IR Archive 1984 | Idaho Reports: Idaho State University Pharmacy School | June 28, 1984

[Music] good evening the patient is sick the prognosis is guarded and apparently the only prescription helpful is money that in a nutshell is the story of the Idaho State University Pharmacy School the pharmacy school in Pocatello once considered one of the best Pharmacy schools in the entire country is facing possible loss of accreditation soon which really means that students going to that school won't be able to find jobs if they graduate that means Idaho could be in trouble as well in supplying the needed number of Pharmacists in this state but it also means to some at least further deterioration of quality and prestige in Idaho higher education almost every one of us have heard the complaints from higher education officials in Idaho about a lack of money to finance University programs well this might be the best example yet of just how tight budgets really affect Things We Begin tonight with producer Paula whistle in Pocatello stress form with zinc and with iron and plane okay and do you have the furgone uh iron pills if the they should be on the bottom shelf I think chances are if you've been to get a prescription filled in Idaho the pharmacist who helped you was was a graduate of the Idaho State University School of Pharmacy close to 75% of the state's pharmacists went to isu's pharmacy school but that could drop dramatically in the future and Idaho could be put in the position of having to recruit its pharmacists from outside of the state so big now this is uh 50 Mig of all the B that's that's should be good the reason is that the state's only School of Pharmacy one that was created by legislative mandate in 1927 and holds the distinction of having offered the first borate degree on the Pocatello campus is now facing possible Extinction the problem the school is confronting is the same one being experienced by all schools in the state lack of adequate funding and in the case of the College of Pharmacy that translates to mean inadequate faculty research and facilities at a time when other such programs in the nation are changing and expanding to meet the needs of a rapidly evolving field of Pharmacy we've had essentially give up research and without that uh we also have a very difficult time recruiting new faculty first of all our starting salaries and the salary levels that all faculty receive here is 30% below National Equity we literally have to compete with 71 other colleges of Pharmacy for faculty positions so we have very few applicants and very few candidates that will come here and then without a research base they they simply say we we cannot come to Idaho there are great concerns amongst the faculty myself included for for the viability of the program in in the future and um as a result that hasn't helped morale here very much I think that the people that are here are deeply committed to to Pharmacy education when the faculty is responsible for very very heavy teaching loads it's extremely difficult for them to find time to to to do research to write grants those kinds of things and uh that uh in addition doesn't help faculty morale uh uh people on The Faculty are scientists uh doing research as part of keeping current in your given discipline and uh faculty feels very strongly about that that uh should have the opportunity to research up until this year we've we've never had academically qualified students transferer to another school they've been satisfied with our program satisfied with the university during this year we've we've received uh a request for uh five or six students to transfer already and we have indication that a that eight or nine additional students have also applied for transfer we will not know until this fall rather those students will actually go through with that they have been concerned because of the uh publicity about the the school and its lack of funding and they're concerned about the quality of the education they're receiving you we simply can't uh provide that same kind of education that they can see that they can it's very obvious to them that they can receive at another school the school has been put on alert by the American Council on pharmaceutical education and warned that if things don't improve dramatically the school will lose its national accreditation by 1986 we were placed on on uh unannounced probation in 1982 uh that persisted for one year with the promise that uh we would do uh make definitive uh improvements uh increase number of faculty and improve our program we have been unable to do those things that we were promis that we promised them we'd do because of these cutbacks during the last five years one of the other uh criticisms was this building this building is uh was was erected in 1942 but it has never been remodeled or renovated to to meet the changing needs in Pharmacy education um so that that's our problem we are in in so how much time do you have to get we have literally now uh less than one year to show evidence that this state has committed to Pharmacy education and is willing to put the extra money into it the impending threat has members of the State Board of a pharmacy worried who say that if the school loses its accreditation they will no longer be able to license its students now we would have as a as a Board of Pharmacy we would have no choice but then to declare graduates uh of this institution uh not eligible to sit for the State Board examinations according to a paper prepared for the University by the college in December of 83 the only way to preserve the College of Pharmacy is to double the budget and the faculty size over the next 5 years which would mean adding 3/4 of a million dollar in the same paper called a 5-year plan for survival the introduction reads this is a plea to be heard and a cry for help that Idaho State University does not lose one of its proudest Traditions but according to Dean hilard as of yet almost no one has responded to that cry for help no one is is listening as far as I can tell the dean of the Idaho State University Pharmacy school is with us now Dr Ira Hillyard has taken it upon himself in the last couple of weeks to raise the cry that his school is in danger of ceasing to exist really Dr Hillard joins us tonight from Pocatello uh Dr Hillard you said there at the end of that videotape piece that no one seems to be listening why is that that's uh a very difficult question to answer