Paralympian Chuck Aoki talks Vikings and going for gold

hey everybody welcome to another episode of purple Insider a very special episode Matthew caller here and I am here with the co- captain of the US wheelchair rugby team Chuck Aoki also maybe the world's most gigantic Minnesota Vikings fan I am in Ann Arbor Michigan so that means I flew here just to talk to Chuck uh there's an article also coming out on his journey as well so make sure that you uh keep an eye out for that over at purple insider.com but we are in your living room here open concept for those fans of uh House Hunters but I am absolutely thrilled to be here with you and I am incredibly excited because the Paralympics are coming up once every four years you get a shot to chase gold so why don't we start out right there with how you feeling man like how's your summer how exciting is this for you to have another chance you have is it two Silvers two Silvers and a bronze and a bronze and this is another chance to chase gold so how you feeling well you know at the moment obviously the highlight of my summer is being on the purple Insider podcast uh and then from we'll just there we'll just see where we go from here hard to imagine we could get much higher than this no uh feeling excited you know uh we just I've just wrapped up a training camp uh with the team a few days ago uh we've got one more to go we leave for we will leave for Paris on August 20th uh so a little bit of time to go until that date but no feeling good you know it's one of those things you you work until the last possible minute so that when you get to the games you just sort of give it all youve got so team is feeling good we've got a balance of six first-time players six veterans who've been do at least three games so really interesting mix of sort of Youth and experience that I think will be they'll be exciting you know I'm I'm excited to see what the team can do but uh it's going to be a battle you know it's not easy they don't they don't just give it to you you have to earn it uh so it's going to it's going to be good but excited really pumped for it um and yeah it's my fourth game so I've done this a few times before but it doesn't it doesn't stop getting exciting it doesn't stop being something you really just you get a you get a feeling in your stomach that's not like anything else for it well I definitely want to go through the sport for those who have never watched it before the last Olympics was the last time I watched it because of you because you're a purple Insider loyalist and so we have talked many many times and I was like man I got to see Chuck play and uh what you don't tell people is that you're like Randy Moss out there so I want to I want to get into that uh but also I've I've been seeing you everywhere that you went on Kelly Clarkson show and you actually made Kelly CL Clarkson cry uh in talking about uh Tokyo so what has it kind of been like to you're you know you're on commercials you've been doing a lot of interviews and and really carrying the torch for this Sport and this Paralympics yeah I mean so I guess I'll do that part first and then we can dig dig into the the the the wonderful sport that is wheelchair rugby AKA murderball um but no it it's been exciting you know I started my career uh the London paral Olympics from my first games which is 12 years ago now and you know if you had told me 12 years from now then it's like oh by the way you're going to be you're going to be in National Commercial you're going to be on Kelly Clarks you're do all these things I was okay like sure whatever you say uh but it's happened you know it's been here we've seen incredible growth in the paralympic movement we've seen incredible growth in sort of awareness interest and excitement behind it you know I think you referenced Tokyo appreciate you watching but unfortunately a lot of people weren't able to watch it was tough it was obviously Co a lot of things happening it was a um it was a tough games for a lot of reasons and we're just excited to really get back to the spirit and the energy of the games you know the passion is going to be there people are excited uh it's it's been amazing to see the growth you know I think you've seen so many different like Brands and partners come on board and and in just interest media interest you know to talk about these things and so I'm excited you know I can't wait to see uh it's been it's been overwhelming at times certainly I look at my schedule I'm like oh my God how am I going to fit all this in how am I going to get all this done you know cuz at the end of the day without the sport it doesn't really matter what all the stuff is you still have to compete and perform at a high level so it's been it's been a challenge sometimes for sure to balance all that and I I have a new appreciation for when athletes professional athletes talk about well it's just tiring some people like how tiring can it be and it's like okay it's not it's not working in a coal mine of course but it's tiring you know you're on the road a lot you're waking up at different cities you don't know where you're going it's uh it's exhausting but I'm just uh I'm excited to be doing it and sometimes uh you on television unlike this great podcast you fly all the way to was it La is where Kelly Clarkson is or York in New York okay so you fly all the way from Michigan to New York and you're on for three minutes and then you're just done and I guess you do other stuff uh but television kind of works that way uh is but you talk about the travel like that's a lot to do just to go on for a couple of minutes but I I did want you to tell the story though that actually did make Kelly Clarkson cry because look since you've been gone it was a banger right about the time I was graduating high school I don't know how many times I listened to that show so I'm a fan Kelly Clarkson but actually it was a great story that you told about uh being the flag bearer right at uh in Tokyo and what that meant to you so please please tell our audience for sure yeah and when you said it's totally worth it I think I'd fly halfway across the world to hang out with Kelly clarson for 5 minutes so uh no it it really was so you know something that people I think maybe know about the Olympics and Par Olympics every there's something there's the opening ceremony it's how kind of the games kick off right and that starts with you know Parade of Nations every single nation comes in and and each Nation selects a person to carry the flag you know literally lead them into you know I think it's probably a a military thing