The Summer of Kamala (w/ James Carville) | Bulwark Podcast

you know we're from New Orleans I see a paraders coming I grab I grab a whistle a baton and a high hat and I throw to the Baton in the air cuz there's a parade and it's called The Comma Harris parade it's that's it that's it [Music] baby hello and welcome to the B podcast I'm your host Tim Miller I told you we do a Monday pod and uh we've had some big news since yesterday many of the big names in the party have rallied around kamla including nearly all of her most realistic Challengers JB pritzker just announced a couple minutes ago though I do think Charlie XCX posting kamla is brat is probably her biggest endorsement yet she's also raised over 60 million in counting and to here to talk about it all is veteran Democratic strategist co-host of the politics War Room James Carville James where's the Chaos we were promised Jam everybody told me everybody told me if Joe bid have decided everybody told they're like James you can't do this there' be chaos where's the Chaos James there is none and by the way you know we're from New Orleans I see a parad is coming I gra I grab a whistle a baton and a high hat and I throw the Baton in the air because there's a parade it's called the KLA Harris parade K it's that's it that's it baby they can do whatever they want but this train is left the station eat her dust yeah that's true so we I had we Bill me and Bill Crystal yesterday were talking about this and and he said at the time you know he's like look this could be the train could be gone in four hours could be gone in 12 hours or there could be a conversation and uh clearly in the intervening time I you know there's no really realistic you know challenge that's gonna emerge right you know as you know I've been dealing with this for a long time kind of person painful I think at the end of the day what really swayed the president was he couldn't get any politicians to show up I when he goes to Michigan and you can hide the PO from him you can be sure he gets good news you can adjust who he talks to you can control who comes in and out the the information flow but he's when he goes to Detroit and the governor neither's Democratic Senor not a Democratic Senate candidate shows up he knows that yeah that cannot be hidden and I I think he had a a growing sense of isolation that no one was going to go to the convention he wasn't going to be able to march on the front row at a Labor Day parade with all the guys and yeah you know Lefty and Shifty and you know whatever it just that wasn't going to work out that way and I think I think he he forget it out yeah it's sad when you put it like that but it's good on him for doing it I I feel like I should have mentioned this yesterday um look we've been on his ass you've been on his ass longer than I have it's still hard to do it it's hard to step aside and we're looking at the other side when you look at the other side you know so is not saying what was the Biden all line don't compare me to the almighty compar me to the alternative he's not the almighty but if you look at the alternative these guys been propping up a [ __ ] rapist criminal for a decade now you know and so having war nice my favorite my favorite is Van Joneses and even the Dan a both of whom I like okay I know I'm both talking about how Trump's change man what in the [ __ ] are you if anybody says that there should be a lifetime ban from being on anything okay me that is just a a breathtaking uh ignorance of what people are liking particularly Donald Trump I it just I love that he was a changed man I tell you word BR my God he sound God yeah right sure absolutely it had every [ __ ] felon you could imagine for around the convention floor yeah and indeed at there's more felons do you ever have any felons at any of the conventions you ran James do you have any ever any speakers fly straight from jail to the stage none that I know of probably some you know Subs to but that used to be I remember a time in politics where it was a mark against you if you were convicted of a felony but well let's well maybe it still is what do you think now turning to KLA to forward looking um so this is this is what I think to yeah first of all people don't know her and she got to understand that and the Trump people know that people don't know her yeah so in the next somebody told me was 30 38 days to Convention I'm pulling that out of my ass so I think someone told me that this a battle for definition and usually summers are not the most exciting times about presidential politics I think this one is going to be a little bit more and that they need to hurry and get some definition on her of course they going come up with you know they're going to hit them pretty hard because and they hurt this is this it was like yesterday when they got the phone call oh God [ __ ] we got to change everything and like you're you're a pilot and you're getting ready to land a plane and every everything is you your whole Mind Set On landing and then they say there's a plane and Runway you got to do a go route you got oh [ __ ] you got got you have to think rethink your whole mentality yeah they're trained to do that where political people are not yeah they uh the mentality shift is is noteworthy uh uh and and I want I want to talk a little bit about what K can say but let's look at the Trump side of this first because um you know obviously you're you're claan to fame it's the economy stupid uh Tim