Tearing Apart Each Others Rankings w/ ‪@Flockfantasy‬

Intro no notes we've been arguing about it these last few days let's talk about it on camera and dissect each other's rankings yeah so we got Mason on the channel here we're going to go through basically talk about one player that we're too high on one player that we're too low on Mason since you are the guest we are going to start with you me and Danny looked at your rankings and we noticed that you are too high sir on James Connor so you need to explain yourself you had him RB 17 I believe again fluid range I think for me and Danny it's like you can kind of put anybody up there but why Conor couple different things I want to acknowledge one James Conner these are rankings for casual ESPN Yahoo NFL fantasy home leagues right these are home League rankings if we are assuming you're playing in an active home League everything that we've heard at training camp is Trey Benson's not going to have a role at the beginning of the year and if you're able to go through have the hot start from James Connor you're able to potentially go through flip him and even if you don't flip him we know that running back production is always so difficult to project out and every week you get further down the road it's tougher to project so you could be in a situation that you get a really good start before Trey Benson comes on at the beginning of the year and then by the time you get later to the season you found another running back off the waiver wire if Connor does fall off those are all fair points I think my only interjection to this would be it's a young offense they're going to want to get guys involved and I think it's all big talk sometimes with these like this guy's going to be the Workhorse the second you see these guys actually perform in games that would be my only argument against James Conor but again following the coach speak I think you definitely have a point and again this running back 16 to running back 24 range if you're playing for early season upside I think that's definitely viable I think Mason made a great case Dan you have anything against James Conor being maybe pushed up the rankings I I specifically feel like I'm lukewarm on him but it's mainly for the late season upside and if specifically for home leagues I feel like you know the the the projections a little more favorable early on can I say one thing real quick what's up go ahead in Underdog best ball if you're drafting beste Ball Mania I'm actually severely underweight James Conor to because there we're optimizing for points in weeks 15 16 17 but specifically in our redraft leagues it's going to be a little bit different especially like I'm assuming the flock League that we're going to do tomorrow I'm kind of going to be draft and get points at the beginning of the year you know because I know I'm going to draft James Conor um and then after the fourth week I'll sell him to Joe and I'll get a running back that has late season upside so basically Mason's saying if you can pray on the weak Link in your league and get James Conor BS off your team you can do it I will say that is the one caveat I have you need someone to be able to pry those bags of James Conor off of you because quite frankly I do not want to be left holding the bag I agree the early season viability especially if you're in a zero RB League I understand grabbing James Conor for the guaranteed touches early however I will say once week four week five week six runs around I do not want to be left with him on my roster yeah and it's not only I think it's a double-edged sword you're like oh in casual leagues I I can sell him to my league mes they're less likely to trade yeah not only that but they're also less likely to let him fall to the seventh round where I would feel comfortable taking him or the sixth round where I'd feel comfortable taking them well for sure if you Tak top five rounds don't take them yeah so RV 17 Again just ADP wise where you have to take a top 17 running back in a casual home League to me is probably the first five rounds just based on the way that most casual home League drafters draft they don't want to have one running back on their roster through the first five six rounds like 85 90% of your league is going to want at least two if not potentially more running backs so I feel like a guy like James Connor because he's been productive in the past because people feel comfortable with him is going to get inherently pushed up the board so amongst running backs I don't think RB 17 is an egregious ranking of him I think it's more so the overall where Tyjae Spears you'd actually have to take him in a home League yeah I agree with that awesome well a running back that I know youall said I was too low on that I think is in a garbage offense and potentially the rb2 in a bad offense Taj Spears what am I missing here so with Taj I think it's it's mainly a bet that the star ahead of him is first of all pretty shaky think it's also a bet on the skill set that this offense is going to play to I mean you got Brian Callahan coming in they ran a top five pass rate offense with Jake Browning last year I feel like with Will Lev's skill set they're going to want to throw the ball and Taj Spears and Tony Pard have virtually been a split to