traditionally which is like you know the flag be is when who leads the charge you know you're there and so uh for for Tokyo I was you know amazingly wonderfully selected to to be the flag bear for Team USA which is just this incredible honor this incredible privilege because there are so many great athletes who've been around and done so many things and been around for longer than I have S have all kinds of amazing stuff and they they pic they picked me you know they picked me to be the to be the flag bearer and you know the reason that that meant so much to me and why it was so exciting is because um you know my family's history in this country is was is is a little checkered I guess to say the least you know I'm Japanese American last name is a it's a very Japanese name and in during World War II my great-grandparents grandparents virtually everyone on my father's side of the family was actually interned during World War II and they they hadn't committed any crime they were just Japanese and in that time um you know the United States said we're going to lock everybody up this is what we're going to do um it was not the right decision of course my great my grandpa actually invent ended up enlisting in the Army Reserves after so anyway very loyal um to this country but either way it doesn't that's not what matters what matters is it was an unjust thing to do but what was just really cyclical and incredible for me is that you know that was only two generations ago that this country had put my family in in prison essentially and then two generations later here I was leading Team USA out it was just you know it's one of those amazing stories that obviously we don't you don't ever want to forget history and you know you don't want to say transgressions that happened are like ah well it's a long time it's okay it's it's you still remember it but it's incredible to see we have come a long way in this country and the way we view people and we still have work to go in many areas of course but I think that was that was a really special thing to to having to sort of you know reflect on as a as an athlete and really my journey and my identity as you know yes I'm an athlete I'm a disabled person I'm Japanese American I have all these identities and it was really cool and I think of course to do it in Tokyo is sort of this cherry on top like oh this is where my family is from uh historically in life was a really really really cool really special moment um when I was you know it was unfortunately of course we marched into an empty Stadium which is no one's fault uh just the way the world was but it was it was still a special moment to get to share with with my team and Team USA yeah it's such a great story and it's so much part of your DNA and to be able to do it there I mean that would be a great honor either way but to have that to be so um steeped in your family's history is is incredible uh so let's talk about the sport a little bit here um and you uh have been playing this since you were a little kid but I love the story of how because you and I have known each other for a while so I I know your story and I've watched your interviews and so forth but obviously my audience has not but how you discovered wheelchair rugby and I would highly suggest the the movie murder ball which goes into where it came from the roots who plays it and so forth but you first start off with basketball and then found yourself and there's going to be a connection here with football eventually to be um aggressive and enjoy physical contact so I explain how you came across wheelchair rugby and why it fits in your athletic skill set yeah so yeah you referenced it I I grew so I'm I'm from Minnesota should we should I don't think we I don't think we said that well he said that you're bit you're a humongous Vikings fan but I we are in Michigan right now so Vikings fans are everywhere we're worldwide baby we're Global um yeah so from Minnesota from Minneapolis and so I grew up there you know loving Sports of course uh but I you know had to start using a wheelchair when I was about 10 years old full-time and my parents start of said okay you're going to be active you're going to play sports like it's going to happen so I you said I tried a lot of things uh basketball is the first sport that I real like okay I like this I I learned early on I was a ball sport kind of person I wasn't a swim as fast as I can kind of person I wasn't uh you know push a chair as fast as I can from a straight line person I was like I got to have a ball I got to be I got to be doing stuff you know so I grew up playing basketball I love that sport but then it was actually murder ball that I saw and was like oh my God there's a sport where people can crash into each other and talk trash and smack this looks awesome like I want to try this sport of course so I did uh I showed up to a practice in Golden Valley Minnesota courage Kenny shout out courage Kenny I did a practice there I got um and I got absolutely annihilated for two and a half hours straight like just it's a physical it's full contact right so I got beat up for for two hours straight um and as those things naturally go I fell in love with it instantly because that's what you do when you play physical sport where you get beat up right um but yeah I fell in love with it you know there there was there's nothing else quite like it when you when you have a disability no other sport that just let you get out there and just sort of go for it you know I think and not unfairly so sometimes you get when you're disabled you're sort of treated with kid gloves and oh we got to be careful and then again that's valid in a lot of circumstances but this was the first time I was like oh no no we're just going to you're just going for it like it doesn't matter what you think you are getting out there and and you can't back down you know it's like it's like in football if you're out there and worried about when you're get hit that you've already lost you've already lost the plot right you've already lost the game so so yeah so I I saw a murder ball I showed up to a practice and I weighed probably 140 lb soaking wet and my they were like you want to play I said yeah they're like okay here we go and that was oh geez seven 16 17 years ago now and here here I am still going and it really resonated with you but also you realized right away that you were pretty good so what is the path look like from just trying a sport for the first time to now Olympics you know again par Olympics again uh for the I mean just how did you get from point A to point B yeah so you know I I