places in the lineup and knew how to produce funny the game has changed so much I mean you go back and you know I I play stratomatic baseball I love it you know and I'm in a league with the 77 season I drafted a team I draft my team I set my lineup I use analytics to help set the lineup and that's it now granted I'm playing a different ball I'm not getting daily metrics that say you know against this pitcher you know pet Alonzo batting second would be better I don't exactly know how they're making a lineup in terms of how they play analytics but I agree you know the 86 Mets you could recite their lineup by heart the 76 Reds The Big Red Machine those who kep fouled that team 77 Yankees they could recite that lineup by heart maybe there's some platooning in the 69 Mets lineup but you could recite that lineup by heart now I mean other than the fact well and part of it has been the restructuring of Lindor in the leadoff spot which we did not inti and I think that's a larger conversation about what is Brandon nmo going forward in the off season because I see him still as a leadoff guy but now that Lindor has done what he's done I I think it's gonna be hard to take him out yeah you know that's part of it so maybe now with how they've evolved because you've had the season within the season within the season that we talked about earlier with the different uh type of Mets teams that we've experienced since April maybe it'll stabilize but I think the day of modern analytics they put in numbers and say all right this is where a guy should hit um other than the fact that right now I think Alvarez and Bader should be at the bottom of the lineup Lindor and nmo and Alonzo and JD Martinez should be at the top of the lineup and then Jeff mcneel is somewhere in between uh with Marte and so on and so forth I want to recap this series with you uh this actually this entire road trip because uh you look at from the start San Diego for four games Arizona for three two teams ahead of the Mets in the Wild Card Standings then you go to Chicago uh it was expected for the Mets to sweep Chicago there was no excuse for them not to there was more pressure on this series than the other two I there there there was because the Mets have really played up to good teams and play down to today was a perfect example I I said this game is built for agitation built crochet I knew was going to be tough and he was I knew he wouldn't pitch deep but I say look he's going to shut them down for four Innings now you get into the M middle of the game with a you know down one up one tide ju and Saturday night I mean how many people would thinking look I know the white socks stink but Ben atend is a pro hitter even though he's having a down year it all go it's like an NBA game in the final two minutes I don't care how bad the opposition is anybody can hit a big jump shot late yeah NFL tie game last two minutes Anthony hockey last two minutes doesn't matter if they're bad they're not bad anymore they're pro team and you know maybe they can't do certain things so you saw this series I was waiting and it didn't happen which maybe that's part of the mindset changing with Mets fans and how it is yeah I mean look they they split the series in San Diego 22 and look they you know it's it's really hard to win a four game series and the Mets have played so many four game Ser I think they've played more four game Series this year than I can remember but most of them have been schedule is gonna bring that out I think yeah yeah most of them have been split uh they take two out of three from Arizona when they probably could have lost that series as well and they sweep Chicago here uh you know what are some of your takeaways from this road trip I know for me um Jose BH kind of seems to be a little more human now right than he was about you know two or three weeks ago that's something that I kept my eye on obviously you're getting a great at bats from Francisco Lindor some big clutch at bats sha manah has been very important and like you mentioned David Peterson as well but what are some of the takeaways that you've taken uh taken away from from these uh road trip here I mean Lindor is playing every bit the MVP role I know he doesn't feel like it all the time I've been critical of him I question the sign I've been down this road he was awful and I still feel like when it's all said and done I if he goes like One for 10 in the last series of the season and the Mets missed the playoffs they're not you know it's all going to start they are nowhere near where they they are without Lindor um he's gonna go on to you know maybe have the you know not maybe probably have the best shortstop season in team history he is shortly going to be the best short stop in team history with compilation of wins above replacement how he's impacted games by himself like he did in San Diego uh that Saturday night a week ago that's an MVP I don't think he's goingon to win it but I mean at this point you have to say the guy is an MVP and now he's doing it three out of the last four years like that's not and you could even say the second half of 21 wasn't bad either that's consistency you know and he's in the leadoff spot I think manah and the evolution of manah which I first started to believe after this I think you mentioned at the beginning the St Louis game when he went out in that you know pit stop in St Louis and shut them down when they were hot I was like okay okay this this is something and I I wrote about it over at the beyond the mic hey the evolution of sha manah I didn't even know at that time that his arm angle was lower it was more about him relying Less on the fast ball on the Sinker slider repertoire but he added the arm slot to it and if you look at the evolution he went from starting to throw hard working with drive line coming out of the bullpen and now tweaking his repertoire to now tweaking his arm angle it shows you how Drive Line can be used appropriately to gain velocity But ultimately good pitching comes from a lot of other things and now you have this guy that in the second half of the Season since June 1 is a top 30 pitcher in baseball according to Fang grabs and if you just look at his total season it's every bit as good as Max freed it's every bit as good as Luis Castillo um you know though that's High Praise Max Freed's going to be a free agent to get big money on the open market and and I'll tell you what shows sha manah and sha manah maybe in the end he's not an ace maybe he's a two and a half maybe he settles into being Chris Basset as a three but if you could bring him back on a reasonable deal uh I think the evolution of manah has not only provided positives down the stretch because he's Ace like well can pitch big Innings and big games but it gives you some answers to questions if you could shell out the money if it doesn't get too stupid uh in the off season um and then the third thing from the road trip is Diaz you know I'm not joking when I say I'm starting to question if they can win a championship with Diaz I'm gonna bring a name out from the past that maybe some fans don't remember if they're younger but I do and I'm sure you do Jose Mesa you remember Jose Mesa of the Indians yes Jose Mesa had an incredible 1995 season but his final two or three years with Cleveland were marked with blowing big saves now everyone's going to thinko bites but Jose Mesa blew a save in the ninth inning when the Indians could have and they're still the Indians in my opinion Cleveland guarded the Indians back then at least cancel me for saying Indians I'm sorry but anyway um he blew a save in the World Series and he really never was the same again he had good stuff and he pitched quite a while after the Cleveland years