start the year so again it's a split backfield and a bad offense like you said but as the season goes along this kind of runs conversely to the way that you'd want to play a guy like James Conor as the season goes along I feel like Taj Spears before quickly could absolutely take over that back field and I feel like where you're getting him you're kind of drafting him in like the eighth ninth round potentially later in casual leagues not a lot of people know who Taj Spears is I think you're getting a good value on him and I would rather take him over some of the kind of milk toast options in like the mid-30s yeah and adding to the point when it comes to talard because I feel like the majority of it is you believe the Veteran running back got paid in free agency should get the goal line work the problem with that one applies to Tony is he's never been an efficient goal line back inside the 10 inside the 20 yard line actually graded as one of the most inefficient backs in terms of being able to score touchdowns a guy that hasn't crossed over six touchdowns more than once in his entire career one time in 2022 was able to accomplish it hasn't accomplished it in any single other year of his career so with me when I look at it I understand he's unproven in this aspect but if Tony Pard is struggling in that role early on I do think there is a case where Taj Spears could very well work inside the five inside the 10 yard line because quite frankly we have evidence that Tony PA is isn't very good at it whereas Haj Spears very well could be see my thought process is I don't care who's the 6040 back I don't care if it's 4060 right now Sports books are projecting it I believe to be the fifth worst offense in the NFL in terms of total points scored and I think it is a split backfield so I view it as I'm okay with having a committee running back in a top offense but if I think that it's a committee whether it's Spears whether it's poers the lead guy I don't really care I probably want going to be avoiding both players Le personally more so anti- Titans rather than anti- Spears okay fair we've been a little bit more Pro as far as maybe not necessarily how many games they'll win like I don't think they'll be great but I think they could be the you know jamus winsty kind of vibe to them where they have fantasy relevant players like Ridley like Spears who even though they're not winning games and and they might just be like an average to below average scoring offense in total I think that Spears is a good enough player showed a lot efficiency wise as a rookie to the point that if this offense is just functional and they're throwing a lot too and there's a lot of volume to go around I think Spears could catch 60 70 passes well but I know we're going to talk about some wide receivers with you but let's stick it with running back cuz we checked in I have one more point on you okay let's go is that with Brian Callahan coming in obviously has that Bengal scheme in mind there running with the Tennessee Titans hires his dad Bill Callahan if you guys are unfamiliar with Bill Callahan arguably the best offensive line coach of all time invest in the offensive line with that seventh overall pick obviously at Perimeter Talent this year that kind of gives Credence again I understand the Vegas sports do have them as the fifth worst projected offense but I do think there's a lot of meat left on the bone to potentially you not only usurp that potentially be a breakout offense personally awesome well you stick with another bad offense running back situation where cor we checked has like Jaylen Warren & Najee Harris Jaylen Warren rb2 najis is rb32 yeah I think it's a a slightly different Gap than that after Jaylen Warren's injury I believe that move him down a couple a couple spots and Naji Harris like one or two spots but for me I look at this backfield and I think that Arthur Smith is going to do crazy stuff I think we all know this about Arthur Smith nii Harris profiles to be the goal line running back probably the guy that gets like the bulk of the carries we've known unequivocally that Jaylen Warren's a better player we've known unequivocally that Naji Harris is going to be pretty much inefficient on most of his touches I don't think that Warren would necessarily usurp Naji Harris when healthy I think they probably like both of those guys to play two different roles I just believe that the receiving upside the potential like Breakaway play ability and the efficiency is what I would tether myself to if you told me right now this backfield to me like a dead even 50/50 split that's probably what it'll be in my opinion I think that's probably the projection we're looking at Warren will do way more with his touches than Nai will do with his and not only that if Warren went down I think Nai would be outscored by the inverse scenario happening if Nai went down I think Warren is much better than Nai is if Warren went down so for me it's just the contingent upsides better and Standalone value wise I think it's going to be relatively split backfield I will say according to Pittsburgh beat uh Nick farall actually follow on Twitter show out but he's basically reported every single Steelers practice and he said at this current point it's 55 60% Nai Nai working between