Jason Bateman Returns | Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard

welcome welcome welcome to armchair expert I'm Dak Shepard Monica padman your mic is all over the place Sky Wampus very wonky welcome to the program welcome we have one of my favorite guests of all time returning Today part two if you've not listened to part one please go back and listen to it there is a debate about butt wiping that is I epic I think it's my best work it might be it really might be Jason baitman man do we all love Jason baitman he's an actor a director and a producer he currently is directing and starring in Ozark he's nominated for Emy in all those categories for that show it's fantastic also Arrested Development Horrible Bosses game night The Outsider and most importantly for me Silver Spoons your favorite show of all time yeah I wrote an essay about it and I urge everyone to check out his new podcast with my buddies will Arnette and sha Hayes it's called smartless and you can find it everywhere you can find podcasts I think I was on the inaugural episode so wow fun so please enjoy National Treasure Jason [Music] baitman [Music] he oh my God your hair's gotten long yeah oh it's so bad it's it's actually I actually cut it I like this is actually cut hold on hold on that's a cut look at all this back wow oh wow for The Listener at home oh we need a picture bitman is extending out his follicles they got to be you got to have a foot of hair there I almost wore a hat just for our Zoom no I like the hair you want to see what's happening with mine or you're not even curious that's the thing about you you're you're not curious about other I see it no you see my cameras on I see I'm looking at you I have a hunch if I went into your room your camera is your face H have you ever pulled that off when someone ask you to take a picture of them you just flip the camera around you take a a tight head shot of yourself no that's a great idea though that's a good bit oh I have a story for you that you would love in this current time maybe not the greatest story I became really good friends with the head of someone at Warner Brothers 5 years ago a real Oldtimer and this Oldtimer had been there in the '70s I know who we're talking about well let me just tell you who it was it was papasian in the' 60s or 70s he was a young guy at Warner Brothers and for some reason one of their main stars took a shine to him right and he kind of put papasian under his wing this guy would have a yearly birthday vacation fishing trip down in the Baja and women would recognize him right so they'd ask papian to take a picture of them with this actor and the guy would pose with his arms around the ladies but he would have pulled his penis and testicles out of his bathing suit which they would have not seen and then he would have gotten it back in somehow he was really good at getting it back in before they ever noticed they were just looking at the camera smiling and then of course the comedy was they'd get home and develop these pictures with this movie star and he was just fully exposed wow you know that's mired with problems but what it what it does let you realize is how public life has become versus just 30 40 years ago where like that's a prank you could do and there was no out come what would the person do they'd get the photo they can't go online and tell anyone about it they what are they going to call the newspaper and go like oh this movie star pulled his penis out there who's going to take that call and then you can't even get that photo to anybody it would take so much effort to spread it out wide enough where it would be a problem yeah it is it's a it's a and even on a more sort of micro level just signing autographs versus taking pictures you know you used to somebody recognized you they would say oh you know can I have your autograph and and then you know you'd say yeah sure great and then they may or may not have a pen they may or may not have a piece of paper you know and then you know you you end up just basically saying oh well you know you shake hands you know great to meet you and and off you go but now everybody's got a camera even those people that are walking by you taking a picture they might think I don't know that guy looks kind of familiar I don't know what the hell his name is but I might as well ceue up for a picture too because I got a Facebook page and and it just it you know you're there for 20 minutes cuz you don't want to be a dick and sincerely have you been in that situation where like a a mild Feeding Frenzy starts like this has happened to me at the airport of course and then at maybe some like Myers Thrifty Acres in Michigan like the big Walmart type store where you know it's four people and then like as you say like six more like who's here is an athlete over here or something and then this has happened dozens of times where I'm posing for a picture of somebody and then the picture concludes and the guy goes what what is your name so I can look you up I mean zero clue they could be taking a picture with Jeffrey Epstein they don't know I know it is it's a weird thing but part part of the job for sure uh some people are great at it some people are just terrible at it too I don't understand why some celebrities are just so allergic to connecting with communicating with the people they're actually doing this for now listen I'm not you know Mr Grand Marshall of a parade or anything like that I'll sit down and talk to everyone and start kissing babies but I like people but I know some people that they get approached and they immediately not only do they turn aloof but they get aggressive and they're like where do you get off bothering me and the like you are a public figure you do a public job like you better come out of your house with your knees bent a little bit and be ready for you know party your gig you know okay I like that that's very very true but I I'm going to make a case for the other side now I have had very levels of kindness out in public okay over the last 16 years that that's been happening and I can make a case for what it is for those people which is if you're someone who deeply desires control as I do it is something that you're reminded of you're completely out of control you don't have a saying if you can just go to your car and be on your way in under 5 minutes there's other people that you don't have control of that are going to stop that right and if you're at the grocery store and you just got off the call with your brother and you had a fight and now you got to put on a it's it's control for me it's like oh I found myself in this situation unlike most people where I can I can't silently move through the world and sometimes I want to and if you're someone who deeply desires control or didn't have much growing up maybe whatever the baggage is it can be physically painful now you've been at times in a 12-step program so you know I do believe in this concept that acceptance is the the answer to all my problems so as I've gotten closer to full acceptance which is that's right you should not have an expectation of privacy or control that's not going happen going forward unless you choose another career so once once I can fully internalize that acceptance then my expectations are met my expectation is it's going to be inconvenient sometimes and then when it's met yeah I knew that was coming but I think that some people are shitty some people are [ __ ] but also there's a lot going on right and it extends to everything too like you know you work on a set like when you're directing something you don't have full control over performance I mean you have control over you know whether you're going to put a 35 on the camera versus a 50 but when you get to something that's living and breathing between action and cut you have no say over that you got to give up how you thought that line was going to be read you can't control that and there's there's something great about that and I mean in your marriage you know you and Kristen I mean you guys are sharing you both have the same rights over that house she has a right to be in a bad mood in that house she has a right to be in a great mood when you're in a bad mood or she has a right to get up earlier than you or you know walk around with heavy heels like my wife does when I'm sleeping she puts on those T shoes and goes and makes that coffee all right and so you just you know the kids running around like it's a shared space and everyone's got a right to it and yeah that control Instinct can be uh inconvenient for sure well okay so a directing question when you get in that situation and it's inevitable right as great as actors are and and and it's so often they surprise you in a way that they exceed whatever your expectation was which is lovely and then sometimes it's like they're just not getting the thing I really need for the scene and I've attempted it a few times now here's where I'm very lazy as a director I'll just go okay I'm going to solve this another way like I know I'm going to have to be on this person will you just keep going and get what you want or do you start thinking of easier ways to get out of it well with performance as you know being an actor as well you can unlike a director that may have no experience with acting we have an ability to empathize with the limitations of instinct Talent Comfort all that stuff that you know we weirdo actors go through you know while we're pretending to be other people like it is easy easier than anything in the world but it can also be like the most difficult thing in the world if your if your mind is a mess and embarrassing when it goes that way yeah exactly and so I'm pretty good as I bet you are too of understanding what the limitations of that actor is and so if they're not going to get what you need there are other things you have at your disposal as a director as you were saying it can you you just start editing right away yeah yeah just so I don't have to see that dumb look that actor's doing on their face the line reading's okay but the look on his or her face is just a scene wrecker it's you know you could just you can do a bunch of different things and it's it's much better to make those efforts than you know get in the face or the mind or the heart of an actor and like wreck their day by jamming them into something that they don't want to do or or don't see is something that they should do you nailed it often there's a word they love like they've really anchored the whole thing on the way they're going to say like right surprise you know whatever that thing is and and you you can recognize it as a Cornerstone of their day right and if I remove this or if I challenge like hey do you think you might want to say surprise like you're not surprised you know if you do that every the House of Cards is going to crumble so it's it's just and I think you're right because we we're so often in that position where we've built a whole performance around how we're going to turn our head and look at the person or whatever the dumb thing is but you know again again you can apply it to stuff in our normal it's people skills you have to if you're having conversation with your wife or your kid you've got to know that no one is going to do what you want them to do if you jam them to do it yeah you know you have to figure out what the positive is and and work out how to mitigate the negative while you know focusing on the positive people who don't have the patience to go the extra step are can be nasty you know because they they just say just do it better that sucks right you know to your kid too be quiet you know as opposed to hey I get that you're having fun and I want you to have fun but Daddy's on a work call or something so can you have fun over there as opposed to shut up you know it's like come on just don't be so lazy you know hey uh going back to the autograph and the photo thing have you noticed that people that don't like a movie or TV show that I do or or might not like a movie or TV show that you do they'll walk right by you they don't stop to say hey by the way that thing you did sucked and you like no no one does that certainly wouldn't do it to you cuz they get their ass beat I think they know that but we don't really do anything that gives somebody the the the drive to stop and be confrontational however what you are doing with your podcast you are out there and presenting your opinion and your perception on things and people love that is a huge success I love listening to I you know I've always loved our friendship because of that and now people get to hear that as well but now you're giving people perhaps an opportunity to confront you based on your political leanings your social leanings blah blah blah blah have you noticed