Psychology over policy: How Harris trapped Trump in the debate

HEARING MUCH MORE ABOUT THE CARE ECONOMY AS WE GO FORWARD. >> CHRISTINE ROMANS, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >>> WHEN WE WERE WATCHING THE DEBATE, WE NOTICED AND YOU DID AT HOME AS WELL, WHEN VICE PRESIDENT KAMALA HARRIS LAID A TRAP, DONALD TRUMP WALKED RIGHT INTO IT. DAVID FRUM OF THE ATLANTIC WRITES OF LAST NIGHT'S DEBATE THAT THE MISSION WAS CLEAR. HARRIS DEBATE PREP SEEMED TO HAVE CONCENTRATED ON PSYCHOLOGICAL AS MUCH POLICY TO TRIGGER A MELTDOWN. >> I'M GOING TO DO SOMETHING UNUSUAL, AND I'M GOING TO INVITE YOU TO ATTEND ONE OF DONALD TRUMP'S RALLIES. WHAT YOU WILL ALSO NOTICE IS THAT PEOPLE START LEAVING HIS RALLIES EARLY OUT OF EXHAUSTION AND BOREDOM. >> SHE CAN'T TALK ABOUT THAT. PEOPLE DON'T LEAVE MY RALLIES. WE HAVE THE BIGGEST RALLIES, IN THE HISTORY OF POLITICS. IN SPRINGFIELD, THEY'RE EATING THE DOGS, THE PEOPLE THAT CAME IN, THEY'RE EATING THE CATS. THEY'RE EATING THE PETS OF THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE THERE. >> TALK ABOUT EXTREME. >> CRIME HERE IS UP AND THROUGH THE ROOF. DESPITE THEIR FRAUDULENT STATEMENTS THAT THEY MADE. CRIME IN THIS COUNTRY IS THROUGH THE ROOF. >> I THINK THIS IS SO RICH COMING FROM SOMEONE WHO HAS BEEN PROSECUTED FOR NATIONAL SECURITY CRIMES ECONOMIC CRIMES, ELECTION INTERFERENCE, HAS BEEN FOUND LIABLE FOR SEXUAL ASSAULT AND HIS NEXT BIG COURT APPEARANCE IS IN NOVEMBER AT HIS OWN CRIMINAL SENTENCING. THE VALUES I BRING TO THE IMPORTANCE OF HOME OWNERSHIP KNOWING NOT EVERYBODY GOT HANDED $400 MILLION ON A SILVER PLATTER AND THEN FILED BANKRUPTCY SIX TIMES? >> FIRST OF ALL, $400 MILLION, I WISH I WAS. I KNOW ZELENSKYY VERY WELL, AND I KNOW PUTIN VERY WELL. I HAVE A GOOD RELATIONSHIP, AND THEY RESPECT YOUR PRESIDENT. THEY RESPECT ME. THEY DON'T RESPECT BIDEN. HOW WOULD YOU RESPECT HIM? >> IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMIND THE FORMER PRESIDENT, YOU'RE NOT RUNNING AGAINST JOE BIDEN, YOU'RE RUNNING AGAINST ME. I BELIEVE THE REASON THAT DONALD TRUMP SAYS THIS WAR WOULD BE OVER WITHIN 24 HOURS IS BECAUSE HE WOULD GIVE IT UP FOR THE SAKE OF FAVOR AND WHAT YOU THINK IS A FRIENDSHIP WITH WHAT IS KNOWN TO BE A DICTATOR, WHO WOULD EAT YOU FOR LUNCH. >> JOINING US, SENIOR EDITOR FOR "THE ATLANTIC", AND FORMER BUSH ECONOMIC SPEECH WRITER, DAVID FRUM. SO, DAVID, WHAT DID YOU SEE LAST NIGHT? >> I SAW A WOMAN WHO CAME ON TO THAT STAGE WITH ONE MISSION. MAKE THIS GUY LOSE HIS COOL, AND AN ADVERSARY WHO KNEW THAT WOULD BE THE MISSION, AND WHO KNEW THAT HIS MISSION