had a lot what what helped is that you know for folks who probably wouldn't be as aware Wheelchair Sports we know we use different wheelchairs like you're probably familiar with you're famili with the hospital wheelchair you've probably seen wheelchairs people use everyday life the ones we use for sports are very different the wheels are set wider they're basically built to go fast and turn fast um but they're just they're a lot bigger uh and so playing wi basetball gave me a lot of what we call chair skills so I was pretty good at manipulating the chair turning the chair going quick up and down what I was really bad at in basketball was shooting the ball which really I am told that that is important to be really successful seems that way I mean you can be just a rebounder or something I say you Donis Haslam made a made a career out of not being a great shooter uh but I also am not quite as big as yonis Haslam or Rudy goar uh I can help you with that elbow in just get that elbow in Tri I tried when you can't feel your hands it's actually very tricky you consistently the same way every time um so so so anyway so I was really good at a lot of things but I was kind of missing this one critical skill which I could still contribute you know as we know in basketball there's a place for the the gritty just Defender type but real rugby I found when it was like okay so I get to go really fast get to hit people which I don't really get to do in basketball uh I have to pass the ball which I was pretty good at passing and I don't have to shoot I was like oh this this might be the sport for me and so I you know had so I had almost a decade of experience playing wheer basketball so I had those chair skills developed and then yeah I showed up to the sport and I was you know I i' worked hard I my team was ranked my wheelchair basketball team was ranked number one of the country at the time really good yeah so I had to work really hard to stay and compete and you know I was a starter on that team again I wasn't the main scorer but I was I was out there so I had to work hard so I brought a lot of physical skill to the game and then on top of that I just I said it eliminated the one thing I wasn't very good at so I started playing and you know the team we we we we had we were kind of an up and cominging team uh we had a guy named Joe delve who is longtime us teammate now the head coach actually of the team so my coach which has been kind of a wild experience um he uh he was on the team with me so we kind of grew up together playing in that development level and he and I um took us to we were playing there's two divisions in the US there's division one division two oh there's division three now actually um we were division 2 so the lower division but we took the team to the national championship for division 2 our first year and no one had ever heard of us like who are these where do these guys come from you know so we showed up and we didn't win that year uh we probably had a little too much Huish we made oh we made it we got this and then we we're beat by a much more experienced team um but then essentially what happens and this is true of a lot of paralympic sport interestingly enough is that there's not really a okay now you've done this you now go into the talent pipeline for this or the development program for this it's sort of like you show up to Nationals the head coach of national teams there coaching his club team other national team players there playing for their teams they look around and kind of say oh anything interesting they're like oh we got this kid from Minnesota who seems like he might be good and you know they watched me and they were like oh yes he does seem pretty good so I got invited to go to triy outs that um that what would have been December of 2008 uh for the national team and I showed up there and again did pretty well uh so I'm I you know I pretty much made the team my first attempt which is pretty unusual again I like to say it's not as simple as I just picked up this Sport and was good at it instantly right like I spent plenty of time being bad at wheelchair basketball and learning the skills of that before I just showed up to this other thing it was like it just happened that a lot of the skills transferred well right uh which Sav time but so I made the team in 2008 and here we are in 2024 I've I've been on the team ever since oh the way that rosters are designed is different levels of disabilities and there's a point system right maybe you can explain just your disability and where you fit in into that system yeah so very briefly on the system uh the the we players assigned what we call a classification score uh and whe rugby ranges from 0.5 to 3.5 with half Point increments so 0.5 1.0 1.5 Etc four on four on a court the four players total cannot exceed eight that's for of so you can do it different ways you can do it a lot of different ways you could do for example two three-point players then two onepoint players you could do four two-point players all over the place so with my my my ability I have pretty significant impairments in my hands but I and I have but I'm pretty significant in my legs but I've got a little bit I've got some core function little bit of leg function um and so I fall on the higher side of classification I'm a 3.0 rug I'm the second from of the highest right so I've got a lot of function so I do a lot of the ball handling a lot of the sort of coordinating passing things like that um and so with me if I'm going to play sort of like great awesome we then if you're going to play you're going to have to have a lowo player to go with me like just by definition and so one of our main lineups on the US team for example is a three a 2.5 a 2.0 and a 0.5 mhm and so we call that a balance lineup because we've got three players who handle the ball a lot one player who is more of a defensive kind of specialist we like to say and offensive picker kind of like Al lineman in some ways um but other countries will run what we call like a high low lineup they'll run two 3.5s so the highest you can possibly have and two 0.5s the lowest you can possibly have and so there's a lot of strategy that goes into deciding what you should do where you should put people um and it's a it's a huge component that people don't always realize about paralympic sport in particular because again I always say the the equivalent I say to this it would be like if in the NBA said okay you can have a 7 foot player that's fine no problem but if you're going to play a 7 foot player you've got to play someone who's under 56 right and it's sort