Episode #406 - Interview with Big Brother 21's Tommy Bracco

all right let's bring him in uh you know him from season 21 of big brother he also now hosts the Real Talk podcast fifth place finisher on season 21 of Big Brother it is Tommy braco Tommy what's up man what's up Steve you're the best thank you so much thanks for been a while since we spoke uh I know a lot has happened in your life we're gonna talk about all that stuff but I wanted to immediately jump into this season of Big Brother which is so I I have so many thoughts and you're really the first person I've been able to dissect at least you know five weeks into the season here exactly what's been going on and before we get to the actual contestants of this season I want to talk about kind of the theme and what you like or don't like so first off I gotta ask do you like three Noms in the bbai arena or no love it you do love it but I think it's overstate it's welcome yeah I think you know who is HOH first like Angela being in the position having to nominate three people first week versus Tor having to do it in week five putting up three NS that's like a cent she actually had a nominate four people that's a third of the house left more than a third of the house left so that's just it's too much it sh like I think that it's it's setting the H the HOH you're supposed to be taking that week to set yourself up because you can't play the following week and I think this makes it way more difficult for the HOH to do that I just don't think it's fair to the HOH to go on this long into the game because nominating three people now means something very different than it did the first four weeks so totally agree but I think it should have cut off a four weeks yeah that's what I'm at the beginning of the season when we found out this was it I said I bet you it's gone after four weeks well now we're in week five it's still not gone my guess is my guess is it's going to be gone in the next couple weeks because you can't do this down to five you can't have three Noms when there's five people left it's too much it's it's it's too much it's not right to the HOH it's it's not fair do you like the fact that one of the three has a chance to save themsel every week with the AI Arena love that love it love it love it now you're more of a you probably follow it and obviously you talk about it more than I do but and so you probably have a better memory of things all the AI Arenas that have happened thus far this season have they all been have any of them been any sort of trivia or memory game or has it all been do something in the quickest amount of time hasn't it there haven't been any memory or trivia in AI Arena has there I don't think I could be wrong no you I think you're right I'm going through them in my my head right now and I think you're right I think they're all time based it and they have to be because it it's got to happen quickly we're on live TV it's a live competition yeah so I think that's why but I do agree that the AI Arena competitions are a little stale for me I feel like they could use a little bit more versatility for sure well the other thing and and we'll get to it when we talk about Tucker is just the fact that well before we get to Tucker because he's the he is the most talked about contestant I think in a while on the show you and I share uh pretty much the same opinion of him and and I want you to repeat it once we start talking about it but which is the unpopular opinion too most people are obsessed with him they love him I mean I mean the fact that he got voted AI instigator which I want to talk about next yeah just goes to show like I understand that Quinn won the first vote but that was more of a vote for that was a negative thing that one right it was popularity thing it was kind of a negative thing this one was hey who do you want to basically cause chaos in the house well if they didn't like voted for him yeah so do you like the AI instigator twist yeah it's so fun it's great it's like uh America's player that we've seen in the past um it's awesome it's great but to me I don't watch for twists like the AI instigator I more watch for I feel like that's just like a fun casual viewer twist thrown in there that's just like it's just the it adds to the fun of the summer show but I don't think it really matters in terms of the game too much however I find Tucker's actions with the as the AI instigator very interesting and I think it supports how I feel about him how how I have felt about him and I'm taking it how you feel about him too he is more strategic than he's letting on he is way more calculated um you know that I I thought it was very interesting that Quinn the holograph of Quinn the first AI instigator yeah Persona whatever says mentally Tucker would be nothing without rabina you should have voted her out so in that moment not only is Tucker trying to put more Target on rabina but he's also trying to downplay his own Threat Level that's on purpose that is extremely calculated and smart that is smart but then don't go in the Dr and say that you only wanted to do that so you can hold hands on and out in public like he's not owning it in the Dr but I'm like there's no way that you were only saying that because you wanted to hold hands with rabina out in public that was way more calculated and I want to see that if that's the truth I want to see that in the Dr I I just don't feel the authenticity with his game all the time and it's bothering me yeah and I think the other thing is and this is what I have brought up is you know since this show started I've been you know been told about things in Tucker's past and shown videos I just you know when I watch Big Brother I want to see people be real genuine authentic and I understand that when you get in front of the camera camera and you get in the Dr you know you'll play things up and you'll you'll maybe you know who was the guy from your season that yelled a lot Sam that was his name he very very loud but like was guil I was guilty of it too like it it does happen like and and it's not fake I know what you're saying and it's not fake necessarily when you're in that position but your adrenaline is pumping through your brains that you're just up you are the up version of yourself so I do think that that it to you know play Devil's Advocate a little bit I think that we see that time and time again from the house guest myself included but I I give them a little bit more leniency with that because I I lived that and I am an example of that yeah you played the game but see when I see you Tommy in the Dr you're just a very animated person in general you just talk with your hands like you did that on the show and I I didn't think that that was anything different when Tucker goes in there and tries to act like Jim Carrey and has all these different voices that he does and it just it's it's just it's just a little extra for me uh for him like I just don't think because I have seen him on the live feeds where he just acts and talks like a normal person and I just wish we could get that in the Dr I don't think you were any different in the Dr not that you can't be excitable in the Dr so that's what I think for you you're just an excitable guy you're a very upbeat guy and it just comes across and and everything that do like I said you talk with your hands a lot and that's but you did that on the show he on the other hand like I said is doing different voices and like well but you goonna do that it's just that kind of stuff is driving me absolutely nuts now as for his gameplay yeah that's what I really want to talk about because that's where my I have these strong opinions yeah I I'm just confused on so this week okay so as we know you we're recording this Wednesday afternoon you're hearing this on Thursday so we haven't seen last night's episode but we know what happens uh cam won the cam beat him in power of veto he takes himself down and Tor puts up Angela so for the first time in a while I think it's the first time since Angela's HOH Tu Tucker did not win a power veto that he was involved in now um after this happened on Monday night I don't know if people have seen this but Tucker was just furious that that Angela got put up it's one of his top allies he's been saying he's going to go to the end with her and it turned into I'm not going to try in the AI Arena I want to go home I want to see my dog I I don't want to be here anymore and the second I started hearing that on Monday night I'm like this guy is way too self-absorbed he cares way too much about