the tackles obviously that was even before the jayen Warren injury there's still a risk that especially in the early portion of the year coming off of that injury maybe instead of even a 55 45 6040 we could be looking at a 65 35 7030 type of situation so in the early portion of the year I do think we have to Value Nai higher cuz giving credits back to the James Conor point if Jaylen Warren gets off to a slow start I feel like it's a better opportunity to buy him late versus with Nai Harris if he's getting 65% of the work in the ear person of the year you may be able to sell him high again it's not like I'm a big pro- Nai guy or a big anti- Warren guy in fact you guys have heard my takes on the channel before but it's more so just knowing going into the year that there's uncertainty with the health status of Warren why I would prefer Nai straight up yeah and what one other thing I want to add to it is I 100% agree with you if they had the equal amount of opportunities Jaylen Warren does more with we've seen that time and time again and I 100% agree with you that if ni Harris got injured Jaylen Warren has a higher ceiling than if the inverse happens but the world that we're living in is I think nii probably touches the ball more and Jaylen Warren's the one that's injured so I think at this point I understand wanting to have Warren ahead of naagi and maybe by a considerable Gap but with the Warren injury I think they have to flip I don't think you have to move Nai up to rb20 but I I think you at least have to have Nai one or two slots higher than Warren total totally a fair critique with the backfield situation the last thing I'll say is that Warren outs scored Nai on way less touches last year so even if it's not a 50/50 split it's a 6040 split for Naji Harris Warren did more with his touches last year by a lot than Naji Harris and like I said in this area of the draft I mean you're talking eighth ninth round probably where Naji Harris and Warren go again if they're going any higher than that they're probably not great picks I'm looking at a a team where I'd already have a lot of built-in Foundation to it these guys are contingent upside High value plays like I'm not drafting Nai Harris especially for those of you guys listening to this that are like start seven shallow leagues I would never draft Nai Harris because he doesn't have a super high ceiling I would draft Warren because he's probably a bench stash for me anyways yeah I'll just quickly add back to that I fully agree if they were both entering the Year healthy and in fact when they were were both healthy I actually did have Warren over Nai but with the news that he is banged up that's what caused me to flip again very close to my rankings I just think at this point with the injury concerns you should have Nai overw for sure let's uh let's weave in some wide receiver talk here Danny so they attacked me the The Stance was basically Devonta Smith that I was too low on the Pittsburgh Steelers backfield like the or I have it ranked wrong I guess is the the stance there so Danny I believe you are too low on Devonte Smith I think the reason for that is the guys that you have him ranked I believe you have him ranked around wide receiver 23 24 wide receiver 23 yeah you guys you have him ranked behind guys that to me profile as like either number twos in worse offenses than Devonte Smith or number ones who have more questions about than Devonte Smith for me my stance on Devonte Smith has always been I want you know pieces of this offense I realize AJ Brown's going to be the alpha there but you still carve out a 25% Target share for Devonte Smith because there's it's a very concentrated offense then I still I still want pieces of that and I think the pass rate is bound to go up this year with Kell Mor call in the shot I think it's bound to go up but in terms of the specific names again I have at wide 23 you have them more so in the late teens what are the specific names that you think I should have Devonte Smith over just so I can craft the AR arent around that so DJ Moore DK metf um I think you have Malik neighbors ahead of them as well and I think I have I have him over Devonte Adams as well I know that one's that one's definitely an unpopular take for a lot of people but guy basically guys like that who are are you know number ones in worse offenses than what Devonte Smith is playing in or kind of potentially in committees where we don't know who the number one is it really comes down to the fact that I I think all three of those guys are talented players I also think Devonte Smith is a talented player but I do think the inherent pass rate of those three teams respect ly will be higher than the Philadelphia Eagles I understand with kellmore coming in it will inherently increase the pass rate what I'm looking at the Chicago Bears with that Tri receivers with Caleb Williams coming in I think they will be a team that will throw the football a ton DK mecof obviously the benefit of Ryan grub I've talked about on the channel before with the jsn take but I think Ryan krub coming in is a huge deal 70% motion rate across the preseason Ryan grub obviously top 10 in both deep pass rate and pass rate over expectation with Washington really with DK meaf the high value targets working down