of like huh but then people hear this oh that makes sense that makes sense cuz right now there's the reality is you'd have to be how many people under 56 there been like two or three ever mug and Nate Nate Robinson's was 5'7 I think so like it's under 6 feet is virtually impossible right and so it's same concept because you know in Paralympics Sports the reality is you can't you can't control your level of function necessarily and so that way you're competing against when you're trying to make a team spot you're competing against other people with the same functions you are at least in the same band of function not it's not like the guy with a c C6 spinal cord injury who's paralyzed from the chest down and has only really can only do his biceps he can only really do this he's not competing against me he's competing against other people like that and likewise I'm only competing against people who are in the same sort of band as I am in so it makes it for coaching and roster design another wrinkle that you have to consider which I I think is fascinating because some teams take different approaches with the points it's almost like those uh internet things where build this team for $500 that's how your paralympic team is put together in the same kind of way uh but your specific disability like uh kind explain that yeah so I just I the the Baseline is don't have any sensation for my elbows down and my knees down so at a baseline I just don't feel anything what that leads to though essentially is um injuring myself because I can't feel it so when I was I was six or seven I broke my leg didn't feel it walked on it not good for a leg believe it or not do that definitely not don't do that at home kids uh so so yeah so that was essentially my childhood growing up was injuring my legs trying to walk around um slowly sort of deteriorating them until the point that I can still walk a little bit uh but uh by and large use a wheelchair to get around cuz just what preserves what I have left the flip side to that then was as I started to use a wheelchair uh my hands would get in cuts and infections I would lose parts of my fingers um which I always say the whole silver line to all this is that to be eligible for wheelchair rug you have to be impaired in all four Limbs and without that hat I wouldn't be eligible for wheeler rugby so it kind of comes full circle but yeah essentially at as core I just don't have any sensation and you know it's interesting and football players maybe would disagree with this pain is actually a really good thing for our humans in some ways because it Prov prevent us from doing things that would lead to further deterioration of our function uh and so for me it's like I I don't have the pain I don't have this heat cold sensation so I have led to injury I've gotten and and admittedly as a as a younger person I was perhaps a little more careless than I should have been with how I sort of live my life but uh but i' I've stabilized now like I said I'm pretty level my function where I am now and like I said it's just it's allowed me to play this sport that's incredible so it's sort of one of those you know a door closed but a window open type things so I watched you a lot in tried to catch every game and uh you score a lot you score a lot because we would we would talk Vikings and we would message you you know you'd ask questions for the mailbag and so forth and I knew you were on the team but until I actually watched you I didn't realize how fundamental you are on the team uh but give everybody a sense of what your role is and how it works like how do you explain to people when they say what what is it that you do oh well what do you say yeah well I said I say well I play wheelchair rugby and they go oh wheelchair rugby they used to be called Murder ball they go oh oh yeah wow okay wow that's pretty wild um it really is unlike any other sport out there it's really a mix of a lot of things I meet people who are knowledgeable about rugby able bu rugby and they kind of get they go well how do you do this I go well we don't really do that and they go oh okay so it's really a mix of wheelchair bassball it's got a little bit of hockey elements to it it's got some rugby elements to it the way I always describe people is you know football you can run to the end zone and catch the ball you in rugby you you have to carry the ball across we have to carry the ball across to score so that's that's there's some similarities but I I tell people it's it's h at first it looks like just highspeed bumper cars chairs are crashing people are flying bodies are everywhere balls are going around but then the more you learn about there's actually quite a bit of tactics to what's going on you know the the the main goal of the game is to literally all you're trying to do is cross we call it the triy line with the ball in your possession seems pretty simple and you do within 40 seconds but there's a lot of strategy going sort of back to the team makeup that you talked about that matters so think of reference we run what we call a balance lineup so that means there's three people on the court who they have the ball well oh no worries they've got it they'll push they get stopped they'll pass the next guy pass the next guy versus some teams uh like we said run these more high low lineups where they have two guys who they really only want those two to have the ball as much as possible and so they'll run a lot more like pick and rolls so and we run some too don't get me wrong but they'll do a lot more like okay they got a Defender all right we're going to come hit this guy off so he can get free this person is going to the lowo player is going to pick this person so they can get around it there's a lot more sort of picking and maneuvering and then just going really fast as opposed to sort of methodical okay get the ball from here to here now from here to here now from here to here and off you go or from here to here here to here off you go so it's it's an interesting combination of like I said a lot of different sports there's a little bit of football element in that each play starts with an inbound it's every like people are moving quote unquote pre- snap but the ball person with the ball ball is just sort of sitting there so there's it's really an interesting mix and um I appreciate you watching first of all but I think folks you almost have to watch it to really get a grasp oh I I can kind of see the different tactics evolving again at first it just looks like a bunch of people in wheelchairs crashing into each other but the more you watch it the more you