WAS TO KEEP HIS COOL. SHE SUCCEEDED, HE FAILED. AND SO YOU'VE HAD THIS VERY INTERESTING CONVERSATION JUST NOW IN THE PREVIOUS SEGMENT ABOUT THE ECONOMY, ALL OF WHICH OF COURSE ARE TREMENDOUSLY IMPORTANT, BUT WHAT PEOPLE WHO WATCH THAT DEBATE AND WHO MAYBE DON'T PAY OBSESSIVE ATTENTION TO POLITICS SAW WAS A FORMER PRESIDENT, A MAN NOW NEARING 80 WHO JUST COMPLETELY LOST HIS COMPOSURE AND LOOKED SCARY AND RATTLED, AND FRANKLY, DEMENTED A LOT OF THE TIME WITH HIS CATS AND DOGS AND THE IMMIGRANTS EATING THE PETS IN THE PARK. AND SOMEONE ON THE OTHER HAND WHO LOOKED COMPOSED AND AMUSED AND WHO NEVER GOT UPSET. >> THERE WAS ANOTHER MOMENT, WE PLAYED IT A LITTLE BIT EARLIER, THIS IS DONALD TRUMP REFUSING TO SAY HE HAD ANY REGRETS ON JANUARY 6th, THAT HE WOULDN'T DO ANYTHING DIFFERENTLY WHEN DWIRCH THE OPPORTUNITY A COUPLE OF TIMES, AND CONTINUING TO SAY THE 2020 ELECTION WAS STOLEN, THAT THERE WAS FRAUD, EVEN WHEN HE WAS FACT CHECKED BY DAVID MUIR SAYING THEY BROUGHT A WHOLE LOST OF LAWSUITS, TRUMP TRIED TO DEFLECT AND SAID HE HAD NO STANDING, AND THAT WAS THE PROBLEM. THERE WAS NO FRAUD, NO PROOF TO PRESENT TO THE COURTS. THAT'S WHY THE CASES DIDN'T GO ANYWHERE. THIS IS WHAT YOU WROTE MONTHS AGO TO DEBATE DONALD TRUMP, SOMEONE DENYING WHAT HAPPENED IN 2020, DENYING AN ELECTION, AND THEREBY DENYING A DEMOCRACY. HOW DO YOU HAVE A DEBATE WITH SOMEBODY WHO'S NOT PLAYING BY THE RULES OF THE CONSTITUTION, THE RULES OF THE COUNTRY, THE WAY THAT WE SEE OURSELVES? >> THERE IS ANOTHER THING THAT DONALD TRUMP WAS DENYING, AND THAT WAS, I THINK, THE KEY TO VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS'S SUCCESS. HE COULDN'T SAY HER NAME. HE COULDN'T LOOK AT HER. HE COULDN'T ACKNOWLEDGE THAT SHE EXISTED. HE WOULD SOMETIMES TALK ABOUT HOW PUTIN DOESN'T RESPECT BIDEN. BUT HE'S NOT RUNNING AGAINST BIDEN, AS THE VICE PRESIDENT POINTED OUT. HE'S RUNNING AGAINST THE I DON'T WANT TO GOMMA TOUR PSYCHOLOGIST HERE. WHAT PEOPLE WITH NARCISSISTIC PERSONAL DISORDER CANNOT COPE ABOUT-W INJURY AND THEY SAY THE PERSON THATTIN FLIBLGTED THE INJURY DIDN'T EXIST. THE MORE SHE BEAT HIM DOWN SHE COULD NOT ACKNOWLEDGE THAT SHE WAS THERE AT ALL AND THAT TRANSLATED INTO A PERSONAL DISRESPECT THAT I SUSPECT MANY WOMEN NTED AT FIRST IN MAYBE A SUBLIMINAL WAY AND IT BECAME MORE AND MORIN SKAEPABLE. BUT IT SHOWS HE WAS OUT OF CONTROL. SHE WAS MASTERING HIM AND HE COPED WITH THAT BY PRETENDING SHE WASN'T THERE. SHE WAS JUST A SET OF PRONOUNS. SHE, HER, AND YOU. >> AND WE JUST SAW VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS GETTING OFF HER PLANE. WE