PS5 Pro Reveal, Price Point And Specs | Xbox Changes & Future | Witcher 4, GTA6, Hogwarts 2 & More

[Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] n [Music] hello Gamers from around the world this is boxen bger the video game Enthusiast from Germany and we are back this week with the world of gaming Dutch after taking a two week break yeah vacation time I know vacation the rest of the world is probably laughing that we have such late vacation but that's how it is vac in the state I'm living in we have our summer vacation uh till uh mid of September actually yeah so yeah we've been away for two weeks um we missed a couple of news bits but we are back for in or in a during a great week to have a return or to return to podcasting um lots to talk talk about of course the big topic will be the PS5 Pro but there's some other cool stuff we're going to talk about today but first Dutch let me welcome our awesome Community the chat is already filling up great to see you guys here h of course a shout out to the people coming in in your chat and man how are you doing yeah I'm doing good yeah it was a welcome brick uh welcome brick It's been a uh a busy week a busy week off for me obviously you went the first week and I was off the second week um but uh yeah it's been a busy one um but needed needed it was a good break away from everything in in definitely definitely and I've squeezed a little bit of gaming in on the first week when you were off and then squeez a little bit of gaming in on the second week when I got back so sweet sweet yeah and I'm I'm telling you you need to buy a handheld I was sitting there you know in Italy booting up it would have been yeah it would have been helpful especially on the because it was about I had a train ride for about four hours and then a ferry ride for about three and a half hours so yeah it would have helped instead I just downloaded a load of films on my on my tablet phone and watch them yeah see I I we need to get you a handheld man we need need to get your handheld we'll see what the future holds because obviously there's going to be some more handhelds released oh yeah indeed coming soon indeed AMD has announced you know their their uh successor to the to their to their extreme chip um that is powering uh handhelds like the rock Ally and the Leno Legion go and it's apparently uh uh significantly more energy efficient uh and then the handheld battery is supposed to last at least three hours which which would pretty would pardon me I have to get getting back to to talk to getting used to talking an English man uh been way too long been a way too long but yeah uh apparently uh yeah probably going to I would assume next year um but yeah I was I was enjoying quite some gaming on the Alley so Dutch let us use that as a segue into our first segment and let's talk about the games of the [Music] [Laughter] week all right all right so as always we want to know from everyone in the chat what have you guys been playing playing um and don't forget to vote uh you can vote what gameplay you want to watch um Dutch let us know what kept you busy over the last couple of weeks yes indeed indeed so I have um eventually finished rebirth I don't know whether or not I told you that but I eventually finished rebirth um uh got to the end of that final thoughts final thoughts great loved it loved it I enjoyed um enjoyed a lot of the boss fights I did um a a separate um he didn't we weren't required to do this boss fight but I did it anyway as part of a side quest and that was quite fun that was difficult it was just against all of the summons and then you have to fight two of the summons at the same time each time and okay two of the summons two of the summons and then fight the the final one um and that was fun um and then the overall the last boss fight was a different way to wrap up a famous scene yeah yeah definitely and without spoiling it that's the only way I can put it it was a different way to wrap up a famous scene and it made me think oh have they did they change it then it are they still there and then they're not still there and I was quite confused as to what reality I was playing in yeah yeah um but not really enjoyed it it's it's just a damn shame we've got wait quite a while to wrap up the game yep the next part hasn't officially I thought really been announced yet they they've chosen a good point in the story to finish this one I mean it it's kind of a glyph hanger but at least they wrapped up this part of the story you know uh in a good way um made some changes to it but not in a significant way and I thought rebirth was was was a fantastic game man yeah I'm just hoping that you get to actually use um Sid high wind and Vincent Valentine in the next game because realistically in the original Final Fantasy as soon as you meet Vincent and as soon as you meet Sid you can use them in your party yeah yeah but on this one you can't they kind of just there is like characters and they don't join you yeah which is a shame and I hope they I hope they do in in the next and final part of it for sure for sure and of course the only part that we agreed on that was boring as hell and I think everybody did was the puzzles with Kate Sith in the Mansion yeah yeah true oh dear God this end indeed I was so glad when that uh chapter was over man yeah yeah it was a long chapter that was a long It sped up quite quickly after that um but I'm just I've I've put that kind of to the side for the moment because there's a few things to play but I'm still enjoying doing some of the side bits and moing the game up um I've also been playing visions of Mana my first Mana game nice how do you like it man it's I have yet to play it I already own it but I I didn't have the chance to play it so yeah I'm really enjoying it so far I'm really enjoying it so far thankfully the voices aren't um I mentioned this about Dragon Quest a while back I can't play a Dragon Quest because they use like overly British like Posh accents for everybody that's just ridiculous and I just can't get away with that um but this yeah I'm I'm really enjoying it it's a bit different I've got it on screen for people to watch in the background um on mine at the moment so people can see like an hour's segment of that um but it's very vibrant very colorful um you can just go straight to the story or you can choose and pick up a few side quests and get those out the way of there's a few mechanics I'm still getting used to that no doubt even new for people that have played Mana games anyway um yeah it's a good story so far um nice it's it's a bit of a bit of sweet story of course because visions of manner is about these I don't know whether or not the same in all of the Mana games do do all of the Mana games have arms in them I'm not sure if all of them have them but yeah they are very known to the to the IP and you know the purpose of the M yeah yeah so they essentially sacrific themselves for the greater good good yeah the entire story is this band of alms and you are the god the soul God and you're taking them to the Mana tree yeah yeah um so that's the premise of the story there is I've come across one of the the the baddies the evil guys so far so I don't know whether or not he's going to turn out to be the big baddy at the end or not um but I'm enjoying it so far it's like I say it's very vibrant very colorful it's nice and easy to get into because it's more of an action RPG mhm um it's interesting with a few of the different techniques and things that you get on depending on the different Essence things that you you pick up um but no I I'm thoroughly enjoying it so far and I'm I'm glad they've got a lot of save points where you can play it in chunks yeah you kind this spot save and then you can just jump off and then Carry On from where you've picked up and it's really they do the story in chunks as well so it's you can't really get lost in it and they kind of recap every time you meet a new person they like and I'm the arm of water and I'm the arm of wind and I'm the arm it's like okay so even if you did pause and come back to it You' easily pick up where you left off on the story so that's good um so no th really enjoying it um so so far it was a good recommendation boxy is what I'll say I can't wait man I just don't have enough time you know there are so many games to play right now uh but visions of Mana huge I'm a huge fan of the original game um yeah Secret of Mana is like one of my all-time favorites so um and I can't wait I can't wait so anything else you can't wait for yeah you have to rub it in my nose yeah yeah Age of Mythology retooled I have been playing that and I've been enjoying it and of course they've got the no but not only do they have just one no God they've got Loki they've got Odin they've got Thor they've got um tier as well so you can choose the no Gods yeah um so there's there's a lot of them to choose from each one of them has different powers and things that are of course they've got Hades and they've got the Egyptian gods and um the Greek gods and so there's there's a lot of them to choose from it's it's good fun runs really well after I've got the visions of Mana thing out the way of I'm going to put a little small gam play segment of that on screen as well um I mention this to you I tried to record a longer section but unfortunately G Nvidia GeForce replay thing didn't record all of it it recorded the first one minute even though it said it was recording and then when I stopped recording it it only recorded one minute so that was fun that's the one I'm most jealous of right now because everyone knows how big a fan I am uh of the Age games um yeah put 700 hours in ag4 and still playing and it's I can't wait but the problem is I have a huge and very important work thing coming up uh on September 23rd and 4th this could be a personal huge career chance for me and I know myself I if I would start Age of Mythology right now I would not be able to put it down and I would stay up every night until 2: 3 a.m. and I would screw up that work thing and it's something I've been working towards in a very long time for a very long time and it's a huge personal chance in my career and I have to prepare a lot of things for that and so I've decided to hold off on Age of Mythology until September 25th and that's where I'm going to start and then you will not he the end of it here during the world of gaming but right now if anybody knows age well has played age and I would assume some people in chat have you know that the games is when boxy was saying 2 three o'clock in the morning that that's probably only three matches because if you just go against what if I do skirmishes first before I do campaign or multiplayer even if you do a skirmish versus one AI that can take 40 minutes at least if you do it three three or four AI which I usually go for and I did I ended up having to do a one Skirmish just to get some recorded footage I did that but usually I go for four AI plus myself and it is freefor all so everybody's attacking everybody yeah then you're not using probably the right strategy because let's be realistic the matches are decided usually after 10 to 15 minutes it depends it depends when you've got poers raining down in you and causing all kinds of Havoc it's h it's a bit different we shall see we shall see have noticed as well and I completely forgot about this but if you if you do Island based and they get a lot of the um not Giants a lot of the mythical the giant mythical beaches the Titans if they get a lot of Titans on their home base trying to get any all of them down is is an absolute chore so if you're choosing a custom match and you don't want it to last 4 days because of the Titans that they summon and they all summon like seven or eight Titans to protect their Kingdom um and you can't get Titans across water they can't go on ships so theyjust to protect um then it's going to take a long time so do land locked games that speeds up the process so much quicker because then you can just send your Titans to go fight Titans sweet um but it's yeah it's it is good fun like I say it's it's adds another Dynamic to it when you can throw powers out and when you're the nose God you can kind of make trees come to life and Destroy things and have WS go onto them man I can't wait to check out all the different nations and um uh folks and uh find my sweet spot with one yeah because I know a lot of people people in age4 tended to you know try to optimize their play style for all the different nations however I was like two Nation guy it was the English and the Holy Roman Empire and I optimized those with my play style so yeah I can't wait to do that in Age of Mythology as well so yeah dut before uh I talk about what I've been playing let me shout out the first Super chats the first is a channel member chat from Sith Lord for being a channel member for 25 months man thank you so much for the continued awesome support he says welcome back thank you uh glad to be back uh $700 for the pro is nuts and not worth it in his opinion okay H we get to that in a bit we get we get to that in a bit man and dra TJ follows up with a $5 Super Chat and says hey guys the PS5 Pro is $750 us with tax and 900 with a stand and disc drive yeah listen man it's €800 which is round about 900 us without the dis drive and the stand so but we'll get to that we we will get to that uh definitely let me briefly see what people have been voting in the chat for what gameplay to watch and the clear winner today is Star Wars Outlaw sweet because that that is mainly the game I've been playing um yes I started hand with on my hand handheld yeah yeah man and it is it is fantastic uh uh so why doesn't it run the game play God damn it sometimes OBS loves to screw with me uh there we go this one we'll start