but he was more of a middle middle reliever uh there's a lot of that Jose Mesa feeling and look he's not had an opportunity to get big outs in the postseason for the Mets he wasn't really given an opportunity against the Padres because the Mets played so poorly that series that they couldn't use them no and they they brought him in early they brought him early stop the bleeding yeah to stop the bleeding when it was 4 nothing at that point you're you're just pitching your best arm to stop the bleeding and uh and that's and that's where I have to question because here it was two games that they really could have accentuated the trip and he blew both of them now to his credit he 24 hours later came back and it wasn't like it spiraled and then he did what he had to do against the socks I thought he looked really good today out of all the outings I mean he looked good in Arizona but today I thought the slider had some bite and he set people up and even though he was throwing ball one ball too it wasn't that riding out of the strike zone where you could tell he didn't he was purposely going in side he was purposefully doing things to set the hitter up when he lacks command and he can't and for whatever reason against lefties he struggled with his command especially on his fast ball um that's when he gets into trouble and you didn't see that today so those are the three things and at the end of the day uh Diaz is gonna be critical for this team to make the postseason uh they can't go back now maniah has got to be it's gonna really come down to Severino manah Peterson doing what they do and then with the Blackburn Mcgill and I'll say canana to me is a very because he's been so inconsistent those are the days you might need more Bullpen but you need those top guys to be good because I don't think the bullpen is deep enough to get 12 outs every night and then you're going to start diving into areas of the bullpen you don't want to to get big outs because you're overusing them and I think that'll get where they'll get into trouble um you know so I think you saw the good the way I was Summit the good the bad the concerning maybe the ugly uh but the road trip brought everything out and all those things are going to be present throughout the rest of the 25 games left for the next three weeks or so all of those three things Lindor and what he does the starting rotation and manah and then yeah it'll be about the bullpen and the Garretts and the matons and they'll piss us off but ultimately you know it's GNA come down to Diaz they are tied at the hip and I know he's got a player option maybe has a big year next year and Ops out I'd be careful if I were him but the Mets and Diaz are tied to each other for four more years and uh if he's not a championship closer man you and I are gonna have some rough shows that we're gonna be doing in the next four years yeah absolutely I want to bring up and I have these standings here uh for this uh current look at the Wild Card get that out there there high technical much more technical than the talking Ms podcast we use a back of the paper bag and Excel sheets and talk we can't do graphics and stuff like that well you know the funny thing is is that I am still just working off of my laptop screen I don't have multiple if I had multiple screens this it would be a lot easier for me a lot easier right but I got the got the uh this little small screen that I'm working off of and I had to yeah I had to shrink us a little bit so we could get some of the standings up here but if you look at the current wild card right now the Mets you know 73 and 64 nine games over 500 for the first time this season seven and three like we mentioned in their last 10 and in on that road trip a game and a half behind the Braves and I think the Braves and the Phillies currently are ti bottom the nth so TI two maybe maybe we break news on this show uhbe and uh but it to me like obviously you want to catch the Braves but I think this is a win-win either way because you're catching a game as well on the Phillies I mean I you know the division is is is the Phillies to lose but you know uh let's see here NL standings met seven and a half games out okay so they're a little bit farther out that it would make them uh seven games out I mean if they if they had won those couple of games I mean even with some you know with a normal DS season Mets are right there with the Phillies I always felt the Phillies were a little too hot for their own good and I think what you've learned with baseball just looking at these standings where teams are where they were if you're an 85 win team you're going to win 85 games you may start out look at the Astros you may start out 10 and 20 you'll find your stride the the the everything Rises to where it's supposed to go or lowers itself to where it's supposed to go and this season has proven that on many fronts with many teams that you're through and going back to the Wild Card like I said one and a half games out if they Braves lose tonight they'll be one game out what I think is so important is a comment that was made here that I starred uh by who was it uh Daniel caps I said the important thing is the Mets own tiebreakers with the two teams ahead of us which is them taking the San Diego series and the Arizona Series so if by chance they end up tying with either team they will have that right now with the Atlanta Braves the tiebreakers tied at five with I think one more series left to go three games left so if they win that series The Tie break there uh they had the tie break against uh St Louis which was that Mania game that you mentioned I think the only team they don't have is San Francisco and maybe Chicago they don't either I'm not sure but I'll have to double check that uh down in the future but the tie breaks are important especially in this day and age right and I and if you look at those standings I mean the Cubs you got to keep an eye on uh less likely that I could see the the Giants or St Louis sneaking back in it but you never know you know look every Mets F remember is seven games out with 17 to play you know they remember that and a week from now or so you'll be down to about 18 games where that same you know Mets team was uh 18 years ago in the ' 07 season so um it it it's it's interesting how everybody started to play at a higher level in the wild card and I think you're going to need I think you the Mets are gonna have to win 14 of their last 25 to be in the playoffs and I don't know if that'll get it done that might be enough for a tie with Atlanta but uh the Braves have very good and you saw that this weekend with them against the Phillies the Braves may not have Riley uh they may not have alz or aunia and I have a feeling they're GNA get maybe ALB back soon I would think I don't know if Riley's gonna come back before The Season's out but even without those guys all they have to do is stay in the ball game and they could still score enough runs their Bullpen good their closure is excellent um you know the Mets are very fortunate if they were the normal Braves I think they would probably have five more wins uh although they were struggling even with auna and lineup let's face it you know they weren't hitting the the ball the way they no normally were but with this pitching they don't have to score five and a half runs a game you know they could they could be inconsistent and still get the job done and we saw that at City Field out the Mets won a couple of close games um out there so I think they need to win 14 of the last 25 I don't think that's going to be easy what is that 14 and 11 um you know you got a lot of Milwaukee and Philadelphia and Atlanta and their Red Sox and they got to go to Toronto that's not