8 Dynasty Players That Terrify Us!

Justin Herbert [Music] welcome into the football G Dynasty show it is me your host and then with me as always is our Dynasty Captain Jeff Bell and then we have brought in a very special guest Jeremy Pope and we are talking about shaky Dynasty assets we're talking about the guys that we've seen the data or tweet or an article that says this guy could suck for various reasons and then we ignored it for various other reasons and now now that we're close to week three and we're close to the the cut date we're left to sit and stew with our decisions um so let's dive into those decisions and we'll start with Justin Herbert and he's a guy we've talked about a couple of times on the show I don't think any of us are saying that he's garbage but I will think I do think that it's not just about Justin Herbert the Chargers as a whole we've really got to come to realistic expectations of what they're going to be and especially after the injury for those of you who watch the uh the Adam Hutcherson podcast like he has a foot injury that could bother him all year and when that's the best part of your offense and your offense isn't very good you have to wonder what they are so right now he's football guys qb1 and then on on keep trade cut um I think he's he's going to he's the qb11 as well do we think that that is the end for him like that's the bottom or do we expect him to fall a little bit further guys because I mean like I said I think it's worse than what people think I think you're there so my concern I think the adjustment already happened and I was a little bit bullish on where the value was sitting on Herbert to come into the season one because I thought his athleticism we haven't really seen seen that translate in rushing like he does have that ability to do or I thought you know a better team maybe a better smarter coaching staff maybe would improve some efficiency because they will throw the ball they're going to throw the ball More Than People realize but I think when you add the foot injury in eliminating any Mobility this year plus the narrative that we're walking in I do think this offense is going to struggle and so that that's where you're starting to snowball things and that's my biggest concern with Herbert we've already got negative momentum towards him and so when there isn't one of those like either the efficiency or the rushing that can kind of pull him back up into that Elite territory you're just going to be stuck with a tough year yeah I agree with that J go ahead Jeremy no you're good I yeah I mean I have Herbert at 10 so it's kind of in that same real realm there I think that like Jeff had said as far as the overall production from this offense I think they'll be more passing long term than we expect this year is a little bit of kind of that down year we mentioned the injury with the plantar fitis so like that's going to be something that may even linger for him all year and it might not be a pretty year but that might open up a window to kind of go ahead and and get him on your roster just because I do think all said and done a year from now maybe lad makoni hits maybe Quinton Johnson resurrects his career maybe we see another receiver added next year and like this offense will throw Greg Roman can throw the ball and he has in the past they haven't at other times too because of what they had for assets at the quarterback position and as well as the wide receiver position so they want to run the ball but they're going to have to throw at least enough in the efficiency numbers he's going to be a low-end qb1 would be my guess at this point I think the the highend ceiling we saw a few years ago is probably gone that's passed it's not going to be there anymore but still a guy that I'm going to buy the dip on because I think that they's still quarterback one Seasons left in Justin Herbert long term especially with a guy that has a contract that hasn't pretty secured yeah and it's um it's it's like you said man especially with the Greg Roman thing people always bring up his his uh rushing numbers and you know how high rushing volume he normally has and particularly just how low of a passing volume has and you want to compare him to the Ravens and again you think about Lamar Jackson and Colin Kaepernick it's one of those things like we talk about wide receivers playing different positions yes technically Lamar Jackson and Justin her but are both what I think are Elite quarterbacks even we just saw pton Manning have both of them as top five quarterbacks they're almost different positions and what they play and how you operate an offense so to me that data isn't indicative of what Greg Roman is willing to do was willing to do with uh Justin Herbert and like particularly with like I I only have one I'm sorry I only have one share of Justin Herbert and with this roster I haven't made a decision about Justin Herbert meaning I'm gonna Panic sell or do anything like that I took over this orphan and I bought Justin Herbert knowing that around this time I'm gon to be making a decision about my entire roster I'm not going to go trade a Justin Herbert but I'm not going to go all in I'm not going to buy old running backs I'm not going to buy old wide receivers I'm going to stay young see what happens and expect to have a pretty high pick next year and then again to piggyback on what you said about makoni that's kind of really where I wanted to lead into and this is a perfect segue into our guy here um lad makoni is goinging right now as a wide receiver 31 football guys in wide receiver 30 on keep trade cut I I think that we are expecting too much of him in year one and I do think that we see that number drop uh Jeremy is that something that Ladd McConkey you're expecting giving off what you said yeah I I am at wide receiver 37 so I'm a little bit lower than you guys as well I I think the there's a lot of space we filled in with lad makoni and his profile as far as like yeah he's gonna be really good like yeah he's a great route Runner which we saw some of at Georgia but we also didn't see a ton of usage at Georgia so like what is his usage at this level it seems like he's going to be a PPR guy he's going to have some value there but I do think this offense this year you could see a dip in mak's value in the off season and he's gonna be a tough guy that if you want to get out from it might be now like I know it's early and you don't really know but if you're were thinking hey I'm going to draft makoni and and sell him at some point in the near future maybe now is the time because I do think that there will be a little bit of a dip like you mentioned just because I don't know if the passing volume is going to be here in this offense this year specifically and if he's really going to be the guy he's battled with some injuries as well through training camp here so we've seen where that kind of affects some of the rookie wide receivers and that development to being an early receiver asset so I'm not sold on him just stepping in and being the guy for this offense I think Josh Palmer's there I think there's a lot of other guys from in that room that could be at least annoying in the development of lad makoni Jeff I know that you thought that lad makoni could still be good just because he's clearly the best Target earner on that offense right now even given the caveat that uh Jeremy said about who he is as a player but uh do have you kind of tempered your expectations seeing his like feels like every report that comes out of there is is just negative man it's like it it's it's like imagine being a Chargers fan you're like doubly sad you're like cool we're