his status on this show there is no way he's going out as a quitter after just dominating comps for five weeks and in the last 24 to 48 hours apparent that has changed and he's absolutely going to try against MJ and uh Angela in AI Arena but just that he just is very very impulsive and I don't know if that is great gameplay and strategically like you said I'm just he's all over the map I don't understand what he's trying to do one of the biggest things in his mind right now is he wants to break the curse I guess he was the first one to walk into the house and that was just such a big deal to him I'm like he's focusing on micro stuff in terms of macro the overall thing and I just I don't understand it so what's What's your deal here with him all right so I just feel like honestly so I I did an interview with Brooklyn when she got evicted and that was pretty eye opening for me because I've gone back and forth I don't know what his motive is in this game is it to win the game or is it just to give us flashy TV because sometimes I feel like he's not really playing to win sometimes I feel like he's just trying to cause chaos because he does the game doesn't matter to him and he says that like you said he's threatening to leave he's been doing this for weeks and that was originally what rubbed me the wrong way with him is that we see him say no amount of money is worth this I'm gonna leave I'm not going to jury if I go to jury I'm walking out like I'm like you made him a commitment thousands of people would literally do anything to be in your position you you sound like a spoil brat like a sore loser like I don't have patience for that I I don't respect people like that it seems disrespectful to the game that I grew up loving so I get mad when I hear people talk like that um I love that he has caused this chaos and that he is people say they REM he remind them of old school big brother and I completely agree with that he's playing fearlessly which I love I love that he's not afraid to make a bold move but I just want to know that at the end of the day what's most important to him is winning this game and that he's gonna that he respects the the the game and I don't always feel that from him sometimes his actions seem a little reckless for me yeah I agree and it you know like not taking yourself off for veto fine but it's like the constant house meetings calling people out there's no I don't think there's any strategy behind it and then when you see him lose a competition he kicks and screams and threatens to leave yeah it's it's annoying me it's I don't have respect for that because to me it comes off as disrespectful so those are my thoughts on Tucker and it's polarizing because like like I said I love so many things that he's bringing to this season we the SE the show has been stale for a bit I get that um and it's it's exciting again I love that part of it but I just don't trust his motive I don't trust that we are being told the truth in the Dr by him I don't uh get authentic from him all the time and I'm just not always buying it and I would almost respect the truth even if it was you know as long as it's the truth but I feel like I'm being lied to by him sometimes and it just makes it just puts a bad taste in my mouth so I asked Brooklyn what her thoughts were on it because they didn't get along yeah and she and I I brought it up I said I feel like this I feel like this she said I think it's a little bit of both I think that he is motivated by these challenges he likes to challenge himself um and that's why the challenges are the priority for him but she basically thinks that he also likes to make flashy TV so so you know it's he's just a very per uh complex character and and I'm loving watching him but also hating watching yeah I want him out I want him out he's steamrolling the season yeah they need to get rid of him the first chance they can we've gotten a sneak peek at tonight's episode and Angela is apparently trying to take him out we've seen it on the feeds also yeah I hope that this house wakes up and realizes that now is the time to take him out because if they don't what happened in my season with Jackson I made that mistake I thought I can get him out later I'll hide behind him a little longer it becomes too late then they start steamrolling the the winning that those competitions is a skill that you cannot under like you can't Overlook that so I hope that the house guests take the shot as soon as they can as soon as he loses and for that reason we got to see this AI Arena go out the window so they have a better chance get ready getting rid of him okay so this this has been my thing is if you do want to get rid of him as long as there's two chances every week power ofo and AI Arena if you want to get rid of him you can't nominate him you have to only give him one chance which is AI Arena and you have to get him on a back door where you gota you you basically you don't nominate him you hope somebody that wins power of veto takes themsel off and you can replace them with Tucker so he has one chance But continuing to put him up and giving him two chances he's not going 0 for two we shown that he's so much better it's not like he's barely getting by Tommy he's blowing everybody out in these comps nobody's coming close to him you remember the one where they had to put the ball in the machine with the wind blowing he had 20 balls before someone had five it was a joke I know you know like that's what I mean I don't understand if they do want to get him out you can't nominate him you just have to I I hear you but I think that there's it's so much more difficult for the HOH with the AI Arena because a back door situation allows you to not it's it's way less less risky in a season without the AI Arena but should he win he's coming back with a vengeance yeah if you put him up and there's no opportunity for him for him to come off it's just by a vote then he doesn't have a you know you he skates by I think that this is a testament to Tor how good of a player she is that she is in an extremely difficult position like I like we said before it holds a lot more weight to nominate three people five weeks into the season than it did week one so she had to nominate four people and none of them we're looking at the end of this week none of them don't like her all of them love her the fact that she has four people that she put on the Block that all love her she's walking away from from an HOH like that that is such a skill she put Tucker up convin like I think here's what I think I think that t cor really wants Tucker out and she maybe is going back in fourth but I think that all along she had in the back of her head if he winds up going this week it's not a bad thing but she con essentially put he he volunteered but he didn't really want to volunteer and she just took that and ran with it I think she's playing Amazing um and so I just want to give her her flowers because I think that she really deserves them after this week um and she's somebody who nominated him from the gecko he lost the vitao we'll see what happens with the AI Arena if he doesn't win the AI Arena and they don't vote him out they are all stupid stupid stupid stupid they're gonna be making the same mistake that I made and I I hope that doesn't happen I really do now the problem is we don't know what the AI Arena competition is going to be tonight but that's why I asked you know has everyone been a time thing and and we do think it is I just I I can't see him losing to Angela or MJ I really can't I don't know what it is going to be tonight because when you have a trivia or you have some sort of memory thing that seems to even out the playing field because that's just he can lose at that hell he's only one what one HOH so it's not like he's dominating this isn't you know he's won six comps already this year um but I think most of them have been where you have to just finish something quicker than everybody else I think those are the ones that he has won he hasn't won memory ones as far as I know and he hasn't won trivia ones so but I just have a feeling if we get another hey time you gotta do this in a a certain amount of time he's going to destroy Angela and MJ and he's gonna be safe again and if Angela and MJ are the two up tonight I haven't looked in the last 24 hours but I'm sure they've talked about it on the feeds if Tucker wins AI Arena tonight who are they thinking who do they want to get rid of McKenzie it's Mackenzie yeah that's what they're saying and honestly I get it because the truth