THINK IT IS AT ANDREWS. THIS IS ANOTHER IMAGE THAT JUST CAME TO US A MOMENT AGO. SO THIS IS NEW TO ME AS WELL, DAVID. THIS IS PRESIDENT BIDEN AT SHANKSVILLE, ON THE THE MEMORIAL SITE FOR THOSE WHO DIED ON 9/11. AND HE GAVE A HAT TO A TRUMP SUPPORTER SAYING THAT THE COUNTRY NEEDS TO GET BACK TO THE BIPARTISAN UNITY AFTER 9/11. SO THE TRUMP SUPPORTER TOOK THE HAT AND SAID YOU SHOULD PUT ON THIS HAT AND DONALD TRUMP BRIEFLY WORE AS YOU COULD SEE IN THIS PHOTO, THE TRUMP HAT. I IMAGINE DONALD TRUMP IS USING IT. HE'S USING TRUMP WAR ROOM AND TWEETING THAT OUT. THE GESTURE THERE WAS MEANT TO SHOW THAT WE COULD GET ALONG DESPITE OUR PARTISAN DIFFERENCES. AN HARRIS WENT AT THAT LAST NIGHT AS WELL. SHE WOULD LOOK AT DONALD TRUMP AFTER HE WENT ON A RANT ABOUT EATING PETS OR HOW TERRELL THIS COUNTRY IS AND GOING TO HELP AND SHE SAID WE'RE BETTER THAN THIS. WE COULD RESPECT EACH OTHER. WE DON'T NEED TO GO BACK TO ALL OF THE HATE THAT HE'S PITCHING THE AMERICAN PUBLIC ONCE AGAIN. SO WHEN YOU SEE THAT IMAGE OF PRESIDENT BIDEN, I GUESS, WHAT DO YOU THINK? >> WELL HARRIS HAS A COALITION THAT NOW SPANS THE RANGE OF BERNIE SANDERS TO DICK CHENEY. THAT IS A LOT OF TERRITORY. AND PROBABLY THE PEOPLE IN THAT COALITION MAY NOT AGREE ON VERY MUCH. BUT AT LEAST THEY AGREE ON HOW THINGS SHOULD BE DISCUSSED, HOW THINGS SHOULD BE DECIDED. WHAT ARE THE RULES OF THE GAME. OBVIOUSLY SANDERS AND CHENEY DO NOT AGREE ON WHAT THE RIGHT HEALTH CARE POLICY LOOKS LIKE BUT THEY COULD LOOK AT THE RIGHT WAY OF DIEDING HEALTH CARE POLICY. IF ONE ANSWER HAS 52 VOTES AND THE OTHER IS 48, EVEN IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE 52 VOTES, IT WINS. YOU TRY TO AMEND IT OR TRY TO REVISE IT LATER OR COME BACK TOMORROW. BUT TOMORROW, IF THE SIDE 48 PICKS UP ONE MORE VOTES IT IS 52-48, THE OTHER WAY, THEY GET THEIR WAY. CHENEY AND SANDERS COULD SPEAK ON THAT. AND THAT MOMENT WITH THE HAT, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LIVE TOGETHER. AND I THINK WE'VE ALL OBSERVED IN OUR PRIVATE LIVES THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE BEHIND TRUMP ARE NOT AS DERANGED AS HE IS. HE'S BRINGING OUT SOME OF THE WORST ASPECTS OF THE AMERICAN CHARACTER TO BE SURE. BUT THERE ARE RESERVES OF GOODNESS IN EVERYBODY. AND IT IS NOT WRONG TO TRY TO REACH THEM AND SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT, WE'RE ALL GOING TO HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER AND AS FELLOW CITIZENS, IT CAN BE DONE. >> DAVID, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. I KNOW I'M -- WE'RE ALL JUST DIGESTING