going to be easy I know there's some gats in there and the Nats would love to ruin the Met season they got those outfielders that are trying to prove themselves everybody you know Cincinnati everybody's got players that want to prove themselves for next year so nothing even Chicago this weekend this wasn't easy it was easier is but were these three games easy I don't think so they had to bring their closer in in two they had to get a save in all three well not in Friday but they had to bring their closer in two of the three and then and two of them they needed to get a save and get a big out in the ninth inning so you tell me if they were easy nothing has been easy this season and I I think that's just a theme of this this New York Mets organization that nothing comes easy e even in games that they're up by a lot of runs we've seen it in the past that the they make it as scary as uh possible um but you know you talked about Francisco Lindor and I know it's it's way out there but this run at the MVP that he's making right now uh this whole season 269 batting average 29 home runs 80 RB 25 stolen bases got 831 Ops and you look at that and you know seeing where he was at the end of April within 089 batting average I mean because batting average is still important to me I know it's changed H 089 you're not getting on base there's not enough home runs and walks that that means that you could be valuable 089 you stink let's put it he he was awful to start the season turn it around uh last 30 Games 320 batting average seven homers 17 RBI he's got nine walks in that and three stolen bases but the important stats for me are this with runners in scoring position 257 six homers 48 RBIs and with the bases loaded because this team struggles with the bases loaded but when he comes to B with the bases loaded batting 333 he's got that grand slam that happened uh you know about a week ago in San Diego uh 14 RB that's big time uh for for what this Mets team needs now obviously Otani is GNA be hard to break but what does Lindor have to do to kind of shrink that Gap to make people think you know do we give this guy the vote over Otani I think there's a couple of things I think first off I think the Mets have to make the playoffs they're going to vote at the end of the season at some time they have to make the playoffs still make the playoffs I think it's a even if it's it's not I I talked about this uh you know before having a David Wright 07 end of the year having a Mike Piaza 98 September you know maybe not to the levels of those two guys those two guys were out of their mind good but a really good September that aligns with what we've seen since June 1st with him and the Mets make of the postseason because the Mets make postseason but he Fizzles out that's going to be something they look at and then the third component will be the voters and how they view 5050 if Otani could get there because let's be fair 5050 with the new rules the bigger bases the home runs are the home runs those are you know what you want to say that there's a live ball there were live balls in the 80s look at the stats in 1987 whole mons they've been screwing around with the baseball for ever and uh the stolen bases are are now easier they're not quite three-pointers like the Commodities but they've made the rules easier to bring the stolen base back to where it was not to another level and how they view that a guy that has no position did not Pitch the shear was a DH 5050 I saw somebody in the comments right well without him the the Dodgers still make the playoffs without Lindor the Mets don't that's fair um you know I don't know how the voters would would would ascertain that maybe they add that into it I think he's got a shot you know but it is extraordinary that here he is playing an elite shortstop uh at a premium position doing what he's doing offensively at the position and Otani is right there without ever Fielding in Wind shares so it tells you how good otani's been it really has as uh as obnoxious as as that whole free agent process was and how you know give him credit for giving the money away but how annoying that was and then the the whole gambling thing which to this day I think is still smells bad I don't I don't get it I don't know how you could F I don't know about you guys but I I don't know how many people could just take money out of my account even if I'm really really rich and not have like an idea about it and I've talked to people who do wire transfers and they're like H I've done wi transfers it's not that easy I mean so anyway that's another story for another show but anyway give him credit 5050 is a huge accomplishment he's got that LeBron James factor with the voter uh do they have fatigue with giving it to him do they ding him for the gambling uh for not speaking to the media think about how the Mets got screwed in 88 with Kirt Gibson because nobody liked the Mets and MC Reynolds and and strawberry split the vote 072 with Wright I think he I I know they didn't make the playoffs but his statistically was better than Jimmy Rollins and if if they're going to do that where you make the playoffs and the Mets make the playoffs I mean that that only favors I think Lindor is going to get I think Lindor could have a big September that me to make the playoffs and unless Otani falls short of 5050 which could happen you know look home runs are streaky you know maybe they start resting him a little bit down the stretch I don't know what the Dodgers are planning I don't know what the guy's health is he's been dhing all year I think Lindor has a better shot if he doesn't hit 5050 but if he hits 50-50 and all the other stuff happen I think it's going to be really hard for the voters not to vote him in I know the MVP is not the best offensive player it's the best player but that's always kind of melded together and if you remember Cal Ripken I think won it back in 1991 playing for a last place Orioles team but he played a premium position and he had a great offensive year so that's where they whole the debate maybe they should have like a a Silver Slugger like best offensive player maybe they name it after like Ted Williams or something like there's a lot of things that you can do to kind of parse out the awards to give the dude to the players to do but MVP to me uh he is the Mets MVP and and I don't know why he doesn't feel like an elite MVP type you know maybe it's because I saw that ground ball on Saturday night that should have been a double play that he didn't make and I'm like I know it was hit hard but I'm like or donus makes that play right a really good short stop makes that play more of his scale makes that play but that's unfair that's you know it's a hard play maybe that's what kind of clouds it maybe it's because he's not intense I even wrote about like he's not Jaylen Brunson he's not Derek Jeter he's not Mark Messier in personality is that why people don't feel it like why do people not feel what the numbers are are stating he again stepped up today they weren't gonna hit that guy he hit him and he gave them a lead and that's why they won because if that's a tie game you never know you know that you know things could go a lot different yeah absolutely we got 235 people in the room right now joining the conversation wanting to talk about this make sure you like this video make sure you subscribe to Subway to Shay make sure you subscribe to Talking Mets as well uh Mike's got also the substack newsletter uh which I read every time he puts a article out there so make sure you are logged in with that as well uh Carlos uh actually Daniel caps first uh he he's MLB's Cash Cow when it talks about uh Otani um Carlos Ramos saying list in 5050 is hard to compete with to be