here so yeah I've been playing Star Wars Outlaws I subscribed to Ubisoft Plus premium for the first time just to not buy the 100 you know uh addition and for7 a month you actually can play play the super premium Ultra super duper deluxe version of Star Wars Outlaw day one and you get cross saves you know you can play in between Xbox console and PC and with that of course the rock Ally uh and get cross save there and it is actually working quite well uh so yeah but yeah let me briefly talk on the game I know it got mixed reviews man but I'm loving it it is a fantastic Star Wars game the from what I've heard from everybody that's played it so far played it so far they've enjoyed it yeah so I think the the reviews are mainly just the critics because everybody that I've spoken to is enjoying the game so yeah continue absolutely man it is it is a great game um I really don't get i' I've read some some of the reviews and I really don't get the criticism honestly does it have a few bucks yeah I me every open world game has that yeah but so far nothing game breaking yeah you see a little pop in here and there and sometimes you have the the the the occasional it's really nothing serious uh Collision error but overall it runs very well um and I I think also from a technical side of view Ubisoft doesn't get enough credit man they offer so many options in their games you know they they launched the game not just with the quality and performance mode they have the 40 a 40 FPS quality mode which by the way is the way to play you get I I didn't really notice any visual difference in between the 30 FPS and 40 FPS mode but 40 FPS on a 120 HZ screen just feels so smooth yeah you've got other a lot of other options that you can turn on and off obviously you know the Cinematic stuff chromatic aberration and everything a great photo mode is implemented um you see me in the in the footage use it quite a lot actually uh um and overall on a technical level I must say like almost every major AAA game that comes out comes out at 30 FPS and with good luck you get a performance mode patched in six months after launch you know or the or the photo mode isn't there and it gets patched in uh four five six months after launch and so on and this game is complete just on a technical level this game is complete at launch and barely any anyone does that anymore yeah it took Starfield like what almost a year 10 months or so to patch in um other um options and it happens all the time with every other game as well that the the people that buy it day one they get to play the the game in in the worst kind of way and later you P they patch in those modes that people actually want to play a performance mode or at the photo mode and you know stuff like that and I think Ubisoft doesn't get enough credit for launching just on a tech technical level a complete game that looks absolutely stunning they captured like you know the essence of the original trilogy really well the music is fantastic you know you you kind of meet when you when you walk into the base of chabba the Hut you know you you can see Han Solo there in his cryic Frozen metal thing and like stuff like that it is just you know so so good um the story is okay it's nothing super special but it's a good story so far you know um and um I'm I'm having a blast yeah um with the game so far so yeah but that's mainly what I have been playing I I continued a little bit with dungeons of hindberg as well um would say 2/3 3/4 maybe something like that I have finished but I intend to do that uh once you know the the work thing is over and then uh just wrap it up it's great game as well but yeah man that is what I have been playing so let me see what people in the chat have been playing because the chat is already discussing heavily the PS5 Pro Dutch I feel like we have we have got to weigh in but let let us see first here sithlord has been playing mafia and Call of Duty sweet sweet siki has been playing the Call of Duty open beta and Age of Mythology and he wants to hear half an hour boxy r and yeah in two weeks in two weeks you will you will hear that for sure that's all you will ever see gameplay wise on the screen ever again yeah the time of voting what you going to watch is is going to be over you know yeah uh siki says that AG of Mythology retold still feels a little dated compared to H4 by the way yeah um they are different games though age age four is entirely different in mythology yeah but there's always the case they never felt the same yeah dony J says Warhammer Space Marine 2 and he likes it he says it's amazing um yeah another game I ultimately want to play but yeah next month I've said I've I've intentionally held off on buying astrobot and because to play through I have to play through Visions first that's the main one yeah like Visions is my priority at the moment and then next month I'll play Some Space Marine and astrobot and I've really held off yeah as much as I've seen everybody playing them and everybody's asking if I'm playing Space Marine or when am I going to pick it up and things like that yeah next month not now yeah we we knew that man that the first week of September is got is crazy with game releases uh arrot is also another game I definitely want to to pay H Pay yeah I have to pay for it of course but play I want to play it I don't want to pay for it but I kind of have to draw TJ says by the way and good shout Lincoln Park is back indeed man yes Emily the new singer uhhuh yeah I mean listen I her own song is fine but her coverage of Chester songs were not yeah they weren't good and that's the thing nobody will be able to replace Chester it's just it was such an iconic singer that so absolutely was like having this harmony with the rest of the band and it is it is just nobody will be able to replace them but I thought to myself after listening to a couple of her cover songs you know like what what should the rest of the band do should they just give up music entirely because nobody's going to be able and for that I I do appreciate them taking the risk in in choosing a female singer yeah and the new song actually sounds fantastic you know um the new song's fine the new but that my my only thing about it is I don't mind I don't mind them as with a lead singer Emily she's a good singer for tracks that are made for her yeah but I don't think the tracks that have been made for Chester sound good when she's singing them I don't think she's got the flexibility to sing those tracks the way Chester did but she does have the flexibility to sing the the new track that is made for her sounds like it was made for her in her voice yeah and I think any have their tracks going forward will sound fine they'll sound great um but I just don't especially when she was covering num it just I was like oh no it just doesn't sound good yeah I I mean you kind of have to get used to it um but I do like I do actually like that they taking the risk and choosing okay this nobody's going to replace Chester so we're doing something different and she is doing a really good job and let let's be real you need some to to step into the footsteps of Chester and um you could tell you know I've seen a couple of videos from from the first geks that they did and um you kind of can tell that she's kind of needs to get used to to being on the stage and representing being the face of Lincoln Park you know um so I'm willing to give her a chance man yeah well we lat us see new music absolutely fine but just leave your legacy where where it is legacy is there for a reason just there's no need to cover it when you've got a new singer just create your own stuff yeah going forward but you kind of have to live up to the Legacy title so it's it's tough but I'm I'm absolutely willing to give her a chance so yeah um but let's get back to gaming man um where were we Paul Drew has been playing astrobot which is incredible he says and the casting of Frank Stone uh doesn't like that game too much though so um so I hope I didn't miss anyone um I'm sorry the chat is already heavily discussing you know PS5 Pro so D yeah the black the black John on mine was asking is this visions of Mana right obviously my game play and he said I'm defin picking this up once I've rolled credit on P5 or Persona 5 Royale so he's playing Persona 5 Royale sweet sweet all right um Dutch let's get into the news of the [Music] week all right all right all right so D do we directly want to start with the PS5 Pro or should we just let's put the chat out of their misery yeah let's put the chat out theiry let's start with with the PS5 Pro so long rumored long rumored lots of leaks it it was an Open Secret couple of weeks ago before we went on vacation we actually discussed whether it's still going to come out this year because they have been rumors out it's been revealed in a 9 Minute stream stream which actually was only 7 minutes or so um about the PS5 Pro because the first two minutes were like okay what can the PS5 the base PS5 do so was actually more like a seven minute stream probably the shortest console reveal ever um because usually and and especially with such a console you know like a pro model which is for the enthusiasts it's not the target audience is not the mass Market it's like your Enthusiast fans you know um and for them to do just such a quick and dirty reveal okay but nevertheless they talked about the PS5 Pro they've shown it basically looks like a PS5 uh just with the three black stripes they talked about it having the big three you know which is the larger GPU they promise 67% more compute units um and 28% faster memory um which should sum up for overall a 45% faster rendering for gameplay you know this was one of the big fives the bigger GPU a big big three then they talked about Advanced rate tracing it has about two to three times uh the amount of capability to race traced yeah yeah and then then the the third thing was the their AI upscaling um pssr PlayStation super sample resolution um so and then they had the re the the the release date in November surprise I didn't I say it to you man every console except the switch except Nintendo but every Xbox and every PlayStation always launched in November yeah every single one yeah um so not really surprising the price tech was surprising um but let's put that uh in in a separate discussion in in a second um they've shown no new games they've released a list of what like 15 games that will have a PS5 Pro enhancement at launched all older titles um except again Ubisoft o surprise yeah um yeah but with Assassin's Creed Shadows um but everything else all the titles they've shown some compar comparisons um which you barely could see do because of the uh utterly bad stream but even if you rewatched it in in higher quality 4K afterwards it was okay but yeah they compared you know games like ret and Clank Spider-Man and the last of us too yeah I mean you announce a new console and show it off with a game that was released on PlayStation 4 anyways um you can already hear a little bit that I'm skeptical and I have so many things to say about this and I don't even know where to begin so judge let us hear your thoughts first on like the way how they presented it the way it showed and let me hear your thoughts on the promised you know um power increase do you believe in it making a significant difference what what are your thoughts on on this reveal before we talk about the price point and everything that after yeah yeah before we talk about that we said this well we've been we've mentioned this beforehand when the when the when we're looking at the the power upgrade and what they were going to do the main thing that was always going to be the issue that is going to hold back any actual significant gains is the fact that the CPU is almost unchanged yeah got a minor boost but that minor boost brings it in line with the CPU that's already on the series X it's clocked to 3.85 as opposed to series X is 3.8 so it's pretty much in line with the series X CPU now on into so there's pretty much no change not even that really because the Boost is only available temporarily for shot temporarily exactly so it's not even a a permanent boost to the CPU and even if it is it's only in line with the series X CPU so even though you have this GPU boost up to 67% more cus than the current one it's negated any by the CPU which we always said was going to be the bottleneck and then even when you have a look at digital foundaries analysis of it as well they're saying exactly the same thing the CPU is the bottleneck and they never mentioned the CPU once in that whole play yeah even though that had a boost they didn't mention it because they know the Boost is so insignificant it's not going to make a blind but a difference the only thing that is going to be a benefit to them even then I me when it was first leaked and they will mention pssr I said because pssr is so refined and so integrated strictly for the PS5 Pro and nothing else IE it's not on any other platform it's not going on PC it's not going on anything else only select titles and only select things will actually make use of it now he's mentioned everything gets an automatic boost all old PS select PS4 G will get an automatic boost we've already had these automatic boosts on Xbox anyway because we had that lovely cycle where everything got up resed and you've got the automatic 60 frames for all the titles and HDR and all that stuff so we've experienced that kind of boost thing for all the titles in the past so it's nice to see that some titles will get that for PlayStation 5 that were on PlayStation 4 however pssr is literally the only only real benefit of this upgrade and that is to me not worth investing in yeah I have a PlayStation 5 it runs fine the games run fine they keep mentioning when they said oh