that things have become or could become more confrontational in public as opposed to just being an actor or director they haven't and it's and it's very curious and I've actually thought a lot about it because I've said a lot of kind of controversial things that I I was kind of bracing myself to see in a headline or something I think well wiping that came from right right that was a big one that that was great though that was so positive the fact that someone transcribed the whole conversation was so flattering did you get stopped you didn't get stopped on the on the street about our wiping did you oh yeah I've had by the way the Fallout from that was I've had probably 150 guys hit me up on Instagram to go tried it holy [ __ ] revolutionary life changed I haven't heard one person right oh my God I tried it and there was [ __ ] all over my balls you're talking about trying the front wipe that's right back to front back to front as I'm a proponent of as you if anyone wants to hear that full debate go back to the first baitman interview and it is lengthy and it's full the the experiment must be let let me tell you my theory on it and it kind of crosses into another opinion I have about acting on shows okay so you know back at the height of stern people hate listened to Howard Stern right there were people that they drove him mad and they couldn't resist but to listen to him but I think largely because he was on their FM dial so there was no real barrier to entry to hate listen to him and I had done it with Rush limbo over the years I think because there's a barrier of Entry to the show you got to go download the thing I think probably the only people that are listening to the show are people who genuinely like it I think that's part of it I've often acted on shows that I personally don't watch and or maybe I think are bad shows but friends are involved in them and they've asked me to come be a part of them and I've done it and what I've walked away thinking is like oh I'm kind of embarrassed about that show but no one that is in my group is even going to watch that show to know I was on it the only people that are ever going to see me on that are people who love it so there's no downside it's it's not like people are watching shows they hate and then I got to worry about that does that make any sense it does until you are watching Super Bowl and you see a commercial with your face on it with your guest spot on that show you're like oh everyone's GNA see that you did that I guess that can happen sure the reason I ask about the opinion thing is because I'm just getting my feet wet in the podcast world now and I started thinking about tempering the specificity of the things that I say cuz our buddy Kimmel he gets a lot of blowback from the right throughout the country for calling out some of the things that the Administration does I feel for him that's he's basically amplifying a common sense point of view and getting drilled for being overly opinionated but you've thought about that right let's talk about Kimmel specifically I have a theory on why that has happened to him and say not Co bear who's 10 times as political do you have a theory on why that blowback exists no I I haven't thought about that yeah why do you think Kimmel gets it and coar doesn't because for a decade Kimel didn't take many stands I think his son being born with that heart condition that being the beginning of him being public which I so appreciate and admire and love that took him down a path and I think his fans were largely Stern type fans that were probably not left leaning at all and I think there's a deep sense of betrayal they thought he was a Centrist or right-wing or whatever they thought he had some kind of alignment with them that they now discover he doesn't and I think they felt betrayed by that I think it's an emotional reaction I think it's deeper than his opinion on the topic oh that's interesting yeah I don't think the oark fan base has any political expectation of you I Don't Think You're vulnerable to that situation but I'm glad you're bringing it up because it's one of my the biggest topics I want to go over with you today which is you have this endeavor I did your podcast smart lless you guys did a great job man it's so [ __ ] entertaining but the thing I have thought about is your level of comfort with divulging certainly I'm on the far end of the spectrum of what I'll divulge you're not and how is that going to play play into like the longevity how much have you thought about that aspect of it I have thought a lot about it because today's culture you can say the wrong thing and it can just paralyze you with anxiety or even with your ability to get employed there's a gotcha radar that's out and so uh you do have to worry about that but by the same token you know I'll have a half hour conversation with you about wiping techniques so I will divulge but I also don't want to load someone's gun who might be on the lookout to grab a gotcha moment well that's the fun dichotomy of you is exactly that I think you have an intention to not end your career and I think it's Unique to you as someone who had a big career then kind of it went away for a while and then you got it back I think the stakes are a little higher for you just from your personal story but what I know about you is that you intend not to get yourself in those situations but yeah you can't help but get ins snared which is I love about you I know what your intentions are and I know that you can't resist I'm a consumer and I'm a fan of anybody who does an interview an ath or musician an actor whatever I hate hearing those interviews and they're super guarded or reading an interview in a magazine and you can tell somebody's super guarded it's like well why am I wasting my time supposedly trying to get a window in on your personal world and you're being guarded so maybe it's still this hold on to some naive thing I'll Trust a journalist till they give me a reason not to but usually it's way too late things did change I don't know maybe 10 years ago where I started to do these interviews and and magazines and stuff I started to notice at first where the way in which they construct the headline of the interview is obviously to draw people in it's a it's a recruiting element to peque your interest and again I am a victim of that as well is just a consumer like oh they said that I wonder what the context is and so you'll click and you'll read the whole interview but you got the sense as the subject that you should start to be not naive about that yeah and I don't blame the journalists for that I understand that media is much more competitive now and there are links to articles on computers that need headlines to click through and I get all that and so as those rules have changed instead of fighting against it and being petulant and pissed off about it I just think it's more responsible to just think a little bit more about what I say when I say it and try not to be guarded about it just be more intelligent about it I hope well I think the thing about podcasts that's different is talking about control you have all the control so you aren't subject to some journalist who's deciding what headline it is like you get to decide what's in what's not I assume you guys get to decide all that and there's no taking out of context I think that's why we especially him have not been canceled well also mainly because I have made sure he's not able to get canceled yeah I would have canceled myself several times let's own that yeah you need to have an editor who loves you guys enough to protect you but isn't so infatuated by you that they can't see where you're [ __ ] up is a very fine line basically I'd have to edit your show right I mean as much as I do like the sound of my own voice I can't stand to listen to the whole thing every time so I just kind of leave it up to our our Engineers our producers and I'd love for my wife to listen to it because she's got a real Keen ear on that but for instance what I as soon as that 15 minutes ago in our thing when I said about her heavy heels walking around while I'm trying to sleep that out of context or even without this video assist that we're looking at where you can kind of see that I'm joking but with if you're just hearing my voice it sounds like Jesus that guy sounds like an [ __ ] like I might Circle that and think hey will someone else listen to this and see if this is something that somebody might grab and use as a gotcha moment is the laugh even worth it the reason it's different is that you're in a highly defendable position so like I know exactly what you're talking about I've done interviews with people and it's like the quote they took is sentence 35 I've built this whole case to add up to this thing right and I had to walk you through it cuz I knew it was provocative but I think if I gave you the background of why I got there it's Justified well that isn't there and I don't have the [ __ ] interviewers notes I can't publish them it's me saying I made a bigger broader point and it was taken out of context and everyone's like horeshit whereas this is like you could post it yeah you have the evidence and there's laughter we're all laughing it's not the same to your point your sense of humor and mind or at least I'll just speak for myself it doesn't work in print all that well no I I've learned that through texting and emailing too you know like sarcasm dryness your bread and butter right you have to figure out how to punctuate that do you need a [ __ ] Emoji afterwards like there's all kinds of things and then as soon as you're round right as soon as you're round the edge too much well now it's no longer dry it's actually soft you know so it's wet it's weird it's moist it's damp yeah so so just to wrap up we're going to cut the piece about Amanda with the you know you know what's funny is on your first episode we cut a couple things per your request which we had no problem cutting it was like whatever I don't even remember what the your publicist your publicist was rightly concerned about the ass wiping conversation but I said look man I'm the only one who's going to take a hit for that like I'm the one presenting an unethical way to wipe your butt like a dangerous unhealth bitman is Towing the line like you should be proud of your client he's uphold holding the hegemonic way of wiping one's ass so that was the only one I fought back and I was like no that's that's me you can't protect us you can protect your client but you can't protect us right and by the way that was the thing that got transcribed and got headlines and it was like the probably the best part of the whole thing I respect you so much I truly do like I've said this before you were the one that was like you should marry Kristen we were in Bora Bora and you're like what are you doing why aren't you marrying this girl why haven't you proposed to her and I said I'm afraid I won't have leverage I'm afraid that I won't won't be able to get my way anymore or bend her to my will wrongly I want to do that sometimes and sometimes I need some leverage and you really walked me through why that's preposterous and that communication's going to get you all that and that there'll still be a desire for Harmony in the relationship and desire for that Harmony is the leverage and all that stuff and you really opened my eyes to that I credit you for that I was doing a lot of Lucin agenics at the time yeah yeah well IAS just become a thing as I recall you know yeah and just watched you raise kids it's very impressive I don't know what the framework for that is I don't know what self-help things you're into I don't know if you're into Landmark form or I know you had a little bit of 12-step interest I'm not sure where you're building all that but it's very impressive but here's what I want to ask you can't you distinguish the difference between when you have errored and when you haven't and I have a sense of when I've errored I trust it pretty much do you do you not trust yours I do I I'm pretty tough on myself about maintaining whatever mental muscle that is assigning judgment about what somebody else is doing and then also judgment about the position that I want to take with respect to that my ability to figure out whether I'm right or wrong or whether I'm being lazy in something and but I'm not perfect by any stretch and you know Amanda my wife has been really good about that with me she's made that muscle stronger in that I now question it a few more times before I commit to something which actually has a downside to it in that once once I then do decide that no I'm really [ __ ] right now I really dig in so I guess there's a good and a bad to it but I think the answer to your question if I'm understanding it right is