honest that's a legitimate record that's that's fantasy baseball numers who would have thought usually guys you first of all we didn't think 50 stolen bases would come back and those that could steal like a Jose Reyes back in the day Luis Castillo Juan Pierre they weren't hitting 50 home runs so yeah Ricardo says the League's front office loves to shine Otani shoes you know my thought process too with this is it would he be the first player in Major League Baseball to win MVPs in both leagues has that ever been done before no it had to be done before um I'd have to look that up I'd have to look that up I'm pretty if you know in the chat let us maybe Frank Robinson maybe Frank Robinson I have to look that up uh you know I'm right podcast saying I'm stunned if yeah it's Frank robinsonon Frank Robinson is the only player to be named MVP in both leagues winning in 1961 with the Reds and then uh with the Orioles as well so I thought it was FR Robinson that's a long long time yeah on that one I'm pretty sure MLB wants to do something like that as well uh you know on right podcast saying he'd be stunned if Lindor wins the MVP so but look you got uh you know Carlos Ortiz uh saying Lindor is contributing defensively and offensively that may come into play with this but I think the 5050 is really going to separate these two things but uh you know like you said he's r m M VP and Rosie K said Lindor has become the leader everyone expected he would be so maybe there's an anti- New York bias an anti-s bias there's so many things that go into MVP you know I think Lindor has done a really good job with the media that will help him hard to say but if you're a voter I mean he'll get second place votes and if I had to take a guess if everything unless there's an extreme Decline and somebody else does something crazy between now and the end and and again we're talking about another three weeks this season three and a half weeks of the season it's not a lot of time left um then I think you know but I think Otani is is the runaway favorite I hate to say it we talked a little bit about uh uh sha manah and I want to discuss him a little more of possibly being the a of our staff definitely is right now I mean you look at his stats this season 11 and five he's got a 3.35 ER he's got 154 strikeouts in 150 uh and two-thirds Innings pitched you know think about sha maniah and what he's done this season you talked about the arm angles and I had uh you know one of my friends on on the show talk about the like breaking down the the the change in his arm angle looking at Chris Sail and I saw Chris S pitch this year uh against the Mets and they could not pick up his sidearm angle and that's what you're seeing from Sha Manan now and it is very deceptive the way he throws now compared to the way he threw at the beginning of the season right I want to know from what your thoughts are is it time to because he has the I think it's the player option is it time to start thinking about giving him the extension to a long-term deal because look we're gonna be right back at square one when it comes to rebuilding a rotation again yeah because you don't have the kids that are ready yeah they're not ready Christian Scott's not really that ready I mean we saw it in his last couple starts before he got injured uh kodai SAA we don't know if he can stay healthy like you said we don't know who the real David Peterson is right really this rotation is in flux again and although it's been just this year but Shawn manay pitched well in San Francisco last year as well uh is this a guy that you invest in you know considering all the other free agents that are out there I mean there's three free agents on the staff I think canana is gonna still get a decent contract and I would probably walk away from him unless it's a one-year deal very limited uh I think srino could get a three-year deal let's say somewhere in the 17 to 18 million a year type of deal maybe like remember good pitchers make it 20 a year I mean that's kind of the number I'm looking at now manah is a guy you know one of the thoughts I had is and I don't know if Boris would even entertain this I'm sure he's got a binder telling you why he's the next Chris S for the next four or five years of his career and he's going to ask for 25 million a year for the guy but you know if you could get him for the bird and hand uh offer opt in to the 14 and a half million tack on three more years to bring him up to 80 total Rodriguez got four years 80 million from Arizona and I guess that comes out to the final three years 22 million a year is and see if you can get him for four-year deal and that'll allow you to have in the late Prime this reinvented version of Manaya you know his you know was a premium Prospect back in the day finally hitting his stride as to who you thought he would be and he could anchor that rotation and give Sprout some time to develop mlan if he's an option Christian Scott you'd have srino who's kind of an Innings Workhorse type of guy knows New York and you know certainly Peterson who you control maybe he slides into that kintana role if you believe in the you know what your eyes are seeing versus the advanced analytics and then you could go out there and I guess the real big question would be can you bring in a legit Ace a Burns do you want to go the Blake Snell route if he's Afra I wouldn't uh do you want to take that risk on a contract at the top rotation or do you see the value of using good analytic principles and bringing in guys on shorter term deals to give you pretty good rotations and build for the bullpen and offense I mean that's going to be kind of the way and I think it's going to be an interesting fascinating conversation because ultimately long-term contracts for pitchers are risky look at Yamamoto and how little he's pitched in La that would have been the Mets this year imagine the conversations we'd be having we knew that was a risk you know Corbin Burns comes in here and blows out his arm like Jacob deom did in Texas you lose two years of that contract and you're paying him met just are about to get out from under bad money with shares and verando now those were short-term contracts and they thought they could squeeze the last bit of juice out of them and look they only got a third of the value of those contracts of any topof the rotation Hall of Fame performances and even that's debatable so I would certainly approach him I don't know if that's something that he'd do before The Season's out but I'd call Boris and say hey before we have to do this dance because we gotta dance with pet Alonzo we might have to dance with stto Can We Dance can we do an opening act and just get this done you know if the Mets believe what they're seeing is sustainable and that's the difference with this for off in the past they're going to take a motion out of it they're going to put field and an eye test along with analytics and I think they'll make a good decision you know these pitchers in free agency their prices are astronomical and they rarely delivered I mean you look at maybe Garrick Cole as one of those starting pitchers that has delivered on his contract gram I think on the first one for the most part I mean he was out the last couple injuries kind of you got a half a year one and a half a year in another that sucked but I mean 2020 2019 you got I mean 20120 would have been an elite season if there was actually yeah season that year so and the Mets have to come to a point especially when developing these prospects where they're developing good pitchers and not having to pay for overpricing some of these starters uh on the market develop your starting pitchers spend money on the position players and those guys that play