I really don't know given the the stat the the status of the College of Pharmacy at this institution the fact that it was created here by by legislative law that it literally served as a nucleus for the development of what we now visualize as Ido State University I it's beyond me to to understand why the pharmacy program was never given the adequate support that it required particularly uh since the mid-60s when you say no one I believe you told our producer Paula whistle that not even the administration really of your school has been taking this seriously that's correct and by that I I take right up to the president Dr Colter yes um this situation I take it the and the possible lack of accreditation now uh the situation has developed over several years you said in the videotape it goes back to maybe what 5 years ago or even longer than that much longer than that uh we we haven't had an emphasis on Pharmacy placed on that program by this this University or by the state uh literally since uh the 1960s the last additional faculty position which was allowed for this program by separate funding was in the 1960s uh in the in the mid1 1950s in fact the the support for this University particularly by the University Administration at that time was so poor that the College lost its its Dean a very very effective individual and most of the faculty they went to California and established a new College of Pharmacy uh so we really haven't had that support that we've needed in order to maintain and keep up with the very dramatic changes in in what we must do to to educate farmacist literally since the N since 1960 but I I take it in your view that's become even more serious in the last 5 years or so very much so because by the time that the economic recession hit us and uh the cutbacks began to to pile up on on higher education our budget was in in such terrible uh condition that we were unable to to uh to do anything about it we had no cushion whatsoever and even uh even though we didn't lose faculty dur the during these recessions we were unable to make those uh tremendous adjustments that we needed to in order to maintain accreditation and accreditation as a videotape pointed out is really absolutely critical to the success of the students in the pharmacy program at ISU yes it's very critical uh a student by law must graduated graduate from accredited college in order to be permitted to take the State Board examination not only in this state but in every other state so they're literally preventing from practicing and working as a pharmacist how many students did you graduate this year uh 38 and uh so what what would your average say enrollment be in the pharmacy school at this point in the last three years the the primary professional years of the curriculum we're averaging about 35 to 40 students uh in each year uh that's below the number of students that we should be educating right now just to meet Idaho needs so between 140 and 160 students at any one time that would be optimal okay uh let me just ask you quickly about your faculty situation as I understand it you have three positions open in The Faculty right now and and basically are having a whole lot of difficulty filling those jobs one of those positions we've advertised for over a year and still haven't gotten it filled uh our problems as was indicated in the introductory piece is not only low salaries it's the inability to allow these young faculty to come in and establish research careers and and uh have a program of professional development uh so they literally reject most of our offers we used to get uh back in the early oh 10 years ago when we had a vacancy we would get 50 or 60 applicants we now receive only four or five and most of those applicants aren't qualified let me just ask you finally and and quickly what would it take to fix this situation well we would need a an infusion of a at least 3/4 of a million dollars additional into the program uh what we're doing would that have to excuse me would that have to come all at one time no as long as we there was a firm commitment that we would do that over a period of time that would that would be close enough so that you could do the uh maintain your program continue it and maintain the quality what we need to do is start this right now not we can't wait for much longer we need to show that we we do are committed to this program that we are going to to provide it and we're going to provide it adequately even though it may take us three or four years to come up to equity with other schools I hear you we'll come back Dean thank you another view of this now from a member of the State Board of Education Mike Mitchell is the board member assigned specifically to Idaho State University Mr Mitchell is from Leon and he's joining us tonight from Moscow how serious is this situation in your view Mr Mitchell it's extremely serious Dean Hillard has said it very clearly and very loudly I hope unfortunately what he's saying now somehow is that information has been shielded from the Board of Education and in like manner the board of education has uh allowed the legislature to be shielded from this problem how's that happen I don't really know Mark but having served with senator Senator little on the Joint Committee I don't believe we've ever had a a crisis presentation that I can recall on the College of Pharmacy problem at Idaho State University we've known it's there uh we've talked about it and we're talking about it more now but we're doing nothing uh is it Dr coulter's responsibility well you know for a long time and you don't pass the the it doesn't do any good to pass the blame to Dr colder even if he were staying and and he's leaving for another position but um for a long time one year the public schools would get an adequate appropriation and then the next year college universities and we went this way and the institutions learned how to live with that type of funding well then we went for a period of years in which uh College universities did not get uh adequate funding uh at least in their their mind eye uh and but they kept waiting well next year and next year and even this past year the Year where this legislature of 1984 everyone thought this is college and University's year well with all the circumstances and everything that happened it was not college and University's year and betting on the come has got us in even more serious problem uh with all of the activities but