in an election cycle and then my team is just like just terrible you know it's like why even have a phone you know like every time you open it up it's just depressing so we do the preseason updates for football guys and the Chargers are actually one of my teams I cover I cover the Chargers the Rams and the Falcons so I'm very very indepth right now on the Chargers reading everything that's coming out there the pro it's just so unknown so so early in Camp they had injury problems with JK Dobbins they brought him along slow G Gus was was brought along slow when they had a healthy Justin Herbert they were airing it out in every single practice now Justin Herbert's been out for two weeks now in a walking boot lad makoni missed a week and this offense is a mess under Easton stick like I wouldn't be surprised if East stick is going to be the backup quarterback like there there was a story coming out of so in their first preseason game against Seattle they they didn't get a first down until the seventh possession on offense to tells you how bad that offense is under Easton stick and the lat latest story from the athletic D Daniel poer that covers them ran through a laundry list of like guys like Tyler Huntley or PJ Walker guys that had previous connections with either a Jim Harbaugh or John Harbaugh or with uh Greg Roman previously because it's been that bad under e stick today they just got they just cut Max Dugan today they signed Luis Perez off of the usfl I believe or I don't even know where they got him for sure so that tells you how bad they that everything has been so it's really tough to say what's actually going on with Justin Herbert because there's just a lot of unknown but like I said early in Camp they were throwing it a lot which does lead to makoni and makoni was making a difference early so it's there but I you know I think you hit on great points there and talking about some of the concerns about what this could be and and again it's just going back to that Herbert thing where the general belief about this offense is so negative that if they are negative it's just going to be double counting on all that yeah yeah that's like uh uh I've made a concerted effort to sell a lot of my rookies this year for um you know like better assets I'm not to be honest I think I'm getting just great deals on him like I've sold lad Maki in a second for tank Dell and um I think I might third tank Dell on the list I don't know like tank Dell is one that I've seen some random tweets that he's not on the field all the time on on uh two wide receiver sets and yada yada yada but it's n it's preseason and I don't think any of it really matters and I just think tank Dale is a good player and I know he's good and he has a good quarterback so if I could take someone that I think is good and go get someone I know is good and and still fairly young I'm going to go do that but with that being said you know this is why we have the optionality and Dynasty if you don't get those trades done you still have someone who has PPR upside you know just understand that if he isn't good and he's getting you seven or eight points a game or if you're not in PPR just you're realize you're going to have to be patient with these Chargers um and that's enough on them I want to talk to about another uh disaster team that's uh uh JJ McCarthy uh and the Vikings JJ McCarthy's out we talked about it briefly last show but that was kind of a rapid fire and we didn't kind of talk about things as a whole so let's just say yes this is JJ McCarthy but really this is a Minnesota Vikings uh a little segment here Jeff we'll start with you are you worried JJ McCarthy about JJ McCarthy in the long run because I'm not saying that he's Trey Lance because obviously he has real game time against Real opponents and his and his one at a high level but in some ways he is kind of like treands where yes he's in a a QB friendly system but it's in one of those systems where they just want a guy to get a ball to get the ball to their guys you know like it's pretty set up it's set up pretty well and you have Justin Jefferson it you know it doesn't take Patrick Mahomes to make it hum and then on top of that he still needed work and even before he was injured he was like fighting for the qb2 spot and you know you and I knew that he's that you know he might not start right away and darnold might be the guy do you think that we're going to see something where we see the Tre Lance kind of pivot and I'm not saying you know Tre Lance where he's at now but where he was where he still lost value and people were kind of panic selling that only happens if Sam darnold turns into the guy that went third that people thought were gonna go first than draft I mean if that happens and Sam darnold just kind of magically becomes Brock py Sam darnold then yeah maybe there's some concern because that's going to be hard to go away from if if you've got that level of performance but if this is the scen go Sam darnold that's turning the ball over if this turns into a long season for the Vikings like frankly it should then I think that that just makes everything bullish for JJ McCarthy coming into next year between all the pieces Justin or Jordan Addison clears This legal potential issue that he's coming up against Justin Jefferson obviously has a Justin Jefferson season those types of things falling the place plus the faith in Kevin oconnell the ability to produce that offense I'm not overly concerned there I I mean to be real if trance hadn't gotten hurt or if Brock py didn't what do what Brock pie did if they still had Jimmy grappo there trying to beat Jimmy grappo I mean Tre Lance is what still the S the franchise quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers right now and so that's that's a tough there I I do think I never understood why there was so extreme difference the way that dynasty Community treated Michael penck relative to JJ McCarthy because the Vikings have been pretty transparent when they drafted McCarthy that they wanted him to sit this year it's just now we know he's going to sit this year and and if anything that removed Temptation for the Vikings to put him in the game if they are one and seven or something like that because their schedule lines up in that direction that being said when McCarthy did play the athleticism showed up there were flashes and this is a great support system Jeremy what about you are you are you concerned about JJ McCarthy's value is just a clear buy for like let's say rebuilders or really if you have the assets to buy for anybody if you're trying to play ahead of the game I feel like the only reason I'm going to say no is because the people that drafted JJ McCarthy are their own JJ McCarthy we'll call them um if they drafted JJ McCarthy or anybody who believed in JJ McCarthy there's a lot of pride in saying that you guys are all wrong this guy's one of the best quarterbacks in this class so I don't think you'll be able to get him at a discount do I worry about jigi McCarthy long term I think yes this doesn't change a ton of it I was kind of in the camp of they didn't want to play him this year because they kind of said that then they're kind of giving darnold a lot of opportunity I think he was forcing their hand because he did look pretty good in those preseason games and yes there were the up and downs that you expect from a quarterback that has limited passing attempts coming to the NFL level but he was forcing their hand a little bit he looked a lot better and was getting better quicker than I think I even thought that would happen so there was a push there and I think the the disconnect between Michael