the field on an offens I think will throw the ball as the reason why and then what was the other one you said um I think DJ Moore like I the last thing I would say is like Devonte Smith had higher Target shares than every one of these guys minus DJ Moore last year this is what I was going to point up because you look at like DK meaf DJ Moore these guys that are technically wide receiver ones on their depth chart but the target share is going to be distributed to so many different players that even though Smith is the wide receiver two behind AJ Brown his Target share can still be higher than DK mea's because you're not having to go up against locket as well as jsn so personally for me I just view Smith as honestly a kind of better player than a lot of those guys and the same thing is I think his Target chair is going to be right in line with those other players and a better offense better offense sure but at the end of the day they're going to have a lower pass rate in my opinion compared I don't think that's a guarantee at all I think the Bears and Shane Waldren versus the Eagles with Kell Moore like I think it's very possible they're both kind of League average if not slightly above average pass could very well be the difference is one has saquon Barkley in the backfield one has Deandre swith Herber in the back field yeah how does that affect Devonte Smith in terms of pass rate in terms of pass rate you're mentioning a high run rate team last year with the Philadelphia Eagles I understand they will increase inherently but also it's going from a bottom five team in terms of pass rate to are we expecting them to be top half of the league are we expecting them to be top 20 I think that's a big jump I think we're arguing the difference between a 570 pass attempt offense and a 550 pass attempt offense and if you have a 25% that's a big projection to say the Eagles are going to get that far up 550 pass attempts that's like basically 20 more than they had last year so you're projecting what the Bears to throw less or the Eagles to throw more I think it's going to be a negligible difference is what I'm saying and I'd rather have the Devonte Smith Target share from Jaylen Herz in that offense versus slightly more pass volume I guess and a clear-cut number one with DJ Moore DK Mecha and I like DJ Moore and DK Mecha to be perfectly clear I just think Devonte Smith is such a a stone cold lock for high-end wide receiver 2 production that I I don't want to pass on that again very minute differences for the record fourth round players at the end of the day you think the Eagles will throw the ball more than the Seahawks and the Bears I think the inverse so I I mean we're talking about the difference between a late third early fourth rounder versus again I have Smith as a a mid fifth or mid fourth sorry I feel like I'm watching my parents fight and I'm a small kid and I'm in I'm in the middle going back and forth we we we we'll let's get to Jonathan Brooks I'll let you I'll let you pick the argument Jonathon Brooks on Jonathan Brooks CU Danny has him at uh running back 19 yeah in his rankings I have him I think in the mid 20s if not the lowend 20s just because you know kind of invert to your Connor argument I'm a little worried about the way he's going to start off the year yeah honestly what it comes down for me with Jonathan Brooks is that once I'm in the round eight plus range at running back I am striving for ceiling especially because of the way I structure my teams whether it's grabbing an anchor early or a double anchor early being able to grab a guy like Jonathan Brooks in round eight on having the upside to be a top 12 profile once he is fully healthy and I understand that is a big caveat he is on the pup right now not a great situation I fully get that but in terms of the prospect profile that we have for Jonathan Brooks three down profile electric runner between the tackles and his ACL tear for the most part is a relatively clean tear similar to that of what we saw from Bree Hall last year a guy that week five on was averaging over 19 PPR points per game so really what it comes down for me with Jonathan Brooks is philosophically I prefer a high upside running back in that range over potentially you know middle rb2 type of work because quite frankly I can grab my Jonathan Brooks and backfield with I mean we mentioned Nai we mentioned you know guys like Blake corm later on Rico Dow Chase Brown there's a lot of archetypes I like later on that I can back fill my production with and I want to take my stab at a lead upside yeah my thing with Brooks is I think for like an BBM perfect right he's going to have a low Advance rate sure but for weeks 15 16 17 he can win you the tournament for sure just in your regular redraft League I don't necessarily think you need to be chasing that especially if it's going to be a league where like your league mates are making trades through the course of the year because you're sitting there with Brooks going okay his value is doing nothing from this point through the first eight weeks now the benefit is if you're able to throw them on your IR then you do get an extra roster spot inherently where you can go through and make additional waiver wire moves and for what it's worth the Carolina situation