every day better return on investment better return on investment I think that's the way to go eventually they're still a long way away I mean they got Brandon Sprout possibly coming up next year but you know Christian Scott didn't really thread the needle for this team uh after the first couple starts maybe because he was injured or what but uh you mentioned Corbin Burns you know I'm right saying I wouldn't sign any starting pitcher until he see what you can get for Corbin Burns he would not give manah and sevino a four-year deal um I don't think srino is gonna require a four-year deal but I don't think you keep Mania without it I mean just look at the deals that have been given just go to spot trick guys do this this is not hard to figure out go to spot trick look at who got watt last year and the year before compare them and that's what the agent's going to do and and Boris is going to do it at a high level and I promise you there's going to be a team that looks at manah looks at what he does let's say he pitches this way the rest of the year and we gladly if he Ops out hand him a four-year deal and they may hand him a deal an excess of 80 million maybe they give him a fifth year you know maybe he gets five years at a 100 you laugh but don't because he's pitching like a $20 million year pitcher since June first he's top 30 in the league go to Fan graphs he's having the same season as Max freed now he's 32 years old so that's going to ding him a little bit but you got a team uh look at what Kansas City did this past offseason signing pitches you know maybe they do a larger two-year deal you know two years you know 48 million or 44 million or something like that I I don't know you know again manah has liked being here I think the Mets you know I don't know what Cohen's position on the the the tax is going to be because eventually you want to reset that's going to be really hard with a stto making 60 million a year like the real story as we get into collective bargaining at some point with the NBA salar Steph making 60 something million a year as salaries for starting pitchers Elite starting pitchers hit 35 $40 million Elite hitters 45 $50 million you cannot keep the luxury tax at that threshold because then what teams are going to do is have one to two good players and they're going to be changing their roster over every year and it is impossible to develop every single player through your system for every Mark ventos you have a Brett batty and that's why you're going to have lousy ball clubs losing 115 games like the Chicago white socks and it's not good for the sport parody's good postseason tournament baseball is good I firmly believe it saved the sport if the sport was like it was when I was a kid in the 80s with four divisions how many people would have tuned out July 1 to do something else once football training camp comes around it's different when we were kids I mean I'm a little older than Anthony Baseball's all you had when you didn't have excessive cable TV you didn't have the internet you didn't have the video games that you have now you had video games but you had different things that you can do but baseball still was a good attraction now you could tune out of the baseball season completely and do something else and come back when you want so you have to have that tournament aspect to keep the fans in these cities like what you've seen with the Mets and the Padres and the and the Giants and the Cubs and so on and so forth Stanley's on board with resigning both manah and sebbi and contract I mean it could get stupid and then you're like hey you know we'll do something else yeah no absolutely and look at what Ricardo was saying would you do a three-year 66 mil what I well that's what I basically propose and I also offered to take pick up his you know ask him to pick up his player option to make it four years but if you want to say decline it out do three years 66 yeah I would do that and you know what it's one less year for the Mets to worry about it increases their liability on the payroll next year and of course you could always work it out where maybe he makes 14 million next year and then they backload it you know depending on it um they're going to have a bunch of money coming off so I'm not sure they need to do that backload thing as much as they used to I don't know what their financial philosophy is with avoiding the the tax I mean they're not going to avoid the tax really if you're gonna sign stto and if you sign stto um then the real debate is can you also sign Pete Alonzo are you going to rely on Vientos repeating what he's doing and playing first base and then maybe batty you know ultim the really win for the Mets that they could get some Financial relief would it be for Alvarez batty and vantos to all hit what they're supposed to hit in the big leagues and so far only one of the three has done it and it was the guy that I was least sold on out of all three IM imagine that I've never been a brick b b batty fight even back in the miners but I've heard good things about him so yeah and Alvarez kind of has really taken a a backseat here especially with the comments that were in I think it was a Tim Healey article that they interview Eric Chavez and how they're trying to get him to hit less power more average he looks awful up there he can't hit a breaking pitch you know the the Mets as a team struggle against breaking pitches Chavez talked about that you throw him a fast ball he's he slugging is 500 Sir Anthony Dominguez learned that the hard way um so you know look uh I think and I wrote I talked about this on the show The tonight I don't think it's crazy to say he maybe Luis torren should start more um I know they they view him as the as the Whisperer for Diaz and I know he's a great leader behind the plate and he's a good framer I think his his style is lending itself to a lot of wild pitches with the way he likes to pick everything and darling talked about it during the broadcast um he's worked really hard on his receiving skills uh his arm's not bad but it ain't like torren uh but the way he's hit he's hitting 150 since the All-Star break and really if you dissected his season he's had 15 good games he had a two we Span in June where he was otherworldly other than that he's been as bad as Tomas Neo was be uh at the plate not much difference guys and Neo was a good receiver he is Tomas Neato the only difference is Tomas Neato didn't have inherently within him the potential to be Mike Piaza or to be jav Lope or whatever good offensive catcher you want to talk about out there but yeah I hate when they give the comps yeah I mean you know that's you know and maybe I don't know maybe he's still dealing with the hand injury that shoulder injury he had as well y that could be there's a shoulder there was a shoulder issue he could be but he's out there the approach stinks that has nothing to do with a hand or um a shoulder I'm not ready to give up on him I think the Mets have a good tandem there uh behind the plate and torren is controllable I think for at least another year maybe two I have to look at the the uh the arbitration schedule uh and whatnot but you know um the thing about Alvarez is his style is lending itself and I know Ricardo brought this up uh to not I haven't liked him blocking pitches in the dirt I wonder if the Mets pitchers are thinking about that when they throw stuff late run on third late are they more less willing to throw breaking pitches something to be concerned about and to keep an eye on most definitely got to keep an eye on uh y his progression as we move forwarded with his career um one guy I want to definitely touch on here GNA be a big talk this whole month and and into free agency as Pete Alonzo