pennix and JJ McCarthy was a quarterback in front of him like Jeff would said like in the dynasty Community everybody respects Kurt Cousins and they're like Kurt Cousins is legit Michael pennis get on the field everybody sees Sam darnold and they go that guy can't throw a five yard pass so they're like JJ's taking his job so think that was where that big disconnect came from which is wild because I think that they're a very similar player just McCarthy's younger he's got the athleticism I think this is good for him long term I think he'll be able to sit and truly red shirt the year kind of learn everything behind the scenes and the coaching staff wanted JJ McCarthy they weren't shy about that either through the draft process you knew the Vikings really wanted him and they're not going to give up on him so they're going to give him every shot in a quarterback friendly system with a ton of weapons around him and honestly this year you know if it is a red shirt year Hockinson will be healthy next year they can go ahead and maybe add some offensive line help they can go ahead and add another playmaker um and maybe a running back besides Aaron Jones for McCarthy next year and it'll probably be even better for him I don't think that it should change your value on him I guess is where I'm going with it I think it should just stay the same and I just don't know if there will really be a window because of who drafted him I feel like they believe in him yeah it's like it's a hold then you know and that's uh and it's like you said I I think I have one maybe two uh JJ McCarthy shares and I've been very vocal on this show Jeff has to where I've said that like go get Sam darnold go get Nick Mullins too or something like it's you know like like I I've been prepared for this you know it's kind of like when the Weather Channel tells you that a tornado's coming and then like when it happens you're surprised and and you're sitting there wondering you know why didn't I do take shelter you know I took it a long time ago you know so and I and when point that you made is like the truthers that do have them like the and Dynasty's almost like that like some of these guys that we say to buy and sell you always should try and that's but realistically let's say you send out 10 trades I think maybe only three or four are going to get done you know at the end of the day because I think that in the other six leagues the person that really values them has already made the effort to go and pay for them so um still try though right like and just like still go try don't just say well Jagger said I only have this try no like it that means it's a numbers game go send out more trades you know unless you find that team that was at the back of the draft and like the pool dried up and you're like they have three quarterbacks and superflex and they're like oh I could use an asset to win this year maybe you could convince someone in that rest retrospect but so let's uh pivot to the rest of the team here and I think we'll be brief on Justin Jefferson before before we get to the rest but no one's saying go sell Justin Jefferson but for all you Savvy people that listen to us do you think that there's going to be a by window if let's say that the Vikings aren't as good as what people think they are and Sam darnold really is like dookie and even worse than like the pasta not Jeff yeah I mean there's always going to be a by window when the results aren't happening it's we've seen it time and time again we've seen talented players that we know are talented players that are current in poor situations opens up by Windows I mean you look like a player like talk about Drake London last year everybody was ready to punt Drake London and and call him a bust when he was playing with Desmond Ritter and and all of a sudden everybody's sleeper this offseason has been Drake London and you see he's almost a first round pick in redraft so that's where yeah the way that people need jerk and how reactive the dynasty Community ends up being when numbers are not being produced there's always a by window yeah and then we'll go to Jordan Addison I've never had shares with Jordan Addison and that's not just because I didn't love him as a prospect I didn't love him I liked him as a prospect I loved Z flowers so I was very vocal about taking Z flowers ahead of him and that's just how that worked out in the rookie draft and then like you like we've been talking about the Jordan Addison shares that happened last year especially after we saw Justin Jefferson go down I couldn't really make any moves for him now I'm just kind of okay just not rostering him because it's like strike five for me at this point and I wonder if the Vikings are going to be very good what is he going to be as a player and I mean how bad is it because it seems to be like kind of the opposite of rashy rice where like rashy rice issues is kind of going away and then with Jordan Addison there seems to be something new every week or and these red flag issues have just kind of ha him since he was in college uh Jeremy we'll give it to you yeah I mean I'm in on buying Jordan Addison in this situation I've liked Jordan Addison like you said a prospect throughout through and through I really liked what Addison brought to the game and I think this year is going to be rough like if it's Sam darnold it we're gonna be lucky if Justin Jefferson I mean Jefferson's gonna be able to do it because he's just gonna get fed and it's Jefferson but for a player that's Addison's level which is not Justin Jefferson level like it's going to be tough when your quarterback plays at subpar levels and that's likely what we get from darnold maybe he's average but he's not going to even beat Kurt Cousins so is there going to be weeks here and there yes will there be in the future more than likely I think that the best thing in that comparison to rasheid Rice like rasheid rice isn't getting suspended this year but who says he's not next year like that's where it's leaning it's more leaning that he's going to miss six or seven games next year where Addison may miss some of the time this year which ultimately isn't the worst case because we already talked about McCarthy not being there so I think that long term Addison's still fine the question is though like you have to know what you're getting like are you getting a top 12 guy never getting a top 24 guy hardly like you're probably getting a wide receiver three with some wide receiver 21 weeks built into him but if you are getting him at a discount now and you're not paying that first round pick you're not paying the premium that he gave us after that touchdown dependent rookie season like okay now it makes sense this is the perfect guy to get to kind of fill a flex spot be able to put him in there and be fairly confident that he's gonna have some value because I think when McCarthy comes if McCarthy becomes what a lot of people believe he will be he'll be a viable asset it's just going to be a weight game with him it's a pretty reasonable take because like a lot of people think that that Jefferson could be like a top TW or uh Addison could be a top you know 15 asset that's the thing I think a lot of people viewed Addison coming in as an elite wide receiver Prospect who went in the first round and then hit as a rookie and so they know it's a rocky situation but right now I think that people are hesitant to sell low unless they're really panicked but if the numbers really don't start coming in this year that's where you know it starts to be tough of well I've got Jordan Addison but I don't feel like I can put him in my line up what else can I do here yeah