is like right now the strongest like core in the house would be Kemo Tor rabina and Tucker too Tucker's in there also for their game it's better to get rid of McKenzie and they've somehow con vinced all the outsiders to just go along with that plan I think that everybody else should fight to be keeping McKenzie I mean Angela's on the Block so she's fighting to stay in that case but yeah I I just think like of course they want to get rid of McKenzie she's the one that's more of a threat to their game and she I will say like I'm holding that hope that if mcken you know that McKenzie could win this AI Arena as well she's won once or twice I forget offand but she's up there in these competitions she's proved to be a competitor so I I wouldn't oh she won twice she won twice so I just feel like um yeah I I just feel like I'm hoping that she wins and that it's Tucker and Angela on the Block and then I'm hoping they take the shot of Tucker that's what I hope for and the reason because the the debate was after um tore won HOH and and once the power of veto competition ended and and cam had won that's where politicking started and that's where Angela started making it known around the house hey I'm not as close to Tucker you know Tucker's thinking that Angela he's he's just T he's riding with Angela to the end and she basically turned on him and that got out he had some very harsh words with Angela and told her like I've been your ride or die I'm the one that's kept you here and now I find out you're going behind my back wanting to get me out you're going up and that's you know Tor listened to it and that's why Tor put Angela up instead of of Leah so she wanted all along like that's yeah like shows you Tucker's power I guess Tor has gotten what she wants and somehow come out not look not being the enemy in all of this and I just find that so impressive I really do anyway sorry I didn't mean to cut you off keep going no no what I was say yeah what I was saying it's just like the the Sixth Street which is the four that you mentioned rabina rabina Tucker uh Tor and chemo with bringing bringing in Joseph and Angela even though Angela just kind of invited herself and said can I be a part of this I mean that's the six strong there's 11 left right and they they've got the numbers they could ride those six to the final six but Angela went behind Tucker's back I don't know if they've I think they've patched things up but if it is Angela against Tucker tonight like you say the only because you have no idea like again when Tucker as long as BBA arena is around I just feel he's gonna win one of two every week he's not going 0 for two because he's so dominant so if somehow he doesn't win AI Arena tonight no matter who he's up against if Angelo wins it and he's sitting there against MJ or MJ wins it and he's sitting there against Angela like you said you got to take him out if you don't he's winning this game Tom me I don't see anybody else with even half the resume that he has and I know I'm I know I'm not just going off comps even though he's a absolute absolute comp beast but I and and I'm gonna give him credit because he he's really good in these comps yeah but it's not like it's not like he's going up against people that I feel are providing any sort of competition for him like the wall I feel he would have stay I know he said it and maybe he's just talking and bragging about himself but I feel he could have stayed up another 45 minutes yeah Quinn had no chance against him again on the wall none none and I just don't feel like anybody's giving him any competition in these comps so I don't want to take it away from him but he's also who else just has a resume on the show maybe outside of Tor anybody else playing well no well also I just feel like don't you all want to have a chance at winning like yeah get rid of him so you got a shot like winning any of the comps like you said you no one's gonna win anything un as long as he's in the house and Tommy you you agree if he gets to the end he's winning right like I I don't see him not winning I would vote for him in a heartbeat yeah so yeah so you had a season where Jackson was a comp Beast right he won 10 11 right yeah I think 11 11 comps yeah which was I think maybe at the time tied for the most or maybe he set the record I can't remember he's still he still tied for the most one of them was a luxury comp okay um but people just like to forget about him and leave him out of the conversation but he was a force to be reckoned with he extremely dominant he was a he was a comp beast and I know that there are some people that are like social game versus comp game and yeah just because Tucker's winning all these comps doesn't mean he's the best player yep I mean like you just said if he got to the end you would vote for him and I think it would be he's he is playing well he's erratic sure he's impulsive sure but he is so dominant I don't think you can take that away from him in a season where anybody else's game right now I just don't see his their resume even half of what he's putting out there he's just so good uh and so dominant but the one chance you get you gotta strike or else you are just you're not gonna win coms going forward he's probably gonna rack up two or three more head of households at some point yeah doesn't he's gonna win some power vetos or AI Arenas like I think that the one difference you know we talk about Jackson from my season because he was also very dominant the between Jackson and Tucker is that Jackson waited until 40% of the season was like finished he didn't start winning until we were like a little bit into the into the game that's right Tucker started winning right away so I do feel like like we saw with Michael from bb24 um I think that we're going to see him get voted out at some point I don't think that he's going to be able to take this the away but um but yeah I I do think he's still a force to be reckoned with and I could see him winning this thing I just think that his path to the end is very difficult because of the way that he's played so far he's almost showed his cards too soon and it's just like okay he's a comp Beast if we don't get him out um he's going to beat us like you've spoken to all the eliminated contestants is the consensus is the the house will take a shot at him when they have a chance or are they saying is Kenny saying is Brooklyn saying Matt Lisa are they all saying no they're scared of him they don't want to take a shot at him well funny enough all of those people are the ones that would have taken the shot at him the people that are left in the house all have final twos with him yeah Angela was right Angela is right he is working closely with Tor and Keo he is working closely with Quinn now he is working closely with Rina he's working closely with Angela and Joseph he has a final too with everyone except for Leah and McKenzie yeah so I don't know what's gonna happen like if they don't I don't know if these people are actually just playing him and they really are just waiting for the they're using him until they have the opportunity to take the shot or if they actually are wanting him to stick around I can't really tell because here's the thing we see them talk on the feeds but they don't always say what they're actually feeling because they know it depends on who they're talking to yeah unless I'm seeing a combo between like Kemo and Tor that's those are two that I believe that they're going to always tell each other the truth yeah there's very few people like even when they talk to rabina they probably have in the back of her their heads she's gonna go back and talk to Tucker about this so they're GNA filter what they say to her so we could see them H saying one thing but they might actually feel something completely different and it's hard to sift through what people are actually feeling sometimes so with that said I don't know if they're going to take the shot at him when they get the opportunity or not because you've seen them say that they wouldn't that they want him in this house still I'm just holding out hope that that's not the truth and that they actually are just waiting for the right moment as someone who played this game yeah I'm just curious on how you feel about or how you felt at the time obviously you all know that the live feeds are happening did you do it the same way did you like hey I'm going to tell certain people like Chrissy I think is the one that you obviously were closest to in the house and you felt like okay I me you you and Christy were kind of