realize oh he hit that guy not this person because he knew he was going to catch the ball and he didn't worry about this guy catching the ball or something like that and there is a score clock you have to score in 40 seconds which keeps it moving back and forth and no I really enjoy the high paced nature of it where it does move very quickly which you explained to me earlier that there was a rule change where it used to look like a har off there used to be no shot clock and so it was like pass pass pass they say basketball before the shot clock looked like like James name naysmith era oh yeah basketball I think where it was like pass pass again pass again pass again yes where there was no three-point line and there was no shot clock although in Minnesota you know this that the high school basketball didn't have the shot clock until teams would get ahead and then just pass it around what I know anyway uh so that must have been less entertaining than it is now but it moves quickly when you're uh when you got a breakway this happens to you quite a bit is what I noticed you feel like Randy Moss is that who you're thinking of when you're when you when you have a break away the ball's coming your way you look it back to catch it are you Randy Moss I think when I make a really cool catch I do feel like a good receiver sometimes like sometimes I'll stick my hand hand out and pull something and like that was pretty cool I can't Carter I can't I can't feel my hands and I did that um yeah a little Carter a little Little J I I do think actually sometimes when I I will admit in the moment you're more thinking kind of about the next play because Sports very important but I think when you go back and watch you know it's not quite the same as getting absolutely crunched after you make a catch and but there are times where I'll catch it and then immediately get hit by two people I'm like oh that's that is kind of like when Jefferson when you go across the middle and just squeeze it and just have you have to hold on you know you don't have a choice uh so yeah no I don't I don't it's more of just the cool catches you feel you're like that was that was pretty that was pretty cool well the reason I ask is because that you are a huge Minnesota Vikings fan and you were 7 years old in 1998 so that's maybe a little a little early for you there with the memories but growing up in Minnesota and developing your Vikings fandom and what we were talking about a little earlier before we started recording is just you're not just a casual you don't just sort of keep in contact a little with the Vikings and see them on Sunday you are truly obsessed with the Minnesota Vikings every roster detail you you read all the purple Insider articles and so forth uh why as you have kept up with your journey here which takes up a huge amount of your time have you still made as much space as you do for the Vikings in your life well you know I think you we said I'm from Minnesota that's that's home and it's always been home and I've you know I've lived a lot of other places I've enjoy I've enjoyed my travels and I enjoy doing the things I get to do but I think you know following Minnesota and I should say Minnesota sports too although the Vikings probably rise to the top you know following Minnesota sports has always given me that little tie to back home right it's always felt like I always text my buddies like what's going like you can't really know hey what's going on and you know you check in on them but it's not quite the same as like hey I'll see you this weekend it's like I see him every few months at best right and so I think it's always been just yeah it's my tie to home you know it's always been you know that little connection I have with friends or with my dad or or whoever about oh yeah the Vikings are doing this they doing that and and also I think when I'm when I really fall in love with something whether it's go to rugby whether whatever it is and Vikings are in this in this realm you want to know everything I I do at least I want to know every detail I want to understand because I think having spent a lot of time in sports in my life you know there are interesting details to everything right whether it's play how do we evaluate players how do you decide which players is going to be great how do you decide that was a good performance that was a bad performance outside of the obvious sort of situations you know and and how do you do that how do you think about who the the four fifth string person's going to be how do you decide to come up with that how do they how do they think about that you know like I think that's one of the most fascinating things to me and then of course just the sheer complexity of the way modern NFL offenses work right there's so much depth and complexity to it I as a athlete I always find interesting like pushing myself forward and so you know I'll watch how line pass off a a stunt right because it's it's essentially like defending a pick and roll it's the same concept it's obviously different because they're standing but you can watch ways of how they get their leverage Point how their balance matters how their angle matters a lot and I try to learn something from it too and I think that's that's a big part but overall it's just you know I I just Minnesota is home and I I bleed purple and gold and so I think that I I want to fall it I want to know every detail and that's the beauty of you know places like purple Insider and the explosion we've had and development a media like this is there you can learn everything you can learn about these things and and really think about them intellectually too and not just have to say well he scored 20 touchdowns he's amazing it's like well yeah we didn't need that but what can we actually learn about you know why Patrick Jones is really not very good it's because this this or this or we can say oh Andre Carter is maybe doing a little something interesting you know I I I find that fascinating poor Patrick Jones he didn't do anything he just got a driveby he didn't do anything but get a PFF grade below like 5050 right it uh quite a bit below unfortunately uh I think that he in a better role would probably be okay more of an average player but he was asked to play so many snaps just to just to clarify in case Patrick Jones sees the interview and is unhappy that he got slammed right there uh but W with the Vikings in particular what I know about you is that you really have a deep appreciation for Underdog stories and I and I think that this comes from for you that your sport is rought with Underdog stories there's