Final Fantasy was a blurry mess yeah performance mode was terrible in terms of its visual quality they kind of improved it a little bit when they patched it I played it in fidelity it was fine it was sharp yes it was 30 frames I don't care personally for me I've mentioned this before I don't care about 30 frames on a single player game for me I only care about frames when it comes to Shooters Call of Duty fighting games like anything that requires online and is competitive for instance age you need to have quick responses you need to be able to do things quickly ideally you want really quick and good frame rates on you couldn't play age at 30 when every other civilization's going 100 miles an hour and doing things and clicking all over the screen and a million things are happening you couldn't have a 30 frames game of age it just would be you would lose horrifically so anything that is competitive and requires quick response I need frame rate anything that a single player campaign don't have to worry about anything like that I'll just stick with Fidelity I don't care so having a boost to that side to me I don't give a [ __ ] and as you've mentioned the only games have really highlighted that have had a a good boost that they can highlight are old games games that are cross gen or games that have been out a couple of years not new games that didn't show off blackm Wukong which has struggled on the PlayStation that didn't show off any of the new releases from this year that mean some of the unreal five titles would have been nice right yeah the ones that are taxing like show off stuff that's going to tax them um so ideally that's what we want to see we want to see okay it's great having these features and this boost amount Etc but show us a real reason to get it as opposed to games we've already played and beaten yeah we've already played and beaten all of these games like The Last of Us Part Two that's that's great and all but that was a PlayStation 4 title that then had a PlayStation 5 re-release yeah so that's not really like everyone's already played that for the vast majority and I know some people like to go back and play games have already beaten but I'm not one of them I'm really not when a game's done A Game's done I know you like The Witcher every now and again but for me when a game is done and it's WRA though I I rarely ever go back to it I'm like that was great that was one of my favorite games ever and I'm going to remember it that way I'm not once I especially when I finish the story and I know what's coming I like to be surprised by the campaigns and the stories and things yeah I'm I'm different in that way because because I I do like a couple of games that I just can go back to and and enjoy because I already know them and but yeah I I do do get that point um and it is a valid point man uh let me briefly shout out face 23 bkny send in the super generous $20 Super Chat and says the PS5 Pro is trash and nobody is going to buy it and it's weaker than uh the series X cor correct and you guys are going to downplay it without seeing games running on it uh analysis by digital Foundry coming so I mean the thing is obviously we can only talk about the things that have been shown to us um Y and of course it definitely remains to be seen how the PS5 Pro performs once it's out in in the wild and we get the get some actual footage um and some uh actual comparisons uh in um but so far of course we can only judge from what what they've told us and this is such a multi- layer discussion because there is it is um it is it's it's massively multi everybody's going to have their what you can't do one one thing we'll we'll both agree on this everybody has to agree on this because it is some of the takes on both sides have been ridiculous yeah yeah what somebody spends their money on is entirely up to them don't pocket watch what everybody else is buying don't make fun of someone if they choose to buy a PS5 Pro absolutely absolutely I will absolutely however when we get onto the pricing section I will absolutely call out when something is ridiculous especially when it's in our currency um but I'm not saying what everybody else has to do with their money if you choose to go and buy one you go and buy one that's your choice and something happened to your audio you're your volume is super low suddenly weird is it okay yeah a little better yeah um sweet um yeah so it's I would never ever choose to tell anybody what they have to do with their own cash um for me and what I like I have a PS5 I've got a series s and X I've got PC I've got switch I have everything I need to do to run games if I want to run games in super high frame rates I'll play that on a PC um and that's and I've already had a little go at Xbox already like week couple of weeks back you've seen me calling out Xbox for exactly the same thing they're not giving me a reason to invest in the next Xbox just as PlayStation aren give me a reason to invest in the play play 5 Pro and I've already said as it stands right now I will not be buying the next Xbox I will be going full on to PC um so that's how I stand and that's how I look at every company as long as you give me a reason to invest in your platform and a reason to buy and spend money on this platform then I will likely buy it me and you have bought the previous I've got PlayStation 4 down one I had the 1X so we've bought these midgen Refreshers I had the one as well so we bought these midgen Refreshers but the difference is with those previous mid gen Refreshers is we went from 1080p 30 and with some 1080 60 games to 4K 30 4K 60 and performance modes the jump here isn't that significant anymore and that's the that's the the hang up that I've got thep isn't big enough for me to want to part with my money let let me jump in here because this is this is really what what bothered me besides the prise of course so see the thing is I really like the idea of Mitch and refreshes and I'm still glad Sony is doing one because let's just face it the typical 78 year console cycle is just way way too long to expect this Hardware to be anywhere near state-ofthe-art and um I feel like this optional the yeah it's an option you don't they are not starting a new gen but having a midgen re uh fresh is is an option for those who want to be closer toward what state-ofthe-art yeah let's face it if you want to be really state-of-the-art you got to put down like 3,000 4,000 and build a proper PC and you then your state-ofthe-art but in that price range where we are with consoles um after after a couple of years your your Hardware still just isn't up to the to the tasks and you can tell we are four years into this gen and look at some of the latest games that released especially the unreal five games yeah these consults are not not not really up for the task yeah I mean other games look at star Outlaws here uh are doing a phenomenal job uh providing amazing visuals you know but um that's why I do like the IDE now when we look back at the PS4 Pro um or series X um they provided or they you say well the the PS5 Pro will provide 45% of um rendering capabilities an enhancement of 45% we compared that from PS4 to PS4 Pro that was 25% jump yeah and they are not doing anything towards the CPU or the ram that would have made an actual you know like significant boost because look at most games that struggle with performance are CPU limited not all but most you know so CPU limitations is still in place you still have the memory issue 16 gigs of RAM just isn't anywhere near of being a state ofthe art and they could have gone 24 they could have gone 32 you know something like that now so since we didn't really get a proper comparison we got these little Snippets you know yeah I'm always I I like to judge once we have the games in our hands absolutely but we have to talk about something here yeah and just from a pure perspective PS4 to PS4 Pro jump was a about 125% more uh rendering um uh faster rendering yeah roundabout and I know that it doesn't really equal out and it's not a fair comparison because other things go into place there's memory response times bus uh uh bit rates and tons of stuff that have to come together to really give you a full picture and we they since they didn't really give any specifics they didn't even talk about okay we have now this or that many uh c yeah um or we've adjusted the clock speed to this and that and or anything nothing just generic numbers yeah 67% more computer units 28% faster memory what is faster is it the SSD is this the is it the ram is is the bus band width what is it what what are they talking about we don't know yeah the PS5 pro has this was the quote 25 45% faster rendering capability for gaml and they've used a very similar slogan explained a little bit more with Hardware actual hardware specs during the PS4 reveal and there was 123 or something per you know yeah somewhere in that ballpark so I can only chat from what they've told me and shown me so far now if you talk about rate tracing well on the PlayStation 4 H five base PlayStation 5 I've always said like the PS5 and the P Xbox series X are super similar you know the the on paper spec improval from PlayStation 5 to Xbox series X we we barely notice that and that's by the way also would also be a fair comparison because on paper Xbox series X should be 25 to 30% faster so in the ball park of the enhancement from base PS5 to PS5 Pro do we really see a significant difference if we are honest yeah in one game we have a pixel more here and the frame more there but overall they are more or less the same but when it comes to rate racing that's the real different only difference if you comp look at games that have implemented rate racing very very well yeah um um games like Metro Exodus yeah some of the Ubisoft games um with global illumination Starfield we haven't really a comparison on on Playstation there but this is actually the the one thing where you could tell okay there's a difference between PlayStation and Xbox but getting doubl the race is really not a number that explains on how how much better rate tracing will actually look because they've bragged with okay we have in gameplay rate tracing now with Gran Turismo yeah sweet we had that before in the photo mode and now we have uh and we and Forza Motorsport has that as well by the way so is that really going to make a difference I I think this will be the least of the things that you will be able to notice it it will only bring them up to speed what the Xbox series X already does so I don't really see a big Improvement there um uh shout out to John from Xbox era in the chat nice to see you he says I haven't chatted to these two in a bit so I thought I'd drop by man it's great to see you we have to get you back on the show man uh y i i I'll get in touch with you absolutely um yeah so and then the third thing is yeah pssr and this is actually the one thing where I have my highest hopes we really don't know how well it will do will it be something something like FSR which is okay it does its job but you can Alo tell especially when you have a very low base resolution a lot of artifacts Intel X ESS is already a little better honestly in in games that provide me the option I tend to use that for instance on my rock Ally because I can't use dlss there um but King is obviously dlss and so what do people use it for people use it to have a lower internal resolution get a better image quality to output and get higher frames and this is this is the one thing if that turns out to be a quality AI upscaler this is the one thing where I see okay this could actually make a difference but then the other thing CA comes into part that you just just mentioned uh and touched upon is it is a proprietary upscaler that can only be used on the PS5 Pro not even the Basse PS5 so it remains to be seen how much effort is it go going to take developers to implement it I have heard one good thing actually about it um developers don't need a different SDK they can they can Implement pssr on the reg their regular development kits which is always good to hear because I know this is a pain in the ass for developers if you have to use a different SDK um to do that and so on that regard it should make it easier for them to implement but still we don't know really first how it how well does it perform yeah will we see similar artifact artifacts like with FSR 2 three um will will you will it be intelligent enough to use things that int xess and dlss do really well with frame Chen is it doing something like that is it how many and how the question will see be how many developers will actually use it if you look at that list of games that will provide a day one you know PS5 Pro enhancement out set of Assassin's Creed shadows and again shout out for Ubisoft putting in the work when no other developer does because I really feel Ubisoft should get credit to that I've talked about this earlier in the show um but other than that and we don't even know if they are going to use pssr or what this PS5 Pro enhancement will mean other than that how many third party developers will actually put in extra work to implement pssr for a relatively small install base yeah it's only on the PS5 Pro the install base of that system even if it will sell similar to the PS4 Pro it will be only like 10% plus minus yeah in that ballpark of 10% uh of the of the overall install base of the PS5 um so a super small customer base you won't be able to use it on PC you won't be able to use it on of course Xbox and all the switch for that matter that will be FSR that will be dlss and on PC also int xess so how many developers are actually going to use it now you can already tell so I'm I'm not like ah this is a super dark [ __ ] thing there are possibilities that this could actually make a little