that it is an everyday thing because it seems like the natural instinct is to buffer your sense of correctness whether that buffer is valid or not I think the human instinct is to like continually prop yourself up every single day and if you'd like to build it with legitimate stuff but if you don't have any legitimate things to feel good about here's a little junk food over here you can kind of pack on it's like a sand castle you know just keep sticking sand against the side of it and make yourself feel better you know you do that for a enough years you can build a real rickety sand castle that's going to drop as soon as some human walks by it I try to stay honest with myself every day I I know you're real good about that too hopefully one recognizes their blind spots right so I'm going to interview someone after you and it's going to be a religious debate right so I come up with some points this morning but I'm smart enough to know I think I just wrote the greatest thought whatever on religion right and I know I'm going to say it out loud today so Kristen's sitting right there and I say let me read this out loud to you and tell me if you think I'm on the right path and then she just cleverly goes it's really good I love your logic but just remember you're a little more logical than emotional and you're kind of ignoring the emotional component of that argument so I think you really need to minimally be able to make that argument for the person or or acknowledge the emotional component and I was like great thank you that is totally where I have a blind spot regularly so you trust Amanda we accumulate people I trust Monica a ton that can help you navigate your blind spots but my point is let's say on your podcast you say something regrettable don't you think one of the greatest modeling things you could do in this time we both hate or you get hung for something don't you think the best way to push back from that is to say you're absolutely right Thursday I said this thing and I didn't even consider what the victim would have felt like about that and I regret it and I'm sorry and I'm real time learning and I'm letting you know it's okay to real time learn that's something we must still value and defend and fight for and that's a part of a little role you and I are privileged enough to play for sure I'm a big advocate for learning moments and admitting that you're wrong the challenge though when you say I was wrong whether the subject is conscious of it or not you are basically seeding an opening to the person you're talking to Forever that I was wrong here and I am susceptible to being wrong and therefore you have a right to call me on this or any number of things forever now you're right and that's a scary thing for a person who has a fragile ego yeah great point you make yourself vulnerable yeah for on and on and on yeah so if you have a healthy ego or an ego that is substantiated by things that are not garbage I try to make sure that whatever ego confidence sense of self whatever that is I just try to make sure that there's aren't a lot of holes in that that I've got enough of a healthy confidence where I could admit that I'm wrong yeah because if you can't do that a bunch of problems happen you know you just end up sprinting from reality and eventually you get tired and slow down and then it catches you and you don't have the coping skills to deal with it and then you reach for something you probably shouldn't yes yes yes eating your Humble Pie yeah while falling asleep stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare now one thing I thought of today was prior to your podcast smartless you had a company with Arnette called Dum Dum you had dum dum and now you had smartless and I was like what is happening here is this a faux humility like you're [ __ ] smart as [ __ ] and Arnette as much as I hate to admit it is also smart as [ __ ] why Dum dumb and smartless what's happening are you embarrassed by that big noggin of yours we really named it after Shawn Hayes you know that's we want to honor his limitations I I think where it probably comes from is I just feel like there's so much more room to be curious if you're honest with everybody that you don't know everything now I can really do what I'm supposed to do which is interview people or listen to people and learn from them if you say come learn something now basically I got to do a lot more homework than I want to do let's just get to it if I say I'm smart then I'm saying you got to learn from me if I say I'm dumb now we can be dumb together and we can lean on the guest to be the smart one one and then we can just lay back and be a listener like the audience is is it a safety net though is it a like I'm going to lower expectations so much that when I error because you have a great fear of erring I think that you'll go yeah the [ __ ] company's called Dum Dum of course we [ __ ] [ __ ] the bed man what did you you didn't hire DARPA or whatever the Santa Monica thing tank is well first of all you've done the same thing by find yourself an arm armchair expert you're basically saying I'm the dumbass that's sitting here watching tossing bombs from the side I can say whatever I want because I'm not really an expert on anything okay that's fair both of you but I think it's more I'm owning the fact that I'm a know-it-all I'm not right often right well exactly so it's the same thing I think if one was to go into some sort of comedic science lab I would imagine somewhere in there it says there's nothing funny about knowing everything yeah you know so this this allows us to get right into a smile and therefore precondition the audience to laugh much more easily know if you're starting with we're all Geniuses you don't start with a grin you start with a okay a flat face and you know prove it this is sort of like okay so we're already flawed pants are down now we're that much closer to having a good time and and laughing okay so that was a real time realization you guys okay so something just happened which is what I just accuse you of you guys are right I did the exact same thing I can't believe you didn't put two and two together I didn't I didn't I literally was thinking the word expert as I was saying smartless I was like oh I got a great Point here so listen that was real time boy again you see in others what you see in yourself right so I was quiu to recognize the safety net you built for yourself and I built the exact same safety net the whole idea to do a Fring podcast is inspired by you I mean I was sick and tired of saying to will or Sean or anyone who will listen like [ __ ] Dax is just killing it this guy's having such a great time and he's just going and going and going and it was fantastic and when I heard will was going to do one I was like oh buddy I want to get in on that and he was like yeah yeah yeah and he kind of walked away and then I I ran into Shawn at something and I said you're [ __ ] Will's doing a podcast I'm GNA barge in on that one I want to be a I want to be a part of that thing he's like yeah me too I was like all right thank God you guys didn't bump into any other people before you went on the no exactly good good news for will because I had to tell Will I said ah you know Sean and I are coming your way H yeah you're going to be splitting this thing three ways now let's uh start recording my favorite tattoo right there those four stars on your bicep I love that oh wait and the tree the tree on the other one is good too I think he's really self-conscious about those stars because one time I asked you what they meant and you got kind of bristly about it cuz they don't really mean anything right oh none of my tattoos mean anything uh so I might have got bristly going like oh here we go I'm going to have to explain to someone that my tattoos mean nothing I just aesthetically I like even numbers I like four of things I like the shape of a star that's that I know that's a disappointing answer you know what Monica we're going to learn when when he passes in about 120 years from now we're going to find a little manual and is going to have a key to all these tattoos they did mean something very important things very important very sexual I could bet yeah my penis is 4 in long and it is a little bit star-shaped on the meus the head the glands the M but bitman I do have another question about smartless which is logistically how the [ __ ] are you guys gonna do this because Monica's 80% of the stress in her life is trying to figure out how to get the guest and myself in one place and one time in this SpaceTime Continuum because I have other jobs and you have other jobs and now you're compounding that by a factor of three which is probably exponential so how's that going to work well we're only doing uh one a week you know you guys do more than that so that makes it a little bit easier for us and it's a laptop and a microphone no matter where you are in the world well now it is yeah that's true that part is okay and once I start on uh on Ozark I'm going to have to do it on the weekends but even then it's like have to like come on it's one hour with two your best buddies and if it's not my guest I literally open up the computer at the time the interview starts and enjoy the surprise of who the guest is just like the listener is and I don't have to do [ __ ] I just sit there and go oh my gosh boy you know something I've always wanted to ask you if I ever got a chance to meet you is this or hey you're a scientist so I've always had a question about that is it's the lightest lifting I shouldn't be making any money on this it's good that I'm actually out of pocket on this I should be paying in the yeah I should be paying for the intelligence that hopefully I'm absorbing from some of these guests so is that the premise so each of you bring a guest each episode yeah it was my idea honestly to avoid the research I was just like let's just make sure we don't tell the other two guys who our guests is that way you guys don't have to do anything you just show up actually The Listener knows who the guest is because it would be up on the site but we the other two Dum Dums don't well it's a genius construct baitman I didn't do [ __ ] for you buddy in fact the only mental note I had for you is like I got to remember the name of the HBO pilot he directed I got to find that out before I talked to him and then I didn't well Monica like what if you could have 10 questions ready for Dax as soon as he opens up the laptop and he sees who he's talking to today and you go oh John Smith and then you slide the 10 questions in front of him and he goes okay well let's look what Monica's got here for me to ask you and then Dax you can actually ask joh Smith here's three questions you pick which one you want to answer and then you guys just start a conversation because you're great like John Stewart was always great with us and Kimmel's great with us Co Bear's great with where you can have a bunch of questions already sort of predetermined via pre- interiew and all that stuff but once the conversation starts it all goes out the window and then it's free flowing if for no other reason then the audience is guaranteed that the conversation is happening in real time as they're hearing it so naturally in my answer sort of prompts a question from not only the audience but from the host because it's a real obvious dangling like well wait a second you just said such and such so it's an ongoing real-time conversation and that's always much more compelling than oh great okay good answer here's my next question you know like just a series of things as opposed to a conversation is I think less interesting okay you just gave me a great idea and since you gave it to me let's maybe the three of us you can jump off your network all right or we can start a third network we'll start another we should have a show called multiple choice wouldn't that be a great podcast so it's like every single time they get three questions would they be generic like James Lipton right the pr or whatever PR what is it prce question you can tell me what your favorite curse word is or tell me how you'd like them to greet you up in heaven pick which one yeah maybe it would work for like a sign off answer well funny enough we interviewed Chum pen on Monday and I had a lot of anxiety about that because I rever him and I don't want to end up on his bad side you know there's all this anxiety I brought into it and one of the things why I wanted to bring up was during his James lip in inside the actor Studio you know he says if you want entertainment get two hookers and an eightball and then I had it wrong I went and rewatched the whole thing cuz I thought he said that in response to what do you want God to say when you get to the Pearly Gates