like the Tor and and Kemo of this season you know you just feel like that is your ride or die and I just when you knew the you know the feeds are running how did you handle it and did you try and bite your lip on certain things because you didn't want anything getting out on live feeds that could be misinterpreted or taken a certain way or were you just like no I I know what this game is I understand what I got myself into I'm just gonna say what I feel how was your take on the live feeds honestly I really didn't worry about the live feeds at all I didn't think about them you forget that you are on camera you really do feel like you're in a house the only time that you realize that you're on a set is when you look up and see hundreds of Lights hundreds of cameras like every they keep them hidden in the corners of the room it's really they do a good job so you forget um I personally did not worry about the live feeds because I my number one priority was to win that game I would have done anything to win I I you know my season had a lot of controversy obviously and it's very interesting watching now as a fan and in mindsight because I would go in the my number one goal when I went in the house was not to be a perfect person to do the right thing to stick up for people and they deserved it that wasn't what was on my mind I didn't care about that I would have compromized who I am in real life for the game I would do anything to win and not pain a Target on my back but I just find it so interesting that fans of the show get so mad at people when they don't do the right thing in the house but sometimes doing the right thing puts a Target on your back and so the answer to your question is did I did I worry about the live feeds no I didn't worry about anything but winning that game but keeping the Target off of me and even if that meant not doing the right thing in real life if I saw someone being bullied I'd stick up for them but in the house no you you don't you don't stick up for them that because the truth is that could put aarg Target on your back and then you could get voted out and that was you don't want that to happen so I did not worry about the live feeds at all I truly forgot that I was on camera and I was just being myself and focusing on each week and just staying in that game so let's just say at some point in the next couple weeks Tucker goes out or just Tucker isn't in the final two and so you know get and he gets out I'm trying to think of okay now let's go down the rung of people left who who has built up a good enough resume obviously there's still plenty of game left there's over half the game still there is that's the thing we like we lose sight of that because so much has happened but we are still just in week five like we have a lot more game to play and if Tucker goes people will have the opportunity to build up their resume someone that I wouldn't write off is Angela for some reason everybody I know but some reason everybody that I talked to that got like evicted and stuff they're all still no one takes Angela seriously in that house and I can't understand why I think she like just painted herself as a crazy person week one so people are writing her off but viewer viewers or house guests both both honestly but I think that she's doing a great job like the fact that she was able to step back and say tucker you have final twos with everybody like who are you telling the truth with she's [ __ ] playing this game she's here to play I I got to give respect where it's deserved um I just think that she's more of a force to be reckoned with than we're giving her credit for um she's one to hoh's everyone wants to say that it was luck and write it off but it's two hoh's that most people don't have nobody else in the house has two hoh's except for this 57y old woman so she's doing something right she keeps Escaping The Block week after week she is painting Targets on people when she needs to her enemies keep leaving the house one at a time so like I don't know I think that she's got a pretty good resume I'm a huge tore fan I just love watching her navigate this game I think that she's awesome Leah is somebody that everyone's sleeping on she's managed to stay off the block and she has so many people fighting for her and it's kind of weird that they're fighting for her because she's not fighting for them so it's like kind of I don't know how she has this power over these people but she does it's working yeah I mean those are some of the people that I'm into right now yeah and you know Tor and Kemo you wonder you know obviously I think in their minds they want to be the final two and yeah you know and I don't think there would be any bad blood right now I think Tor has a much better resume uh than Kimo Kimo hasn't won anything right he hasn't really even been a threat in any sort of comp I just don't see anything where he would get votes over Tor if they happen to be the final two but like we said plenty of time left maybe he pulls a great game move at some point or directs a blinds side and can claim that on his resume we don't know yet but yeah I'd say right now now I think people could take Angela to the end because I think they think nobody's gonna end up voting for her like I don't know how wellik she is in the in the house she's doing well in in terms of staving off being eliminated yep but you know if Tucker took it if if this toome of Tucker and Angela ever got to the end I mean Angela gets zero votes I just don't think anybody's voting for her yeah I agree and I can't figure out why like why are they writing her off maybe in time she can turn it around and that would be even more impressive if she's just downplaying her Threat Level and making them all think that she's just a crazy person that they could write off but then towards the end she people start realizing that they underestimated her maybe she can have that game and that like a like a Nicole franel game in the first game first season that she played in I feel like I I could see it going well for Angela I could because they are writing her off I I might have my foot in my mouth if she gets kicked out this week but tonight yeah yeah but um but I don't know I just feel like she's I'm very impressed with her and I think that people are underestimating her skill level because she's so and you know what this is what I'll say this is the difference between Angela and Tucker like look how I'm like fighting for Angela and then Tucker I'm not into both of them are playing boldly fearlessly recklessly but I never question her motives I know that she wants to be here I know that the game matters most to her she would never threaten to leave she would never ever like she is appreciative and you can tell that this means something to her he just feels like a a spoil brat that kicks and screams when he doesn't get his way sometimes and I just don't have patience for it but they're actually very similar in that regard and I am look how much I love her and I'm I'll like fight for her in these conversations but for him I'm I'm not about it I'm over it yeah no it is it is certainly quite the dynamic and obviously we just don't know going into tonight you know I without knowing what the AI Arena comp is I I just assume Tucker's gonna win because he wins basically everything um so we we'll see and gosh if he is on the Block if somehow MJ or Angela beats him you got something wouldn't that be something if Angela wins AI Arena over Tucker and is is is the person eliminated tonight are they are they first person on jury or no we don't know that yet we're gonna find out usually Julie says Anie vition nights congratulations everyone here has at least made jury yeah I think we're gonna see that I mean usually they do either a nine-person jury or a seveners jury so I think that we have a little bit longer to go can you imagine if Tucker doesn't win a Arena whether it's MJ rangela and he gets voted out like one of the biggest comp beasts we've ever seen in the history of the show can't even make jury like it it's because nobody that didn't make Jury has I I you know I don't I only know the show from your season on your season was the first one I ever really watched um but I I can't imagine anybody in the previous 21 seasons in the first 21 Seasons won six comps and didn't make jurry and was eliminated before jurry there's no way right yeah right you're right he's it would be amazing because everybody's expecting him like if he gets to the end he's winning but yet he might not make the jury if he somehow loses AI Arena