difference but do I honestly expect the vest majority of games to M have a very significant difference similar to what we had with last gen midra I remember booting up the serus uh H the serus the the 1X for the first time with um Assassin's Creed Origins you know there was just of course resolution boost going from 1080p to 4K mindblowing first time ever uh proper HD our implementation mindblowing yeah you've seen other things really noticeable improvements will we see that probably for most games not I don't expect it I hope to be proven wrong but I really can't see a world where the where a system that is already bottleneck by CPU getting a little bit of better GPU that brings it more or less in the ballpark of the series X maybe a little better yeah but in that ballpark um having a little bit more rate tracing is probably not going to be really a game changer and pssr yes that's the one thing that could make an actual difference but I do not expect it to be implemented by many developers and I don't expect if I'm honest the first shot of every upscaler whether it was dss1 fsr1 or Intel's x0.5 it was they were all bad all y of them and pssr is the first shot it's the right thing to do in general to go into AI upscaling I'm big supporter of things like dlss yes um but the first iteration usually isn't really doing it so yeah I I really don't see it happening that it is going to be a major Game Changer we will see in the digital Foundry analysis probably it's going to be able to keep more stable frame rates and we will see in a distant tree two leaves being rendered at a high little higher resolution than on series X or based PS5 but I for me I've not been sold not by what they've shown so far and I went back and watched it the the the com their comparisons again at 4K 60 FPS best quality possible that they provided on YouTube um and it really didn't do much I also noticed that the console there they are that they now sell basically on frame rates right this was the was the the the tagline of of Mark cery people choose in between quality mode and performance mode to get either a good image quality or and by the way interesting phrasing chunky gameplay yeah um yeah or they apparently three quarters of the players uh choose performance mode yeah to get better frames and they want to combine that this was the exact same promise that they did gave us when they launched this gen by both of them by the way yeah I'm not excluding Microsoft here because Xbox promised us the exact same thing and now we are sitting here with almost every game either directly being at 30 or if you have the option to play in a performance mode blurry as [ __ ] and you you kind of have to play a 30 because otherwise the image quality drops so this is what they are promis ing now again the exact same thing that they promised us four years ago four years ago exact same promise they promised us as that again and then they show off hogwart's Legacy running a 30 yep so I'm not sure I'm I'm not convinced and now you have to factor in and we haven't talked about this yet Dutch the price point yeah $700 €800 and it is also 800 right 700 B 700 yeah but conversion yeah conversion wise conversion wise to Dollars it's $913 yeah and it is $890 uh uh US dollars here in Germany so very similar price point in the UK and Mainland Europe and by the way the rest of the world and the only Market where it's cheaper I'm not saying it's cheap I'm saying it's cheaper is the US and then they have the audacity and I think this is this was really the tip of the iceberg for me you know like seriously you are charging for stand yeah separately the dis Drive I if if it would have been a 500 console okay just extra for the dis Drive I am not using it anyway most people are not using it anyway I I've said this before it's for me it is okay to remove the dis Drive in order to save money and put that money into better Hardware actual Hardware that is okay but if you already have such a premium product and it is a premium product not just because of the price point but because this MCH refresh is targeted towards you know the enthusiasts the gaming enthusiasts the fans of the brand and you basically remove content from the base model with the dis drive so to get the complete package we are talking here round about20 920 which is round about a little bit more than $1,100 us that is what the full package is here in Germany and again I see the I can kind of see I'm not defending it but I I get the why they remov the dis drive but the audacity to to charge extra for the stand to put up your console like or even lie it down without it wobbling this yeah it is pure greed it is nothing else else so now that I have more to say about the price but I want to hear your thoughts first so where do you stand with this uh again I think if it's a pro model then everything needs to be included in that price I don't think there should be separated at all um I can understand why there might be going to an old digital thing we've said in the future we expect the next base models of consoles to have all digital and you buy the drive separately we've said that also elves however this is a pro model of the console you would expect in a pro package you would have everything that is required to be a pro console yeah but realistically the actual full price of a proom model console is £830 it's not £700 it's 700 and then you have to buy the stand so they're 730 and I'm not cuz I don't want wanted standing up ideally so i' have to buy ABS yeah have space to lay down you know what the current consoles like anywh and you know what the Slim's like even if it's lying down without it stand on the bottom it's wobbling about I'm I'm sorry a stand is part of the console if you buy a console two things have to be included the co three things have to be included the console with a stand for people to be able to put it up and the controller these are the things that are not negotiable yeah I'm sorry I didn't even get the that there's even isn't even a controller includ there isn't even a controller included like I think there is a controller included on the on the picture there has to be there has to be there is a controller included on the on on the advertising images they always showed it with the controller I hope it is but that's I would put it out of the realm of the possib that as well because the controller prices also went up by $5 yeah yeah yeah yeah which is now 75 instead of 70 which is ridiculous as well by the way but you know what the the the one thing that this alludes to to me going forward is this isn't looking great for next gen consoles in terms of pricing I agree isn't even a full next gen console this isn't even a full fully fledged upgraded CPU which is zen3 or Zen 4 this isn't the next lines of GPU or Apu that they've got involved with in EMD or Nvidia or Intel whoever they use for the next slot we know PS5 well ps6 is going to use AMD again we don't know who Xbox are going to use um but this at the moment to me looks like the next set of cons s are looking to be a minimum of 600 at launch with or without maybe's even without the drive um which is is the thing that we have to all kind of prepare for I think going forward um and it's I I don't I would have been expecting to see 600 and I think 600 would have been a price people would have been okay with for the for the most part would have been okay with which currency are you talking about because we apparently have to make a real difference here yeah yeah well should be it should be across the board 600 Euro 600 um and whatever that obviously we know that the dollars are never going to match up so it'll be $600 yeah but then I can live with the Delta yeah that is what Bas PS5 and Xbox are doing pricing euros and dollar the same yes it is a Delta we also have to mention to be fair us prices usually are without tax yeah but even then the average sales tax is only 8% yeah yeah yeah so even with that you know it's 19% here in Germany yeah by the way even with that included we're still a 100 more so so it still makes no difference um or more than 100 more m um but realistically yeah I just don't think it sets a good presentent for what we can expect for pricing going forward for consoles to be honest and my my key issue here and Everyone likes to see yeah but gaming gaming is a is a um is an expensive hobby but it never it was never meant to be an expensive hobby console gaming for the living room was never meant to be an expensive hobby yeah it was always meant to be gaming for the living room room to get the Casual people to play games on their TVs yeah that was what G console gaming was always originally about and the enthusiasts went to PC that's what the difference there was the contrast the the the sheer enthusiasts the ones that wanted all the latest greatest newest fanciest things were always on PC and the price justifi the difference it's what you get on Console we'll do the best for what we can for the for the money that you pay and it's a a good entry level price it was $399 for the PS4 Pro it was $399 for the C the 1X it was 399 or 400 for the original model consoles and now we're already sitting at 500 for the base models this year yeah and 700 for the pro model and you can see where it's going yeah it went from being 399 to 600 in the space of a full generation yeah I mean there is there's much to add to this honestly because let's face it it is a super weird generation it's the only generation where the consoles got more expensive after launch usually we are used to if you look back to every other generation the consoles went down in price a year or two years or three years into the generation and they came out with the Slims that made it even more cheaper and you know the this is the only generation where both consoles PlayStation first yeah they increased Rel I think a year or so after launch and X series X two years after launch remember if it wasn't for the fact that series X was priced lower at launch the PlayStation 5 was set to be priced higher yeah yeah yeah but Xbox unveiled the price first and Sony tweaked laste went right TW okay yeah fair so but you know what I mean it is a weird generation in that regard and yes we had a couple of years now of higher inflations inflation rates are getting back to normal now uh but you have to factor that in then you have to factor in of course and before people start to think I'm trying to defend it it's not where I'm going with this yeah um electronic in general semiconductors in general went up in price um so and you can also tell that from PC parts look at PC part prices GPU prices CPU prices RAM prices everything went up absolutely and that's also sometimes when I see people I'm just going to build a PC yeah you do that do that um PC is a valid option however pc pc prices also PC part prices also went up you know yeah nevertheless the the one thing about console Hardware is that is has always been a subsidized Hardware Y and I feel like that is the major difference that we are going to see that console oems console manufacturers are not going to subsidize this the the the hardware in the same way that they did did before that they used to yeah they used to because you know if you look at things like the rock Ali I'm just taking that as an example because I've been playing so much on the Rock Ali lately yeah yeah a Asis is not a platform holder they are not making any money of of me buying that system afterwards I buy it once and everything else I'm going to spend on that device is going towards steam yeah epic Xbox whatever yeah so they are not able to subsidize it that is why the price is as high as it is because they have to make their return of investment of of the hardware sale that's not the business model of a console the console is sold basically for its manufacturing and development cost and all that stuff factored in Playstation Xbox Nintendo is a little different but those two never made really any money off of selling the hardware itself it's about selling the software yeah so but with this PlayStation 5 Pro price I could see that the future is going to to to go away from that model where we get subsidized console Hardware at least not to the degree same degree because there's no way that you can tell me that this console removing the dis drives and dis Drive prices have gone up way up by the way yeah it's actually what Phil Spencer said a couple of months or ago yeah because no other devices using disk drives anymore there are simply super small numbers the few million consoles is really for the global market nothing absolutely nothing so so dis Drive prices have gone up but they removed that dis drive and a few more Computing units four years after the generation yes Mo law is slowing down I get it nevertheless not in the same percentage that the prices for the PS5 Pro went up and yes there is a 2 terabyte SSD we have kind of have to mention that that is a price Factor agreed but still not in the in this way and so I just feel okay the days of subsidized console Hardwares are over Sony at least right now is expecting to make an actual return of their investment on the hardware and I think that is the reason why yeah Xbox is going to look at this very very carefully are we going to subsidize our console Hardware next gen as well and seeing that Microsoft really really need to make some or the Xbox division or Microsoft gaming division or whatever you call it yeah is really really going to have to make sure to make also a higher return of investment because the mother company just spent $80 billion I think not only we see that but this is also partly the reason I think the subsidized section of it is why we haven't seen console prices drop this gen absolutely yeah absolutely um and in fact' seen