I mean right now he's chasing a little bit of Mets history just passed Mike Piaza on the Home Run list there uh this season you know you look at it from an outside perspective 241 30 homers 76 RB got a 794 Ops and you think oh that's that's pretty good uh especially for a guy that's hit now 30 homers four years in a row if you don't count the 2020 season which was cut short thing that that hurts Pete Alonzo is runners in scoring position batting 209 five home runs 43 RB I don't even want to get Bases Loaded because it's even worse than that but Pete Alonzo you know there was a lot of talk about oh is he going to make judge type money right that that was the that was the whole beginning process right it was oh this guy's gonna hold out yeah that if Boris gets that from anybody Pete comes back I say God bless you sign that cont contract and get that contract signed now before that team changes absolutely yeah and but you look at not judge not judge no no definitely not judge money um I had him in the maybe 175 to 200 range uh for a contract but is if if he is able to cash in this month on a you know carry the team type level that he's done before in the past if they can get into the playoff and he hits does the Daniel Murphy you know I think he will help his status come the off seon but man this has been such a weird season for him yeah I see him as Paul kerko going forward that's the name and that's not a bad guy to be no that's not Aaron judge and that's not 30 million a year I'm willing to give him the most that a first baseman has ever had at 27 million a year and if you do that for five years five at 25 is is 125 and you add another 15 million that's five years 140 I think that that puts him as at least for a little bit I think at 27 puts him at the highest paid first baseman in history uh I don't think you could justify more I don't and I don't know if it's going to come down to Pete versus stto uh I I I do know that with Boris representing both clients that the Met have a good in of time frames I would not be so quick to make Pete feel comfortable coming back after he takes a Mets offer and shops it I am not willing to jerk around with him until February like they did with cesp like you know Montgomery and Snell did although I think players saw what happened and even to a certain degree JD Martinez which was not all his fault and say you know what I need to get my routine into a team early players that sign mid-season very rarely does it work out that first year step Drew did it many years ago kind of screwed him uh what was it uh was another pitchure that Boris had righty I can't remember uh Kyle something he used to pitch for the Phillies and the twins I can't remember his name right now but Kyle Lo Kyle Lo Kyle Lo good call there Anthony um he did it it didn't work out well so you know um I love to have peep back but realize he's pul keral and that's cool like 35 home runs 100 ribbies hit you know maybe he'll be better with runners in scoring position and execute a little bit better uh you know with the bases loaded maybe there's some Randomness to that maybe he's feeling the pressure of a walk year um but I don't think that he's anything more than that I don't think you could expect him and I think the fact that we're mad at him for not being judge I think that's unfair because he never was to be that if I told you in 2019 he'd evolved into Paul kerko not and I thought maybe he could become Paul gold Schmid MVP Paul Goldman he could still do it but he's never shown the inclining to consistently hit the other way to hit for higher average and to and to cut his swing down and not to Chase and that's why I think he'll be Paul kerko and that's okay there's nothing wrong with that I see a lot of people in the chats saying resign Pete some saying don't resign Pete what is your contract limit in years and price tag what is it where you say this is the amount I'm offering you or else I'm walking I think I I I would wouldn't go more than five years and I mean I don't know if if it's 5150 which is 30 million a year I'm not OPP post that but I think that's kind of like the ceiling and if you give him 30 million a year I'd have to structure that where it doesn't hurt you know because that's going to come into the luxury tax oh tan structuring well he ain't gonna do that I still got to figure out what well eventually the IRS is gonna get involved say hey guys time out you know the state of California say where's mine and New York is gonna say where's mine you know look the these are high-profile guys they get audited like I'm I'm laughing because I'm like you think the state of California is be all right cool I'm just going to not collect taxes until you move out of you move back to Japan in your retirement no not going to happen I I would expect a tax audit on the state of California if I was on ton pretty quick especially after all he did with the gambling and all that nonsense the Mets made a couple of September call-ups well they're only allowed to make two with the uh I guess the new rules this you know couple years that have happened one pitcher one position player they went with Alex Young who pitched very well for them uh in relief in the middle of the season and but the more the talk was about the third baseman they brought up Pablo Reyes a utility man uh he can play multiple positions and he's got some speed as we saw in the Chicago White Sox game they put him that he scored that very important extra run in the ninth inning uh I know a lot of people wanted Lis andan hunia up here but from what we heard from Mendoza what we heard from Stern turns it was you know we want him to play every day down there he's not going to play every day up here um and this guy at least gives you an opportunity plays multiple positions and he's got some speed that can help out who I I can't remember who the guy is that they brought up in 2022 terore they just brought him Teran score that was just playing Teran score I mean he's not as fast as Teran score he's play it makes sense look if they were out of it maybe Akuna would be C up because he'd be playing every day I guess they brought a guy that could be a weapon could play multiple positions in case they get into a a long game with there's an injury um guy who could run you saw him today you know he's not you know you see him bolt but he can score from first on a double maybe disrupt the pitchure a little bit he's been with uh some good teams who made the playoffs before that counts and uh they see something in him by observing him in in Syracuse that they like I mean they must have liked him because they they bought him from the Red Sox they must have had their eyes on this for a while I don't have a problem with it Alex Young has been surprisingly good more so against righties than lefties um he's another AR I mean they can always change it up I I wonder what happened with T Taylor Rogers I haven't heard anybody claiming him I thought the Mets might claim him he's having a really good year and uh I haven't heard of anybody claiming him and I thought maybe Hector ner was going to be someone they would look at and uh I would seriously consider claiming Taylor Rogers I was it 72 hours so maybe by tomorrow we'll hear something maybe teams don't want to touch the contracts they're waiting for him to clear wavers and then negotiate with him which would be a home run because then the Giants would have to pay the rest of the contract um I don't even know if those are irrevocable waivers they put them on I don't know I mean I didn't talk about this on my show and maybe I should have but it's silly now because now because there's no trade deadline waiver trade they're just releasing players so like you've created