tonight and they do what they should do which is we got to take a shot so usually Julie will announce on it like on the live show on the live eviction episode congratulations you all made jury I wonder there's still time for her to announce it if he gets evicted this week and they just want him in the on the show there's she could reveal it once he's out of the house already they might have that plan in their back pocket just to keep him around yeah no I we've got a we've got 11 right now right but two but then there'll be two on the um the final final two so this usually the jury would have been announced already if it was a nine-person jury they would have announced it Thursday but because they didn't people are thinking it's going to be a seven-person jury so that the votes are can't be split down the middle they do that it's either nine or seven but they didn't announce it so people are thinking it's a seven person jury but if he gets voted out you're right I think they want him involved with this season the whole way I could see them revealing if he you know during his exit interview with Julie if he does get eliminated hey you actually made jury we're doing nine person we would have announced it last week but plot twist were we announcing it now what was your jury nine or seven nine I like the nine person jury I think that it's important I do yeah and so you guys had a nine person jury ever since your season do you know off the top of your head from 21 through 25 n they've done seven they've done seven people like last season was a seven person was it okay I don't remember yeah I don't my retention of this because there's so many episodes and they kind of all run together the seasons but I can't remember number of jury members each season last year was seven last year was Seven you think you remember yeah last year was Seven I'm pretty sure and I think the year before was seven as well was the year before cookout or was that three seasons ago three seasons ago and I think that was nine but I'm not 100% sure on all of this honestly that's right because going back going back well we can go from your season to now it was winners Jackson and then 22 was All-Star season right or was that 23 yep 22 was all stars during covid then the cookout then cout Taylor and then Jag was last year and now we're at this year wait who won All-Star season I'm already forgetting Cody Cody that's right and you know what I'll throw some flowers on his name too Cody's one of the best players that we've had in Big Brother history and people just don't like to admit it he's so good the fact that he made top two both times and the way that he seamlessly won all stars I just I love watching him play I think he's so good at the game so charismatic great at competitions when he needs to be big fan of Cody so this should be I mean it should be a hell of an episode tonight and like you said it's this is this is all coming down to the AI Arena and can Tucker beat Angela and MJ you would think he he could based on no matter what comp it is but you throw in a hey a memory thing or you know even that first HOH that Angela won where it's just hey let's just roll a puck across a board like something like that would not give Tucker any sort of Advantage unless I mean well he didn't win the first one so clearly but what I'm saying is something like that you couldn't practice at home nobody has a skill of rolling a puck across a board and Landing it on a certain number I mean that's I don't want to say luck but it evens out the playing field if you have something like that but if it's you know yes I will say I I think that people you know last year the competitions were I think that in the past big brother has not had Equitable comps that they've been like fair for everyone but I think that this year they have done a much better job at making them Fair anyone's game it's just it just so happens that Tucker is extremely well-rounded yeah like if you look at the different types of competitions that he's won they're kind of all over the board they they really are I know you're right that a lot of them are the timed ones the AI Arenas but in terms of vetos or um that HOH that he won they're kind of all over the place the comps are a lot more Equitable this year than they have been in the past which I appreciate I'm trying to remember now obviously he's one six we don't need to go over all six but the one where you had the plug and you're running through a maze and it couldn't hit something or else it added to your time he won that one right which I would say is a mixture of like athleticism but also just like patience and like using your brain and being smart so I think that in that regard I just feel like some these competitions are not just endurance the wall one is just endurance really but like pretty much everything else requires multiple skills and not just one it's not just focusing on one skill per comp if that makes sense did he did he win the one where um running across the boards and hitting the button for the score and whoever the highest scored did he win that one no McKenzie won that one was that McKenzie oh gez yeah that was forgot already with the balls when you had to knock them off the middle no no no the one where you had where you had to run you know on it's almost like um it seems like they they run this comp every season where you have to run across like planks and you have to remember you had to Sprint and hit a button was that I I I think he won that I think but I can't remember no you're right who won that one it was um McKenzie fell and was going to win that and was it Tucker or Cedric yeah was that Cedric's win see that's what I don't remember but that comp has always seemed to be there every season that was the beginning of Tucker's like winning streak I think that was the first one that he won okay yeah see that seems to be a comp that they use every year where running running across planks Y how far did you last on the wall I don't remember well that's so it's an interesting question because the wall were you out on that no I was I was top two on that one it was me and Jackson with that one oh but um uh what's it called so the wall comp used to last for hours and now it's it's not lasting as long as it used to they must be tilting it at a a sharper um angle than they used to in the past or something like that which is making it we're seeing more athletic men win that competition than we used to it used to be skinny tiny people like people with just like lean bodies um it could have been a man or a woman but I feel like over the last few years we're seeing more men win that comp than they used to honestly men used to not win that competition because they had more weight to hold on to yeah so it would only go a little bit and it was just easier for I don't I don't know I don't know what it is but we're seeing people like Tucker Jackson win that competition more now than we were in the past I think I lasted I I I honestly forget but it was it was a while and if if I'm not mistaken Tucker won it in like 40 minutes or something like that it was yeah and we've had some that lasted in the past based on what I I went on Wikipedia because I was like it's seeming like Tucker won this fairly soon and I was seeing like they ranked the longest wall winners yes there was like a three hour there was a few that were three hours back in the day exactly so there's no way it that far in someone lasting three hours you almost can't physically exactly and that's why we're seeing stronger people last because it's more about the muscle when you're going down at a sharper angle than it is just how long can your body keep going versus how much can you hold when you lost to Jackson again I don't remember but were you offered a deal were you just like and you couldn't take it I was at the W like I couldn't I really couldn't last anymore and he was like I'll give you a deal and I was like all right I guess I'll take the deal I get to play it in next week's HOH and I'm safe this week let's do it so I took the deal and you were you were you were done you couldn't last I was done I couldn't last anymore and he was an animal so he was going to last a lot longer yeah I mean he's just he was a put together guy he was big he was strong like exactly what you were saying like that's seems to benefit the wall seems to benefit those people now you know even though he's got more weight to hold on to he's also stronger so maybe it doesn't clearly works out a lot you know just he also I gotta like give him