increases in some in some in some areas you've seen increases in specifically Asia and and European territories you've seen an increase in price on consoles than a decrease yeah yeah yeah yeah definitely definitely um so looking at that okay $700 us then the real or not the real but another issue comes in why is the rest of the world paying $200 more for it yeah and we've discussed the new strategy of Xbox yeah so many times on this show and both of us always said that every PlayStation fan should root for a strong Xbox including their exclusives because this is the only way that PlayStation is going to get competition and competition is what helps us consumers the most and the only Market where Xbox is slightly competitive is the US market in the rest of of the World Xbox is absolutely no competitor for PlayStation in the console space yeah not talking about the software or publisher perspective now with ABK but Call of Duty is still multiplate it's like they basically all that big stuff is now third party yeah Doom coming Indiana Jones coming and so on talking here about sort of of it's not fully third party publisher I'm not saying that you guys know what I mean you know yeah and so Xbox as a as a as a division is fine but the the the console space they are not competitive we've talked about PlayStation being outsold here in Germany 10 to one Xbox being outsold by PlayStation 10 to1 yeah yeah um they are no competitor whatsoever and that is exactly what happens they have a quasi Monopoly you know what I mean they it's and they can do whatever they want they can charge at a higher price here because people will still buy it because they either don't even know that an Xbox exists or because they've never they don't know anyone who has an Xbox don't know what it offers don't know you know PlayStation is by far the market leader in the console space yes there is Nintendo as well by the way but again Nintendo is somehow on a in their own world you know what I mean yeah and this is the only explanation I can come up with why is the PlayStation 5 Pro roundabout $200 US dollar more expensive in every other country it's in the UK it's Mainland Europe it's in Asia Australia insane what was it 1200 1100 1200 uh Australian dollars Australian dollars yeah or yeah it is it is crazy to me what do you think where where where's this major price Gap coming from I don't know I'd love to know why the difference is so vast um and I I really don't understand it this is what I've been trying because a lot of the Americans are like well it's only $700 I'm like but it's not though because for us in UK or Europe it's closer to $900 yeah it's a significant different price yeah and then they have then they talk about the the average um wage is and or minimum wage I'm like yeah but minimum wage on buying a PS5 Pro if you hav look at the average salary the average salary in Europe is smaller than this the average salary in America yeah not really it's just because the the Americans don't pay that many much uh that much taxes many taxes you know what I mean yeah the the the actual uh uh income is very it's comparable and that's why Why by the way for as long as we can think of prices have been more or less the same the F the Xbox series X the P base PS5 launched at 500 E and $500 US yeah yeah $500 US plus tax equals more or less the the the um the the the conversion rate that you have in between euros and and and the US bam same price and now we're talking round about a $200 price difference yeah I couldn't I couldn't tell you what it is to be fair I just don't like the the when when people are saying oh well it's only this price I'm like well it's it isn't though it isn't because it's not just oh now it's it's 500 here 500 there but it's not it's $700 or700 they're in vastly different things yeah £700 are 900 an American sent me $700 even or even if they sent me $750 I would still be short by almost £150 from buying a PlayStation 5 Pro so it would make no difference like it isn't the same conversion you would have to send me $900 if you wanted a PlayStation 5 Pro from the UK yeah that's like scalp a territory yeah definitely scalpa territory absolutely let me briefly shout out check 8282 he sends in a $5 Super Chat thank you man he says it seems like both companies are going in different directions having to adjust they both are competing differently and making good and bad decisions yeah absolutely Xbox is trying to compete in a different way now as in the publisher space in in the space of selling software absolutely uh while Sony is definitely um trying to continue the the CL more or less classic console model yeah they've also made differences they bring a lot of their games now to PC as well some of them even day one um but yeah in the console space they follow a very similar tactic but now with this price uh point yeah again we are back to non-subsidized console Hardware yeah and I've got a super chat here as well from Michael mooney5 pound Super Chat thank you for that he said most Xboxes are sold in North America I suspect Microsoft might be or will be debating future Hardware releases outside of North America but I don't think they'll debate debating releasing them we do know that they're wind essentially winding down Marketing in Europe for Hardware anywhere going forth yeah so I don't think they're going to be focused on pushing Hardware in Europe anymore um have they ever have they ever been even yeah I was going to say but even then you only have to go back to the Xbox one generation find out that obviously to get an Xbox in the Netherlands for instance you have to either wait a year or go all the way over to Germany to buy a console yeah so it it is a valid question and I sure hope they are not pulling out of the the console space in Europe entirely um but I would be also surprised if that isn't discussed within Xbox honestly um we we we shall see I still hope that they will surprise us the out of the 30 million consoles or 25 million consoles whatever it is that sold this generation I would be surprised if 4 million of those are in Europe yeah absolutely and it includes UK which is still their biggest Market in Europe outside of America yeah and I know a lot of people always say yeah well countries like Germany France Spain Italy Etc have traditionally been PC markets um and while PC is a super strong platform around here uh Nintendo and Playstation are doing well yeah very well they are and that is because they have marketing they have brand awareness and they actually try to sell the consoles yeah to get people yeah and still Microsoft have made plain to them that while they'll offer hardw their focus isn't on the hard way yeah their focus is play wherever you want and buy our off yeah yeah so it it is this this discussion again where's Xbox going with with their next gen hardware and it is even more interesting question now um with the PS5 coming out now in November are the rumors the one thing allowed it to to kind of have you follow on from that because it'll go into it I think this will be something that they will look at the reaction to the pricing mhm going forward they look at that reaction and they'll think right okay they we know they're focused on their next gen Hardware that we know they're not doing mid gen Pro yeah or Elite model so we know they're focus on the next one they'll be looking at this pic and thing and the kickback from people about the pricing and what's included within it and think right okay so how do we Arch this now with what we need to do and pricing where where are we positioning this yeah because that's the one thing that we'll have to look at yeah absolutely yes the pro model is not for everybody granted nobody's going to go no not everybody gets them and it's only a small percentage of people that invest in a pro model a very small percentage Yeah that's for both series The the 1X and the PS4 Pro it's always been the case it's been a very very limited number out of the hund I think it was 120 plus million consoles that were sold for PlayStation or more last last gen I think it was 4% of that was a pro model so it's a limited number but that it's still a couple of million people that by it it's a smaller section this time though because we're Midway through the Gen PlayStation on 50 60 million units not 100 million units and the models now coming out and I don't and I I think personally seeing this price and this console will push people more towards buying up a slim digital or a slim regular based model PS5 then the will picking up a could definitely be I mean live to dat sales for the PlayStation uh five are more or less on par with the PS4 right so if they and I actually assume now if since they are launching this MCH refresh this year that they are going again for an 8-year console cycle I fully expect Sony to to do the traditional 8year console cycle and with that they could definitely end up in the 100 million plus minus ballpark you know at the end of the chin um so it is really the question I mean Phil Spencer said himself basically what's the point of a MCH refresh this gen yeah last gen it made sense because of 4K and everything um we don't have that thing this year now we just talked about the enhancements of the PS5 pro at least to us right now they don't seem really that significant um yeah so the question Phil brought up is what's the point of of a midgen refresh this ch um and the question now will be what is the response of Xbox are they the the rumors true are they going to launch the next Chen in 26 or are they also following a an 8year console cycle what do you think man will they be able to do an 8year cycle with not having a m gen fresh yeah no no I think I think it is likely to be brought forward I think it's going to be 26 at the push win uh like winter 26 when it launches so technically 27 but November November 20 if it comes out it comes out in November 26 again every console launched in November yeah so technically 27 but yeah you it's uh yeah I think that's probably going to be the case I think they I think they'll just they've mentioned what's the point and I think there's there that's a multifaceted response I think it's what's the point because we're so far behind on this console generation bringing out a pro at this point isn't going to make a difference and I think that's part of the reasoning behind it for for his team is what why would we bring like we're not doing well enough on the console side of things anywhere in terms of sales bringing out a pro model of this console isn't going to benefit I think what they're looking at right now is we need to quickly draw a line in in the sand on this one we're going to focus on the next gen and we're going to start the next gen with a whole another thing we're just going to start from scratch and we're going to go from there now granted Xbox have always been heavy proponents of backwards compatibility so whatever they do is going to ensure that your peripherals will all work your games will be cross gen so they'll they'll work perfectly fine across all devices but it is going I think it is going to be a good shift across and and something brand new instead um I think they're already they already fully aware that it doesn't make sense for them to do a a mid gen refresh because they are too far behind this gen they are in terms of consoles they're just they're miles off absolutely miles off so it wouldn't for for them spending the money and and and the R&D um on a midgen pro model of a console that hasn't hit the heights yeah doesn't make sense it doesn't we we everybody else the the enthusiasts might want one but it it you have logically it doesn't make any sense you just draw a line under the sand right well this hasn't worked what what we've made was too complicated for developers to to get in the tools the tools weren't ready all the way through the the it was what PlayStation 3 had with difficulty developed for yeah is what Xbox series X is has been said all the way through it's been difficult develop for the series s has been more of an issue because it is significantly lower powered than the the series X simp is a second skew I I don't even think that that the the pure specs of the series s is that big of an issue because most games Bally made it work eventually yeah to run on the series s it's just the work you have to put in yeah um especially given that it is a low install base yeah yeah yeah and of course when you've got two others the series X and the PS5 which are at a certain level of of capabilities whether it comes to the GPU the CPU the ram availability which is one of the issues for the series s the RAM and we've been seeing this any for the consoles in general 12 gig or 16 gig is still not enough like yeah the next gen the actual next gen consoles need to have much more than that much more than that in a computer when you've got a GPU that has its own video RAM so you have its own vram of at least anywhere from 8 to 24 gig depending on the cord you've got and even then 8 gig cards are kind of Disappearing now and we're starting to see Baseline of 10 or 12 TW yeah 12 really should be the minimum on a GPU and then you've also got your your RAM on top of that which is 16 32 64 gig yeah that's the available memory you've got on both GPU and RAM that's General problem Shar shared yeah the general problem of an APU design right you have a shared memory pool um yeah that's that's the thing um if XBox decides to launch 26 I think that would be actually the smartest move that they've made in a long time honestly because there are multiple things you have to factor in the first is I fully agree with you if they would have a proper install base in the ballpark similar to what PlayStation has right now right um they it would be a little a