Alberta uh pointed out that that the Trump people had a frame that they were sticking with which was strength versus weakness and um you know and the debate and the assassination attempt both played right into that frame in a way that was like you this might in a way that you could only dream about in a campaign frankly and and he wrote yesterday Alberta really cannot overstate how problematic this is for the Trump operation everything they built was customized for that contest strength vers weakness with Biden I mean everything and you can see that a little bit and it's only been 24 hours but they seem to be flailing a little bit I they're going to attack her on immigration they'll come up with stuff to attack her on but they have they have lost their North Star a little bit don't you think I I do you know let me say this tber is one of the better reporters we have today I mean he's a very very good report of very and you know again it go back to my analogy they were they were all prepared to land the airplane they they had the wheels down they had the flaps in the right place they had the towel okay and then hey we got we got to go back up and that they're fighting the controls now and I think that that what Tim says that fits pretty well with my early analogy yeah I want to play for you just just just because you deserve a little bit of pain this morning James you're riding a little high and so I want to play for you the voice of Steven Miller here's him last night on Fox talking about the state of play they held a primary people they had ballots they filled out circles they went to the voting booth they spent money on advertisements and as president Trump said the the Republican Party spent tens of millions of dollars running against Joe Biden now they just woke up one morning and said never mind we're camp cancelling the entire primary we're we're getting rid of our candidate and we're pretending the election has never even happened and we're going to let donors handick a new nominee poor little Nazi poor little Nazi so sad I I always knew that guy was odious I I never had to listen to a clip that long oh my god oh you could you can see the you see the F the face and this is their uh the Democrat Party is a is a coup and and now they def I I it's it's that's how hard they've been hit that's that's the depth of that argument you can see why he takes it out on immigrants so now he had he had to have a tough time in the cafeteria with that voice in face you think anybody wanted to be be hang around him in high school I don't think no I don't think we need a professional psychologist to figure out what's happening there no no um what about their other message that they're going to try to do with the coup thing is that the Biden should resign B must resign there's been a cover up I I don't I look as somebody who's been talking about the Biden age problem for a while against interest like what do you think is the efficacy of that message well what they're probably G to say is that Harris knew he was declining didn't say anything and put the country Jeopardy and she's going to sure she's got a very good answer for it and she's got to pull it up and use it for sure but you know right now they haven't settled on anything they're they're you know they're just picking up the machine gun and you know somebody's coming up uh but Harris sh they have to be very aggressive right now in definition they you know they don't they need to worry less about organizing and more about getting out there the Harris team you mean or the Trump the Harris team yeah and they need to start doing some some things and fast you know they can go to want some more my ideas go to car on the war College you know you got all kind people WR a National Defense foreign policy speech you know talk I think part of her campaign and remember she was a successful uh da attorney general and she couldn't talk about it in 2020 because of the asininity and Democratic campaign coach in 2020 it wouldn't allow you to talk about that so she looked like an empty vessel yeah she looked like a because the real reason a story she didn't have the story I mean she couldn't tell people the real truth well now the real truth kind of helps her right yeah okay how much Chang it and the one thing that people believe and Mark this out they believe these companies are rigging prices fixing prices talking to each other to screw them over and she has a consumer background and say I'm going to have attorney general establish a task force to see what in violation of any any trust laws whatever then that that you using that experience to something that they can't say that people really do care about and they really do things they will say in focus groups I can't tell you number people say did you Biden hadn't caused inflation he too old to cause inflation okay these companies are doing it but he's too old to stop yeah I I mean take that so you want a little populace from Kam I I took on the big Banks I took on these big corporations I'm going to go out there and do that take on but most of all you're taking on price fixing yeah price fixing okay that's because if you try to I took on this and I'm gonna do away with the capital gains tax and ta you get you get lost yeah you know we we're not going to allow them to we'll allow them to make a profit as they're entitled to but not to make unreasonable predatory profits at the expense of the American people you're hurting my former