and that's like we talked about it a lot and i' you know tweeted about about it Jaden Reed's kind of the same thing it's just like yeah these guys are fine I just if I can get them for guys who can be you know uh week in week out wide receiver twos with wide receiver one you know uh output I'm going to go do that because I think these guys are just wide receiver three and have their most value if you're in a league that starts W like three wide receivers you know some people still play playing Jane two start wide receivers you know a lot of people do so um that's enough on the Vikings we'll pray for them and we'll keep them in our hearts as they go through a tough year but we'll go to another team having a tough year Drake May and the Patriots Drake May is currently going as qb8 key trade cut and football guys um we thought he was dead because of Joe Milton for an hour so um now that that's over and he had a pretty decent game and people have come into their senses and more importantly jacobe brassette hasn't looked or he has looked like jacobe brassett do we think that Drake May is like kind of a let's buy right now type thing even if you're a contender because he has a rushing upside and you know at least we hope it's going to be a better offense Drake Maye Jeff I would buy him if I can I I do think that while brassette has struggled they're not going to put May in and unless they feel like they can protect him I do believe that just I think the way the coaching staff has been and the organization so that's where if he does play I feel good about how they feel he's going to play um but I would buy him right now if that opportunity is open yeah and it's like you hit it on there I mean like I'm wearing a Teddy brusi Jersey right now I'm a Patriots fan and like what's going to stop this offense is the offensive line you know like uh like the whole team defense will still be pretty decent even without judon but that offensive line is abysmal if David Andrews goes down it's bad news like we basically don't have a backup center and that doesn't sound like a big deal but it is you know offensive linemen they're like running backs they don't tend to play you know 17 games a season and having someone who could play center is incredibly important um so it make a lot of sense you know don't let him get hurt you know maybe have him able to play a couple of games at the tail end but throw him out there to the wolves and and let's let's say it's not even just injury but if you don't have an offensive line you're just going to have a bad time half of Bryce Young's problem wasn't just play calling and not having support from you know Playmakers it wasn't having support from that offensive line as well so um definitely concern uh Jeremy we'll give it to you do you and I guess like Drake may I at least I think he's good are you one of those people think he's bad um if you think he's bad explain on that but if you think he's good we'll move on to the rest of the pass catchers do you think the rest of the pass catchers have value if Drake May is let's say a starter earlier or sooner than later uh I'm a drake May Stan uh I had him as the quarterback too in this class long term I think that if the development happens and if the Patriots do it smartly he will be better long term than Jaden Daniels as much as we love Jaden Daniels rushing upside but different day we could talk about the pass catchers because you want to move on to that let's talk about them um I think that there is viability here I think the issue is is like it's going to be week in and week out of a in game a little bit of a headache as much as we want to Crown Javon Baker looking great in preseason and in training camp his style of play lends to that he's kind of a separator he's a one-on-one winner and that's what you're going to see a lot of the highlights from training camp you'll see those guys are the guys that you tend to see flash because that's it's easier one-on-one in training camp when you're lined up against them as opposed to facing the full defense and as the game progresses through a play so I think there's like there's good things we've seen from jav Baker then there's also good things we've seen from pulk there's also bad things we've seen from PK and the main issue I have still is pulk and Baker are running behind like KJ Osborne like taquon Thorton's running in there a little bit like they're not really separated themselves as much as I think we would like and whether that's just the coaching staff being a little bit more in the Vintage category where like they're giving betet like a sacrificial season to help Ma success maybe they're doing the same at the receiver position so is their viability here even with Drake May starting say half the season potentially um but I think either way you're still going to be playing a lot of guessing games because this offense just won't be that good even with May in it this year like you'll maybe have some viability but like how much like you're talking like wide receiver three maybe you know you're hoping for like commanders last year that's kind of where you're at you know so it's not great let's put it that way and from what I've heard basically the only one that you want for this year's like de Mario Douglas just pop Douglas maybe Hunter Henry is like a Kon type where he's get you like eight or nine points and then if he falls in for a touchdown like I like I think the offense I think the offense is going to be better but like it was B like better is like not a high bar guys like I mean it's like I I think we're coming out of the basement and now we're at the floor let's put it that way you know so steps up the basement steps not exactly exactly yeah so it's uh like I'm I'm and I guess if like I still cared about best Ball Mania and stuff like that and was still in that mindset I would like regret some jayen pulk and like like pop Douglas I think is the guy and he's someone that you know in in in fantasy that I think that not not enough people are are really valuing because he's so incredibly cheap and now I'm going to put him on the next show show sheet so I take a midal note Jack okay no I I completely agree that's where I am too pop Douglas is the one that you want and they remind me a lot of the Giants prior to adding the league neighbors where you're like pop Douglas is kind of that wandell Robinson where he could just eat in PPR and then I think pulk is really just a wide receiver 2ish long term you don't Madison at best yeah well even yeah at best and so that's where you look at this team long term if they're able to add a Luther Burton or a t McMillan into this lineup then suddenly things make a lot a lot of sense or they really need Jayvon Baker to hit in a big big way for the WRC record make a lot of sense yeah I think they'll have an interesting like they'll be an interesting team come draft season like where they fall and if like Luther Burton and like Toria McMillan hit to the point of where like okay we're talking top 10 draft Capital like does New England go offensive line and help themselves or do they go with the fancy receiver and hope for a better playmaker in that aspect but yeah I definitely think that like just how this team is built if we would have got Brandon iuk I think they would have like maybe cap kept Matt judon done some other things because they're like okay this is a receiving core and then like maybe we can even trade for some o line depth like the Jaguars sort of did at the end of the last season or something like that but like not getting Brandon a you know kind of dictates what they're going to do going forward cuz like we're not