another you're trying to prevent teams from being stacked but now you're making it where teams could just gra grab PE the thing you're trying to prevent is happening Tommy fam just gets gifted over because all right I don't want to pay him I mean I I I think that's a whole another story for another day we could go on and on and on but like as uh you know I'm right says on here you know Rogers wouldn't be postseason eligible like it they would just bring him up for the month he's not going to be able to be postseason elig yeah because he's not in the organization that's a fair point uh because nobody claimed him interesting I didn't think of that yeah I didn't think unless they've claimed him and there's a paperwork thing that goes on I don't know that's a fair point by the way the Braves lost so the Mets are game back of the Bravos but again news close close game Eed out of Victory Braves are tough man even without their key offensive players they are tough and I it re reinforces my belief that good pitching good defense is what's going to win a championship and and that's what you need and the Mets have some good defense uh Keith Hernandez said it's one of the better defensive teams they've seen in a while and um maybe they have or they're evolving into with with Mani at the top of the rotation some good pitching they're one game out now and this is it to me this is the moment that this team needs to make the run now because I don't know if you're G to get any closer than you are right now you can't fall back to four games there's not enough left can't do it this is as you know you could do one tied one maybe two can't fall back no yeah you have to be the Mets have I think six more games with the Phillies uh and then they have three more games with the Braves you want to be at least within that one to two game rain uh range when that s and it might you want to be either tied probably or within the one game range with the Braves because you know the Braves I don't remember the last time the Mets swept the Braves like yeah I mean I think going into Turner Field late in the year um this will be a first for the Mets I don't think that they've ever been able to be successful in a pennant race like 06 they just blew the division away 2015 the Braves are bad so when the Braves have been good and the Mets have been good they've yet to master Turner Field now they're going to have an opportunity if things hold true because I mean at the very least if they're ahead they're not gonna be head by a lot where they get a chance to go into Atlanta and do something special and we'll see we'll see how that turns out uh ultimately I've stayed on record I think if I'm a betting man the Braves pitching how their Bullpen is how they don't give up a lot of walks how they're not prone to the Home Run is a huge Advantage because if I'm a betting man the meic going to get leads their Bullpen going to walk guys and the Braves are going to hit home runs even if it's a you know not a guy that that you know Robbie Gman or something like that you know so um and that's what concerns me is ultimately that that's where the Mets Bullpen has been giving up a lot of walks and a lot of home runs yeah that's the biggest worry of all season and it'll continue to be until they show that they can limit those walks a walks and a bomb like has has messed up like you said has messed up part of this season for them uh which leads now into this big series every series is big I I I was asked on uh the New York Post clip that I did this weekend how crucial is this Chicago white sock series it is all there's no more there's no more stub your toes nope they hurt every loss hurts TW you got to start playing the postseason tomorrow yep absolutely and that but you know know yeah you gota you got to keep every game is important and this Boston Red Sox series is going to be important uh game one Luis srino who had an iffy outing nine and six with a 3.96 erra going up against Brian Bella who's 12- six with a 4.66 erra then in game two you got David Peterson eight- one with the 2.83 ra against cutter Crawford who's 8 and 12 with a 4.12 ER and then Tyler McGill 3 and5 with a 4.82 ra against Tanner H who is eight- n with a 3.1 thought I'd be praying for Paul Blackburn to have a great start on Tuesday in Syracuse get him back as soon as possible but look The Stuff Plus says that McGill had a great outing on Friday my eyes told me it was a lot it was good from the third inning on this is truly McGill's last stand I wrote about it on beyond the mic at this point you know are you heading into next year as 4A shuttle because he still got options or are you a legit option for the rotation and who knows if he pitches well against the Red Sox on Wednesday I'm not so sure you're ready just to say hey Paul Blackburn go right back into the rotation you know at that point you know maybe you keep McGill on maybe you designate uh down to the miners braban who has not been good since his time coming over from Miami so it'll be interesting you remember when the Grom went down in Spring of 2022 he was incred also I I think I think that Max Scherzer missed his first start late May late May and they went for the first month was Tyler Mcgill and he was like Jacob deg Grom for a month him and Peterson have had stretches if you go back to 2022 Peterson was huge in the month of June he was I mean up until he he fell apart at the end of the year David Peterson helped McGill the first six weeks and then Peterson from that point forward till scherer's return around the Fourth of July they were huge they've never put it together now Peterson from his return from hip surgery has looked good from day one mill to me I don't trust him because I've seen this play out before and I'm not sure he's even a a i I think he's a number five and I don't even think he's a really good number five I think he's number five that is going to get hit more than not and not go deep into games can he be like his brother and become a reliever I don't know if he could stay healthy um but we'll see look he knows he's on the clock he's not dumb he wants a career and he will always have an opportunity if it's not with the Mets with someone else guys like him I mean for crying out loud Dom Smith is still banging around and at this point you know he can't play so so you know these guys tend to get a lot of shots picturers as long as they could walk and chew gum and have somewhat healthy arm I did see McGill use his fast ball a little bit more uh his Sinker was working and he was getting the Batters to you know the exit velocity which a lot of people like to talk about yeah uh was not that high on on the batters that he was facing a lot of infield yep uh slow ground outs that he was getting but I I just don't know if he's consistent enough and can be consistent enough that's that's my worry you know you have you have guys in this rotation that you worry about right he's one of them right you look at Jose canana who you shouldn't have to he he's a veteran pitcher yeah he should be better than what he has given us this year this this season to me has kind of been I I would say unacceptable from disappointing for sure disappointing I mean but he pitched big against San dieg I mean he battled you know he got enough of the five innings I still like him as a pitcher I don't know maybe you're seeing I mean you can make the argument you're seeing the last of canana what he has to offer you may be seeing the last of what JD Martinez has to offer it's been in the back of my mind since July 1 is the back acting up again I mean you've seen a decline you knew that that existed maybe we're seeing the last breath of these guys as viable contributors at the for a contending