credit like he had a very just as strong as his body was his brain was just as was equally as strong he had a really like just when he like locked in there was no beating him yeah it was it was a mental thing too the um yeah I I mean I this is some great big brother talk this is exactly what I wanted to get to but I love that you love it now I love that you started with our season and then you just kept watching I love it yeah I just it's so good I love it I once I got hooked you know I just for 21 Seasons I was just like it's a show on three times a week it's on the same time as The Bachelorette in the summer I just didn't have the time to dedicate it yeah Ted gate to it and the reason I started watching your season was because I knew Holly we weren't close friends or anything right but she had been on my podcast before so I'm like I'll watch it and then I was just like okay I'm sucked in look it if Holly got eliminated in episode two I probably would yeah I W be would been out on your season H's another one like people don't realize how good of a player that she really was she won a lot of competitions yeah she won a crazy amount of competitions it just so happens that Jackson won more but comparatively speaking to other Seasons Holly won a crazy amount of competitions she stayed off she holds the record like one of the highest records for staying off the block the longest um it was me and her we got put on the Block the same week but uh she went on two days after me I think I went 79 days and she went 81 days something like that so but so her social game was incredible too she is somebody that like oh my God I would love to see her play again it just sucks because our season you know had so much controversy and it was so triggering for so many people and understandably so like I get it it it it makes sense but there were a lot of good players in my season a lot of people were there to play the game and they played hard and they were great competitors that just kind of don't get the recognition that I think they deserve and Holly if I'm not mistaken even won like late in the game when it was down to I think three or four didn't she win that endurance one where you had to hang on and it spun around she won that one didn't she she won that one and what was going on was her it wasn't until at least like halfway through the season where then she would win an HOH then Jackson would win the HOH then she would win the HOH then Jackson would win the HOH then she would win the HOH they just took they just literally kept winning they take took a chance a piece at winning the next one so they stayed safe for so many weeks yeah no it's they were good they were good yeah I'm glad I'm glad I've stuck uh with the show um I do I I definitely do enjoy it I don't watch the live feeds but I read yeah you know the Twitter and I'm just like okay I just a gist of what happened I I'll basically find out okay who won HOH Friday night who' they put up and then on Monday who won power so I just I keep up I keep up to date that way but I just don't have time to watch obviously the feeds and congratulations to all the people that that do have time and report it because yeah it's thank you for doing that because I just don't have the time for it um obviously Tommy we haven't had joh on since uh believe would have been yeah 20 when I was with cat so that was 2020 yeah that was during covid when you blindsided me and you had her on the call and you were trying to get me to talk [ __ ] about her but I didn't because I don't I don't I don't do that but yeah that was so funny typical cat typical the um you know it's it's it's funny because there's probably two things two major things that have happened in your life since then that I want to talk about you went on one of my other favorite shows you went on the challenge yes went on the challenge that was like a fever dream yeah like was it was so fun I'm so glad I did it yeah I got to go with anaise who was well oh going back to what we were saying before like you you mentioned like having a person that you can talk to and really be open and honest with in the game and not worry about what you're saying and who it's goingon to get around to I was thinking about it I really had a few people like that honestly in the game it was chrisy Analise and Jack those three people I felt like I could say anything to and I would trust that it wouldn't get around and that was that's something that you know that not everyone has in that game and and I think that's why I I always felt good in the house anyway so I got to piggybacking off of that I got to do the challenge with Analise and I am hoping that the world gets to see what she can what she's really made of without me because I held her back that's the truth like I'm so freaking tiny I'm not meant for that show it's just not my thing but um I had a great time I got to hang off of a building in Argentina that was unbelievable and I'm so glad that I did it but you would think that like I actually thought that it was way more difficult than big brother was and not even because of the physicality of the challenges it was more about the mental game like feeling like you are just a rookie and you're on the the outs and your days are numbered and you're you're just paranoid and trying to stay out of the elimination it was so exhausting um on the like night before we got eliminated before we went into the elimination um I was just crying and Analise looked at me we had s like such a real oh sh I can't say enough good things about her honestly she's incredible somebody else who really she just the world has not seen her potential yet but anyway she looked at me and she just said Tommy I can I know you like a book and I know that you are just being strong for me but I know that you're not okay right now and you can you can let your guard down and you can like open up and be vulnerable and let me know what you're really feeling all that that was all she had to say and I just the floodgates opened it was it was really tough really tough was was it always a hey we want to get a big brother team and we're kind of mixing and matching was it always going to be a Tommy and aise thing or was it thinking hey we'll put Analise with this person from Big Brother or we'll put Tommy with this person from Big Brother during casting for for that so no honestly people don't really real because me and chrisy had our uh connection outside of the game before Big Brother people associate her and I together which like we're still best friends like I of course like as it should be but they just don't they didn't associate me and Analise together necessarily but we were also best friends like she's literally like she's like my best friend forever I love her it's really like the people that I'm closest to are um analy sis I call her uh christe and Holly those the three the four of us like they are like my home honestly um and they're just the the best I love them them and everybody else like I'm still close with Obie with Nick with cat um with Nicole and I've developed relationships with all of them honestly but with that said what happened was I had been in for casting CIS had been in for casting and then they had this twist where they were going to do they wanted to do teams ride or dies and we basically just said we fit this theme because we're literally best friends yeah um we were probably one of the the handful of teams that actually had a real a strong relationship I would say that our connection before going into the the the game fit the theme more than majority of the other couples see I'm already forgetting were you Challenge USA or challenge MTV Challenge M the main the main show and that's the problem going on a show like that when you're not a regular like no matter how good you and Analise were you were going to be targeted you know that's the problem being a quote unquote rookie you know the Vets on that show not in a mean way or maybe sometimes it is a mean way they gang up on the newbies and they're just like you need to prove yourself like did you know going into that look Analise no matter how we perform unless we literally get immunity every week we're gonna be one of the early teams to go in because yeah I totally knew you knew okay was going because I wanted to have an experience like yeah it wasn't about I literally lost money going on the show like you don't make anything when especially when you're a rookie so I literally had to like buy a whole new Under arour wardrobe because you can only wear under arour