going to put Drake May out there without a wide receiver one and no offensive line maybe one or the other but like definitely not both you know so like I was gonna say t Higgins out there oh man yeah like if don't give me not getting in ciny I'm just saying they they will be a favorite spot a lot of cap then they could go offensive line in the draft make a lot of sense they're trying to recreate him in the aggregate you know I think Germaine Burton and Andre ois can be like Tyler Boyd and T Higgins together like if that makes sense like together I think that it they could be productive or you know especially with like Chase Brown if he uh develops a little bit more as a pass catcher you know but like I T Higgins would be great and that's why I think Luther Burton wouldn't be the guy because you know we have enough guys who can live closer to line of scrimmage you know we need someone that is a little bit bigger has more size and can go deep so it's like that's nothing against Luther Burton as a player I just don't want that for Luther Burton and I don't want that for the Patriots like go get you know someone that isn't redundant you know it's like those those NBA teams it's like okay you're going to roll out six point guards and you wonder why like your rebounding is so bad you know all right we're gonna go to another rookie here and it's crazy I guess not really that he's here but is Trey bitson in shaky territory we start there Jeremy because like this has been a roller coaster two weeks for Trey bid cuz like as someone who's a film Watcher like Jeff S2 he objectively looked bad his first preseason game and we still saw some of that stuff and like Jeff you said in group chats and I've seen it where he has a lot of pitter patter in his game um he does small boy stuff we Trey Benson saw a little bit of that but we saw a little bit you know him taking holes and feeling more comfortable so do you think Trey Benson is shaky you know like tank bsby has messed me up a little bit I've got trust issues as Drake would say tank bigy hasn't messed me up too much give him time give him this year all right um but I think with Trey Benson when you watched his tape at Florida State it was much of the similarities you're one yes he was explosive had some great plays but he had the pitter patter he was very indecisive he didn't want to hit certain holes that were there and you were kind of like H then he was over running holes running into lineman like it was very in decisive and very like one play it's great one play it's not and I think we saw that get better in his second season at Florida State not crazily better but better we saw Improvement so I think for us Trey Benson's a long-term guy like yes it's the first couple weeks aren't going to look great we saw that adjustment like I said in those first couple Seasons at Florida State like he didn't he wasn't fully there yet and I still think he isn't fully there so it is a little bit of a long game with Trey Benson I don't think the Cardinals expected him to come in and be a viable asset for them this season I think it's okay if you know Connor gets hurt we'll fill in with Benson and somebody else but it's not going to be okay now Trey Benson here you go here's 25 touches a game like they're not going to do that I think Trey Benson's a long-term guy I think if you can buy the dip it's it's good is there a chance that he becomes like Kendra Miller or tank Bigsby like yeah for sure there is that potential and I think that's any potential with any rookie running back but think we have to give him time I think we saw a little bit of improvement in week two and I think it's just G to take him you know a little bit to get used to the speed of the game everybody moves a little bit quicker give him a year and I think we'll talk about him next offseason a little bit differently when we get to see some more of him in game action Jeff I think you're running into a kneejerk reaction right now because when he was drafted everybody looked at it as oh well James Conor's old and boring and it's Dynasty brain and exciting rookie and he's just going to put him on the bench and roll with it but I think the reality of it is is the Cardinals view it as you're our long-term back and we have a great short-term back that we really like a lot plus they are going to play imari D Marcado or Michael Carter as the passing down back and I don't know if people have understood that yet and maybe that might be a a bad week one reveal for some people but I think that that's that's as well and there's just been this mentality I think in the dynasty community of of while James Connor is always hurt and boring and old and I don't want him on my team and so Trey Benson is going to be the dude and when it doesn't happen immediately because the team never was planning on it happening immediately people freak out and I have Trey Benson as an rb2 on a lot of my Dynasty teams but again as our long-term viewers know I build my rosters from that like I'm not even like I I have a buff wide if if not one I have two buff wide receivers a third one that's really good and a good tight end like I'm optimized to do that like if if you're rolling out with like Devon Adams a as your wide receiver one then like you you shouldn't depend on Trey Benson because you probably got problems there and that's that's where we get in the in the roster construction and it's funny Jeff I've waited a long time to say this but I've read an article that should be coming out soon and uh I Trey bitson as like one of my rebuild buy targets it's like Taj Spears Trey Benson and Dylan lby those are three guys that no matter what happens I think you should be aggressive on buying them this year and buying them early because like you said Trey bedson might be a slow start but I viewed him in his tape like brayan Allen where he had a lot of Piller pitter patter but it wasn't like he consistently did small boy stuff like I saw him run over people and it's like we even saw in the preseason game when he gets rolling and makes a decision he looks good so it's like he just needs a coach to like Rec create that you know because it is like as much as we saw the pitter patter on his uh on his tape what does he do well when he does get going he's pretty Unstoppable and he has an a lot of athleticism so he just needs to to go just like you're someone needs to tell him like bro you're you know you're 220 just like run you know just anywhere just forward you know and he just he doesn't have a lot of carries even at the Collegiate level he's really only played two full seasons and he bounced had some injury injury issues he was over at Oregon and then came over to Florida State then split Touches at Florida State so like again it's just a guy that's it's going to take a little bit of time like you said like once he gets going and he sees the hole and that's what Dynasty guys love like that's what we're seeing like those highlights of him ripping off a 50 yard run and then running somebody over and then taking it for another five like he has that upside it's going to be just we have to be patient you know like Jeff said like the team wasn't planning on starting him so why are we yeah because like James Conor still got enough in the tank and like like immani de Maro is decent apparently I I never can't tell if uh if Michael Carter is dead or not because like I still have love for him I still have love want go like Dallas like can we get him like I'd rather him just get cut and like end up somewhere that maybe there's some viability yeah or just just retire like I don't want to think about you anymore is my thing like I just don't want