different story but now your console sales are slowing down you haven't even met the life to- dat sales of the Xbox One um which really isn't considered a successful generation for them um they yeah do you spend the R&D and everything in that or they directly de develop a new gen you would also break out of the direct competition towards PlayStation if you don't always launch the same time like your big competitor does right giving a head start in a generation of two years or so would make an actual real difference um and then I still believe the biggest problem of the series X was the way they handled their first party Studios and the general sentiment of the console in the first two two and a half three years um the one thing was the tools that you already mentioned yeah they've sold the series X as the most powerful console and in the first two years almost every third-party game ran worse on on Xbox than on on PlayStation and yes a lot of that issu those issues were not even m Microsoft's direct fault because AMD simply didn't have a lot of the c 2 uh stuff uh ready the tools the drivers and so on um nevertheless and at at the end of the day the console didn't perform in the first two years as it was supposed to and the same goes for your first party roster right they bought all these Studios way back in 2018 and this was supposed to be the generation where finally this this the tagline of Xbox has no games disappears and then they launched the console without a game and it took them 10 months to release the first first party game exclusively on the platform um uh and they had one good year with Halo and Forza Horizon but then again it was still just Forza and and Halo which was the other techline they only have F Sagar and Halo right so they only launched that then they had had 18 months of nothing the longest Dy streak any platform holder ever had just to release a redfall and this was just not a good two and a half years start for them it was nowhere near where we were supposed to be where we are now where we have this proper pipeline this regular Cadence of quality game yeah we had just had um hellblade 2 this year yeah we are still Age of Mythology came out but probably console gamers are not really counting that for whatever reason but then yeah we are still getting Indiana Jones and we getting um stalker stalker and and Call of Duty and all the good stuff you know we are still getting that and then early next year AOW and then we get we are getting Doom next year and all so they are now at this point where we can see okay now they pumping out in regular Cadence quality games but we are four years into the generation and so yeah this gen really didn't do what it was supposed to do for them and to just break out of this and say okay this wasn't it but now we have this Cadence of regular games and we're launching a new console in 26 and with this generation we finally have this regular support it would all make sense absolutely at the same time we see the Deep prioritization of of consoles for Xbox they don't longer care about exclusive content and a reason to really buy the console they their advertisement slogo slogan is now we have you don't need a need a console to play right and um so it it'll be interesting to see if if this strategy works for them if they launch in 26 when people are hungry for for next gen and if if and what what what will be be the price point what will be the offering yeah I still believe I thoroughly believe that they are going to somehow unify consoles and PC yeah that the next gen Xbox is going to run on some sort of Windows it it's not going to be that you boot up into your desktop and you can also open up your PowerPoint and Excel sheets and that's not going to happen but it will run at its base core on a Windows with that they make sure that developers have it easy to switch from because the Xbox is then just the PC version they don't have to build a separate console version yeah yeah um they will try to do something like that and I'm still rooting for that Xbox handheld um to be true uh but honestly uh that's the one thing that's the one thing I would buy next gen from Xbox is if they bring out an Xbox handheld I'll buy that but as it stands right now I've got no reason to own an Xbox console not if you have a good PC yeah right um unless you are like me and just prefer to play on a console listen I'm going to I'm it's no secret I'm no no fan of what Xbox is doing with this um bringing games over to PlayStation thing that's not a secret I'm still going to buy an Xbox as long as they are going to make it yeah and I've always been a multic console owner so I also will buy the ps6 I'm not sold on the PS5 Pro absolutely especially not at that price point Point um it's by the way also something we haven't covered earlier when we talked about the PlayStation 5 Pro that the the one thing that is also um so really important to mention in my opinion is they launched that PS5 Pro and they don't have a showcase title for it and I've been a multi I own a Nintendo I own a PlayStation I own an Xbox uh and I use the PlayStation as my exclusive machine I play the I love the first party games I truly do but I play almost every of my third party games on Xbox some of them on PC and um with not having a proper road map what is what is the point for me to get a PS5 Pro yeah I I'm I'm not there there's no no there's Wolverine yes Wolverine is probably a 26 game especially after the this Ultra strong League of uh even the base code uh and the the game code um yeah yeah um w we looking at 26 here so what else is there for me to play there really isn't anything announced astrobot just came out and that's it right I I really don't see a reason from for as someone who plays third party games on Xbox if yeah the the PlayStation 5 Pro would you know offer a significant Hardware performance upgrade and it would be in the ballpark of 5 to 600 EUR not 800 without the stand um then I would probably consider getting it and to and and then play more third party games on the them when if if I would really see an actual proper benefit but so far with what they've shown and with the specs that they have announced I'm not seeing that you know and especially not for that price point um because then I could also just play on my PC I have a 3080 uh I know it's not super state-ofthe-art but it still significant boost over the PS5 Pro so yeah I'm and and this is different with Xbox Xbox has a super exciting road map very exciting road map can't wait for stalker to can't wait for Indiana Jones AOW Fable Doom super excit exting road map right but I feel like I've been shouting for PlayStation's road map for very long time now yeah like Concord came out and it was so ter terribly received good they had they've had to cease it online and refund everybody yeah and also pulling review copies away from people who give insanely utter failure and then and not doesn't board well for games like Marathon by the way um yeah who who is also still not really been spoken about they haven't talked about it they haven't showed it off it's exactly the same as what they did with Concord they showed this little Gameplay trailer everybody said wasn't even a Gameplay trailer it was more like a CGI thing a quick thing yeah and they didn't really advertise it they didn't really push it they didn't really justify why it would differ from any of the competition that you don't have to pay for um and then they brought out their highly successful Astro bot but that's one game and now what and now what it is I I was fully expecting and I I think we talked about this in the DMS right before the PlayStation 5 uh Pro reveal yeah that we we're talking about okay why is it only 9 minutes long and I I was like I was and I was wrong yeah I I said to you man the this is just more or less a tease and they going to announce at the end of this reveal a proper showcase somewhere when either in September or October to to fully show this thing off with some of the highly expected games from Bend or Santa Monica or ghost of sushima 2 or something like that yeah but no no showcase no road map it's crazy and then and then just to come back to to Xbox and 26 it'll be very interesting to see what they do I again I fully expect them to have a Windows light or something like that to run on the machine uh developers will not have to develop differently for console and PC it will be just the PC version of the games running on on the Xbox um therefore eliminating All Tech technical reasons to not launch your game day one on on on the Xbox console and also opening up the possibility of third party launchers like epic steam or something like that right um this is what I expect them to do and it would only make sense I do hope that corporate Microsoft is still willing to take such Hardware risks you know yeah um there I'm not saying that there won't be a next Xbox absolutely not uh there will be one more gen yeah and I hope that this is going to be a super successful one for them because we need this competition the PlayStation 5 Pro reveal and especially the pricing outside of the United States shows how important it is to have proper competition and just hope that Xbox is finally going to be able to put that competition up because they have everything on the table they have the chance to launch 26 new CH Big Head Start make it attractive fulfill the wish of the community by also launching a handheld with it they have the games right this time they finally have the games to launch with a console um it it's all on the table they have the by far the best offering um value for price with Game Pass um in gaming and they have everything to to have a successful console generation but we all know everyone here in the chat knows everyone knows they are not behind consoles anymore and this is the the one thing that just worries me um if they're willing to put in the effort that it takes to have a successful generation yeah yep I completely agree another thing that I'll add as well is and I said this last time around when it comes to Xbox there'll absolutely be another box there'll probably be another box after that but they still have to give and I've said this before they still have to give a reason to buy the Box because if a gen goes by and that one is tracking behind the series X and then the next gen's tracking behind that series and then the next gen's tracking behind that eventually there'll be coming a point where the hierarchy will say this is no longer feasible yeah so they have to no matter what people say about exclusivity they have to give a reason for people to buy the hard way otherwise they will stop making the hard way yeah regardless of what you want if it starts to slowly decline which is what it's doing the 360 the Xbox One the Xbox series the monthly at the actual sold units track behind the Xbox One currently if it keeps tracking below every series all the way through eventually the investors the funders will go why are we still doing this yeah yeah it's that's the thing so my my thing for Xbox is I'm not 100% I am not getting an Xbox I have categorically said right now I do not have a reason to invest in the xxbox because they're not giving me a reason to invest in the X Xbox what they're saying is I can play everything everywhere so if that's the case I'll just play everything on PC I'll save the money I'll play things on PC I got a PlayStation 6 I got the switch 2 because they're still currently giving me a reason to buy them currently yeah even if PlayStation's releasing on PC it's one year later or a year and a half later yeah it's still a a long enough time for me because if if I don't pick up something near its launch point the chance of me actually playing something two years old later down the line is Slim because there's always something new coming out and I'll be playing that new thing yeah so the only time I'll stop considering getting the PlayStation is if they go to the same route and say well we're going to release everything on PC day one okay brilliant now I don't even invest in a PlayStation I'll just buy it on PC yeah but as it stands I like I say PlayStation Pro no nope no no not for me not that price definitely not as it stands I'll get the next X the next PlayStation I'll get the next switch I'll upgrade the PC but Xbox need to give me a reason to get the X Box which I don't currently have yeah let's let's see how many people will feel that way once they they reveal the their next gen plans and I sure hope it's going to be 26 men but Dutch let us move on from this topic to yeah a couple of other news bits uh before we get to this week's Community questions and The Witch of four we have to bring it up right yes go of course of course we have to bring it up um CD project red um had a the the head of CD project red Michael no novakovski has said um in a statement work on Polaris which is the new Witcher game yeah is progressing its development team is nearing a major Milestone which will Mark the end of pre-production phase the situation in our ongoing project uh this year is pretty stable and they have been progressing at a consistent Pace the Polaris team is maintaining the right scale to enter production phase very very soon while our work on both announced and unannounced proess project projects are still steadily progressing um so The Witcher 4 finally leaving pre-production phase going into into full production what are your thoughts man thank God I finally I am hyper anticipating this game not because it's not just because it's The Witcher and it's the next version of it but also to see how these devs and what these devs are capable of on Unreal Engine because it's the unbelievable job on red engine yes ABS their own proprietary engine was unbelievable for what they