and I thought he said there's two hookers in an aball inside but I was wrong I punched it up in my memory on accident you made it better talk about grabbing of headline it was on the heels of do you think your movies are entertaining or they are they difficult or hard and he said well look if you want to entertainment get two hookers and and an a ball and of course they pop to a closeup of Robin right pin like in the audience so anyways I'm like this is one of the greatest moments in so many ways that I've witnessed on that show and then I'm like I got to figure out how to bring that up in a way that doesn't set the whole conversation on fire and I never felt like I could do it so it was just kind of softened up the witness enough to drop that huh after an hour I think the humanness kicked in where it was like seemed to like me and I liked that so much that I was like I'm not I don't want to [ __ ] worth risking it right yeah no he's uh I've only met him briefly a couple times he seems like such a great guy he he was really really really fun and cheery in a way that I wasn't expecting now how has the dynamic between you three and I'm sure it's still evolving right like we thought we knew what the podcast was about and then it kind of kept presenting itself to us what roles do the three of you feel like one of them I noticed right away is that hay seems to be kind of in charge of the emotional journey of the guest is that still the case is it evolving who's going to hit the hard hard question do you guys know who does that what are the roles yeah I guess we're still sort of figuring that out and it varies based on our level of curiosity individually for each of the guests I might be really fascinated where the scientist where his you know will might get really interested in somebody who's talking about religion it really does vary and that's a good thing now I will say that will is hilarious and has Unstoppable energy and that's really good for a guy like me who's half asleep all the time and will tend to get a little bit more cerebral than probably a listener wants to get sometimes and sea is incredibly loving and non-judgmental and we probably skip over some of that loow hanging fruit that will and I might grab to like make fun of somebody so you know you're always kind of safe in Sea's arms so there's a proper Dynamic here where each of us kind of offsets the Plus or the minus of the other person I think so far no I agree I think some really neat symmetry to the whole thing and I think you nailed it right so like I'm so excited for Arnette to have a podcast because however funny you think he is in movies or TV shows as you and I have worked with him that doesn't hold a candle to him behind the monitor you can put him behind the monitor with Will frell and the Mount Rushmore of comedians Barney's probably getting the most laughs behind the monitor yeah he's one of my favorite favorite people in the world and truly that as is Sean that really is the drive between us talking for an hour if you're like me which I know you are with the kids and wife it's like we don't get out and we don't drink anymore and the Dodgers aren't playing like the only time I ever spend time with my friends is when I take one of them to a Dodger game I don't see anybody yeah I don't talk to anybody I barely email with folks or text with them so this is a a nice Outlet if it was just up to me it would be slow and boring and kind of monotone as I hope this interview isn't but Will's got the great energy Sean's got great energy and you know like in my I to keep talking about Amanda she's probably going to hate it but that's one of the things that's great about our relationship is it she's super social and she's the talker I don't talk that's right they might shock people yeah I sit there people just don't think I'm having a good time Amanda asked me every time we leave a place did you have fun like yeah I well you know you seem like no that's me relaxing that's me just sort of like you know I don't want to insult our great friends by being formal with chatting about you know boy the traffic was nuts so getting over here it's like well what we just meet what are you talking about traffic I just won't say anything and then they'll think wait he's not very talkative no I'm just super comfortable you're like my sister let's just hang out two dudes can go on a road trip and not talk for a 100 miles and be in Bliss with one another that's true that's true and again in Amanda's defense and I hate to throw you under the bus and maybe I said this in the first interview but I also had you as a guest over on New Year's Eve one year and what you did is you ate an enor amount of food and I think you ate more sugar than you're used to and then you went laid on a day bed and I think you might have fallen asleep and then you kind of around 1 p.m. you're like let's get the [ __ ] out here like two hours before the ball dropped and yeah I bet if Amanda got in the car with you and said did you have a good time Jason she had really good reason to ask right but however that's like nothing could be a bigger compliment in my stupid world if I'm so comfortable that I'm going to eat all your food pass out wake up and say let's [ __ ] roll that means I'm super comfortable like I'm basically in my second home yeah you're treating me like I'm your parent like if you had left some laundry for me to do afterwards I would have been like yeah yeah I'll do his laundry yeah no I I need to fix that because I'm sending signals sometimes that I don't want to send again she's an incredible partner in this journey I'm on it let me know that I I need to sort of like throw a smile on every once in a while people don't know you're super Bliss as you sit there in a food coma okay now let's talk about an interpersonal thing for one second if you'll oblige me indulge me rather I'm ready so we came over not long ago it was just pre pandemic I guess oh my God that's right yeah like B and I were driving for some reason and I realized like oh that's baitman street so we just we did a pop in which is very rare in La I think right didn't you see each other on the street in the car yeah I was turning onto my street you had to stop to let me turn on and as I'm turning in front of you I like wave and then you guys followed me under the street and then up into the driveway that's what happened and there we were yeah yeah that's what happened and then we went inside and we hadn't been there since you had started construction years before and it was really awesome to see your house it's so beautiful you have such great style it's incredible oh thank you that's all Amanda and then I find that the pattern when we hang out is very similar all the times by my account which is I'm always so excited to see you I talk your ear off always 100% of the time what's happening in Ozark BL blah I want to talk to you about directing blah blah blah and then again from my perspective I'm like oh he's waiting through this so that he can talk to Kristen who he really likes to talk to and that there's something about my Approach that prevents true intimacy between us and I desire intimacy with you what is your perception of that my perception would be the opposite and I'm I'm not just saying this because we're talking public I'll caveat the opposite by saying I love talking to Kristen I would talk to her whenever and forever how long but as far as you go I could talk to you about directing a loan for 365 days okay 24 hours a day I could talk to you and try to learn about cars you know like what you're doing right now I'd love to know a lot about that I'm quitting September 1st dipping for the listener I'm packing a liard so I can handle the reaction this is probably a great the reason you're asking this question is a followup the subject of trying to read whether I'm into it or not and I got to work on that my rest face is clearly sending a signal and in fact I've noticed it on Ozark you have to edit that [ __ ] exactly and there's something about like I'm looking on the zoom right now like my brow I guess everyone's brow gets a little heavier as they get older and I'm like starting to form a constant frown or like huh look on my face you know yes and so I'm looking angrier on Ozark than my character needs to be a cuz often times he does need to be angry but often times he needs to look vulnerable and and not able to handle the situation and sometimes that brow gets a little heavy it looks like oh he's about to kick your ass like in other words like I can handle it yeah well by the way though I just on that really quick I have enjoyed the progression of your character getting more assertive I I think that's really rewarding and fun it's it's very similar to the breaking bad kind of model I like that part oh right right right but it's not what I'm intending to do it's a good learning process for me to actually see it I mean Amanda's been telling me for a little while like join the conversation godamn well let me be more specific I don't think I'm owning my insecurity enough so I'll have these interactions with you and I love them so we'll have these great conversations and I think well normally I'd see this guy next week like when I connect with somebody like I connect with you or at least how I feel like I connect with you the next thought is like well let's do this more often right right this is all jealousy I'll be like I think he and Arnette hang out or talk 5 days a week I'm trying to figure out what thing Arnette has that I don't have that there's not this desire for quantity because the quality is there right well rest assured you're one of my top top friends you're one of my best friends that's helpful thank you right exactly so that's a but imagine that's a shock the person who thinks we are best friends and is probably definitely top five I talk to once a month if that and that's like a three-word text so that's another thing I've got to look at reading some article the other day about workaholic and I'm an alcoholic you know in recovery so I've definitely I have that that Gene in me so I have probably definitely shifted it over into work at the expense of some of the other things I should be focusing on and sharing time with you know whether it be friends or family or whatever it is so I have had this thought for 13 years about you like I adore you and I'm confused by why I don't get to see you more often and all the other factors being neutralized controlled for we're both busy all that stuff whatever the expectation could be with that and I've never just been vulnerable and said that to you and then in doing this I realized like you're kind of a solitary creature additionally right you're a cat right right yeah that's another problem exactly again Amanda's got me properly diagnosed as an introvert it's pretty funny there is a 10 question thing they give to people their first meeting uh at AA right and I think if you say yes to one of them you might be an alcoholic say yes to two you probably are say yes to three you definitely are I think I said yes to seven sure sure sure so she sent me a questionnaire of 10 about if you're an introvert and I was 10 for 10 no [ __ ] yeah 10 for 10 10 for 10 and it's not a negative thing it's just it's just a personality trait I don't look to fuel or or to fill my tank through communic bonding sharing with other people I kind of pop in and then I have to actually go refill my tank with Solitude as opposed to human connection and I don't know what that is because I I think when I was younger it was a little bit different but I don't think that that's you know unique to me I think when when anybody's younger they've got 45 friends and then when you get into like your teens and 20s you've got 25 or 30 friends and you're drinking with a lot of them you know but then like if you do what you and I did and you stop drinking well now you got a whole new sort of criteria for who do you want to spend time with who do you not want to who can you not spend time with you know so I think all of that changed for me was it almost 20 years ago when I stopped where I had to really take a hard look at what it is I want to do with my private time while considering how how busy I am with my professional time yeah well and I think that's why you and Kristen do connect on a level that say you and I don't or Amanda and I connect which is Kristen's very much an vert too weirdly enough cuz she's very social but at the same time she'll invite 12 people over we're all hanging out I notied she's been gone for an hour and a half I go in the bedroom she's reading a [ __ ] book I'm like you cannot invite people over and then go check in with a book but of course she can and and people love her anyways and that's cool but that