to think about him anymore no lie this is like off topics I know but I'll be quick I swear watching the Bills game all of a sudden I saw the Steelers and I was watching the Steelers game and I obviously with the Bills game and like I saw perine in the backfield and I saw take a run and I go there no way that's L Michael perine and I like looked and I was like holy crap it's l Michael perine I forgot about him like I was really high on him like eight years ago that's like Tim Patrick Tim Patrick you guys forced me to cut him because I had him on every IR ever and now it's just like after a wook draft and I'm like who should I cut and I'm like I guess it's time to cut Tim Patrick and now he's a thing now it's the year been long been a driver of the tin Patrick is a good football player bus and and I'm excited for him now Tim Patrick truther stand up all right we're talking about Tim Patrick better move on Michael Tim Patrick people are Ching the channel now that's next episode with John Bosch it's like half deep cuts and I changed mine so I changed my gu so it wasn't like all deep cats so but zamir white uh speaking of a deep cut he's he was like a last year or two year ago deep cut that is raced for the dead but is it real like and uh let's just put it this way critics say no you know it's not real um I've been telling you that you should sell them no matter what even if you're a contender just try if you can go get Tre Benson like we talked about go and do it you know like he's he's as Damen Pierce as they get Zamir White and it's even worse he's like old Damen Pierce and uh uh Jeremy before or Jeff before I kick it to you I'm sure we all saw the the PFF tweet the the best fantasy F the best fantasy finishes by non rookie running backs to play in the second half of the second preseason game since uh 2021 Devonte Freeman is the best finish at rb31 then it's all the way down to RB 52 to Rex Burkhead Deon Jackson Deontay Foreman jichael Hasty it's pretty bad and again I I don't know this it's technically data but it's a little bit narrative based data I feel like a little bit Jeff do you think this is Su of Antonio Pierce just like doing things differently or do you think that this holds water are are the Raiders well-run offensively I feel like would be my primary question and that's um you know i' we've said it we go back to our show with Heath Cummings a couple months ago I said I listed zamir white as the guy you got to sell right now that he's he was holding Dynasty top 20 running back value at that time I said get out now what are you doing because I think the The Narrative and our thoughts around him were are well Alexander Alexander Madison is awful we saw that and and Dylan Obby is a late round rookie so it's going to be a a bcow because that's what it was last year and and it's not going to be a bow because Luke gy is running the offense and they can't run the ball yeah and it's funny that you mentioned that like as you guys know now I always give you the football guys um the football guys ranking consensus ranking and then I give you keep trade cut and most of the time those are pretty pretty even like Justin Herbert's the same lad makoni is's one off zamir white football guys we have him at rb32 keep TR cut is rb22 and I think rb32 right now is because some guys need to update their rankings you know like everyone's just kind of waking up yeah yeah exactly I was like it's not me that has him that high so it's it's pretty scary and like again I think he might have early value but that's fake guys that's fake love as again I just can't stop quoting J Drake uh Jeremy where are you on the zamir white conundrum I mean I have him at 30 so like I'm in the Wheelhouse there um um I liked zumir white I did as a prospect do I think he can be this Elite fantasy asset this year kind of as in like a volume based but like it's not going to be their long term like this running back class that's coming out is going to be very good and they will replace him 100% so I'm even on the campaign that like even though Alexander Madison's bad like he's probably their third down guy if not Dylan so like what is zamir white you know is the early down grinder touchdown dependent on an offense that likely scores you know bottom half touchdown numbers so like what is our lore here like who says he's not just like trying to think of someone like that was last year that didn't really hit the number um let me look quick here like Brian Robinson Jr like is that his upside you know is he like oh Robinson Jor was good last year Robinson rookie year or Antonio Gibson you know what I mean like these guys that really like there was some hype but like he didn't really get there and he was kind of a running back two running back three and then long term there's nothing there like Devin single ter probably a good career path like there's some volume there and then he's decent but like never really gets going so I think it if you have that creep trade cut at 22 like you're talking about guys you could probably get him for Brian Robinson Jr I'd rather have him David Montgomery probably rather have him Trey Benson javante Williams I'd definitely have over him you know like DeAndre Swift probably a guy that's relatively near him I'd rather have DeAndre Swift like so there's a lot of guys that take over him and I guess if I was maybe a contender I'd hold on to him because my investment cost probably isn't there and unless somebody was coming up to the plate to pay top 20 number value then maybe I would move on but if that value is not there I'm not just getting rid of him I guess is where I'm at he's one of these guys guys that he's going to be 25 when the season starts and I think he's one of these guys that people think he's 22 because he didn't do anything until like it's there's these random guys that their age don't line doesn't line up with their actual age and and I mean he's not that much younger than like a Tony Pard and I feel like the upside is so much higher on Tony Pard if Q flip zamir white for Tony Pard plus because you people view it as selling a young running back for an old running back yeah yeah Tony went from yeah he's went from a sale to a hold cuz I'm like well he's so cheat now that like you know like he's almost by territory it's like why not the team said that he's like the 1A and they're going to use him so you know that's like you said with the upside but like but back to zamir white man I I was kind of thinking like you we you know like Jeremy you made up a good you brought up a good question you're like what is he is he this team's Malcolm Brown we're like like the Rams liked Malcolm Brown like like wildly obsessed with Malcolm Brown he does it fumble when he's a good pass blocker darl H and JIS scen out yeah exactly like like he's a glorified tight end essentially out there he's a Ben Jarvis Green Ellis you you know this and you've got D lobby as the James White and catch dump offs from Garder mchu and you know Lobby's gonna be this garbage time dude that's going to put up 13 PPR points and then white is going to have his 13 to 17 carries for 48 yards and you're praying for a touchdown otherwise you're staring at six points in your lineup and saying what am I doing right now and that's what like when I always tell people Dylan L's a buy we're buying to sell probably is what I'm saying it's like his value's going to go up people are like well he's the guy you don't want any of these Raiders right now like you just don't want low draft Capital guys could he be something sure but like I don't know if Antonio Pierce is going to be there next year and then like like Jeremy brought up