Republican free market soul with this message James but it seems smart though that seems like good politics maybe I think it I think it is good politics and by the way you know Adam Smith you know really believed in Annie truss laws really didn't believe in price fixing yeah okay that that's the most violative thing you can do to capitalism that's true is but grocery grocery stores aren't aren't you know monopolies I but the the craft food is craft food is is a monopoly you know the largest egg companies are and what they have is the top if the top three are talking to each other capitalism loses what it's supposed to be about competition I mean I I would argue my my argument should fit right into your earlier Laz Fair capitalist instincts okay all right we're going to try to blend them all right okay for and then she's but the prosecutor thing also goes to um she's going to have to she had that tweet that she sent out about the bail fund which is going to hurt her but um you know she has a record of being strong on Law and Order she's a record of going after corruption she has a record of going after corrupt politicians and companies I mean that that like that's where she's got to start right like that for with Trump or do you think that's a little too no no it remember there's one more thing but this Rising crime rate I mean falling crime rates and not just falling a little bit yeah all right and I I think she made a mistake when she didn't take crime as her portfolio as soon as she came into the office of Vice President uh but you know best time plan O3 25 years ago second best now yeah her under her the Biden Harris Administration you took over from Donald Trump thec rate is down 25% of whatever it is pretty good message yeah you couldn't handle it I agree with that obviously the abortion message is stronger Biden Biden was was so I interrupt you just so I keep hearing this the Democratic what happened to the Democratic party how did the Democratic party fall apart I I I was reading something I might respond by this guy Tyler coward who you know kind of leading George Mason right I got news for you the Democratic party is not falling apart it wins elections yeah okay it it hasn't lost an election in two years we were winning every Senate race yeah every Senate rate they people had a problem with the fact that Biden was to0 the problem is of course Democratic part is always conu but the Democratic part has not Fallen apart it's a much stronger party if you if you count elections which that's a pretty good barometer and it that's it just whole and it true among some democrat that the whole thing is going to hell in the hand basket and the part is you know irretrievably damaged and that's just not true at all no we kept saying this on all the polls Democratic senator candidates are all winning like you know there's no there's no evidence of any issues and at Michigan poll where Biden was down seven that was yesterday morning yeah and and I said I bet you schlotkin is up look they said well yeah she is up and that that was everywhere people actually want to to vote Democratic it's a hard thing to say because the it's always dims and disarray right party you know but but I think this is pretty pretty pretty defining moment all right I want to do VPS but first all that Happ talk you know I like to be raincloud James so what what worries you about about kamla what worries me is this you think of the great politicians you think Reagan for sure Clinton for sure Obama I guess going back maybe Eisen how a little older but whatever they were all very competitive but you know what they all had in common they never looked like they were trying too hard and once you look like you trying too hard and that's something that Harris has got to understand the line that you where you you look too aggressive you look like you're Bobby gendle right yeah you don't want to be Bobby gendle you don't want to be and sometime I look at clips of her if I were her campaign manager I I I'd say Madam V let's let's take about 20% off of that and I think one of the things that when women come up in politics they probably feel like they don't get heard and so they have to be aggressive because no one I I I think I think this is just something yeah no she would say that she would say that I I think that uh you know because I my criticism of her in the past is that sometimes she gets in her head and I think that people say like because of the way women are treated because of the abuse you get because of like the Lang you know that that you overthink things like you know a little bit and and and then when you're overthinking when you're in your head then you come off as a little more like you're trying I would say let's try a less less harder yeah Le you know let's be is ambitious as Abba but don't give the people you're trying too hard because it doesn't it's not it's not a good sales tactic yeah I don't know what you think about this my advice to the team would be and has been like just she should let it rip like I like just if she not like if I was her I would just try to go out there and be like I can't be worried that they're going to take some clip out of context right like I just got to be me and do me and and maybe that'll right be better but I know well once you start thinking they're going to do that then you you you you think of every word that you say and then you you end up not saying anything and I I I would really really coach