oddly enough is one of the few situations in fantasy I'm actually confident with handcuffing simply because chuba hubard in the 15th round if you're pessimistic about the pup time we saw chuba hubard be able to produce as an rb2 last year once he was able to use certain mile Sanders so if you're really concerned with Jonathan Brooks do you think instead of week three coming back it's closer to week five week six again that's a last round opportunity cost if chuba har was a 12th round 13th round pick I wouldn't be advocating for that but in the final round if you're really worried about Brooks I'd be able to do that so we're going to waste two roster spots on the Carolina Panthers backfield if it's rb2 plus production plus Jonathan Brooks having an rb1 ceiling once he comes back I'm fine with it yeah I I I push back on the rb1 ceiling because I think people like I'm very familiar with both Jonathan Brooks as a Texas Fan and Dave Canalis as a Buckaneers fan I think people think that Dave Canal has made Rashad white what he is and he like definitely contributed to it but they wanted to use Rashad white before they ever hired Dave Canalis in a Workhorse role that was a Todd Bulls decision not a Dave Canalis decision and I think Brooks when healthy would be a big Workhorse back but is he going to Fresh Off an ACL te for a rookie give him a huge workload right away I think this is a year two he's going to be a Workhorse projection in my opinion I think again BBM tournaments totally make sense in a standard home redraft League I think you're talking about a a very destined to be depreciating asset by week five I will rebuttal that I do feel like if you had the concern that he wouldn't be fully healthy at least by the first month of the Season why would you trade up into the top 50 to go select Jonathan Brooks when you feel confident in chba hubard being able to lead the backfield Dave can was the head they made that move they're not making that decision simply for 2024 so they traded up into the top 50 they take a year or two plus projection I mean yeah like they were hoping he would be back on the field by mid-season and that's probably what their plan is for him I don't see a scenario where you're playing for a running back again a position that quite frankly is the most replaceable in the NFL to trade up into the top 50 for a guy that you aren't confident in year one yeah I mean I'm sure they they're confident in his recovery and things of that nature I just I I tend to think that it's more difficult to trade for a guy like Jonathan or to the guy like Jonathan Brooks hold him on your roster soak up that bench spot or whatever like you said in an IR spot League it's a little bit more stomach aable but anyways uh Mason you stood here well we argued but uh we could we could roast more of Mason's rankings I mean I saw he had jsn pretty low we already talked about that you want to you want to give a little bonus 30 second take on jsn before we get out here if you look at all the JSN historical data jsn rookie season he is not Quinton Johnston but he is training towards the bus route and I love jsn coming out trust me and locket still there I understand the change with the offensive coordinator is a lot of people saying more three wide receiver sets more throwing the football I get the positive case I think I would rather just hit the reset button on one of those like round one guys this year that are in top offense just such as Xavier worthy such as Brian Thomas Jr such as Roman dun with Tyler locky you mentioned as The Proven Target this a guy that's seen his yards per route run decrease across the last three years since he Peak and with jsn I mean we've heard all reports this offseason they want to change the usage he was a slot only low adol player last year reception perception darling too reception perception darling but he was better than the stats would indicate we we mentioned earlier with Ryan grub coming in when I talked about DK top 10 in terms of deep pass rate top 10 in terms of pass rate over expectation I think there's a lot of left on the bone for jsn to really develop his game into a three-level threat rather than that intermediate within three yard threat that he basically was last year yeah the premise of I would rather have worthy makoni Thomas and so I actually don't disagree with that I have those guys ranked over jsn I think he just fits into that group of young upside shots that you're taking in the later rounds and if you don't like them and you want to go makoni or Thomas or whatever that's totally um your jurisdiction in that area of the draft so we talked a lot of rankings of course if you guys want our rankings you can head down to link in the pin comment head to underdog dog fantasy.com put some of this advice into action use the promo code fsse when you sign up you get 50% back on your first deposit up to $11,000 and within 24 hours our draft guide will be in your email inbox and of course if you are not able to play Underdog you already have an underdog account head to flock fantasy.com use promo code FSE over there as well start your 7-Day free trial get six months for free when you sign up annually as well all that will be linked down below but with that being said peace out we'll talk to you soon