so I literally lost money going on the show but it was you when you're offered an opportunity like that you don't say no because it's just an how many people could say that they got flown to Argentina and got to compete in these challenges run in the mud scheme hang off buildings with their best friend like that is something that I will say that I would pay to do actually yeah um so I knew that it was going to be a very tough road ahead but um it was more about just having the experience for me yeah I was gonna say you wouldn't you wouldn't trade that for the world at this point nope wouldn't definitely not the other thing that's obviously happened to you since 2020 is is you got engaged and something that obviously you're very happy about so tell us um were you I can't remember who proposed to who were was it a surprise and where are you in wedding planning going on with everything so um I met my fiance Joey in 2020 during the pandemic we met on hinge oh you met on hinge okay I was going to ask like where did you I I didn't remember but did you meet him on we met on hinge and we we got a cool story we we do like um I I I just love him I'm obsessed with him he's my my like he's my partner he's my best friend he's like a part of me at this point we live together he's downstairs working right now um we have our wedding day picked out April 19th I'm super excited it'll be great um and we both just come from big Italian families he's from the Bronx I'm from Staten Island so are we fit together like a puzzle it's great I'm I'm very lucky before you met him on Hing just out of curiosity before you met him on hinge were you were you new to hinge had you been on a bunch of hinge dates and you're just like God I'm about to give this up or whatever or did was he one of the first ones where were you with that I was talking to a bunch of people but I didn't go on a lot of dates necessarily okay because you only go on a date if you think think it's going to be worth it and I kind of just knew that it wasn't going to be worth it I'm sure that I went on a handful of them I can't remember offand it's honestly been so long at this point that I don't remember but um but I knew right away as soon as we went on our first date that I I knew that he was my person I did which is interesting because like you said it happened during covid so how did you manage the co thing because technically you weren't supposed to meet people yeah who who were new and you didn't even know them you know where they had been or who they had come in contact with how did you guys manage it because that's exactly how cat and I started dating we dated during Co and we were basically both home alone and we're and that's how we started dating yeah and we just told each other like hey I haven't been hanging out with anybody and I'm like yeah neither have I so we met up and we felt we were safe but same thing with you guys well okay so here's what I'll say and this is like the cool all right so when you meet on a dating app it kind of takes the element of Fate out of it because you're like oh you literally forced it you set it up you literally both went on an appp you matched and then you decided to meet up there's no element of Fate yeah that's not true with us because we matched in May of 2020 and we talked for a little bit but then it fizzled away I didn't know this at the time but he was not out of the closet to his family he still hadn't told his family that he was that he's gay oh okay that was always a deal breaker for me I would I wouldn't have dated somebody who was still in the closet and I wouldn't have wanted somebody to come out just to be with me either I wouldn't have wanted that pressure so that was a deal breaker for me if we would have continued to talk in may we wouldn't have worked out because I would have written it off so first week of August he comes out to his family on his own the week after I messaged him again and I said hey I don't know if you're still on this app but like what's up and I picked things back up if we would have continued talking when we originally matched it wouldn't have worked out but so I always think that that's a fun story because yeah you know you he hear dating app and it it makes you feel like there's no element of Fate but I do think that we were meant to meet and it it feels like fate to me so when you were when you first started talking to him in May of 2020 he told you I haven't come he told you I hadn't come out yet never I oh okay so you didn't know we didn't get that far so I had no idea so that's why I like had no idea but if we would have continued and gotten that far I would have written it off and he told you oh by the way I haven't come out yet you would have been like not when we when we started like really talking end of August and here's the other thing like what I was gonna get back to was how like during Co how was that meeting then I don't like I I feel like in the summer things kind kind of calmed down with Co like people were going outside a little bit more people were it was not going away but the the wave of covid was not at its peak and then it picked up back again in the fall yeah so because we were all still figuring out what it was but what happened was in March it really hit we were all inside and then by August we were kind of like in July and August we were like going outside again it wasn't spreading as much and then it picked up again and we went back inside but we met during the window where we were kind of like testing the water still a little bit and going outside as a society so we again we got lucky in that regard as well yeah cat and I were the opposite we met during the literal the worst time when it started but and that was just one of those things where nobody was doing anything and she's just like I haven't seen anybody in x amount of days and right I'm like well neither have I so clearly we should be fine and then you know are youing now what's going on with you no uh not anything serious um just talking and maybe seeing if something goes somewhere cool there's uh I don't really talk about it too much but it's always been tough you know um for me I just I I'm I don't want to say I'm picky because I don't think I am in terms of like looks I don't it doesn't I don't care about blonde versus brunette or tall versus short it's never been that with me it's just just for me I've always been very private about my personal life cat was the very first person in my life that became someone who other people in the Reality Steve World knew about you know because she had been on reality TV and people knew her and it took some adjusting uh for me and then to post stuff cat is obviously very photogenic she loves posting stuff on Instagram and I'm the opposite and yeah I'm not saying that ultimate led to our downfall it just I don't think if cat and I would have kept going I think that ultimately would have been our downfall it's just I wouldn't have been able to take it and you know nothing against her I have no problem with her being that way um I just know after a while I wouldn't have been able to keep up with it and I just knew it would have eventually set in but for now you know for me it's just like I someone that I date has to understand also the second I say even though I'm not any sort of celebrity I've never been on a reality TV show I am known within a niche audience of the you know the bachelor Nation whoever I do date once it is public that I am dating then they have to know that like they're gonna get judged and I just it's just a weird thing to put somebody through um because people are just gonna have comments you know most most will be positive but you know Tommy I I you know I wasn't going to bring this up but now that you brought it up I will you know you I'm sorry to put you on the spot I'm I just want to know problem I have no problem uh talking about that but it it reminded me of something that I saw about you know just talking about how judgmental people are online and you and and and your fiance have had put up a post I can't remember how long ago it was maybe within the last six months to a year about receiving hate uh online and you know I hate that you have to go through with it I that you have to go through that and it's just I I just I've never gotten it like that and obviously um being part of the lgbtq community that you are obviously we know it's it's easier for people to hate on people that are you know different from them and I just want you to kind of talk about it and just how how did you deal