managed to carry out not only what they managed to carry out on Console but also managing to P such a Jugger not game onto switch Yeah and make it look half decent um but what a fantastic looking game that was and still is no matter where you play it it looks fantastic definitely um and of course then we've seen red engine still granted had had its issues at launch because they tried to do it on the on the generation that really shouldn't have had it yeah but cyber Punk unbelievably gorgeous game and on PC if you've got the highest if You' got the 4090 and all the bells and whistles turned up that is the most graphically impressive game of the Generation by a long shot yeah it is absolutely insane how beautiful that thing looks so red engine really it was a surprise to a lot of people because the red engine did a lot of things very well that a lot of other engines didn't do as well it was a very very competent engine so to see them switch to in real was a massive get for epic um and I hope I hope the results are equally as outstanding when they developing on this game because that's that's ultimately the only thing that I'm in I'm intrigued by I'm I can't wait for the game but I'm intrigued on what they managed to pull out of the Unreal Engine on a Witcher title yeah that's that's fascinating to me to see that switch absolutely absolutely couldn't have said it better um it was a surprise to me because like you said the the red engine is such a incredible powerhouse engine uh probably the best proprietary engine out there right um for them to move away from that definitely going to be interesting to see we also haven't really seen any open World um unreal 5 games yet yeah uh stalker 2 is about to to launch this um year but um other than that we really don't have any any open world games uh on the horizon in in unreal 5 so yeah yeah that will definitely be interesting to see and of course um in this interview he also talked a lot of about um having all the right Mecha the the mechanics ready story is more less lined out they have an idea of what the game play Loop and the uh the the overarching game is going to be and now for a game to enter full production um it's a big step and hey maybe we get the first glimpse of of what it looks like somewhere next year during during showcase season or so um hopefully yeah hopefully yeah maybe see the first vertical slice of it you never know you never know you never know some in engine stuff maybe not even a full gameplay reveal but do do Xbox get another they did with the Witcher they did with thing on it yeah exactly who knows could be could be that would be a big get for them if they get if they manag to get Witcher four on as a marketing Gambit oh yeah that would be be they've always and to be fair they worked hand inand with them across the thing to make sure it was and and to their to their surprise to my surprise the Xbox series version of that game was probably the best version that was available at launch because the PS5 version wasn't very good the PS obviously we know the Xbox One and the Xbox uh and the PlayStation 4 versions were terrible and the PC version wasn't very good at launch the series version was okay yeah so yeah um so fingers crossed um fingers crossed uh this I can't wait for it to be fair I'm intrigued to see where it goes yeah definitely how and I think everybody's intrigued to see who will be the lead whether or not we we have a create your own character scenario or whether or not it's Siri as the lead or Siri is going to be the lead I think they going to introduce a different school you know in the lore you have these different schools um but then did they do the whole create your own Witcher scenario yeah that that'll be interesting it would definitely behooved them in in in a certain way because how do you follow up a Witcher 3 right um I mean of course I'm a little biased but generally it has been super well received and you kind of have to introduce something new to it and where did where do you innovate on a game that was considered for the most part a mess piece yeah yeah um and and having your own character in there would definitely change a lot yeah on the other hand yeah the thing that made Witcher three so good was like the writing and the stories and to have that with a randomly designed character going to be is different is it this it's a challenge right um they did have it in cyber punk though so who knows yeah who knows man let's hope we see it next year all right dut GTA 6 yes over the last week it was delayed then it was not delayed um real quick what are your thoughts are we going to see GTA 6 next year yes yeah we will see it will we play it yes all right clear stat they told their shareholders they are on track for fall 202 uh 2025 launch yeah that was in April they haven't told their shareholders anything else if anybody's going to know anything it'll be the shareholders first not us not a Lega yeah they'll be the shareholders I agree so unless they've come out and said in another report that it's not coming to their shareholders it is still on track for fall 25 and I think it's absolutely on track for fall 25 because they're in Full Tilt uh so yeah we'll play it I don't believe any of these so-called leakers I agree because this isn't this isn't this isn't a Ubisoft this isn't um an EA where the average person would know everything this is take to interactive very large they make a lot of money has significant more than the likes of U Etc and the reason they can do that is because they've brought out Masterpiece after Masterpiece after Masterpiece and they've made a lot of money yeah like Red Dead was unbelievable Red Dead 2 was unbelievable GTA 5 was unbelievable the vast majority of the GTA games are remembered fondly everybody loves GTA 4 and then remember the DLCs that they got with GTA 4 they remember San Andreas they loved San Andreas yeah I playing GTA the original top down GTA on PC when it first released on GTA London so they've always been great they've always been fondly remembered and they've never you even have to think of the the silly games that people remember fondly and would love to come back like table tennis take everything's done well that they've produced and they've always done it when they've said they're going to do it like they don't put out a trailer if they're not confident that game's going to release I agree Within certain time frame um so yes I abolutely believe that's dropping fall 25 I can't really add anything to this um so Dutch I think it's time to move to our community questions because we have a couple of good ones this week nice you're so good every day I hear the words all from you all right Dutch we got a couple of good ones this week from our community as always you can write in every Wednesday we post on YouTube We post on X we post on everywhere you can send in questions yeah and so did storm player DX um can't wait to tune in in your show brother I have another I have a question for you what do you think about Ubisoft in general how they survive this business they fight currently with low sales and their Shares are at an historic low yeah I don't know if you've seen this Dutch but last week Ubisoft reached an all-time low in their stock price and starting this week they dropped even another 7% down um after Star Wars not being being received critically as well as they probably would have hoped to and sales probably also lacking a little bit behind um yeah what what are your thoughts uh about this decline of Ubisoft well this is this is the thing that well Star Wars is an IP that's fondly liked yeah I tend to find if it doesn't involve Sith or Jedi if it was a Boba Fett game you've got another thing entirely but if it doesn't involve Sith or Jedi I don't think the vast majority of the masses would pick up a just random Star Wars game because the vast majority of Star Wars fans want to be Boba Fett or they want to be a Sith or they want to be a Jedi they want to have Force Powers so I don't think it was Mass going Appeal on this particular Star Wars IP as much as it is a Star Wars IP we've seen that before where they've went off and did something else and it doesn't always work when you go for a different type of character in this like the Lord of the Rings Golem game for instance yeah of all characters to make a Lord of the Rings game for Gollum was never going to be successful true I don't care how bad the game was in general but it's just not a character people want to play as so as much as it's an intriguing game and people are loving it for what it is and people are intrigued by a nice Star Wars open world game as um a rogue as it were as a hand soloes character um it's it's not what the mass people want to be in a Star Wars game they want to be a Sith Jeri or Boba fit Bounty Hunter they want to be one of those um so I can understand why it's not it's not just critically I just can understand why Mass Market appeal isn't there for it regardless of it being a Star Wars IP does this explain the general Ubisoft decline entirely it depends I think I think the decline is also partly down to the fact that it's it's open world fatigue the vast majority of games that Ubisoft big games that Ubisoft are releasing are open world yeah RPGs that take significant amount of time to complete yeah you've only got so much time in the day again when you're talking about Mass Market every game that they're releasing is 30 40 50 60 70 hours long yes every game well Prince of Persia earlier this year po yeah but that's a the M the casuals aren't buying Prince of pers I agree what they what they ideally what Ubisoft might need to do which they probably won't do is refine a single player narrative like small linear game something that they haven't done for a significant amount of time they need to do a linear game that appeals to the casuals that doesn't take up all of your week yeah to to even get close to doing something on it they need a 20 like a 15 to 25 hour game yeah that is Triple A and linear that's going to be Mass Market Appeal on the on the flip side then you've got the whole hooa around another Assassin's Creed shadows and things like that that's yet to come out we yet to see how that performs and whether or not it tracks well on how that's taken by reviewers when it releases but I think a lot of it's just down to to open world fatigue for Ubisoft to be honest um and even if you have a look at the shooters in in the likes of Tom Clancy um um games ex toy didn't do well yeah really didn't uh Rainbow Six has been okay but not many people play Rainbow Six Siege I mean it's old right six seven years at least Rainbow Six extraction didn't perform the ghost re the last Ghost Recon was good but it didn't perform as well as the Hop it should and again Avatar probably didn't perform World game again yeah Avatar also probably didn't really perform as good as it it was a good game was another massively open world game yeah yeah like everything is by the book you and this is why we say it's a Ubisoft title because everything regardless of the skin you put over the top of it is very much a Ubisoft game and everybody's got used to it okay just a big another open world game okay we go for this and we do these side quests and we do this and we'll follow the story and this open this up and open this map up and do this and no matter what that skinned in Blue Giant aliens or whether or not you're a bounty hunter in Star Wars or whether or not you're an assassin in Assassin's Creed or whether or not no matter what it is or your or you're um a troop in Ghost Recon matter what it is it's a giant open world game and it's it's just open world fatigue and we find it anyway in the vast majority of other open world games that are on the market sometimes we have to sit down and go right I need to stop I've just finished one giant open world game need a few smaller titles to to C completely cleanse the pallet yeah and where the hardcore where the people that play games consistently never mind the casuals if you going to trying to get into the Casual market and get your sales up and and hit that you need to have something that they can play and finish over the course of a a month not over the course of many months which is what casuals would take to complete one of these games well then you could also make the argument um that you get a lot of game for your buck you know what I mean um which can also be appealing but I I do tend to agree that there is a certain open world fatigue especially in a time where we we there used to be this this time around when The Witcher came out open we knew open World Games there would have been plenty out by then but it we didn't get like five good ones a year right yeah um and we are at this point now we had this year you know Dragon Dogma and we have um uh Dragon Age coming up and stalker 2 is coming up and we have in the midst of this now Star Wars and then Assassin's Creed and you have these good quality open world games but you got so many of those each year so I I agree that there is a certain fatigue around it I also feel like this I mean that's how the media works right negative headlines sell yeah uh and generate clicks and so on and it is it's it became kind of famous or popular to hate on Ubisoft you know people like to hate Ubisoft games but if you look at those games like I'm you can see the footage right now on screen right I'm playing Star Wars Outlaws it's a fantastic game I really do enjoy it but since it it became the norm to just ah yeah well it's Ubisoft it's and so on uh this is not helping them they don't have the Press anymore and I feel like they're taking way too much time to do the stuff that people actually want like the Splinter Cell remake yeah that has been announced what now four years ago