is so foreign to me Amanda would die before she would do that and I would die and you would probably do the same thing yeah I mean believe me I am very well aware that is it is potentially rude it is off-putting uh it is it can send bad signals I just that needs to be a louder voice in my head so that I actually take action but if there's so much discomfort it is all a cost benefit things if there's so much discomfort then no you shouldn't do that I guess well it's it's not about discomfort it's more about it's more about just listening to Instinct like for some reason I just have this instinct to go have some internal experience you know like like with Kristen with the book like for some reason she thought I'd love to just kind of climb into this world that I am reading about and creating pictures in my head as opposed to sitting down and thinking of stuff to talk about with that other person and that is incredibly fun I love doing that for some reason I find myself at a stage in my life where this introspection this introvert sort of predisposition is what's fueling my interest at the time and by the way if I wasn't in that place I don't know if I would enjoy doing what I'm doing professionally as much right now in that it's you know a lot of directing right now and so as you know there's such a depth of thought and Analysis and vetting you have to go through to do your job correctly I think that if I wasn't comfortable with literally staring at the wall I mean I know you know this as right as a writer too I've done very little of it but I know this somewhat of the same muscle your ability to concentrate and get small and get quiet is the difference between good and great or failing and succeeding so maybe I'm subconsciously keeping myself in that place so that I don't screw up my obligation to lead at times you know like I got to come with a plan yeah yeah and if I'm out there like not really being small and focused I might not do my homework I don't think it's a surprise that you have a lot of introvert in you because you've been so public for so long you've had to be an extrovert and you've had so many experiences that are outward that maybe some of them don't even feel real because they're so outward that in order to like get back to some sort of stasis you need to come back to yourself and you need to have some Solitude I think that makes total sense knowing the trajectory of your life and Kristen too has been public for a very long time she was quite young too and it had to be so outward that I think your brain is trying to compensate for that a little bit I think yeah perhaps it's just an effort to balance and write the scales a little bit yeah perhaps I thought of one more work question on my way over which was for the bulk of your career you had 3 years on on arrested but the bulk of it has been pretty compartmentalized three months here three months there go there for three months go here for three months Focus your energy and your attention for three months sustain it for three months you're now in a situation where you've been doing Ozark for I guess over three years right yeah about to start our fourth has your attention span had to evolve to match that have you found yourself policing yourself about getting bored disinterested yeah I mean there are moments where you're interested and you're engaged and then there's other probably you know sections of the Year where you just you kind of start to gas a little bit and you might yeah potentially but I'm pretty good much like the introvert extrovert thing you know being chatty or being quiet there's whether I'm conscious of it or not I'm able to kind of be black or white with work or play or talk or thinking when I'm not working like right now I mean I'm literally in pajamas all day long I me I'll show them to you right now I don't use the kind of we got to mount a war here type of brain power at all I'm just I'm an idiot I'm watching survival shows on television I'm uh going to bed at 9:30 10:00 I'm up at 6:30 and I'm looking at sites on the computer that are completely frivolous but then when it's time to work I'll gas up and I've I've got a lot of that since I haven't used use that it's exciting for me to kind of play with that side of my head for a while hopefully it'll we're going to do a little bit of a longer season this year so hopefully I don't I don't run out of gas but that's I get home every weekend so I can be stupid you know now and you already brought it up and I think we're similar in this way is that you like to kick your own ass right you you hate yourself more than any other person could POS your your biggest enemy probably doesn't hate you with a third of the eye or you have for yourself is that accurate well it's set a different way my eye on what it is I'm doing as an actor as a director and then the whole either film or TV show that I'm that I'm in or on my eye is is sharper than anyone else's eye for my particular taste right so I'm not saying I'm the best critic in the world but I am for the things that I like so when I'm doing something I know for sure that there is one person that is laser focused on all the things that I like and all the things that I don't like and so that forces me to really kind of be on my game cuz I know that person's going to be watching so yes I'm pretty intolerant of me screwing up but also too if you like if you say something at a party you're going to really let yourself have it for about six or seven hours right you're going to you're going to obsess on that and and give yourself a good lashing about your impropriety yeah in my personal life I am the same way too but again getting enough to belabor the issue I probably air on on assuming the other person thinks like me you know and I shouldn't do that you know like the other person is going to think well the reason he's not talking is because he's comfortable here no they're thinking the reason he's not talking is because he's not happy here but it's the opposite I just need to put myself in other people's shoes a little bit more well well I guess what I was going to say is I wonder because of that because I I um really loath myself at times I've gotten way better over the years I'm just saying from where I started right I just I'm a big piece of [ __ ] and I was should have been one way and my mom deserved to have one son and she got this other one and so I've I've structured my life in this punctuated way where I kill myself for some period of time to buy myself some Goodwill so I can enjoy just being by myself right so let's say I direct a movie right and I just murder myself Al that I can sit on that couch and watch that [ __ ] and and not hate myself but then it wears off like there's money in the bank I did X Y and Z and then the first three days are Heaven fourth day I'm not feeling it fifth day I'm like you're a big pile of [ __ ] you got to go do something I wonder if you motivate yourself and cycle through that similarly I don't know if I'm conscious of it but I do think that what you're I think you're talking about is the burden of the person who has not built a dumb House Of Denial you know of unsubstantiated ego you know getting back to what we were talking about before like things are pretty simple for the person who's entitled things are pretty simple for the person who's arrogant but I would much rather kind of air on the side of self-doubt so that I don't buy the attitude I should have been renting you know cuz like that that lesson's real painful yeah you know and I've gone through that one I mean I've spent a lot of my life thinking I was badass and then got smacked when you know the the real news came in you know so like you can live in that bubble until it's popped and then you got to pay the bill of the correction and I just don't want to go through that again so I would much rather assume that I'm not right and just put in the extra effort to to get as sure as I can that I am and in the event that I'm not right I've got some options yeah and that goes with work it goes with personal life I just think that it's the burden I think we pay for being I know what the right word is but Kinder more human more vulnerable more kind of participating and I don't know everything and that's I got a long hopefully I'm just halfway through you know I got another 50 years to to live and so that means I got half more to learn stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare last two questions do you have anything you guys kissing you guys are kissing each other what's that curious is monin your top 10 best friends yeah yes yes yeah yeah yeah yeah above you sure sure as she should be I want to ask two more kind of professional questions one is I just want to acknowledge that you got nominated again for acting you this year as an for an Emmy and then I imagine as a producer of the show did the show get nominated as well yeah yeah yeah and then last year you got nominated as a director it's so wonderful do you feel the safety of like you're good man people know you're good you can take a breath not that I'm saying you need to ease up or anything but just you know the racket we have of like will I work again will the options still be open I hope you're approaching or have already landed on the I will work I'm good people have seen it and I'm say I'm okay I don't think you'd be surprised to hear that that is not the case okay okay okay you know it was really scarring I guess you know it's a lot to overcome to have been on top and then get your ass kicked and then build your way back yeah and again just being a consumer like you and I could probably spend 20 minutes talking about all the people that were relevant last year that you haven't heard a word about in the last 10 months that's true you know I mean it is unfair cyclical thing but also a healthy cyclical thing in our business that you know just like in professional sports like if you're not hitting above you know 200 you're going back down to the minors it's just it's a meritocracy in that sense yeah but you know we don't have batting averages in in this business and so it's a little bit more sort of unsettling because the gauge by which they decide whether you're going down to the minors or not is kind of nebulous it involves likeability it involves like all these social media followers how good looking you are yeah and also know it this is a true team sport you know you can knock it out of the park in your lane but you're fully reliant on multiple Lanes of equal effect to do their job as well and sometimes that's while you're working with them and other times it's Downstream after you're already on something else there's another group of people that are working on it up to and including just the release of it the marketing of it like what look at the poster they did that's it's terrible no one's ever going to see that and it's it's two years your life represented by a photograph right and can't blame the audience for that what else are they going to gauge their decision on you know it's a 30 second ad on TV and a poster that's it you know maybe a trailer I I'm honest with myself that I can try to do as good a job as I possibly can but there are zero guarantees there's no guarantee of employment with a diploma a minimum of salary based on a degree um it's all very objective and you need to stay humble and work hard to keep living or making a living in this particular business for sure okay so I believe that you're that person you will never not get a job working on TV you're just too good you'll never not good to job directing you've proven you're just great so you know will it be at the heights who knows but I do believe you've proven as much as a human can prove that you're so competent and so I want to say thank you what you're Stellar at as someone who's watched Ozark is you get the most even beautiful consistent performances but what whatever you're doing with the actors is topnotch um visually that aesthetic I talk about your home that you you give the credit to Amanda you have a beautiful aesthetic you I know you put a lot of time into what visually happens on that show you're really really great at it the thing I want for you this is part two do you watch succession I I do not and I it is number one on my on my list a lot of people that I love and respect are just crazy about that show it's definitely arguably the best show on television and I I'm so excited for you to watch it because what they're doing on that show is they're playing everything hyper real the stakes are high the tension's there and it's [ __ ] hysterical it is and it's even it's even exponentially hysterical because the world is so grounded and rooted visually production wise everything right it's a master class and so when I