team yeah uh uh it's going to be a race for the next month to the postseason yep for this team and I got you covered here on subway to Shay Mike has you covered on talking Mets we'll be back at it again with each other probably as we get closer to the postseason or maybe during the off season we're always in touch with each other through chat Tex all the time I direct message him I've got much better I got to tell you I gotta get myself I'm becoming a veteran I finally took me to the age of 47 years old where I took those tough losses really well I was annoyed on Sunday it was me and the dogs watching the game my wife had something to do and and I will tell you this the dogs were peacefully sleeping as I'm watching the eighth inning and I I did yell when um B gave up the Home Run not so much when Diaz did because I was like at that point I was annoyed and the dog I woke up the dogs and they all got unsettled so when you have dogs especially four of them like me don't yell when your team gives up a home run and they're sleeping don't do that that's a bad and then I was sleeping for the Diaz situation in Arizona so I had a chance to get annoyed in the morning but that one stung that one hurt but I'm getting handling that one did uh I posted uh on Twitter just gave up a grand slam I'm done that's what I posted everyone thought I was done for the season you want you didn't want to hear from in and truth I play you in the middle of the night you gota you got to go to bed you don't want to hear DS say I I'm not commanding my pit she well no no yeah no blank you're not commanding I've heard that story a half dozen times since May 1 there there's I hate the West Coast trip so much and to stay up that's that's why I was like I'm done but people took that as I was done for the season because a lot of people were tweeting that and it was just I'm done tonight I want to go to bed I want to go to bed I can't watch this anymore I'm done but you know thankfully you know too also we have other sports coming up right I mean you Nicks I love watching theck me devils and I I'm watching US Open tennis as well I'm a big a big tennis guy like guy you're the whin and kiche and you have like the sweater around your neck crowd that type of deal is that word I wish I wish I I I'm more of the drink the honey Deuces guy everybody knows the honey deuces are but um there you go you have that I still have my stratomatic baseball I got fantasy football um but I mean I'm really excited about September for the first time I feel like this organization is really competently run I feel confident about their decisions I don't agree with everything but I feel good that they kind of know they have an idea of why they're doing something and they're in good hands and I don't think that money is g to be an issue they will have some decisions to make it may be a tough one uh with stto and pet Alonzo and um I think the offseason is going to be fascinating whether the Mets win a championship or not and um this is a great time to be a Mets fan it's a great time to do the stuff that you and I do and I feel very fortunate that Cohen's around because this is really hard to do if they're in a rebuilding year I me imagine if if this was talking Chicago White Socks what would you and I be doing Anthony at this point I don't know that's a tough I actually thought about this this is I was driving stuck in traffic and I said how do I do talking Mets beyond the mic and talking Mets podcast if I'm a if the Mets are the white socks in five years or the metso rebuilding and I have some ideas I mean I was I mean I did radi doing show though weren't you doing a show in the like 11 12 13 range back then I was doing Mets and Yankees I was doing New York baseball uh digest so I could I could flipflop and that was fun because when the Mets were out of it I could just spend the whole summer breaking the Yankee fans chops about gerardi you know AJ Bernett and things like that now it's different and the Mets have been out of it during the tenure of my show but there's always a story line a new GM a new manager um trading off pieces like they did last year during the co season that was a whole another situation right because of the instability there's been things to talk about not good stuff now it's about baseball which is really cool but sometimes it's hard to talk just boring baseball and keep people interested because drama is what sells eyeballs so it's kind of like one of those things so what do you do you say you say things like I did tonight is should the Mets play Luis torren more and you know away you go and do Mets math and give people some hope and then Dash it with hey it might come down to Mets Mojo versus logic which is Braves pitching which right now they're both right there so we'll see well that's that's why we love doing what we do I mean it takes a lot out of us right we're we we're not you know paid actors here to to do these kind of things we have to come up with sure good topics good things to talk about and very difficult sometimes you know and and no one's feeling sorry for me because they say hey I'm investing time in you come up with something good man and I hopefully we've done that tonight and we'll continue to do that and I love coming on this show I love the fact that I can get to show my face and then you know the live stream it reminds me the old Blog Talk Radio Days when people used to listen live we've lost that a little bit in the modern era uh some of it's good some of it's not but I have a ton of fun I'd love to come on again it's always awesome having you on Mike uh please let every everyone know what you're working on uh I know you got your podcast coming out tomorrow and let everybody know the newsletter and all that the podcast should be out I mean I have it done it's going to be uploaded after the show but uh uh talk podcast.com no G is in that uh talking uh go there it'll bring you to the uh subscription on the Apple podcast and if you wanna I mean less than a cup of coffee from Starbucks for the month substack docomo I give you four to five you know thoughts in between I mean they're articles between Sunday to Sunday so that by the time the show comes on there are topics like Diaz being a championship Clos or Tyler McGill's start a bunch of stuff sha manah and his Evolution there are things that that deserve its own space and I think sometimes lend itself better in writing than in words so check it out sub stack.com metog G there's free trials and and things like that so I'd love for you to try it out and I'll be there at podcast talkpod dcom talkn onx I'm all over the place if you follow Anthony you'll find me he retweets me here and there so we'll do that ozer to all the good stuff you come out with Mike uh Mike Silva host of The Talking Mets podcast I'm Anthony Rivera for Subway to Shay you can follow me on X Instagram and Tik Tok at Subway to Shay follow me on X at an 86 and subscribe to the podcast if you're watching on YouTube if you're listening Apple podcast and Spotify I the Mets got a big month ahead of them starts off with the Boston Red Sox but we got to stay positive we got to keep this thing rolling and hopefully the Mets get into the postseason at the end of the month that wraps it up for the subway to shap podcast thank you to everyone that took part whether in the chat whether you just watched 274 people in the room right now I can't thank you enough if I missed your comments uh I apologize I saw everything I could and and I appreciate every single one of you for tuning in here nothing but love for you all thank you for tuning into to the subway to shape podcast and you know let's go Mets and uh you gotta believe you gotta believe thank you everybody