the running back class let's say if we love the bejan jir class that was kind of shallow where it was topheavy and then everything else was a quagmire this next class is stacked guys it's it's much different Talent level than what we've seen before it's you know kind of a reverse of what this year was with wide receivers so that's enough zir wide guys we've told you um the the uh balls in your court now as they say uh you could keep hanging on to them and I know you guys are because you're yelling at me in the comments like while zamir white did this in four games that didn't matter and one of them was against the Chargers you know so it's just Chargers are a good defense they yeah okay that's good sarcasm you're you're gonna make me spit in my mic Jeremy cut that out we're GNA move to another shaky ass set my favorite and I've done really well not talking about him J Fields uh it's now it's time guys um this could be one of those things where the Steelers just still suck and then maybe Mike Tomlin is just done you know like he's just kind of done running a good organization and this is the LA his last draw maybe um as Jeff said it maybe uh Justin Fields like you were saying Arthur Smith just kind of sucks he just had AJ Brown and Derrick Henry at the right time you know like that could be an issue here but Justin Fields looks much better than Russell Wilson do we think that he has any long-term value here do we still think this is a red shirt and then Russell Wilson's going to die for whoin I don't feel like the Steelers have that luxury to be in that mode anymore Jeremy will'll start with you I don't think Justin Fields has look that much better than Russell Wilson I think we just haven't seen Russell Wilson I think Justin Fields against the bills looked a little bit more Justin Fields esque um I think that it's good or bad longterm Fields will prove who he is and he has already done that in Chicago um whether that was the coaching staff ruining Justin Fields because I did like Fields coming out or it's just Justin Fields continuing to not develop as a passer and processor um we know the athletic abilities there but I think he's closer to that Trey Lance comment you made earlier like I don't think it's here you know like it just is what it is I think he's done I think maybe Pittsburgh gives him an option if he's in the game he's going to get us fantasy points so yes there's maybe some value to hold on to him am I blatantly cutting him no just because of that dual threat upside and the issue that he's in right now like if the Steelers get bad do they feel it out and say hey can he be a guy but I think they're already leaning towards Russell Wilson I think they're gonna let Russell Wilson quote unquote cook and uh whether that's good or bad for the Steelers I don't know but I do think that for fields's Outlook I'm pretty much done with them I don't think that it's going to happen we don't see it often that these quarterbacks once they start bouncing around really hit again yes we can point to Smith we can point to a few other guys that had Baker Mayfield you know had some late career not even late but mid to late Career Success but again now Gino Smith's at the bottom half nobody really respects what Baker did last year so like I think it's pretty much done for Justin fields at this point yeah I've um guys all apologize right here on the show I've been one of the biggest Justin Fields guys ever what I hope is that Justin Fields takes over so I could sell him because I don't just think that Justin Fields isn't that good I just think the Steelers suck I think George Pickins is a better wide receiver too than he is a wide receiver one I if George Pickins was as good as everyone said they said he was I don't think that uh I don't think the Steelers would have been that aggressive to get a wide receiver as they were in the first round that like that's already came out they've been trying to get auk for a long time I think that Roman Wilson was settling because wide receiver kind of dried up you know you like Jaylen pulk all they basically it dried up pretty quick early you know like we had a lot of wide receivers go but no one has been like real difference makers um that offensive line could still be dooo because they still have PR Pat FR Mo blocking 40% of the time it just maybe they're just not good man the Steelers just suck they all suck Mike Tomlin sucks Arthur Smith sucks George Pickins is mid like that is I'm not trying to say this as a mean it is greater than a nonzero chance that this whole roster besides defense is just dooo Jeff M might being Bleak I think a little bit I I the problem every quarterback is a system quarterback and the problem with Justin Fields is the system that he needs is so extreme for NFL mindsets that it's just hard to find somebody willing to actually make that investment and put him into that system and so that's why I think we saw diminish trade value when they were trying to to trade him or trying to find somewhere to land him because gner mchu is going to be a starting quarterback in the NFL Daniel Jones is a hundred million doll man you're telling me that I still believe that Justin Fields is one of the 32 best options to be a quarterback weekly for an NFL team the problem is I don't know that an NFL franchise is willing to manipulate themselves enough to make Justin Fields one of the 32 best options for an NFL team and he's in a situation in an offensive coordinator that's not going to do it either yeah like Arthur Smith not his system to his skill set now he fits Arthur Smith's skill set a little bit like we've seen Smith wanted a running quarterback so maybe there's a little Bleak hope um but like Jeff said unless somebody decides that they want to go to like an RPO like one read kind of read half the field and then run like it's just not going to work for Justin Fields well and I think the problem is that when Luke getsy came in they tried to change him so much from instead of being like this is who you are let's make it work around you they tried to say this is how you have to play NFL quarterback and that is bad coaching to me and that's where I think Justin Fields is thinking too much and that I know that the Steelers are trying to get back to well this is the way you played it Ohio State like this is your natural way of playing but it's kind of one of those things of you screwed up guy's head to the point that you're trying to unscrew it it's still a screwed up head yeah it's like ma Jones like I tell everyone I'm like M Jones was a good quarterback he was a good quarterback and then Bill bich broke him you know like Patricia broke him yeah M exactly like like they they just they just broke it man it happens unfortunately quarterback is a very mental game and we see this happen a lot we're like what I think Derek Carr like Derek Carr is won where that dude was magic his rookie year and after he got injured he was never the same he had Happy Feet he was just a scared player it it even in my brief career I've seen it and I know like someone like Jeff you're older than me like you've seen this happen with players in several sports that something happens and they're never a game never the same again it's like a what is it in the MCU like a Nexus event like once that happens it's just it's effed you know like I can't curse but that's I'm going to hit Jeff's heartstrings with this one uh Trent Edwards yeah he took that one hit that one hit just ended his career I mean he you know he he was on a developmental path and he took that Adrien Wilson broke his jaw essentially or broke his face more or less and he's never the same player again yep