watch succession I immediately think of you because I think oh man baitman could do this show he's one of the few people other than the people doing this show that could do this show you could come in and you could make everything so real so believable the performances would be there and then you have such a brilliant comedic mind I guess what I'm wondering is are you going to try to infuse that aspect because Ozark is a very specific thing and it's we could all agree it's not the funniest show will you tackle a project that combines all those things I would love to yeah as far as uh future projects and stuff go yes please I'm not a writer I I wish I was but I'm always looking for the opportunities in what is not designed as a comedy whether it be a scene or sequence whatever to find the humor in it because if you are playing something real even if it's a drama you're right on the edge of losing your dignity as a character so that's kind of where comedy lives anyway especially with the characters that I play which are these dorks that are kind of right in the middle of like they're not not a protagonist they're not the scary guy and they're not the funny guy they're the one reacting to both of them so I like playing that part I like projects that have that and as a director I like straddling that tone so yes anything and everything that's got that I would love to read yeah well I was gonna say just the last compliment is um that's another just an asset you have which is you've always been since I've been studying you as you can see I have the egolessness of how you have always gone out and gotten someone better than you involved which I have been reluctant to do out of my own fear that it would expose my insecurities like that would it would confirm what I thought about myself that I'm not that good and if I just bring this person that's better than me they will certainly expose that right you've not had that like when you did identity report you were quick to go like oh my God Melissa McCarthy she's a [ __ ] she is a force of nature that's who I want in this movie and that just takes some kind of confidence and egolessness that I think has really benefited you and admirable and should you know people should learn from that I guess it's it's what people in tech companies do right they go out and get people smarter than themselves well it's nice of you to say but I'm I mean me being kind of the straight man I need somebody really funny for me to be funny uh me being the Straight Man in Drama I need somebody to be a really great character actor so that you can cut to the lead the person who's supposed to be just normal you know the audience member to react to something that's startling from a character actor so there's a necessity there but there's also a sense an understanding a trust that no matter how good anybody is the fact that it's a team thing there's going to be a lane available for me to excel in and and to kind of show my plumage you know and and you you must have a much better sense and confidence in that than you're even implying you know your your podcast is a testament to that just one example of it the amount of introspection analysis honesty that you've been living with in the last year five years 10 years versus you know any time before that you've got to be proud of I mean that's that's why people love listening to you I'm sure is you I mean List are the questions you you've asked me on this thing like deeply personal easily understandable because they're honest questions that's a superpower that I don't care who you would hire in any movie you would direct or anything that you would do where you're trying to judge I don't want to bring that person on they're too good no one's got that superpower like you do and that pardon the term trumps every everything else any sort of ability or skill set if you're a person that is Unapologetic about how honest they are and how true they feel things and their ability to articulate those feelings tell me what circumstance you aren't on the top of the food chain with whether it's a conversation work on a set play a game whatever it is if you have that quality you can't fake that that takes a lot of work and and something you should probably uh as you are you wear it right on your chest and say I'm a badass look at this I'm I'm I am I'm confident and secure enough and comfortable enough on my own skin that we can have this conversation we can do this Venture together whatever it is I think that's what everyone's shooting for okay so my conclusion after that volley of compliments we clearly love each other so I I'm going to see what like next Wednesday right we should I'm coming over right after this you're good okay maybe we should schedule something for you know December all right well bitman I [ __ ] adore you I had so much fun doing smartless and then I listen to it people loved it you were fantastic on that we really shouldn't have started with that because as great as all the other interviews are it all goes downhill there there is an energy and an ease to you like what I just got finished saying it it it translates it's infectious so well thank you I loved it and I listen to it you know 40% cuz I'm a narcissist but really 60% to see how you guys were going to make that sausage with three you know four people talking I just I had a a logistical curiosity about how it would come out and I got to say it came up brilliantly and there's as you say there's a lane for everyone and and everyone it's it's very cohesive and it could have been a real [ __ ] show like an explosion of everyone getting their two cents in and you've avoided that so I think it was great and I I hope people check it out and I adore you and I love you and I'll see you in a year and we'll feel the same way about each other we don't it doesn't have to be a quantity thing we are solid right it doesn't even matter we're solid no matter when we see each other I love you right back Monica you know the way I feel about you number one best friend number one best friend love you both thank you very very much for having me and thank you for doing our thing yeah yeah enjoy the rest of your day and your jammies thank you pal all right you guys see you batesy bye and now my favorite part of the show The fact check with my soulmate Monica padman DX saw the list of questions on my fact check and got excited I did I try not to spy on your work cuz I don't know if you write sometimes like [ __ ] hate Dax and and if you feel that way occasionally that's okay it's none of my business I don't think I would write it down we say that in AA what other people think of you is none of your business I like that I like it but it's aspirational yeah yeah well we we claim progress not Perfection yeah do you have any more quotes yeah I have tons of them the first is tomorrow so tomorrow is your sobriety birthday oh tomorrow is the first speaking Tuesday speaking of alcoholism tomorrow is your sobriety birthday 16 years without any drinky poo or nose candy yeah good job really good job I got to say the thought of going 16 years without a drinky poo was truly unimaginable to me yeah yeah I'm so proud of you but one day at a time you can add it up to 16 years oh it's so impressive that's so hard to do you can't make it what like 3 days oh right now I can't hardly make it 3 hours it's it's become never felt the need to like take a week off of drinking which people do all the time and I don't really get it but after Saturday I am going to take some time off you are What's led this idea that you want to take a break I just have been drinking a lot objectively you're like am yeah I just feel like maybe my body could use a break but um I was told when I got my diagnosis uhhuh which one you have so many now they're piling up like mine why well you have epilepsy yeah that's the one yeah and then you went on an anti-depressant so I didn't know which one you were referring to my epilepsy I was told by a doctor that drinking a lot can cause one H but also having been drinking a lot and then stopping can cause one oh no [ __ ] yeah so I have to like we off yeah oh okay that that kind of makes sense because I've had the DTs many times and it's violent shaking it's like almost a seizure yeah depleted I don't think I felt much embarrassment I would feel embarrassment about like things I said while hammered you know and then I'd have to call and apologize to people but the actual the overall look I was fine with because it was like you know I still was getting good grades and I was in the growlings and I was doing things but um the the times that I had the DTs and I be laying in bed next to Brie and it's like the most uh for me they were like they were always like emanating from my stomach and they would cause my whole body jerk yeah I was pretty embarrassed by that oh my God like she's laying next to me what is she thinking like this is what you see in a movie I'm like you just feel out of control too yeah yeah yes yes yeah yeah it's like an ultimate sign that you're not in control yeah yeah and then also I guess if I do want to call up my new diagnosis it's a depressant a pretty potent one alcohol yes and so not great for me to be drinking a ton having just gone on a new medication to combat the thing I'm now bringing back in my body right like maybe it takes you just back down to zero yeah so I'm just going to take a little Breaky what do you think about that you always think I drink so well but what do you think I do think you drink well and I think um anytime you're thinking you need to take a break you should listen to that voice yeah but one of the things you said to me that I found to be very flattering and really raised my self-esteem is you said it's kind of easy to not drink around me cuz it's fun so just hang out with me a lot that next week and I'll put on a show okay okay sounds great all right you've fallen in with a bad crowd is what it is your wife my wife Matt Laura these are all bad bad people bad influences I know well it's also paralleled your new love for Spades exactly oh my God that's the thing like I'm not gonna not play spades but I also need to drink during space sure that makes sense okay that was my thing with poker is that I I love to drink my um Jack Daniels when I played poker and then my good friend Scott Johnson who God bless him because this is a hard thing to say to a best friend you know he said you I don't want you to drink in my house anymore after my performance at one of the Sunday night poker games and how did you received that were you defensive not at all I was so embarrassed I was mortified and then I quit drinking for a year and a half on my own without AA that was the period I did drugs but didn't drink anymore right went kind of well I guess I no no it didn't did not but you know I applaud him for doing that I know it's so hard to say to a good friend it's just a real Act of love to say that to somebody and it's it's a very hard thing to say and it's and I very much appreciate that he had done that yeah it's so funny when you tell these stories CU I I just feel like you're talking about another person do you feel like you are or does it still feel very much like you yeah no it feels it feels like me yeah but I agree there's so many stories that just simply wouldn't have happened in the last 16 years that were common place but you know enough about me in my ego that like one of the things I have in the past thought was cool about me is that I have a high tolerance for everything right like be it pain or risk or uh consumption so I think if people are like oh he's crazy you know like I think I was letting that be a compliment to me you know that's not the case anymore yeah which is good yeah the idea that somebody told you you couldn't come over to their house anymore like that would drink house yeah I know yeah I can't imagine like you causing a scene so well in some ways I can but not in I it's just so unlike you right right but yeah you've grown that's just means you've grown that's great I'm a grownup boy okay Jason Jason B you said the name of the HBO pilot but you couldn't remember the name The Outsider The Outsider yes okay now we're going to get to the fun part oh this is the part you saw glanced at that you cheated at okay so we were talking about inside the actor Studio mhm and you were saying the prow questionnaire right PR PR it is it's PR so that's one of the checks okay I looked up how to say it PR but also the inside the actor studio question question is not the prce questionnaire it's not it's not it's from a french guy named Bernard poo it's called The Poo you know he says that almost on every episode yeah now that you say poo I can hear him saying it and he he would affect his um French accent for it