particularly the pharmacy program at Idaho state of all of the and I know as a member of the State Board you can uh point to a lot of problems that you see in higher education in Idaho as we sit here tonight is this the most serious pressing problem well it's an interesting thing about this one uh it has to be considered because it's the one that does Supply the the jobs it fills the jobs that are required in Idaho we would have to look outside and that's not good when we we can't employ our own educated young people but the Idaho legisl established this school at the Idaho State University and every time we've changed the name of the school uh it's been reaffirmed that the College of Pharmacy would be located in poel Idaho at Idaho state but an interesting little line in that statute and that's Idaho code that's the law it said it shall be maintained at the standards as they are now or here as they Hereafter may be by an accrediting uh counsel or an accrediting agent we are actually in violation of the law we have not kept it to the state-ofthe-art uh that's a Board responsibility and a legislative responsibility we haven't met it so just quickly what what should the legislature do what should the State Board do well the state board has got to find out more about it uh first of all so that they can present the complete case to the legislature The Joint Committee with Dave little on your program today and being a co-chairman of that committee perhaps he will ask his staff in the interim between now and next January to look in and be able to supply even additional information but like the Department of Corrections last year the legislature has to know more understand better what the problem is and the board has a responsibility to bring that message to him Mr Mitchell we'll come back sir thank you as Mike Mitchell suggests we have another look at the situation now from an influential member of the Idaho legislature Republican senator David little is the chairman of the Senate finance committee that Committee of course is one that appr creates money for the state's higher education programs among other things how serious do you think this situation is Senator well from the way it's been explained by Dr Hillard and Senator Mitchell I think it's very serious and it really disturbs me and I think Senator Mitchell brought it out that I don't recall any time on a joint committee where they have come in and really uh made a plea uh for the uh Pharmacy appropriation and I checked with some former graduates of the school and they were very proud of the the reputation that the pharmacy school at ISU did have over the past and uh it it really bothers me and I don't know uh it's real easy here to try and put the blame on someone I think that that uh now the problem has been identified and and I will surely follow up with Senator Mitchell's suggestion is to get the staff to go right in and try and find out what we can do and what will take to uh resolve that because to me it is very very serious and I remember years ago when I was going to the University of Idaho and they were talking about making it a four-year school and they said well give them this the School of Pharmacy and here we thought we had one of the bests in the nation and I I thought it still was so this is all really sort of news to you it sure is to me and that might be part of of uh a lot of it my fault but and I'm a little concerned because you see within the last 3 or four years we've introduced the the dental program at ISU and why we would take a real uh good program ongoing program and neglect it and then come in with a new one and I don't know how we can get a handle on that and whether it's the legislator's job or the State Board I assume it's all of Us's job to to go in and I guess for a better term a performance audit I think that we have a tendency uh as legislators to go ahead and we'll introduce programs and we'll fund them and then we have a tendency to forget them and you know we hear we want quality education maybe we're better off with less we're going to have to well as a practical matter isn't that the responsibility of the State Board and and the administration of those schools to to let you know how well those programs are performing well that'd be an easy way for me to get out of it but we have a staff up there in the fiscal office and should be finding out and getting us information to it I I don't want to pay pay place the blame on on either the state board or ISU uh now we've got the problem the thing is now is to concentrate our efforts on a ambil solution to the problem well let me just finally ask you about that solution uh the budget of the pharmacy school is around $700,000 now and you heard Dean Hillyard say that it might take a doubling of that over the next several years to to do what needs to be done is that realistic that I guess here I said why going to pass the buck and I'll turn around it' be the state board that less than 1% of the state board's appropriation uh and they they have a lump sum appropriation they have those guidelines but I think that the uh the legislators from that area the the state and all of us need to really try and get to the bottom of this because we and then either we want it a quality school or abandon it one of the two I I don't think that we want to go along and I am concerned that we're we're doing more and more of that is that we try and introduce new programs and of course part of it has been the the influx of federal money that came in and we jumped on the bandwagon to get the federal money then they they backed away and then we winded up with media worker programs I don't think this uh is is a case in School of Pharmacy but I think it is in the dental program uh let me go back to open this up and invite all you gentlemen to get back in Dean Hillard Senator little seems to be suggesting that the options really are to spend the money or to shut the school down are are those the options that is precisely the option right now uh we we really don't have any other options uh we we could lose our accreditation again as early as next January uh the the accreditation council is not very happy with the the amount of progress which we've made which is practically nothing because we haven't had the the additional funds that we've needed to to do those things that we promised them that we would do in 19 82 so your message I take it to Senator little and uh and Mr Mitchell here both