a lot of people uh who have gone through very traumatic things in their lives and use Sports and uh my wife is actually going to be broadcasting paralympic uh basketball wheelchair basketball on on both the men's and women's side and she's reading about how a lot of these people became uh you know disabled and the some of the stories are just absolutely remarkable from things that they overcame to be here and I I think that that is a connection with you with certain players that you know how difficult it is and also you being an athlete at your level know how many people try and Cann not get to that level so if you are the fourth string running back and you came from Tulsa or something how how did you overcome all that and it's never-endingly fascinating so I think we agree on this but you are going to have to explain your obsession with Matt oata this this is when you told me that your favorite player was Matt oata I was like excuse me I don't think I should have to defend that in the slightest to the purple Insider Community but I will I I I I think it's unusual I would say it's unusual I would say he's my well he's one of my favorites for sure um well you know that so I'm try to i i i i as as I get older I I have a hard time remember the exact years but there was the one year Matt aat kind of burst onto the scene so to speak and was like this little I've always really appreciated for the lack of a better way to put the bowling ball running back back not and I obious enjoy all of them the shiftiness is great things like that but the bowling ball who just sort of like goes out there and just somehow just rumbles forward they're not going to blow by you they're not going to Juke you they're just they just R and they just and they just keep running and they just sort of keep going and it's really remarkable to watch them keep moving forwards and it's it and I've amazed it and Matt oata was the first one I remember doing this this first sort of bowling ball I remember just oh he's just still going oh he's just still going Plus scored like three touchdowns in a game which is incredible and I think as a kid I was wow that was amaz wow he's going to do that all the time and fun fact he did not do that all the time he did not but I I I really enjoyed it he seemed like a pretty good guy you know too he seemed very you know friendly and just affable but some something about the bowling ball running back has always always been a you know a favorite of mine I I do think the bowling ball is kind of going out unfortunately you know we don't we don't have as many bowling balls these days but uh but no I I I again I don't feel I need to defend m my f a fendom but I will happily do so I just mean that if you asked a thousand people for their top five Minnesota Vikings I think you might be the one out of a thousand who says Matt ASAT that's not related to him I believe it was 2014 when he and Jerick McKinnon split the role after Adrien Peterson let's not talk about it and all that uh thing that happened there but the somebody thunder and lightning baby thunder and lightning is uh but this is somebody who probably had almost no chance to carve out an NFL career and found a way to do it in this specific role and while he was not a superstar he was a contributor and could do a lot of different things for them and had a lot of toughness and grit which you and your sport uh requires a lot of the that toughness in order to do it so here's the thing every week on the written side on the newsletter side we have a Friday mailbag and I'll tell you what shows up in my DMs pretty often from Chuck some sort of Friday mailbag question so I'm here I came all the way to your house did what do you got what do you want to ask exclusive just to you mailbag questions whatever is on your mind about the Minnesota Vikings you can ask me oh my gosh and actually give your own feedback to my answer which usually you just read my answer right oh okay okay I was going to say I can answer my own question that's kind of a that's kind of an odd well I guess really for me I think the question that is currently cuz you know we're in that sort of between things regard I'm curious to know and this is this will be a little more I usually put a lot of thought into my questions by the way I really you know something concrete I think the biggest one for me right now is where where do you think this defense is going to fall because they've they've they've added players who are good I think that's I think that's just a fact they they lost a couple who were good too but they Hunter specifically but they added lots of good players and I think you know you you talk about and you hear this a lot it's like defense is variable and they were I think good for some of last year but then not very good last year which maybe correlates with quarterbacks they played huh weird how that works but I am curious where you think the defense is going to fall just based on the talent collection and then of course that Bri we we we Brian Flores knows what he's doing he's good at his job yeah I would say that that will depend entirely on the health of their secondary uh because if you're talking about sha Griffin Byron Murphy Jr and maai Blackman they are going to have to hold down significant roles and if you can't cover people you can't do anything defensively and we saw this last year when Byron Murphy went down they were a totally different defense even I think it was in the Cincinnati game he got hurt and he kept playing but wasn't the same and then they took advantage after that and it was never the same the defense and even though he didn't have the highest PFF grade that was a starter and it was someone who could handle a lot of different things at at least average to above average level and when he went down and it was a Caleb Evans having to take over that big role it was just not the same at all and that's the biggest weak point because if you go through the other parts of this team like the defensive line interior D line is a major concern but they can rush the passer off the edges they've got tons of Versatility they have three safeties who are excellent they have now two linebackers I don't think people realize how good Blake Cashman was they did not sign him because he's one of us they signed him because he was in the top 10 by PFF last year he has to stay healthy though because the next guy down is kamu gr Hill who has been a journeyman kind of backup special teamer type that guy's not supposed to play five or 600 snaps the health of Jonathan grenard the health of Andrew van GLE these guys have