I loved that show so much I did too there's few people that can take themselves as seriously as he does and it's still charming and likable and he is right at the maximum James Lipton yeah James Lipton so the Poo questionnaire that's what's your favorite word what's your least favorite word what turns you on creatively spiritually or emotionally what turns you off what's your favorite curse word what sound or noise do you love what sound or noise do you hate what profession other than your own would you like to attempt what profession would you not like to do if Heaven exists what would you like to hear God say when you arrive at the Pearly Gates okay that's poo okay now PR okay did he have a questionnaire oh he did oh he did yeah we're going to do it oh wonderful yeah the pr questionnaire has its origins in a parlor game popularized though not devised by Marcel PR the French essayist and and novelist who believe that in answering these questions an individual reveals his or her true nature here is the basic PR questionnaire this is so fun I am already thanking you for constructing it number one what is your idea of perfect happiness it's family when when my three ladies are very happy I just witnessed it um they were laying in bed last night and they were all kind of giggling and being happy and that's a 10 for me that's nice yeah okay what is your greatest fear my greatest fear is declining physically yeah not being able to do the things I like to do what's your greatest fear can we do these together sure so so answer the first one okay um it's harder right than you would think yeah it's hard cuz you don't want to you don't want to say one and then an hour later remember oh no no no the thing I like way more than that is this there's just anxiety to that's okay you don't have to we can do this every week yeah to put too much pressure on ourselves for me it's being in a space with the people I love who I I know for certain love me back yeah okay greatest fear yours is declining physically but by the way of course my greatest fear is that my kids something would happen to my kids right okay but but then beyond that my own selfish personal fear is that yeah my greatest fear is abandonment okay good I was I was going to phrase it differently yeah but I guess I was going to try to say like to learn that your friends had a negative opinion of you that they were sharing amongst themselves but not to you which is really abandonment yeah that's yeah oh buddy have you ever had a friend abandon you no yeah you're super likable and everyone loves you that knows you so much I cannot foresee anyone abandon you you okay what is the trait you most deplore in yourself my self centeredness my uh pensent for for making everything about myself mine is having an unflexible ility in expectation of other people and myself I guess but mainly of other people like I don't really give people a break mhm okay what's the trait you most deplore in others I think it's the same really yeah it d me crazy yeah and it makes sense cuz I hate it about myself I don't like that in in people either but what I hate the most is hypocrisy I think I'm everyone's guilty of it sometimes but I don't think I'm that guilty of it I don't think you are at all and I agree with you that for me is abnormally triggering yes because I guess it's always generally in my opinion associated with judgment so it's like f it starts with someone being judgmental and then they're guilty of it themselves yes I just hate people who are in the shaming others business I can't stand it it also is there's something about it that feels like Injustice yeah which living person do you most admire there's so many that's hard it is hard it might be a tie between Bill Gates and Chappelle my blankie is shedding um mine is my dad oh I so happy to hear that oh man sorry Mom oh man now I'm now I'm thinking I should have said my mom well Chappelle did pop into my mind first when I read the question yeah for me too I'm just so amazed by him yes but he's such an impressive human being yeah he is but I don't know the intricacies of him you know like there are things I admire about my dad that have that have nothing to do with success or what he puts out it's just like his patience level you know I don't know came over here by himself I know and he made this life and it G and he made this whole um simulation and yes he made Co you know father made Co we love him admire him for that yeah okay well this should be easy for you what is your greatest extravagance cars yeah panga for you panga I don't know that lamp you bought was pretty extravagant I always see it and I wonder do you still feel I love it I love it I love my lamp oh good there's zero buyers remorse I Love [Laughter] Lamp but you will get a matcha delivered your house yeah when you hit me with the price tag of that the other day I was like wow I don't I even know if I would I would do that yeah but I don't have kids and stuff so I can buy well I do have a pea baby but she's very lowc cost oh yeah yeah yes she's free yeah what is your current state of mind current is um gratitude I've been feeling immense piles of gratitude lately I have a really nice life and I and it's filled with the most beautiful people yeah that's beautiful how about you um my current State of Mind is alcoholic Ros uncertain that's a great word yeah I've noticed for a couple weeks you've been kind of navigating something I don't I'm not sure what but I can tell there's a lot on your mind well yeah and just the state of the world is so uncertain there's a lot of uncertainty around and I think it makes you start questioning your own personal stability I guess yeah well what's interesting about I was talking to my psychiatrist this morning we were talking about this interesting aspect of Corona and and again not for everyone everyone's having a different experience with it and and some people are you know working their asses off and you know nothing's really changed for them for me I have stepped out of the woods I can I can see the forest currently uh but you know you're you're you're generally so busy whipping through the forest that you don't have the perspective so to like kind of paused so much of life you're now able to observe it which can be good or bad you know yeah I think there's no space right now for avoidance so you just have to kind of confront all the feelings yeah the way you could normally keep yourself distracted yeah it has changed a bit what do you consider the most overrated virtue uh niceness that's way up there for me not to be confused with kindness which I do find to be different and I think kindness is wonderful yeah I think that is a very good virtue but niess I agree is overrated probably the most yeah you know so many people like what do you like about someone oh they're so nice and I just think that's not enough for me I mean anyone can fake nice and you also not to Beal of the South but you know often when I'm in the South there's so much politeness yeah Southern Hospitality yeah and I'm split on it it's a little bit like yeah it's nice but then what are their actions yeah what are their actions and you know I don't know I I don't know that I always believe it I guess is yeah this has been a long time rant of mine I know I know I'm kind of um I stole your answer yeah also sometimes again not to be too critical South sometimes you you'll go to a gas station in the South and there's only two people in front of you and it can take 13 minutes because of the chitchat oh my God and how are you you're good oh good good and they're good and you're well oh good yeah we're doing good too we're well you know and you're like oh my goodness yeah uh pick up the pace okay on What occasion do you lie there's several sure I will punch up a story I will evaluate whether or not May rightly or wrongly whether the person can handle the truth at that moment or and if that's going to be helpful to them in that moment it's a sliding scale I have some friends that I I can be 100% honest with at all times and there's some that I know they are too fragile for that and that's not really what they're asking for yeah but you are making the decision for them which isn't really fair that's right yeah how about you yeah also multiple ways but the one that sticks out is like if it's going to make the person feel good but I don't believe it then I'll say it yeah sure I've also lied um about my penis size I've told people it was 14 inches because I thought they'd be afraid that it's actually 16 inches oh so I okay that's an honorable lie oh gez what do you most dislike about your appearance oh [ __ ] where do we start where do we start well my nose number one I think for me yeah probably my nose o which living person do you most despise hm that's a hard one well I have a few you do yes you do oh I do yeah Bill riy and by the way having nothing to do with his politics I can handle that someone has different politics than me but the The Bullying the the one thing I saw him do that I wanted to find him and beat the [ __ ] out of him was he had the son of a first responder to 9/11 who was anti-war anti-g going to Iraq and he was on the show promoting that and he said your father would be ashamed of you yeah he that's and I'm like you're a [ __ ] monster dude oh yeah that made me want to take him out to the Woodshed for sure who do you hate currently I I think Trump okay I I do I think there's too much hatred he's sown mhm I despise it oh what it's fun to read these I haven't read them yet yeah what's the quality you most like in a man I think dependability for me prick size yeah well not 16 Ines how about 14 though that sounds pretty good [Music] right I don't think so I think vulnerability I'm I'm I'm taking mine back I said dependability that's a good one though well you know what's interesting is that I started hosting an in-person AA meeting but outside social distance it was basically up to me to pick who I was going to invite because it had to be a small group and I love all 30 some people that are in my Tuesday meeting but I was like why did I pick the these specific guys and I think it was um honest I I am so attracted to people who are dead honest I think it's yeah or self-aware for me is important yeah what is equality most like in a woman it's interesting because I don't see the reason for there to be a distinction really uh between male and female that's true that's true but I guess I guess in truth it's um competence I'm I'm very very attracted to competence in women yeah and obviously cuz I think my mother is like in so insanely competent that Ma manad Sheila Oh wow was she [ __ ] competent was that was 24 years old go build me a city okay I'll do that how about for you for well she she had competence but she also had um Stockholm Syndrome from The bogwan yeah yeah yeah but why is it different from people who like Jesus no like she felt like when in the dock she says like he put his hand on her leg maybe or her hand and she looked in his eyes and she could feel what people feel when they look at Jesus well I guess no one looks at Jesus but you know what I'm saying right I think that is the difference aive human on earth who can manipulate you currently versus yeah people can use Jesus's teachings to manipulate but he's not doing it right right the interpretation of him can be good or bad but yeah what did I answer no no uh you know I think I'm gonna reverse it I think for women for me it's dependability oh okay yeah do you think in general women are less Dependable than men no no but for me the women in my life that I trust the most or have put in my inner circle are all incredibly Dependable right so that's kind of how I judged it which words or phrases do you most overuse you know what's funny is for an average person taking this test like they'd really probably have to think about it but because we have a show where we talk non-stop I'm kind of overly aware of how many I there's so many right I used to say suffice to say so often you don't say that I know cuz people pointed it out so much that maybe okay well suffice to say I'm G to probably bring it back uh inordinate I think is probably high in my I love I love saying inordinate or inordinately huh you also say you say the phrase witches a lot oh tell me like use it in a sentence okay I'm GNA try suffice to say I thought something the other day which is I oh yeah you use it as transition a lot I don't even think I'm aware of that it's cool which is to say that I am new to this I'm sure I also have so many um are you unaware of them it's no there's one I know for sure but now I'm blanking and I've I've actually made it a point to try to stop yeah uh funny enough when Bradley swung by yesterday and we we had a long chat we were talking