would be uh if you're going to do something you better do it quickly at least have some kind of concrete evidence that the state will back us rather than let the school close Mr Mitchell how about that well I agree in fact we all seem to be agreeing that we're going to have to do something the bottom line is going to be that money and I don't know that any of us can answer that the the board of education has had a group in the state of Idaho doing a an what they call an external audit they are people from the outside Professionals in the academic area one of those professionals was a person I think Dean Hillard will uh will agree with was an exceptionally outstanding person in Pharmacy in September the Board of Education will get their report and I can tell you that it is going to be saying the same things I can't tell you how as we've been saying that that is you either must fish or cut ba with the College of Pharmacy at Idaho State University um well let me ask you excuse me just let me interrupt for to ask you about this money question I think I heard Senator little say that basically the the board could shift the money around within its own budget well yes it could it uh the board I believe would feel that um to we would have to take it from someplace else now if if you want to Target as the senator has mentioned the new dental program you could also Target the new Whammy progr program or the new vet medicine program um new agricultural research programs you could look at a lot of things and say well those came after College of Pharmacy and they should not have or we should take a good look at them um but it isn't as simple as that because we can't simply go in and say we'll take care of it don't worry about it because then something else would slip away Senator well I I agree with what Senator Mitchell said but the problem is that there isn't any way that we can commit the next legislature we don't know the make of it I don't know whether I'll be back in the legislature and so we're really betting on on the next legislature uh to to really help the State Board solve the problem what I was referring to more is a interim thing to hopefully to to salvage a an ongoing program that has to to best of my knowledge has been very successful in the state of Idaho and hopefully that in the interim and I think that the legislature when they're faced up with the problem and going to have to do as I as Dr Hillard Reed what I said is that either going to have to have it we either want a quality program or we don't want it one of the two Mark yes sir could I make a suggestion um we'll get a report in September I believe that the legislature The Joint Committee would probably be meeting between then and the first of the year before the regular convening of the legislature that we share the information of that with at least the leadership of that committee and its staff the leadership of Senator Little's Comm yes the Joint Committee in January I would sort of hope that the accrediting council would come in and would Place us on some type of uh semi uh non accreditation they would tell us what it is we had to do now the legislature's there in January if there was enough advanced work done could we ask for a supplemental and say okay we this is what we plan to do now and then we will go into a long-term project keep in mind right now the code says and we have failed to do it as a government that we must keep it up to the standards of accreditation as they were or as they may be right I hear what you're saying and we haven't done it Dr hilard would that be good enough for these folks who are going to do the accrediting I think that would work out very well I think they would be very glad to work with us uh after all their mission is to maintain the quality of Pharmacy education they realize that we we need the Quality Pharmacy education out here as well as they do in the East uh I think we could work with them they they will work with us and I think they would if they could see that that the state is willing to to maintain this excellent program then uh they would give us that kind of uh of cooperation sounds like a good plan to you Senator well I think it's the only one and I I sure don't see anything wrong with it and want to give it my wholehearted support uh let me uh Senator Mitchell uh former Senator Mitchell ask you finally uh if this is likely to be maybe just the first sort of crisis situation that we're going to see from schools in Idaho that are accredited where accreditation means so much to the students are we going to see other situations like this develop we may see them but I would hope we would handle them better one of the things that the word was mentioned early as to whether the the we've been the system has been shielded from the problem for for Lord only knows what reason the Board of Education in my opinion and this is only mine has got to spend more time talking to the Deans of the various schools when they're on the campuses provide time to know what is going on in the various colleges of our universities in the state of Idaho it's my understanding that they have not talked to the Deans at the Idaho State University since 1976 that's not right uh Dean Hillard let me go back to you finally here uh you've heard uh two very influential men in this state and on the subject of higher education do you feel any better after hearing what they've said about the future of your school I feel better now than I've felt in 15 years I I think finally someone is listening to what we've been trying to say it's it's excellent we'll uh we'll see how it turns out we appreciate your joining us tonight in pocatella Dr Hillard thank you so very much thank you very much Mike Mitchell and Le thank you for joining us too Mark and uh Senator little thank you sir thank you Mark that's our time for tonight I'll be off on assignment tomorrow covering the state Republican convention Jee mcneel will be sitting in here with the latest results in our Idaho opinion survey we've sampled how idahoans are feeling about the political races this year and also how they're feeling about the question of wilderness we'll have those numbers for you tomorrow night and I'll have some analysis of the numbers from the state Republican convention in Sun Valley I'm Mark Johnson good [Music] night the funding for this program is provided by The Corporation for Public Broadcasting and the friends of 4 10 and 12 [Music] [Music]