self-confidence you know and you know you know you know what to say and you you're right they'll take anything and redo it and rework it and but but I just you got and not she's exhibiting some I'm looking for self-confidence like I'm I'm going to win this goddamn thing you understand yeah and I thought her answer was I'm work hard to earn a nomination I thought this was a stupid MSNBC if you don't nominate her this is an affront to women of color in an Intergalactic system and you cannot do this that's a dumb message right is but she to her credit she said I I plan on competing for the nomination you know by saying that no one's going to run against you if you say I'm entitled to nomination going to run against you actually political thing to say I agreee with that so I'm but you know so far so good but we ain't going very far yeah um I'm I'm with you on all that okay one more thing you just popped to my head before VPS on the confidence thing man I think the Republicans got to have some regrets that they're a little overconfident right now I I look back at that convention and and you know um The Pick of JD Vance just the whole vibe of it was like that they felt like this was a coronation and Trump's return rightful return to the throne and all that looks like that was kind of a Miss now in retrospect I don't do you still pick JD Dan if you knew they were GNA do this well what's interesting is so let's fast forward Thursday the 22nd of August in in Chicago so it's Harris her husband her kids and I don't it's Andy bashia okay of Josh a 45ish sky with three kids and a wife and on the podium and the balloons are dropping yeah that's you see that's signal now they can't do that with JB JD Vance and I'm just saying I'm I'm not be I'm just telling you what time it is you know this I know this his wife is Hindu is an Indian apparently clerk for two supreme court and Justice I but and they're attacking her right now the Rus and so they can they bring JD Vance wife and kids and I don't know that they y'all built that stinky [ __ ] house that you live in go ahead and live in it I give a [ __ ] is somebody but you you have you know how these people are yeah Usha took some [ __ ] from the right no doubt um and uh and I and I just think that also JD just like him and Trump sitting next to each other just take the families out of it kamla and D you know kamla sitting next to her VP Trump in him like he just looks like he looks sad he's like this little kind of you know he's got his baby fat still in his face and he's got to say yes sir Mr Trump yes sir Mr Trump and like you know he's been very extreme on the issues I don't know if talking about a presidential vice presidential pick if if they want somebody to go after Trump inance yeah defend her did somebody three times better than all the rest of put together who's that M Andrew the best attacker Defender you could imagine do you worry a little about do you worry a little bit about Mitch and kamla having to carry all the Biden baggage I thought about Mitch they're going to make you carry it no matter what but a little bit you know if you had bashia Shapiro look if you if you wanted to kind of can do message in a swing state then you go to J to Josh yeah if you want a real kind of Youth message appeal to Middle America or something then you go with anyy I mean depends on what you're looking for yeah what day you but the thing you got a lot of good choices I like the Mitch idea I should have mentioned it yesterday because it come to my mind and I forgot like do I mean do you think that's like feas conceivable that he'd be in the conversation but I think it would be conceivable and and but you know if if what are you doing when you're looking at your potential advice right you know you have a lot of things that you're going to look for the one thing that he excels in is a attacking and defending yeah I mean and I would just have him I I honestly I wouldn't let him out three miles away from a TV studio I was so I was talking with um with Liz Smith about this my friend who did Pete's campaigns now helping the DNC so unfortunately she can't be on you know she's a um but uh we were just talking about behind the scenes and and her point and you know with Pete there's gay stuff that that you know potentially it's like are we going a little too far with the black woman an a gay man I don't know there's maybe some concerns there but her point which is right in line with yours is in this day and age especially you know given what the Democrats have had in a lack of messaging in the Biden Harris ticket like picking somebody that can sit in a TV studio that can do video YouTube videos that can just be constantly on the attack delivering messages is like a super valuable trait in modern politics more so than when like you only had to go on the Nightly News you know and and and it's sort of a small list I mean can do it obviously Shapiro I think can do it well Mitch could do it like once you get past that I think maybe like a Chris Murphy could do that okay by the way Chris Murphy don't don't you know if I were putting parlays or something yeah you know if if I had like 25 to one shot I definitely would would Chris Murphy because he generat not that way older than he looks yeah and he's he's got the one issue that's really potent that Democrats do not exploit and that's the whole gun issue yeah so I I I think that you smart to mention Chris's name I mean what we finding out is what people like