or so yeah with a with a logo basically a teaser logo and um and that's it and where are those kind of experiences yeah um the division was super popular but it's they've they've gone off the grid there's no excitement around even though we know it's being made a division 3 yeah this takes them somehow way too long even though they are such a gigantic cooporation with so many resources and I know development times have gone up everywhere but kind of kind of feels weird to Ubisoft even though they launch on a regular basis great games they do yeah they are great games the problem is is they just they all they make is Giant open world games and I think they need to take a step back and refine that and start making make try making a linear experience yeah yeah try making a linear because they've got the capabilities to make these giant fantastic hyper detailed open worlds if they put that effort into making a linear experience with a great Story You've seen the technical capability they've gotten the snow drop engine you've seen how detailed di make word an avatar Etc if you refine that into a smaller or a smaller linear experience that's like 20 hours long 25 hours long yeah so many people will will jump on that and they'll experience something a little bit different it's is why people like the likes of the last of us because it's a little bit of a more despite the last of us two actually being a little bit longer than people wanted this time around yeah yeah but it's a little bit more of a linear experience you can you can completed in a set okay 20 hours yeah last one anyway not two 15 20 hours somewhere in that ballpark even then you have a look at other hyper successful linear games um that have come out and and done really well you don't have to be unbelievably long in order to to have a great time with some games yeah I agree and you don't want to outstay welcome and sometimes some of these games like like people with Valhalla you have to remember I enjoyed Valhalla but I still put 77 hours into it without doing everything and without doing the DLC you a lot of people that have played these games have put hundreds of hours into them like true and I can understand people going know that game is just too big it's too bloed there's too much to do yeah yeah it it is and it is and the one thing we can definitely argue about is they really don't take any risks in their game right yeah even though starb Wars Outlaws and Avatar the two bigger one most recent ones yeah I really enjoyed them they played it safe super safe yeah um but I have to shout out Hogwarts on screen at the moment um by the way on yours because I've just tuned into yours as well yeah actually we wanted to talk about a little bit that feels a little bit more linear yeah it feels more down a tunnel yes you can go out and explore the world Etc if you want to but you directing it down you're kind of directing it down a tunnel with this when it comes to the story it's like okay go and explore the castle and go to this this this and then you go over to this town and you do this and then you travel over this town and you do this by the ways too is the top priority for Warner Brothers now yes they came out this week right yeah yeah I'm looking forward I can't wait for that I you know because I smashed that game into Oblivion the first week it came out yeah and got the 100% um I loved that game loved it and I'm I'm I'm also slightly gutted that I have 100% the game because there's nothing left for me to do in it I have seen everything I have done everything I cannot experience that game for the first time again I I thoroughly enjoyed that game yeah um so I cannot wait for the second one and I'm intrigued to see what what um what the overarching villains going to be in the next one yeah even the timeline where they going really powerful like human Wizard or something like that I want as opposed to a goblin yeah yeah absolutely absolutely I can't wait yeah all right back to the community questions man uh the Hau Luke writes in and asks what do you guys think about the price tech of the next Xbox console will it be around 800 bucks too if the PS5 Pro sells well or will Microsoft take a different approach I think the Baseline consoles next gen will be 600 yeah I think so too and there will be a similar pricee point to for for handheld I still believe in the handheld man and I think it's going to be around the price point yeah I think I think the handheld could be anywhere between six and seven depending on what it has in it yeah yeah yeah yeah I could see that I could see that Donnie writes in waiting for wondering Dutch to be like how much yeah more like a common yeah yeah it was more yeah the whole price thing for me was mainly because it just doesn't do anything it doesn't do enough for me to justify partner with my money um yeah and it's and again we've we've spoken on the discrepancy On Us versus UK and Europe yeah yeah yeah it doesn't yeah it's it's way out of water it's way finite Rich writes in and says Concord hadn't released when he went on holiday and by the time you got back it had shut down yep yep they didn't even give me the chance man wouldn't have saved the game though what a failure man I mean we said it on on this show right that yeah this game is dead onaral in the hero shooter space way too much saturated Market space and genre to launch a game where you biggest competitors that are known and loved for the most part like your overwatches and so on um are free to play to launch the game at at the price Model of 40 is just it was Dead on Arrival and besides that the characters designs were super uninter uninspired and nobody cared for them uh which makes part of the fun of playing hero Shooters right and then um you could have seen the science latest with the with the beta where nobody played it right when it was free the beta was free free yeah nobody played it how would you expect anyone pay for it and then on the other hand like what did they say 8year development cycle $100 million in development cost you can add probably uh another another 20 to 30 40 million for marketing on top of that it's to spend that kind of money launch the game then take it down what 10 days or so after launch at least they gave refunds for those who bought it but they basically made zero money with this game they lost so many millions of dollars with it um it I honestly can't remember a game being shut down that quickly I I thought about it I didn't the other intriguing thing as well is the player numbers must have been that small that's only what willing to offer off their own backs full refunds for anybody who bought it of course it is expensive to run the numbers were larger Sony would never have said everybody who's bought this game is getting a refund yeah yeah yeah but running the servers the back end and everything the support is expensive I said that I said if it doesn't change something rapidly very soon there is absolutely no way Sony are going to continue thrwing money into the servers and keeping this game afloat yeah when no one's playing it and then everybody was trying to defend it oh I can find a game in x amount of time and I can find you that makes no difference that makes absolutely no you always played against the three same people same yeah the same people every time it's yeah it is do you think we're going to see it again are they going to like rework it to into a free-to-play model and then just launch it again or you think it's gone for good I think it's gone the the the thing with a freeo play model is that you have to build the game around being a free-to-play model which means that it would have to go back in yeah it would have a bunch of microtransactions in there you would have to on a freeo play model you'd have to have loads of skins weapon skins different power up you has have a battle pass like things that they originally promised oh the battle pass is going to be free as part of the 40 quid right now scrap that now we're doing a paed battle pass that you have to get every month and then you have to come up with a whole bunch of skins that you sell separately like the whole game needs reworked in order to make it a free to play game you know what I think they going to do with it yeah I think they going to they going to use the the base Concepts the maps and and what not gameplay mechanics they try to they going to rework it into a free-to-play model and then launch it probably with different characters uh skins yeah um under a different name because the name Concord is so burned now yeah there's no way you can bring back a concard again so they're going to launch it under a different name rebuild it to into a free toplay model and then just launch it again I if I think that I personally think they're just going to cut the losses on this and use it as an experience now okay that failed miserably what we're not going to do next time is we're not going to launch a hero shooter in a market full of free to play with hero Shooters with a price yeah we will not do that now so let's take this as a as a learning experience this didn't work it it the reason hell divers worked is because it was a Cooperative experience where you with your friends fighting against hordes of enemies yeah and everybody enjoyed it and they're all role playing and pretending there were um Starship Troopers and things like that it worked because of that it was a fun experience because of that for hell divers and that's still doing all right on the flip side unfortunately for Concord there wasn't any of that it was there was a handful of people this is a really good fun shooter like no no matter how much you shouted from the rooftops how much free advertisement you give this game yeah nobody is buying the game the game yeah yeah yeah so for me I don't know if the the development budgets we've heard and development time and I mean Sony bought the studio for that game right yeah which means that it was in development for a certain period they thought it looked great what they were doing so they bought the studio they then continued to fund that studio to finish that game so yeah likelihood is they were four four years into Dev cycle by themselves at that point I fully believe Concord if it was not owned by PlayStation would have probably originally released as a freeo play yeah yeah and Sony thought otherwise when they've tooken them over they went right okay we're funding it now so it's going to be this price and they they're thinking 440 is not a bad price but then you think yeah but respective to the entire genre that you're going into freet to play Hero shooters or the hero shooter section of the industry everybody else is free to play yeah yeah so you can't like Sony Sony just made a massive miscalculation I but I put a lot of the blame on on its issues on pricing on Sony I think the studio probably originally when they were first coming up with the concept was thinking right we're going to go in with a with a competitor for an OverWatch free to play Dr yeah yeah yeah so let's see where this is going so last question of the day comes in from Dave Ramos I kind of feel like we answered that already but just for sake of it uh we definitely want to shout him out by the way it's his birthday today so Dave happy birthday birthday um Super Chat that will make you laugh razor Ultron $2 Super Chat he says you made more from this Super Chat than Concord did oh yeah definitely definitely the Super Chat will not set us back a hundred plus million dollars so so no um I am more [Laughter] profitable Dave reos writes in it says now that we know the price of the PS5 Pro Care to guess what the price will be for the Xbox handheld and the Xbox gen 10 console so think we said that before probably round conso six seven for the handheld yeah somewhere in that ballpark all right Dutch that already brings us to an end of this podcast man it's been a blessed to be back after the two week break good to be back absolutely absolutely so let me shout out this awesome Community we super appreciate you all tuning in listening to us discussing gaming with us um means a lot of course also a big shout out to everyone who listened after the fact either you're on YouTube or Spotify or apple podcast or wherever you're listening um we super appreciate it I also want to say a big thank you for all the super chats that came in we really do appreciate them um as well as our awesome channel members um we your support whether it's through just tuning in listening whether you support with super chats or Channel memberships um we it means a lot it really does so we are glad to be back right and we I can't wait for next week's uh show where we are back of course but Dutch before we let everyone out here let everyone know what you are working on indeed indeed yeah I've been uh I've been slightly neglecting the channel as of late to be fair so I'm going to I'm going to do start doing a few more um streams in between podcasts um just gaming stream so feel free to jump in those those are usually very laidback just chatting and playing games um differentiate every other week I'm still chipping away very slowly I'll be chipping away at Red Dead on stream because I'm playing through Red Dead Redemption 2 as well in the background um visions and manner I'm doing off stream because I've already halfway I'm already two chapters in now so it's too late too late to start playing on that that on stream um but I'll be playing just random some random games things like that just chilling out with the with the chat um but other than that podcasting again every Thursday with yourself sweet sweet all right guys yeah again a big thank you for tuning in um we will be back next week and until then uh enjoy your upcoming weekend don't forget to game on [Music]