about the podcast and he said you know what what impact do you think it's had on on you personally and I said you know at this point this hundreds and hundreds of hours of talking I've had to confront a lot of my I think of myself as someone who's pretty self-aware but even within that I'm I'm not nearly as self-aware as I thought I was so I'm so much more controlling than I would have thought in conversations to a nauseating level I think I have peeled that back you know compared to our first yeah you know 30 episodes or whatever but I I still have a lot of work to go but isn't that a gift no it is I that's what I'm saying I think probably everyone could benefit to hearing themselves yeah what or who is the greatest love of your life I I can't isolate that to one person you have to because this is pred well but then well I got to pick one of my two kids yeah I refuse to answer this question then well would it be your kids then yeah for sure I can't believe I know them um Callie my best friend I think yeah my mom might be tied with my kids yeah but that's scary to say so am I in trouble with my wife I don't think she can get in trouble she doesn't listen to this okay well this is I mean it's similar to an earlier one but when and when and where were you happiest ah seventh great [ __ ] no problem how about you I think I was happiest can I guess sure Athens I haven't Miss I've been so nostalgic for college lately M it's so hard because there's another thing I want to guess can I guess why yeah sure it's hard is you still had a sizable amount of anxiety about getting into the goals you wanted to accomplish exactly exactly so I was so happy but yet there was a lot hanging over yeah personal goals professional goals yeah so I don't think I could say that even though was so fun so yeah I think I would probably say sixth grade oh my goodness I got two best friends that year mhm and I just had the best time and one lived in my neighborhood and so we hung you know we we hung out every day and I think sixth grade but ninth grade is also when I started cheerleading oh it's hard to pick I I've I've had a a lot of Happy Times very lucky this is tremendously fun I know I agree I don't know if it's interesting for anyone listening but it is fun which Talent would you most like to have uh singing for Me piano but without the practice yes of course like just be able to do it yes sit down and just tickle the ivory yeah if you could change one thing about yourself what would it be that's also similar some of these are similars one thing about myself I would change you know in the past that would be so easy for me I would it would be looks related mhm but I I don't feel that way anymore good no you know my big breakthrough in that I would watch episodes of Parenthood and um I got to be be careful cuz I'm eating I know and I would leave a scene where I was really critical of how my nose looked in that scene and then I would watch a scene with Craig T Nelson and I would just be like he is such an attractive being like his whole Essence is so attractive yeah I'm never focusing on his nose or his chin or his anything right I'm just taking in him as a whole thing yeah and that clicked a little bit for me where I was like I'm not a nose or anything I just I'm I'm this thing you take in total yeah that's great that's true I think I would change I mean it kind of is the same thing as what I said earlier about what I don't like about myself like I guess I would change stubbornness maybe but I do like a lot of it I like what it leads to often so it's hard for me to say I want to change that I don't like the negative elements but I do like the positive ones actually I think the one thing that I really would want to change is to be able to let things go I have a very hard time doing that what do you consider your greatest achievement I think it's sobriety oh yeah I just think because I did not think I was ever going to be able to stop drinking right right like I really didn't think that was I thought I thought I was going to die of it yeah I forgot that are smoking quitting smoking man I just couldn't do it and I knew I was going to die of it that's my greatest achievement too your sobriety good job thanks what's your greatest achievement St Champion that's not my greatest achievement I don't think I mean if it is that's a sad life probably I don't think you necessarily should evaluate it in its overall impact or it's almost like something that was not in the cards that you made in the cards right that's true that's true okay then in that case it's when I learned to do a backflip We call we call it a back tuck but for like layman's terms it's a backflip and I very much could not do it and I did not think it was in the cards and I had to do it because we had to have Squad tucks and I was going to be replaced there was threat of getting replaced and so it was not cut but having an alternate come in who could do more tumbling than me and I just like was not my body was not meant to do those things and so I worked so hard and then one day I did it and then I kept doing it and kept doing it by the second season I could like really you could rip it oh yeah I could do 10 in a row 10 back flips in a row yeah Monica why don't you do backflips I can't do them anymore but but but you can no no no no no it was hard enough then even though I have Elite muscle mass for some reason did not serve me well like I had to build up so much muscle in order to do it and that is gone that is gone not coming back that went the way of the dodo okay if you were to die and come back as a person or thing what would it be I'm kind of stuck on Logistics of this like could you come back as Brad Pit but isn't he still alive right and then is there two Brad pit take over his body killing Brad Pit to become Brad Pit but you know what's funny is as much as I love him and worship him I would not want to be Brad Pit if I had my pick I'd rather be Bill Murray yeah but let's for the sake of this pick animals what do you think oh okay yeah so what animal would you want to come back as oh I would come back as a very domesticated dog cuz I'd want to live in the comfort of somebody's home I would be an elephant I love elephants the most but I don't think I'd want to be when they're not treated well well no it'd be in the wild oh how do you know you might get captured not not this guy not this elephant you know what I like about him is that they're they're not Predators but they're the toughest so they have no threats yeah they're very nice Uber intelligent they're super communal yeah yeah I think I think that'd be great okay where would you most like to live Austin Texas I knew you were going to say that where would you most like to live New York oh wow yes but not more than La if we all lived in New York like all our friends and then yeah I would really I love it there I love it too but I we would all have to have a billion dollars yes you you have to have a katrillion dollars there I just find it's it can be too much for me it can like lot of stimulus yeah although you're right I do think La is the best place to live because of weather y yeah for me proximity to mountains to snowboard at uh sand dunes uh ocean yep it's a good place we got the best place yeah there's no mystery as to why 30 million people live here okay what is your most treasured possession I think our current house not the one we're moving into oh oh that's nice it means so much to me emotionally yeah cuz you bought it first house I ever bought I've now lived there for 16 years my children were born there yeah how about you your Prius yeah God I love that thing it's so funny as much as I love material items MH I don't know that I have one that's treasured that I actually feel like if the house was on fire I would grab it yeah I take it all back um my journals oh yeah yeah that's a thing that I cherish and would hate to lose yeah which is really interesting because it is your ego I can acknowledge that why well I don't know just like why do I need my thoughts from you know I guess what I'm saying is like I'm never going to read it and I doubt my kids even though I would let them I don't think they're going to read it yeah but I mean it but it's just a chronicling of your journey so I don't I don't know if that's ego as much as I mean maybe it's ego because whether you have those or not you had your journey right okay what do you regard as the lowest depth of Misery the lowest depth of misery now is this in theory or something you've experienced you we'll have to decide I think in theory I think it would definitely be losing a child yeah I think so too like like accidentally flushing my pee baby that could happen what is your favorite occupation uh this one again this is tricky is it a it must be in theory right I don't know all right well pruce pruce be a little bit more clear yeah okay I bet it's more in theory and I would say medicine is is the one I'm the most uh grateful for anyway mhm like when you showed us your shoulder all opened up and it's like somebody did that somebody put a bionic arm on you yeah okay what is your most marked characteristic I think that means what characteristic defines you the most right like if someone was saying oh you know Dax he's blank right okay um I think it'd be my humor yeah how about you that I'm short I think that's what they would say really you know Monica she's short and and they say other things but short is probably first I've never said that what do you most value in your friends um well I think that goes back to we can delete we're going to skip this one okay who are your favorite writers that's cool that he included that yeah big time yeah well he's a writer so it's kind of self serving right there's a lot gr cow dovi however the hell you say that Bukowski of course Tobias wolf Raymond Carver how about you who my favorite writers I used to love Pat Conroy he wrote the Lords of discipline I love I've never heard of him or that book what's it about West Point but it's fictional story based on boys at West Point it's so good and Malcolm Gladwell oh yes yes you think he just put that on there in hopes that many people would say PR oh actually PR is my favorite okay good good um who is your hero of fiction that's good that is really good I I'd probably see Howard roor but I don't know it's been many years since I read that book so I I I might not feel that way now but the lead character of Fountain Head okay yeah how about for you Dumbledore oh perfect he's a beautiful man and he's not a man he's a wizard on top of everything else which historical figure do you most identify with none really yeah how about you probably Mother Teresa cuz I'm so giving that makes sense yeah I've thought that about you a lot in fact I never describe you as short but I always go you know Monica she's like Mother [Laughter] Teresa who are your heroes in real life that's also similar to something earlier we can skip yeah oh what are your favorite names Justin Justin is your favorite name mhm oh my God are you being serious yeah yeah yeah oh wow I never knew that I thought I brought it up on here I've never met a Justin that wasn't super cool oh my oh yeah how about you I like the name James for a girl oh so dibs okay I'm going to skip what is it that you most dislike because again I think we did that with hypocrisy and those things yeah yeah what is your greatest regret probably not being kinder to my father I think mine is the same but for my brother ah uh-huh uh-huh yeah could have been and still could be yeah yeah as I could still be yeah how would you like to die if I could somehow drowned while on fire no oh my God oh my God I'm teasing am I sleep I hate to be generic but yeah yeah old old as [ __ ] take a nap and then just never wake up yeah same okay what is your motto last question do you have one yeah keep your eyes on your own paper oh really yeah is this too long I'd like to compare yourself to previous versions of yourself that's good that's not too long why would that be too long I don't know because it if I really lengthen it out it would be like don't compare yourself to other people compare yourself to previous versions of yourself no you only compare yourself to previous versions of yourself that's eight words keep your eyes on your own paper seven same okay same same same well that is the pr questionnaire and we did it wow and I wonder what the normal time frame for that is I don't know I mean I think it's like a dinner table thing oh and that's all because we really didn't have many for Jason baitman okay great baitman were sorry he just didn't have facts that's not a bad thing no no it's not well that was really fun let's do the Poo one next okay okay all right okay bye bye love you love you [Music]