all been banged up throughout their careers if everyone were to stay relatively healthy and we're not talking about getting into the uh you know deep depth of this unit uh I think they should be somewhere between 10th and 14th that it's not quite a team that is Le uh ready to get to the elite level and they do have a very difficult quarterback schedule you go through there's a lot of proven quarterbacks which is kind of how I look at it is how how much can you rely on here but with flores's brainchild the amount of different things he can do with people they brought in like Andrew van gingle who again was just absolutely excellent last year if these guys are healthy and they're playing a lot then I would say Fringe top 10 defense yeah I think you know to answer my own question and to respond to you do we agree yeah no I I tend to agree I I've always you know I've always found the the coverage versus pressure I for pass rush pass rush debate really interesting because you know and it's like it's like the meme of what is the meme of where it's like uh when the Bengals are drafting either Jamar Chase or pan Su is like well if he has if no one's in front of him he can't throw Mar chase at all it's like Well turns out he could can actually um but i' I've always I've always leaned and i' I've come to trust my intuition on things a lot not all the time but like my intuition was always that past rush mattered more that was just my intuition it was like it made sense to me that if within what is it like a quick pressure is like under two seconds right if someone's in your face in under two seconds that is going to make a difference now and I and I still believe it does make a difference but I think the reality too is quick pressure rates for good players is what like the it's not it's not actually all that high when you consider how many snaps happen in the game correct so if you're talking about immediate pressure under two seconds that's going to ruin every quarterback all the time his correct correct and we saw that in the Giants and Patriots Super Bowl with Tom Brady but pressure that's more around 2.5 to 3.5 seconds is often on the quarterback and can be prevented if the quarterback is good enough and that's how good quarterbacks have lower pressure and Sack rate so I think what you're getting at is even if they have these players who create pressure unless they create insane instant pressure all the time which is not realistic the corners are going to have to do their jobs yeah exactly and I think that's why I've come out to I think I still believe that quick and as you said quick pressure is the best pretty much still the single best thing you can do as a defense as far as I'm aware um but the but to but to but beyond that the corners have to be able to stand up and and sha Griffin is apparently going to be like he's going to solve the defense he's going to solve the tell us which which you know if we consider a weak link system and you upgrade one of your weak links to a pretty good player here we go I've always thought that the gap between average and great is similar to average and awful so if you go from awful to average that is a massive upgrade not not quite in the same impact way as going to Greatness but that it matters a lot to to be average that's not like a you know that's that's a compliment in a lot of ways to an NFL player the question is really can sha Griffin be average when early in his career he was at times but he was also cut from his team last year in the middle of the Season which is not a huge selling point to Canen he be average it it doesn't it doesn't fill you with confidence but at the same time you know it's a situation I think we've talked about this where if you believe in the organization that said this is a this is a good person for us we think this is good and obviously they didn't have their pick of Any Corner back they wanted they had to pick what was available but if they identify and said this is a player we want you know it's at a certain point as a fan you have to say all right these people this these people do know more about this than I do particularly what makes a quarterback really really good right I have to trust that they know what will make a quarterback good and trust that they just you know I mean let's be real Brian Forest put together defense last year at some points that really didn't have anybody particularly great on denil Hunter on it and they were really good I think trust for Brian Flores specifically is or it kind of depends on who we're talking about cuz maybe Ed donatell would get a little less trust in this uh situation okay one more give me one more give me one more mailbag question okay wow well that was that was the high level that was a good one yeah well let let's let's let's let's see here what I guess you got to ask something about the quarterback don't you well okay yeah I guess what I'm what I am still wondering about the quarterback is what I'm trying to think of this obviously s Sam darnold to me is the fascinating example right this is a player who has been really really bad like just objectively really bad outside but you've obviously watched a lot of his tape you've kind of gone back and looked at him what what have you seen from the the the in the tape that existed that makes you say that okay that could actually what what has he shown other other than the physical tools I think we know the physical tools exist is there anything besides that I guess that gives you hope and terms of seeing decision making seeing I'm just curious if there is something other than his physical tools seem good we believe in the coach Kyle shanan was really happy to have him his backup go all right so the answer was going to be physical tools that was going to be where I started uh I'll give you this that if you only watch Sam darnold play in his last seven games so you only watch and this is a bad way to do it I understand that you can't just say hey Chuck remember all those bad games you played let's forget about focus on the recent good ones but if you only watch the performance when he was not with Matt Rule and not with Adam gase and he's only with Steve wils and then Kyle Shanahan in that one start that he had and when he came in against Baltimore you would come away thinking this could be an average Quarterback there's some times where you can't believe what a bad decision he made and there's also a lot of really good throws on that tape and there's some complete games and you can also see how the smarter coaches tried to protect him a little bit tried to allow situations where