with it how do you deal with it still I mean I'm sure you get comments here and there um but did it put a strain on your relationship at any point like how does it feel to have to be marginalized like that and be put through that it's got to suck first of all I'm like laughing because I love that this is turning into a therapy session we were like literally like meeting up to talk about big brother I'm obsessed but all right so Joey my fiance Works in finance he is not in this world at all yeah but you know you say that um whoever you date has to understand this part of your world and it's it scares you sometimes it sounds like because it's it's a lot to put on a person and who didn't ask for it who's not in that world but here's the thing they are asking for it if they want to be with you that's what I've had to surrender to and learn it's a part of me this is what I do I I podcast I do Broadway shows I do reality TV shows that's Who Tommy is and so if you want to be with me then this is what being with me looks like you have to embrace and love this part of me as well and then you find what works for them and what doesn't you you have to have these conversations and talk about boundaries my fiance gets nervous on camera like he's not obsessed with it all the time and so we have to like pick and choose what we do and I respect that but he's also the most supportive um he's extremely supportive I I'm very very very grateful for that all the don't let that intimidate you like some like whoever it is will be okay with it and they got to be okay with it because that's that's who you are that's what you do and it's exciting that's the other thing like what we do is exciting we don't have a nin to-5 where we sit down a normal person job and and I think that that's that's why they're attracted to us in the first place like because we're not normal we're weird we're crazy and I think it's it's okay to embrace that and not think that it's something to to not be ashamed of but just like be nervous about or have reservations um I think it's I think it's something to embrace and just know that like yes it might be tough sometimes to get that hate online but think about how we got to go to the opening of this Broadway show think about all the exciting things that came because of what I do and it becomes worth it you just it gives you tough skin you know all that hate I don't even when I when someone gives me hate I don't even get mad I just like and I don't even judge them for it I'm just like all right they're at a place in their life where that's what they think and I hope that they find out that what they think is wrong one day and that I hope that they just come from a place of love that's it that's all you could do I just I I've just gotten tough skin over the years and um I I don't judge people when they um give me hate because I am a big believer in this is like one of my mots I don't believe that there are many bad people in the world I think that people just do bad things because of bad things that have happened to them I think that a lot of our issues stem from our childhood stem from our trauma and they cause people to do things that maybe they're not proud of or that hurt other people but I don't think that they do it out of a malicious intent usually I think that usually people just do things because you know hurt people hurt people that it's that saying um so it doesn't bother me I could go on so many tangents Steve I'm literally just such a talker I'm sorry but no it just doesn't it doesn't affect me I'm like I see it I like to more draw attention to it because I think it's important to know it's still out there I think that I'm blessed to live in New York City where and come from a family who does accept me and my fiance but that's not the case all over and sometimes it's good to bring awareness to the fact that there is a lot of hate out there and that people aren't as accepting um even though we live in 2024 and even though it's not in my immediate circle it still is out there and a lot of people are dealing with it and that doesn't fall unrecognized so um yeah he you know he's I wish that he wasn't in a meeting because I would honestly ask him to jump on and be like how do you feel like being like getting hate because he gets it too now sometimes and it's like you know he's he's gotten good at just dealing with it that's it you mentioned last thing here you mentioned Broadway shows yeah are you in one right now what was the last one you did or what's on the horizon for you well funny enough so big brother happened in 2019 and then for you know like six months after that or whatever however many months I was just coming off the high of the show I wasn't working I wasn't performing at that point I was doing appearances just in the reality TV world and then the pandemic hit and Broadway shut down yeah and it took me until this year to get back to Broadway I opened a new Broadway show this year it was called the heart of rock and roll it did not do well it closed but I've been lucky enough to jump right to the next gig and now I'm doing another show in New York called Titanic um and I'm performing again it's amazing I'm I'm very freaking blessed I really am I'm doing what I love I've got a bunch of different pots on the stove whether it be podcasting reality TV and theater um I'm doing it all and and planning a wedding and it's all good a lot of good things nice just out of curiosity have you seen the Back to the Future musical yeah and I loved it I thought it was exactly what a musical should be in 2024 great story great dancing Great Performances great music and the set is so immersive it's incredible I'm can't recommend it enough yeah it's coming to Dallas I think in March of 2025 and I'm definitely want to go see it uh because I've heard nothing but I mean everybody that says it says it's just awesome and I'm you know being a an 80s Kid myself absolutely obsessed with everything back to the future I talk about it all the time on my podcast I have seen the movie at least a hundred times I quote it to my friends all the time like this is I it'd be dumb of me to not see and you know I'm I've never been a huge theater guy I think I've seen I've seen Phantom and I've seen Wicked okay I think those the only two I've seen uh and I actually saw them in New York um and there might have been one other one that I saw but I can't remember it's not coming to me right now but Back to the Future I have to see it I I think it's here in March so I definitely I just want want to I I don't think I've talked to anybody I've seen the reviews everybody loves it the critics love it but I haven't talked to anybody who's actually seen it but you've seen it you it's great you love it you're love it you're going to love it it is so fun it it's like a great homage to the movie for people who are fans of the movie you get exactly what you want and more you don't you a lot of times when they do stage adaptations of movies people are either disappointed or like wanted something different they give you all the fans of the movie exactly what they came there to see and more it's amazing and speaking of movie you talk about stage adaptations of movies or how about or movie ad movie adaptations of stage are you Pro or anti- wicked as a movie Pro very Pro I've seen Wicked on stage over 30 times I'm obsessed with it I love it I love seeing I watch videos all the time I love seeing what all the different um actresses bring to the Glenda and alpab Baro I love that show and I'm so freaking excited I'm so excited I will be there at the first showing we're at we've actually my family and I have already spoken about getting tickets to the like like soon to the first showing as soon as they come nice I can't wait yeah no that's I I definitely you I don't know I'm be there first night but it's definitely a movie that I I I do want to see I want to see the interpretation and see how Now Grant I saw Wicked and on Broadway I or back in the day it's got to be 15 20 years ago like I got to refresh my memory on the story itself like I'm forgetting I'm kind of forgetting the story uh because it was so long since I saw it but um anyway Tommy thank you so much uh for coming on man I love to having you on I'm not going to wait four years to have you on again maybe make this a yearly thing talking at some point during every summer during big brother we get you on congratulations on everything and obviously we'll we'll be in touch man thanks Steve you're the best thank you you got it so good to talk to you bye