well we'll finish up with our last guy and again this is kind of um these last two is a tour of a Jag's favorites that um dug a hole out in the back and um I put a treat in the bo of the hole and I'm whistling for him to come get in cuz I got to put a bullet in their head it's Johan Dodson I joke a little bit I don't I don't get Jan Dodson as a player and at this point I'm just seeing what happens it's not good I have so much that says he's a good good player I've done this long enough and talked to enough people long enough that my eyes are pretty good I know what a good receiver looks like and Johan Dodson is one of them but he just can't seem to get it going going last year I think it was multiple things it's not on him but now we have Lan kein coming in Jahan Dotson and it's just all bad and I'm down bad Jeremy where are you at on Johan Dodson I'm kind of inish I think just at his price points like yeah I also the issue is is like the reports aren't great so far they haven't been very glowing but the opportunities there I think that's where I'm in still like we saw a little bit of The Flash we saw it at Penn State we saw him do it at the NFL level very that kind of quick separator very good in the Red Zone in that aspect and I think this offense could be better I think Jaden Daniels fits him pretty well as long as as well as Terry McClaren so I have hope I guess is where I'm at and I think he's affordable to where I'm willing to take a couple shots on him um so I'm not ready to give up just yet uh but I'm definitely a depreciated value in it and like being real with it like am I expecting it to 100% hit no is it like 50/50 100% like I'm like 50/50 like I'm not loving it like I'm not all in but I'm definitely playing the hand out here and seeing what we get um and maybe it is something good we've seen it like I said there's been that that proven upside there and maybe a little bit more friendly system he can put it all together and it's really in his shoulders at this point the balls in his court as far as just showing the commanders what he has because there isn't much competition in that room so I'm still in I think he's a a a very cheap option for a potential wide receiver two on his offense wide receiver three type of production and like you said yes in maybe some of those Sher leagues you only start two in a flex like maybe he's not a super great option for you there's plenty of leagues out there nowadays everybody's trying to get deeper and deeper it's three wide receivers three Flex like those teams like he's definitely still viable I think yeah and it's like you said he's so cheap now that like what am I selling him for you know and and let's see worst case scenario happens and he doesn't make up the roster I think a team is going to pick him up like I like again I'm being like a Patriots homer I'm like you know we hope Javon Baker is Jan Dodson let's put it that way like that that's what we hope that he is as a player you know the similar profiles these are Big play deep threads that you know maybe aren't going to break a whole lot of tackles or whatnot and don't have like a lot of size so like let's just go get someone who's good but and again I just don't know what he is as a player but when I when I hear that he's competing with like olus Zak is someone whose name I've refused to learn because I don't need it you know like that's like that's a problem for me Jeff where are you at on Johan Dodson should we just give it up Cliff kingsberry is not a good football coach I don't understand what's going on like what like how did this happen like and I've tried to have I've tried to say this on Twitter and people you don't know you're talking about he's a genius offensive mind what are you talking about he had Patrick Mahomes at Texas Tech got himself fired at Texas Tech and somehow was hired to be the head coach of the Arizona Cardinals in a baffling move he was able to string out a couple years there where he had Kyler Murray Kyler Murray yeah yeah Kyler Murray was decent enough to give him a couple years I don't I don't understand why people think that Cliff kingsberry is a good football coach he's not a good football coach and so that's where on doson I mean for I think for his dynasty stake for any of it I hope he goes to a new team I hope somebody takes a chance on him and and throws him out there I mean go grab him Buffalo you're looking at trying out all these wide receivers or what not try him in in this system in Buffalo or try to somebody else go out there and get him and rescue him because I think it's more Cliff than Johan Dodson yeah because and again I like I think we talked about it like Jan Dodson is not someone that's going to thrive in every system and click Kingsbury you know what he wants he wants athletes he's like okay well you're not the greatest player ever and I certainly can't scheme you so like I you know you're just not for me you know like that he to be honest I think you know would be a great trade if the Broncos traded Johan Dodson for Marvin Mims or something like that you know because like that that's the player that kingsbery wants like can you just go really fast CU I think that you know my scheme that I think is genius will get you open as long as you get there there quickly when it's really not that good so Jeff I'm here for that rant 100% I'm always here for the the the Kingsbury hate and it's again it's one of those things where like some some people said like give to the the 49ers he's not a 49ers guy ever either because he doesn't P he doesn't run block that's like that's the thing like you're you will not play for kle Shanahan if you if you can't run block and that is that is not Jan doson so um it's pretty sad and basically what I'm saying guys is I'm still deep and I'm not ready to put a bullet in my shares um that's it guys um if you like the show as always like subscribe more importantly go to football guys.com plans and subscribe there Jeff right there I'm writing now you guys who complain about my dynasty rankings you know because of a graphic I wrote a whole article where I break them down by tier and explain them and what you should do and give you actual advice moreover I'm going to be giving you guys a college Big Board every month or maybe more often I'm doing all this without Clayton's permission because I know that we're going to work it out and that's just how I roll um Jeremy you got anything to plug before we let you go uh kind of the same stuff you just did just at fdn uh but yeah follow me on Twitter at popes ffh I'll have a lot of stuff up there uh Dynasty podcast for ftn Fantasy that's on any platform you want and then uh same thing you know I'm GNA have some college football content coming out throughout the season Dynasty stuff weekly weekly rankings for redrafting as well as dast for your start sit problems so everything and anything you know football related go ahead give me a follow and check out the stuff over at fdn Fantasy yep we're we're in mid-season form guys everyone's making the same content because it's exactly what you want well Dynasty show you know we're all we all love the film and we all love the college players we're all making the same stuff exactly that's true it's like like once we get to week four we're like okay like nothing matters anymore who cares 2025 class let's go yeah it's like I'm on to 2025 or just bill B after week four but um as always guys I'm Jagger and with me is Jeff Bell and that's Jeremy Pope we'll see where we're going to have John Bosch and we're going to talk about a lot of deep Cuts but uh we're talking about our Dynasty risers so we'll see you on the next one