he could scramble because he's very mobile and maybe was underutilized by his previous teams you can also see where they went with some quick and easy stuff where they went with a lot of play action and RPO stuff to make it a little bit easier for him as opposed to let's just drop back on third down and long all the time and what Levon Bell was saying on Twitter is absolutely right like they ran a ton on second and 10 when he with the Jets they and and I looked at this his numbers when he was playing on third down and long he throws masses of interceptions on third down and long but not third down and long it's still above average but it's not horrendous like you can't believe how many interceptions in turnover worthy plays and his turnover worthy plays were significantly reduced from his previous times in those last seven games now how much weight can we really put on a small small sample that I'm not sure but it's when he had the better coaching and a better design for him that he played better and if he was able to give 17 games if they have to of that type of play you can be in the playoff hunt uh but if it's the play that he was you know in New York then you're not then your season is going to be over pretty quickly but I don't think that's the same player I mean that's six years removed from that and a lot of different circumstances including the universe's greatest wide receiver which cannot be understated and I I have to say I've been chuckling a little bit and look I do think Jordan Love's going to be good I think the Packers are good so you know but this idea that it's better to have a bunch of me receivers than the greatest receiver disagree you know why because I've watched Justin Jefferson and I don't think that it's wrong to look at what Nick Mullins did last year and I know you're a fan of Nick Mullins and say if he just throws it to Justin Jefferson you got a chance to be in every game they they they they almost beat the Lions which were objectively a good team trying to win the game without TJ hackinson I think they're missing somebody else too I can't quite remember they and they oh that's not the one they should have won the first one's the one they should have won and Hawkinson got hurt in the game so for half of the game not they could have easily won both of those games with literally just Nick Mullen in in Madden he was hitting snap and he was pressing what he'd probably be the B receiver he probably whatever the top route is in that he was just hitting the same button over and over again and it it almost worked like it's just it's it I don't want to call it Preposterous because it's not Preposterous to say hey if you just give the ball to the best player on the team yeah it will work really well but it was it was just comical to watch so yeah no that that uh that makes sense I I'm I I said he is probably the most interesting you want talk about an Underdog Story that's trying to come back from really really struggling one I think we've said i' I've I've believe this I think you've talked about this the NF knows like there is a reason he has stayed in the league this long right it's not like he was in it this is they just cut him off as rookie dealing I'm said all right let's give this guy a try no he's stuck around teams have looked at him and said there's something here a lot of different football people and of course we spent the first bit saying maybe the first group of football people weren't the best football people but they they also probably knew a little something about football so Carolina gave up a second round pick for him and and if he's good enough for Kyle Shanahan he has to be at least good enough to try for you right and he beat out Tre Lance who they traded everything for and when you consider that they probably didn't want to do that they probably didn't want to to tra to trade away their guy that they spent all those draft picks on then it does kind of make sense and I think they picked the perfect Bridge quarterback because if it doesn't work out you didn't P play pay that much but he is if all the most intriguing players in this training camp number one is McCarthy number two is Sam darnold then you could switch them uh because adversity comes in many different ways and for him he's been through this whole journey and if you're still here and still getting chances that means P people believe in your character as well and I've gotten that sense uh this has been a great pleasure of course to meet you in person we had breakfast this morning you crushed a giant burrito we had a we went to a great breakfast place here in in Arbor it's beautiful I've been driving around and stuff great place uh the Paro Olympic games are coming up I'm nervous for you I know that you're like that's cool man whatever but uh this is this is such an exciting time for you headed back to Paris uh for another chance at Gold uh where can people learn more about your your sport where can they watch it let me know yeah no I appreciate the time and glad you've enjoyed your time here in Michigan uh you know I think uh folks can follow uh me and the team uh Chuck Aoki on pretty much every social platform Instagram is probably the main one I use along with Twitter X whatever it's called and all those other things um you can also follow Team USA witer Rugby Team USA uh and then yeah the par Olympics kick you're you're hearing a lot about the Olympics right now which is fantastic you should watch them you should watch all them the par Olympics will start uh Opening Ceremonies August 28th uh NBC Peacock all those platforms you should be able to watch literally everything you could possibly watch I want to watch so make sure you check it out it's uh it's going to be a very exciting uh time yeah apparently your dog is a fan of diet Dr Pepper saw that just took your bottle down grab my bottle there um it's been so much fun following your journey and there's a lot of times where I'm like that Meme that's pointing at the like when I see you on television or you went to the White House yeah I've been to the White House a couple times that's yeah that's pretty cool so uh Chuck aoke make sure you follow him on whatever social media platform you prefer and again just an honor to be here to meet you in person to do this show with you and uh for you to give me an opportunity to write an article about you as well the uh one of the world's largest Minnesota Vikings fan a Minnesotan going for greatness going for gold so thanks again man I really appreciate it and thanks everybody for watching listening it's purple Insider thanks for having me