you and I knew all the time is just so [ __ ] much talent in a Democratic party yeah I mean it's just it's just so why when you start talking well you was this guy this guy we can do this oh we do that or what about that I mean it's it's kind of a fun game but but there's a lot of people walking around out there that that can fill a lot of bills right now yeah for sure okay just's two of the top candidates really quick then I'll let you go um Shapiro I I mean I you know I just this is basically a Shapiro porn podcast at times so I I think he's done a great job I worry the Israel issue Israel Gaza has been off the table for a while for Democrats it was obviously a huge problem in the spring he was vocal rightly by the way speaking about against anti-Semitism on campus he is Jewish do you worry about that like becoming a distra very very very little okay and when when you have the Republican senator at a trump rally trying to run with you the Democratic governor that's a good sign yeah let me tell you that that's is something Happ for Shapiro yeah yeah for something I have for Shapiro he that's how popular he is and his whole reputation is can do stuff I don't I don't think I think regardless St this there are reasons that people you know feel very intensely about this hope issue either side I just don't think it's going to be that big of a voting issue mean some of the young college young you know percent of people under 30 go to Ivy League schools and can't count me so small all right yeah kind of nice to it's kind of nice actually to not have that baggage potentially just as far as turnout and Madison and and AR bur and stuff is concerned maybe so but boy you know I mean it bring you a lot but you know it's something right last one no a didn't cost Gore 200 votes that's true um now now you're talking the bullworks uh the BS language our Dream McCain liberman took it never came to pass all right last guy Mark Kelly people floated him astronaut great bio Arizona swing state some concerns though that you know I guess a Democrat would have to could appoint his replacement Katy Hobbs but then then it's up in 26 and you know maybe Chuck doesn't like that um maybe isn't quite as compelling his the most compelling story between him and Gabrielle but maybe not as compelling like verbally as some of the other people we've talked about what do you think about Kelly I I look he's a very hot pick among I kind of chattering class not in a in my only thing I would say about C Kelly is he's a little old yeah I ideally I'd like to have somebody under 55 with yeah right you want to be able to troll that old ass [ __ ] he's the oldest candidate ever now it's an it's our issue now it's our issue I just think we want we want to project generational change youth Vigor and there a lot of people we got that can do that with okay I agree with that all right let um um finally to close um well actually I have one more thing before we close can can you what do you got what do you got back there what what's your favorite bottle back there you got you got your whiskey cabinet behind us you got something you got a favorite you want to you want to show us if we want to take a have a victory sip this weekend this is a little bit old but this is a a Zen Wine this is a wine Bach weaseling which is a hell of a good fed wine people don't understand how good of wine that reasing can be they really don't and uh this is something I don't even know what this is somebody gave it to me Vancouver Island Seaside JY I love JY okay okay I'm I'm a big Jin guy I know I don't think there's any such thing as a vodka mortini little Vancouver Island Seaside Jin Martini I might I might need a Seaside J Martini myself this weekend well James I wanted to I wanted to have that because I wanted to have a toast to you because I got to tell you this I know you've had I know I know you've taken some [ __ ] over the past year or two and you don't need to you don't want to like be patting yourself on the back but I got to say for about a year now James conille and David Axelrod who who who were the strategists behind the last two successful democratic presidents before before Joe Biden were out there saying repeatedly this is a problem he's too old there's an iceberg ahead we should turn before we get to the iceberg and a bunch of idiots who don't know anything that the mest touch podcast or like black KN 10 on Twitter or like random people have never been on campaigns all these people like are out there like hey hey actually what I think we should do is press on the gas and speed right into the iceberg you know and and every yeah yeah and and Jay these old [ __ ] don't know anything and I just we got to speed straight into the iceberg and I just I gotta say Cuda maybe we should just maybe we should have just listened to to people who know a thing or two and been around politics maybe there's something to be said for that that's all I'm gonna say because it seems like I mean you know the election isn't won yet but just Vibes wise seems like things are turning out a little a little okay I don't know one man's opinion thank you all for the greater glory of LSU go Tigers James carille thank you for coming on go Tigers we got the number one recruit in the country coming next year Bryce Underwood out of Michigan life is good klet is brat tigers are King thank you to James Carville we'll be back tomorrow with another edition of the bull podcast see you all then peace [Music]